Bring4th

Ra said that third density is approximately (symbolized with the ~ character) between 75,000 and 76,000 years in length. For the sake of calculation, I will assume the middle ground of ~75,500 years in length. We know from more recent Q'uo channelings (and other sources) that the end of third density is Dec 21st 2012. So if we backtrack, we can then calculate the beginning date of third density, as well as the start/end dates of all the sub densities. (I am also ignoring leap years here... fyi. If someone wants to do the leg work on those calculations I can update these dates)

Here's how it breaks down

End of 2nd Density / Start of 3rd Density
75,500 yrs / 27,557,500 days -- Date was Dec 21st 73,488 BC

Start of 7th sub-3rd Density
10,785 yrs / 3,936,525 -- Date was Dec 21st 8,773 BC

Start of 7th sub-sub-3rd Density
1541 yrs / 562,465 -- Date was Dec 21st 471 AD

Start of 7th sub-sub-sub-3rd Density
220 yrs / 80,300 days -- Date was Dec 21st 1792 AD

Start of 7th sub-sub-sub-sub-3rd Density
31 yrs / 11,346 days -- Date was Dec 21st 1981 AD

Start of 7th sub-sub-sub-sub-sub-3rd Density
4.5 yrs / 1,642 days and 12 hours -- Date was June 21st 2007 AD at 12PM

Start of 7th sub-sub-sub-sub-sub-sub-3rd Density
0.64 yrs / 237 days and 6 hours -- Date will be May 7th 2011 AD at 6PM

Start of 7th sub-sub-sub-sub-sub-sub-sub-3rd Density
0.09 yrs / 32 days and 20 hours -- Date will be June 9th 2011 AD at 2 PM

Start of 7th sub-sub-sub-sub-sub-sub-sub-sub-3rd Density
0.013 yrs / 4 days and ~18 hours -- Date will be June 10th 2011 AD at 8 AM

Start of 7th sub-sub-sub-sub-sub-sub-sub-sub-sub-3rd Density
0.00187 yrs / ~16 hours -- Date will be June 11th 2011 AD at 12 AM

Start of 7th sub-sub-sub-sub-sub-sub-sub-sub-sub-sub-3rd Density
.00267284 yrs / ~2 hours -- Date will be June 11th 2011 AD at 2 AM

...at this point you can keep dividing by seven and run in to an infinite number of sub densities...

End of Third Density / Beginning of 4th Density
Dec 21st 2012

Now, if my calculations are roughly correct, we should now be in the 5th sub-sub-sub-sub-sub-3rd Density. 1199 days since the start of sub-sub-sub-sub-sub 3rd Density, / 237.25 = 5.05374078, which = 5 sub-sub-sub-sub-sub 3rd densities plus 12 days and 18 hours. We should have entered this particular density about, approximately, two weeks ago.

however, even if the timespan of a density is roughly identifiable, we havent been given any information regarding the rise of frequency, so that the frequency increase (hence the sub density changes) can be mapped to time.

for example, vibrations started to increase speedily since 1937, and since 1937 the planet was in green wibration, according to Ra.

Yes, I agree. The "actual" (if such a word can be used) transition to 4th density is I believe more gradual in nature as the vibrations begin to overlap and one gradually fades out in favor of a new one, and are not tied to sub-density transitions.

It makes one wonder if there are actual identifiable characteristics to each sub density that we could compare. I am not well read on David Wilcox but I recall him once writing about how each of these sub-density transitions have been marked with a major consciousness shift in our world history. As we move towards 2012 he expects that these happenings will become more and more frequent in line with my above figuring. It should be noted however that this works out quite well with his "instant shift" theories that I personally don't put much stock in. An interesting theory in itself nevertheless though... I believe he's tied it in with the I-Ching and Terrance McKenna's work. Something I again don't know very much about

Thoughts?

L&L, ~L

I hope you don't mind my having some fun with this first:




There are some sources that say that Ra provided the most likely scenario at the time of the contact, but subsequent developments in evolution make the most likely future a different one from our point of view. For example I think David Wilcock and Salusa both describe ascension as a growth stage that might not require our death. However that would take us outside of the L/L Research material.

I guess the real question is whether the Harvest process, described as walking the steps of light as far as comfortable given our spiritual growth, requires the death of the physical vehicle - and if so can the consciousness return to that vehicle at its new location. I have no spiritual insight into this, just trying to figure it out from this side of the Veil.

The timings are, for your benefit and accuracy, winter solstice to winter solstice:
Minor Cycle: 25625 yrs
Major Cycle: 76875 yrs

Ra stated that walking the steps was a requirement prior to the veil. Since the spirits of this planet are veiled, the process is and will be different, however, just to be absolutely clear on one point... one cannot take the 3rd density vehicle to 4th density as much as they can take the 3rd density vehicle to 6th density.

Consider death if you will. It is much less difficult or traumatic than one has been led to believe, than one has been taught to fear, for if you think about it, one dies each and every time they go to sleep. This process of sleep is the same except the choice is made (most often) to continue the experience, and the person "wakes up". For those that do choose to not continue the experience, their physical vehicle ceases to function and they "die in their sleep". Do you fear sleep? If the answer to this is no, then you should also not fear death, for they are one and the same, only viewed from different perspectives.

Love and Light to you all

Hi, P! I'm not trying to dismantle tor point on sleep = death. But I must point out that during sleep, although the consciousness leaves the physical body, the heart still beats and the lungs still breathe. It must be, then, that we leave a part, however small, of our life every inside our body to keep the brain working overnight. How is this the same as death, when the heart and lungs and other organs stop their functions? I'm thinking that the experience must be nearly the same to the experiencer. But the two are slightly different. Do we go to the in-between incarnation resting place when we sleep? ("Limbo" in the general misunderstanding of spiritual terms haha) We must not, because we dream. Do we enter the gates of larger life every night? What are your thoughts on this?

some of your life energy is tied to the body with silver cord, as i remember. you are larger in dreamland, however, you still spend some of your energy to maintain your 3d body, and shoulder its weight.

(10-01-2010, 10:37 PM)Questioner Wrote: [ -> ]I hope you don't mind my having some fun with this first:

Ha, that's great!

(10-01-2010, 10:37 PM)Questioner Wrote: [ -> ]I guess the real question is whether the Harvest process, described as walking the steps of light as far as comfortable given our spiritual growth, requires the death of the physical vehicle - and if so can the consciousness return to that vehicle at its new location. I have no spiritual insight into this, just trying to figure it out from this side of the Veil.

There are several threads devoted to exploring and debating that question, with strong opinions on both sides of the 'gradual vs sudden shift' debate.

Your statement brings up another question: We often use the terms Harvest and walking the steps of Light synonymously, but are they really? Doesn't each entity walk the steps of Light, to determine where it will end up after incarnation? But not everyone will be harvested. In this quote, Ra stated that (at the time of the channeling) that the Harvest was small. This implies that only those who graduate are considered 'harvested' although, presumably, those who aren't harvested still walk the steps of Light. This to me indicates that being harvested is a possible result of walking the steps of Light, not the same thing.

If walking the steps of Light = being harvested, then there's no way the Harvest could have been small. Being harvested must mean something other than walking the steps of Light, though that is the means by which it is determined whether or not an entity is harvestable, and perhaps even whether the question of being harvested even applies to that entity.

Quote:13.23 Questioner: How does a third-density planet become a fourth density planet?
Ra: I am Ra. This will be the last full question.

The fourth density is, as we have said, as regularized in its approach as the striking of a clock upon the hour. The space/time of your solar system has enabled this planetary sphere to spiral into space/time of a different vibrational configuration. This causes the planetary sphere to be able to be molded by these new distortions. However, the thought-forms of your people during this transition period are such that the mind/body/spirit complexes of both individual and societies are scattered throughout the spectrum instead of becoming able to grasp the needle, shall we say, and point the compass in one direction.

Thus, the entry into the vibration of love, sometimes called by your people the vibration of understanding, is not effective with your present societal complex. Thus, the harvest shall be such that many will repeat the third-density cycle. The energies of your Wanderers, your teachers, and your adepts at this time are all bent upon increasing the harvest. However, there are few to harvest.

Those who repeat, surely walk the steps of Light, to see which density they belong in, right? But they aren't harvested. In my understanding, to be harvested means to graduate from the present density into the next. All walk the steps of Light to determine whether or not they have graduated (if applicable), or must repeat the grade, or maybe even slipped back a grade, or maybe even graduated to a different polarity. But not all who walk the steps of Light are harvested.

Monica, my own interpretation so far is that at harvest time, the harvesters assist each entity to the entrance of the stairway, so to speak. The entity walks the steps of light until they get to the floor that is comfortable for them. If the entity has developed its own capacity to climb all the way to the roof, it is harvested.

So to try to pull in what u100, Aaron and P mentioned. Perhaps it is impossible to walk the steps of light while trailing a cord back to the body. Perhaps that cord must be cut, so the physical body dies.

The remaining mind/spirit complex walks the steps of light. At the level the entity chooses for itself, a new body is available for the mind/spirit to enter and continue the lessons. Those who are harvested enter a new body in 4D+ Gaia or 4D- ParanoiaVille. Those who did not climb out of the sinkhole of indifference enter a new body in 3D Continuation School. 4D people would remember their 3D experience and have a new body that continues their lessons, just as we can recognize ourselves and each other in new clothes. Continuation School students would not remember their brief visit to the stairway, but would have further experiences beneath the Veil.

(10-02-2010, 01:51 PM)Questioner Wrote: [ -> ]Monica, my own interpretation so far is that at harvest time, the harvesters assist each entity to the entrance of the stairway, so to speak. The entity walks the steps of light until they get to the floor that is comfortable for them. If the entity has developed its own capacity to climb all the way to the roof, it is harvested.

Right. That's how I understand it. So some entities who walk the steps aren't harvested, in the sense of graduating to another density, though they are being assisted by the harvesters.

It seems that the process has 2 components: walking the steps and actually being harvested (graduating to another density) and the term harvest is often used to denote the whole process, rather than a component of it.

I agree. Human farmers - and commodities brokers - might refer to this year's harvest. The term could include earlier work on the fields, along with subsequent grading and shipping of the fruits or grains.

I think we're on the same page here. Sometimes that's very nice.

(10-02-2010, 02:07 PM)Questioner Wrote: [ -> ]I agree. Human farmers - and commodities brokers - might refer to this year's harvest. The term could include earlier work on the fields, along with subsequent grading and shipping of the fruits or grains.

Good analogy! The crops must all go thru the process, but not all will be taken to market.

(10-02-2010, 02:07 PM)Questioner Wrote: [ -> ]I think we're on the same page here. Sometimes that's very nice.

Yes!

(10-01-2010, 02:06 PM)Lavazza Wrote: [ -> ]Ra said that third density is approximately (symbolized with the ~ character) between 75,000 and 76,000 years in length. For the sake of calculation, I will assume the middle ground of ~75,500 years in length. We know from more recent Q'uo channelings (and other sources) that the end of third density is Dec 21st 2012. So if we backtrack, we can then calculate the beginning date of third density, as well as the start/end dates of all the sub densities. (I am also ignoring leap years here... fyi. If someone wants to do the leg work on those calculations I can update these dates)

End of Third Density / Beginning of 4th Density
Dec 21st 2012

Now, if my calculations are roughly correct, we should now be in the 5th sub-sub-sub-sub-sub-3rd Density. 1199 days since the start of sub-sub-sub-sub-sub 3rd Density, / 237.25 = 5.05374078, which = 5 sub-sub-sub-sub-sub 3rd densities plus 12 days and 18 hours. We should have entered this particular density about, approximately, two weeks ago.

Dear Dr. Lavazza,
How refreshing to see you and your well thought out calculations of pendaticism and good humor included . Do you remember the scene in the movie "Back To The Future" where the disheveled nutty professor with the shambled big white hair is standing on a clock tower with a jumble of wires in his hand in the middle of a lightening storm doing his hyper-dimensional algebraic-trigonometric equations all in the effort to re-juice the car to get them back to the future?

Now, my question is, with as much seriousness and playfulness, both set aside one for the other (huh?) as yours, are we doing your calculations above in accordance with the variations and knowledge that the Gregorian Calender was off to begin with by as much as 4 to 18 years? The mistake of dear Father Gregory's math throws everything we thought we knew into a tailspin as a result. Given that our calender is based on the birth of Christ, Brother Gregory seemingly did his math all wrong from the outset thereby giving us a distorted (pun intended) baseline from the beginning. He seemingly miscalculated the birth of Jesus, perhaps as a result of raiding the monastic winery into the wee hours of the morn while laboriously laboring over his arithmetic in an otherwise epiphanic state of another order. History teaches that Jesus was born near the time of "The Slaughter Of The Innocents." Herod ordered the slaughter of all male children beginning at the birth of Jesus, inclusive up to some 2 years after. He didn't want to miss the mark he set for himself and therefore gave himself the degree of latitude that despots allow themselves through their majesty as per the "Guidelines And Rules For Despots" on page 4 of "The Despots Manual," notwithstanding that they seldom follow the manual. The problem with Brother Gregory's calculations is that Herod died some 4 years before the Gregorian Calender accounts for Jesus' birth. In other words, unless Herod was drinking from a similar vat of wine that was as tainted as Brother Gregory's, how could he have ordered the slaughter 4 years before Jesus was born? This means that Brother Gregory, who was assigned to do the math for the conversion of the Julian Calender to the Gregorian Calender got it wrong, and that that the calender as a result may be off by as much as a minimum of 4 years to as much as an astounding 18 years at most. Brace yourself....This means that we may in fact be living in the year 2014, if not as much as the year 2028!!!!!

Think I'm kidding? Well...I sorta am....but see below, with all seriousness aside .... seriously. The Julian calendar was introduced by Julius Caesar in 45 BC. It was in common use until the 1500s, when countries started changing to the Gregorian Calendar. However, some countries, for example Greece and Russia used it well into this century, and the Orthodox church in Russia still uses it, as do some other Orthodox churches. Now, the old Roman calendar was very complicated and required a group of men, known as the pontiffs, to decide when days should be added or removed to keep the calendar in track with the seasons. This made planning ahead difficult as well as sketchy given that the pontiffs were open to bribery in order to prolong the term of elected officials or hasten elections. It seems Time really is Money....more than we ever knew. Everything can be bought for money.....even time

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anno_Domini Wrote:Birth of Jesus

See also: Nativity of Jesus and Chronology of Jesus

According to Doggett, "Although scholars generally believe that Christ was born some years before AD 1, the historical evidence is too sketchy to allow a definitive dating"[9]. According to Matthew 2:1[10] and Matthew 2:16[11], King Herod the Great was alive when Jesus was born, and ordered the Massacre of the Innocents in response to his birth. (However) Blackburn and Holford-Strevens fix King Herod's death shortly before Passover in 4 BC[3]:770, and say that those who accept the story of the Massacre of the Innocents sometimes associate the star that led the Biblical Magi with the planetary conjunction of 15 September 7 BC or Halley's comet of 12 BC (less likely since comets were usually considered bad omens); even historians who do not accept the Massacre accept the birth under Herod as a tradition older than the written gospels.[3]:776

The Gospel of Luke states that Jesus was conceived during the reign of Herod the Great[Luke 1:5] (i.e., before 4 BC) while also stating that Jesus was born when Cyrenius (or Quirinius) was the governor of Syria and carried out the census of the Roman provinces of Syria and Iudaea.[Luke 2:1-3] The Jewish historian Josephus, in his Antiquities of the Jews (ca. AD 93), indicates that Cyrenius/Quirinius' governorship of Syria began in AD 6, and that the census occurred sometime between AD 6-7,[12] which is incompatible with a conception prior to 4 BC, thus making Luke's chronology not only incompatible with that of the author of Matthew, but also internally contradictory within the Gospel of Luke. On this point, Blackburn and Holford-Strevens state that "St. Luke raises greater difficulty ... Most critics therefore discard Luke". Some scholars rely on John 8:57[13]: "thou are not yet fifty years old", to place Christ's birth circa 18 BC.

P.S. The calender in question we operate on today was in fact introduced by Pope Gregory XIII, after whom the calendar was named, by a decree signed on 24 February 1582, a papal bull known by its opening words Inter gravissimas. The reform was a modification of a proposal made (originally) by Doctor Aloysius Lilius (or Lilio) who no doubt was a bit loopy if not lou-lou. As a confession required in Catholicism, Doctor Lou-Lou wasn't really Brother Gregory at all, notwithstanding that he did drink profusely from the monastic winery nonetheless, and was only named as such for poetic license in humor. I promise to do my penance later by means of self-flagellation, even if it means breaking my "Recovering Catholic" status. I further apologize to any Catholics out there that have as yet to in fact recover, this for the aforementioned remark about recovery. Nor was it my intent in any way to deprecate the recovery process required by any said Catholics in need of recovery. Wait a minute...this is getting as tangled up as your wires in the lightening storm.

So in closing, we either live in the year of our Lord 2014 to as much as 2028. Yikes! What happened to the convergix two to sixteen years ago? I slept right through it ..........as will no doubt the vast majority in 2012, that already happened, at which point we will be equipped to return to 2012 in 2028 to go "Back To The Future." It does get loopy.

So good professor Lavazza, shall we instead convene to the local tavern to re-do the math of subsubsubsubsubsubsub-ness while we drink deeply from the vat in the effort of likewise gaining epiphanic states required to sort this out?

The following should clear everything up quite nicely and forever more, this as offered by the great sages of wisdom "Abbott and Costello": Do watch it...even if you've seen it before...you won't be sorry as it never gets old:

"Whose On First" .....anyway?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wfmvkO5x6...re=related

Love and Light in total confusion what ever D I hail from or am in....

~ Q ~

Hey Q,

Wow, that's a boat-load of information I hadn't really been too sharp on before, thank you! I had heard some rumbling about the Gregorian calendar before, but really didn't know what it was all about. It's funny how certain things we take for granted everyday may be entirely based on a false premises. Of course- it then begs the question of relative importance, for it seems to me so long as you have a consensus agreement on a system of counting years, months, days, and et cetera then good progress can be made in communicating ideas about the past, present and future. It is in this mindset I presume the Confederation operates in when communicating with us about dates, just as they would speak using our clumsy English language to speak about metaphysics. Indeed, 2012 may not be 2012 but in fact 2030 and yet the discreet point at which 3rd density light expires would be the same. I know you know this, but I felt it would be fun to record here on the thread regardless

As regards the sub-densities, I'm pretty sure we'd still be in the same sub-density as the math in that formula simply counts backwards from the present. Assuming of course it was just our calendar that was hijacked and not our system of year measurement also!

I really enjoyed that link you sent over. I couldn't help but think of recent dialogs on our forum that I've been observing from the audience... "Infinity's on first, Intelligent Infinity is on second, and The One Infinite Creator is on third.. But wait, if the One Infinite Creator is on third, how did he get there is Infinity is on first? Hold up- Intelligent Infinity just stole third base! The One Infinite Creator is running for.. second?? Where is Infinity!? Wait- there it is, it's going for the dug-out... to get more chewing tobacco!? Yes, it is! Oh, the humanity!!"

Love, Light, and always a heavy dollop of Humor,
Dr. Lavazza, Ph.D, adorning a cosmic dunce cap

(10-06-2010, 05:39 PM)Lavazza Wrote: [ -> ]I really enjoyed that link you sent over. I couldn't help but think of recent dialogs on our forum that I've been observing from the audience... "Infinity's on first, Intelligent Infinity is on second, and The One Infinite Creator is on third.. But wait, if the One Infinite Creator is on third, how did he get there is Infinity is on first? Hold up- Intelligent Infinity just stole third base! The One Infinite Creator is running for.. second?? Where is Infinity!? Wait- there it is, it's going for the dug-out... to get more chewing tobacco!? Yes, it is! Oh, the humanity!!"

Love, Light, and always a heavy dollop of Humor,
Dr. Lavazza, Ph.D, adorning a cosmic dunce cap

A-h-e-m...excuse me Dear Dr. "L"....

I should have thought that for all the effort put forth that you would have rather naturally understood that Infinity occupies all bases infinitely before there were ever even bases created, notwithstanding that they don't even exist in infinity, or that, as the little Bald British Buddhist Kleptomaniac Kid that stole all of the Oracles kitchen-ware said to Neo as they sat on the floor, "there are no forks," or was that dishes, tables, or maybe bases......no, I think it was balls. "There are no balls". Yes, now I remember. The little Buddhist kid that Neo met at the Oracles house sitting on the floor told Neo that he didn't have any balls at which point Neo attempted to bend them. I get all confused with Infinity and where we are, much less if we really have any balls in a state of non-infinity, when we do in infinity. I think I'll watch the videos again as I remember either explaining it all pretty well.

(1) 1 minute: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dzm8kTIj_0M

(2) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wfmvkO5x6...re=related

Dollops back at ya,

~ Q ~

(10-02-2010, 01:51 PM)Questioner Wrote: [ -> ]So to try to pull in what u100, Aaron and P mentioned. Perhaps it is impossible to walk the steps of light while trailing a cord back to the body. Perhaps that cord must be cut, so the physical body dies.

NDE's are not connected by the silver cord though may return. As long as decomposition has not set in, it is a simple (inner plane angelic) process of returning the spirit to the body.

I note that there will be a choice that is oft not considered, nor did you mention it, for those that will desire to continue 3D lessons on Earth if those lessons are in congruence with healing the Mother. This option will be possible only for those close to ascension. Though Ra did not speak of this, Q'uo has.

(10-27-2010, 01:16 AM)Peregrinus Wrote: [ -> ]NDE's are not connected by the silver cord though may return. As long as decomposition has not set in, it is a simple (inner plane angelic) process of returning the spirit to the body.

That is much simpler, and more reassuring, than the older information I'd seen.

Quote:I note that there will be a choice that is oft not considered, nor did you mention it, for those that will desire to continue 3D lessons on Earth if those lessons are in congruence with healing the Mother. This option will be possible only for those close to ascension. Though Ra did not speak of this, Q'uo has.

Everything I've seen about the Harvest/Ascension process - that is, all I've seen that seems resonant and sensible to me - insists that the widest possible range of people will be offered a free will choice about their next option.

I feel that "walking the steps of light" results in an accurate measurement of the highest level that an entity is able to participate in, based on their essential nature.

As I interpret what I've read, I get the impression that entities will be free to proceed at that highest level - optimizing their own degree of brand new experiences that promote their own personal evolution. And just as free to go to any lower level, where they might prefer to serve in the upliftment of others from earlier grades.

Just as in our physical realm, a person who receives a bachelor's degree could go on to get a master's degree, or drop back to be a college teacher's assistant, high school aide, elementary school assistant, or even nursery day care worker.

The steps of light... just to clear up a point; though Ra spoke of this process of ascertaining the developmental level of the spirit so that we might think of it as steps, there are not any actual steps. A spirit has no legs to walk up steps and therefore has no requirement for such illusory devices anyway

All choices are free will, as is the choice of being here in this plane at this time, and nothing is ever forced upon a spirit. To quote Ra if I may, "This distortion is not in any case necessary. It is chosen by each of you as an alternative to understanding the complete unity of thought which binds all things. " This, of course, applies to all spirits in the tribe of mankind, including wanderers.

Two considerations do come into play in spiritual evolution though. Because all evolution happens according to the desire to move in the ever upward spiralling path, those able to ascend most likely will choose to do so. Those that wander will do as their contract specifies, upon which they will have the free will to again do as they choose. My thought at this time is that I think I will take at least a few million years off 3D work

Funny thing... how I just came to fully realize that I am disconnecting in a way with the 3D already and am half residing in the other planes... causing this physical vehicle to begin to break down. My contract is done at the time of the harvest, though I, as many do, have the choice to remain. I have as of yet to determine what that choice will be though I think I will be leaving, returning to my family.

Very insightful Q and Pere. It makes me wonder if the steps of light themselves are illusion, and we are just in some simulation for the betterment of those who learn through us. Maybe it's all just part of the game.

"Walking the steps are light" is obviously just a metaphor.

It's really an escalator.

Has anyone else felt that the sun was hotter than usual? I have found that I can change my perspective as to making the sun feel hotter, or cooling it down a bit. Is it possible that this could be a preliminary form of the gradient of light as I like to call it. I take the hotness of the sun perception to a level that feels right for me. I can take it to where the light stings my skin, or cool my sensations down. I wonder if here in space/time if it's possible that this could be walking the steps.

So yeah, it's like an escalator, in a gradient form, slowly moving across the densities. I'm curious if anyone else can turn up the intensity they are feeling of the sun?