Bring4th

Since many of the posters here seem to come from the US, I want to ask you something that has been puzzling me for a while.
Why is it that americans talk so loud?
Is it something they teach you at school?
where does that come from?
I use public transportation rather frequently and especially in the summer months often have american tourists travelling with me.
The other day there was this dude bragging on about his air condition and how he paid it and used some credit, blablabla.
I had to insert my emergency ear plugs and for the rest of the journey I still heard the words "air condition" "bank account" blablabla his voice was so piercing (that is the other thing, if at least their conversations were interesting ! then it would not be so annoying having to listen in. Haha.)
They seem absolutely oblivious that there are other people around them who maybe want to read or sleep on trains.
Over here there is some tacit consent which most people observe, that is when you are in a public place and have a conversation with someone you don't raise your voice as not to disturb others around you.
Americans don't seem to have that.
So I wonder why.

Lol! You may potentially be tap dancing on thin ice venturing into national stereotypes! Here's some funny ones!

JayCee Wrote:Why is it that americans talk so loud?
Is it something they teach you at school?
where does that come from?

I've lived in Germany for a while, so I know what you mean. In my personal opinion there's a few things going on.

1. Anytime somebody doesn't speak your language in a normal voice when you're not expecting it, it can sound loud. I definitely do not believe this accounts for your total experience, but I think it is worth mentioning. I think some of the anti-immigrant sentiment in America comes from, for example, hearing Spanish spoken in a way that is not necessarily loud so much as not self-conscious.
2. I do think Americans often have little experience engaging with other cultures, which leads them to be very excited. It's novel to them, and this raises their engagement and consequently their voice level. Since we also often travel in groups, this can be accentuated. I've seen plenty of foreigners in big groups be disruptive in any country; I think Americans tend to stand out sometimes because our media culture makes us so easily identifiable to the rest of the world.
3. There's a gregariousness that is seen as desirable in American culture, whereas in some other cultures this is perceived as cloying or overwhelming. Perhaps this has to do with how much space we have in our country and, therefore, how free we often feel to disregard matters of space. But even in urban areas you can see it. Which leads me to…
4. Individualism approaching solipsism. As a country whose natural tribal units were abandoned long ago by our immigrant forebears, we often don't have a highly developed sense of community that comes from centuries of culture and tradition. Combine that with the kind of marketing that celebrates the aggrandizement of the self (you see some of this in the UK, too, I think, anywhere where capitalism has really seized the airwaves of the national discourse) with little counterbalance in the cultural temperament, and I think that rounds the matter out.

Probably a lot I've missed there. If you're courageous, ask them to quiet down -- most of the time they don't realize how loud they're being, and the reminder that they are in somebody else's space will often shock them. If they're truly an "ugly American" then it's not going to matter what you do, but there is a lot of just plain inability to place oneself in another's shoes. For most Americans, engagement with them would be the highest honor, and it would afford you a way to at least have a somewhat interesting exchange.

So what happens if a bunch of solipsists attend a solipsism convention? Which one is the real one? (one of Alan Watts' jokes...)

Thank you all for replying!
Lol yes YinYang that is exactly why I was hesitant to post it at first... I carried it around for a week or so before mustering up the courage. And I like Alan Watts! Can't say I get what he is saying though. I only understand it intellectually
Yes Jeremy – but there are other foreigners on that train and usually it is the americans who stand out re noise.
It is the train to Salzburg and it is always full of japanese, italians, americans.. well italians can be loud too but at least their language sounds more lovely to me (sorry, haha, please don't hate me now).
My favorites are always the asians, I had an asian neighbor once, the quietest most polite dude you could imagine, plus the bowing...
I think our western societies could only profit if we introduced bowing as a form of greeting.
I must mention this one exchange I witnessed, it is funny but also kind of sad. No, it is sad, actually, really sad...
there was a group of american girls, I took them to be students. Wore some kind of college sweater.
One of them talked about an exchange she had with one of the mobile vendors on a train.
They were chatting and he asked her where she was from and she said „New York“. Then she asked where he was from and he said „Iraq“.
And then this female actually asked him why he had left Iraq and gone to live in Europe!
Uhhhh I thought to myself, I cannot really believe she asked !
But the vendor had diplomatic skills and replied that there was a lot of terrorism and bombs going off in Iraq and it was not safe therefore he left.
And she replied „oohhhh I see“.
Judging from her reaction I gather that she had no clue that the US under orders of GWB had invaded Iraq and started the war there, plus she probably couldn't place it on a world map either.
It is actually scary because I guess most americans will never hold their politicians accountable for what is being done in their name because they simply lack the knowledge.

JayCee, I accept everything you're saying and agree w/ 99% of it. I simply sought to provide an explanation, but you certainly need not excuse yourself for finding my countrymen crass and obnoxious. As you well know, you are not the first one to observe this.

Quote:Judging from her reaction I gather that she had no clue that the US under orders of GWB had invaded Iraq and started the war there, plus she probably couldn't place it on a world map either.
It is actually scary because I guess most americans will never hold their politicians accountable for what is being done in their name because they simply lack the knowledge.

You have it. From that point of view, we have the perfect President. We have a tremendous amount of ignorance in our country for the level of power our government enjoys. That's why I, personally, look forward to the day when our government relinquishes its death grip on the globe and finally allows a bit more balance amongst the nations. While I find all governments pretty scary, I do think more balance amongst the gangsters redounds to the benefit of all of us.

Lol I can relate to that, JayCee. But just wait till you shared a bus or train ride with Somalis.

Lol sunnyside, I do think I had a bunch of them on my train some time ago... they were really loud, yes. But since I don't understand their language it is easier to just blend it out as background noise.
Whereas when I understand what is being talked about I have to listen...
Yes Jeremy, and in Europe it is not much different. Our governments suck and participate in all those illegal wars.
I do believe that the US empire is going to collapse like all empires eventually did, it is long overdue, their own hubris will be their eventual downfall.
Which is why I love him:


I love him for standing up to the US and calling a spade a spade. Highly intelligent man. Just listen to one of his speeches and compare to what our politicians are saying. Also I don't know of any other politician who can talk freely for hours and answer questions of their own populace.
Oliver Stone's interview with him was very interesting also and I think is still on youtube somewhere.

Putin and the chinese president seem some of the saner voices of politics. I think there is even a Cayce prediction about freedom coming from Russia and China in the future...
if anyone has the quote please share. I don't remember exactly.

(09-07-2017, 12:10 PM)JayCee Wrote: [ -> ]I love him for standing up to the US and calling a spade a spade. Highly intelligent man. Just listen to one of his speeches and compare to what our politicians are saying. Also I don't know of any other politician who can talk freely for hours and answer questions of their own populace.

Putin and the chinese president seem some of the saner voices of politics.

Tempted to respond with some facts, but I shall resist to avoid getting sucked in.  Too late - I'm already responding - abort, abort!

Maybe when he's done liberating Ukraine from the Nazis, he can come and liberate America next?

I actually feel that you can't really stereotype a nation... I mean someone living in Alabama is completely different in temperament than someone living in New York or LA, and someone living in Texas is completely different in temperament than someone living in... say... Florida... and then you have the North/South thing, with the North looking down on the South... India also has that.

JayCee, I also like Putin, I have listened to many of his interviews, and I have to say he's pretty intelligent and level-headed. The Russians also love him, I have spoken to many of them recently when we worked together. He has managed to restore their national pride after the dissolution of the Soviet Union,

I want to go to St Petersburg and visit the house where he was born and get a Putin t-shirt
And wear it on election day, haha.
Yes, Putin, please liberate us all!
Let us take off our sandal and follow him, for he is the messiah!

Well....I wouldn't go that far :-) I only have his interviews and press announcements to go on, which is favourable. Don't forget about the poisoning of Alexander Litvinenko, although that story is very murky... Us mere mortals on the ground can never know what goes on behind the scenes.

Stranger Wrote:Tempted to respond with some facts, but I shall resist to avoid getting sucked in.  Too late - I'm already responding - abort, abort!

Ha-ha-ha! Thanks for the laugh!

Stranger Wrote:Maybe when he's done liberating Ukraine from the Nazis, he can come and liberate America next?

Well yes, the word "liberate" coming out of the mouth of any American politician, means "bomb them to smithereens".... This is what American liberation looks like:



It's textbook Orwellian doublespeak... another favourite is "defend", which means "attack". Or "peacekeepers", which means "placing armies on foreign soil". I will never forget the term "friendly tyrants", which are dictators installed by America around the world, tyrants to their own people, but friendly to American interests.

I think maybe I like Putin because he has so much suave, you always see pictures like these:



And the other day he was laying a wreath in the pouring rain, which made me wonder why no-one offered a head of state an umbrella!

Yes, MSM goes to any length in order to vilify Putin.
There was an interesting documentary about the Litvinenko story, I think it was some of the journalists at "New eastern outlook" who published it, unfortunately I cannot remember his name. It seems to have been a murky story of secret services and I think Berezovsky was somehow involved too...
If US politicians accuse him of doing anything you can rest assured it is something they have been doing themselves....
russian hacking? NSA etc!
murder of opponents? Clinton body count, Bush body count, etc!
Well why didn't he have an umbrella the other day?
because he is tough and bad-ass and not made of sugar!

Sorry I have to stop now, my Putin crush is just too obvious...
Never mind me! Please move on, nothing to see here and good weekend everyone.

JayCee Wrote:Clinton body count

Yeah, after begging her husband to bomb Yugoslavia to smithereens, I thought after his reign of terror her influence is finally over, then she became Secretary of State and Libia and Syria was next... and then the bombshell... (pun intended)... an email from her released by Wikileaks which clearly showed that ISIS is an American creation... so no matter what kind of a clown Trump is, Clinton would have unleashed absolute terror on the world. Thank you, Julian Assange!

JayCee Wrote:Never mind me! Please move on, nothing to see here and good weekend everyone.

A nice ayahuasca weekend for me :-) I'll ask mother Ayahuasca if Putin is a good guy, before you start writing him love letters!

(09-08-2017, 01:17 AM)JayCee Wrote: [ -> ]Sorry I have to stop now, my Putin crush is just too obvious...  
Never mind me! Please move on, nothing to see here and good weekend everyone.  

I suppose this is a matter of cultural perception.  As Americans, we generally perceive those who won't speak to us, and express themselves freely, as unfriendly and rude, or even sinister.
It isn't confined to Americans.  If you get the chance you should spend some time in a pub in England or Ireland (or Australia or New Zealand) on a Friday night.  English-speakers have the "Gift of gab", and we aren't afraid to use it.