6th-Density Negatively Polarized Wanderers?

[unity100]

Yes, i have read parts of the Quran many times. And no im not a muslim. But i still know a thing or two.

only parts of the quran wont suffice. even if you attempt to read entirety of koran slowly, by cross referencing the surah with hadith, and what was happening at the time when that surah was supposedly sent by god, it still wont suffice in preventing the negative orders and nature of the material thats in there.

that is despite there is no need to do as such - koran says it is sufficient by itself.

First, there is no sura called "Tevbe". I think you mean "Tawbah" or "Tobah" which means repentance. A reget for a past action.

yes, there is a surah called tevbe. it is its name in turkish.

I would also like to start with the fact that yes, you can interpret Quran because evidently there are numerous explanations of the text.

no you cannot interpret koran. period. it goes against what koran itself says. whomever reads it, and understands something, is true. noone else can interpret anything over that person's own understanding. so, if someone read and saw that god orders him to kill christians and jews, he is right.

'numerous explanations of the text' all are there because of various islamic scholars coming and going over the course of history and doing scholarly work on it. however, this was something that should never have happened, since koran says there can be nothing in between god and the subject, eliminating the means and potentials for any kind of priest caste in the religion.

however as a result of the traditions and regional culture, inevitably a caste of imams have been produced in islam too.

It is true that the Quran has all of those rules that are supposed to guide a person in his daily life. Remember that these rules were sent to human beings in the desert more than a thousand years ago. Back then, people pillaged, raped, killed and commited crazy deeds like slavery and worst. These sort of actions are adressed in the Quran, and especially in "Al-Tawbah" Sura simply for a cause of instilling some order into the minds of men.

When this holy book came and told people that there is order even in what you may portray as chaos, it was a revolutionary idea. Instead of people waging wars and raids randomly, motivated and driven by loot and power only, a form of order came in to try and lessen the distortion of the people at those times in that area and region.

I fully understand why the Quran would tell us how to divide slaves and loot between each other. I can also fully understand why the Quran sets and defines the Women's value and place in society. At those times, like today, the distortion of female inferiority existed, and male superiority too. When you put an outline to those in a way that is no longer as offensive and cruel as before, then yes, it is portrayed as positive.

There is no argue as to whether negative influence was present in the channeling / making up of the Quran. Because it is evidently there. But, there is a point i tend to argue about and that is whether the Quran has positive teachings or not. And it does.

yees. an order was needed for raping and pillaging and distribution of loot. that is something quite positive.

are you aware that you are basically appreciating and rationalizing institutionalization of negative behavior as positive ?

so, you are basically saying that there was too much negative behaviors in an environment of chaos, and koran, whatever its source was, brought an order to that chaos.

that is what 5th d negative entities do -> bring order to the undisciplined, wanton negativity of 4d negative. in case you remember, ra has told that 5d negative entities see the universe as something that is to be put in order.

Al Tawbah 9:5
"And when the sacred months have passed, then kill the polytheists wherever you find them and capture them and besiege them and sit in wait for them at every place of ambush. But if they should repent, establish prayer, and give zakah, let them [go] on their way. Indeed, Allah is Forgiving and Merciful."

Eeven though the relationship between a Muslim believer and a polytheist is further explained in earlier ayat and parts of the Quran. This is a good example that you decided to use. It is not a secret that nonbelievers are wrongdoers in the Quran, but if they should repent, then the outcome is totally positive. Clearly, there was a need, in the opinion of the channeling entity, for the instillation of order in the chaotic desert. People who were polytheists back then, were far away from even getting close to acknowledge the Law of One. Islam, is just one step which could be final also, towards the one.

so you are basically portraying killing of people who were thought to be 'wrongdoers' as something positive.

on top of that, you are accepting and rationalizing killing of people, who believe in polytheism, and not the 'one'.

instead of acceptance of those entities, the 'order' that is needed takes the extreme of killing them ?

I know that alot of muslims support this method of thought whch you emphasize on, that the Quran is god's unchanged words and that everythign written in it, is 100% true and relevant. I also know alot of muslims who think differently. I am not inclined and limited to believe in a manner and way that seem primitive to me. Just as the old testament, i know that its full of horror and negativity, but i also know that it is full of positive teachings too.

those muslims who dont think 100% of koran is true wont be able to voice their opinion in any muslim country.

moreover, what they say contradicts koran itself. it says its unchanged, and the word of god.

again, i would like to see that part 'full of positive teachings', if you dont mind speaking about. i have read koran in the manner i described above 4 times, yet, i havent seen any 'positivity' in it. if you are talking about how 'there is one' being a positive thing, the mention of that doesnt make any part of koran positive.

All the parts that you quoted are totally positive in my opinion. If again, you look at the time period of which they were more relevant to.

excuse me, you are proposing that institutionalization of pillage, slaughter, suppression of entities who believe other religions under pain of death, as positive.

you cant. there is nothing positive about 'putting an order' to pillage, slaughter, suppression. regardless of the time and circumstances it happens, it is institutionalization of such acts.

No matter what, the Quran is full of positive teachings. I can provide examples perhaps later or in another thread.

please do. it would be good to have it in this thread, since its relevant to the topic extensively.

Oh and i do want to note something that you have opened my eyes to. It is totally probable that Mohammad was a negative 6d wanderer as you said and which was the cause of our arguement.
But then we went on to argue about the positivity of the holy book itself. I would have attempted to "defend" any other teaching that was positive in my opinion. I dont take the Quran lightly. In my opinion, the Quran has EVERYTHING in it. And i do mean everything. Even explanations about planes of existance and extraterrestrial life. Light frequencies, astral entities, social and philosophical ideas and also, society rules that are the "negative" part of the Quran which is not negative in my opinion if you consider the time frame.

excuse me but you are teaching a former muslim who had studied koran extensively.

all the propositions and arguments you have used up to this point are the arguments which islamists use to defend islam or koran here.

all the stuff that you think that is there in koran, are taken from occult egyptian, judaic and christian sources that were kept in monasteries in caanan for thousands of years. this includes the tree of life (the tree which mohammad passes as last before reaching 'god') to other paranormal teachings that go back to egypt.

and again, there can be no justification of institutionalization of murder, slaughter, pillage, looting and suppression to make them positive. it is just an institutionalization of these negative acts, just in the manner in which a negative 5d entity would do.

I would also like to note that disinformation about "Jihad" is much too common.

so is the disinformation against 'disinformation' about jihad.

however, koran's god openly ordering muslims to make war against jews, christians is not something that is open to discussion. if you take koran seriously, it is as clear as day, it is god's own word, and it is directly understandable. and it is ordering muslims to wage constant war against these groups until they are either converted or subdued.

this is negative.