Episode #60
07-29-2017, 09:07 AM, (This post was last modified: 07-29-2017, 09:11 AM by YinYang.)
#31
RE: Episode #60
For what's it's worth, Jeremy, I have never experienced your posts as authoritarian or patronizing, and I have always liked your frankness, I like that in people. It always comes across as phony and fake to me when someone wants to say what they feel, while simultaneously trying to appease everyone else involved in a discussion.

Just wanted you to know that. Thanks for your authenticity.
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07-29-2017, 10:22 AM,
#32
RE: Episode #60
Jeremy, I think the issue is that all of us have a great deal of investment and attachment involved in this topic. As an activist, I understand where somebody is coming from who wants to shake us into feeling what our society is engineered to hide. There is an urgency, sometimes even an anger, borne of feeling that suffering deeply. On the other hand, I understand how a person wants to figure out how they feel for themselves, and that sometimes the activist attempts to pull people farther along than they personally are ready.

I keep coming back to the Q'uo excerpt in my signature: "It is not that love will tell you what to do. It is that love will tell you how to do it with love." Maybe it's not so much what side we occupy on issues like this but the way we use taking a side to limit our willingness to feel.

Jeremy
It is not that love will tell you what to do.
It is that love will tell you how to do it with love.
Q'uo 3/19/06
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07-29-2017, 10:49 AM,
#33
RE: Episode #60
I think it's very difficult for any activist to 'not' create an "us and them" milieu. The very nature of activism is taking a strong stance on an issue, and I admire activists and whistle blowers. They are the people in our society with a lot of spine and bravery. Activism means entering the arena.

I am also a straight shooter, so naturally I will be attracted to the straight shooters on this forum. This has probably been the most difficult balancing I have ever had to do, because of the "soft touch" issue, because I so strongly believe in authenticity and honesty. So I'm trying to do "soft touch" without being fake of dishonest.

People are allowed to "think aloud" on this forum, ironing out their "wonderings" against a sounding board. Discourse is good! Not personal insults.... but discourse. That's infinity, an infinite amount of expressions.
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07-29-2017, 11:05 AM,
#34
RE: Episode #60
I still think we keep putting second density into this box that it shouldn't be in. Ra says that even a rock can become fourth density harvestable - so at any point the "switch" can go from pain to misery/suffering. Holding them into the "pain" corner isn't serving us at all, in my opinion, except to give us a reason to not feel empathy.

I guess I just disagree fundamentally with a lot of the conclusions here. I believe farm animals are high second density. They have been domesticated by humans for thousands of years and are handled by humans almost every day. I do believe they are taking this opportunity at harvest, on our bellicose planet, to potentially harvest third density souls. But this is definitely not an excuse to participate in the system, either. You think this is the only place where we can harvest souls? You think this is how we should be harvesting souls? Obviously this HAS to go away before we can become a fourth density positive planet.

One thing I've been thinking about recently, as far as the difference between killing/torturing plants or animals, is that if you go to a factory where they process tomatoes, that place is gonna smell like tomatoes. When I go to the factory where they process lambs, it smells like DEATH. Unmistakable, the thick smell that you can taste in the air. A ubiquitously repulsive smell, except to those beings who eat carrion. I don't know, something about how my body reacts to each form of sustenance seems like a big clue.

I also think this crosses over to how, when we see an animal trembling, or hear it crying for its lost young, that what we see is completely recognizable as pain. Suffering, sure, I guess that can be a whole nother thing. Plants can communicate with you too, but a yellowed leaf doesn't instinctively cause the same desire to offer comfort as does a crying/injured puppy.

But what I really see is that the whole planet is in agony. I think the Confederation has stated in many words that this entity is suffering. We are eating her alive and poisoning her with excrement. Our forests and oceans are dying. What are we going to do? Maldek this planet up with methane and Round-up instead of a-bombs?

When we say animals can't suffer, what I believe the Q'uo channeling is trying to state is that they lack the spiritual suffering that comes from a spirit complex. Obviously, they can still suffer in the mind and body, because they are mind/body complexes. They feel emotions. Much of what we consider "suffering" from our point of view is completely replicable in the mind/body of any mammal, since emotions come from the mammalian brain. However, we also know that the spirit complex can attach to/enspirit a mind/body complex at any time, when the catalyst is efficiently used - and I believe that any animal that is in pain, emotional and physical, every day if not every moment of its life, will likely have to use that catalyst at some point. But on the flip side, all the animals we eat are babies anyway, so they probably really don't have enough time to process pain into suffering... much like if we killed infant humans at 3-6 months old. I guess who I really think about as truly suffering are the mother cows who are milked - they are really the most tortured beings in the world.

BTW, did you know that ants farm aphids? I think ants are one of the higher second density life forms, as well. Estimates say that there are 100 trillion ants. Seems like a pretty good place to maybe funnel factory farmed m/b/almost s's. 100 trillion ants, 70-100 billion farm animals... humans are quite the minority! Also, each of us is made up of more bacteria than human cells in our bodies. How we treat and conceptualize second density is a big deal.

I have a hypothetical question for anyone who would honestly answer. If Ra had said that there was a chance that this planet could be harvested negative, would you eat factory farmed animals?
There is no magic greater than honest distortion toward love.
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07-29-2017, 11:26 AM,
#35
RE: Episode #60
There is no getting around the issue that it's torture, none whatsoever.... all beings are sentient. What I have seen made me sick...

I just want to empathise Joel Goldsmith and Prentice Mulford's words, two spiritual teachers whom I personally consider very 'on the mark'... and I don't see any of this in these discussions...

Jade, one of our very enlightened poets, and also a "miracle worker" of sorts - long story - wrote a book called The Soul Of The Ant. You may like it, he studied them for a loooong time. He also spent a lot of time in nature, hypnotising baboons amongst other activities, which he called "mesmerize".
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07-29-2017, 12:00 PM, (This post was last modified: 07-29-2017, 12:01 PM by Jeremy.)
#36
RE: Episode #60
I hear ya on the aphids. Its a losing battle with those suckers in our garden lol.

Anyways, I'm curious about a part of your post. When you say this has to go before this can become a 4th density planet, do you believe that this sphere as we see and experience it will be the same in 4th density?

The reason that I ask is that I don't recall Ra stating that this sphere will be the same just with 4th density inhabitants.

These two passages come to light

63.8 Questioner: From last session, I would like to continue with a few questions about the fact that in fourth density red, orange, and green energies will be activated; yellow, blue, etc., being in potentiation. Right now, you say we have green energies activated. They have been activated for the last 45 years. I am wondering about the transition through this period so that the green is totally activated and the yellow is in potentiation. What will we lose as the yellow goes from activation into potentiation, and what will we gain as the green comes into total activation, and what is that process?
Ra: I am Ra. It is misleading to speak of gains and losses when dealing with the subject of the cycle’s ending and the green-ray cycle beginning upon your sphere. It is to be kept in the forefront of the faculties of intelligence that there is one creation in which there is no loss. There are progressive cycles for experiential use by entities. We may now address your query.

As the green-ray cycle or the density of love and understanding begins to take shape the yellow-ray plane or Earth which you now enjoy in your dance will cease to be inhabited for some period of your space/time as the space/time necessary for fourth-density entities to learn their ability to shield their density from that of third is learned. After this period there will come a time when third density may again cycle on the yellow-ray sphere.

Meanwhile there is another sphere, congruent to a great extent with yellow ray, forming. This fourth-density sphere coexists with first, second, and third. It is of a denser nature due to the rotational core atomic aspects of its material. We have discussed this subject with you.

The fourth-density entities which incarnate at this space/time are fourth density in the view of experience but are incarnating in less dense vehicles due to desire to experience and aid in the birth of fourth density upon this plane.

You may note that fourth-density entities have a great abundance of compassion.

63.9 Questioner: Now, at present we have, in third-density incarnation on this plane, those third-density entities of the planet Earth who have been here for some number of incarnations who will graduate in the three-way split, either positive polarity remaining for fourth-density experience on this plane, the negative polarity harvestable going to another planet, and the rest unharvestable third density going to another third-density planet. In addition to these entities, I am assuming that we have here already some entities harvestable from other third-density planets who have come here and incarnated in third-density form to make the transition with this planet into fourth density, plus Wanderers.

Is this correct?
Ra: I am Ra. This is correct except we may note a small point. The positively oriented harvested entities will remain in this planetary influence but not upon this plane



Please correct me if I'm wrong but it seems to point to an entirely different version of earth all together. A different plane of earth exists along side the other densities not within it.

Are there any references that point to our current 3rd density configuration simply switching to 4th density vibrations while retaining the 3rd density appearance of earth?
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07-29-2017, 12:05 PM,
#37
RE: Episode #60
Thanks YinYang. That book sounds very interesting.

And to transfer the words from what Joel and Prentice said into terms for this forum, I believe what they are talking about is the Transformation of the Spirit -when a "higher power" calls you to perform a service. Until then, we are bound within the sarcophagus.

I've been accutely aware of a Transformation of the Spirit within me, as far as the slaughterhouses go. I was called to do this. It's very strong. I hate driving, but I drive 160 miles round trip through the heart of Denver to do this, and when I'm in the car to and from the vigils, there is no stress, there is no anxiety, there is no worry. It's as if I'm being carried. My efforts here, my impassioned pleas, are an attempt to create a transformation of the spirit within others. Ra says that it is with the help of others that we pierce the veil - and through my recent experiences, I also feel that keenly, as uniting with this group of others who witness the lambs has had such a profound impact on both me and Kile. I think I understand how Austin and Gary and Jim felt after going to Asheville, and seeing large groups of friends who live near each other who are united with the goal of compassion. It's amazingly beautiful and I'm so grateful to have found a place like that.

Before this, I felt quite a big void in my life, actually. I felt there was more I could be doing. My rote daily attempts at service were boring me, I guess. So I spent more time surrendering in meditation, seeking my highest will and the will of the creator. And something appeared and I had no idea I was even looking for it. And part of me is sorry that coming out of the sarcophagus makes some of my friends here uncomfortable, but I've also been reading through this latest season of Q'uo channelings and I feel very impassioned, motivated, and encouraged on my path to act. The more quickly people wake up, the quicker anything resembling suffering at all goes away.

I think this experience is kind of hard to understand until it happens. Because the Confederation does teach us to cultivate our being before we make any attempt at doing. And cultivating the being can take a very, very long time. But as soon as you feel called to do, as in the Transformation of the Spirit, it's unmistakable.

I have a unique experience here because I was a vegan before I found the Law of One. So to me, the philosophy easily dovetailed into what I was already practicing. I have no idea how I would have conceptualized my consumption of animals after reading the Law of One. But what I know now is that through this process of paying attention to what I consume, I have whittled what I do consume down to very, very, little, as a service to our planet which is filling up with trash and exploiting countless untold second density beings and almost all third density beings, for our vanities. I feel called more and more to give up practices that ultimately hurt our planet. And since I feel "experienced" in these matters, I also feel I must share my experiences with others who might be interested in making change, in conversations like this.

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07-29-2017, 12:08 PM,
#38
RE: Episode #60
Sorry for the double post but I didn't want to edit and it be missed in case anyone was typing a reply.

Oh dang sorry forgot about your hypothetical.

I'm not sure I understand how eating meat and polarization are related. Can you provide instances where Ra described 2nd density entities as other selves? Service to other selves is relative to other 3rd density selves. Again, I'm fully ok with being wrong. I just cant seem to find where there is a direct correlation between service to others and 2nd density entities.

This session comes to mind

42.3 Questioner: I will attempt to make an analogy. If an animal, shall I say a bull in a pen, attacks you because you have wandered into his pen, you get out of his way rapidly but you do not blame him. Or, you do not have much of an emotional response other than the fear response that he might damage you. However, if you encounter another self in his territory and he attacks you, your response may be more of an emotional nature creating physical bodily responses. Am I correct in assuming that when your response to the animal and to the other-self seeing both as the Creator and loving both and understanding their action in attacking you is the action of their free will then you have balanced yourself correctly in this area? Is this correct?
Ra: I am Ra. This is basically correct. However, the balanced entity will see in the seeming attack of an other-self the causes of this action which are, in most cases, of a more complex nature than the cause of the attack of the second-density bull as was your example. Thus this balanced entity would be open to many more opportunities for service to a third-density other-self.
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07-29-2017, 12:12 PM,
#39
RE: Episode #60
(07-29-2017, 12:00 PM)Jeremy Wrote:  I hear ya on the aphids. Its a losing battle with those suckers in our garden lol.

Anyways, I'm curious about a part of your post. When you say this has to go before this can become a 4th density planet, do you believe that this sphere as we see and experience it will be the same in 4th density?

The reason that I ask is that I don't recall Ra stating that this sphere will be the same just with 4th density inhabitants.

These two passages come to light

63.8 Questioner: From last session, I would like to continue with a few questions about the fact that in fourth density red, orange, and green energies will be activated; yellow, blue, etc., being in potentiation. Right now, you say we have green energies activated. They have been activated for the last 45 years. I am wondering about the transition through this period so that the green is totally activated and the yellow is in potentiation. What will we lose as the yellow goes from activation into potentiation, and what will we gain as the green comes into total activation, and what is that process?
Ra: I am Ra. It is misleading to speak of gains and losses when dealing with the subject of the cycle’s ending and the green-ray cycle beginning upon your sphere. It is to be kept in the forefront of the faculties of intelligence that there is one creation in which there is no loss. There are progressive cycles for experiential use by entities. We may now address your query.

As the green-ray cycle or the density of love and understanding begins to take shape the yellow-ray plane or Earth which you now enjoy in your dance will cease to be inhabited for some period of your space/time as the space/time necessary for fourth-density entities to learn their ability to shield their density from that of third is learned. After this period there will come a time when third density may again cycle on the yellow-ray sphere.

Meanwhile there is another sphere, congruent to a great extent with yellow ray, forming. This fourth-density sphere coexists with first, second, and third. It is of a denser nature due to the rotational core atomic aspects of its material. We have discussed this subject with you.

The fourth-density entities which incarnate at this space/time are fourth density in the view of experience but are incarnating in less dense vehicles due to desire to experience and aid in the birth of fourth density upon this plane.

You may note that fourth-density entities have a great abundance of compassion.

63.9 Questioner: Now, at present we have, in third-density incarnation on this plane, those third-density entities of the planet Earth who have been here for some number of incarnations who will graduate in the three-way split, either positive polarity remaining for fourth-density experience on this plane, the negative polarity harvestable going to another planet, and the rest unharvestable third density going to another third-density planet. In addition to these entities, I am assuming that we have here already some entities harvestable from other third-density planets who have come here and incarnated in third-density form to make the transition with this planet into fourth density, plus Wanderers.

Is this correct?
Ra: I am Ra. This is correct except we may note a small point. The positively oriented harvested entities will remain in this planetary influence but not upon this plane



Please correct me if I'm wrong but it seems to point to an entirely different version of earth all together. A different plane of earth exists along side the other densities not within it.

Are there any references that point to our current 3rd density configuration simply switching to 4th density vibrations while retaining the 3rd density appearance of earth?

It's my understanding that the deactivation of all that is third density in vibration is a process that the planet goes through.

Another quote from session 63:

Quote:63.32 Questioner: When the third density goes out of activation and into potentiation that will leave us with a planet that is first, second, and fourth density. At that time there will be no activated third-density vibrations on this planet. Am I correct in assuming that all third-density vibrations on this planet now are those vibrations that compose the bodily complexes of entities such as us; and that that is the sum total of third-density vibrations on this planet at this time?


Ra: I am Ra. This will be the last full query of this working. This instrument has energy left due to transfer but there is discomfort. We do not wish to deplete this instrument. May we say that this instrument seems in better configuration, despite attack, than previous workings.

To answer your query, this is incorrect only in that in addition to the mind/body/spirit complexes of third density there are the artifacts, thought-forms, and feelings which these co-Creators have produced. This is third density.

So Ra seems to confirm that there will be a time on the continuum where there are no longer any artifacts or thoughtforms belonging to third density. However, we will still have first and second density... so I'm guessing much of the native physical structure of the planet will remain, that which existed before 3rd density came and mucked it all up.

Interestingly, when searching for the quote above by the word "artifact", I also got this quote, which I think answers the question posed in the podcast:

Quote:71.22 Questioner: I see the most important product of this communication being a vehicle of partial enlightenment for those incarnate now who have become aware of their part in their own evolutionary process. Am I correct in this assumption?

Ra: I am Ra. You are correct. We may note that this is the goal of all artifacts and experiences which entities may come into contact with and is not only the property of Ra or this contact.

Ra says the goal of all artifacts and experiences is to hopefully lead to spiritual enlightenment.
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07-29-2017, 12:17 PM,
#40
RE: Episode #60
(07-29-2017, 12:12 PM)Bring4th_Jade Wrote:  
(07-29-2017, 12:00 PM)Jeremy Wrote:  I hear ya on the aphids. Its a losing battle with those suckers in our garden lol.

Anyways, I'm curious about a part of your post. When you say this has to go before this can become a 4th density planet, do you believe that this sphere as we see and experience it will be the same in 4th density?

The reason that I ask is that I don't recall Ra stating that this sphere will be the same just with 4th density inhabitants.

These two passages come to light

63.8 Questioner: From last session, I would like to continue with a few questions about the fact that in fourth density red, orange, and green energies will be activated; yellow, blue, etc., being in potentiation. Right now, you say we have green energies activated. They have been activated for the last 45 years. I am wondering about the transition through this period so that the green is totally activated and the yellow is in potentiation. What will we lose as the yellow goes from activation into potentiation, and what will we gain as the green comes into total activation, and what is that process?
Ra: I am Ra. It is misleading to speak of gains and losses when dealing with the subject of the cycle’s ending and the green-ray cycle beginning upon your sphere. It is to be kept in the forefront of the faculties of intelligence that there is one creation in which there is no loss. There are progressive cycles for experiential use by entities. We may now address your query.

As the green-ray cycle or the density of love and understanding begins to take shape the yellow-ray plane or Earth which you now enjoy in your dance will cease to be inhabited for some period of your space/time as the space/time necessary for fourth-density entities to learn their ability to shield their density from that of third is learned. After this period there will come a time when third density may again cycle on the yellow-ray sphere.

Meanwhile there is another sphere, congruent to a great extent with yellow ray, forming. This fourth-density sphere coexists with first, second, and third. It is of a denser nature due to the rotational core atomic aspects of its material. We have discussed this subject with you.

The fourth-density entities which incarnate at this space/time are fourth density in the view of experience but are incarnating in less dense vehicles due to desire to experience and aid in the birth of fourth density upon this plane.

You may note that fourth-density entities have a great abundance of compassion.

63.9 Questioner: Now, at present we have, in third-density incarnation on this plane, those third-density entities of the planet Earth who have been here for some number of incarnations who will graduate in the three-way split, either positive polarity remaining for fourth-density experience on this plane, the negative polarity harvestable going to another planet, and the rest unharvestable third density going to another third-density planet. In addition to these entities, I am assuming that we have here already some entities harvestable from other third-density planets who have come here and incarnated in third-density form to make the transition with this planet into fourth density, plus Wanderers.

Is this correct?
Ra: I am Ra. This is correct except we may note a small point. The positively oriented harvested entities will remain in this planetary influence but not upon this plane



Please correct me if I'm wrong but it seems to point to an entirely different version of earth all together. A different plane of earth exists along side the other densities not within it.

Are there any references that point to our current 3rd density configuration simply switching to 4th density vibrations while retaining the 3rd density appearance of earth?

It's my understanding that the deactivation of all that is third density in vibration is a process that the planet goes through.

Another quote from session 63:


Quote:63.32 Questioner: When the third density goes out of activation and into potentiation that will leave us with a planet that is first, second, and fourth density. At that time there will be no activated third-density vibrations on this planet. Am I correct in assuming that all third-density vibrations on this planet now are those vibrations that compose the bodily complexes of entities such as us; and that that is the sum total of third-density vibrations on this planet at this time?


Ra: I am Ra. This will be the last full query of this working. This instrument has energy left due to transfer but there is discomfort. We do not wish to deplete this instrument. May we say that this instrument seems in better configuration, despite attack, than previous workings.

To answer your query, this is incorrect only in that in addition to the mind/body/spirit complexes of third density there are the artifacts, thought-forms, and feelings which these co-Creators have produced. This is third density.

So Ra seems to confirm that there will be a time on the continuum where there are no longer any artifacts or thoughtforms belonging to third density. However, we will still have first and second density... so I'm guessing much of the native physical structure of the planet will remain, that which existed before 3rd density came and mucked it all up.

Interestingly, when searching for the quote above by the word "artifact", I also got this quote, which I think answers the question posed in the podcast:


Quote:71.22 Questioner: I see the most important product of this communication being a vehicle of partial enlightenment for those incarnate now who have become aware of their part in their own evolutionary process. Am I correct in this assumption?

Ra: I am Ra. You are correct. We may note that this is the goal of all artifacts and experiences which entities may come into contact with and is not only the property of Ra or this contact.

Ra says the goal of all artifacts and experiences is to hopefully lead to spiritual enlightenment.


Cool i get that but 4th density resides on a different plane or sphere it seems. I guess I'm confused to the verbiage. 
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07-29-2017, 12:19 PM,
#41
RE: Episode #60
(07-29-2017, 12:08 PM)Jeremy Wrote:  Sorry for the double post but I didn't want to edit and it be missed in case anyone was typing a reply.

Oh dang sorry forgot about your hypothetical.

I'm not sure I understand how eating meat and polarization are related. Can you provide instances where Ra described 2nd density entities as other selves? Service to other selves is relative to other 3rd density selves. Again, I'm fully ok with being wrong. I just cant seem to find where there is a direct correlation between service to others and 2nd density entities.

This session comes to mind

42.3 Questioner: I will attempt to make an analogy. If an animal, shall I say a bull in a pen, attacks you because you have wandered into his pen, you get out of his way rapidly but you do not blame him. Or, you do not have much of an emotional response other than the fear response that he might damage you. However, if you encounter another self in his territory and he attacks you, your response may be more of an emotional nature creating physical bodily responses. Am I correct in assuming that when your response to the animal and to the other-self seeing both as the Creator and loving both and understanding their action in attacking you is the action of their free will then you have balanced yourself correctly in this area? Is this correct?
Ra: I am Ra. This is basically correct. However, the balanced entity will see in the seeming attack of an other-self the causes of this action which are, in most cases, of a more complex nature than the cause of the attack of the second-density bull as was your example. Thus this balanced entity would be open to many more opportunities for service to a third-density other-self.

I'm not talking about individual polarization, I'm talking about polarization of the social memory complex/planet.

Ra usually refers to service to others as other-selves being "entities". I'm pretty sure there is a point when they are moving where Ra refers to the house as a "living entity".

Quote:95.4 Questioner: Thank you. The new room that we choose will of course be carefully cleaned and marred surfaces made well. We shall also use the Banishing Ritual of the Lesser Pentagram prior to a working. Is there anything else that Ra could suggest? And I would also know if there is anything in particular that Ra might suggest with respect to the particular place that has been chosen for the new location.

Ra: I am Ra. We scan the recent memory configurations of the questioner. Firstly, there has been some less than harmonious interaction within this dwelling. The dynamics of this interaction were potent enough to attract a lesser thought-form. Therefore, we suggest the salting and ritual cleansing by blessed water of all windows and doorways which offer adit into the domicile or any out-buildings thereof.

Further, we suggest the hanging of the cut garlic clove in the portion of the room which has accommodated those whose enjoyment has turned into a darker emotion centering upon the area we find you call the wet bar, also the room intended for the sleeping which is found near the kitchen area. The appropriate words used to bid farewell to those of the lower astral shall be used in connection with the hanging of the garlic cloves for the period of approximately 36 of your hours. We believe that this is equivalent to two of your night periods and one of your lit periods. This should cleanse the house as you find it to the extent that it is neutral in its vibrations. We suggest that you then request of this living entity that it now be welcoming and absorbent for the vibrations of harmony, love, and thanksgiving which this group shall then, as the incarnational experience proceeds, offer to the domicile.

This has always touched me. It seems we need to see all "things" as entities and serve them accordingly.
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07-29-2017, 12:27 PM, (This post was last modified: 07-29-2017, 12:27 PM by Jeremy.)
#42
RE: Episode #60
(07-29-2017, 12:19 PM)Bring4th_Jade Wrote:  
(07-29-2017, 12:08 PM)Jeremy Wrote:  Sorry for the double post but I didn't want to edit and it be missed in case anyone was typing a reply.

Oh dang sorry forgot about your hypothetical.

I'm not sure I understand how eating meat and polarization are related. Can you provide instances where Ra described 2nd density entities as other selves? Service to other selves is relative to other 3rd density selves. Again, I'm fully ok with being wrong. I just cant seem to find where there is a direct correlation between service to others and 2nd density entities.

This session comes to mind

42.3 Questioner: I will attempt to make an analogy. If an animal, shall I say a bull in a pen, attacks you because you have wandered into his pen, you get out of his way rapidly but you do not blame him. Or, you do not have much of an emotional response other than the fear response that he might damage you. However, if you encounter another self in his territory and he attacks you, your response may be more of an emotional nature creating physical bodily responses. Am I correct in assuming that when your response to the animal and to the other-self seeing both as the Creator and loving both and understanding their action in attacking you is the action of their free will then you have balanced yourself correctly in this area? Is this correct?
Ra: I am Ra. This is basically correct. However, the balanced entity will see in the seeming attack of an other-self the causes of this action which are, in most cases, of a more complex nature than the cause of the attack of the second-density bull as was your example. Thus this balanced entity would be open to many more opportunities for service to a third-density other-self.

I'm not talking about individual polarization, I'm talking about polarization of the social memory complex/planet.

Ra usually refers to service to others as other-selves being "entities". I'm pretty sure there is a point when they are moving where Ra refers to the house as a "living entity".


Quote:95.4 Questioner: Thank you. The new room that we choose will of course be carefully cleaned and marred surfaces made well. We shall also use the Banishing Ritual of the Lesser Pentagram prior to a working. Is there anything else that Ra could suggest? And I would also know if there is anything in particular that Ra might suggest with respect to the particular place that has been chosen for the new location.

Ra: I am Ra. We scan the recent memory configurations of the questioner. Firstly, there has been some less than harmonious interaction within this dwelling. The dynamics of this interaction were potent enough to attract a lesser thought-form. Therefore, we suggest the salting and ritual cleansing by blessed water of all windows and doorways which offer adit into the domicile or any out-buildings thereof.

Further, we suggest the hanging of the cut garlic clove in the portion of the room which has accommodated those whose enjoyment has turned into a darker emotion centering upon the area we find you call the wet bar, also the room intended for the sleeping which is found near the kitchen area. The appropriate words used to bid farewell to those of the lower astral shall be used in connection with the hanging of the garlic cloves for the period of approximately 36 of your hours. We believe that this is equivalent to two of your night periods and one of your lit periods. This should cleanse the house as you find it to the extent that it is neutral in its vibrations. We suggest that you then request of this living entity that it now be welcoming and absorbent for the vibrations of harmony, love, and thanksgiving which this group shall then, as the incarnational experience proceeds, offer to the domicile.

This has always touched me. It seems we need to see all "things" as entities and serve them accordingly.

Oh I definitely agree with everything being an entity. Everything is alive relative to its density level. 

But what I'm getting at is that you asked if the planet was going negative harvest, would we still eat farmed animals. It seems that you're correlating effects of the harvest on the eating of meat which is where my confusion lies. I don't see the correlation between polarization of service to other or service to self in regards to eating farmed animals when the polarization process has to do with the interaction of self with other selves which the material indicates are other 3rd density selves. 

I know we are all things. I get that lol. But it seems to me that according to the material, the crux of polarization deals with self and other 3rd density self. 
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xise
07-29-2017, 12:29 PM,
#43
RE: Episode #60
Dang it i keep forgetting stuff lol

Anyways I will definitely agree with you regarding the assistance in birthing 4th density. That's why I applaud your efforts.
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07-29-2017, 12:35 PM,
#44
RE: Episode #60
I guess I just had the thought that by Ra saying that our planet has already been harvested to fourth density positive, basically, but that it will just take an amount of time from 100-700 years to finalize, might make people a bit complacent. And I think that's okay, that's probably part of the design. I am just curious that if the material had said that there was still a chance that this planet would descend into negative harvest, if we would be so quick to dismiss participating in the mass farming/enslavement/torture of hundreds of billions of beings, practices which are directly leading to what could be, without hyperbole, the total annihilation of our planet if we don't slow down. If there was still a chance that it could all go bad, do you think that buying meat, paying the people who continue to perpetuate this horrible, horrible system, might contribute to the heavier energies that are being promulgated? And therefore if there was a chance that we could still be a negative harvest, would you give your hard spent energy in the form of money to the people who are doing this?

The real evil is capitalism. This is a system that says that profit must be made at every expense, including the welfare of others. When you keep making cuts to the quality of life of those who are your products or those who make your products, or those who buy your products, so that you can put more money in your pocket - well, that is why we say money is the root of all evil. But it's not money. It's our widespread acceptance and celebration of capitalism.
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07-29-2017, 12:46 PM, (This post was last modified: 07-29-2017, 12:50 PM by xise.)
#45
RE: Episode #60
If we're talking about minimum polarization to harvest positive from 3D, you probably don't need to go meat-free.

But if we're talking about whether going meat-free out of compassion increases your positive polarization, I think it's important to get back to basics and understand the positive polarity is a configuration of the energy centers, particularly a bright green that is a choice - so just ask yourself:
  • do you feel compassion when you see animals suffering in factory farms? 
  • Or animal abuse in general? 
  • If your green ray feels empathy for the animals, ask yourself what you do with that feeling - do you acting fully upon that green ray feeling by forgoing meat, or closing and compartmentalizing your heart to that feeling and eating meat freely and constantly, or whether you partially compartmentalization the ray with partial acting by grateful eating meat and thanking the animal for its suffering knowing you are eating it out of taste/convenience/habit
I think when one answers that question, the answer to whether the green ray applies or opens to 1D and 2D life is self-evident. But we're all here on a different person and global missions, and I think free will involves choosing which catalyst to work upon. 

-----


To me, it's not odd that positive people continue to eat meat - it's hard to change that and there are different more pressing inner and outer work to be done - but to me it is odd and I have trouble understanding that it's not even acknowledged on the future to-do list as a way to lighten the vibration of the planet by not engaging in the suffering of other 2D entities, even if it's not necessary for a positive harvest. I especially think the convenience reasons for eating meat will prove itself to be true in the future when 30 years from now the meat-free protein substitutes will taste great and be super abundant. Imho, of course.

Service to Others means Service to All. That includes yourself.
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Bring4th_Jade
07-29-2017, 12:55 PM,
#46
RE: Episode #60
Yeah, it's not even that I'm mad that people are still eating meat. I'm a waitress for Christ's sake, I also still participate in this system. I just get bothered when I see this material, which explicitly states that Earth is school meant to teach us compassion, is used to justify a lack of compassion. It's the combination of that and my personal experiences that gets me all riled up in here lol. Really, I know that not everybody's going to stop eating meat anytime soon. But I think it's within the realm of possibility for most people who post here to acknowledge that this system perpetuates great suffering, and that there can be better choices made, even just with baby steps.
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07-29-2017, 01:31 PM,
#47
RE: Episode #60
Aren't semantics fun lol

I've learned a lot so I thank all of you. I just seem to get the feeling from those that are of equal passion towards animals that there is something wrong or should I say misguided with those that aren't as passionate. It goes back to my post about particular missions. Maybe its part of my lessons pertaining to empathy and compassion or it could be your lesson on acceptance of other selves free will. Who knows what the answer is but I'm sure it's somewhere in the middle lol
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07-29-2017, 02:19 PM,
#48
RE: Episode #60
(07-29-2017, 01:31 PM)Jeremy Wrote:  Aren't semantics fun lol

I've learned a lot so I thank all of you.  I just seem to get the feeling from those that are of equal compassion towards animals that there is something wrong or should I say misguided with those that aren't as compassionate.  It goes back to my post about particular missions. Maybe its part of my lessons pertaining to empathy and compassion or it could be your lesson on acceptance of other selves free will. Who knows what the answer is but I'm sure it's somewhere in the middle lol

I added the red bits.

The problem and to some, the conundrum, of "acceptance of other-selves' free will" is that animals are other-selves too. Some things to consider: 

1. Animals are at our (humans, wanderers, anyone here incarnated as human) mercy. 

2. Humans use food animals in the much the same way STS adepts use humans. The only difference is that animals aren't capable of resisting because they don't make those kinds of choices. 

3. What might the message to us be in "alien abductions" where people are coldly violated without agreement?

4. In considering connection to all things, transparency of thought and action, and unfettered telepathic communication (this does not just happen human to human), what would existing with factory farms be like?

5. And a question: Why would a wanderer need to wake up to compassion? (Aside from being in a thick veil here, wouldn't compassion be at least innate?) 
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07-29-2017, 02:25 PM,
#49
RE: Episode #60
(07-29-2017, 02:19 PM)Diana Wrote:  
(07-29-2017, 01:31 PM)Jeremy Wrote:  Aren't semantics fun lol

I've learned a lot so I thank all of you.  I just seem to get the feeling from those that are of equal compassion towards animals that there is something wrong or should I say misguided with those that aren't as compassionate.  It goes back to my post about particular missions. Maybe its part of my lessons pertaining to empathy and compassion or it could be your lesson on acceptance of other selves free will. Who knows what the answer is but I'm sure it's somewhere in the middle lol

I added the red bits.

The problem and to some, the conundrum, of "acceptance of other-selves' free will" is that animals are other-selves too. Some things to consider: 

1. Animals are at our (humans, wanderers, anyone here incarnated as human) mercy. 

2. Humans use food animals in the much the same way STS adepts use humans. The only difference is that animals aren't capable of resisting because they don't make those kinds of choices. 

3. What might the message to us be in "alien abductions" where people are coldly violated without agreement?

4. In considering connection to all things, transparency of thought and action, and unfettered telepathic communication (this does not just happen human to human), what would existing with factory farms be like?

5. And a question: Why would a wanderer need to wake up to compassion? (Aside from being in a thick veil here, wouldn't compassion be at least innate?) 


Can you find a reference in the material that states 2nd density animals are other selves?
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xise
07-29-2017, 02:32 PM,
#50
RE: Episode #60
(07-29-2017, 02:25 PM)Jeremy Wrote:  Can you find a reference in the material that states 2nd density animals are other selves?

I won't take the time to do that, because, of course they are. "Are you not all things?" would perhaps cover it.
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07-29-2017, 02:38 PM,
#51
RE: Episode #60
(07-29-2017, 02:32 PM)Diana Wrote:  
(07-29-2017, 02:25 PM)Jeremy Wrote:  Can you find a reference in the material that states 2nd density animals are other selves?

I won't take the time to do that, because, of course they are. "Are you not all things?" would perhaps cover it.

Nope all things and other selves are used in different contexts. An other self directly involves the polarization process within 3rd density. Since you won't I already did last night. There isn't a single reference that I could find that portrayed a second density entity as an other self. I Just went over this a few posts up. The closest I can find with both terms even in the same subject was this which directly states that one person is an other self and the bull is a 2nd density animal

42.3 Questioner: I will attempt to make an analogy. If an animal, shall I say a bull in a pen, attacks you because you have wandered into his pen, you get out of his way rapidly but you do not blame him. Or, you do not have much of an emotional response other than the fear response that he might damage you. However, if you encounter another self in his territory and he attacks you, your response may be more of an emotional nature creating physical bodily responses. Am I correct in assuming that when your response to the animal and to the other-self seeing both as the Creator and loving both and understanding their action in attacking you is the action of their free will then you have balanced yourself correctly in this area? Is this correct?

Ra: I am Ra. This is basically correct. However, the balanced entity will see in the seeming attack of an other-self the causes of this action which are, in most cases, of a more complex nature than the cause of the attack of the second-density bull as was your example. Thus this balanced entity would be open to many more opportunities for service to a third-density other-self.
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07-29-2017, 02:45 PM, (This post was last modified: 07-29-2017, 02:48 PM by xise.)
#52
RE: Episode #60
Quote:Can you find a reference in the material that states 2nd density animals are other selves?


Yes, because 2D disease causing bacteria are other-selves:


Quote:76.20 Questioner: What was the form of disease, and why did this exist at beginning third density?

Ra: I am Ra. Firstly, that which you speak of as disease is a functional portion of the body complex which offers the body complex the opportunity to cease viability. This is a desirable body complex function. The second portion of the answer has to do with second-density other-selves of a microscopic, as you would call it, size which have in some forms long existed and perform their service by aiding the physical body complex in its function of ceasing viability at the appropriate space/time.

Thank you for asking the question, as I didn't remember this passage beforehand.

Service to Others means Service to All. That includes yourself.
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07-29-2017, 02:49 PM,
#53
RE: Episode #60
Thank you Xise. Smile
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07-29-2017, 02:50 PM,
#54
RE: Episode #60
Awesome thanks brother! I had yet to find one so I appreciate it!
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07-29-2017, 02:56 PM, (This post was last modified: 07-29-2017, 02:57 PM by Bring4th_Jade.)
#55
RE: Episode #60
In Ra's response, they refer to a "third density other-self" - why would they need to make the distinction if "other-self" was purely a third density term?

Anyway, let me offer you exhibit #??. The Experience of the Body:

[Image: tarot11.jpg]

Look at all of the second density!! Not only does she have two birds upon her head, but she also has a lion's mouth in her hands. Above and below her are grasses and vegetables. I feel like I don't even have to explore the deeper meaning of the symbology to know that the experience of the body involves how we interact with second density. In the Q'uo channeling posted earlier, Q'uo says they call suffering "experience". So really, we could call this card, "Suffering of the Body" - how are we handling second density??

Our own body complexes are second density. Sure, thanks to Yahweh, we have more advanced brains and hands and larynges. And thanks to efficient use of catalyst, mostly due to these artificial advances of our body complex, we unequivocally have a spirit complex.

Either way, even if your supposition is right, that an animal isn't technically an 'other-self' so they are void in our efforts towards polarization (doubtful), I was still asking the question about the polarization of the social memory complex of Earth, not personal polarization. I think these can be differentiated, though still linked. In your quotation even, Ra says that there are "MORE opportunities for service to a third density other-self", not that there is no way at all to serve the second density entity.

eta: Thanks xise. Smile
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07-29-2017, 03:02 PM,
#56
RE: Episode #60
Sorry I don't get into the archetypes much.

Anyways, another lesson checked off of the list.

I guess maybe I've chosen the more ways of service towards 3rd density entities rather than the focus upon which you have so passionately pursued. As I said before, we all have our paths. Neither better nor worse Smile

I guess I don't give much thought of assisting with the blossoming social memory complex that will inhabit the 4th density planet of this sphere. Never really been something that I've chosen to pursue. Guess I've always been more drawn to showing natives how to treat themselves better and with more love rather than animals. Again, not to say one way is more commendable. Just different lol
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07-29-2017, 03:08 PM,
#57
RE: Episode #60
Well, for one last nudge, let me highlight the Q/A from the Q'uo session you posted:

Quote:At this time we would offer ourselves in the answering of further queries which those present might have for us. Is there a query at this time?

P: Concerning the truth, absolute and relative truth. Most of the time what we experience seems to be of relative truth. What is the relation of relative truth to absolute truth?

I am Q’uo, and am aware of your query, my sister. In this great octave of experience which we all share there is that which can be seen as the ultimate or absolute truth and that which is relative, and we would utilize the portion of the deep mind which is called the archetypical mind as an illustration of that which is, for this octave, an absolute truth, for it is the architecture of the process of evolution. It is the journey upon which we each find ourselves moving upon. It is that which we all shall fulfill, each in our own way, which is that which we would call that relative truth.

As we move through this pattern of expression of the one Creator we do so in a way which is a function of our unique choices, a way which is a function of memory and experience. The archetypical mind is not affected or changed in any way whatsoever by memory or by experience of any entity moving within its patterns and opportunities. Thus, each entity provides an—we search for the correct word—interpretation of this journey which is relative to all other entity’s choices. Yet the architecture of the Logos, that source of Love, is absolute. In truth, there is one great Absolute as far as we are aware and that is the unity of all things and all entities, for even the archetypical mind is that which is expressed by an infinite number of logoi throughout the one creation.

Is there another query?

P: We as individuals seem to be the builders of the archetypical mind, so aren’t we the builders of absolute truth?

I am Q’uo, and am aware of your query, my sister. In the deepest sense, that which recognizes each entity as the Creator, this is so. But in the sense of entities which move through the illusion as portions of the Creator this would not be so, for there is no choice which you can make as an individual entity that changes any portion of the archetypical mind. This is given by the Logos. You may choose an infinite number of manners to move through this mind, but it is ever and always the same.

Is there another query, my sister?

P: No, thank you.

Wink
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07-29-2017, 03:10 PM,
#58
RE: Episode #60
I'm lost lol
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07-29-2017, 06:20 PM, (This post was last modified: 07-29-2017, 06:25 PM by YinYang.)
#59
RE: Episode #60
I haven't read all of the posts, but one thing which I am wholly certain of, is that harmony is characteristic of the positive polarity and disharmony is characteristic of the negative polarity. Ra encourages the group to maintain their harmony, knowing that disharmony opens up an avenue for "our 5th density friend" or ending the contact. Ra also states that mixed harvests and especially negative harvests are of intense disharmony.

Then Ra tells Don that the hallmark of a negative UFO contact is fear.

Now, these factory farms are places of extreme disharmony and fear. Fear is the anti-thesis to love. I honestly cannot know how much they suffer or how much pain they endure, but at this point the hallmark of our (3rd density) contact with them is fear (in that particular setting), which I think is something to think about.
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07-30-2017, 12:16 AM,
#60
RE: Episode #60
Your post makes me think of the part of the material about cattle mutilations. Back in the 80s, our collective was manifesting these events. Nowadays, if you want to see a higher order second density being cruelly mutilated and harvested, all you have to do it go on youtube and find thousands upon thousands of videos. Sad
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