Bring4th

Full Version: What density the Archangels are from?
You're currently viewing a stripped down version of our content. View the full version with proper formatting.
Pages: 1 2
I have this doubt. Anyone have any idea? Thanks.

Peace, love and light.
I think they're our Guardian pals from the next Octave. Funny how the word Archangel is not found within the Ra material.

*waves awkwardly at the Archangels* Hello BigSmile
Late 4th and 5th density entities, probably.
There are some angels at the level of Creator.
The best density. Probably feels great all the time forever, just radiating nonstop love to whatever they want to, what a life
Well, second some sources Lucifer is a Sixth-Density entity. Anyone agree with this?

Peace, love and light.
(04-10-2017, 05:32 PM)Infinite Wrote: [ -> ]I have this doubt. Anyone have any idea? Thanks.

Peace, love and light.

I'd venture to say inner-planes 3d.

The fact that they can be 'invoked' in fairly straightforward rituals, suggests an accessibility (and availability) that is quite intimate, and close.
(04-11-2017, 10:45 AM)Infinite Wrote: [ -> ]Well, second some sources Lucifer is a Sixth-Density entity. Anyone agree with this?

I'd say a group composed of a 4th, 5th and 6th density hierarchy.

The 6D entities are much like overseers of Free Will in their own way.
(04-11-2017, 11:09 AM)Minyatur Wrote: [ -> ]I'd say a group composed of a 4th, 5th and 6th density hierarchy.

Please, you have any source about this?

(04-11-2017, 11:09 AM)Minyatur Wrote: [ -> ]The 6D entities are much like overseers of Free Will in their own way.

I believe that Lucifer is from the Light of the 6D.

Second Ra, Lucifer is a Logos. Is possible an archangel be a Logos or a Logos be an archangel?

Peace, love and light.
I don't have a source other than my own intuition but archangels are sixth density light forms/aspects of the infinite creator. They are portions commonly invoked during magickal rituals (i.e. Auriel/Rapheal/Michael etc).
I don't know if angels have gone through 3rd density because I've read in several places that angels were never humans or incarnated.
(04-11-2017, 12:01 PM)IndigoGeminiWolf Wrote: [ -> ]I don't know if angels have gone through 3rd density because I've read in several places that angels were never humans or incarnated.

I think that's merely symbolic of the veil and not 3rd density itself.
(04-11-2017, 11:16 AM)Infinite Wrote: [ -> ]
(04-11-2017, 11:09 AM)Minyatur Wrote: [ -> ]I'd say a group composed of a 4th, 5th and 6th density hierarchy.

Please, you have any source about this?

I tend to go intuition-based rather than source-based.

I thought this was how the Orion group is presented also in the Ra material, yet I just felt like verifying and now I see there's no sixth density members mentioned and instead only fourth and fifth.
My intuition still tell me there are sixth density members in Lucifer group or perhaps the name in itself refer to a strict sixth density group which then works with other groups like Orion by overseeing them using negative polarity, so I would just lump those two together anyway as one hierarchy across the densities. I think STS groups have quite the volatile members, whereas STO groups are like super-BFFs.

(04-11-2017, 11:16 AM)Infinite Wrote: [ -> ]
(04-11-2017, 11:09 AM)Minyatur Wrote: [ -> ]The 6D entities are much like overseers of Free Will in their own way.

I believe that Lucifer is from the Light of the 6D.

Second Ra, Lucifer is a Logos. Is possible an archangel be a Logos or a Logos be an archangel?

I think the portion of the Ra material that used Lucifer alongside Logos did not mean that Lucifer is a Logos but instead that within a Logos was first used the symbolic archetype of Lucifer, that is to grant knowledge of both good and evil to the self through the use of the veil, to extend free will. Prior to this experiment, the negative path was not known and as such Lucifer has a slight different meaning to us now as we tend to use it to refer to the dwellers of the negative path. Still, I think any portion of consciousness is a Logos (sub-Logoi) of itself, but that the Ra material usually use these term to refer to 7D beingness that internalizes a plenum of space and time so that sub-portions of the Creator may experience themselves and grow from within the colors of their beingness.

I guess you could call the first Logos to implement a veil upon its 3D creation the first Lucifer, but that might be misguiding as the intent was truly to offer the Creator experiences of a more satisfying quality and Lucifer usually holds a dark connotation.
Thanks a lot.

(04-11-2017, 01:50 PM)Minyatur Wrote: [ -> ]I think the portion of the Ra material that used Lucifer alongside Logos did not mean that Lucifer is a Logos but instead that within a Logos was first used the symbolic archetype of Lucifer, that is to grant knowledge of both good and evil to the self through the use of the veil, to extend free will.

I understand. The passage is:

Quote:77.17 Questioner: Now, would it be possible for this work of our density to be performed if all of the sub-Logoi chose the same polarity in any particular expression or evolution of a Logos? Let us make the assumption that our sun created nothing but, through the first distortion, there was no product except positive polarity. Would work then be done in fourth density and higher as a function only of this positive polarization evolving from our original creation of sub-Logos?

Ra: I am Ra. Elements of this query illustrate the reason I was unable to answer your previous question without knowledge of the Logos involved. To turn to your question, there were Logoi which chose to set the plan for the activation of mind/body/spirit complexes through each true-color body without recourse to the prior application of free will. It is, to our knowledge, only in an absence of free will that the conditions of which you speak obtain. In such a procession of densities you find an extraordinarily long, as you measure time, third density; likewise, fourth density. Then, as the entities begin to see the Creator, there is a very rapid, as you measure time, procession towards the eighth density. This is due to the fact that one who knows not, cares not.

Let us illustrate by observing the relative harmony and unchanging quality of existence in one of your, as you call it, primitive tribes. The entities have the concepts of lawful and taboo, but the law is inexorable and all events occur as predestined. There is no concept of right and wrong, good or bad. It is a culture in monochrome. In this context you may see the one you call Lucifer as the true light-bringer in that the knowledge of good and evil both precipitated the mind/body/spirits of this Logos from the Edenic conditions of constant contentment but also provided the impetus to move, to work and to learn.

Those Logoi whose creations have been set up without free will have not, in the feeling of those Logoi, given the Creator the quality and variety of experience of Itself as have those Logoi which have incorporated free will as paramount. Thusly you find those Logoi moving through the timeless states at what you would see as a later space/time to choose the free will character when elucidating the foundations of each Logos.

Do you believe that Ra was not talking about Lucifer as a Logos?

(04-11-2017, 01:50 PM)Minyatur Wrote: [ -> ]Prior to this experiment, the negative path was not known and as such Lucifer has a slight different meaning to us now as we tend to use it to refer to the dwellers of the negative path.

I particularly don't think like that. The negative path is just a choice that became possible with the Luciferian Matrix.

(04-11-2017, 01:50 PM)Minyatur Wrote: [ -> ]I guess you could call the first Logos to implement a veil upon its 3D creation the first Lucifer, but that might be misguiding as the intent was truly to offer the Creator experiences of a more satisfying quality and Lucifer usually holds a dark connotation.

I agree. This dark connotation have bases in religious mistakes that consider Lucifer and Satan as the same entity/concept.

Peace, love and light.
Q'uo directly said that Archangel Gabriel is Sixth Density, or at least was at the point Mohammed incarnated to make his attempt at providing a message. (And, let's face it, past and present are pretty wonky when talking about 6Ds anyway.) But from that I'd tend to think that the other Archangels were/are also sixth. However, doing some Googling around the Q'uo transcripts, I can't find any other examples where someone directly asked about the density of the others, so that's conjecture.
(04-11-2017, 01:52 PM)Infinite Wrote: [ -> ]
Quote:77.17 Questioner: Now, would it be possible for this work of our density to be performed if all of the sub-Logoi chose the same polarity in any particular expression or evolution of a Logos? Let us make the assumption that our sun created nothing but, through the first distortion, there was no product except positive polarity. Would work then be done in fourth density and higher as a function only of this positive polarization evolving from our original creation of sub-Logos?

Ra: I am Ra. Elements of this query illustrate the reason I was unable to answer your previous question without knowledge of the Logos involved. To turn to your question, there were Logoi which chose to set the plan for the activation of mind/body/spirit complexes through each true-color body without recourse to the prior application of free will. It is, to our knowledge, only in an absence of free will that the conditions of which you speak obtain. In such a procession of densities you find an extraordinarily long, as you measure time, third density; likewise, fourth density. Then, as the entities begin to see the Creator, there is a very rapid, as you measure time, procession towards the eighth density. This is due to the fact that one who knows not, cares not.

Let us illustrate by observing the relative harmony and unchanging quality of existence in one of your, as you call it, primitive tribes. The entities have the concepts of lawful and taboo, but the law is inexorable and all events occur as predestined. There is no concept of right and wrong, good or bad. It is a culture in monochrome. In this context you may see the one you call Lucifer as the true light-bringer in that the knowledge of good and evil both precipitated the mind/body/spirits of this Logos from the Edenic conditions of constant contentment but also provided the impetus to move, to work and to learn.

Those Logoi whose creations have been set up without free will have not, in the feeling of those Logoi, given the Creator the quality and variety of experience of Itself as have those Logoi which have incorporated free will as paramount. Thusly you find those Logoi moving through the timeless states at what you would see as a later space/time to choose the free will character when elucidating the foundations of each Logos.

Do you believe that Ra was not talking about Lucifer as a Logos?

Re-reading more slowly, ya it does seem you're right they explicitedly referred to the Logos as Lucifer.

I tend to see names as archetypes though and I wouldn't think this Logos interacts directly with the Earth and more that the Earth follows its legacy in some way. If we define the identity of Lucifer this way, then in our experience what mimicks Lucifer here would either be the Earth or our Sun rather than beings of the negative path. About the "morning star", it does make sense to see it as referring to the Logos which first allowed the Creator to know Itself in a more vivid experience and of which the cause and effect stretches across time and space. I personally would tend to see the name Lucifer as reffering to its legacy more often than not though, or the legacy of this thought as an archetype and as such the beings who promote this archetype (back to the 6D beings of the negative path overseeing Free Will).
So is Lucifer a dark entity, or are they positive?
(04-11-2017, 05:25 PM)IndigoGeminiWolf Wrote: [ -> ]So is Lucifer a dark entity, or are they positive?

I can't say. Apparently Lucifer caused a cosmic rebellion and create the separation of the Unity through an experiment. But, if Lucifer helps us to evolve more fast (cause the free will is a catalyser) how it can be negative?

Peace, love and light.
Is there any human culture that gave names to our Guardian friends?

They'd need a ranking above these Archangels but I am not aware if there's any such thing.
(04-12-2017, 08:23 AM)Minyatur Wrote: [ -> ]Is there any human culture that gave names to our Guardian friends?

They'd need a ranking above these Archangels but I am not aware if there's any such thing.

Seraphim?

Peace, love and light.
(04-12-2017, 08:41 AM)Infinite Wrote: [ -> ]
(04-12-2017, 08:23 AM)Minyatur Wrote: [ -> ]Is there any human culture that gave names to our Guardian friends?

They'd need a ranking above these Archangels but I am not aware if there's any such thing.

Seraphim?

Peace, love and light.

Seems like that could be the case. Reading about them I see the heavenly hierarchy is described as more complex than I knew.

Archangels are pretty lower beings I guess, I thought they were described as the most badass of Heavens and they're not even at the top of the third order of the Christian angelology.



There seems to be a distinction between archangels and Archangels where Archangels might refer to Seraphim (Guardians?).

Also apparently there's only Micheal who is referred to as an Archangel within the Bible and the word is only used in singular form. For example, it says that while Gabriel is considered one in most Christian traditions, there's no text that supports this.

Guess I'll just call everything the Creator, seems easier.
(04-11-2017, 05:25 PM)IndigoGeminiWolf Wrote: [ -> ]So is Lucifer a dark entity, or are they positive?

They are a comglomeration of negative souls. They are that ancient snake, the highest power of evil in our area of the Creation. If you are greeted by them, it feels like a vise-grip on your heart and you are staring into a black mirror which reflects and amplifies anything and everything evil and dark within you. When they appeared to me, (this was during an awfully misguided attempt to channel, along with two others) it was appearing in my mind's eye like a black dragon. It was momentarily awestruck by my energy, and then it instantly shut me out from its mind once it realized I was aware of it on that level. Another time when I interacted with them in a dream (with bone-chilling horror, raging anger, swiftness, and justice as I was forced to by an emergency situation involving a soul I love), they appeared like a gigantic black snake. 40-50 ft long and as wide around as a man is tall. A cold and calculating predator, thinking like a computer. They have a venom which affects the very soul of a man. Their temptation is horrific.

They are in the process of releasing polarity on their way through mid 6th density, I believe. They have at least two forms. They have this form of black intelligence which is in time/space, and apparently which has a physical counterpart driving negative polarization on Gaia. They also can incarnate as a human being and be subject to having their heart torn open. Be subject to FEELING and be subject to the karma of their sin. I have met one who has incarnated outside of the bloodline families for whatever reason. I believe he still has not penetrated his identity. I don't necessarily want to cause more pain and suffering to anyone by helping that process along prematurely. But I did ask him, completely out of the blue, what he thinks about the Illuminati currently attempting to enslave humanity. He got a surprised look on his face, then smirked. His response was along the lines of "How can you be sure it's an organized evil force and not just the spontaneous evil of man?" Of course they don't want to take responsibility for the negativity which they have seeded. Reminds me of the quote from the Hidden_Hand exchange: "Yahweh was, in effect, running a benign dictatorship." They sure do believe what they're bringing to the table is justified. It is a delicate matter to be of service, if it is at all possible.

I'm so confused and in awe at the Creation.
So, Lucifer is a negative Sixth Density entity? Curious that a friend recommended to me today a brazilian book about reptilians and the author talk that Lucifer is the master of they. Synchronicity?

*********************
Aaron, do you believe that Lucifer created the "experiential system" dualidade and free will?

Peace, love and light.
(04-11-2017, 03:56 PM)APeacefulWarrior Wrote: [ -> ]Q'uo directly said that Archangel Gabriel is Sixth Density, or at least was at the point Mohammed incarnated to make his attempt at providing a message. (And, let's face it, past and present are pretty wonky when talking about 6Ds anyway.) But from that I'd tend to think that the other Archangels were/are also sixth. However, doing some Googling around the Q'uo transcripts, I can't find any other examples where someone directly asked about the density of the others, so that's conjecture.

I think you're right. I got this from Scott Mandelker; he says that there are two lines of evolution. Free will based mind body spirit complexes and then the devas, the angels who are never disconnected from the Creator. They don't have free will but they carry out the Creator's will. For example, the elemental angels, angels for the second density, third density helpers, 6D archangels. The hierarchy of angels could be divided into densities. The angels are created specifically to help the Logos. They're in the Light at all times, never having left the embrace of the One Infinite.

I think there is some truth to this. It makes sense to me.
(04-25-2017, 02:57 AM)Aaron Wrote: [ -> ]If you are greeted by them, it feels like a vise-grip on your heart and you are staring into a black mirror which reflects and amplifies anything and everything evil and dark within you.

In my own experience, if you get past that then they can't hide behind your own undistilled darkness anymore and they'll leave so you don't go about healing them by perceiving them now more clearly.

Little neggies, what can I do but see the Creator within you and guide thine restless souls to peace?
And the Ascended Masters? Fourth Density maybe?

Peace, love and light.
Well, the possible answer to my question of this thread is in book "Prism of Lyra" (that I know a lot of time ago):

Quote:Angels/Angelic Kingdom: Existing within the realms of fifth and sixth density, the angelic kingdom has interacted with
Earth through various means. These include spirit-guide manifestation, visions, inspiration, channeling, and telepathic
communication. Energies appearing as angels are frequently from the Arcturus realm.

Peace, love and light.  
(04-11-2017, 10:55 AM)Bring4th_Plenum Wrote: [ -> ]
(04-10-2017, 05:32 PM)Infinite Wrote: [ -> ]I have this doubt. Anyone have any idea? Thanks.

Peace, love and light.

I'd venture to say inner-planes 3d.

The fact that they can be 'invoked' in fairly straightforward rituals, suggests an accessibility (and availability) that is quite intimate, and close.

I second that. Inner 3d is my understanding as well.
I believe that what is invoked is a portion of your consciousness (thought-form). The Archangels manager a big sector which is beyond the Earth. They must be omniscient.

Peace, love and light.
Quote:Carla: Then you and angels are both inner plane beings or entities, right?

I am Latwii, and am aware of your query, my sister. For your purposes and according to your perceptions, this is so, yet this is so in a relative manner, for in our own illusion we inhabit a portion of what you may call a higher density, which also has its own so-called outer plane or space/time portion of experience. In your way of perceiving this experience, it would appear that we would be the same as an entity inhabiting the inner planes of your own planetary influence, for both experiences are much more filled with light than is your own, and are much less filled with the manifestation of illusion than is your own.


Carla: Yeah. Angels, then, are third density, able to graduate to fourth density, therefore virtually fourth density. Is there any possibility that angels or angelic presences—I suspect that you must want to say something different because you keep saying “socalled”—can go further than the beginning of fourth density? Is there further learning possible without leaving the inner planes and reincarnating?

I am Latwii, and am aware of your query, my sister. We have prefaced the term, angel and angelic presence, with “so-called” as a modifier for it is quite a large universe that we inhabit and which your  planet finds itself in as well. There are many learning opportunities available to those so-called angelic presences within your planetary influence, and there are many types of angelic presences as well. We have spoken to the majority, and have not spoken of the greater variety of entities which may be perceived as angelic presences. Some are of what you would call a higher density, shall we say, having come to this planetary influence in response to a specific call. Some are of your own planetary influence and remain in the, shall we say, role of angelic presence for the greater portion of their beingness. Some chose to reincarnate and apply their beingness to a physical incarnation in order to be of more service in that manner. There are, as you see, more types of angelic presence than can be adequately described by your language system and your sense of comprehension and our ability to so describe.
Pages: 1 2