In regards to eating meat

[Bring4th_Austin]

The role of the consumer is not self preservation, it is more like self gratification. That is how the system programs us. Self preservation does not make a person think they need meat to be healthy, society tells them that.

I was not referring to the consumer, but rather to the farmer. The farmers' actions of inhumane animal treatment and denial of human animal treatment is in the interest of self-preservation. There's no question in my mind about that. There much more money and much less work in inhumane animal treatment. The same goes with organic produce growing, and sustainable environmental practices. None of these things matter to the "big" farmer, just their wallets.

Can’t 3D awareness come naturally, without interaction with 3D entities?

Possible if there were enough love from another source. But how would this happen? We see it in interspecie captive animals, but not so much wild animals. We really are the caretakers of the planet, we heal it or rape it.

How does a planet make the jump from 2D to 3D without a 3D population already on the planet? I recall Ra saying that 3D entities instilling love into 2D entities was one way the graduation was made, but not the only way.

I recently discovered (just last night in fact…) this is not the case for all breeds of chickens, but most I’ve encountered (a possum is able to kill every chicken in a chicken coop without a peep from the chickens).

With a little research you will find that specific traits can be bred into an animal within only a few generations.

I'm well aware of this, it doesn't change the argument. If the trait is already bred into the chicken before it incarnates, if it is indeed choosing to incarnate in that way, it is aware of the trait and accepts it.

I can see how a goat’s incarnation is more invested than an aphids in a sense, but couldn’t it also be true that the goat that is killed might also be instantly reincarnating as another goat?

It does, unless of course you have given it enough love for it to become aware of itself as an individual being. There has to be something to bump it out of its endless cycle, and when the secret behind the jump from 2D to 3D is love, just how large do you suppose that secret may be?

Then is the same thing not true about an aphid?

And when this time arrives, maybe the lives of weeds and bugs will be in the forefront of peoples’ minds.

We move forward in stages. When we have reached certain understandings and subsequent choices we then work on the next stage of decisions. As a whole we haven't even moved beyond the habit of consuming death believing it will bring us life.

The whole topic of the discussion was the fact that consuming vegetables is not avoiding the slaughter of 2D beings, and not just the 2D beings which are being consumed. My heart is jumping around on the subject, and I've that to make progress in this society I should subscribe to the "step" system that makes logical sense to the others I am incarnated with. To me, consuming death happens in my garden as well as my goat herd. Monica helped me see a couple different perspectives on this.

My wife is a lifelong vegetarian, turned raw vegan. Things that we try to learn how to do has always been natural for her. When I bring up something new I experienced she says she thought everyone was like that. So many things that she can see, she just assumed we were all like that. One of those things is the life in a plant, and how it reacts to her. There is no fear or suffering, unless it wilts and dies for nothing. She can tell there is sadness emanating at that point. I grew up a dense meat eater, so having my awareness grow in so many ways makes the world seem new all over again in my eyes. I am actually getting into things I either did not believe in or made fun of. There is a whole new world out there for me.

The awareness I gained was the fact that there were many, MANY more plants that "wilt and die" for nothing due to the organic vegetable industry. Just because the plants she's eating didn't wilt and die, it doesn't mean that there weren't thousands of weeds and bugs slaughtered to bring her those vegetables.