Oh, I See: Productivity!
06-09-2015, 05:32 AM, (This post was last modified: 06-09-2015, 09:34 AM by VanAlioSaldo.)
#1
Oh, I See: Productivity!
You, Infinite Creator.  We're all here now, and more come, others went.

I want to discuss the forum as a whole, but I want to focus towards Productivity.  I find the forum alone is an aid but the members themselves are the Gold Mines for me.  If I could just figure out who all wants to consistently work on the Law of One with themselves and others (at least weekly) and if we could all consistently communicate towards sharing perceived understanding in subjects rather than random topics would be incredible.

My favorite example is my thread in the Olio forum titled The Vibratory Formulae, I've had a few people PM me in thanks for that thread so it made me realize we have the Gold, we're just missing the Mines (threads?)

I hope to direct even a small group into helping provide consideration and guidance to other seekers that come here but may be put off by the nature of other less Oriented members or the unfocused aspects of the forum.  That being less study more play if you will.  Which isn't bad or wrong, but intermingling play with study is extremely distracting.  Then the attitude and lax moderating (Actually really liking it but just not used to it) may push some away who are more serious and devoted or looking for a specific place to practice their philosophy and research it without interruption.

So who is up for trying to get together a small membership or group of seekers to simply peruse and utilize the forum space in more oriented manners to help encourage more people to participate who otherwise would shy away?

(Would mention one member who posts threads often but not allowed to Heart )
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Fastidious Emanations
06-12-2015, 07:00 AM,
#2
RE: Oh, I See: Productivity!
I lav goooold
[Image: Austin-Powers-Goldmember-austin-powers-8...52-480.jpg]

But seriously, I will always be down to contribute.
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06-12-2015, 07:41 AM,
#3
RE: Oh, I See: Productivity!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WCme_K6MYLY

I TOO LOVE THIS NEW STAR
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06-12-2015, 09:54 AM,
#4
RE: Oh, I See: Productivity!
I just wish i could come here and seek. With the inactivity and the manner of operation.  I don't know.  im slowly finding this place is closer to a distraction.  A tool being mishandled or at least utilized less than its usefulness makes possible.

Similarly how few follow the guidelines and others troll.  I understand the trying to uphold STO principles but this is a forum of humans, on the Law of One which isn't just about STO.

This forum I'm in posting right now, community relationships, has a good example right here.  The moderation post and the split and locked threads is not STO guided, its tricky and sly.  Members will fight, so its quietly swept away, handled in the shadows, and then left and forgotten.  The fact a subforum is so small and tucked away is why they're more inactive than the upfront forums.  This applies to mainly the First set of Forums' Sub-Forum's.  But how inactive the treehuggers forum is should be an indication.

Does anyone have any thoughts or suggestions on mainly how to bring more activity and members about?

I know its not my place or forum.  But if the operators of Bring4th's forums have a problem with me pushing for more activity and consideration of seekers, well please just ban me and be done with it then.
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06-12-2015, 10:07 AM,
#5
RE: Oh, I See: Productivity!
We all are co-creators on this forum.

Cheers friend, if you want to discuss things in depth create a thread and many will be happy to answer if they can.

The mods are trying their best to make this place the best it can be for everyone, please acknowledge it. You need to understand it is ever-evolving as we all are co-creators of this forum.

In the idea of infinity, acceptance of all the potentials the mind can think of is required for a balanced union with what is seen of infinity
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Sabou
06-12-2015, 10:48 AM, (This post was last modified: 06-12-2015, 11:27 AM by VanAlioSaldo.)
#6
RE: Oh, I See: Productivity!
I understand, what I don't understand is why no one is curious or concerned about the inactive state of the forums.

And using Law of One logic on those people who come here and won't even be openminded towards the philosophy doesn't necessarily work for them.  Calling them a Co-creator to their face is like calling someone on the street a god.  Do you think it gives them any proper level of perspective or showcases the point I'm trying to get across here?

Because my only point I'm trying to get across here is.  Well, efficiency and productivity.  I haven't seen a decent Law of One discussion in the Law of One forum in a week or two...

That should be the second most active forum on this site, dedicated to the Law of One.  I don't care if a thread on a subject exists on page 2 or page 99, that is the most important forum and one of the more inactive ones on this site.

Seriously, we have the Gold, we just need the Mines.  Where's all the members?  50 guests daily but 5 members?  Why??? What is wrong and what deters them from joining up?

EDIT: Though half of the Guests are always Registering or Viewing a No Permission's Pages so I imagine they might just be bots...
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06-12-2015, 03:54 PM, (This post was last modified: 06-12-2015, 03:54 PM by Aion.)
#7
RE: Oh, I See: Productivity!
I think it could be that in general the forum isn't completely focused in its organization.

For myself, I think that the "Harvest" forum is somewhat dated because we are now past the big 2012 phenomenon and although I know the concept of Harvest is still relevant as per the transition period and the concept of Harvest and graduation I feel like an entire forum as such should be moved to being a sub-forum perhaps. I would say in the Strictly LoO section, but there are posts that are certainly not strictly LoO,

That being said, I feel like Olio is kind of an abyss into which all 'non-LoO' topics basically live for a time and then get buried. Olio probably has some of the most unique threads on the site dwelling within it. That being said, any 'alternative' spiritual philosophy usually ends up there, and since the forum is by definition "for anything that doesn't fit anywhere else" it doesn't exactly have the vibe of a 'serious spiritual discussion' usually and is a place that is often entertaining but things become mixed and unfocused at times.

This is where I find it interesting because the Treehugger's Forum is private for members only, so Olio is what most guests actually see as our "random" section, which is also where a lot of serious discussion becomes buried. However, while I absolutely appreciate that this forum and L/L is about the philosophy in the Ra material and the LoO, I think it can be inaccessible if individuals have no opportunity to share deeper nuances of their own experiences in a focused discussion area. In the Strictly LoO section people have a chance to do this in relation to the LoO. There isn't another 'serious' forum where individuals can do this in relation to their own experience.

Thus, I would actually propose for the Harvest forum to be modified to become a "Spiritual Journey" forum where we can focus entirely on spiritual seeking on an individual exploration level rather than through any particular lens. I would make a "Harvest and Graduation" sub-forum to hold all the posts currently in the Harvest forum and to keep that subject open. This way, Olio can become more a place of relaxation and light-heartedness while the more serious spiritual discussions will have a healthy home where they connect together.
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06-12-2015, 04:14 PM, (This post was last modified: 06-12-2015, 04:31 PM by Elros.)
#8
RE: Oh, I See: Productivity!
What I meant by that we are co-Creators of this forum, is that this forum is a group project within which everyone shapes it as he needs it to be.

You have your needs of exploring certain ideas which others don't just like the opposite also is true.

Innactivity is understandable, you can't expect everyone to always have ideas of threads to create. Myself I ran out of things I tried to know and am trying to help others understand what they want.

In the idea of infinity, acceptance of all the potentials the mind can think of is required for a balanced union with what is seen of infinity
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06-12-2015, 04:29 PM,
#9
RE: Oh, I See: Productivity!
I think you make some valid points there VAS. (I hope you don't mind me abbreviating your username here) I think the word to describe this mixture of interests is 'Focus'.
There is a study group over on facebook and I am aware that some of those members prefer not to come and engage here for the reasons you mention. Lighthead also touched upon this somewhat when creating a thread asserting that past threads/members seemed more focused than the present one's. I think the art worth refining for any member is to gracefully glide through unfruitful thread or posts and maintain said focus. For example...

Why did we click on this website at any given time?

What are we hoping to achieve?

It's an open forum, what are our expectations of it?

One member who, in my eyes at least, exemplifies what I mean here. That is JustLikeYou. A man of few words, and I have yet to find a post of his that lacks in thoughtfulness and focus. Another member (who is also a moderator) who consistently navigates the varying currents of focus, while attempting to steer attention to a more focused or useful thread (that being, pointing towards harmonious interaction) is Plenum.

At the end of the day it is what it is. That said, the moderators/admin staff are always open and receptive to any new ideas or suggestions. I am sure they would embrace any idea that might improve the focus on a collective level. Other than that though I feel that the attempt to persuade or guide others is not the wisest of intentions. Moderation begins with the self, as does responsibility, so for any group within the group forum or thread to manifest, it would only bloom to the extent that it is desired, thus we have what we have.

My first consideration here would be to ask, What is the Gaia meditation, how can we join in, and what visualisation is most suitable to use in this collective effort?

Finally, I would personally refrain from subtly judging the value of members who choose to post often and seemingly randomly  Heart
...the highest wisdom is to suffer all men to have full liberty to think on all subjects in their own way. - OAHSPE  
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Elros
06-12-2015, 05:26 PM,
#10
RE: Oh, I See: Productivity!
Nicholas, Plenum is the unmentioned person in the OP Heart
I appreciate the honesty. I figured we could make compromise, so i also must reiterate. This forum is human. Min touches on a good point, we have few members, we all can only make so many threads. I know i see plenum write out art and it almost seems unappreciated yet i know it is here.
I'm glad the moderation team is open as said. I believe that and have seen it.
So Tan created a great suggestion idea I'd very much agree with. I do not mean to guide, I just want to know that I'm not the only one who cares and try to push some energy into a more productive and active forum. If wanting to use a very useful tool more efficiently is unwise then i am confused.

I personally enjoy those posts. Its trolling, blatant disregard of the guidelines, and off topic commentary getting too out of hand that bothers me. And too out of hand is simply killing a thread by making several of its pages not relevant to its subject matter making maintaining linear comprehension of the conversation burdensome for others viewing the thread for the first time. It discourages new posts basically.

I dont mean disrespect. I'm genuinely worried about these forums.
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Nicholas
06-12-2015, 06:02 PM,
#11
RE: Oh, I See: Productivity!
Aha! My misunderstanding on the anonymous member assumption. It's funny but that is a prime example of how language is subject to interpretation. (where telepathy certainly is not!)

I viewed your last statement in the light of your less oriented/unfocused members comment so "my bad" as the saying goes. I reiterate that you make some good points and my main input would be to investigat how we can all coordinate towards a 5 minute meditation devoted to prayer on a planetary level. That is my immediate concern, in part because one of Carla's statements on the radio show before she passed on was "join us", in the said practice. The value of such a coordinated effort is immeasurable, metaphysically speaking.

With regards to your worries though, again I refer to JustLikeYou's signiture. "All Is Well"  Heart

I did not mean to imply that your intent here was unwise, no not at all! What I meant by is that it implied to me that we would be attempting to window dress the forums rather than freely and sincerely expressing ourselves within it. That was the impression I got from your post.

There is not one jot of disrespect in your thread here VAS and I am sorry if I came across that way. Again, I simply misread your last comment, all is well  Big Grin
...the highest wisdom is to suffer all men to have full liberty to think on all subjects in their own way. - OAHSPE  
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VanAlioSaldo
06-12-2015, 06:04 PM, (This post was last modified: 06-12-2015, 06:25 PM by Bring4th_Austin.)
#12
RE: Oh, I See: Productivity!
Hey VanAlioSaldo, thanks for the post. This type of expression has been made in various ways throughout the lifetime of the forum, but it's always nice to have some feedback on how the forums are perceived, and to allow for some reflection on the part of the mods. I am in a space for reflection at the moment, so here are some personal thoughts on the larger picture, using your own post as a backboard.

Also, to you and anyone else who is interested in this discussion, keep in mind that the mods are in the midst of devising a Community Questionnaire where we will seek feedback on various aspects of the forums which will be taken into consideration in a long-coming overhaul. Offering feedback here and in other threads is welcome, but ensuring that these opinions are also shared on this questionnaire will be very helpful, as it will have a much higher chance of being seen and considered during the deliberation. It should be posted in the near future.

(06-12-2015, 09:54 AM)VanAlioSaldo Wrote:  This forum I'm in posting right now, community relationships, has a good example right here.  The moderation post and the split and locked threads is not STO guided, its tricky and sly.  Members will fight, so its quietly swept away, handled in the shadows, and then left and forgotten.  The fact a subforum is so small and tucked away is why they're more inactive than the upfront forums.  This applies to mainly the First set of Forums' Sub-Forum's.  But how inactive the treehuggers forum is should be an indication.

Does anyone have any thoughts or suggestions on mainly how to bring more activity and members about?

I am a bit confused by what I see as a contradiction in your expression. That is, in the first post, you talk about perceiving lax moderation, but this statement seems to be desiring of less moderation?

I've mentioned it many times before, but the differing perceptions of certain aspects of the forums always tickles me. You're not the only person to feel that this sub-forum is a way to "quietly sweep away" interpersonal catalyst, but at the inception of this sub-forum, some members thought that it would draw too much attention to such interpersonal catalyst. This dual-sided perception seems to exist with everything we do as moderators. It is difficult to modify our approach to the forums when there is such a variance of perceptions in how things are handled.

The intention behind this sub-forum is actually in-line with your intention within this thread - to help to focus the forum. The forum dynamic obviously changes and comes in waves, but when this forum was devised,  an incredible amount of threads through all of the main forums were devolving into interpersonal catalyst to the point where it was nearly impossible to discuss any actual topic. In trying to keep things organized and focused, much of the interpersonal discussion was moved into a single thread which turned into a huge mess and didn't help anyone process the catalyst. Eventually, that thread served as a sort of perpetual soap opera without any real progress towards reconciliation and actual processing of catalyst.

Had this forum not have been created, who knows how things would have gone? It could have continued snowballing in that direction or maybe equalized. The point is though, many people felt pushed away from the forum because it seemed that interpersonal catalyst was the primary focus. And that is not the intention of Bring4th. In making this particular space a sub-forum, it was a hope to emphasize this - interpersonal catalyst is inevitable, it is natural, it is allowed (so long as it moves in the direction of respect and harmony), but it is not the purpose of the forum as a whole, and it is indeed secondary to the primary purpose. We wanted to offer a space dedicated to this purpose so the processing of interpersonal catalyst would not distract from the rest of the forum.

If a member wishes to seek a community where the primary focus is allowing distortions to rub against each other and play out in a heated discussion, there are a virtual infinite number of places online for this type of activity. One doesn't need to be discussing the Law of One for this to be meaningful, as every time this happens, the discussion is moved away from the actual topic and then focuses on people themselves. There's certainly no judgment if that is a desire, as that sort of activity and behavior (while could become self-perpetuating) is a way to help define one's own distortions and seek to harmonize with other distortions. But in Bring4th, we seek a modicum of self-realization where a harmony can be found towards a certain goal (that is, study and support) without the need for addressing interpersonal issues at every turn. It is silly to think in 3rd density that this type of catalyst can (or should) be avoided, and thus this sub-forum was created - acknowledge, honor, and process this catalyst, but don't let it distract from the primary purpose. (To give my own biased opinion as a moderator, I think this sub-forum has worked very well for its intended purpose given the nature of the discussion taking place in the rest of the forum now versus when we created this space, and general feedback.)

You also mentioned the closed threads - we fully believe that this type of interpersonal growth cannot take place unless harmony and reconciliation are the primary goals in participating in such interpersonal discussion. Not everyone will have these goals, and not every discussion will maintain those goals. At a certain point, the discussion ceases to be processing of interpersonal catalyst and energizing and perpetuating of interpersonal catalyst, where reconciliation is no longer in sight within a discussion. This is markedly not the intent of this forum. We don't wish to provide a space just for people to fight. Working through disharmony towards harmony is one thing, but when the discussion is not headed towards harmony (in the eyes of the mods), then we'll cease to provide a space for that.

And a note about the statement about our actions being "is not STO guided": I do truly understand the perception that certain types of moderation are not rooted in a service-to-others mentality. Some people think any moderation at all is an infringement on the level of service-to-self. In the dual-sided perception aspect, some people think we are not being "STO guided" because we are not quicker to squash what is perceived as negativity and harmful communication.

What is or isn't "STO guided," how we can apply those labels, whether those labels are relevant in any infinite number of contexts - it is all subject for massive discussion which has been  had time and time again in many places on this forum and off, and internally by the moderators. But, for as far as you're willing to take my word, I can guarantee you one thing: the creators and moderators of this forum have an overwhelming and abundant desire to fulfill a certain vision that Don, Carla, Jim and L/L Research have for a community, that is, to provide a positive space for wanderers and seekers to come together and share in love, and discuss this philosophy that is so dear to all of our hearts. We desire this so strongly that when we feel that we fail, it literally keeps us up at night. In working with L/L Research in many different ways, I can truly say that nothing has given me more emotional catalyst than the attempt to moderate this forum in a positive and service-oriented way, and I know that this is also (basically) the same for GLB and Plenum. Our desire is never to be tricky or sly in how we operate this community. An entire encyclopedia could be printed with the amount of correspondence that goes in to how we approach this community in the attempt to be as positive as we possibly can in upholding the vision of L/L Research. When we receive feedback which hints that we may have failed at this, it can be very easy to beat ourselves up. And we do, probably a lot more than you would think.

But to see a weary wanderer comforted, to see a seeker reach a new level of understanding, to understand myself a new metaphysical concept, to hear stories of how the Law of One and Bring4th have helped seekers in their lives, to see a healthy debate unfold and various perspectives being shared in a positive space, to witness just how passionate people can be in their spiritual seeking - it is a very fulfilling thing.

I think it's true for anyone in a position to receive feedback that negative feedback will be much more apparent than positive feedback, and so it is a constant struggle to remember the positive experiences people have on the forums, and the desire and amount of work we put into to trying to make this a positive space. It is too easy for us to witness our own efforts here with a jaundiced eye. But we are always fueled by our desire to maintain this vision, and always seeking to find better ways to approach the community.



Quote:But if the operators of Bring4th's forums have a problem with me pushing for more activity and consideration of seekers, well please just ban me and be done with it then.

Done.

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06-12-2015, 06:27 PM,
#13
RE: Oh, I See: Productivity!
(06-12-2015, 06:04 PM)Bring4th_Austin Wrote:   I can guarantee you one thing: the creators and moderators of this forum have an overwhelming and abundant desire to fulfill a certain vision that Don, Carla, Jim and L/L Research have for a community, that is, to provide a positive space for wanderers and seekers to come together and share in love, and discuss this philosophy that is so dear to all of our hearts.

(((  Heart  )))

(06-12-2015, 06:04 PM)Bring4th_Austin Wrote:  But to see a weary wanderer comforted, to see a seeker reach a new level of understanding, to understand myself a new metaphysical concept, to hear stories of how the Law of One and Bring4th have helped seekers in their lives, to see a healthy debate unfold and various perspectives being shared in a positive space, to witness just how passionate people can be in their spiritual seeking - it is a very fulfilling thing.

(((  Heart  )))

The high level of integrity I felt while reading the introduction to the LoO in book 1 has just been reflected here. Beautifully written Austin and much love to you guys. One of the main reasons I don't PM or email you when I would like is because of the surety that you are hard pressed with the work load you already have. I love you all from the infinite depth of my limited heart  Heart 

We learn from each other but we cannot learn for each other.
...the highest wisdom is to suffer all men to have full liberty to think on all subjects in their own way. - OAHSPE  
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06-14-2015, 08:03 AM,
#14
RE: Oh, I See: Productivity!
(06-12-2015, 06:27 PM)Nicholas Wrote:  Beautifully written Austin and much love to you guys. One of the main reasons I don't PM or email you when I would like is because of the surety that you are hard pressed with the work load you already have. I love you all from the infinite depth of my limited heart  Heart

I literally cried a little bit.  This effectively sums up my feelings towards Bring4th.

I took some time to think about who I am because of your words, Austin.  I appreciated your response greatly, and I feel almost ashamed that I couldn't give back such a beautiful response, when a few months ago I could have.  So I'm going to do my best to address everything everyone has said, including you Nick, because I want to give you some perspective on my perspective towards why everything you could ever say or do would be accepted and loved and forgiven by me.

-gets all dramatic-
-turns on the Bold font-

(06-12-2015, 06:04 PM)Bring4th_Austin Wrote:  Hey VanAlioSaldo, thanks for the post. This type of expression has been made in various ways throughout the lifetime of the forum, but it's always nice to have some feedback on how the forums are perceived, and to allow for some reflection on the part of the mods. I am in a space for reflection at the moment, so here are some personal thoughts on the larger picture, using your own post as a backboard.

Also, to you and anyone else who is interested in this discussion, keep in mind that the mods are in the midst of devising a Community Questionnaire where we will seek feedback on various aspects of the forums which will be taken into consideration in a long-coming overhaul. Offering feedback here and in other threads is welcome, but ensuring that these opinions are also shared on this questionnaire will be very helpful, as it will have a much higher chance of being seen and considered during the deliberation. It should be posted in the near future.

(Just to be clear, basically reiterate all of these concerns and suggestions on the questionnaire essentially?  Totally acceptable, and good to know.)






(06-12-2015, 09:54 AM)VanAlioSaldo Wrote:  This forum I'm in posting right now, community relationships, has a good example right here.  The moderation post and the split and locked threads is not STO guided, its tricky and sly.  Members will fight, so its quietly swept away, handled in the shadows, and then left and forgotten.  The fact a subforum is so small and tucked away is why they're more inactive than the upfront forums.  This applies to mainly the First set of Forums' Sub-Forum's.  But how inactive the treehuggers forum is should be an indication.

Does anyone have any thoughts or suggestions on mainly how to bring more activity and members about?

I am a bit confused by what I see as a contradiction in your expression. That is, in the first post, you talk about perceiving lax moderation, but this statement seems to be desiring of less moderation?

Lax and less are not the same in my mind so I might need to explain a bit more in depth.  Having a lax moderation to me is witnessing breaking of the rules and allowing it to continue past a point of reconciliation.  I could also be biased as I don't know how common this place is under watch.  However, my statement isn't desirous of less moderation, but more transparent moderation.  From what I have seen (and it is not a lot so I don't really want to stand behind just this example)  Why were some of the locked threads (posts) moved out of view of the public?  Seeing that moderation occurs would be useful for some.  I actually appreciated the post.  I thought it was odd how it was all moved and handled privately though when it was occurring partly in public forums.  Again, I don't want less, just surprised at how it was handled.

(06-12-2015, 06:04 PM)Bring4th_Austin Wrote:  I've mentioned it many times before, but the differing perceptions of certain aspects of the forums always tickles me. You're not the only person to feel that this sub-forum is a way to "quietly sweep away" interpersonal catalyst, but at the inception of this sub-forum, some members thought that it would draw too much attention to such interpersonal catalyst. This dual-sided perception seems to exist with everything we do as moderators. It is difficult to modify our approach to the forums when there is such a variance of perceptions in how things are handled.

If you have a desire to make your forums the way you think will bring forth a better manner of seeking and activism as once described for their presence here.  Allow a few to question the manner of operation, if you're humble, transparent, and serious about the guidelines and their enforcement, asking a few members to remain true to the purpose of this forum in those areas where it's asked should not be an adequate excuse to say it's STS oriented or hypocritical to moderate behavior that isn't consonant with the purpose.  Unless you guys approach it in an iron-fist way I couldn't imagine the accusation of such occurring from what I have seen so far.  If you used to have admins or mods who were more strict, it might explain why some expressed that.  As such it seems you guys took it to heart since the older threads express such changes.  But as things are now, I don't think it's fair to you all to be told to allow others to turn your place and your desire into their desire because of the principles of a higher manner of Being.  This forum is not a social memory complex and it is not a collective consciousness of individuals.  It's a website, human designed with human bugs and human people.  You are all as good as you are trying to be.  But letting others use this place the way they want at the cost of many untold others isn't really consonant sounding to the mission of this forum.  Which to my understanding from another post in the Corkboard Forum is along the lines of Spiritual Activism and...Or at least place for Seekers to Study and interact.  I may say lax in that it appears you guys do not strive for that mission on a daily basis (which I highly doubt is true...), but I really only meant it as an allowance of members using this place in ways it wasn't meant for past an allowed point.  Which, as it does vary with everyone, I think would be a powerful way of balancing Love and Wisdom when dealing with what variances of acceptance, forgiveness, and allowance are most beneficial to the Whole Forum in a demonstrative, or at least, approachable and appreciated way...  I care too much.  So I sit here judging where I have no place to because I have an opinion that my configuration would be better, when I honestly don't have any configuration to offer.  But instead, ideas.

(06-12-2015, 06:04 PM)Bring4th_Austin Wrote:  The intention behind this sub-forum is actually in-line with your intention within this thread - to help to focus the forum. The forum dynamic obviously changes and comes in waves, but when this forum was devised,  an incredible amount of threads through all of the main forums were devolving into interpersonal catalyst to the point where it was nearly impossible to discuss any actual topic. In trying to keep things organized and focused, much of the interpersonal discussion was moved into a single thread which turned into a huge mess and didn't help anyone process the catalyst. Eventually, that thread served as a sort of perpetual soap opera without any real progress towards reconciliation and actual processing of catalyst.

Had this forum not have been created, who knows how things would have gone? It could have continued snowballing in that direction or maybe equalized. The point is though, many people felt pushed away from the forum because it seemed that interpersonal catalyst was the primary focus. And that is not the intention of Bring4th. In making this particular space a sub-forum, it was a hope to emphasize this - interpersonal catalyst is inevitable, it is natural, it is allowed (so long as it moves in the direction of respect and harmony), but it is not the purpose of the forum as a whole, and it is indeed secondary to the primary purpose. We wanted to offer a space dedicated to this purpose so the processing of interpersonal catalyst would not distract from the rest of the forum.

Well I will firstly say, I like this as a Sub-forum, for the manner of it's use and the way it is applied, its execution was done very good in my opinion from what I see.  I just don't think it should be the exclusive 'all posts of this nature will be moved outside of their home thread to this member-only sub-forum' as it appears as I said, and others have expressed...  It makes this forum feel tainted, like the skeletons get moved here if it's just a collection of a few posts completely out of context of each other or not clearly directed anymore.  Sometimes moderation is allowing others to fight if it is clearly being figured out and then leaving that there for all to see how its done, why we encourage it. If the members ask their posts to be moved, do so then, that's not manipulative, it's considerate.

I'm getting the feeling that you guys care more than you express later in this post of yours.  Because it feels like y'all don't just lose sleep over such judgments, but you take it to heart to a point you fear disallowing it.  This is your human forum, Creators of 'Bring4th.org/forums'.  You are allowed to maintain it to your desired state, even at the dislike of others.  You can't please everyone.  I've been trying.  You simply cannot, so instead of trying to do the best for the most, do the best for as many as you can, and not just the most.  There's a balance.  But right now, moderation isn't really the big concern to me, because the activity and productivity isn't there to be moderated on the forums exclusively.  I don't...Actually know how much a mod actually needs to do outside of the forum here...

(06-12-2015, 06:04 PM)Bring4th_Austin Wrote:  If a member wishes to seek a community where the primary focus is allowing distortions to rub against each other and play out in a heated discussion, there are a virtual infinite number of places online for this type of activity. One doesn't need to be discussing the Law of One for this to be meaningful, as every time this happens, the discussion is moved away from the actual topic and then focuses on people themselves. There's certainly no judgment if that is a desire, as that sort of activity and behavior (while could become self-perpetuating) is a way to help define one's own distortions and seek to harmonize with other distortions. But in Bring4th, we seek a modicum of self-realization where a harmony can be found towards a certain goal (that is, study and support) without the need for addressing interpersonal issues at every turn. It is silly to think in 3rd density that this type of catalyst can (or should) be avoided, and thus this sub-forum was created - acknowledge, honor, and process this catalyst, but don't let it distract from the primary purpose. (To give my own biased opinion as a moderator, I think this sub-forum has worked very well for its intended purpose given the nature of the discussion taking place in the rest of the forum now versus when we created this space, and general feedback.)

(I completely agree!)

You also mentioned the closed threads - we fully believe that this type of interpersonal growth cannot take place unless harmony and reconciliation are the primary goals in participating in such interpersonal discussion. Not everyone will have these goals, and not every discussion will maintain those goals. At a certain point, the discussion ceases to be processing of interpersonal catalyst and energizing and perpetuating of interpersonal catalyst, where reconciliation is no longer in sight within a discussion. This is markedly not the intent of this forum. We don't wish to provide a space just for people to fight. Working through disharmony towards harmony is one thing, but when the discussion is not headed towards harmony (in the eyes of the mods), then we'll cease to provide a space for that.

(I again completely agree with this.  I may be biased, I have only seen the most recent moderation and a few things from the older threads)

And a note about the statement about our actions being "is not STO guided": I do truly understand the perception that certain types of moderation are not rooted in a service-to-others mentality. Some people think any moderation at all is an infringement on the level of service-to-self. In the dual-sided perception aspect, some people think we are not being "STO guided" because we are not quicker to squash what is perceived as negativity and harmful communication.

What is or isn't "STO guided," how we can apply those labels, whether those labels are relevant in any infinite number of contexts - it is all subject for massive discussion which has been  had time and time again in many places on this forum and off, and internally by the moderators. But, for as far as you're willing to take my word, I can guarantee you one thing: the creators and moderators of this forum have an overwhelming and abundant desire to fulfill a certain vision that Don, Carla, Jim and L/L Research have for a community, that is, to provide a positive space for wanderers and seekers to come together and share in love, and discuss this philosophy that is so dear to all of our hearts. We desire this so strongly that when we feel that we fail, it literally keeps us up at night. In working with L/L Research in many different ways, I can truly say that nothing has given me more emotional catalyst than the attempt to moderate this forum in a positive and service-oriented way, and I know that this is also (basically) the same for GLB and Plenum. Our desire is never to be tricky or sly in how we operate this community. An entire encyclopedia could be printed with the amount of correspondence that goes in to how we approach this community in the attempt to be as positive as we possibly can in upholding the vision of L/L Research. When we receive feedback which hints that we may have failed at this, it can be very easy to beat ourselves up. And we do, probably a lot more than you would think.

I do not think it is fair to accuse you all of being selfish in the light of attempting to maintain a sort of balance and order to your forum.  Especially that you truly hold the Bolded as your Being...  I think there is a level of Objective-Subjective or Subjective-Objective reasoning that can reconcile for as many that it can, the need for moderation or the reasonings for how the moderators act.  But importantly, they are also human, we all are.  The members are also asked to provide the same feelings towards them as they would another.  Some form of mutual respect.  We know you guys Love.  We know you work hard.  We ask things, or...At least I do, but I expect that you all will do as you can and need to where you can and must.  I think members need to be reminded that you guys can be fried and still on the job, and handling it all well then ONE person can come in, accuse you of all these things, slyness, trickery, manipulation, indifference (-cough-) and force you down and beat you up, and you guys put up with it.  You didn't get a say, sometimes a remark slips.  You're human.  If a perfect moderator is required, we have the technology!  We can build Her.

Or at the very least, we can all ask ourselves, if we were in their position and had that energy directed at us, could we, would've we, can we, have handled it better?
But then beyond that we must consider this.  If it has already happened, should we judge it, or use the philosophy we come here to experience every day, and work with it instead?

I'm more than sure, like, about, 187.96% that you guys beat yourselves up more than you admit to!  and that makes me sad!  Don't let others beat you down, this forum has a mission, and it needs those who will guide it to maintain that vision.  If the ones who do so are basically made out as wrong, how is that fair?  There's a balance as I said.  I do not think moderation overall would be the real issue in a more active forum environment because the current amount of non-focused posts would be well balanced with guided ones.  Those who are off or 'out-of-line' with the guidelines are given consideration for the contextual surrounding situation.  Mods also aren't omniscient (or ARE THEEEY) or omnipresent.  They can't be expected to handle everything immediately and perfectly as it sounds like you guys hold yourselves up to very high level guidelines.  I don't know, maybe I'm seeing this wrong, but I'm getting this strong vibe that you all have been told some pretty unfair and cruel things and are trying very hard to keep everyone happy as things are right now.

(06-12-2015, 06:04 PM)Bring4th_Austin Wrote:  But to see a weary wanderer comforted, to see a seeker reach a new level of understanding, to understand myself a new metaphysical concept, to hear stories of how the Law of One and Bring4th have helped seekers in their lives, to see a healthy debate unfold and various perspectives being shared in a positive space, to witness just how passionate people can be in their spiritual seeking - it is a very fulfilling thing.

I think it's true for anyone in a position to receive feedback that negative feedback will be much more apparent than positive feedback, and so it is a constant struggle to remember the positive experiences people have on the forums, and the desire and amount of work we put into to trying to make this a positive space. It is too easy for us to witness our own efforts here with a jaundiced eye. But we are always fueled by our desire to maintain this vision, and always seeking to find better ways to approach the community.

Well allow me to say, contrary to the tone I have had, that I perceive very positive aspects of the current moderation team.  I'm just a somewhat candid and annoying individual when it comes to pointing out odd or suspicious things, even if I'm overly suspicious and curious.  (Thank one of the members here for making me realize that).  I would ask that you all not actually change anything currently as is, and I'd like to see how things are handled on a more active forum environment, I think it'd be much differently applied and executed now than it would have years or months prior.


(06-12-2015, 06:04 PM)Bring4th_Austin Wrote:  
Quote:But if the operators of Bring4th's forums have a problem with me pushing for more activity and consideration of seekers, well please just ban me and be done with it then.

Done.

[Image: 40c.gif]

NOOOOOOOOOOOOO
If I were Pacman I'd turn inside-out and disappear!

...But truly.  I am fine with how things are, I just want more activity, more production.  I want to look at ways the members and mods can help draw in activity.

(06-12-2015, 06:02 PM)Nicholas Wrote:  Aha! My misunderstanding on the anonymous member assumption. It's funny but that is a prime example of how language is subject to interpretation. (where telepathy certainly is not!) (I know right?  I wish I had telepathy!)

I viewed your last statement in the light of your less oriented/unfocused members comment so "my bad" as the saying goes. I reiterate that you make some good points and my main input would be to investigat how we can all coordinate towards a 5 minute meditation devoted to prayer on a planetary level. That is my immediate concern, in part because one of Carla's statements on the radio show before she passed on was "join us", in the said practice. The value of such a coordinated effort is immeasurable, metaphysically speaking.

(Let this be the first major suggestion and major consideration to implement, let's get a thread started on the progress of the Gaia Meditations encouraging joining and how they aid or affect those who participate in it, what we do, how we do it, when, why, and such.  Something to encourage others to join in, and to help draw in attention that this is a place where we do perform, rather than just goof off!  (even if goofing off can be fun~) )

With regards to your worries though, again I refer to JustLikeYou's signiture. "All Is Well"  Heart

I did not mean to imply that your intent here was unwise, no not at all! What I meant by is that it implied to me that we would be attempting to window dress the forums rather than freely and sincerely expressing ourselves within it. That was the impression I got from your post.

There is not one jot of disrespect in your thread here VAS and I am sorry if I came across that way. Again, I simply misread your last comment, all is well  Big Grin

I'll mimic you!  By referring to JustLikeYou's signature. "All Is Well"  Heart

I was in the chat and got a few impressions about you while in there.  I had the choice once to continue being with someone who potentially might have had her short-term memory permanently gone and I said yes to that.  I see you made a not so similar, but seemingly familiar decision (unless I have been completely ignorant) and the respect I hold for you in doing so is...

I wish I could meet someone like you in person, if not simply to thank you for making the world a better place... Heart

So please know.  No Worries.  All is truly Well.  Thank you for your thoughts and words.

Actually, thank you everyone so far for the thoughts and words and actions.  I look forward to seeing how this place evolves in the future, and I hope it does not wind down into mostly inactivity.
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