Quote:69.22 Questioner: There are many techniques and ways of practicing so-called white magical arts. Are rituals designed by a particular group for their own particular use just as good or possibly better than those that have been practiced by groups such as the Order of the Golden Dawn and other magical groups?
Ra: I am Ra. Although we are unable to speak with precision on this query, we may note some gratification that the questioner has penetrated some of the gist of a formidable system of service and discipline.
It appears to me here that Ra is acknowledging the "formidable system of service and discipline" that is used by the Order of the Golden Dawn. The Lesser Ritual of the Pentagram which is used by the group for clearing their space is also of Golden Dawn origin. I was once informed that some of the higher adept workings in the Golden Dawn include trance channeling and keeping scribe. I have speculated that perhaps Ra, or one of the members of Ra rather, is one of the Secret Chiefs of the Golden Dawn.
(05-12-2015, 05:28 AM)Tan.rar Wrote: [ -> ]It appears to me here that Ra is acknowledging the "formidable system of service and discipline" that is used by the Order of the Golden Dawn. The Lesser Ritual of the Pentagram which is used by the group for clearing their space is also of Golden Dawn origin. I was once informed that some of the higher adept workings in the Golden Dawn include trance channeling and keeping scribe. I have speculated that perhaps Ra, or one of the members of Ra rather, is one of the Secret Chiefs of the Golden Dawn.
Have you ever wondered what Ra actually means with their "attempt to make reparation for distortions of this law set in motion by our naïve actions of your past"?
I actually believe Ra's teachings were part of the gist of many magical traditions, including Freemasonry, Hermetic philosophy, Rosae Crucis, Kabbalah and possibly the Golden Dawn itself.
All these magical traditions have roots in the ancient Egypt, all of them share much of the same knowledge and, unfortunately, all have gone into a path of secrecy and elitism...
I think most of the tradition of the western mystery tradition has come down from Ancient Egypt and into Greece/Roman before making its way across Europe.
The secret chiefs are normally seen as a type of inner plane contact but some consider them to have physical counterparts on Earth, perhaps through inner Earth civilizations.
Crowley's Aiwass could be a type of Ra contact. The problem with different societies is that if they become distorted the contact is lost and it most likely becomes a STS channeling or contact.
Many modern groups exist today, most of which claim some type of contact with the inner planes.
I have been reading a lot about Qabalah lately and i think its a great system to use with the practical application of magick. One of the most interesting things to come out of the Golden Dawn was a practice called god form assumption , although i am not sure if this was the original name. When one takes on the form of a god making use of mytho drama and correspondences in relation to the sephiroth in question. This to me sounds a lot like becoming Archetypes at will and moving towards the great work of becoming the magical personality.
Wow. How would a person be who was an archetype at will? If a person were all the archetypes? What type of person would they be? Enlightened?
I had forgot about the Golden Dawn, I made a thread not so long ago about it because I felt slightly called to join that group.
I'd only join that group after remembering about myself as I would not want to go through the tiresome learning of their ways of magic from scratch.
My uncle is a freemason, and I chose not to participate or be present at one of their rituals. I'm not into the secret societies all that much.
I see Ra as saying that rituals designed personally are best. This makes sense being a creator and all. The more personal the connection to the symbols, the easier it is to create a deep emotional atmospheric state I think..like a direct link. I haven't really used ritual much, but personal meaning can easily alter consciousness which is something I've experienced.
In session 74 Ra does make the distinction that known rituals are best for certain circumstances.
(05-12-2015, 10:45 AM)Matt1 Wrote: [ -> ]I think most of the tradition of the western mystery tradition has come down from Ancient Egypt and into Greece/Roman before making its way across Europe.
The secret chiefs are normally seen as a type of inner plane contact but some consider them to have physical counterparts on Earth, perhaps through inner Earth civilizations.
Crowley's Aiwass could be a type of Ra contact. The problem with different societies is that if they become distorted the contact is lost and it most likely becomes a STS channeling or contact.
Many modern groups exist today, most of which claim some type of contact with the inner planes.
I have been reading a lot about Qabalah lately and i think its a great system to use with the practical application of magick. One of the most interesting things to come out of the Golden Dawn was a practice called god form assumption , although i am not sure if this was the original name. When one takes on the form of a god making use of mytho drama and correspondences in relation to the sephiroth in question. This to me sounds a lot like becoming Archetypes at will and moving towards the great work of becoming the magical personality.
Remember that the Qabalah was one of the three systems Ra offered to teach the group about archetypes and their use. They chose tarot instead of Qabalah or Astrology, but I can imagine that if they had of chosen Qabalah it would have looked a lot like Golden Dawn concepts. God-form assumption is basically the western equivalent of guru yoga. Also, recall that the magical personality when invoked is synonymous with invoking the higher self. Interestingly, Ra suggests that this is something that happens gradually.
I would say that the Qabalah is most certainly a system of understanding the archetypes and learning to become them at will.
Quote:75.38 Questioner: Now the invocation of the magical personality is not necessarily effective for the neophyte. Is there a point at which there is a definite quantum change and that personality does then reside, or can it be done in small degrees or percentages of magical personality as the neophyte becomes more adept?
Ra: I am Ra. The latter is correct.
75.36 Questioner: How does the use of the magical ritual of invoking the magical personality aid the mind/body/spirit complex totality? Could you expand on the answer you gave in the last session with respect to that?
Ra: I am Ra. When the magical personality is properly and efficaciously invoked the self has invoked its Higher Self. Thus a bridge betwixt space/time and time/space is made and the sixth-density magical personality experiences directly the third-density catalyst for the duration of the working. It is most central to deliberately take off the magical personality after the working in order that the Higher Self resume its appropriate configuration as analog to the space/time mind/body/spirit.
By what it is saying here is that by magical practice you gradually allow your sixth-density self to more and more experience and be present here in this third-density incarnation. When the magical personality is invoked, you invoke your own unified self. Interestingly, it says that invoking the magical personality isn't effective for a neophyte per se, but rather it is a gradual process whereby one is more and more able to grasp that self.
I believe the magical personality/Higher Self is the same as the concept of the Genius in Golden Dawn or the Yechidah in Qabalah.
(05-12-2015, 12:06 PM)Gemini Wolf Wrote: [ -> ]Wow. How would a person be who was an archetype at will? If a person were all the archetypes? What type of person would they be? Enlightened?
I am not sure you quite understand. A person who can become an archetype at will is empty. They fill themselves with the archetype. It is the skill of the adept to be able to assume a particular type of intelligent energy. We all already have all the archetypes, we are all already assuming them in lesser, mixed and distorted degrees. What magical practice helps you to do is to assume the archetypes more purely.
(05-12-2015, 09:20 AM)andreazzi Wrote: [ -> ] (05-12-2015, 05:28 AM)Tan.rar Wrote: [ -> ]It appears to me here that Ra is acknowledging the "formidable system of service and discipline" that is used by the Order of the Golden Dawn. The Lesser Ritual of the Pentagram which is used by the group for clearing their space is also of Golden Dawn origin. I was once informed that some of the higher adept workings in the Golden Dawn include trance channeling and keeping scribe. I have speculated that perhaps Ra, or one of the members of Ra rather, is one of the Secret Chiefs of the Golden Dawn.
Have you ever wondered what Ra actually means with their "attempt to make reparation for distortions of this law set in motion by our naïve actions of your past"?
I actually believe Ra's teachings were part of the gist of many magical traditions, including Freemasonry, Hermetic philosophy, Rosae Crucis, Kabbalah and possibly the Golden Dawn itself.
All these magical traditions have roots in the ancient Egypt, all of them share much of the same knowledge and, unfortunately, all have gone into a path of secrecy and elitism...
Precisely, I believe Ra is now attempting to reintroduce the proper principles of white magic whereby before they went awry, although that is a secondary purpose of course since their focus is always with enunciating the Law of One.
(05-13-2015, 12:26 AM)Icaro Wrote: [ -> ]I see Ra as saying that rituals designed personally are best. This makes sense being a creator and all. The more personal the connection to the symbols, the easier it is to create a deep emotional atmospheric state I think..like a direct link. I haven't really used ritual much, but personal meaning can easily alter consciousness which is something I've experienced.
In session 74 Ra does make the distinction that known rituals are best for certain circumstances.
Consider our planetary mind. A ritual that has been done hundreds, thousands of other times creates an imprint and so when you perform that same ritual you are accessing that collective of power which has been generated over many occasions.
(05-13-2015, 01:07 AM)Tan.rar Wrote: [ -> ] (05-13-2015, 12:26 AM)Icaro Wrote: [ -> ]I see Ra as saying that rituals designed personally are best. This makes sense being a creator and all. The more personal the connection to the symbols, the easier it is to create a deep emotional atmospheric state I think..like a direct link. I haven't really used ritual much, but personal meaning can easily alter consciousness which is something I've experienced.
In session 74 Ra does make the distinction that known rituals are best for certain circumstances.
Consider our planetary mind. A ritual that has been done hundreds, thousands of other times creates an imprint and so when you perform that same ritual you are accessing that collective of power which has been generated over many occasions.
I would agree here, I think about anytime we do anything, we call from this collective.
(05-13-2015, 01:05 AM)Tan.rar Wrote: [ -> ] (05-12-2015, 12:06 PM)Gemini Wolf Wrote: [ -> ]Wow. How would a person be who was an archetype at will? If a person were all the archetypes? What type of person would they be? Enlightened?
I am not sure you quite understand. A person who can become an archetype at will is empty. They fill themselves with the archetype. It is the skill of the adept to be able to assume a particular type of intelligent energy. We all already have all the archetypes, we are all already assuming them in lesser, mixed and distorted degrees. What magical practice helps you to do is to assume the archetypes more purely.
Nicely said Tan.Rar I really like how you applied the concept, that we are already being these archetypes. In just a distorted mixed. and lesser ways. I believe to perceive what you said correctly, sheds light on the archetypes.
You could perhaps say that the techniques of magic and inner alchemy are designed to distill, separate and recombine the elements of the archetypes until they gradually become their pure forms, unmixed with eachother yet still capable of joining forces. Each itself, yet unified together. All of the techniques of meditation in fact work with the archetypes to some extent I believe, as each type of meditation involves the prioritization or focus upon particular archetypal aspects of the self.
For those who are practicing mindfulness and silence I would correlate with the Fool (Matrix of the Mind) or the World (Way of the Spirit), the beginning and the end of the journey of the soul.
It was once said to me that the difference between magical systems is that of sophistication. Comparing a simple hermetic qabalah magic or perhaps simple witchcraft to Lurianic Qabalah or Yoga is like comparing a bicycle to a space station. Bicycles are still cool and can do things the space station can't, but the space station requires a much greater degree of sophistication of thought to accomplish what it does. So it is with the different systems of magic. I believe this is part of what draws individuals to particular systems just like there are some people who like to work with bikes and some people who like to work with space stations.
(05-13-2015, 05:06 AM)Tan.rar Wrote: [ -> ]It was once said to me that the difference between magical systems is that of sophistication. Comparing a simple hermetic qabalah magic or perhaps simple witchcraft to Lurianic Qabalah or Yoga is like comparing a bicycle to a space station. Bicycles are still cool and can do things the space station can't, but the space station requires a much greater degree of sophistication of thought to accomplish what it does. So it is with the different systems of magic. I believe this is part of what draws individuals to particular systems just like there are some people who like to work with bikes and some people who like to work with space stations.
Dam.
That makes a profound amount of sense. This is off topic, what is your opinion on hermetics in general? In Hermes?
(05-13-2015, 05:18 AM)Indigo Light Wrote: [ -> ] (05-13-2015, 05:06 AM)Tan.rar Wrote: [ -> ]It was once said to me that the difference between magical systems is that of sophistication. Comparing a simple hermetic qabalah magic or perhaps simple witchcraft to Lurianic Qabalah or Yoga is like comparing a bicycle to a space station. Bicycles are still cool and can do things the space station can't, but the space station requires a much greater degree of sophistication of thought to accomplish what it does. So it is with the different systems of magic. I believe this is part of what draws individuals to particular systems just like there are some people who like to work with bikes and some people who like to work with space stations.
Dam.
That makes a profound amount of sense. This is off topic, what is your opinion on hermetics in general? In Hermes?
Hermes is a good friend of mine. Hermetics is a powerful system of thought and is reflective of many truths I believe I have experienced. It is, of course, with its limitations and is rather cerebral in its approach but I enjoy its mechanisms. I would not say I exactly have an opinion I suppose other than I believe it is a competent system of thought. Hermetics are also intimately intertwined with alchemy which I am fond of.
Again, Hermeticism is a system of working in thought, it is a philosophy. You could perhaps say it is a method of self-creation.
(05-13-2015, 05:06 AM)Tan.rar Wrote: [ -> ]It was once said to me that the difference between magical systems is that of sophistication. Comparing a simple hermetic qabalah magic or perhaps simple witchcraft to Lurianic Qabalah or Yoga is like comparing a bicycle to a space station. Bicycles are still cool and can do things the space station can't, but the space station requires a much greater degree of sophistication of thought to accomplish what it does. So it is with the different systems of magic. I believe this is part of what draws individuals to particular systems just like there are some people who like to work with bikes and some people who like to work with space stations.
Lurianic Kabbalah is the more traditional Judaic method coming from Isaac Luria and the Hermetic tradition came through Giovanni Pico della Mirandola by fusing Christian and Hermetic elements into the Qabalah. However it was Athanasius Kircher glyph of the Qabalah that is mostly used in the western tradition.
I haven't studied the Lurianic Kabbalah in depth but i wouldn't say its better or more than the hermetic Qabalah, it simply has a different arrangement of the pathways connecting to the Sephiroths. A path connecting Geburah to Chockmah and Chesed to Binah. Rather than paths connecting Hod and Netzach to Malkuth.
The hermetic Qabalah has some advantages as they aren't limited by Mosaic law nor to traditional correspondences. For example the Tarot cards have been used as a correspondence in the Hermetic system which is highly rejected by the traditional Lurianic Kabbalah.
The higher self or the Holy Guardian Angel is almost always a correspondence of Tiphareth rather than Kether. I would say its the primordial light reflecting of Kether into the Solar Logo's of Tiphareth.
Kether and the Supernal being the Yechidah in my understanding and Tiphareth through Chesed being the Neshamah.
One of the main issues i have found while studying Qabalah is that every Occutlist has his or her own way of dividing the tree into the 4 worlds of the tetragrammaton and parts of the soul.
I do not know why I am not interested in those ways. They vibrate for me as an indirect way of doing things, all powers should be within so I know not why I should work indirectly through borrowed powers or rituals.
I know that what's not within is yet also within as there is only One, but it seems to me that using such methods while making it easier also does keep one from reaching the stage where he can himself become an incarnation of these powers.
It seems to me like either you borrow or you achieve becoming a source yourself.
Not sure you quite understand the concept in Golden Dawn ritual practice. There is no borrowing, the goal is to balance the forces of the self to fully realize oneself as a co-Creator. It is, of course, only one method and who can say what is 'best'?
(05-13-2015, 06:24 AM)Matt1 Wrote: [ -> ] (05-13-2015, 05:06 AM)Tan.rar Wrote: [ -> ]It was once said to me that the difference between magical systems is that of sophistication. Comparing a simple hermetic qabalah magic or perhaps simple witchcraft to Lurianic Qabalah or Yoga is like comparing a bicycle to a space station. Bicycles are still cool and can do things the space station can't, but the space station requires a much greater degree of sophistication of thought to accomplish what it does. So it is with the different systems of magic. I believe this is part of what draws individuals to particular systems just like there are some people who like to work with bikes and some people who like to work with space stations.
Lurianic Kabbalah is the more traditional Judaic method coming from Isaac Luria and the Hermetic tradition came through Giovanni Pico della Mirandola by fusing Christian and Hermetic elements into the Qabalah. However it was Athanasius Kircher glyph of the Qabalah that is mostly used in the western tradition.
I haven't studied the Lurianic Kabbalah in depth but i wouldn't say its better or more than the hermetic Qabalah, it simply has a different arrangement of the pathways connecting to the Sephiroths. A path connecting Geburah to Chockmah and Chesed to Binah. Rather than paths connecting Hod and Netzach to Malkuth.
The hermetic Qabalah has some advantages as they aren't limited by Mosaic law nor to traditional correspondences. For example the Tarot cards have been used as a correspondence in the Hermetic system which is highly rejected by the traditional Lurianic Kabbalah.
The higher self or the Holy Guardian Angel is almost always a correspondence of Tiphareth rather than Kether. I would say its the primordial light reflecting of Kether into the Solar Logo's of Tiphareth.
Kether and the Supernal being the Yechidah in my understanding and Tiphareth through Chesed being the Neshamah.
One of the main issues i have found while studying Qabalah is that every Occutlist has his or her own way of dividing the tree into the 4 worlds of the tetragrammaton and parts of the soul.
I think the difference is that in Lurianic Qabalah they use various scriptures and writings such as the Zohar as a basis for studying the tree of life as an enourmous psychodrama of human life and concerns as they develop and evolve through the journey up the tree. This, whereas in Hermetic Kabbalah the focus is much more on the Tree of Life glyph itself, study of its correspondences, the sephiroth and the uses in ritual magic. The Golden Dawn temple I am familiar with works with Lurianic Qabalah although they teach Hermetic as well I believe.
I think it's important to remember that besides the glyph, Qabalah is actually derived from these types of texts (Zohar, Sefer Yetzirah) and the Old Testament and began first as a religious philosophy and system.
The system that Golden Dawn uses probably varies from temple to temple, but I think it's important to remember that the Golden Dawn and Qabalah are not synonymous even though the former makes extensive use of the latter.
Hermetic Qabalah is alot easier to get into i think, its difficult to find any good information in English about the Lurianic Qabalah. You do have some translations of the old texts. I think its also fair to remember that all the old texts in themselves were written by human beings who would have there own distortions. As fair as western occultism and the Ra material goes i think the Heremtic system probably works best
(05-12-2015, 05:28 AM)Tan.rar Wrote: [ -> ]Quote:69.22 Questioner: There are many techniques and ways of practicing so-called white magical arts. Are rituals designed by a particular group for their own particular use just as good or possibly better than those that have been practiced by groups such as the Order of the Golden Dawn and other magical groups?
Ra: I am Ra. Although we are unable to speak with precision on this query, we may note some gratification that the questioner has penetrated some of the gist of a formidable system of service and discipline.
It appears to me here that Ra is acknowledging the "formidable system of service and discipline" that is used by the Order of the Golden Dawn. The Lesser Ritual of the Pentagram which is used by the group for clearing their space is also of Golden Dawn origin. I was once informed that some of the higher adept workings in the Golden Dawn include trance channeling and keeping scribe. I have speculated that perhaps Ra, or one of the members of Ra rather, is one of the Secret Chiefs of the Golden Dawn.
I know next to nothing about the actual teaching of the Golden Dawn or the hierarchy of people and knowledge. Would you be suggesting that the Golden Dawn would be trance channeling Ra? Or perhaps Ra is interacting in a more direct sense?
I got the sense from the Ra material that Ra has decided not to interact directly and preferred the method of channeling as a teaching technique. And this particular passage seems to speak to their success in finding channels:
Quote:6.20
We have walked among your people. We remember. We remember sorrow. We have seen much. We have searched for an instrument of the proper parameters of distortion in mind/body/spirit complex and supporting and understanding group of mind/body/spirit complexes to accept this information with minimal distortion and maximal desire to serve for some of your years. The answer, in short, is yes. However, we wished you to know that in our memory we thank you.
I feel as though they are implying that their search has not been fruitful up until this certain point. Ra's particular distortions and desires may prevent them from sharing in certain ways and in certain contexts, based on their past experiences. However, that doesn't really say much about the sources the Golden Dawn may have access to through trance channeling. Ra is not the only member of the Confederation working with channels - not even the only 6th density memory complex. To a dedicated and pure group of magical workers, there is probably an abundance of potential positive sources in a similar vein as Ra.
(05-13-2015, 05:01 AM)Tan.rar Wrote: [ -> ]Fool (Matrix of the Mind)
I am seriously losing my mind here or something, I thought The Fool was the Significator of the Body and the Magician the Matrix of the Mind...
Questioner Wrote:Are rituals designed by a particular group for their own particular use just as good or possibly better than those that have been practiced by groups
Ra Wrote:I am Ra. Although we are unable to speak with precision on this query, we may note some gratification that the questioner has penetrated some of the gist of a formidable system of service and discipline.
Is how I interpreted this. I saw it more that Ra was referring to the act of "rituals designed by a particular group for their own particular use" as that system of service and discipline which is formidable. But they may very well have also meant it about the Golden Dawn.
(05-15-2015, 01:14 PM)VanAlioSaldo Wrote: [ -> ] (05-13-2015, 05:01 AM)Tan.rar Wrote: [ -> ]Fool (Matrix of the Mind)
I am seriously losing my mind here or something, I thought The Fool was the Significator of the Body and the Magician the Matrix of the Mind...
I'm not sure where this confusion is coming from, but for clarification:
In Ra's tarot, The Fool is The Choice, and is not a specific part of any of the mind, body, or spirit cycles. (
http://www.lawofone.info/results.php?c=T...The+Choice)
The Matrix of the Mind is the Magician.
The Significator of the Body is the Hanged Man.
There are a few charts, tables, or resources online to find clarification and learn more. One would be
the Book 4 PDF (starting on page 6), another would be
this handy website, or
the Tarot category on www.lawofone.info.
Also
the Archetypes Sub-forum table of contents.
http://www.thirddensity.com/tarot
Is my reference, there's where the confusion may lie. I still need to take the time to explore all of the forums here. Linky linky, clicky clicky
That was a mistake on my part, I meant the Magician, not the Fool, it was just an example so I threw it out without fully thinking.
(05-14-2015, 09:43 AM)Matt1 Wrote: [ -> ]Hermetic Qabalah is alot easier to get into i think, its difficult to find any good information in English about the Lurianic Qabalah. You do have some translations of the old texts. I think its also fair to remember that all the old texts in themselves were written by human beings who would have there own distortions. As fair as western occultism and the Ra material goes i think the Heremtic system probably works best
Well, I think what "works best" is whatever is most relevant and empowering to the individuals. Perhaps I would agree that the Hermetic Qabalah is the most accessibly compatible.
(05-15-2015, 11:52 AM)Bring4th_Austin Wrote: [ -> ] (05-12-2015, 05:28 AM)Tan.rar Wrote: [ -> ]Quote:69.22 Questioner: There are many techniques and ways of practicing so-called white magical arts. Are rituals designed by a particular group for their own particular use just as good or possibly better than those that have been practiced by groups such as the Order of the Golden Dawn and other magical groups?
Ra: I am Ra. Although we are unable to speak with precision on this query, we may note some gratification that the questioner has penetrated some of the gist of a formidable system of service and discipline.
It appears to me here that Ra is acknowledging the "formidable system of service and discipline" that is used by the Order of the Golden Dawn. The Lesser Ritual of the Pentagram which is used by the group for clearing their space is also of Golden Dawn origin. I was once informed that some of the higher adept workings in the Golden Dawn include trance channeling and keeping scribe. I have speculated that perhaps Ra, or one of the members of Ra rather, is one of the Secret Chiefs of the Golden Dawn.
I know next to nothing about the actual teaching of the Golden Dawn or the hierarchy of people and knowledge. Would you be suggesting that the Golden Dawn would be trance channeling Ra? Or perhaps Ra is interacting in a more direct sense?
I got the sense from the Ra material that Ra has decided not to interact directly and preferred the method of channeling as a teaching technique. And this particular passage seems to speak to their success in finding channels:
Quote:6.20
We have walked among your people. We remember. We remember sorrow. We have seen much. We have searched for an instrument of the proper parameters of distortion in mind/body/spirit complex and supporting and understanding group of mind/body/spirit complexes to accept this information with minimal distortion and maximal desire to serve for some of your years. The answer, in short, is yes. However, we wished you to know that in our memory we thank you.
I feel as though they are implying that their search has not been fruitful up until this certain point. Ra's particular distortions and desires may prevent them from sharing in certain ways and in certain contexts, based on their past experiences. However, that doesn't really say much about the sources the Golden Dawn may have access to through trance channeling. Ra is not the only member of the Confederation working with channels - not even the only 6th density memory complex. To a dedicated and pure group of magical workers, there is probably an abundance of potential positive sources in a similar vein as Ra.
More what I am implying is that the Ra Material appears, to me, as a slice taken out of the journey of the magician. Ra variously stated that combined as a group the channelers had only as much skill as a Neophyte (which is the first grade in the Golden Dawn), however their harmony together allowed them to access a much higher vibration and level of teaching than simply their skill would have allowed. So, I believe they were able to engage in an advanced work of magic due to their harmony without actually having accomplished the lesser work a magician would normally go through to get to that point of purity.
That being said, it only says there "for some of your years", so that says to me that they have found and utilized others, but they haven't found one in awhile. Considering this channeling happened in the 80's, and the Golden Dawn started in the late 1900's I would say almost a hundred years is 'some years' by that measure and it's not unreasonable to consider that perhaps the magicians of the Golden Dawn and prior have indeed managed such contacts.
Now that being said, I am still on the outside. I haven't joined the Golden Dawn yet so I do not know all the details of their working. I showed the Ra Material to the senior adept I know and he was the one who expressed that such a channeling would be the work of an adept however I would mention that he did not seem particularly impressed although he did find it interesting.
I admit, while I believe Ra offers a pure teaching, through a pure channel, there is something which has always seemed incomplete about the channeling.
However, my ultimate conclusion is that Ra very much acknowledges the Golden Dawn system as formidable.
(05-15-2015, 01:14 PM)VanAlioSaldo Wrote: [ -> ] (05-13-2015, 05:01 AM)Tan.rar Wrote: [ -> ]Fool (Matrix of the Mind)
I am seriously losing my mind here or something, I thought The Fool was the Significator of the Body and the Magician the Matrix of the Mind...
Questioner Wrote:Are rituals designed by a particular group for their own particular use just as good or possibly better than those that have been practiced by groups
Ra Wrote:I am Ra. Although we are unable to speak with precision on this query, we may note some gratification that the questioner has penetrated some of the gist of a formidable system of service and discipline.
Is how I interpreted this. I saw it more that Ra was referring to the act of "rituals designed by a particular group for their own particular use" as that system of service and discipline which is formidable. But they may very well have also meant it about the Golden Dawn.
That doesn't make sense to me since they refer specifically to "
a formidable
system". If they were just referring to various rituals designed by a group, that to me wouldn't constitute an established 'system'. It seems clear to me that they are referring to the Golden Dawn system as in the question Don asks if self-designed rituals are "just as good" as Golden Dawn rituals which shows that Don clearly appreciates the Golden Dawn system and I believe it is this appreciation and knowledge that Ra is acknowledging.
There are a couple quotes which I believe support this.
Quote:42.16 Questioner: I had one experience in meditation which I spoke of before which was very profound approximately twenty years ago, a little less. What disciplines would be most applicable to re-create this situation and this type of experience?
Ra: I am Ra. Your experience would best be approached from the ceremonial magical stance. However, the Wanderer or adept shall have the far greater potential for this type of experience which, as you have undoubtedly analyzed to be the case, is one of an archetypal nature, one belonging to the roots of cosmic consciousness.
42.17 Questioner: Was that in any way related to the Golden Dawn in ceremonial magic?
Ra: I am Ra. The relationship was congruency.
42.18 Questioner: Then in attempting to reproduce this experience would I then best follow practices for the Order of the Golden Dawn in reproducing this?
Ra: I am Ra. To attempt to reproduce an initiatory experience is to move, shall we say, backwards. However, the practice of this form of service to others is appropriate in your case working with your associates. It is not well for positively polarized entities to work singly. The reasons for this are obvious.
It seems to me to be pretty clear there that Ra is suggesting to Don that the practice of Golden Dawn ceremonial magical is a worthwhile path to follow, especially when doing work in a group. I believe this also shows that Don clearly had an interest in the Golden Dawn and was studying their techniques, so it could be also that Ra suggests it for Don because he is already familiar with it.
Thus, it is suggested to me that the techniques of the Golden Dawn and the teachings of Ra are highly compatible.