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    Bring4th Bring4th Studies Spiritual Development & Metaphysical Matters closet masochist

    Thread: closet masochist


    Monica (Offline)

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    Posts: 7,043
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    #13
    12-26-2009, 02:53 AM (This post was last modified: 12-26-2009, 03:58 PM by Monica.)
    (12-22-2009, 01:29 AM)ahktu Wrote: First of all, I would like to state up front that the topic I want to discuss is considered a bit (okay, maybe a lot) taboo by many people. I do not think anything in this post will be explicitly sexual but I do feel that sexual energies are a contributing factor in the issue, so I sincerely hope I don’t offend anyone.

    You have done a fantastic job of tastefully broaching a subject that could be very delicate. And, you've integrated it with the Law of One principles. I can see that you put a lot of thought into your choice of wording. Well done!

    (12-22-2009, 01:29 AM)ahktu Wrote: From an early age I’ve had fascination with physical pain.

    I'm rather squeamish about pain myself, so I'm probably not the right person to offer any opinions, but, for what it's worth, right off the top of my head I would suggest that you probably had a past life experience in which pain was an overwhelming part of your life. Fascinations/obsessions early in life are often the result of unresolved past life issues.

    For example, I had memories of being in a dungeon in a past life, and for awhile I became somewhat obsessed with those memories. Once I worked thru them, the obsession, and even interest, completely faded.

    From a psychological standpoint, sometimes obsession with pain is associated with having had pain inflicted by a parent or some other caregiver...so pain and love sort of get wired up together. Is it possible that you might have suffered some sort of abuse as a child that you aren't aware of? Or maybe in a past life...just a thought to consider.

    If so, then it would seem to me that, rather than being concerned about the current fascination, perhaps if you approach it from the angle of getting to the root of what caused it in the first place, you might get some clarity about it, and it might even resolve itself, as the root issue gets resolved.

    (12-22-2009, 01:29 AM)ahktu Wrote: today I was going through book II of the Ra Material and session 31 caught my particular interest. It was discussing orange ray sex, and how some gain pleasure out of displaying power or being forced to submit, and it all seemed to be described in a sense that made it sound very unhealthy.

    Perhaps it is. But so is yelling at our kids, and I've certainly done that plenty of times! I think it's important to remember to forgive yourself, even if you do decide that it's unhealthy. You can forgive yourself and love yourself while at the same time acknowledging that something might be a blockage or imbalance (ie. 'unhealthy') and seeking healing in that area. We all have blockages and 'unhealthy' imbalances!

    You can embrace and love yourself at the same time even while acknowledging that there's an area you want to heal.

    Having said that, we do know that the dynamic of domination/submission is the very hallmark of STS energy. So I would venture to say, in answer to your request for feedback, that it would appear to be something in need of balancing and healing, since you have clearly chosen the STO path.

    And now I am in the delicate position of trying to be tactful here: I do not intend any judgement when I say it's an STS dynamic. None of us is 100% STO. We all have our issues we are working on! I did something a couple of days ago, in a moment of anger, that was STS. I wasn't happy about it and realized that I was in need of healing in that area. It was resolved and forgiven, but my point is that, in our efforts to be non-judgemental, we don't have to dance around what might be obvious: That harming or dominating anyone, or being harmed/being dominated, are inherently STS. It doesn't matter if the harm/domination is done to another self or to self, since we are all one!

    We can acknowledge this while at the same time forgiving ourselves and withholding judgement, since we all have that little speck of STS in us. We can help one another to heal and balance those energies.

    You might look at it this way: What if your husband was beating up one of your children? Would you consider that healthy?

    Of course not! You'd consider that STS, right? You wouldn't even hesitate to consider it STS and highly unacceptable, right?

    Why, then, would it be any different if he's beating YOU up?

    Don't you deserve the same treatment as your children or anyone else?

    What I'm getting at here is: If you wouldn't allow a loved one to be harmed, why would you allow yourself to be harmed? Perhaps you might ask youself how you can love yourself more, so that you won't want to harm yourself. You don't naturally want to harm those you love, right? So if you want to harm yourself, even if momentarily, then could that be an indication that you don't have much love for yourself?

    The good news is that, just the fact that you are questioning this aspect of your life, could be an indication that you are beginning to love yourself more, so maybe a behavior that was acceptable before might be less comfortable as your self-love grows to a healthy level.

    Here's another way to look at it: Regarding Ra's words about some using sex to control others and that being an expression of blockage or even STS energy exchange: If you did experience that, perhaps in a past life, and you now are questioning whether it's healthy, that in itself could indicate a moving out of that particular pattern. In other words, just the fact that you are now questioning whether it's healthy or not, could be an indication that the issue is starting to get resolved and healed!

    (12-22-2009, 01:29 AM)ahktu Wrote: I am a perfectionist, and don’t like to let a single detail slip out of place.

    Now this part I can relate to! Tongue

    In my case, I ended up falling flat on my behind before I realized that I wasn't in control...no matter what. The more I tried to control everything, the more messed up it got. For me, letting go and going with the flow have been major themes in my life!

    It's really strange, in a way...it's actually a lot more fun to not control everything! What helped me the most was reading the Q'uo transcripts...one in particular (sorry, don't remember which session) said something to the effect of, when we make a decision to trust, they will align the forces needed to accommodate our free will.

    Powerful stuff! Just knowing that this principle is at work, has helped me to let go of details and trust more in the River of Life.

    (12-22-2009, 01:29 AM)ahktu Wrote: My husband, on the other hand, often feels like he has no control over anything in his life and it makes him feel good to try to be the dominant personality, even in a fictitious situation.

    Well at least you're compatible! Sounds like you're very complementary and helping each other work thru these issues.

    On the other hand, are you really healing the imbalances by indulging them, or are you reinforcing the imbalances in each other?

    Here's a suggestion: What would happen if you tried some reverse psychology? What if you declined to play that role for him, or he for you? What if, instead of relying on each other to reinforce that dynamic, you sought balance within yourself, instead of being balanced by an other-self?

    How to do that? Well, you might consider: Instead of putting yourself in the position of being controlled or harmed by an other-self (even if it is your husband, who would stop short of seriously harming you), is there another way to relinquish control for awhile? Could you satisfy the need to relinquish control by simply taking a day off...setting more time aside for yourself...relax, take a bubble bath, get a massage, designate certain days of the week as days in which your husband or some other family member did the cooking, shopping and cleaning...have a Mom's Day Out, go to the beach and soak up some sun, whatever gets you out of your normal environment and responsibilities.

    By getting temporary relief by this dominance & submission role-playing, could you actually be avoiding what's really needed, which might be to just take more time for yourself in which you get some relief from being in the position of control and responsibility? Everyone needs a break from their lives now and then...even if it's just going to a movie. Maybe, if you did that, you wouldn't feel as strong an urge to escape in that way.

    (12-22-2009, 01:29 AM)ahktu Wrote: I often find myself fantasizing about being in a slave’s position, and I’m wondering if I simply don’t want to face my responsibilities.

    Hmmm....with so much emphasis in the Law of One being on free will, I'm not sure how that fits in...but then I guess you'd be exercising your free will to relinquish your free will...?

    I do remember in one of the Q'uo sessions they said that fantasy was generally a healthy, harmless way of indulging our desires. We can work thru a lot that way. So, fantasizing about whatever is certainly preferable to actually doing it!

    But, if we find ourselves fantasizing about something that, if acted upon, would be STS in nature, then it might behoove us to ask what is at the root of that fantasy.

    (12-22-2009, 01:29 AM)ahktu Wrote: Is this just an escape attempt or a healthy outlet? Am I helping to clear my chakras or only making them more knotted up?

    That's a very insightful question! Here's a suggestion: Are these activities producing good fruit in your life?

    If so, I'd say they are helping you unblock your chakras.

    If not, then maybe they're reinforcing any blockages you might have.

    (12-22-2009, 01:29 AM)ahktu Wrote: My empathy causes me to take in the pain of others like it was my own, so what better way to adapt to that overload of stimuli than to learn to enjoy it?

    Here are some questions to consider:

    Why do you feel you must take on the pain of others? What does that accomplish?

    Do you think it's ok to inflict pain on another? If not, then you might ask yourself: If we are all one, then if you wouldn't want to inflict pain on another person, then why would you want to inflict pain on yourself? Is the pain really so enjoyable, or have you somehow 'learned to enjoy it' because you felt you had to, in order to be of service? If you could be of service without pain, would that be satisfying to you? In other words, is it actually the pain itself that is attractive to you, or its association of being of service?

    (Just some ideas!)

    (12-22-2009, 01:29 AM)ahktu Wrote: There have been times that I have felt so satisfied from being being beaten that it seemed like I’d entered an altered state of consciousness.

    Could it be that this altered state of consciousness is what's appealing, rather than the pain itself? If so, have you considered trying some other way to achieve an altered state of consciousness? Some other way that would essentially allow you to relinquish control, yet not be painful?

    What I'm getting at here, is: Is it really the pain that is appealing, or something associated with it?

    (12-22-2009, 01:29 AM)ahktu Wrote: is there anything wrong with getting this crazy rush from feeling a sharp pain that you know you can truly call your own? From knowing that for once everyone isn’t counting on you to make it all okay?

    Well, I generally avoid saying anything is 'wrong' so that's something you'll have to decide for yourself. Although, a general guideline that I personally adhere to is: if it inflicts pain on someone or infringes on their free will, I would consider that STS, and I consider an STS action to be 'wrong' for an STO entity, but entirely 'right' for an STS entity. Your situation is a bit trickier since you are utilizing your own free will to initiate the pain. So, since it's you doing it to yourself, or inviting someone to do it to you, does that make it any less STS (or any less 'wrong') ? Since we are all One, does that little detail (whether the victim is you or an other self) matter?

    As I mentioned, I have an aversion to pain so I might be a bit biased here...but I'm trying to offer some suggestions that might help you clarify exactly what it is about the experience that you find appealing...and then maybe you can accomplish that objective in some other way that doesn't involve inflicting pain on anyone.

    You provided a clue here by saying "From knowing that for once everyone isn’t counting on you to make it all okay?" This seems to indicate that what you might really be yearning for is for some guidance in your life. I think maybe the Christians are onto something when they say to 'surrender your life to Jesus.' I would modify that to say 'surrender to a Higher Power...or to your Higher Self' but the idea of surrendering actually has its merits! Since we truly aren't alone, but do have a support system, then why should we feel we must take on all the responsibility for every little detail? What's the worst that could happen? Some food will spoil in your frig? is that so bad?

    What has helped me to relinquish some of that control was to realize that, even if the worst happened (and, in my case, it did! or at least what I thought was the worst at the time!), it's not the end of the world!

    My conclusion is that a health balance is in exercising our free will while, at the same time, surrendering to the guidance of that Higher Power...It seems rather paradoxical, but Ra did say that they came to show us the resolution of paradox, eh?

    (12-22-2009, 01:29 AM)ahktu Wrote: From knowing that for once everyone isn’t counting on you to make it all okay?

    There are other ways to get some relief from your burdens. They may be more difficult...role playing in the bedroom can be done in an hour at the end of a long day. Whereas, truly addressing the root issue - which may be that you simply need some time off - requires a bit more dedication and determination. I would assume that an hour of role-playing is very intense...maybe because you don't have much time to devote to it. You had a long, hard week...you need relief and you need it now, right? In order to relieve the stress in a less intense way, you'll need more than an hour. You might need a couple of hours at the movie theatre, or even - gasp! - a whole day off!

    Sometimes the solution is very simple and obvious. I suspect that part of why this particular form of release is appealing is because you either aren't willing or haven't yet figured out a way to get the same sort of release in a less dramatic way...by simply taking a day off once a week, and letting someone else take over for you. A common objection to doing that is FEAR...fear that things won't get done 'right.' A possible antidote to that is to face the worst possible consequence (like maybe some food spoiling or a bill getting paid late) and accept it as a small price to pay for healing.

    (12-22-2009, 01:29 AM)ahktu Wrote: I feel this lifestyle quirk would be a very hard one to get rid of if I decide it is unhealthy in my quest to serve others. I feel like the efforts involved could only increase the difficulties I am experiencing for a good while, so in your opinion, is it worth giving up?

    Well, I've never tried heroin so I can't really tell a heroin addict whether it's worth giving up or not. Who am I to tell him that when I've never experienced it? All I can do is tell him about the dangers of heroin.

    Then again, I can also tell him about the joys of healthy highs that don't involve endangering his life.

    You've stated that your life isn't in danger, since you and your husband stop short of that. The only other suggestion I could add is to pointedly ask your guidance system whether your polarity is in danger...ie. are these activities increasing or decreasing your polarity?

    (12-22-2009, 01:29 AM)ahktu Wrote: Do you think this behavior could do serious spiritual damage or could it simply be a way my soul has chosen to express itself?

    Choosing to wear a red dress instead of bluejeans is 'simply a way to express oneself.' Choosing to harm or be harmed, in my opinion, is more than mere expression and is something that affects polarity.

    (12-22-2009, 01:29 AM)ahktu Wrote: Once again, I apologize if this topic makes anyone uneasy. I’ve gotten a lot of strange looks when I talk about this type of stuff, even from people on my wavelength. Still, any serious input would be appreciated.

    No apologies needed! But I appreciate your conscientious concern! We are here to help one another. I have offered some suggestions, and maybe even some pointed opinions, and I don't intend any judgement towards you whatsoever! I offer these only as suggestions to consider. Please discard whatever doesn't resonate!

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    Messages In This Thread
    closet masochist - by Brittany - 12-22-2009, 01:29 AM
    RE: closet masochist - by Turtle - 12-22-2009, 03:04 AM
    RE: closet masochist - by ayadew - 12-22-2009, 09:42 AM
    RE: closet masochist - by Lavazza - 12-22-2009, 12:18 PM
    RE: closet masochist - by peelstreetguy - 12-22-2009, 12:56 PM
    RE: closet masochist - by Aaron - 12-23-2009, 12:52 AM
    RE: closet masochist - by pksmith - 12-23-2009, 03:50 AM
    RE: closet masochist - by Brittany - 12-23-2009, 03:23 PM
    RE: closet masochist - by colorado - 12-25-2009, 01:26 AM
    RE: closet masochist - by kylissa - 12-25-2009, 08:16 AM
    RE: closet masochist - by ayadew - 12-25-2009, 08:46 AM
    RE: closet masochist - by Questioner - 12-25-2009, 11:39 PM
    RE: closet masochist - by Monica - 12-26-2009, 02:53 AM
    RE: closet masochist - by ayadew - 12-26-2009, 05:24 AM
    RE: closet masochist - by Monica - 12-27-2009, 01:56 PM
    RE: closet masochist - by fairyfarmgirl - 01-02-2010, 03:16 PM
    RE: closet masochist - by Questioner - 01-02-2010, 08:47 PM
    RE: closet masochist - by Monica - 01-02-2010, 10:31 PM
    RE: closet masochist - by fairyfarmgirl - 01-03-2010, 01:15 PM
    RE: closet masochist - by Questioner - 01-03-2010, 01:50 PM
    RE: closet masochist - by fairyfarmgirl - 01-03-2010, 04:33 PM
    RE: closet masochist - by Brittany - 01-05-2010, 06:26 PM
    RE: closet masochist - by Questioner - 01-06-2010, 11:49 PM
    RE: closet masochist - by Unbound - 09-01-2012, 06:07 PM
    RE: closet masochist - by Patrick - 09-01-2012, 09:48 PM
    RE: closet masochist - by Brittany - 09-01-2012, 11:54 PM
    RE: closet masochist - by Plenum - 09-02-2012, 12:21 AM

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