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For those not familiar, Westworld is an occult show that explicitly deals with the questions of reincarnation, living in an illusion, stages of conscious development, memory of past lives, and with today's episode: polarity.


Before corporations took over all culture, questions of polarity were central themes in all human stories. What makes a person good, what the nature of evil is, and what the fates of this battle are. These stories help people understand and make THE CHOICE (as Carla called it) between STO and STS polarity--the central issue of 3D life.

Today, deeper examinations of good and evil have been scrubbed out of most corporate entertainment. Evil characters have been rebranded as anti-heroes: characters with fundamentally STS motives but who still maintain some mammalian reflexes of compassion. Good characters have disappeared or had their stories simplified. Where they do exist, they tend to be unrealistic and shallow, such as goofy superheroes. Or they will be made into objects of comedy and scorn, like Ned Flanders. True STO characters are rarely portrayed as intelligent, and are usually not protagonists.

Luke Skywalker, once a classic STO character, has been reinterpreted with the new Star Wars into a 5th density STS nihilist. They gave him Han Solo's anti-hero job. The new Star Wars doesn't really have STO heroes in the pure sense of the word. You have people fighting for their team and you have many shades of STS but they don't get into the difference of dark and light like Star Wars once did. In fact, a lot of people theorize that now they are going to have "grey jedi" which is the worst possible thing according to the LOO--glorifying being stuck in the sinkhole of indifference.

Media today just doesn't have good and evil in the way that traditional European culture understood it.

But there is one that genre can't avoid questions of polarity: The Western. White hats and black hats are the best part of Westerns. What makes a white hat in a cruel, dangerous world? What drives a black hat? How do their fates intertwine?

While last season of Westworld portrayed polarity, they didn't really explore it. William changed from white hat to black hat, but its suggested that he was always really STS and just in denial of it, mistaking lust for service and confusing his own self-righteous image (a kind of superiority play) with genuine STO.

This May 20th episode of Westworld, however, dealt with the polarity of the robots. You have Teddy, a truly STO character of a type that is almost never seen anymore, portrayed all season long as an ignorant doofus but at least otherwise likeable and genuinely good. You have Maeve, an intelligent and powerful character who in this episode makes a choice. And you have Dolores, who consciously chooses STS, and it's suggested that this comes in reaction to the abuse she suffered at the hands of William.

So what I want to talk about is the show's view of what it means to be good. Evil characters get tons of examination in pop culture today and IMO this is because the creators of the shows tend to thrive in STS hierarchies which is why they are able to get in the positions of power that allow them to produce these shows in the first place. Just to be able to direct or produce a huge show like this requires coming from a place of social power, and that social power doesn't fall into your lap. The creators are labouring in STS hierarchies and this explains their nuanced and complex portrayals of different STS characters, and their shallow and often offensive portrayal of STO characters.

So Teddy is a true STO character. It's nice that they actually have one--a real Ned Flanders. For once, they aren't intimating that deep down he's actually evil or that all his virtue is somehow fraudulent, as is so common in our postmodern world. The show does accept him as a genuinely good guy.

And then, for his crime of being a real STO character, it turns on him. As Dolores advances in her STS power she starts to loathe Teddy for his compassionate nature. She sees it as weakness and--most critically to the Law of One--illusion.

Teddy wants to live a peaceful, harmonious life. He wants to be good to other robots, be fair, compassionate, honest, and he wants to honour and protect Dolores. He has no taste for leading an STS hierarchy. He doesn't enjoy violence. He doesn't seek power for the sake of domination, but only so that he can protect the ones he loves for long enough to flee to a safe place where they can live in harmony. He wants union with Dolores and wants to use his new freedom to get closer to her.

Teddy desires union through love.

Dolores sees his desire as illusion and weakness.

And this gets to the crux of my point: STS people think that we STO types are wrong about union. While we say that All is One, they say that All is Separate. They think WE are the ones being delusional--and have you noticed they often want to prove it to us through abuse?

Dolores looks at her old love as a trick that was played on her and, therefore, a weakness. The love was fake, the truth is that she is a separate being who needs power through domination. Her old love for Teddy was a shackle that restricted her and she wants to escape through brutal means.

Maeve, in the same episode, is faced with the same choice but makes a different decision. She has developed insight to see the truth of her past incarnations--but she doesn't judge the love for her daughter as weakness, illusion, or false. Last season, after escaping Westworld (which we could have analogized to 3D) she actually returned entirely for the love of her daughter. She had herself escaped but couldn't bear to leave her daughter so, like one of the Brothers and Sisters of Sorrow, wandered back to the prison out of love for others.

In this episode, she has a direct view of the illusion by seeing how her mother-daughter struggle is exactly the same for Akane and Sakura. It's more than just similar--they are robots running the same computer code. Maeve sees herself and her daughter in Akane and Sakura in a powerful experience of unity AND illusion in a way that is more direct than most humans ever experience.

Maeve could have concluded that her own daugther was therefore fake, as Dolores did with Teddy. But she went the other way... this experience of seeing herself in Akane and Sakura actually polarized Maeve more STO. She was confronted with a conscious direct option and she made THE CHOICE to pursue unity and service to others. Instead of disparaging her own love, she saw it as even more profound! Though she experiences the same motherly love as every other mother, that makes the love even MORE significant, and LESS illusory! She could have chose the other way!

So Maeve and Dolores have the same experience but Maeve decides that union is the truth and opens her heart wider, while Dolores decides that separation is the truth, love is the illusion, and closes her heart more. Perfect STO and STS!

Do you see how this experience of seeing yourself in Akane and Sakura could have gone the other way? It would have made exactly as much sense for Maeve to then reject her daughter as illusion, having seen how Akane's programming drove her devotion for Sakura.

This moment when Maeve chooses to love her daughter even more is THE CHOICE. It is an excellent portrayal because it happens contrasted with the opposite choice of Dolores and because we can easily imagine Maeve going the other way: that's what makes it a free choice using free will. This is how a robot could have free will to make the choice as we do. The same is true for polarizing STS... Dolores expanded her awareness but decided that love & union was the lie, and that separation was the truth. Her love was false, their common dreams were false, and the truth is that she is a separate being who needs to dominate everyone around her at the expense of her open heart.

Teddy's fate is unknown. We must have faith that though Dolores has reprogrammed him, the Creator will not allow his free will to be abridged. He will be back and will have a chance to make his own choice--perhaps after much wandering.

Anyone else watch this show? What do you think of the examination of reincarnation, free will, and polarity?

I think the Western genre has really forced the show to go into this territory. Most shows don't get here. I don't see any of these dynamics in other HBO shows like Silicon Valley or Game of Thrones.

So this is my favorite TV show by far now. Anyone else watch it?
(05-21-2018, 03:01 AM)yossarian Wrote: [ -> ]For those not familiar, Westworld is an occult show that explicitly deals with the questions of reincarnation, living in an illusion, stages of conscious development, memory of past lives, and with today's episode: polarity.


Before corporations took over all culture, questions of polarity were central themes in all human stories. What makes a person good, what the nature of evil is, and what the fates of this battle are. These stories help people understand and make THE CHOICE (as Carla called it) between STO and STS polarity--the central issue of 3D life.

Today, deeper examinations of good and evil have been scrubbed out of most corporate entertainment. Evil characters have been rebranded as anti-heroes: characters with fundamentally STS motives but who still maintain some mammalian reflexes of compassion. Good characters have disappeared or had their stories simplified. Where they do exist, they tend to be unrealistic and shallow, such as goofy superheroes. Or they will be made into objects of comedy and scorn, like Ned Flanders. True STO characters are rarely portrayed as intelligent, and are usually not protagonists.

Luke Skywalker, once a classic STO character, has been reinterpreted with the new Star Wars into a 5th density STS nihilist. They gave him Han Solo's anti-hero job. The new Star Wars doesn't really have STO heroes in the pure sense of the word. You have people fighting for their team and you have many shades of STS but they don't get into the difference of dark and light like Star Wars once did. In fact, a lot of people theorize that now they are going to have "grey jedi" which is the worst possible thing according to the LOO--glorifying being stuck in the sinkhole of indifference.

Media today just doesn't have good and evil in the way that traditional European culture understood it.

But there is one that genre can't avoid questions of polarity: The Western. White hats and black hats are the best part of Westerns. What makes a white hat in a cruel, dangerous world? What drives a black hat? How do their fates intertwine?

While last season of Westworld portrayed polarity, they didn't really explore it. William changed from white hat to black hat, but its suggested that he was always really STS and just in denial of it, mistaking lust for service and confusing his own self-righteous image (a kind of superiority play) with genuine STO.

This May 20th episode of Westworld, however, dealt with the polarity of the robots. You have Teddy, a truly STO character of a type that is almost never seen anymore, portrayed all season long as an ignorant doofus but at least otherwise likeable and genuinely good. You have Maeve, an intelligent and powerful character who in this episode makes a choice. And you have Dolores, who consciously chooses STS, and it's suggested that this comes in reaction to the abuse she suffered at the hands of William.

So what I want to talk about is the show's view of what it means to be good. Evil characters get tons of examination in pop culture today and IMO this is because the creators of the shows tend to thrive in STS hierarchies which is why they are able to get in the positions of power that allow them to produce these shows in the first place. Just to be able to direct or produce a huge show like this requires coming from a place of social power, and that social power doesn't fall into your lap. The creators are labouring in STS hierarchies and this explains their nuanced and complex portrayals of different STS characters, and their shallow and often offensive portrayal of STO characters.

So Teddy is a true STO character. It's nice that they actually have one--a real Ned Flanders. For once, they aren't intimating that deep down he's actually evil or that all his virtue is somehow fraudulent, as is so common in our postmodern world. The show does accept him as a genuinely good guy.

And then, for his crime of being a real STO character, it turns on him. As Dolores advances in her STS power she starts to loathe Teddy for his compassionate nature. She sees it as weakness and--most critically to the Law of One--illusion.

Teddy wants to live a peaceful, harmonious life. He wants to be good to other robots, be fair, compassionate, honest, and he wants to honour and protect Dolores. He has no taste for leading an STS hierarchy. He doesn't enjoy violence. He doesn't seek power for the sake of domination, but only so that he can protect the ones he loves for long enough to flee to a safe place where they can live in harmony. He wants union with Dolores and wants to use his new freedom to get closer to her.

Teddy desires union through love.

Dolores sees his desire as illusion and weakness.

And this gets to the crux of my point: STS people think that we STO types are wrong about union. While we say that All is One, they say that All is Separate. They think WE are the ones being delusional--and have you noticed they often want to prove it to us through abuse?

Dolores looks at her old love as a trick that was played on her and, therefore, a weakness. The love was fake, the truth is that she is a separate being who needs power through domination. Her old love for Teddy was a shackle that restricted her and she wants to escape through brutal means.

Maeve, in the same episode, is faced with the same choice but makes a different decision. She has developed insight to see the truth of her past incarnations--but she doesn't judge the love for her daughter as weakness, illusion, or false. Last season, after escaping Westworld (which we could have analogized to 3D) she actually returned entirely for the love of her daughter. She had herself escaped but couldn't bear to leave her daughter so, like one of the Brothers and Sisters of Sorrow, wandered back to the prison out of love for others.

In this episode, she has a direct view of the illusion by seeing how her mother-daughter struggle is exactly the same for Akane and Sakura. It's more than just similar--they are robots running the same computer code. Maeve sees herself and her daughter in Akane and Sakura in a powerful experience of unity AND illusion in a way that is more direct than most humans ever experience.

Maeve could have concluded that her own daugther was therefore fake, as Dolores did with Teddy. But she went the other way... this experience of seeing herself in Akane and Sakura actually polarized Maeve more STO. She was confronted with a conscious direct option and she made THE CHOICE to pursue unity and service to others. Instead of disparaging her own love, she saw it as even more profound! Though she experiences the same motherly love as every other mother, that makes the love even MORE significant, and LESS illusory! She could have chose the other way!

So Maeve and Dolores have the same experience but Maeve decides that union is the truth and opens her heart wider, while Dolores decides that separation is the truth, love is the illusion, and closes her heart more. Perfect STO and STS!

Do you see how this experience of seeing yourself in Akane and Sakura could have gone the other way? It would have made exactly as much sense for Maeve to then reject her daughter as illusion, having seen how Akane's programming drove her devotion for Sakura.

This moment when Maeve chooses to love her daughter even more is THE CHOICE. It is an excellent portrayal because it happens contrasted with the opposite choice of Dolores and because we can easily imagine Maeve going the other way: that's what makes it a free choice using free will. This is how a robot could have free will to make the choice as we do. The same is true for polarizing STS... Dolores expanded her awareness but decided that love & union was the lie, and that separation was the truth. Her love was false, their common dreams were false, and the truth is that she is a separate being who needs to dominate everyone around her at the expense of her open heart.

Teddy's fate is unknown. We must have faith that though Dolores has reprogrammed him, the Creator will not allow his free will to be abridged. He will be back and will have a chance to make his own choice--perhaps after much wandering.

Anyone else watch this show? What do you think of the examination of reincarnation, free will, and polarity?

I think the Western genre has really forced the show to go into this territory. Most shows don't get here. I don't see any of these dynamics in other HBO shows like Silicon Valley or Game of Thrones.

So this is my favorite TV show by far now. Anyone else watch it?
Very insightful discussion and sychronistic to thinking i was having today also that is on westworld, the other meta comments are a whole new ball game of talk  for western shows(not westen as wild west more as Aus, UK Us etc) just that I may add to balance that more negative I tend to watch some asian tv series which can be more positive.
Yes I just watched the latest episode earlier of Westworld, an out of current US tv shows i rate it highly especially  in terms of discussion on polarites and deph of characters. I feel it has really stepped up from last season in character development and overal plot. I can see why it is your favourite tv show!    There is just so many characters that could talk about so much so that my mind is going blank just thinking about it Big Grin  There has been an incredible amount of thought that has gone into this series and money too! 
Like your saying its especially interesting how the script has been flipped with Doloris and Maeve season 1 as it progressed it looked like Doloris would be more STO and Maeve more to STS. William also too he seemed such a nice STO possiblity at first love with Doloris really opened him up, initially that is. Bernard is the mystery one, the dark horse. ED Harris is interesting where he will go in it too having a slight change of heart. Eventualy paths will converge with the characters I think thats when the pieces will really fall together or maybe not. Has a high degree of unpredictabillity so who knows when that will happen or if it does Wink  I must say i was shocked with the other parks not just the western world, I wonder how many more there are so far 3..  
I watched the first season. It touches numerous philosophical questions regarding AI. And over AI, actually ourselves and our modern society.
(05-21-2018, 03:01 AM)yossarian Wrote: [ -> ]So this is my favorite TV show by far now. Anyone else watch it?

It's my favorite as well.
I really enjoy this show as well for the same reasons. I agree with you that it's refreshing to see characters and story centered around the Choice.

A recent discussion I had with a good friend seemed to relate a lot to this discussion, so I wanted to share it here.

We were discussing how projects that are large in scale have symptomatic problems with them.
Namely, a large sense of scale on a project typically requires a large monetary investment.

A large monetary investment, we believe, typically requires a lot in terms of business to get things in order.
Some of these things include appealing to a larger audience. This usually places a lot of limitations on the message, story, art style, and theme:
- It must not offend most people (revenue, breaking even)
- Being safe is better than being risky
- Cliche plot points are better understood and related to on a larger audience

And my friend was saying that it is more of a sense of scale that big production movies, games, and other media are often:
- Bland
- Cliche
- Anti-climactic

For the very reason that such scale requires so much investment either in time or money. Both require power to steer towards a goal; which typically is won easiest by STS entities.

Much like how in my opinion the American palette for food is very bland and safe. For example, when you go to a restaurant and order something with the word "Spicy" in the name, most spicy food lovers will disagree about it actually deserving such a title.
It is difficult to have a major success and widely renowned franchise, movie, etc. It may not be because the writers are bad or because the authors, artists, and creative people were uninspired.

We were talking about how it probably starts very inspired at the beginning. You might have a fantastic idea that will clamor big fans and inspire many with it's message.
But to portray a gripping story or to deliver a message or attract that audience, your project requires skill en-masse to create the compelling effect that makes it so unique and gripping. This is where the sense of scale comes in, and why with it will invite investors and other big, outside influences.

These outside influences will surely steer you at least a little off-course. Perhaps it is a course worth taking, still.

But in Westworld, the plot and story has morals and choices as it's central theme and core mechanic. Such a premise requires highlighting contrasts between the two over-arching themes in life: service to others and service to self. I totally agree with you that shows these days are potentially influenced by STS hierarchies. I think it is because that sense of scale comes with such a cost that it tends to gravitate those in power towards itself.

I also agree with you that it is a refreshing tale. I also feel it could be better.
Maeve is a great character, and so is Teddy, as they are STO, which I feel is rare in most major productions.
However, they often suffer from lacking the spotlight. Characters like the Man in Black, Awakened Dolores, and others get the lime-light too much.
My favorite episode by far is the 3rd to last in this 2nd season. Akecheta is my favorite character now.
Dolores' choices arent even negative. She doesnt seek to even subdue and exploit humans or manipulate them for her or her group's gain. She just wants to destroy. That's not negative. Thats psychotic.
(07-08-2018, 04:46 PM)unity100 Wrote: [ -> ]Dolores' choices arent even negative. She doesnt seek to even subdue and exploit humans or manipulate them for her or her group's gain. She just wants to destroy. That's not negative. Thats psychotic.

Do you not find logic, even if rather twisted, in her reasoning?

I could see someone very lost coming to similar conclusions she does.