In regards to eating meat

[Diana]

The one i linked is this HFAC/Certified
Humane® (not the american one) right ?

Edit: Yea http://www.certifiedhumane.org/index.php...act-sheets

I want to emphasize how much I appreciate this kind of helpful information. It addresses what is truly the problem. The problem is Not that humans eat meat. Human have evolved over millions of years to eat meat. I have yet to see one of the vegetarians acknowledge this fact, or comment about the video I posted about Aajonus V, who actually healed his body when the Inuits told him to eat raw meat, and as he was dying Coyotes brought him rabbit as an offering which he ate, after being sick and vegan, and experienced immediate health benefits, and eventually healed to vibrant health.

Monica responded to it. And I will too. That is a beautiful story. I love it. The healing was probably on more than one level. For one, love. The love coming from the coyote, the Inuit, and receiving the love. Also, the connection we have lost with nature was reestablished. And finally, the meat was RAW. Raw food is what our bodies know how to digest and use for fuel and healing.

The problem is not that people eat meat, it's the inhumane treatment of animals and the factory farming system that we have. That's atrocious, I don't think anyone on this board would disagree on that.

Agreed, that is the core of the problem, a closed heart and connection to all. I would like to think that no one here would disagree with that. There are some here like Austin, who farms humanely, and a few have mentioned seeking out locally and humanely farmed meat and eggs.

It goes deeper. Humane treatment of animals for food is a huge leap from factory farming. And yet, there still exists the fact that animals do not want to be killed. I find it difficult to comprehend that Gaia would say the animals don't mind. I do understand the circle of life, and perhaps you meant that their souls understand it (like we do). But who wants their life cut short to be food?

We have discussed gratitude here before, but I will mention it. If one eats meat, yes, the gratitude you give as the Native Americans do is an acknowledgment of the circle of life, and your gratitude for the sacrifice an animal made to be food. The intention is there, and that's good. Remember though, that this was meant in a time when humans were part of that cycle, their bodies decomposed into the soil, or at least their ashes became part of the soil, which nourished the plants, which nourished the animals, etc.

And we come to, what does the meat do to your spiritual nature? There is the fact that animals (no matter how much their souls might understand) do not want to die. Not only does this seem like an infringement of free will (and I have at length talked about plants in regards to that, but would be happy to repeat), but it also suggests that the fear and terror of dying is in the food, both chemically and energetically.

Also, animals are by their natures violent and/or fearful. They live in a violent and fear-based paradigm (fight-or-flight all the time). What are you consuming when you consume an animal?

So I think that is what bothers me most about this particular thread, I find it dis empowering.

I can only imagine that you find it disempowering because you are in conflict. I can tell from your writing that you are a sensitive, loving person. We are all here to discuss. And if you were comfortable in your choices, you would not feel disempowered no matter what anyone said.

I was not a true vegetarian, but ate fish , eggs, milk thinking back. But I ended up in a transpersonal crisis, a difficult spiritual awakening in which I became really ungrounded and took quite a while to regain stability. The stress probably contributed to the severe anemia I experienced. Eating meat helped with the the ungroundedness and anemia, both. I've already mentioned the social/community environment I am in which supported neither spiritual awakening, nor vegetarianism.

No matter what a person eats, it's best to eat responsibly--to make sure you nourish the body well. This goes for meat-eaters, vegetarians, vegans, no matter. It sounds to me as though you were thrown out of balance, and were having both good and deleterious results. The idea is to balance. If you try again to be vegetarian, a bit of research on healthy eating would be good, and to take it at a pace that doesn't upset your life too much.

As for your environment, this is where I completely depart from your stance. Why on earth would this stop you, because others don't support it? You are your own person, and stand in your own integrity. If you lived with an STS individual, would you comply to his/her wishes? It is easy to be a vegetarian for the most part (much harder to be vegan and raw). You just eat the plant food and not the meat from a meal. Let me add that the meal, should, in the first place, be healthy for all; so there should be enough food choices for you. You can supplement with green drinks and superfoods.

So just from my own personal experience, the views posed by the vegetarians in this thread feel uncompassionate. I am not saying you are all uncompassionate people, I know that you are compassionate. But you're presenting your views in a way that disempowers. This is my opinion and reflection for you to ignore, understand, or reject, or accept. I hope you'd understand, but am certainly not counting on it, based on the 106 pages written here so far.

I respect your opinion, as I trust everyone here does. All opinions are welcome. No offense taken. Firstly, this is a discussion, and many views are presented. It can be difficult to word things exactly right so as not to offend anyone. Secondly, this is a spiritual site for seekers, individuals interested in exploring ways to evolve, and the question came up about meat-eating; hence, the discussion. Thirdly, no one can disempower you; only you can do that.

Perhaps you can forgive the vegetarians for their passion. I will speak for myself. I may not sound it because I tend to intellectualize everything, but I am very sensitive. I don't even like driving by the properties with horses. They are almost always just standing there, staring, penned in. Sometimes they are trying to reach through the fence to get leaves from a bush on the other side (some food that is real) because their own area is nothing but dirt and the processed foods they are fed. My heart just hurts every single time, which is every time I drive anywhere as I live outside the city. Humans have been using animals for their own purposes for millennia, and we do not need to.

I simply won't be a party to it, and though I miss some areas where I am complicit, once I become aware, I stop. And I do try to help others become aware. But only when appropriate. I don't preach; I respond to a question. Which is what I am doing here.

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I was watching a series of TED talks on love last night. One of the most striking comments for me was about how the most important thing for a human being to feel loved is a sense of belonging. Let me say- when the message offered is "You don't get to join the "Clear Energy Club" unless you stop eating meat"- there is no belonging there. Only separation. There is no empowerment, only shame. And that is making the subject to be very, very personal, despite whatever the surface words may be.

Personally speaking, I don't feel like I belong in this thread. I feel like there has been a false front put forth in this thread about having open discussion and "understanding" and yet what I actually feel is elitism and prejudice engaged in their most favorite of shadow dances.

I understand what you are saying. Humans, and animals, all have a sense of wanting to belong. It is an evolutionary mandate, a survival instinct (packs and herds survive better). Humans are out of sync right now, because they are evolving past the instinct for survival to higher consciousness. (This is not a judgment, please don't take it as such.)

Humans want to belong for other reasons as well, such as, dysfunctional families when growing up, leaving one wounded and separate. There is also the idea of being separate from intelligent infinity, or God, if you will.

Elitism and prejudice, Tenet, are your judgments upon people with opinions other than yours.

You also feel superior somewhat, do you not? Because you are educated and an "expert" on nutrition. That's fine. I respect your expertise, but I do not have to agree with it.

We can discuss this issue, even if no one agrees, because we all still have an interest. In discussing, we stir the soup. It is not a linear process: ask question, get answer, agree and change. It is a complex, dynamic, evolving process which provides opportunities for awareness, growth, understanding, and interaction.