Bring4th

I don't know if I should waste my time wondering about this ... but I am.

So yesterday I met up with someone who has been avoiding me and several other of his friends for a few months. We were closest though, like family.
He still calls me, sometimes twice weekly but has avoided any in person interaction where previously I would see him once every 2 weeks for what ever reason.

Hes gone through some drama at home(marriage/kids) and made a drastic change that seemed nonnegotiable cutting lots of who he was, and who mattered to him out of his life. After trying to get some reasonable explanation and being unsuccessful I just accepted the change and went on with life as this being the new normal. We've been joking he moved to Africa to make it less confusing/shitty that he just suddenly wasn't "available" yet still obviously wanted to stay friends somewhat as he calls to talk to me around an hour a week on the phone. I hate the phone but make an exception.

Anyway for the last week or two hes been different, seeming a bit like the friend I used to know texting more, just a different vibe and then the universe offered him a way to meet up with me and it not be either of our idea so he went with it instead of saying no.

It was really nice to see him, but 2 things happened I didn't understand and I wasn't going to ask him and make our visit uncomfortable for him.
First
He kept trying to buy me stuff, (we met up at a store and he was already inside). Like 5 times tried to get me to choose something/anything we are talking $40-$60 range so he could buy it for me. I didn't want or need anything and really no one needs to buy me anything. I just found it confusing really. It was nice but I'd have liked to understand what he was trying to say with that gesture, more than being bought something.

My guess/feeling was that he was trying to show he cared about me still or was trying to make some sort of amends. Honestly it could be either or both or neither.
He loves money so trying to spend it on someone I think is a gesture  IDK I think that is safe to assume but then the contrast.
He decides we need tea/coffee so we go next door and get one but then right after we pay(yes I let him buy my beverage/ we used to always alternate)
he says oh I need to make a quick call can you wait? Sure I sit there as he talks.

10 minutes later of what was by no means an urgent matter hes done and we have a 15 minute convo ourself.

But what was that?! I almost left because its really rude but then I know he is super high stress and might have just been trying to still hanging out without having to talk the whole time. We ended up having a pretty deep good conversation after and it felt kinda like old times. I had forgotten his birthday card at home which isn't for a month but he implied I would see him before that. I really don't think the phone call was an attempt to be rude but had anyone else done that I would have politely excused myself and just assumed they weren't into my company. That WASN'T the vibe I was getting. It almost felt like a stall tactic in some way to extend the visit, or defuse something he found stressful.

Add to that we get back to our vehicles and he forced at least $80 worth of stuff I do not need into my vehicle. So more reason to assume the rude phone call wasn't intended to slight me

Just curious would that stuff make any of you curious about what just happened? Its not bothering me but I can read people so well generally, him I used to be able to read like a book but he is just a walking mask the last while and I am left feeling "what just happened?"

Any insight. Maybe I am to close to see the obvious.
Either way it was nice to see an old friend and I will just accept the new normal is always in transition.

My analysis is simply this: he obviously wants to get with you, but was nervous about how to go about it. Everything you described screams this conclusion.

I can't really say what his intentions were but the older I get the more I find that pretty much every interaction between 2 human beings is somewhat awkward, like it's a cosmic and cataclysmic event of some sort, two asteroids bumping into one another and so it's hard to pinpoint the details. But there is no other way than to just deal with the awkwardness head on. If you think it's awkward, face the awkward until it resolves. If you went a little while wihout seeing him there might have been some things weird that happened and changed him. The awkwardness will leave if you spend time with him and you will eventually understand why. But if you pass another while without seeing him it's gonna get awkward again probably. It's like you never really meet the same person twice in life, each time it's a totally new cosmic event.

(05-25-2017, 05:12 PM)anagogy Wrote: [ -> ]My analysis is simply this: he obviously wants to get with you, but was nervous about how to go about it. Everything you described screams this conclusion.

Well shhhhh... crumb that didn't really even occur to me as we are both married. He nearly lost his family hence cutting nonfamily out of his life for the most part.
He did mention some time ago he had issues being around me outside of work for that reason but I thought we were WELL past that.

Interesting Anagogy, thanks for the insight, I totally missed.

I guess that makes me a bit less insulted he avoids in person stuff now.
thanks

(05-25-2017, 05:34 PM)Night Owl Wrote: [ -> ]I can't really say what his intentions were but the older I get the more I find that pretty much every interaction between 2 human beings is somewhat awkward, like it's a cosmic and cataclysmic event of some sort, two asteroids bumping into one another and so it's hard to pinpoint the details. But there is no other way than to just deal with the awkwardness head on. If you think it's awkward, face the awkward until it resolves. If you went a little while wihout seeing him there might have been some things weird that happened and changed him. The awkwardness will leave if you spend time with him and you will eventually understand why. But if you pass another while without seeing him it's gonna get awkward again probably. It's like you never really meet the same person twice in life, each time it's a totally new cosmic event.

I hear you. I think I used to really let awkward moments bother me. I would find it unsettling and be off balance somehow trying to figure out how I could ease what ever the issue was but thankfully I'm finally at the point where I just give up and ride out the awkward as inevitable.

I was so close to leaving during the phone call though I guess that's why I was still wondering what the heck was going on since he was overly nice otherwise.

Did you have or came close to have a relationship in the past? Or been aware that he has been desiring that? I have this theory that when we love someone we never really stop. Sometimes people change a lot and we don't resonate as much with how others change but I believe we remain fundamentally attached to the version of them that we have been attracted. If you still have the characteristics he used to like in you, maybe he is not ''pass that''. I do not believe when there is love that it can just just stop, else it's not really love.

I don't know many guys who would enjoy having an hour conversation on the phone with a girl 'friend'. I don't know many guys who would have a one hour conversation on the phone at all. I don't know many guys who would have a one hour conversation at all in fact. There's probably lots of them that would, in certain circumstances, with old friends, family, at christmas dinner. But usually it takes some kind of common baggage, else it doesn't seem to be very common for the male archetype to be very conversative. I believe if he does, he really likes you a lot. Even considering that your friendship is somewhat long term and that you stayed friend while both being married seems to indicate towards that direction as well.

Some people have theories that males and females friendships does not exist at all and that some people just like to tell themselves that. I wouldn't venture as far, but I find that usually most friendships start with some aspects of loving or liking certain aspects of others, and so while it may not end up in relationships, chances are that most of the times, there has been a certain attraction to begin with. Whether it's possible to have a pure 100% friendship between male and female is still a mystery. But most likely in many cases people are just blind to the attraction that exist. It's probably more likely to have friendships with opposite sex over the internet or with people you just see once or twice in your life. It's actually hard not to end up liking someone if you talk to them on a daily basis.

There is/was a very strong soul connection.

Good point about the oddity of him phoning like that. That makes me feel a bit better. It was pretty traumatic to have him "move to Africa" I'll have to remember those phone calls show I wasn't just discarded or not worth seeing as it felt.

On a plus side for weeks I've felt an urging to vocalize something he is dealing with and its spiritual link for him(know thy self) but I don't like forcing that stuff on him. On the way to meet him I asked/prayed to be used for the highest good and if I was supposed to guide him on that matter asked to have it come up. Well he brought up the exact topic and showed an openness to insight about it even before I mentioned it.
It was awesome .


On the male|female friendships. I've always had a lot of guy friends and they really were platonic.
At the same time I'd never date anyone I hadn't been friends with a while so I understand that.

I think its worth rising above our biology, I mean cutting 50% of the population out as friends is pretty limiting.

Well the thing is attraction has nothing to do with how we label our relationships. And that's why it's so complicated.

Do you feel something for him?

Enough that I can respect that we are blessed to know each other and be able to be friends.
I think we are both doing that.

I'm going to ask this come down.
I'm still hoping this friend will awakening.
I think this would be awkward to find if he showed up here one day. Thanks for your help.

-removed-