I can't really think of a better subject line but it's not necessarily purposefully selective but at times, I find it difficult to empathize with an other self when my own ways of thinking differ on a particular situation.
For instance, my mother is having surgery Thursday and she would like all of us to be there because she's scared. Regardless of my spiritual beliefs, I've never been one to ask for a shoulder to lean on or emotional support. Not sure why exactly, I just figured it's my issue so why involve others.
Now I understand the need to be there for her because she is scared but not the reason as to why she needs others there for support. I'm ok with being there for her but it's more forced acceptance because, well, she's done so much for me, its the least that I can do. But the reasoning for it is where I'm having an issue finding empathy for it.
To me, I'm good with myself. I'm good with dying. The worst part of dying would be the impact to others whom don't share our incredible realization of what awaits us. Their attachment to this illusion is understandable given their forgetting.
But to put myself in her shoes or anyone's shoes who needs a pep talk, a pat on the back, or just some type of emotional reinforcment of a situation boggles me.
So I'm just gonna think out loud after having this conversation with my girlfriend.
I guess such reasoning is beyond logical faculties which is ultimately where my issue resides. Though I'm quite contradictory considering, hell most people would think I'm crazy for what I believe in spiritually and if they asked why, I'd just say because that's what I believe to be true or that's how I feel.
To go into faith is to bypass or accept that logical faculties are of no use. So such emotional needs are again beyond logical reasoning thus what ones believes is their own. But the reasoning behind this specific situation is where my confusion lies. Why need others for something that ultimately is out of our control and the soothing words of "you'll be ok, or everything will be fine" are truly empty words considering no one truly know what will happen.
So ultimately, what does hearing words of encouragement such as those achieve a calmness to an other self? How does words which are soothing yet ultimately could be wrong do any good and how would this make anyone feel better about it? I guess in thus situation, it just does is the only reason though it may fly in the face of logic
I undertsand. I am exactly like you. I don't feel like I need emotional support and it wouldn't really help me and find it hard to understand that others might need that. But I guess it can be as simple as that even though words of confort have no impact on you they do have an impact on those who seek love and happiness outside of themselves. They need to know that they are loved I guess. To me it feels weird that my own mom wouldnt know that I love her yet but some people just need to be reminded that they are loved over and over gain because maybe they don't love themselves enough. I guess everybody can understand that in some way.
Quote:So ultimately, what does hearing words of encouragement such as those achieve a calmness to an other self? How does words which are soothing yet ultimately could be wrong do any good and how would this make anyone feel better about it? I guess in thus situation, it just does is the only reason though it may fly in the face of logic
Here is the fact: We are in 3D moving to 4D. Some of us come from 5D, or 6D, but the energies that are in play right now are shifting to 4th density. It is never the wrong response to deal with a 3rd density situation with 4D+ energies (love with the absence of wisdom). Offering emotional support to those close to you, just out of pure love and recognizing their intangible but satiable needs, is a very high STO vibration. There is wisdom because you likely know what better to say to your mother that is true instead of just placating her fears, and you also aren't just offering free love to all strangers (also not a bad thing). I guess my point is that, if you have to choose between what is staunchly the wise choice without being loving or the loving choice without being wise, it is always better to err on the side of love. Perfecting the balance is of course key, but in the heat of the moment, love always wins.
There are those of us who are relatively emotionally stable, and then those who we surround ourselves with who are less than that. As loving STO beings, it's our job to extend ourselves to them in whatever ways are asked for - in fact, your mom has specifically asked you for this service. This is gold! You can fulfill that role. Wisdom may tell you her fear of death is silly, but love is the energy she needs right now. If you feel comfortable balancing a bit of wisdom with your love (don't ever forget the love - wisdom without love is the other energy), then offer her wise comfort. But, I think we're all capable of offering comfort. Think of the words "All will be well" as not empty words of encouragement, but as a prayer of your intentions.
In Humanity what isn't selective?
I think we don't need to feel such powerful empathy all the time. We'd burn out. Shine along man, guilt is also an attachment to this illusion. Do what you want, don't fret too much because you seem like a great person and I Imagine you doing what you want would be helping more than hurting
People worry here almost dogmatically about being STS. Got bad news yall, ye be service to thee self as you
Are all things. Monster, and Lover is how I view the two paths, we're all monsters and lovers. We can be.
That's why we're here in 3D Earth. To figure how and why and what, how does a choice become formulated for each? You're free to ponder, but honestly this sounds like a Love/Wisdom balancing catalyst. How best to love where you feel more than love (as you've expressed) and how to approach this with what you have already experienced (I won't say 'know' as what do we know? Lol)
In some ways "emotional stability" is our way that we cut ourselves off from emotion, our choice of whether to feel or not. Because the nature of emotion is something that comes at us without any rhyme or reason, we are utterly subject to it. Many times I choose not to empathize it has nothing to do with the other's feelings but with my own and my own structure of resistance to emotion that allows me to maintain coherence. To see somebody swept away with emotion and not reinforce that coherence is to confront my own powerlessness, even to resent their reminder that I have the same cauldron of emotion not fully realized within just as capable of sending me for a loop.
To offer empathy and aid to one, as Jade says, is a gift to yourself in that it is a chance to balance within by working without. It does not operate on the rationality that built the structure of resistance to raw emotion. What you offer in being there is the experience of not encountering this abyss alone. What comfort arises from that taps into something that neither you nor the other have control over.
Yea like I said, this is something that's basically something I'll never understand because I don't see reason. I guess understanding is of no importance in this case. Only sympathy and the comfort they get from simply being there.
It doesn't answer my original question but I'll just have to accept that lol
89.
30 Ra: . . . It is our feeling that to
be each entity which one attempts to serve is to simplify the grasp of what service is necessary or possible.
(01-05-2016, 12:48 PM)Bring4th_GLB Wrote: [ -> ]89.30 Ra: . . . It is our feeling that to be each entity which one attempts to serve is to simplify the grasp of what service is necessary or possible.
Hence the reason why I'm here. To understand that understanding isn't necessary
I just try to view everything through the lens of "practicing love", which gives it meaning, to me.
(01-05-2016, 01:42 PM)Bring4th_Jade Wrote: [ -> ]I just try to view everything through the lens of "practicing love", which gives it meaning, to me.
Practicing love without practicing wisdom is something which has escaped me. In this case how does one practice love by being comforting yet not being honest? Coming from my healthcare point of view, I know all that could go wrong. So I can't in good conscious say that everything is going be ok in her terms of what she deems as ok. Sure I can say that all will be well from our point of view because we aren't as attached to the illusion. But to someone who's truly afraid of dying, all will be well doesn't necessarily cut it ya know lol.
Sooooo, I know I can say stuff like "we are here for you" but outside of that, am I supposed to lie simply to bring her comfort?
I've always been about the why's, the logic, the practicality, the reason. Yet there are certain situations where this is easier for me. Take the whole vegan meat eater debacle. I'm perfectly ok accepting the realization that I won't ever understand the point of view of a vegan and that's OK to me. I guess in this instance, it doesn't directly involve me so I can simply let it go
When confronted with something such as emotional issues where most, from my point of view, are counterproductive, they captivate me as to the reasoning behind them. I wish I could understand the need for these emotions but my logical mind takes over. Maybe it's simply because I'm not phased by many issues where emotions would normally override ones balanced point of view anymore. I'm just able to simply see the situation and go with the flow.
(01-04-2016, 06:41 PM)Jeremy Wrote: [ -> ]Why need others for something that ultimately is out of our control and the soothing words of "you'll be ok, or everything will be fine" are truly empty words considering no one truly know what will happen.
Figure of speech.
I think the boggling is a good thing.
Now that you see this self perceived issue, could you tell yourself why this issue arises at all enough so to bring it here for input? Is there a root to these feelings? How and what did it feel like when you realized you didn't really want to be there because its not something you'd want? You call it Forced Acceptance so I hope my last sentence doesn't sound presumptuous.
In...100% honesty, if you want to understand why she is asking such and is as she is.
You should ask her
Oh and 110% honesty, I'd be scared to go into a room, lay down, be put unconscious, sliced open, by strangers, fiddled with, bits of me removed or new stuff added, sewn shut, then wake up all alone sore and pained with nurses who (least the hospitals I've been to) can barely share a shred of a real eye wrinkling smile.
...Naw, I'd be horrified... How would you not be?? Its absolutely logical. Emotions aren't illogical, they incite illogical thinking, they're very, very logical, I'd argue Superational Logical.
Are you sure yer not just a bamf who doesn't afraid o' anything??
(01-05-2016, 02:13 PM)The_Tired_Philosopher Wrote: [ -> ]Its absolutely logical. Emotions aren't illogical, they incite illogical thinking, they're very, very logical, I'd argue Superational Logical.
I've been making the case here and there that at our roots, emotion is primary and informs all thought and action. I recently came across a
book by a popular neurologist that says what you're saying..that emotion and reasoning go hand in hand.
(01-05-2016, 02:13 PM)The_Tired_Philosopher Wrote: [ -> ]I think the boggling is a good thing.
Now that you see this self perceived issue, could you tell yourself why this issue arises at all enough so to bring it here for input? Is there a root to these feelings? How and what did it feel like when you realized you didn't really want to be there because its not something you'd want? You call it Forced Acceptance so I hope my last sentence doesn't sound presumptuous.
In...100% honesty, if you want to understand why she is asking such and is as she is.
You should ask her
Oh and 110% honesty, I'd be scared to go into a room, lay down, be put unconscious, sliced open, by strangers, fiddled with, bits of me removed or new stuff added, sewn shut, then wake up all alone sore and pained with nurses who (least the hospitals I've been to) can barely share a shred of a real eye wrinkling smile.
...Naw, I'd be horrified... How would you not be?? Its absolutely logical. Emotions aren't illogical, they incite illogical thinking, they're very, very logical, I'd argue Superational Logical.
Are you sure yer not just a bamf who doesn't afraid o' anything??
I look at life in terms of productivity. I'm here to teach and learn. So asking here is to possibly learn the spiritual implications or reasons for what I consider counterproductive thinking
I'd agree that emotions themselves aren't illogical and the reaction to those emotions are the more illogical part of it so maybe I worded it incorrectly.
If you're horrified, you're still holding on to this illusion a little to much. Like I said earlier in the thread, the thought of dying matters not to me. Only that those here that hold an emotional attachment to their perceived loss of me would be the only unfortunate aspect of death.
Otherwise, it's not that big of a deal.
Emotion can be primary if one is balanced enough to consciously process it and allow love to come through.
Other than love coming through, being able to have that ah ha moment where one can sense the truth and the lesson involved in a particular interaction or situation, one can then learn from it. In this instance, love may not be warranted as ones lesson wouldn't have been presented had some emotion not been illicited. So yes, emotionally speaking, it's not all useless as I wasnt trying to imply that all emotions are counterproductive. That would just make someone callous and indifferent to the world which I am definitely not.
I'm also on my 9th day in a row of work so I could be just babbling nonsense at this point lol
Jeremy the Snow Miser..cold as ice! I hear everything you're saying and empathize with your situation. Sometimes the path of least resistance is just giving what another is asking of you.
Lol
I don't see it as cold though. I've actually contemplated that for a while before. I was scared that I had become emotionally indifferent for some reason. I was scared that what had happened during my constant analysis of myself was that I simply closed all emotion.
But as I kept thinking and thinking, I couldn't find a reason as to why I would have done this. I'm not emotionally scarred from anything. I had what many would consider a good childhood. Was a bit lonely but eventually realized it was because I had my own path. Sure I had a tough 4 or 5 years where my ex put me through hell but it never deterred me from finding another mate. Actually came to the realization that everything happened exactly like it was supposed to else I wouldn't have found this material. So I came to thank the hell I had been through.
So I was left trying to find a reason why emotions like anger, fear of death, sadness, loss, anguish, etc rarely make an appearance. Trust me I'm not claiming to be some Buddha. I still have plenty of work to do regarding balanced responses to emotionally charged situations. I have just come to a point where certain situations don't incite what would be considered the "normal" emotional response. I just see the situation for what it is and allow it to pass
I salute thee, intrepid wayfarer. I don't know your answer and I hope you find something of value on your path of confusion!
Yea it was so awesome living by myself for a couple years. I could not have come to where I am without it. No one to talk to forced such introspection, I truly am thankful for such seclusion.
The little delay of time between you creating the post and the day of the surgery is a nice opportunity to process your thoughts and emotion so you can come to terms with the part of you that makes you feel like you are lying. I don't think lying would be of any use. But how can you manage to be there for her and stay true to yourself? I see a learning oppportunity. Like it has been said it seems like a love/wisdom balancing catalyst. Why not make both grow? Love is truely powerful because sometimes the simplest forms of love can overthrow the biggest amount of wisdom. But only you can find your way to stay true to yourself during this experience. You've got an opportunity to learn something about yourself through wisdom and something about others through love.
Yea I definitely agree. It is the reason why I am so intrigued by it. There is clearly a lesson of attempting to find love in the moment. But how to not make it disingenuous is my sticking point. I will be there because it's what she would like. Me being there isn't going to affect the outcome. All it'll do is require me to wake up at 2:30am and drive almost 2.5 hours for it but as my sister said, it's for mom and that's exactly how I feel about it.
I'm thinking the difference is the reason I'm going.
It would be better in most people's minds that I would WANT to be there for her since she's scared rather than simply being there because SHE wants me there
Maybe you can find a reason to want to be there
I like where you're going. Thank ya!
Would your emotional response be different if it was your daughter who would go through a surgery and before doing that, would ask you to be there with her? Would you still not understand why she would want you to be there with her?
A child is a bit different because they haven't had time to process or develop their own sense of mortality. They aren't afraid of dying per se, only of being in a place that they truly don't understand. They simply lack the awareness of their own existence and experience of life itself.
One could then liken an adult who is unaware of the greater picture as a child I guess. Lacking the wherewithal to realize that all will be well regardless of the outcome. I guess part of the issues is my lack of connection with my mother.
When my daughter had to have 9 of her teeth extracted in the operating room of a hospital, I don't remember being very nervous or afraid. This was prior to awakening though. I just kinda knew she would be ok.
Going back to my mother, maybe it's because the reason for her surgery is self inflicted due to smoking, verry poor diet, and inactivity. Part of it is the lack of connection. Sometimes it makes me feel ungrateful because I know all she's done has been out of love though what I would consider misguided. I've always realized she's tried her best and always loved me the most out of my siblings and she's told me that. Yet I never could reciprocate. I often wondered why as a child and adult yet never found a reason. I just didn't love my mother like she did me.
Which has always lead me to wonder if I ever truly knew what love is. But then I look back at how I loved my ex and how I love my girlfriend and my daughter. It's just always been a constant love and connection that I have never felt for my mom. My grandparents and I had that connection. My psychologist always felt that since they kinda raised me while my mom worked after leaving my biological father, I could have potentially formed the maternal and paternal bond with them instead.
That doesn't necessarily make me feel better given the amount of love my mother has shown me but it explains it quite well.
So going back to my daughter, I can see the reason to be there mainly because if something happened to her, it would be something that was out of her control. Something that which was created for some sort of lesson to her and or I. Something that which would be frightening to her only because it wasn't her fault. I would be there for her because I wouldn't want her to be alone given her immature mind, body, and soul. I am there to be the one to comfort her because she doesn't know any better. By contrast, an adult should have learned that there are consequences to ones actions. To continue to act irresponsibly, invites consequences. Thus to find empathy for ones implicit irresponsibility is difficult to me
You are a set of distortions and others are their own.
Applying the Law of One, why do you not empathize with your own self about these things?
Because I wouldn't expect empathy in such a case if I were in the same situation. I don't need anyone to be there for me. Even when my girlfriend asked if I would want her there, I told her that she didn't need to be and I wouldn't expect her to be. It's my issue so why bother others with it
You seemed to say that it would be fine in the event that one did not create their own circumstances (which I believe to be impossible).
Have you contemplated the idea that you chose your mother and not the other way around when incarnating?
You could then ask yourself, why did you seek to have this mirror unto yourself? A mirror you are not able to empathize with?