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+---- Thread: The Detuning of Session 17 and Ra's True Intentions Regarding 2011 - Part II (/showthread.php?tid=3231)
The Detuning of Session 17 and Ra's True Intentions Regarding 2011 - Part II - native - 09-04-2011
I feel I have made some important intuitive observations. I will cite session numbers for those who are new to the material so that they may easily follow along. The following is hard at times..at least for me it was in putting it together. Understanding how time works will help with the deeper connections, but generally speaking anyone will understand the obvious implications. It took me an entire day and night to work this out, and a lot of intuitive perceptions.This is lengthy and meticulous, but your understanding of the harvest should become clear.
This thread came from contemplation of my other thread. I wasn't satisfied with just that explanation knowing that it wouldn't be "enough" for others, so I went over all the information on the harvest for anything that might be useful and the result is the following. So this thread is to be read in conjunction with my other thread titled The Present Moment and Intuitive Perceptions of the Harvest - Part I here.. http://www.bring4th.org/forums/showthread.php?tid=3222
There had been a lot of intense discussion on the harvest a few weeks prior, and I felt that focusing in such detail on specific words and meanings was missing the point entirely. I had found that when I attempted to make sense of the details amongst all the confusion that was being debated, I only became more confused and threw out radical ideas. I was trying to fit a generalized understanding within other's elaborate frameworks of interpretation. So I looked at all the harvest information as a whole and I intuitively pulled the following together. By intuitively, I mean I would come up with an idea which led to an insight within the transcripts, which then led to another and so on.
I feel that at the very least, this idea that I have formed is an exercise more than anything. It's possible that my interpretation is wrong, but in considering it you reflect on all of the philosophical teachings that Ra imparts. While I have gone into great detail, it is not my intention to get caught up in the details themselves. I simply feel that certain statements have been carried away from their intended meaning entirely too much, and so much confusion has been created that a more thorough step by step explanation is needed. I am simply trying to bring understanding back full circle. Afterwards, it may help you to recognize bias or influence that you weren't able to notice before.
Regardless, I think it's clear that the harvest is occurring now, as Ra has stated in 14.14. After having lived the duration of an average lifespan, an individual is harvested when they pass away. A better understanding comes from contemplating how time functions. Space/time and time/space are not relative in their experience. What is experienced as a space/time dilation of many moments (a lifetime), is simply a fleeting moment in time/space. When Ra said the harvest is now, they meant that the opportunity is available now during this lifetime for those who have yet to polarize. Meaning, the time in which the harvest occurs, is during this space/time and time/space nexus. So, the harvest does not pass us by or float away as we go about our business in this life.
It's helpful if you use this link to open up the different sessions into several windows.. http://www.lawofone.info/
The statement in question:
Quote:17.29 Questioner: Am I to understand that the harvest is to occur in the year 2011, or will it be spread out?
Ra: I am Ra. This is an approximation. We have stated we have difficulty with your time/space. This is an appropriate probable/possible time/space nexus for harvest. Those who are not in incarnation at this time will be included in the harvest.
The statement above is invariably the be all end all statement that people rely on supporting that the harvest is instant, as opposed to occurring naturally upon normal death. To begin, Ra had advised the group many times throughout the contact not to not seek transitory information. Here are just a few of the quotes.
Quote:26.33 We can only ask each group to consider the relative effect of philosophy and your so-called specific information. It is not the specificity of the information which attracts negative influences. It is the importance placed upon it.
Quote:37.24 It is quite precisely correct that the level and purity of this contact is dependent upon the level and purity of information sought. Thusly, the continued request for specific information from this particular source is deleterious to the substance of your purpose.
Quote:62.23 Nearly all positive channels and groups may be lessened in their positivity or rendered quite useless by what we may call the temptations offered by the fourth-density negative thought-forms. They may suggest many distortions towards specific information, towards the aggrandizement of the self, towards the flowering of the organization in some political, social, or fiscal way.
When the group begins entering into areas that Ra wishes to avoid, the ability to contact Ra lessens. Ra's purpose is to impart the Law of One philosophy, and is not interested in transitory information or dates at all. Ra made this clear, and to avoid asking those types of questions. When you request specific information, this lessens the purity of the channel and it only leads a person astray in their seeking. So when one falls prey to this, they open themselves up more and more to negative manipulation. If this continues over a period of time, the group's seeking is no longer centered upon spiritually pure information and being able to contact Ra would be impossible because the group's vibrations are no longer harmonious with Ra's. Negative entities influence people involved in channeling groups towards asking specific pointed questions on the past, and especially prophecy of the future. Ra must abide by free will, and when specific information is requested, they must lack some amount of clarity so that the answer can be interpreted both ways because Don is falling prey to the negative temptations. That's my interpretation at least, by way of applying the concepts that Ra has given us. If Ra is not doing it purposely, it is simply a result of the purity of the channel lessening. At a minimum, the negatively charged question affects the dynamic of how the reader interprets the answer. That is, if you are influenced by the misleading nature of the question you will interpret the answer incorrectly. So, if you take into account all of Ra's warnings and their advice on seeking, their answers become clear.
If you're new to the material, please read session 16 to better understand how the 'quarantine' functions and what the 'window phenomenon' is. Our free will is maintained by a quarantine that doesn't allow negative entities to pass through, except through random windows that can't be predicted. However, if a person through their free will, requests negatively oriented information, the window becomes more predictable and more negative influence is allowed to be impressed. This is what happens in session 17. The group was already being targeted by fourth density entities who were suggesting negative thoughts. In session 17, Ra must honor Don's free will of requesting negative information, not by answering incorrectly, but by lacking clarity. Again, I'm not even sure this is intentional by Ra, rather if the channel itself is a part of Don's state of mind, Ra is essentially talking through a distorted channel. This comes through as lacking clarity, because as we'll see below, Ra makes very simple mistakes when a session begins to detune.
Moving on. What is the most significant way Ra could violate free will, or cause confusion over the material? My opinion is that they would give end-date scenarios. Why would Ra impart fear of death? They wouldn't. My realization is that the detuning of session 17 allowed Ra to lack clarity in 17.29, and that it was an Orion entity that influenced Don beforehand to ask the question. Who is always responsible for transitory information and prophecy dates? Negative entities. By asking transitory information, the window phenomenon becomes more predictable, and is to open yourself up to negative manipulation. In my seeking process over the years, when I stopped worrying about agendas, conspiracies, and figuring it all out, my intuitive ability and spiritual growth progressed significantly. Ra gives the same advice. When you center your seeking upon spiritual progression, you will notice a change in your consciousness and your attitude towards those topics will differ. As Ra says in 72.7..
Quote:72.7 Thus those whose desires are shallow or transitory experience only ephemeral configurations of what might be called the magical circumstance.
Above, Ra is speaking of a very slight but real magical influence. An interest in unimportant information deceives and confuses us. It leads us astray, or perhaps it's better said that we do it to ourselves.
Ok..on to the main question of the thread. After looking at all the information on the harvest, I realized that session 17 started with an opening statement, which I took to be an indication of something suspicious. I then looked and noticed there are only 7 opening statements by Ra out of 106 sessions. This has significance. The first two are at the beginning of the first and second sessions, which is to be expected. Moving on to the others..
Session 43 - In this opening statement, Ra requests that a fold in the sheet above Carla's head be smoothed. They refer to this as.. "There is a line of interference crossing the crown of the head." This is a metaphoric clue. Ra isn't really speaking about a fold, but that there is negative distraction in Don's mind. Because Ra exists outside of time, they know the questions Don is going to ask. They are either attempting to draw Don's attention to this, or leave it as something to be realized when reflecting upon the session later on. Don, in all innocence as he always does when trying to gather important information, starts off the session by asking about cattle mutilations of all things. At the end of three of these questions Ra warns that this type of information is unimportant. Don then asks about fourth density life span, if fourth and fifth density entities need to eat food, and whether or not the group should construct gadgets to aid them in their seeking. Ra ends the session by saying.. "The surrounding of self in a sylvan atmosphere, apart from distractions, in a place of working used for no other purpose, in which you and your associates agree to lay aside all goals but that of the meditative seeking of the Infinite Creator is, shall we say, not gadgetry but the making use of the creation of the Father in second-density love, and in the love and support of otherselves. Are there any brief queries before this working is at an end?" They are hinting at the irrelevance of the session, and to carefully realign themselves by not concerning themselves with this type of information. It seems there was some detuning although Ra provided spiritual philosophy to each answer as best as they could.
Session 62 - Carla was under specific psychic greeting. Ra asks that breath be expelled over her body.
Session 69 - I am unsure as to the nature of the opening statement. Ra says that there is interference with the contact and that Carla's hair should be combed and aligned before each session. In the previous session, it is mentioned that during one of their Sunday meditations Carla accidently began slipping into the trance state. This was used as an opportunity for psychic greeting. The rest of session 69 discusses some aspects of psychic greeting, and the information seems to be ok. Ra ends the session by saying that the group is conscientious. In session 70, Don states that Carla has complained of being under psychic greeting for the past diurnal period, and Ra confirms this. There was clearly psychic greeting occurring regularly during Carla's life, and Ra is letting the group know to carefully align themselves. We can assume there was probably a greeting in session 69, and is why Ra mentions combing the hair. They simply could be saying to be mindful of the physical vehicle.
Session 80 - Ra starts the session by saying they made an error in stating which archetype was the Significator of the Mind. In the previous session, Carla was having pain flares and apparently this was the cause of the mistake. Ra actually had to pause during session 79 during this pain flare, which is when the error occurred. A negative entity perhaps used this to their advantage to confuse the information.
As far as opening statements go, we can see Ra correcting errors in regards to psychic greeting and also a transitory warning. As you'll see below, the opening statement in session 17 is profound.
Session 17 - It should be noted that in this session, Ra having access to all of our possibilities/probabilities, knows what question is coming because it already happened. Understanding the simultaneity of time is necessary to make sense of the following. You have to understand that Ra exists in the present outside of our concept of space/time, and any distortion (significant at least) that is made within the original contact must be corrected in all possibilities/probabilities, including this one. Ra, existing outside of time, receives all of Don's questions at once. Upon reflection of all the questions asked, their answers are adjusted with warnings as needed just as Don asks questions. In 1.1 Ra states how they use other possibilities/probabilities to alleviate distortions of the original transmission of the Law of One to the group.."However, we then felt the great responsibility of staying in the capacity of removing the distortions and powers that had been given to the Law of One. We will continue in this until your, shall we say, cycle is appropriately ended. If not this one, then the next. We are not a part of time and, thus, are able to be with you in any of your times."
Session 17 starts off with an error correction, and also a warning. The importance of this opening statement cannot be emphasized enough. The only other time they opened a session by correcting an error was immediately in the preceding session..they started session 80 by correcting the Significator of the Mind error from session 79. Now here, three sessions later in 17 they are correcting errors that were made in session 14? As if Ra just 'realized'..oops? Why wouldn't they just correct it in session 15? No, they have chosen three sessions later to symbolically represent how over 'time', their information became distorted. They use sessions 14 and 24 in an attempt to alleviate the confusion that is about to occur in 17, which I'll outline below.
They did this artfully by planning their statements ahead with unthinkable creativity. The opening statement:
Quote: 17.0 Before we communicate by answer we shall correct an error which we have discovered in the transmission of our information to you. We have difficulty dealing with your time/space. There may again be errors of this type. Feel free to question us that we may recalculate in your time/space measurements.
The error we have discovered concerns one of the arrivals of both the Orion group into your planetary sphere of influence and the corresponding arrival of emissaries of the Confederation. We gave dates of 2,600 years for the Orion entry, 2,300 for Confederation entry. This is incorrect. The recalculation indicates numbers 3,600 for Orion entry, 3,300 for Confederation entry.
In the first paragraph of the correction, they are informing Don (more importantly, those who will read the Law of One later), that in their first attempt in the 'past' to contact Don, Carla, and Jim, session 17 was detuned by transitory information. Ra is speaking about a past error in the material itself, but they are actually referring/hinting to the question about 2011 that is to come, and how Ra perhaps lacked clarity in their 'transmission of information'. Directly speaking however, Ra is reminding Don as to the unimportance of dates and how they can be calculated incorrectly by Ra. Does knowing the difference of 1,000 years as it pertains to an historical event have any kind of relevance to our spiritual seeking? Do we feel relieved that those dates are cleared up? It makes no difference. Ra specifically advised the group to place no importance on history or dates, that they should seek spiritual information, and here Ra is supposedly taking the precaution to make sure dates are accurate? No, that's not what Ra is doing, because they can not explicitly lead the group in the proper direction they must speak metaphorically. Ra is advising Don that dates are meaningless, and that there is no specific pointed date in regards to harvest because it occurs over a period of time. The danger is that the question Don will ask about 2011 is a future date, which causes controversy because it involves prophecy and uncertainty. Negative manipulation uses prophecy to their advantage, so Ra is attempting to warn Don not to ask about 2011 because people will place importance on it...'It is not the specificity of the information which attracts negative influences. It is the importance placed upon it.'
In the second part of the correction, Ra is cunningly leaving a remark stating that a negative entity is present, as in it has arrived in their sphere of influence (or at least negative influence resides in Don's mind) for the session and is going to try and detune the channel, as it had happened in the 'past'. It should be noted, that prior to session 17, in session 16 there is actually information about wanderer's being subject to Orion entities thoughts.
Read 17.0 again. Do you see how Ra is speaking in metaphor about negative influence arriving, in other words, this influence is present in Don's mind..i.e. his 'sphere of influence'? Negative entities detune channels by influencing people to ask transitory information. Ra knows this will happen with the questions Don is about to ask because they already experienced it in their present moment state. They are now attempting to fix their distortions in real-time. The warning is exactly like the wrinkle in the pillow sheet about how Don is about to ask transitory information. I've clearly outlined above how opening statements are only for the purpose of either communicating how transitory information will be present in the session that is about to take place, or there is a negative entity present, but really the point is that those two situations are one in the same with such advanced trance channeling. The group was a high-priority target, and any chance in which the channel could be side-tracked, weakens the window phenomenon/quarantine and allows manipulation. So Ra is warning Don not to make the same mistake he made 'before'.
Don could never have realized what was Ra was really saying at that moment, but they are leaving a metaphorical clue that can be understood later on upon reflection. They truly left it for the group/us to contemplate and figure out.
Again, if you don't understand how time works in third density, the following won't make sense. You will get it if you think about it enough. You have to grasp the simultaneousness of time as Ra 'looks into' third density. Since third density is many moments that exist as one present moment, when the group contacts Ra, Ra is basically receiving all questions at once as I understand it. So the answers they give in session 22 are based upon reflection of session 11 for example, and vice versa. Contemplate what Ra has said about the present moment, the experience of third density existing only as a moment, The Choice and the harvest only being a moment, and the ability/purpose of Ra or your higher self being able to communicate across 'time'. As a reminder, read my thread titled The Present Moment and Intuitive Perceptions on Harvest - Part I. It is specifically for the purpose of describing the function of the harvest and its relation to the present moment, and how all of our third density experience exists as a moment within the octave.
Moving on. This time around, working with parallel possibilities/probabilities, Ra is asking Don not to ask specifically about 2011 because it will be taken out of context. They can see our future possibilities/probabilities, so they know the precise controversies that will arise from their words. Ra is attempting to warn the group that the entity is present, and trying to influence Don about 2011. It is to be noted that in session 18, Ra explains that in session 17, psychic greeting was allowed to occur because of Carla having taken LSD previously, and that this allowed for a 'spotty' contact in that session. I will come back to that later.
In 17.2, Ra presses Don once again.. "We encourage a dispassionate attempt to share information without concern for numbers or quick growth among others." So again, Ra is reminding Don to avoid asking if the harvest will occur in 2011, yet he doesn't realize it. Not to mention, the opening statement is for the purpose of 'correcting' errors in regards to numerical information. Ra is telling Don that numbers aren't important, but especially that they are often wrong and not relevant. Don was amazing at asking intuitive questions in the moment, but he can't be perfect. I certainly can't blame him..it must have been incredibly difficult at times.
In the statements of previous sessions leading up to session 17, the harvest was clearly referred to in the present-tense:
13.22 "This is causing a somewhat difficult harvest."
14.14 "The harvest is now."
Back to session 17. Don's third question for Ra in session 17 is that in meditation, he received the message that he should ask about the Tunguska crater in Russia. Why would he receive such a message? This is completely transitory information. It was either a message from Don's higher self to reflect on the transitory nature of the question and not ask it, or the Orion entity influenced this thought.
Don then proceeds to ask seven questions about the Tunguska crater, and nuclear technology. Don then starts asking about Jesus' life, which is more transitory information. Ra blatantly makes a mistake, saying Jesus came from fifth density (a numerical error), which Ra corrects in the next answer when Don points the error out. This is a red flag, as rather simple information is being distorted. Don asks eight more questions about Jesus.
He then asks a question about Taras Bulba, Genghis Khan, Rasputin, and then four questions about spontaneous combustion! It's safe to assume, given Ra's warning, that the session is now unreliable and lacks clarity. The purity of the contact is dependent upon the purity of the information sought. Don of course asks about 2011, and Ra says it's a time/space approximation. Clearly, should Ra have been in better control of the session, they would have answered differently stating in some fashion or another that we are incarnate during the period of harvest, and that the harvest is now. Because the Orion entity was present (at least negative influence was present in Don's mind), Don succumbs to this negative influence by attempting to attach a date to the harvest, and because free will must be honored, the response must lack clarity. In this way, those who are swayed by negative influence will perceive the answer incorrectly. In actuality, if the harvest is now, the harvest certainly is occurring in 2011, correct? But people take the quote out of context.
Don's reasoning for asking the question has to do with the time frame of the channeling. It was 1981 at the time, and in sessions 6.16 - 6.18, Ra explains how our planet will fully transition into fourth density.."This sphere is at this time in fourth-dimension vibration. Its material is quite confused due to the society memory complexes embedded in its consciousness. It has not made an easy transition to the vibrations which beckon. Therefore, it will be fetched with some inconvenience." "This inconvenience, or disharmonious vibratory complex, has begun several of your years in the past. It shall continue unabated for a period of approximately 30, thirty, of your years." 1981 + 30 years = 2011. Don simply hand not yet grasped the concept of the harvest as something that is an ongoing process, so he asked about 2011 thinking that's when the harvest would really occur. Ra has clearly stated in several ways that the harvest is occurring now, which I'll outline below.
At the end of session 17 Ra says.. "This instrument is not wearing the appropriate apparel for this work. As inpourings occur in the regions of the, what you may call, seventh chakra as you speak of these energy centers, filtering through the sixth and so forth, the entity’s other or base chakras become somewhat de-energized. Thus, this entity should be more careful in its selection of warm apparel for the part of the body complex you call the feet."
It should be noted that negative entities prefer manipulating our emotions that relate to the first three energy centers, so Ra could be directly referring to psychic attack as it relates to the base chakras. They are saying metaphorically that the session was not in proper alignment with the nature of seeking only spiritual information. I forget if it's in Book 1 or 5, but one of the group states that it took them quite awhile to figure out that when Ra was saying the candle, chalice, bible, and incense were not aligned properly, they were actually hinting at the questions within the sessions themselves. This was confusing to them, because the objects were often aligned perfectly.
A poignant example of this actually comes from session 14 itself, where Ra says the harvest is now, but the session also includes transitory information. Ra says at the end.."We only reiterate the importance of alignment. This instrument is placed .2° away from the direction of the resting place, which is correct. This may be “eyed,” shall we say, by sight and the instrument reminded. You are being conscientious."
One truly can't eye .2°. Well you can try, but it is an extremely small adjustment and you will probably never get it right by intensely focusing on such specificity. Ra is calling attention to Don's need for irrelevant minor details, and while he is genuinely attempting to find the relevance in his questions, he should be mindful of such specificity.
So we can safely assume, as I outline below, that an Orion entity was involved in detuning the session by influencing Don. Now, the numbers Ra mentions in the opening statement of session 17 are extremely important and refer to sessions 14 and 24. Rather than correcting these dates in session 15, they waited until session 17 to mention it for obvious reasons. Again, remember that it seems Ra is saying an Orion entity is present, they go on to state:
Quote:17.0 We gave dates of 2,600 years for the Orion entry, 2,300 for Confederation entry. This is incorrect. The recalculation indicates numbers 3,600 for Orion entry, 3,300 for Confederation entry.
No date of 2,600 was ever mentioned before this session, but it is mentioned in sessions 18 and 24. They are 'referring' to a statement that was never made by them, and they are alluding to the fact that later in session 17, the urge to ask about 2011 was influenced by an Orion entity. Furthermore, in session 14 there is no mention of Orion entry at all, except in relation to George Van Tassel receiving positive and negative messages. This is what Ra was also pointing to.
Most importantly though, session 14 is also the session where Ra states that "The harvest is now." I feel that Ra's warning at the beginning of session 17 is pointing to session 14 for the correct answer. Admittedly, session 14 also has transitory information. But I've clearly outlined that Ra only made an opening statement when it was necessary and important. I clear this inconsistency up in regards to transitory information in session 14 in a bit.
Intuitively speaking, I think Ra left encoded allegories within their answers about taking their statements out of context in 14.13, 24.3 and 24.4. In 14.13 Ra says:
Quote:14.13 There were two contacts which gave the entity with the vibratory sound complex, George, this information. One was of the Confederation. The second was of the Orion group. The Confederation was caused to find the distortion towards non-contact due to the alteration of the vibrational mind complex patterns of the one called George. Thus, the Orion group used this instrument; however, this instrument, though confused, was a mind/body/spirit complex devoted at the heart to service to others, so the, shall we say, worst that could be done was to discredit this source.
Here, because Ra already knows the outcome of other possibilities/probabilities on how the Law of One will be perceived, they can leave this clue as to how the material will be distorted in regards to 2011, or how the Law of One information can be discredited. Come 2050, or anytime afterwards, people might point to that statement as evidence that the Law of One is not true. Ra is saying that in session 17, if Don asks the transitory information that he did in the 'past', the session will include both Confederation and Orion influence, which it did without a doubt. Ra is both speaking about George and Don/Carla/Jim ("this instrument") as one, both having been subject to negative manipulation but devoted in the heart to service to others.
In the very next statement in 14.14, Ra chooses to clarify the 'past' statement in 17.29 by saying "The harvest is now." Clearly they are ingeniously attempting to alleviate their distortions in any way that they can by manipulating their responses through their ability to work with time. Session 24 confirms this.
Session 24 is the next use of the numbers 3,300 and 3,600. Again, Ra clarified in session 17 that 3,600 = 'Orion entry' and 3,300 = 'Confederation entry'. Ra is both saying there was 'entry' through the quarantine in a physical sense, and they are pointing to within the Law of One itself when Don was influenced in the 'past' by an Orion entity to ask a question which will be taken out of context. By mentioning 3,600, Ra is asking us to examine session 24 which is the next time more irrelevant dates are imparted.
In 24.2 Ra says..
Quote:24.2 In the case of the Atlanteans, enlargements upon the information given resulted in those activities distorted towards bellicosity which resulted in the final second Atlantean catastrophe 10,821 of your years in the past, as you measure time.
10,821 years?? That is a blatant red flag because Ra has never been so detailed with a date. Ra is directly saying the specificity of the date 2011 asked by Don in session 17 was clearly a question that should have been avoided, and will be taken out of context given everything else we know about the harvest. Do you also see how Ra also says "enlargements upon the information given?" The Atlanteans took peaceful well-intentioned information and used it negatively. Much like the information on the harvest, which has been clearly stated, has been interpreted to be something that it is not as a result of negative influence in the mind.
Quote:24.4 Questioner: How did the Orion group get through the quarantine 3,600 years ago? The random window effect?
Ra: I am Ra. At that time this was not entirely so, as there was a proper calling for this information. When there is a mixed calling the window effect is much more put into motion by the ways of the densities.
The quarantine in this case was, shall we say, not patrolled so closely, due to the lack of strong polarity, the windows thus needing to be very weak in order for penetration. As your harvest approaches, those forces of what you would call light work according to their call. The ones of Orion have the working only according to their call. This calling is in actuality not nearly as great.
Thus, due to the way of empowering or squares there is much resistance to penetration. Yet free will must be maintained and those desiring negatively oriented information, as you would call it, must then be satisfied by those moving through by the window effect.
Firstly, Ra says there was a proper calling for transitory information..which intends to refer to all the statements Don was asking about the crater, spontaneous combustion, and Jesus in session 17. Ra is both speaking about the past several thousand years ago, and referring to session 17. They are using the opportunity to speak about history (which Ra wishes to avoid) to impart spiritual information that helps us understand how the nature of seeking affects both our path of learning and the channeling process. Ra is explaining to Don that when transitory information is requested, the quarantine weakens and negative entities are able to influence the channel indirectly through Don's questions. Ra is bound to abide by free will. If Don requests irrelevant material, Ra must answer but in an unclear way so that people can interpret it incorrectly in the negative sense.
Furthermore, do you see how the above can easily be taken out of context? Ra isn't saying the harvest is approaching now at all. The harvest is occurring now. Wanderers are here now increasing the harvest as I'll clarify at the end of this post. Ra is speaking figuratively how Orion entities came through the quarantine to impart negative information as the harvest approaches in regards to our past, and also how Don's poor choice of a question affected the Law of One material. This harvest statement can be taken out of context. In the above quote Ra is speaking about the quarantine, and for those interested influenced by transitory negative information, will also use this statement to misguide themselves to think the harvest is 'approaching', and interpret the harvest in 2011 comment as being literal also! They are figuratively referring to our own 'sphere of influence', and our own 'quarantine'. That is the message Ra is imparting by pointing us to session 24! More importantly, session 24 includes transitory information, so Ra's clarity becomes compromised as it relates to the harvest statement. Isn't it amazing how Ra creatively leaves a hidden message to be understood if you apply all the advice Ra gives?!
Now, bear with me here..it only becomes even more complex. I have chosen to explain 24.3 after 24.4 because it hard to comprehend the sheer ingeniousness of it. Ra is telling an encoded story about not only how their interaction with the Egyptians became distorted, but at the same time relating how the Law of One channeled by the group will also be distorted unless clarified. Ra is using Yahweh in their place. Read Yahweh as being Ra. Again, the 3,600 date is the reference to session 17, where the Orion entity was present:
Quote:24.3 In approximately 3,600 of your years in the past, as you measure time, there was an influx of those of the Orion group, as you call them. Due to the increasing negative influences upon thinking and acting distortions, they were able to begin working with those whose impression from olden times, as you may say, was that they were special and different.
An entity of the Confederation, many, many thousands of your years in the past, the one you may call “Yahweh,” had, by genetic cloning, set up these particular biases among these peoples who had come gradually to dwell in the vicinity of Egypt, as well as in many, many other places, by dispersion after the down-sinking of the land mass Mu. Here the Orion group found fertile soil in which to plant the seeds of negativity, these seeds, as always, being those of the elite, the different, those who manipulate or enslave others.
The one known as Yahweh felt a great responsibility to these entities. However, the Orion group had been able to impress upon the peoples the name Yahweh as the one responsible for this elitism. Yahweh then was able to take what you would call stock of its vibratory patterns and became, in effect, a more eloquently effective sound vibration complex.
In this complex the old Yahweh, now unnamed, but meaning “He comes,” began to send positively oriented philosophy. This was approximately, in your past, of 3,300 years. Thus, the intense portion of what has become known as Armageddon was joined.
Ok..at this point there should be no doubt that Ra is asking us to understand sessions 14, 17, and 24 as allegories of Orion manipulation. Do you see how Ra is both talking about the past, and describing the process of contacting the group, how their information became distorted, and they felt the need to correct it? Ra states in 24.3 above that.."Yahweh then was able to take what you would call stock of its vibratory patterns and became, in effect, a more eloquently effective sound vibration complex." Ra seems to be imparting that negative information will influence the clarity of session 17, but using the methods they have to leave hints and clues, the information becomes undistorted.
3,300 is the date Ra gives as the corrected 'Confederation entry' date. As I've stated, when going back to the date that Ra is referencing for the correction (2,300 session 14), we see Ra is saying.."The harvest is now." This must be a reference to when Ra clarifies their 'past' statement of 2011!! Perhaps in another possibility/probability, given the transitory information of session 14 also, the contact might have been influenced by Orion and an erroneous harvest statement was made.
Do you see the symbolic nature of all these dates and the stories attached to them?? Ra points to 3,300, which they are actually referencing session 14, as when they 'sent' their positively oriented philosophy (the harvest is now). Do you see how Ra is subtly saying they vocalized their correction in session 14 (taking stock of their vibratory patterns), and they intended to say in session 17 that the harvest is now, and not 2011? Since they receive all the questions at once, by reflecting on session 17 and how it was taken out of context, they make sure in session 14 that they vocalize this more appropriately! Psychedelic!!!!!! But instead, some of us interpret session 17 and 2011 as an Armageddon date. This is why they say these two statements were 'joined'. Unbelievable!
Quote:24.3 ..However, the Orion group had been able to impress upon the peoples the name Yahweh as the one responsible for this elitism.
Do you see how Ra is saying the Orion entity made it seem like Ra was imparting 'elitism' and negative philosophy?? As I said at the beginning of this thread, what is the most significant way Ra could cause distortion and infringe upon free will? Give a prophecy/armageddon date..tell people when the world is going to end..i.e. 2011/2012 nonsense. It wasn't a genuine answer by Ra, because Don started treading into negative territory so Ra had to be unclear! Unbelievable how Ra communicates this!! In fact, most of session 24 speaks about Orion's historical involvement.."The so-called prophets were often given mixed information, but the worst that the Orion group could do was to cause these prophets to speak of doom." To imply that the harvest will occur in 2011 is to speak of doom, which is not what was intended! In my opinion, Ra is clearly telling us that the Law of One has been compromised so to speak, and contains mixed information in the form of lacking clarity. Ra never says the harvest will occur in 2011, but merely attempts to work with the question Don asks.
The genetic reference in 24.3 coincides with session 14 directly too. There must be some larger picture related to Mars transitory information also, which Ra is attempting once again to move away from this transitory information in this reality that we find ourselves in. And in session 18 there are also the dates 2,600 and 3,600 mentioned which is the only other session that 2,600 comes up in. In 18.20 Don is once again asking for transitory information and Ra clearly stumbles and is a signal that the session detuning. Notice how the words are mixed..
Quote: 18.20 The 2600, approximately, time was the second time—we correct ourselves: 3600—approximately, the time of attempts by those of the Orion group during this cultural complex; this was a series of encounters in which the ones called Anak were impregnated with the new genetic coding by your physical complex means so that the organisms would be larger and stronger.
If dates only provide transitory information, how poetic that Ra would use this to their advantage to actually leave clues and encode their clarifications within the text! It is the struggle between Positive and Negative right there translated metaphorically in the text! They actually state this in session 24.2..
Quote: 24.2 Our attitude thus was one of caution, observation, and continuing attempts to creatively discover methods whereby contact from our entities could be of service with the least distortion and above all with the least possibility of becoming perversions or antitheses of our intention in sharing information.
Clearly, there can be no doubt as to how we interpret the harvest and the significance of all that I have outlined so far. The cross communication across sessions, the back and forth interaction between the past/present/future of the sessions among possibilities/probabilities..we can clearly see the present moment at work! They are able to correct their errors in the moment. Ra is showing us how we too ultimately exist in the present, and that all of our accumulated third density experience exists as one moment!
The metaphorical message is that session 17 allows the rest of the material in regards to harvest to be doubted and interpreted negatively for those who are influenced by transitory information. I was guilty of this myself. I used to be open to interpreting the harvest as instant because I couldn't see any other way as to how Earth's situation is going to get better. When I realized that things will be fine and how the truth will become transparent as the veil thins, I stopped living in the future and embraced the present. I'm choosing to create a positive reality. When I did this my perspective began to change. All these intuitive perceptions started with my grasping of the present moment a year ago. We clearly see how we must be genuine in our seeking, and to only focus on the present. Concentrate on spiritual progression, and stop worrying about the future or supposed negative agendas. After I began living in the present, my interest in piecing together the whole space drama and getting caught up in conspiracy went away. I no longer worry about the future, because I am choosing to live with a positive mentality in the present moment.
Going forward, Don intuitively seems to sense that something might have be wrong in session 17. Either his higher self offered the thought or Ra suggested it to him to reflect on the situation. Don asks in 18.1..
Quote:18.1 I was thinking last night that if I were in the place of Ra right now, the first distortion of the Law of One might cause me to mix some erroneous data with the true information that I was transmitting to this group. Do you do this?
To which Ra responds.."We do not intentionally do this. However, there will be confusion. The errors which have occurred have occurred due to the occasional variation in the vibrational complex of this instrument due to its ingestion of a chemical substance." Ra then goes on to explain in the next response that there was a spotty contact in the previous session..
Quote:18.3 Thus, first the phenomenon of, shall we say, a spotty contact and then, as the instrument relies again upon its own vibrational complexes of vital energy, the vital energy in this case being very low, it became necessary to abruptly cut off communication in order to preserve and nurture the instrument.So what does a variation in the vibrational complex and a spotty contact exactly provide for the negative entity? It can't directly manipulate the session, but if negative influence was present in Don's mind, combined with the detuning of the session and the problems of the spotty contact, I think it's fairly reasonable that Ra's clarity could be lacking.
Now that we can go forward with some clarity and understanding, let's examine all the other mentions of the harvest. Seven of the twelve statements I'm about to outline came after session 17. Do we interpret them incorrectly, or do we use our newly informed intelligence to evaluate their congruency on how the harvest is clearly happening at this moment?
Quote:6.19 Questioner: Is it possible to estimate what percent of the present population will inhabit the fourth-density planet?
Ra: I am Ra. The harvesting is not yet, thus, estimation is meaningless.
The harvesting is 'not yet', because there are still millions of harvestable third density entities still alive. Once they pass away naturally, the harvest will be complete.
Quote:13.23 The energies of your Wanderers, your teachers, and your adepts at this time are all bent upon increasing the harvest. However, there are few to harvest.
If the harvest is occurring now, the above isn't a future-tense statement as if the harvest hasn't happened yet, which is what some people interpret the statement as saying. Wanderers are here now attempting to help people polarize positively, thus directly increasing the harvest. This is why when you polarize and make The Choice, you make contact with intelligent infinity and experience bliss, and your outlook on life changes. The happiness and enlightenment you experience is coming directly from infinite intelligence, that part of the creation that exists eternally present in its unified state of timelessness. So you are literally feeling that eternal part of yourself in an energetic way.
Quote:14.4 Therefore, this was not pursued further. There was a landing approximately 3,000 of your years ago also in your South America, as you call it. There were a few attempts to aid your peoples approximately 2,300 years ago, this in the area of Egypt. The remaining part of the cycle, we have never been gone from your fifth dimension and have been working in this last minor cycle to prepare for harvest.
This statement is congruent with the allegories told in session 18 and session 24. Preparing for harvest is not a reference to the harvest that will occur in the future. Ra is simply saying they've been busy these last few thousand years 'preparing' Earth's peoples through various methods. Also, session 14 involves transitory information, so Ra's clarity could be lacking.
Quote:17.22 I will attempt to sort out this question. It is difficult. This entity became aware that it was not an entity of itself but operated as a messenger of the One Creator whom this entity saw as love. This entity was aware that this cycle was in its last portion and spoke to the effect that those of its consciousness would return at the harvest.
The particular mind/body/spirit complex you call Jesus is, as what you would call an entity, not to return except as a member of the Confederation speaking through a channel. However, there are others of the identical congruency of consciousness that will welcome those to the fourth-density. This is the meaning of the returning.
The statement above is a response to Don's question about the returning of Jesus. Since the harvest is going on now, new fourth density graduates are here now on Earth performing fourth density work within dual bodies which has been stated throughout the material. On other planets, as their own harvesting occurs, entities transfer here to begin their fourth density work because of all the catalyst that is available. Earth's fourth density sphere is already formed as described in 6.6, 13.22, 13.23, and 17.1. There can be no other interpretation than how these entities are incarnating during the harvest since we know dual bodied entities are here now. Ra clearly says in the above that those from the fourth density (dual bodies) will return during the harvest, which Ra confirms by also saying these dual-bodied entities are here now. Through their efforts, our planet will become a more loving and peaceful place, and the planet becomes more and more of a fourth density sphere. As newly harvested graduates of this planet once again incarnate on Earth, this time in a dual body, this is how those fourth density graduates 'welcome' others to fourth density.
Quote:17.43 The seniority by vibration is the preferential treatment, shall we say, which follows the ways of the Law of One which encourages harvestable individuals, each individual becoming aware of the time of harvest and the need on a self-level to bend mind/body/spirit towards the learn/teaching of these lessons, by giving them priority in order that an entity may have the best possible chance, shall we say, in succeeding in this attempt.
All third density entities here that are not wanderers are here by seniority of vibration because they are harvestable, meaning, they are good candidates to polarize positively and be harvested upon natural death. They are incarnate now because they are aware that the harvest is now, and this is their last chance to polarize before they'll have to move on to another planet.
Quote:33.12 The question must be answered in two parts. Firstly, the planetary catastrophes, as you may call them, are a symptom of the difficult harvest rather than a consciously programmed catalyst for harvest. Thus we do not concern ourselves with it, for it is random in respect to conscious catalyst such as we may make available.
The second portion is this: the results of the random catalyst of what you call the earth changes are also random. Thus we may see probability/possibility vortices going towards positive and negative. However, it will be as it will be. The true opportunities for conscious catalyst are not a function of the earth changes but of the result of the seniority system of incarnations which at the time of the harvest has placed in incarnation those whose chances of using life experiences to become harvestable are the best.
Clearly, Ra is referring to the harvest in the present tense because of the symptoms. The use of the word harvestable is not a future-tense meaning, which some interpret. It is simply a reference that an entity will be harvested upon death by making the choice in their incarnation, because the physical harvest of stepping through to fourth density takes place in time/space which is what Ra has said. Ra again uses the phrase.."..at the time of the harvest", meaning the harvest is occurring now.
Quote:35.1 It is to be noted that in discussing those who are well-known among your peoples there is the possibility that information may be seen to be specific to one entity whereas in actuality the great design of experience is much the same for each entity. It is with this in mind that we would discuss the experiential forces which offered catalyst to an individual.
Quote:35.5 Thank you. That is an important example I believe. I was wondering if any of those who were subordinate to Adolf at that time were able to polarize in a harvestable nature on the negative path?
Ra: I am Ra. We can speak only of two entities who may be harvestable in a negative sense, others still being in the physical incarnation: one known to you as Hermann; the other known, as it preferred to be called, Himmler.
The two above statements have been taken out of context by others. Harvestable in the above sentence does not refer to the present tense as Ra has warned in his first response. Ra is saying that 'harvestable' will be taken out of context. Which it has..as a few people believe that Ra is saying these entities are waiting to be harvested. Those that are interested in transitory and misleading material interpret the question incorrectly. Ra is using known entities as examples to apply the great design in general, not as fact. Ra wasn't referring to Goering or Himmler directly.."there is the possibility that information may be seen to be specific to one entity whereas in actuality the great design of experience is much the same for each entity." Do you see how Ra is saying people will interpret those entities as somehow waiting to be harvested, such as at a specific date or time? But Ra wasn't speaking about them directly, they were speaking generally.
Quote:48.7 Questioner: Who supervises the determination of further incarnation needs and sets up the seniority list for incarnation?
Ra: I am Ra. This is a query with two answers. Firstly, there are those directly under the Guardians who are responsible for the incarnation patterns of those incarnating automatically, that is, without conscious self-awareness of the process of spiritual evolution. You may call these beings angelic if you prefer. They are, shall we say, “local” or of your planetary sphere.
The seniority of vibration is to be likened unto placing various grades of liquids in the same glass. Some will rise to the top; others will sink to the bottom. Layers and layers of entities will ensue. As harvest draws near, those filled with the most light and love will naturally, and without supervision, be in line, shall we say, for the experience of incarnation.
This can be taken out of context. Ra is not saying the harvest is drawing near. They are referencing the process of seniority of vibration generally speaking, and as the harvest draws near, who gets to incarnate during the harvest period.
Quote:50.5 The incarnation was understood to be one which would take place at harvest.
50.5 describes a detailed illustration of.."..how an entity sets up a condition for attracting a particular experiential catalyst and how that catalyst then is provided or is learned."...which was Don's question. I only posted the relevant information. Clearly, by Ra using this person who is incarnate now shows how we are incarnate during the harvest.
Quote:52.9 Questioner: I would just include the question as to why the time of harvest is selected by so many Wanderers as time for incarnation?
Ra: I am Ra. There are several reasons for incarnation during harvest. They may be divided by the terms self and other-self.
In retrospect of all of the above, the meaning is obvious. The harvest is an ongoing process.
Quote:63.28 The influxes of true color green energy complexes will more and more create the conditions in which the atomic structure of cells of bodily complexes is that of the density of love. The mind/body/spirit complexes inhabiting these physical vehicles will be, and to some extent, are, those of whom you spoke and, as harvest is completed, the harvested entities of this planetary influence.
The harvest isn't complete because not everyone has lived out their normal lives with death occurring naturally. When an entity dies, their harvest occurs in time/space.
Quote:64.7 Let it be said that any entity or group may create the most splendid harmony in any outer atmosphere. Ra’s experiences are no more than your own. Yours is the dance at this space/time in third-density harvest.
The above is a rather clear and direct statement.
In 65.15 Don asks a question in the present-tense about how if the harvest were complete today, what would the numbers be? Ra states they do not wish to "project success." Ra says this because the harvest isn't finished yet. It's not until the last third density entity passes away that the harvest is complete.
So there you have it. It's my hope that readers will begin reflecting on the negative influences within the mind, and how this affects our perceptions. This was exhausting for me. In the creation of my first thread I became restless and unsatisfied over the past few days, which lead to this thread. I have slept sparingly. For what it's worth, during the creation of this thread which took over a day to put together, in the beginning when I was pulling together the intuitive concepts, I was receiving energies in different spots of my head, throughout my whole body, and also a 'flow of energy' coming down over my head upon my shoulders, and an influx of energy through my feet, which I associate with positive protection, receiving information from either my higher-self, or a positive contact. I was also feeling all sorts of relief in terms of minor personal ailments, and a shoulder problem that has not gotten better over the course of a few days has vanished. When I began typing however, my chest at times became tight, I had a hard time focusing, and at one point when I got up to get a drink of water, I realized that my body was exhausted! My legs felt like they do after a good run or bike ride..heavy. It seems I was receiving positive and negative contact.
It is to be pondered what Ra says in the allegory of 18.25 in regards to the holy way. "Specifically those who are strong, intelligent, etc., have a temptation to feel different from those who are less intelligent and less strong. This is a distorted perception of oneness with otherselves. It allowed the Orion group to form the concept of the holy war, as you may call it. This is a seriously distorted perception. There were many of these wars of a destructive nature." We occasionally have smaller battles in here. Why do we sometimes seek to convince others of our opinions? It's useless. It's as if the other person is laying on the ground and you're standing over top of them and not letting them up. Accept the value of letting others think what they want to, otherwise you hinder their learning by not letting them process their catalyst, or it simply becomes useful catalyst to the effect of learning the errors of blindly following another.
In another thread, my frustration at being unable to explain my understanding of the harvest in a coherent way led me to, in a stream-of-consciousness fashion, type out a metaphorical understanding of the harvest as it relates to the present moment. This led to further refinement which became my other thread. I still wasn't satisfied, because I knew it wouldn't provide enough clarity for those who aren't able to see the deeper connections about time, or for those that are new to the material. I set out to expand on Part I. I began to grasp more intuitive notions, which became this thread, Part II. The function of intuition is to inform intelligence, Ra says. The Law of One clearly includes negative influence in parts, inevitably where transitory information occurs. If you approach the Law of One in a balanced manner, you won't become distracted by the details.
In summary, sessions 14, 18, and 24 are allegories of the symbolic battle between Ra and the Orion entity, both in their historical interactions, and the historical nature of the Law of One as channeled by the group. Ra, having walked through the gate to the present long ago, is able to be with us in any of our times, as they say. As I said earlier, you have to grasp the simultaneousness of time as Ra 'looks into' third density. Since third density is many moments that exist as one present moment (a cycle of completion), when the group contacts Ra, Ra is basically receiving all questions at once as I understand it. So the answers they give in session 22 are based upon reflection of session 11 for example, and vice versa. Looking back, I realize that session 14 could actually be intended to point to 17, but I interpreted 17 as originally pointing to 14. Nevertheless, there is no difference between the two because it's all simultaneous. How I outlined the 'flow of events' is how I perceived it originally, so I'll leave it as is.
I believe I may have interpreted (ironically) the wheel within a wheel and cherubim statement incorrectly. I haven't read much of the bible, so I'm not familiar with it. Ezekiel apparently was a prophet, which an Orion entity had contact with. In session 24 Ra explains how Orion communicated prophecy which is always unreliable, and apparently it was through the use of what Ezekiel heard. So Ra may simply be pointing to session 24 saying that the prophecy of doom, i.e. 2011, is what the Orion entity had hoped for in getting Don to ask about 2011 within session 17. I'll edit my original post and add this.
Mystifying! For as long as the material has been around, I have a hard time believing I'm the only one who has made this observation. Let me know if anyone else has. Thank you for taking the time to read this and I hope it brings some clarity. More than anything, I hope you begin living in the present without apprehension over the future.
** In light of recent clarification by βαθμιαίος which involved the re-listening project, it was made clear that Ra intended in the opening statement of session 17 to correct errors in session 16. My original interpretation of how Ra was pointing to session 14 is wrong then. However, those in the past who would have tried to make sense of this possibly would have come to the same conclusions I have. It's as if Ra knew (which they would have) that the original publication would leave the original error out by mistake, causing confusion and the desire to make sense of it. This desire would have lead others to the interpretations I made. Speculative..but phenomenal if true. If everything is symbolic, you could interpret that the material is becoming 'whole' over time, and understood clearly. The project is cleverly titled The Re-listening Project..hearing Ra's words correctly..listening our way through the distortion. I will leave the basics of my thread unedited then, because the essential message of the thread remains the same. The dates of each session all point to the each other anyway, which ultimately must have been Ra's intention. It seems Ra creatively takes advantage of the transitory information requested to link sessions together, and within each session Ra imparts the philosophy of how negative entities attempt to influence us in our direction of seeking. Here is the clarification in session 16 that Ra was referring to, which was originally left out:
Quote:Questioner: [What contacts has the Orion group made with our planet?]
Ra: I am Ra. Approximately four five thousand [45,000] years ago an attempt was made. It was not successful. Approximately two six oh oh, 2,600, years ago the group sent an entity of social memory complex to this planetary sphere. This effort met with some success but was in the space/time continuum lessened in impact. Since approximately two three oh oh, 2,300 years ago in your measure this group has constantly been working upon the harvest just as the Confederation.
Questioner: Can you name the entity that they sent 2,600 years ago?
I am Ra. This entity named by your peoples, Yahweh.
This actually seems to illuminate even further what Ra was attempting to hint at. Throughout the material, Ra refers to Yahweh as being from the Confederation. Here in session 16 though, they seem to be saying Yahweh is from Orion by linking it to the 2,600 date. Quite honestly, it's a rather confusing statement because they also seem to be saying that Orion entities came in 2,300, yet in the next session, Ra says the 2,300 date relates to Confederation entry. Ra is certainly lacking clarity here by interchangeably referring to one, and then another. It's possible Ra's original intention was to point to session 16 and this answer specifically, to show how negative and positive information was being mixed.
So that's it. It's my hope that you reflect on the influences in your own mind. Reflect on what is causing you to emotionally attach to certain ideas. Remember to read my other thread also, Part I.. http://www.bring4th.org/forums/showthread.php?tid=3222
RE: The Detuning of Session 17 and Ra's True Intentions Regarding 2011 - Part II - 3DMonkey - 09-05-2011
Thank you so much for your effort..... "Wow"
(I always considered "The harvest is now" to be a misfit sentence to begin the answer to that question. You have done something I am sure nobody else has.)
RE: The Detuning of Session 17 and Ra's True Intentions Regarding 2011 - Part II - Conifer16 - 09-05-2011
Yes thank you very much. This post has really got me thinking so thanks. The idea of the harvest being now and us living out our lives has been brewing under the suface of my mind for a while now. You have just put it out there more coherently(Sp?) then I was thinking about it. It was all abstract in my head and as you say intuitive.
Once again thanks,
Conifer16
Adonai Vasu Borragus
RE: The Detuning of Session 17 and Ra's True Intentions Regarding 2011 - Part II - native - 09-05-2011
You're welcome to the both of you. Yes, it clearly is an Orion entity that influenced Don.
I could have easily summarized all of that, but I wanted to detail its importance so there wouldn't be any misconception. For those who enjoy summaries, sessions 14, 17, 18, and 24 are all linked together by dates. By leaving us a clue at the beginning of session 17, Ra asks us to examine all the information in those other sessions. When you do, you realize Ra is telling an encoded story on how the Orion entity has been attempting to manipulate the group into asking about 2011. Ra points to session 14, where the true statement about the harvest is spoken.."The harvest is now."
Conifer - Yeah, give it some time. Understanding the present moment is the hardest part. It might help to print all the sessions out so you can follow the dates and allegories side by side, or use the Law of One link above.
RE: The Detuning of Session 17 and Ra's True Intentions Regarding 2011 - Part II - zenmaster - 09-05-2011
The superior view will always be an interpretation based on the 'present moment'. If one has not experienced 'the now', there is no convincing possible. People need transitory info, even if made up, for the purpose of reinforcing prejudices and magnifying emotions to a recognizable level. In this manner, catalyst may eventually be used.
As Ra said, "It is not the specificity of the information which attracts negative influences. It is the importance placed upon it." Consider the threads here with sole purpose of doing just that - seeking to inflate the importance of certain specific information. e.g. "If you ignore the evidence and listen to the December 21, 2012 “alignment”*** prophets this is likely to have very serious direct consequences for your own life and how you approach the future."
But we are certainly free to create our own reality.
RE: The Detuning of Session 17 and Ra's True Intentions Regarding 2011 - Part II - Tenet Nosce - 09-05-2011
This is brilliant! Luckily for me my power is out and so my cell phone keyboard prevents me from typing out an exhaustive list of all the things it explains. So I will limit it to saying that the main thing I kept beating my head against the wall was how Ra could have said something which was intended to mean its opposite. However if it was not Ra, but the Orion contact then it all makes perfect sense. Ra wasn't "wrong" rather "Ra" wasn't Ra.
I would also like to offer you and others my apologies if some of my words have been tinged with bellicosity.
... and now my cell phone battery is nearly dead... buh bye!
RE: The Detuning of Session 17 and Ra's True Intentions Regarding 2011 - Part II - native - 09-05-2011
I believe I may have interpreted (ironically) the wheel within a wheel and cherubim statement incorrectly. I haven't read much of the bible, so I'm not familiar with it. Ezekiel apparently was a prophet. In session 24 Ra explains how Orion communicated prophecy which is always unreliable, and apparently it was through the use of what Ezekiel heard. So Ra may simply be pointing to session 24 saying that the prophecy of doom, i.e. 2011, is what the Orion entity intended within session 17. I'll edit my original post and add this.
Nice reminder Zenmaster. Do you know which session describes how a contact gradually erodes when seeking transitory information? It would be useful to put in my original post.
No worries Tenet Nosce. It's apparent now how easily a simple number can cause so much confusion. I used to be persuaded by that date, but even after I came to understand the present moment placing no importance on the date any longer, since it was within the material I tried to give it significance somehow within my interpretation of the harvest occurring over time, which only led to absurd speculation as to what Ra 'actually meant'.
RE: The Detuning of Session 17 and Ra's True Intentions Regarding 2011 - Part II - Nathan - 09-05-2011
Thank you Icaro, you've done great work in analysing those sessions. I think you're right, that Orion entity was able to send some of his negative information in the session. This is very subtle. When I'm thinking about Don's work, it must have been really difficult to ask proper questions, he knew that transitory information is weakening the contact, but on the other hand it helps to put things into perspective. Some specific information did a great job for me when I was reading first time the Law of One books. Before that I was sifting through lot of materials that were only general, and it was really difficult for me to believe it. So when deep spiritual message, with honest words and approach combined with some specific information emerged, I was fascinated.
I hope that when people will read LOO and your posts, it would be clearer that no Armageddon or sudden catastrofic shift is happening and harvest is happening now and will be happening some years ahead.
RE: The Detuning of Session 17 and Ra's True Intentions Regarding 2011 - Part II - βαθμιαίος - 09-05-2011
(09-04-2011, 10:59 PM)Icaro Wrote: No date of 2,600 was ever mentioned before this session
This is incorrect. There was a question/answer in session 16 that wasn't published until the relistening project. This is what Ra was correcting in session 17. See http://www.lawofone.info/show-diff.php?session_id=16&version=Relistened&sc=1&ss=1
Quote:Questioner: [What contacts has the Orion group made with our planet?]
Ra: I am Ra. Approximately four five thousand [45,000] years ago an attempt was made. It was not successful. Approximately two six oh oh, 2,600, years ago the group sent an entity of social memory complex to this planetary sphere. This effort met with some success but was in the space/time continuum lessened in impact. Since approximately two three oh oh, 2,300 years ago in your measure this group has constantly been working upon the harvest just as the Confederation.
Questioner: Can you name the entity that they sent 2,600 years ago?
I am Ra. This entity named by your peoples, Yahweh.
RE: The Detuning of Session 17 and Ra's True Intentions Regarding 2011 - Part II - native - 09-05-2011
Ok..will you be putting that response within your searchable database? How did this question/answer not make it into the original text? My original interpretation of how Ra was pointing to session 14 is wrong then. Though the dates of each session all point to the each other anyway, which ultimately must have been Ra's intention. It seems Ra creatively takes advantage of the transitory information requested to link sessions together, and within each session Ra imparts the philosophy of how Orion entities manipulate information.
This is inconsistent with Ra's other statements about Yahweh, so maybe it is another nudge as to the inconsistency of the material? Now they're saying in only that response that Yahweh is associated with Orion and not the Confederation, which is perhaps another nudge in saying how Orion imitated Ra through deception in regards to session 17.
(09-05-2011, 06:13 AM)Nathan Wrote: When I'm thinking about Don's work, it must have been really difficult to ask proper questions, he knew that transitory information is weakening the contact, but on the other hand it helps to put things into perspective.You're welcome. I'm sure there are other slight inconsistencies throughout the material.
RE: The Detuning of Session 17 and Ra's True Intentions Regarding 2011 - Part II - zenmaster - 09-05-2011
(09-05-2011, 03:23 AM)Icaro Wrote: Do you know which session describes how a contact gradually erodes when seeking transitory information? It would be useful to put in my original post.37.4 Questioner: I have been very hesitant to ask certain questions for fear that they would be regarded, as I regard them, as questions of unimportance or of too great a specificity and thereby reduce our contact with you. In order to disseminate some of the information that I consider to be of great importance; that is, the non-transient type of information, information having to do with the evolution of mind, body, and spirit, it seems almost necessary in our society to include information that is of little value simply because that is how our society works, how the system of distribution appraises that which is offered for distribution. Will you comment on this problem that I have?
Ra: I am Ra. We comment as follows: It is quite precisely correct that the level and purity of this contact is dependent upon the level and purity of information sought. Thusly, the continued request for specific information from this particular source is deleterious to the substance of your purpose. Moreover, as we scanned your mind to grasp your situation as regards the typescript of some of our words, we found that you had been criticized for the type of language construction used to convey data. Due to our orientation with regard to data, even the most specifically answered question would be worded by our group in such a way as to maximize the accuracy of the nuances of the answer. This, however, mitigates against what your critic desires in the way of simple, lucid prose. More than this we cannot say. These are our observations of your situation. What you wish to do is completely your decision and we remain at your service in whatever way we may be without breaking the Way of Confusion.
RE: The Detuning of Session 17 and Ra's True Intentions Regarding 2011 - Part II - native - 09-05-2011
That's helpful but not the one I'm thinking of. The quote describes how the positive channel is gradually replaced by a negative entity over time. Maybe I'm thinking of the introduction in Book I, or something that someone else said.
RE: The Detuning of Session 17 and Ra's True Intentions Regarding 2011 - Part II - zenmaster - 09-05-2011
(09-05-2011, 10:11 AM)Icaro Wrote: That's helpful but not the one I'm thinking of. The quote describes how the positive channel is gradually replaced by a negative entity over time. Maybe I'm thinking of the introduction in Book I, or something that someone else said.Can't find that particular one. There is also this one:
"64.4 Questioner: Can you tell me why the slight error made in the ritual starting this communication two sessions ago allowed the intrusion by an Orion affiliated entity?
Ra: I am Ra. This contact is narrow band and its preconditions precise. The other-self offering its service in the negative path also is possessed of the skill of the swordsman. You deal in this contact with, shall we say, forces of great intensity poured into a vessel as delicate as a snowflake and as crystalline.
The smallest of lapses may disturb the regularity of this pattern of energies which forms the channel for these transmissions."
RE: The Detuning of Session 17 and Ra's True Intentions Regarding 2011 - Part II - Tenet Nosce - 09-05-2011
(09-05-2011, 03:23 AM)Icaro Wrote: I believe I may have interpreted (ironically) the wheel within a wheel and cherubim statement incorrectly. I haven't read much of the bible, so I'm not familiar with it. Ezekiel apparently was a prophet. In session 24 Ra explains how Orion communicated prophecy of doom, and apparently it was through the use of what Ezekiel saw. So Ra may simply be pointing to session 24 saying that the prophecy of doom, i.e. 2011, is what the Orion entity intended within session 17. I'll edit my original post and add this.
Nice reminder Zenmaster. Do you know which session describes how a contact gradually erodes when seeking transitory information? It would be useful to put in my original post.
No worries Tenet Nosce. It's apparent now how easily a simple number can cause so much confusion. I used to be persuaded by that date, but even after I came to understand the present moment placing no importance on the date any longer, since it was within the material I tried to give it significance somehow within my interpretation of the harvest occurring over time, which only led to absurd speculation as to what Ra 'actually meant'.
If I may attend to my battered ego real quick
I would like to point out that I never said anything about 2011 being an "Armageddon" date or making any sort of doom and gloom prognistications. But I can understand why some of what I said could have been taken so as to assume as such.RE: The Detuning of Session 17 and Ra's True Intentions Regarding 2011 - Part II - native - 09-05-2011
Alright thanks Zen.
Tenet Nosce - Your statements never bothered me, no worries. What I wrote was simply something for everyone to consider about how we tend to try and impress our opinions on others. I always see constant debates here and in real life of 'who is right'. I'm more content to let others do their own seeking, and offer my own advice subtly.
I've been feeling violet ray energy. I have a greater sense of the sacredness in all acts/movements/things, and especially the sacredness of being here at this time. I'm feeling more connected to those around me as I'm aware of the sacred moment of what is taking place at this time.
RE: The Detuning of Session 17 and Ra's True Intentions Regarding 2011 - Part II - Bring4th_Austin - 09-05-2011
Wow Icaro...just, wow. Thank you so much for taking the time to do this. I'll read it a couple more times before participating in discussion.
RE: The Detuning of Session 17 and Ra's True Intentions Regarding 2011 - Part II - Tenet Nosce - 09-05-2011
(09-05-2011, 11:57 AM)Icaro Wrote: Alright thanks Zen.well you have done an excellent job of taking something intuitively perceived and expressing it rationally. Where I have been stuck is that I have been intuiting something "big" on the horizon as far as consciousness is concerned. And yet I also perceive that there will concurrently be a "wake up call" for those who have not done the inner work. So in attempting to reconcile this with the Ra material, I have been attempting to identify this "event" I have been intuitively perceiving as "harvest". Of course, if the proposition you have put forth here is true, then the Ra material is actually silent on such an "event" and I have been projecting an intuitive perception onto the material where it is not naturally present. Or it could be that there will be no "event" of any kind, and that the world will just continue on as it always does, and that somehow it will all work out in some stepwise fashion that I am simply unable to perceive.
Tenet Nosce - Your statements never bothered me, no worries. What I wrote was simply something for everyone to consider about how we tend to try and impress our opinions on others. I always see constant debates here and in real life of 'who is right'. I'm more content to let others do their own seeking, and offer my own advice subtly.
I've noticed a change in my consciousness. I have a greater sense of the sacredness in all acts/movements/things, and especially the sacredness of being here at this time. It must be violate ray related. I'm feeling more connected to those around me as I'm aware of the sacred moment of what is taking place at this time.
(09-05-2011, 09:05 AM)βαθμιαίος Wrote:(09-04-2011, 10:59 PM)Icaro Wrote: No date of 2,600 was ever mentioned before this session
This is incorrect. There was a question/answer in session 16 that wasn't published until the relistening project. This is what Ra was correcting in session 17. See http://www.lawofone.info/show-diff.php?session_id=16&version=Relistened&sc=1&ss=1
Quote:Questioner: [What contacts has the Orion group made with our planet?]
Ra: I am Ra. Approximately four five thousand [45,000] years ago an attempt was made. It was not successful. Approximately two six oh oh, 2,600, years ago the group sent an entity of social memory complex to this planetary sphere. This effort met with some success but was in the space/time continuum lessened in impact. Since approximately two three oh oh, 2,300 years ago in your measure this group has constantly been working upon the harvest just as the Confederation.
Questioner: Can you name the entity that they sent 2,600 years ago?
I am Ra. This entity named by your peoples, Yahweh.
So the manipulation and confusion by the Orion contact impacted even how the information was published... only coming to light right now as a result of the relistening project and the confluence of minds offered in this very forum!
So that would mean... Ra actually knew what they were doing, not just in the sense of viewing the whole of the material from outside linear time but to have also anticipated the redaction, followed by the eventual creation of this very forum, and the inspiration for the relistening project itself! This is sheer genius! Bravo, Ra!
If I may also point out, today does happen to coincide with a night/day transition in the calleman system and I have personally observed and noted some sort of real correlation with events in my personal life. So... not to throw the baby out with the bathwater there. Maybe there is some other way that the puzzle fits together...
(09-05-2011, 10:19 AM)zenmaster Wrote:(09-05-2011, 10:11 AM)Icaro Wrote: That's helpful but not the one I'm thinking of. The quote describes how the positive channel is gradually replaced by a negative entity over time. Maybe I'm thinking of the introduction in Book I, or something that someone else said.Can't find that particular one. There is also this one:
"64.4 Questioner: Can you tell me why the slight error made in the ritual starting this communication two sessions ago allowed the intrusion by an Orion affiliated entity?
Ra: I am Ra. This contact is narrow band and its preconditions precise. The other-self offering its service in the negative path also is possessed of the skill of the swordsman. You deal in this contact with, shall we say, forces of great intensity poured into a vessel as delicate as a snowflake and as crystalline.
The smallest of lapses may disturb the regularity of this pattern of energies which forms the channel for these transmissions."
So NOW you pull this quote out! LOL... great find!
RE: The Detuning of Session 17 and Ra's True Intentions Regarding 2011 - Part II - zenmaster - 09-05-2011
(09-05-2011, 12:45 PM)Tenet Nosce Wrote: So NOW you pull this quote out! LOL... great find!How about these quotes:
"The teach/learning which is our responsibility is philosophical rather than historical."
"Thus those whose desires are shallow or transitory experience only ephemeral configurations of what might be called the magical circumstance"
"Since the concepts of space/time, or physics, and time/space, or metaphysics, are mechanical they are not central to the spiritual evolution of the mind/body/spirit complex. The study of love and light is far more productive in its motion towards unity in those entities pondering such concepts"
Contrast with those whose main focus relies on the importance of transient, circumstantial, historical events, and of course speaking for everyone else:
"Unfortunately, billions of people lack basic knowledge about the Mayan calendar or even when its end date is and without this basic knowledge it is not easy to understand what is happening in the world."
"in case you havent noticed, i havent discussed with you at all regarding history. this, however, was something particular to the very reason we are here in this forum, and therefore, important. "
"so basically, you dont trust Ra when they say harvest will happen at 2011."
"in the light of this information, we can say that something big is going to happen this year, and that will, at least be the harvest. the major occasion for this space/time point."
"the day before harvest, and the day after harvest can not be the same."
The question is, both how and why does one manage to get themselves so caught up inflating some ultimately impotent notion of an 'event'? The answer must be because it mirrors the dynamics of their psyche. It must symbolize a reconciliation of perceived (highly charged) opposites. You can kind of see that because each event view carries with it the personal bias of a particular justification. That is, the new circumstances will ultimately be that things will be 'made right'. Where 'right' tends to be (amazingly) what the person fantasizes about based on their own unaddressed concerns.
RE: The Detuning of Session 17 and Ra's True Intentions Regarding 2011 - Part II - native - 09-05-2011
(09-05-2011, 12:45 PM)Tenet Nosce Wrote: well you have done an excellent job of taking something intuitively perceived and expressing it rationally. Where I have been stuck is that I have been intuiting something "big" on the horizon as far as consciousness is concerned. And yet I also perceive that there will concurrently be a "wake up call" for those who have not done the inner work. So in attempting to reconcile this with the Ra material, I have been attempting to identify this "event" I have been intuitively perceiving as "harvest". Of course, if the proposition you have put forth here is true, then the Ra material is actually silent on such an "event" and I have been projecting an intuitive perception onto the material where it is not naturally present. Or it could be that there will be no "event" of any kind, and that the world will just continue on as it always does, and that somehow it will all work out in some stepwise fashion that I am simply unable to perceive.Most importantly, the process you went through was necessary. Which is why we can't be pushing onto others what is 'right' and 'wrong' because it influences others in a direction they weren't meant to go. That is unless a person willingly let's themselves be persuaded by another, in which that catalyst becomes valuable in hindsight. We should only offer opinions. This is why you should always trust your own intuitive notions, combined with genuine seeking. If you genuinely seek, your intuition will lead you through the various opinions available.
RE: The Detuning of Session 17 and Ra's True Intentions Regarding 2011 - Part II - unity100 - 09-05-2011
even though a commendable effort, it is riddled with a lot of incorrect propositions and grand neglect of spiritual information - after leaving out incorrectness about statements about various dates and so on of course.
the simplest grand statement that is contradictory to spiritual basics, is like the ones below :
Quote:Since the harvest is going on now, wanderers from fourth density and those recent graduates are here now on Earth performing fourth density work within dual bodies. There can be no other interpretation than how they incarnating during the harvest since we know dual bodied entities are here.
im leaving out the fact that harvest is not going on at all, since numerous entities seen as harvestable, and ALSO naturally dead, were told to be harvestable, in a state of waiting for harvest, circa 1981. if harvest was 'then', they would be told to be harvested. i will concentrate on the spiritual grand neglect :
never in the material it was told or implied that wanderers were incarnating in 3-4d bodies. at any subject relevant, it was always stated that wanderers had to choose the confines and forgetting of 3d body veil in order to not infringe on free will. in addition, it was told that wanderers remembering higher density teachings and activating higher/denser bodies and living like gods, was not something desired. this was in response to don asking why there were young people so easily manifesting paranormal feats. these entities were told to be in dual bodies.
so, it is a grand misstatement to say that wanderers are incarnating in 3-4d bodies. these bodies enable even newly harvested 4d entities to remember some 4d understandings. for a wanderer their effect would be much greater since the advancedness of the wanderer compared to a new 4d entity. leaving aside what they would remember, their ability to use intelligent infinity would be much greater than new 4d entities, making their seemingly paranormal feats seem like child's play. these would lead to innumerable infringements upon free will of entities upon this planet, willingly or unwillingly.
......................
all in all a valiant effort that goes to great extents to trivialize and abstract what Ra says, make them say totally something else whereas they directly answered to a direct question, while ignoring a lot of major information in the process and making incorrect assumptions that contradict very basic laws that are applied to this planet in regard to quarantine.
RE: The Detuning of Session 17 and Ra's True Intentions Regarding 2011 - Part II - Oldern - 09-05-2011
Unity, why so bitter?
I understand if that is an urge to you, but really, this part:
"all in all a valiant effort that goes to great extents to trivialize and abstract what Ra says, make them say totally something else whereas they directly answered to a direct question, while ignoring a lot of major information in the process and making incorrect assumptions that contradict very basic laws that are applied to this planet in regard to quarantine."
..this part is totally unacceptable, imho. To me, this reads worse than a direct attack on a non-LL forum, and that is rough.
RE: The Detuning of Session 17 and Ra's True Intentions Regarding 2011 - Part II - native - 09-05-2011
Unity - Your response is to be expected. You appropriately took my statement out of context. There are fourth density wanderers here now also..I did not say they are incarnating in dual bodies. Those that inhabit dual bodies are entities that have recently been harvested to fourth density on other planets, and in all likelihood from this planet also. That's what I intended to mean.
RE: The Detuning of Session 17 and Ra's True Intentions Regarding 2011 - Part II - unity100 - 09-05-2011
(09-05-2011, 03:50 PM)Oldern Wrote: Unity, why so bitter?
I understand if that is an urge to you, but really, this part:
bitter ? that is lost to me. if you can offer explanations and rationalizations as to the grounds behind that word, i may be able to reply.
Quote:"all in all a valiant effort that goes to great extents to trivialize and abstract what Ra says, make them say totally something else whereas they directly answered to a direct question, while ignoring a lot of major information in the process and making incorrect assumptions that contradict very basic laws that are applied to this planet in regard to quarantine."
..this part is totally unacceptable, imho. To me, this reads worse than a direct attack on a non-LL forum, and that is rough.
there is nothing unacceptable about it. i told what i saw plainly and straightforwardly. you may not have liked it, or you may have liked what the other had to offer and someone not agreeing with it may have irritated you. however, there is nothing i can help on those points.
what i saw after i read, was exactly what it is, no different than the exactly similar post icaro made in the 'part i', but this time bringing in the proposition that Ra contact's information was 'negatively published'.
the extensive 'power of present moment' 'presentialization' of the information and its subsequent 'irrelevantization' was to a greater extent here. despite Ra has directly said 'there is a past and future in 3rd density'. more referrals to points nearing infinity was made, which had done nothing to change the present in this present moment in past-future continuum of this 3d point.
so what do you expect ? i should go over the exact same propositions over, and reply in the exact same manner over, reiterating same things that are plainly rejected or 'metaphorized' when it is readily desired ? or, totally ignoring what someone else has shared outright ? maybe that would be better ?
(09-05-2011, 03:59 PM)Icaro Wrote: Unity - Your response is to be expected. You appropriately took my statement out of context. There are fourth density wanderers here now also..I did not say they are incarnating in dual bodies. Those that inhabit dual bodies are entities that have recently been harvested to fourth density on other planets, and in all likelihood from this planet also. That's what I intended to mean.
excuse me, but that seems exactly what you have said in the below bit :
Quote:Since the harvest is going on now, wanderers from fourth density and those recent graduates are here now on Earth performing fourth density work within dual bodies. There can be no other interpretation than how they incarnating during the harvest since we know dual bodied entities are here.
there isnt even a context here. you directly told what you meant it seems. unless there is extensive 'metaphorization'.
RE: The Detuning of Session 17 and Ra's True Intentions Regarding 2011 - Part II - native - 09-05-2011
There is no point in debating this with Unity in this thread. I suggest refraining from doing so as it will only take the thread in the entirely opposite direction. If my original post can't spark anything, his opinion is set.
Those that exist in dual bodies aren't wanderers. Wanderers are those that have lessons to teach and can enlighten the planetary consciousness (which I suppose the transitional entities do also). Transitional entities are new to fourth density, and thus are here to learn the ways of love by utilizing all the catalyst that is available as the planet progresses into fourth density. Technically you could call them wanderers, but not in how the material presents the term. This is highly ironic how you're misinterpreting my statements.
RE: The Detuning of Session 17 and Ra's True Intentions Regarding 2011 - Part II - unity100 - 09-05-2011
(09-05-2011, 04:18 PM)Icaro Wrote: There is no point in debating this with Unity in this thread. I suggest refraining from doing so as it will only take the thread in the entirely opposite direction. If my original post can't spark anything, his opinion is set.
please. at least, be reasonable in your statements.
in your last thread, you have gone the way of trying to replace the concept 'i believe' to flat out describe a situation in which propositions were contradictory to the plain information given in the material with 'intuition informing intelligence'.
in this topic, it has gone even further - now, you are basically invalidating what Ra HAS directly said, with what Ra has NOT said at all. even to the point of claiming negative interference in the material -> despite Ra had had informed of such situations AFTER they have occurred, like the case with the psychic attack that happened to Carla in another, totally irrelevant channeling session.
in such a position you cant rationally tell me that my mind is set. every other day you add to the steps/workarounds you go into for denying the possibility of a sudden scenario. it has gone over what, now, 8 steps ? i would again include them here, but i think you are being offended by that. still one wonders why you are spending that much effort for denying even plain, direct information in a material you seemingly trust, and then being offended by observations to that end.
as i said, you are basically taking what Ra has not said, to invalidate what they have said.
not to mention that you have based an ENTIRE post on a grand misstatement and misperception like the below :
Quote:The statement above is invariably the be all end all statement that people rely on supporting that the harvest is instant, as opposed to occurring naturally upon normal death.
no, it wasnt. 17.29 is not the quote on which instant harvest propositions rely or hinge upon. there were numerous other information and quote given in the previous 3 threads you participated in that subject. so many that i wont even at all bother to include them here.
yet you ignored ALL of them, and spent that effort to invalidate one single plain q/a, by going to the extent of claiming negative influence in 'publishing' of the material and invalidating what Ra says with what they dont say.
i am asking you, where all the q/as, information, pointers more than one people shared in three separate threads, have gone, while you were making this thread ? why have you ignored them ?
RE: The Detuning of Session 17 and Ra's True Intentions Regarding 2011 - Part II - native - 09-05-2011
Concentrating on session 17 only, if you can't see how it was detuned and an Orion entity gave the statement, there is no argument that can be made to enlighten your viewpoint on the harvest.
RE: The Detuning of Session 17 and Ra's True Intentions Regarding 2011 - Part II - unity100 - 09-05-2011
(09-05-2011, 04:52 PM)Icaro Wrote: Concentrating on session 17 only, if you can't see how it was detuned and an Orion entity gave the statement, there is no argument that can be made to enlighten your viewpoint on the harvest.
excuse me, again - where have all the quotes shared, and pages of information given pointing a sudden harvest in a total of three threads have gone ?
im not even arguing with you honoring your proposition that says a negative entity grabbed the contact and gave the 17.29 answer - it goes beyond logic, and is also negligent of a lot of spiritual information basics - if an entity grabs the channel to that extent, the compromise would no remain only with a single quote. there is nothing to discuss there - you are just proposing what you believe, and your belief says a particular quote that you feel that stands on your perceptions as of this moment, has been an orion entity. not others. there is no way that anything can be argued when someone says that. from that point on anyone can claim that an orion entity grabbed and influenced the channel, when they see something they dont like.
RE: The Detuning of Session 17 and Ra's True Intentions Regarding 2011 - Part II - native - 09-05-2011
I'm not sure how you don't understand that when transitory information is requested, the window phenomenon weakens and negative entities come through to manipulate information. This is how the balance of free will is maintained. Because through free will, people request transitory information, and negative entities gladly take advantage of this.
I'm still waiting on someone to find the quote where Ra says continual erosion of a contact turns the channel entirely over to the hands of negative entities.
RE: The Detuning of Session 17 and Ra's True Intentions Regarding 2011 - Part II - unity100 - 09-05-2011
(09-05-2011, 05:10 PM)Icaro Wrote: I'm not sure how you don't understand that when transitory information is requested, the window phenomenon weakens and negative entities come through to manipulate information. This is how the balance of free will is maintained. Because through free will, people request transitory information, and negative entities gladly take advantage of this.
I'm still waiting on someone to find the quote where Ra says continual erosion of a contact turns the channel entirely over to the hands of negative entities.
and im not sure how you don understand that what you propose is valid in EVERY case when you speak of 'transitory' information. this includes moses being called from a burning bush, this includes who built the pyramids, this includes atlantis, this includes maldek, this includes negative wanderers in history, this includes ufos, this includes practically everything in the material.
with your proposition anyone can argue that ten commandments are actually not negative - a negative entity influenced the channel and replied to that question.
someone else can argue that atlantis in fact did not sink - it was not there at all.
someone else can argue that Ra didnt build pyramids - a negative entity wanted to confuse.
maldek exploding can be named as a negative entity trying to influence people into fear.
............
the probabilities of channel getting compromised due to prolonged exposure and interest in transitory information, does NOT mean that any kind of information will cause the compromise of a channel instantly and selectively as you propose.
and if a channel is compromised as such, it just doesnt go away a moment later, or the next session. if a negative 5d entity made such an inroad by using an existing bias/distortion of an entity, it would continue to use it.
and, the most important and critical information you are forgetting ; there is no desire or need to physically remove a channel from the face of the planet if it is compromised or can be compromised to any extent. a compromised channel is much more usable to a negative entity.
RE: The Detuning of Session 17 and Ra's True Intentions Regarding 2011 - Part II - native - 09-05-2011
The group was harmonious in their intentions, this is how the contact was maintained in a positive fashion.
Session 17 became detuned enough, that when Don asked a pointed question about 2011, it was enough for the Orion entity to inject their own answer.