This is a forum of individuals...
04-01-2015, 04:32 PM, (This post was last modified: 04-01-2015, 04:34 PM by Parsons.)
#1
This is a forum of individuals...
... not a community or institution of people that has some kind of standard of moral behavior.

I write this to draw attention to a pattern I have observed. Common examples:

A) Someone is displeased with one or more persons' post. The post may contain content that really is negative or unfair or callous (etc), or it may be just that one person's catalyst they are projecting on others. Either way, that someone responds by lumping the whole community as responsible with something to the effect of "I feel that this community is a haven from the negativity in this world; maybe I was wrong!" That person may choose to use that as reason to unregister from the forums, and also may consciously or subconsciously want others to become disgusted and leave with them.

B) One of the B4th moderators speaks their personal opinion and enters into a discussion as an individual. One or more persons disagrees with the opinion (which is perfectly fine), but then says something to the effect (or general energy) of "I can't believe you would say ~that~ when you are an admin! You are representing L/L Research and I feel it is inappropriate for you to express that opinion!" The moderator then feels less apt or much more careful about expressing their opinion in the future (or simply doesn't do so at all) as though they were walking on eggshells.

C) A moderator takes action that they feel clearly violates the B4th guidelines. The parties directly or indirectly affected make a huge issue out of whatever happened (sometimes something as little as moving a post or splitting an argument off into a new thread). Similarly to example B, they respond with "how dare you!" and call out their representing L/L Research and that they can't believe LL would take that stance.


What all this boils down to is: the person(s) taking umbrage to a post or mod action stops seeing the other party as a person and sees them as a group or institution that they foist their own personal moral standards on. Often times,  the majority of people will agree with their opinion, but a handful of people will disagree. They then start grandstanding which (IMO) is an attempt to snuff out the other party's opinion altogether, even if it's only one or two people. I know I have been guilty of that particular behavior and consciously try to avoid it.

I have worked at several positions including lower/middle management at very large corporations for 10+ years. A common behavior is angry customers call in and start complaining at the company (even though they are talking to me, a person). Oftentimes it isn't even the company's fault or my fault, yet it is rare I can even tell them that because "the customer is always right!" I am forced to constantly lie and be false with customers rather than expressing myself as a human being / citizen of eternity, which would probably result in a much more pleasant conversation for myself and the customer.  I see nearly identical behavior when people see Gary, Austin, or Plenum as "B4th Mods/Authorities" rather than the people that they are. Because of that tag on their names, if someone disagrees with them, they have to put on the facade of being political/diplomatic/patronizing/authoritative in response. 

Just like being a peon for a large corporation, it really is a thankless job, even though they are performing some service for others. I can tell you it would be very unlikely I would accept a mod position here even if it was asked/offered to me. I digress.


What I am trying to encourage everyone to do is handle your disputes and arguments personally rather than try to gang up on someone via grandstanding or calling in an admin. Just because someone is expressing negativity in one post/discussion doesn't mean it is a representation of the entire community. You are always dealing with an actual person, an individual holographic reflection of the Creator, who has personal thoughts and opinions. I would rather deal with someone honestly than force them to begrudgingly apologize to me / force themselves to agree with me in lip service only (like a child apologizing to a family friend for knocking over their vase and breaking it).


PS: I am not saying this is happening constantly and that everyone is guilty of this behavior, nor am I calling out any individual for this behavior. However, I have observed this several times in different forms over the years that I have been here.

PPS: Feel free to move this to the community relationships section if you feel it is inappropriate for this subforum.
-==-
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04-01-2015, 05:06 PM,
#2
RE: This is a forum of individuals...
I've met all of the moderators in person and am close friends with two of them. If not for this privilege of personal closeness I would probably be guilty of looking at the moderators as some faceless, conglomerate authority figure, simply because of my personal bias against authority figures in general. When I see people rant and rave at the moderators without the slightest concern for their personal feelings, as if they are robots and not PEOPLE, it makes me feel kind of sick, though on at least one occasion I've done it as well (and apologized afterward).

Moreover, I often find myself saying things on the forum in general that I would NEVER say to a person if speaking to their face, and I have to remind myself that I am, in fact, talking to actual people whose essence extends beyond whatever particular opinion they are expressing. It seems that for me and many others the internet often becomes an outlet for emotional venting that is not otherwise accessible, but emotional suppression is a personal issue and not an excuse to disrespect others, even under the protection of anonymity. There is just as much opportunity to show love and compassion to others on the internet as there is in "real life".

Thank you for this important reminder.
Things are not as they seem.
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04-01-2015, 05:49 PM, (This post was last modified: 04-01-2015, 06:04 PM by third-density-being.)
#3
RE: This is a forum of individuals...
Dear Parsons,

Longer I live, more I realize one, basic thing: I cannot change Other-Selves. All I can do is to choose my own behavior/reactions to Other-Selves. If someone if offending You, first-of-all He/She is giving a testimony of what kind of Person He/She is. This is an information for You, based on which You can choose weather You want to interact with that Person or not. It is your involvement/investment in such interaction that makes You venerable to "being offended".

Know Who You are and NEVER let anyone make You doubt it. I, personally, prefer to drop the discussion in such situations and not to offer such Beings my time/involvement – to leave Them alone with Them-Selves. That's worst what You can do to such Beings - to ignore, when They cross boundaries of good/proper manner / respectfulness.

I realize, that in your job it’s different, but I don’t think it may be compared to forum moderation/administration. Here Beings-in-Service to Other-Selves may and have full right to express Them-Selves as They see fit. If someone perceives it in “holistically” fashion, blaming the whole Community based on a Words of the Individual – that has nothing to do with the Community, but with what kind of Person They are. If He/She is doing it here, He/She is doing it also elsewhere – in fact – everywhere. He/She is just such person – projecting qualities (equally positive as negative) on “the whole”. This is a “personality dysfunction” that should be at best pointed out in reply that ends interaction with such Person.
It doesn’t mean of course, that He/She cannot change. Of course, He/She can. But it is not your responsibility to be involved in it.

Worst You can do is to permit Other-Self to provoke You. Value Self and Consciously Choose with who You interact with.

If someone would think less of You or the Community because of the Words of one Being – without any effort to learn it on Their own – do You really think such Beings are worth your time and investment to “convince” Them? And even if You were to convince Beings with such personality-set – week or two later, at the occasion of another argument, They would change Their minds back. So, what’s the point?

I think the key is to recognize with who You are dealing with and to act accordingly. Respect your-Self and expect same form Other-Selves. If Other-Self is unable to offer it, You have absolutely no obligation to prolong contact/interaction with such Being.

I realize above may be contradict to the philosophy of “seeing every-One as Creator”, but I think that to apply it utterly in Our existences, would be nearly fanatic. Creator may say "no" to a Creator. Among other things, this is the nature of Our experience here, in this reality.


All I have Best in me for You
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04-01-2015, 07:48 PM, (This post was last modified: 04-01-2015, 08:45 PM by isis.)
#4
RE: This is a forum of individuals...
(04-01-2015, 05:06 PM)Yera Wrote:  I've met all of the moderators in person and am close friends with two of them. If not for this privilege of personal closeness I would probably be guilty of looking at the moderators as some faceless, conglomerate authority figure, simply because of my personal bias against authority figures in general.

I haven't met Gary, Austin, or Garry in person & am not friends with any of them...& yet I don't look at them as "some faceless conglomerate authority figure" or as robots...but maybe that's just bc I have no problem with authority figures & never have - IDK.

(04-01-2015, 05:06 PM)Yera Wrote:  When I see people rant and rave at the moderators without the slightest concern for their personal feelings, as if they are robots and not PEOPLE, it makes me feel kind of sick, though on at least one occasion I've done it as well (and apologized afterward).

I don't think anyone has ever ranted & raved about Gary, Austin, & Garry "without the slightest concern for their personal feelings" but I could be wrong about that - oh, wait - I guess I definitely am wrong about that bc you wrote that you did that.

(04-01-2015, 05:06 PM)Yera Wrote:  Moreover, I often find myself saying things on the forum in general that I would NEVER say to a person if speaking to their face, and I have to remind myself that I am, in fact, talking to actual people whose essence extends beyond whatever particular opinion they are expressing.

Everything I communicate to someone online is something I'd also communicate to them in person - with the same amount of ease. I've never found it hard to realize that I'm communicating with "actual people whose essence extends beyond whatever particular opinion they are expressing."

Since I've been a member here the only thing that Gary, Austin, & Garry have done that bothered me (a little) was when they didn't inform Bluepill & Gemini Wolf that their favorite thread (the example discussions thread) was taken offline. That was unlike them...normally, if something is taken offline that you've posted you get alerted about it & also get to know why. But I think it only happened bc Gary was going through a lot of tough stuff at the time. (I doubt Austin & Garry even realized the thread was removed so I don't think they can take any of the blame for leaving GW & Bluepill feeling sad & confused.)

"I am all that has been, and is, and shall be..."
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04-01-2015, 09:15 PM, (This post was last modified: 04-02-2015, 02:36 PM by Elros.)
#5
RE: This is a forum of individuals...
[Image: b67.jpeg]

In the idea of infinity, acceptance of all the potentials the mind can think of is required for a balanced union with what is seen of infinity
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04-01-2015, 09:23 PM,
#6
RE: This is a forum of individuals...
Parsons for admin! Spread the suffering!

Words mean nothing.
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04-02-2015, 01:16 AM, (This post was last modified: 04-02-2015, 01:19 AM by isis.)
#7
RE: This is a forum of individuals...
I think this thread should be called:

'I double dare you...to post something negative about Gary, Austin, or Garry right now.'

It's just a wild guess but I doubt they're in the mood for reading stuff like this at this current space/time nexus:

(04-01-2015, 04:32 PM)Parsons Wrote:  I know I have been guilty of that particular behavior

(04-01-2015, 05:06 PM)Yera Wrote:  though on at least one occasion I've done it as well

Considering what they're going through right now, this thread makes me feel like this:

[Image: gLNpaTq.jpg]

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04-02-2015, 05:08 AM,
#8
RE: This is a forum of individuals...
i wish the mods the best. they need support right now. everything else can wait, imo.
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04-02-2015, 01:31 PM,
#9
RE: This is a forum of individuals...
There will be self-centered people no matter where you go.

Personally, I would be happy to say everything I have said here to everyone's face. Discussions and debates are much more fun in person.

Regarding the Mods: they may have a difficult job here being of service, but I think they can take it. That is not to say it's okay to abuse them. But in any position of authority, there will be challenges to authority (at least here in current 3D). Humans just aren't that evolved yet.

Furthermore, challenges to authority can be healthy. It can be unhealthy to not challenge authority. 

I imagine that the Mods here would prefer to be seen as part of a team rather than authorities. But in essence authorities they are. Someone's got to do the job of herding the humans.  Tongue
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04-02-2015, 03:51 PM,
#10
RE: This is a forum of individuals...
There exists little purpose in allowing those beings who preemptively act from arrogance, pride or unfounded and misdirected frustrations to provoke you, push you over the edge and cause the harmony and positively-oriented disposition one might be anchored in to disintegrate and cause regression into discordance, blind rage or combative retaliation; this I say from very recent experience, with my landlord directing threats towards my well-being earlier this morning and causing me to descend into extreme rage, which took quite some time to quell. Fortunately, I've willed my anger to dissipate, despite it having taken a bit of a toll as I'd prefer to never have to resort to anathematic retaliation or stoop down to the level of pointless confrontations over trivial and mundane factors, such as an individual whose anger towards you is based upon personal, emotional dysfunction or negative thought patterns or vibratory distortions which stem from circumstances which do not involve you, thus turning the retaliating party into a mere scapegoat or means to vent.

It is always better to attempt to dispel quarrels before they reach the point of no return, and it is especially better to avoid the accumulation of negativity via angry dialogue, with the end result being that the conflict one is involved having absolutely nothing to do with the original circumstances which facilitated it. This is especially true when there is absolutely nothing to be gleamed from allowing the disagreement/conflict to progress into utter chaos where unnecessary damage for one or even both sides would occur. This all goes without saying for this particular forum where the common principles here are founded upon fundamental spiritual acknowledgement of each being's innate essence and the collective pursuit of spiritual harmony. Why allow the seething thoughts and words of an individual currently anchored in negatively confused distortions bleedthrough and phase you, especially when simple resolution can be found in the mutual recognizance that fighting over nothing is pointless and it is better to live and let live, dropping the conflict, bidding each other well and going your own way in peace?
(((( as beyond ... so within ))))
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04-02-2015, 04:40 PM,
#11
RE: This is a forum of individuals...
(04-01-2015, 05:06 PM)Yera Wrote:  I've met all of the moderators in person and am close friends with two of them.

Crank up that boombox Yera! Big Grin
...the highest wisdom is to suffer all men to have full liberty to think on all subjects in their own way. - OAHSPE  
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04-02-2015, 05:06 PM,
#12
RE: This is a forum of individuals...
i see a back alley of a religious book store that hasnt changed the shelves in decades

i dont think there was a community to begin with

there is a lot of bad incense
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04-02-2015, 05:13 PM,
#13
RE: This is a forum of individuals...
(04-02-2015, 05:06 PM)AnarchaFeminist Wrote:  i see a back alley of a religious book store that hasnt changed the shelves in decades

i dont think there was a community to begin with

there is a lot of bad incense

As it is, and always has, we see what we need to see.

Quote:42.10 Questioner: How can a person know when he is unswayed by an emotionally charged situation if he is repressing the flow of emotions, or if he is in balance and truly unswayed?

Ra: I am Ra. We have spoken to this point. Therefore, we shall briefly iterate that to the balanced entity no situation has an emotional charge but is simply a situation like any other in which the entity may or may not observe an opportunity to be of service. The closer an entity comes to this attitude the closer an entity is to balance. You may note that it is not our recommendation that reactions to catalyst be repressed or suppressed unless such reactions would be a stumbling block not consonant with the Law of One to an other-self. It is far, far better to allow the experience to express itself in order that the entity may then make fuller use of this catalyst.
...the highest wisdom is to suffer all men to have full liberty to think on all subjects in their own way. - OAHSPE  
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04-02-2015, 05:16 PM,
#14
RE: This is a forum of individuals...
and this "community" suppresses catalyst every chance it gets

ive been lurking here for awhile and you guys just say "positivity, love, blahblahblah" but if anyone has a disagreement you just tell them to shutup and leave
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04-02-2015, 05:28 PM,
#15
RE: This is a forum of individuals...
When I lurk on Bring4th it is usually because I don't feel like being "nice". For thousands of years this planet has been bombarded with projected narratives of how to be and how to be it. I would prefer to be a part of the solution. Sometimes the "blahblahblah" is actually "heartheartheart". The tone has a subtle difference.
...the highest wisdom is to suffer all men to have full liberty to think on all subjects in their own way. - OAHSPE  
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04-02-2015, 05:29 PM,
#16
RE: This is a forum of individuals...
I've gotten over trying to be nice, I'd rather be honest.
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04-02-2015, 05:32 PM,
#17
RE: This is a forum of individuals...
heartheartheart often takes listeninglisteninglistening so the messages gets across
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04-02-2015, 05:46 PM,
#18
RE: This is a forum of individuals...
Lots of people here with full cups.
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04-02-2015, 05:49 PM,
#19
RE: This is a forum of individuals...
(04-02-2015, 05:29 PM)AngelofDeath Wrote:  I've gotten over trying to be nice, I'd rather be honest.

That why I prefer to just remain silent. Not because I am shy of conflict...

As Ra sais:  "Perceptions are not the same as sound vibration complexes and the attempt to define will therefore be a frustrating one for you".
...the highest wisdom is to suffer all men to have full liberty to think on all subjects in their own way. - OAHSPE  
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04-02-2015, 05:50 PM,
#20
RE: This is a forum of individuals...
(04-02-2015, 05:46 PM)AngelofDeath Wrote:  Lots of people here with full cups.

Is that statement about to spill over?
...the highest wisdom is to suffer all men to have full liberty to think on all subjects in their own way. - OAHSPE  
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04-02-2015, 05:54 PM,
#21
RE: This is a forum of individuals...
Hopefully, and it will be like dominoes.
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04-02-2015, 06:11 PM,
#22
RE: This is a forum of individuals...
(04-02-2015, 05:54 PM)AngelofDeath Wrote:  Hopefully, and it will be like dominoes.

I was a an engineers apprentice in my early 20's. I kept saying "I know" when he was teaching me how to shut off valves and stuff. He repeatedly exclaimed "No! You do not know, you understand!"

He was a very generous chap but had little patience. I eventually got the message. "A full cup" is merely a quiet request for acceptance, on reflection.
...the highest wisdom is to suffer all men to have full liberty to think on all subjects in their own way. - OAHSPE  
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04-02-2015, 06:15 PM,
#23
RE: This is a forum of individuals...
Wouldn't want to disturb anyone's cup.
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04-03-2015, 03:17 PM,
#24
RE: This is a forum of individuals...
(04-02-2015, 05:16 PM)AnarchaFeminist Wrote:  and this "community" suppresses catalyst every chance it gets

ive been lurking here for awhile and you guys just say "positivity, love, blahblahblah" but if anyone has a disagreement you just tell them to shutup and leave

So you feel this is the view of every forum member?
-==-
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04-03-2015, 04:18 PM, (This post was last modified: 04-03-2015, 04:18 PM by Adonai One.)
#25
RE: This is a forum of individuals...
If all catalyst here were suppressed, Gary would lock the forum down to only L/L Research donators and revoke donations smaller than $1000.
...only one important statement...All things, all of life, all of the creation is part of one original thought.
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04-03-2015, 04:45 PM,
#26
RE: This is a forum of individuals...
I sent a $100 donation to L/L over a year ago and they never cashed the check.

There is an anthro somewhere who needs me and I need them.
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04-03-2015, 04:48 PM, (This post was last modified: 04-04-2015, 04:21 PM by isis.)
#27
RE: This is a forum of individuals...
(04-03-2015, 04:18 PM)Adonai One Wrote:  If all catalyst here were suppressed, Gary would lock the forum down to only L/L Research donators and revoke donations smaller than $1000.

lol

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04-03-2015, 04:51 PM, (This post was last modified: 04-03-2015, 04:54 PM by Adonai One.)
#28
RE: This is a forum of individuals...
I'm f-in serious, ISIS. How are they going to channel The Picard in time for the next Harvest?

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Who_Watches_the_Watchers
...only one important statement...All things, all of life, all of the creation is part of one original thought.
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04-03-2015, 04:56 PM,
#29
RE: This is a forum of individuals...
Are you trying to get your account put on moderated status?

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04-03-2015, 04:57 PM,
#30
RE: This is a forum of individuals...
What is moderated status? Does it mean that they watch you more closely?

There is an anthro somewhere who needs me and I need them.
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