In regards to eating meat

[Monica]

this poses a dilemma for the philosophical vegetarian because it would allow for the eating of animals that were raised and slaughtered in a nonviolent manner.

How can slaughter be nonviolent?

The only real reasons for vegetarianism that hold water are:

1. Unwillingness to participate in a system which perpetuates cruelty to animals.

2. The claim that vegetarianism is healthier for the body.

#1 - I have no beef with. (Pun intended)

#2 - There are some major problems with this idea.

The first problem with making these sorts of health claims is that they have never been scientifically shown to be true. In fact, vegetarians are at higher risk of certain vitamin and mineral deficiencies, as well as the usual concern about not getting enough protein. Science HAS shown that eating a plant-based diet is good for the body, but it has NOT shown that vegetarians enjoy any kind of special health benefits when compared to those who eat moderate amounts of meat.

Respectfully, Tenet, you are mistaken on this point. The myth that vegetarians don't get enough protein was laid to rest decades ago. While it is true that vegans may be at risk for vitamin B12 deficiency, protein deficiencies are extremely rare. Contrast that with the myriad risks for meat eaters. It has been conclusively proven that the more meat a person consumes, the higher his/her risk for all the major diseases: cancer, heart disease, diabetes, stroke, obesity, etc. For verification of this, read The China Study.

Proponents of meat-diets such as Dr. Mercola dispute The China Study. However, Dr. Mercola's arguments fall flat and in fact contradict his other points made elsewhere, such as the importance of clinical evidence. And, there were many other studies, prior to The China Study. A simple search will yield much.

While it is of course possible to meet the body's nutritional needs without consuming animal flesh, in practice many vegetarians and vegans subsist on all manner of processed garbage foods with all sorts of additives and chemicals somewhat curiously intended to make the food appear and taste like meat. This is not healthy for the body. Processed foods are junk to the body: vegan, vegetarian, or otherwise.

I agree about the processed foods, and it's certainly true that not all vegetarians eat healthy. That's because there are different reasons for being a vegetarian - not all of them health based. I've known vegetarians who smoke cigarettes and drink cancer-in-a-can! (soda)

But then, so do many meat-eaters, so it's a moot point. Discussing the vegetarians who eat junk foods, is kind of irrelevant, being that meat-eaters do too.

The bottom line is that, when all those other factors (exercise, smoking, other dietary considerations, etc.) are accounted for, vegetarians still have lower risk of most diseases than meat-eaters. This is a statistical fact.

The second problem with the health argument is that it ignores the- now scientifically established- fact that every body is different. What is healthful for one body at one time, is not healthful for another body at another time. There is no "ideal" diet because there is no "ideal" person.

In my opinion, the only reason that theory holds any water is because of the person's consciousness. As the consciousness is raised, the body adapts.

Consider this quote:

A ideal (healthwise) vegan raw food diet gets 80% of it's calories from raw fruit. This reduces harm to animals and plants. The rest of the 20% is from nuts (also do not harm plants) and vegetables for nutrients (which do harm plants).

Not only does a 80/10/10 vegan raw food diet reduce the amount of damage you do, it is literally the healthiest diet that human beings have discovered. It is literally the healthiest possible human diet and for most of the world it has been impossible to attain UNTIL TODAY. Thanks to modern agricultural practices we have enough bananas and oranges and mangoes and papayas so that people in the northern hemispheres can eat high-fruit diets year round and get the majority of their calories from fruit.

Come again, my friend? These claims are not based in any sort of science that I am aware of. This is somebody who is taking their personal opinion and trying to pass it off as scientific truth.

Yossarian didn't claim that those ideas were backed by scientific study. However I agree with him about the raw vegan diet, though the ratio is disputable. I just wouldn't claim it to be backed by scientific study, because, to my knowledge, the raw vegan diet hasn't been studied scientifically. However, there is an abundance of clinical evidence supporting it. And, it's intuitively reasonable that the human body would thrive on the foods naturally supplied by Mother Nature.

I constructed a 2000-calorie meal plan according to the rules proposed above. A nutritional analysis revealed it to be critically deficient in 3 essential vitamins and minerals as well as to only contain 50 grams of protein. This is barely enough protein to sustain the normal metabolic function of a 150-pound person who is completely sedentary (i.e. lying in a hospital bed). I will also point out that having 10% of the calories come from greens equated to 30 cups of raw spinach.

So, my friends, here is some dietary advice from somebody who is an actual bona fide nutrition expert as well as an avid student of the Law of One.

But, respectfully, apparently not well educated on the raw vegan diet. Which is understandable, being that it's a relatively new phenomenon. I invite you to become acquainted with the works of Dr. Gabriel Cousens. He's an MD and absolutely the most brilliant proponent of the raw vegan diet. However, he recommends a higher fat ratio than the 80-10-10. There are different schools of thought on the raw vegan diet. Dr. Cousens has the most clinical experience to back up his views.

Start here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yiQE-YF11qU

when it finishes, #2 will pop up automatically

Here is #4, where he starts talking about problems in vegan diet:

04 - Problems of the Vegan Diet - Dr Gabriel Cousens MD - Overview of Great Health Debate, Dr. Cousens vs. Dr. Mercola
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DkXrBgSvyJ8&NR=1

05 - Common Deficiencies in Both Meat and Vegan Diets - Dr Gabriel Cousens MD
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KRwlgHghPGM

06 - Meat Eater Scare Tactics - Healthly Vegan Mental Health -
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-VkDxdufj...re=related

07 - Healthly Vegan Mental Health and Healthy Vegan Babies Part 2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q8syy2NbeAQ&NR=1
(He talks about DHA in bluegreen algae here)

08 - Acidity Alkalinity and Mental Health - Dr Gabriel Cousens MD
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hFsScI6ljd4&NR=1

09 - Creating the Right Diet for your Life Agenda
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B04lgiuzT...re=related

10 Live Food Turns on your Anti-Aging Genes and
Turns Down your Inflammation Genes
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_AIwYibEs...re=related

11 - Live Food Has the Potential to Create Super Athletes
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hUNiF8pIu...re=related

12 - Eating According to your Age, Seasons, Location,
and Constitution: An Ayurvedic Approach
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EFBu3tVi5a4

13 Holistic (Mind Body Emotions Spirit) Approach to Diet
Vs Allopatic
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7nbR8JJlPdc

14 - Issues with High Carb Low Fat Diet
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pUPa9eQSk...re=related

15 - The Enlightenment Cuisine
and Locavore Discussion
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YIhJjVwctUI&NR=1

16 - Reality of Veganic Farming
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XEV5ckhxW...re=related

17 - The Less you Eat, the Longer you Live
Energy as Food
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T2Xz-vyji...re=related

18 - The Proven Dangers of the Meat Fish
Chicken and Dairy Diet
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mf7IINReIjk&NR=1

19 - Big Picture of the Health Debate Discussion
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v5vBAoM6DkA&NR=1

20 - Evidence of Successful Live Food and
Plant Source Cultures in History
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LXMOTLtrcMs

Seek first to understand what the actual physical needs of the human body are, i.e. what is the minimum amount of the 23 essential vitamins and minerals, essential fats, and protein needed for the body to function properly.

Those RDA amounts are all based on cooked foods, so those values are obsolete. Raw foods are absorbed so much better, that less is needed.

Check out these raw vegan bodybuilders:

http://www.markusrothkranz.com/muscledvd...ledvd.html

I purchased this dvd set and highly recommend it. Mind-blowing! Shatters all the myths about what the human body needs to thrive. These people are living it.

Secondly, seek to understand which foods contain which nutrients. It is not enough to simply eat "fruits and vegetables" for optimal nutrition. Especially if you are choosing a vegetarian lifestyle.

I don't know anyone claiming that only fruits and veggies are enough. The diet must also include nuts and seeds.

Thirdly, forget about all these supposed nutrition gurus who claim that their way is the one true way. There is no one true way.

True, because we're not all at the same place in our evolution. However, the raw vegan diet, by all indications, seems congruent with what Ra has told us about the direction we're going in - towards a nonviolent 4D reality, an eventually consumption of only living nectar. As I said previously in this thread, no one is going to make the leap from hamburgers directly to living nectars. It's a process. Eliminating dead animals is the first logical step.

In my opinion, the best reason to be a vegetarian is simply because you choose to be a vegetarian, and because you have the free will to do so. You do not need to justify your choice with any sort of philosophical argument.

No one needs to justify their choice. But why not? There are so many reasons to quit eating animals! The list of reasons is so long...

And if you DON'T choose to be a vegetarian, please don't worry about whether or not this is going to retard your spiritual progress. Spiritual growth has much more to do with what is coming out of your mouth, than what is going into it.

Tenet, after reading your excellent points about war, I am quite surprised by this. I view the slaughter of animals, in the same way you view war.

All things are one, that there is no polarity, no right or wrong, no disharmony, but only identity. All is one, and that one is love/light, light/love, the Infinite Creator.

This is the bottom line. Everything else is an illusion. Including that hamburger.

Including that child killed in a raid in Iraq?

Not trying to be sarcastic here! But just making a point. I agree with you 100% on war. I invite you to consider the incongruency, of viewing war as incompatible with the STO path, yet slaughtering animals is compatible and 'just an illusion'. How is animal cruelty an illusion, while cruelty to humans not an illusion? Why is war unacceptable, but supporting cruelty to our younger brethren, acceptable? Do you see the incongruency here?

I invite you to read this entire thread, Tenet.

---

If all bacteria in your body die, so do you.

If all enzymes in your body die, so do you.

Very true. We have more microbes in our bodies than we do cells. This is fact.

We are supposed to evolve towards becoming beings of light.

The best health comes about from taking in light. Not death. The darkness inside folks just love to feed on death, with their mouth, with their eyes, with their ears. Kind of strange how Mankind is so easily manipulated by those that understand what forms and shapes your mind. I can guarantee that any person born into a natural vegetarian household will not begin to salivate when they see an animal run across their path. In fact you have to love the thrill of killing before the thought of killing even enters the mind when something crosses your path.

Can you tell me in simple terms exactly where you can take in light in the form of an ingestible substance?

It has taken a long time to create this system of mass production of death, and getting folks addicted enough to pay for it.

I wish there were more that were willing to step up against the false "Law" instead of taking the path of least resistance.

Well said!

Life begets life.

Death begets death.

OK this is kinda over-the-top evangelical, but right on!

http://www.markusrothkranz.com/