Bring4th

How could one infinitely negate the other self without a strong core of Self love?

Their service is a deep love of creation and self-manifestation. Is their service to themselves, then to hide the the force of the lower chakras manifesting a deep 'Love' of creation? To mask this force as a darkness no fool could possibly understand, lest the fool attempts to see through the eyes of the shadow. And reaching this point itself requires the polarized self to be almost smothered totally in the weight of the unknown.

I too often see people say that STS is all about Negation and Control, but at the root of these is an absolutely boring uniformity and unfreedom of thought. Why would anyone aspire to see all things as the same, perfectly under control with no more work in the world to be done? To be Evil? Never. There is a deeper veiling at play.

I have the feeling Negative adepts hold a deep understanding and love of the Auras of others - so they may see their own uncontrolled, random, non-service-to-self energy reflected back in their eyes - so they may serve themselves more by knowing others - knowing the self.

Is their Love to others the gift of Fear? After all, they know deeply the virtues of Fear and how it may be used for the benefit of both polarities.

Maybe their totality of 'Love expression' their 'Heart Center' is simply the power and force of the lower three chakras in divine alignment to the creator. There is no "Absence of Heart" , ever. And they know this serves all.  Thoughts??

Ehhh its a bit more complicated, and I don't have the time atm to fight my phone keyboard and explain it.

But in response to your title (more on the OP later if I don't forget) I think most people need to step away from duality. Love and Understanding is in ALL THINGS, Intellectually and Energetically.

The STS path uses the same items with different intention.

'Our' love is feel-good via our polarity.
'Their' love is feel-good via their polarity.
Both understand this version of Love, its the same love experienced in a different way is all.

Both understand their desires and manifest them.

What's the difference?? What are 'we' without 'them'?

There is no absence of heart ever indeed, a closed heart is nothing like having no heart. Love can be found in why the heart was closed as a great service to self, in my view one needs to understand that through any STS entity's path, they would also have closed their heart out of love for themselves in the same manner.

And the heart is only closed, STS entities are ever having their heart and adding to their own misery when they hurt other-selves. They make themselves fall deeper and deeper into the abyss of their own sorrow until they finally open their heart again and face all they did with an open heart, distilling the love/light from it until total acceptance of it all is found.


But yeah STS entities grow in love in 4D just like STO entities and then in wisdom in 5D.


STS entities deserve nothing but love, but they work to not receive love. They were twisted by their own fate and reject the Creation they were born into, working to alter it into something they can be well for themselves.

Quote:Ra: I am Ra.  If you see the energy centers in their various colors completing the spectrum you may see that the service-to-self choice is one which denies the very center of the spectrum; that being universal love. Therefore, all that is built upon the penetration of the light of harvestable quality by such entities is based upon an omission. This omission shall manifest in fourth density as the love of self; that is, the fullest expression of the orange and yellow energy centers which then are used to potentiate communication and adepthood.

When fifth-density refinement has been achieved that which is not is carried further, the wisdom density being explored by entities which have no compassion, no universal love. They experience that which they wish by free choice, being of the earnest opinion that green-ray energy is folly.

That which is not may be seen as a self-imposed darkness in which harmony is turned into an eternal disharmony. However, that which is not cannot endure throughout the octave of third density and, as darkness eventually calls the light, so does that which is not eventually call that which is.

Essentially, all green ray is "universal love".  STS beings still experience "personal love".  Green ray might best be thought of as "impersonal love", or "unconditional love".  They definitely still experience conditional love, which is love extending from the identity of the self, and the lower energy centers.  As an example, if anyone has watched the recent Johnny Depp movie "Black Mass", the main character of the movie is essentially negatively polarized, yet still cares for his family, and those extremely loyal to him, because they are extensions of his power and identity.  He's just not the type of person who would help any joe off the street, and doesn't hesitate for a moment to use fear or physical violence to control others.

Another thing a negative will deliberately and consciously block is the "blue ray" center.  Since a big part of their game is flipping truth on its top side, and using falsity to manipulate others, this manifests as a blocked blue ray center, again, a very conscious and deliberate action.

I never resonated so much with most of Ra quotes about the STS path, which is understandable as it's like asking the Devil to talk about the STO polarity. 

You'd probably be told that STO beings and mindless fools that focus only on love, that as long as their heart is open and filled with love then all is well and that it is the sole thing of importance. That their love is a mindless blanket that tries to cover anything unconditionally without any understanding nor actual acceptance of it.

That they are self-righteous preaching that they are selfless yet work their hardest to paint Creation to their liking and their own self-desires.

(10-05-2015, 10:45 AM)anagogy Wrote: [ -> ]Another thing a negative will deliberately and consciously block is the "blue ray" center.  Since a big part of their game is flipping truth on its top side, and using falsity to manipulate others, this manifests as a blocked blue ray center, again, a very conscious and deliberate action.

I always enjoy reading your posts, anagogy.  If STS entities block their blue center, and the blue center relates to verbal expression, how then to explain Hitler's persuasive oratory which mobilized an entire nation - or the impact of Muslim hate clerics, for that matter?

(10-05-2015, 12:06 PM)Stranger Wrote: [ -> ]

(10-05-2015, 10:45 AM)anagogy Wrote: [ -> ]Another thing a negative will deliberately and consciously block is the "blue ray" center.  Since a big part of their game is flipping truth on its top side, and using falsity to manipulate others, this manifests as a blocked blue ray center, again, a very conscious and deliberate action.

I always enjoy reading your posts, anagogy.  If STS entities block their blue center, and the blue center relates to verbal expression, how then to explain Hitler's persuasive oratory which mobilized an entire nation - or the impact of Muslim hate clerics, for that matter?

I think there are blocages on emission of the true self.

(10-05-2015, 12:06 PM)Stranger Wrote: [ -> ]

(10-05-2015, 10:45 AM)anagogy Wrote: [ -> ]Another thing a negative will deliberately and consciously block is the "blue ray" center.  Since a big part of their game is flipping truth on its top side, and using falsity to manipulate others, this manifests as a blocked blue ray center, again, a very conscious and deliberate action.

I always enjoy reading your posts, anagogy.  If STS entities block their blue center, and the blue center relates to verbal expression, how then to explain Hitler's persuasive oratory which mobilized an entire nation - or the impact of Muslim hate clerics, for that matter?

^^no offense Anagogy. But I do agree here. The only problem is Hitler wasn't properly STS (he might still be in healing too).

But can I say you're both right since I think the blue ray can very much be active in a negative way, where honesty isn't the game but concealment is. If that makes sense? Being the Cocreator chakra the deliberate Intentional use of 'honest lies' to mask your 'truth' is how that chakra would be used I think.

(10-05-2015, 12:06 PM)Stranger Wrote: [ -> ]I always enjoy reading your posts, anagogy.  If STS entities block their blue center, and the blue center relates to verbal expression, how then to explain Hitler's persuasive oratory which mobilized an entire nation - or the impact of Muslim hate clerics, for that matter?

(10-05-2015, 01:24 PM)The_Tired_Philosopher Wrote: [ -> ]^^no offense Anagogy.  But I do agree here.   The only problem is Hitler wasn't properly STS (he might still be in healing too).

But can I say you're both right since I think the blue ray can very much be active in a negative way, where honesty isn't the game but concealment is.  If that makes sense?  Being the Cocreator chakra the deliberate Intentional use of 'honest lies' to mask your 'truth' is how that chakra would be used I think.

This is the difference between an unconscious blockage and a conscious blockage.  You see, it is not that they do not have good communication skills.  Or that they cannot feel or do not have the requisite skill to tap into universal compassion if they wanted to.  It is rather that they are deliberately restricting these energies to suit their needs.  As for compassion, they simply view it as both weakness, and an obstacle toward power over others.  And with blue, they again, use it to suit their needs.  A fully open blue center results in complete self honesty, self expression, and pure communication of that truth.  In the case of the negative adepts they use communication to suit their needs, so it may not be a completely void blue ray center, but a restricted and carefully managed flow of information and ideas to most effectively persuade, and thereby control and mobilize many souls towards their ends.  Highly developed STS types are often cunningly persuasive, and often end up in positions of power (probably more often than STO individuals).

Quote:Ra: The vibratory rates are not to be understood as the same in positive and negative orientations. They are to be understood as having the power to accept and work with intelligent infinity to a certain degree or intensity. Due to the fact that the primary color, shall we say, or energy blue is missing from the negatively oriented system of power, the green/blue vibratory energies are not seen in the vibratory schedules or patterns of negative fourth and fifth rates of vibration.

The positive, upon the other hand, shall we say, has the full spectrum of true-color time/space vibratory patterns and thus contains a variant vibratory pattern or schedule. Each is capable of doing fourth-density work. This is the criterion for harvest.

Activating the indigo ray from the yellow ray is exhausting. The green ray in such a situation becomes the focal point of the concentration of the lower chakras. In other words the heart is used as something to bounce off the energy of the lower chakras to amplify their power. The awakening of the heart in this state is terrifying because it means a loss of self-integrity and self-interest. It is more that because everything is seen to be One and that One is the self, it is that other selves are deemed to not truly exist. They exist only as a function of one's ability to create them. Discovering and dismantling that structure of layers is one of the keys to the 'dark power'.

However, in that regard, the compassion and love is that destruction becomes mercy. What is more satisfying than destruction is sustained suffering of those who are out of line with the One Self you see yourself to be. It may be that you think you are helping them, as they appear to be suffering anyways, or it may be that you want others to experience what you have experienced, amongst other possibilities.

In the end, I think 'STS' is about a disregard for the fact that reality is co-created, and instead all of creation is attributed to one's own self. In such a state, one's word is law, and one's desires absolute.

I wouldn't use Ra quotes against me
Your current quote regards the act of viewing ones self through the violet ray in regards to harvest, as well as refers to how one energetically 'appears'.

I assure you, a non properly activated blue ray can still be used, blockages are just another tool or 'way of being'.

I bet you a STS entity has a nonblocked blue ray towards someone they love, and intentionally blocks their blue ray when not speaking to that person.

A blocked ray is not an inactive ray. Plus you're putting a lot of emphasis that STS has no lesser variants of STS being, as if a STS being can't exist with STO parts included into their life.

Or better put, stereotyped STS tendencies aren't the only reality there is, Ra described the needs to harvest. Do you think a typical STS entity knows they need to be NIGH-COMPLETELY selfish and does such? Or even strives for it when found out?

Its a bias from my perception. The chakra system can be shut down through blockages, but that doesn't mean its not still working. Blue ray doesn't need green unlocked to be active and used by its entity. Indigo doesn't need green or blue unlocked.

Its why a STS energy system can access Intelligent Energy and Intelligent Infinity.

Its why intuition works.

You can use blue ray to block blue ray, does that make sense?

Some time back, I found myself perusing a book on the subject of Chaos Magick out of philosophical curiosity.  It ended up giving me great additional insight into how the STS mindset works.  Because it wasn't some over-the-top cartoon cackling about how eeeeevil they are, and was in part focused on how people should get past good\evil dichotomies because they're just another form of control system.  It even talked specifically about how destruction for its own sake is counterproductive.

But what really stuck me is that it emphasized, over and over, that everything is You.  That if one thinks they are talking to guardian angels, or summoning demons, it is still only themselves in a different form.  That even the world is merely an extension of self.  It very directly encouraged readers to view the self AS God/Creator.  And, as such, it saw the aim of chaos magick as learning to shape the world in the same way one shapes the self, by viewing them as one in the same.  Obviously it didn't use the term "Service to Self" as a polarity in the way Ra would, but that certainly seemed to be the implication.

(This seems a good time to mention I'm not endorsing these views necessarily, just discussing them in the abstract.)

So, it wasn't a loveless book, since one necessarily loves themselves.  It actually encouraged understanding, but understanding through the lens of All-as-Self.  And, somewhat like Aion talked about, it saw destruction -when properly/rationally applied- as an act of renewal.  The fire-rejuvenating-the-forest effect, basically.  I'd tend to believe it may have been the product of a negative 5D thinker, since much of the thought seemed quite advanced.  

I had very little interest in applying its teachings to my own practices, but I'm still glad I read it specifically because it gave me more empathy\understanding of the self-focused mindset.  It helped me see how there can still be love and understanding in STS even if one is attempting to dominate or control other-selves, because it doesn't recognize "other selves" as being a thing.  The goal professed was the creation of a more perfect world\self by taking direct control and responsibility.

And after a fashion, that's the same thing STOs are attempting, just with a much different focus.

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edit: For that matter, even the works of Ayn Rand -who I consider basically the High Priestess of STS- are not without love or understanding. Her characters love life (they say so repeatedly) and even sometimes love each other, after a fashion. But it's a very harsh love that encourages one to expel anything that gets in the way of one's own vision of perfection, even if it means engineering a global collapse to create a die-off that allows a new paradigm to thrive. Calculated destruction is a major part of her works, and one of my own chief disagreements with them, but it's not destruction for its own sake. It's destruction for the sake of creating a better replacement.

Can you pm me, or post, the name of that book??

That's an interesting look at the use of 'chaos magic'. Sounds like an overly grim name for what you said it spoke of heh

Ok, so to derail my own thread, excuse me If I know next to nothing about Ayn Rand and her literary works, but everyone around here seems to esteem her as a great example of a Negative adept. Why is this?

@Tired: I know it was one of the books by Michael W. Ford, who's written a lot of stuff on Luciferian magic, but I don't remember which particular one it was. I'm not sure if posting a link to a large catalog of left-hand texts is appropriate for this forum, but if you Google him, he's got a Google Drive with a bunch of his books on it.

@Tamryn: Ayn Rand invented an entire philosophical system she called Objectivism, which was the basis for a couple novels (The Fountainhead and Atlas Shrugged) as well as a whole bunch of nonfiction books. The entire focus of her philosophy is the elevation of the Ego as the highest form, and Ego-tism as the highest ideal. For her, material success was the best kind, and she had a strong emphasis on hierarchical thinking as a way of dividing the Best from the Rest, so to speak.

If you wanted an overview, the best source would probably be the official Objectivism website, since her books tend to be many-hundred-page doorstops. However, it's in some ways summed up by the "Galt Pledge," which simply states "I pledge by my life and my love of it, that I will never live for the sake of another man, nor ask another man to live for mine." ie, it's an absolute denial of inter-connectedness.

Her esteem largely comes from the fact that she does have so many adherants, including a lot of folks high-up in business and government. For better or worse, her philosophy of selfishness resonated with a lot of people.

Ah thank you

For better I assume. Every one has their path and resonance

This was a hard one for me to get.

My teacher taught that the dark ones are the most loving souls because they are willing to sacrifice their loving connection to All while incarnated. It's a big sacrifice of their true essence and being as souls.

Ultimately, as Ra says, the path of radiant being is the true path of our true nature.  So even though Ra gives credence to the STS path, it's a big lie and deception.

(10-06-2015, 09:43 AM)Shemaya Wrote: [ -> ]This was a hard one for me to get.

My teacher taught that the dark ones are the most loving souls because they are willing to sacrifice their loving connection to All while incarnated. It's a big sacrifice of their true essence and being as souls.

Ultimately, as Ra says, the path of radiant being is the true path of our true nature.  So even though Ra gives credence to the STS path, it's a big lie and deception.

I do not think the path altogether is lie and deception, the duality is born from being an individualized portion of the Creator among other individualized portions. As such self is faced by this duality of self among other-selves. A STS entity won't be well in positive densities and I do not see any STO entities wanting to provide to that entity the services that it desires to be well.

An entity can evolve through all densities in the negative path except move on to the 7th density. A positive entity won't leave the positive densities to move on to 7D (although there are most likely "many" in 6D who switch to negative densities because they perceive the limits of their S/M/C and seek further understanding of the All) but I still think positive entities will need to let go of what they think is service and love to embrace a greater perception of what Love truly is, one that is not serving their self in a way.

Ra did say that evolution in 6D is very slow, I picture that happening because STO and STS entities do not want to let go of how they define themselves. True Love is a power that both creates and destroys, but one side does not want to create and the other does not want to destroy. 7D is a realm where both are fully embraced and perceived equally as Love. In 6D and under whether one is STS or STO, one is always serving self foremost and providing catalyst/experience for other-selves by it. 

A STO entity by spreading love is trying to create the reality that it wants, there is no selflessness in that, it tries to be what it want to be for itself using other-selves as a pretext. Picture that just as one can have desires of spreading love, another can have desires to spread darkness, both are acting on their self desires. If a STO entity was truly selfless then it'd be able to provide assistance to those of the negative path, it'd help them create world of darkness for 4D STS planets to be born. But that is not the reality that STO entities want and as such STS entities need to create their own reality by fighting STO ones.

In a STO-only world, the STO path is truly positive.

In a world with the duality of polarity, the positive path is negative to those of the other path. Their ways of love hurt and make others fall deeper into their own darkness.

(10-05-2015, 10:45 AM)anagogy Wrote: [ -> ]

Quote:Ra: I am Ra.  If you see the energy centers in their various colors completing the spectrum you may see that the service-to-self choice is one which denies the very center of the spectrum; that being universal love. Therefore, all that is built upon the penetration of the light of harvestable quality by such entities is based upon an omission. This omission shall manifest in fourth density as the love of self; that is, the fullest expression of the orange and yellow energy centers which then are used to potentiate communication and adepthood.

When fifth-density refinement has been achieved that which is not is carried further, the wisdom density being explored by entities which have no compassion, no universal love. They experience that which they wish by free choice, being of the earnest opinion that green-ray energy is folly.

That which is not may be seen as a self-imposed darkness in which harmony is turned into an eternal disharmony. However, that which is not cannot endure throughout the octave of third density and, as darkness eventually calls the light, so does that which is not eventually call that which is.

Essentially, all green ray is "universal love".  STS beings still experience "personal love".  Green ray might best be thought of as "impersonal love", or "unconditional love".  They definitely still experience conditional love, which is love extending from the identity of the self, and the lower energy centers.  As an example, if anyone has watched the recent Johnny Depp movie "Black Mass", the main character of the movie is essentially negatively polarized, yet still cares for his family, and those extremely loyal to him, because they are extensions of his power and identity.  He's just not the type of person who would help any joe off the street, and doesn't hesitate for a moment to use fear or physical violence to control others.

Another thing a negative will deliberately and consciously block is the "blue ray" center.  Since a big part of their game is flipping truth on its top side, and using falsity to manipulate others, this manifests as a blocked blue ray center, again, a very conscious and deliberate action.

You nailed it!

...

(10-05-2015, 12:06 PM)Stranger Wrote: [ -> ]I always enjoy reading your posts, anagogy.  If STS entities block their blue center, and the blue center relates to verbal expression, how then to explain Hitler's persuasive oratory which mobilized an entire nation - or the impact of Muslim hate clerics, for that matter?

Blue ray isn't just about verbal expression, or even about communication in general. It's more than that and also includes honesty and the ability to truly relate to other beings, as well as the ability to express one's own feelings, to the point of allowing oneself to be vulnerable to those who love them. This is the essence of connecting on the higher chakras with one's beloved.

An example of blue ray expression in 2 mated STO entities is open communication about their darkest fears, their deepest secrets with their beloved. This can only happen if they are sufficiently grounded in green ray.

In contrast, STS entities don't expose themselves like that. Sure, they can communicate well, but what are they communicating about? You won't find STS entities openly talking about their own weaknesses or fears. You won't see them allowing themselves to become vulnerable. That only happens in STO entities who have open blue rays grounded in green.

STS entities can indeed open their blue rays, and the higher chakras as well. But they won't be totally open. They'll still have blockages because their communication will be largely limited to lies and manipulation. They won't have the full expression of open, honest communication with other entities that is based on the foundation of an activated green ray.

This is one of the reasons why the STS path can only go so far.

...

(10-06-2015, 09:43 AM)Shemaya Wrote: [ -> ]This was a hard one for me to get.

My teacher taught that the dark ones are the most loving souls because they are willing to sacrifice their loving connection to All while incarnated. It's a big sacrifice of their true essence and being as souls.

Ultimately, as Ra says, the path of radiant being is the true path of our true nature.  So even though Ra gives credence to the STS path, it's a big lie and deception.

I came to that same realization. What you just said there is quite profound!

...

(10-05-2015, 01:24 PM)The_Tired_Philosopher Wrote: [ -> ]The only problem is Hitler wasn't properly STS (he might still be in healing too).

I don't think that's the reason. Ra did acknowledge that he was STS, but his confusion and deluded good intentions kept him from graduation. So just how STS was he? 75%? 85%? Who knows? But that's still quite STS! Enough so that his behavior was still a good example of the STS entity.

(10-05-2015, 01:24 PM)The_Tired_Philosopher Wrote: [ -> ]I think the blue ray can very much be active in a negative way, where honesty isn't the game but concealment is.  If that makes sense?  Being the Cocreator chakra the deliberate Intentional use of 'honest lies' to mask your 'truth' is how that chakra would be used I think.

Exactly! (along with the other distinctions I just made a couple of posts back.)

...

OK, I got curious and looked up the Hitler thing. And wow. I may actually feel a little sorry for Hitler.

Quote:35.4 Ra: I am Ra. In speaking of the one you call Adolf we have some difficulty due to the intense amount of confusion present in this entity’s life patterns as well as the great confusion which greets any discussion of this entity.

Here we see an example of one who, in attempting activation of the highest rays of energy while lacking the green-ray key, canceled itself out as far as polarization either towards positive or negative. This entity was basically negative. However, its confusion was such that the personality disintegrated, thus leaving the mind/body/spirit complex unharvestable and much in need of healing.

This entity followed the pattern of negative polarization which suggests the elite and the enslaved, this being seen by the entity to be of an helpful nature for the societal structure. However, in drifting from the conscious polarization into what you may call a twilight world where dream took the place of events in your space/time continuum, this entity failed in its attempt to serve the Creator in an harvestable degree along the path of service to self. Thus we see the so-called insanity which may often arise when an entity attempts to polarize more quickly than experience may be integrated.

We have advised and suggested caution and patience in previous communications and do so again, using this entity as an example of the over-hasty opening of polarization without due attention to the synthesized and integrated mind/body/spirit complex. To know your self is to have the foundation upon firm ground.

That quote makes me fearful for what Ra exactly specifically means by, "personality disintegrated" due to confusion.

Is Ra speaking of the soul personality too??  It can't just be the human ego in a sense of 'shedding away disintegrated' otherwise how would the entire complex become unharvestable?

If becoming informed causes the things of personality in terms of ego to shed away, does confusion cause the ego to disintegrate rather than fall down like a petal (that can close back up) revealing the inner truth?

I should reread the Ra Material, it seems I'm noticing new ways of reading it now.