10-19-2010, 07:53 PM
It's a crude analogy, but to me that would be like exploding a grenade, then taking each piece of shrapnel and putting it back together to find that each piece is now its own grenade?
unity100 post 88 above Wrote:we cannot resume an 'academic' exchange with you. i have been waiting for your response to recent posts...
to which Quantum Wrote:As for posts you suggest several times here that you've put to me that were left unanswered? My great apologies if I've ever left even one unanswered. It seems like it has been me that has repeatedly openly invited you to answer? Ive read many times that you refuse to post to me (other than these personal posts it seems). Please re-direct me to any unanswered post and I would be more than happy to respond.
to which unity Wrote:... i cant think that you havent been able to understand that clearly. i cant imagine how you can confuse what i said, with what you understood above. you either skimmed, and misread it, again, or you are again deliberately 'not understanding' something you dont desire to understand.
Quantum Wrote:I leave my question open as to your last post as regards the concept of Multiple One Infinite Co-Creators? It is as interesting a concept and as unique as have been many of your others, for which I would ask the same, "sticking to the book of course," where in the LOO might you have arrived at this? Given this is a forum to further our understanding of the LOO, can you, would you, provide evidence of a single quote we might review?
Peace my friend, and feel free to redirect me to those unanswered posts I apologize for not answering. I'm sure I would be more than happy to.
Love and Light...
~ Q ~
(10-19-2010, 07:26 PM)βαθμιαίος Wrote: [ -> ](10-18-2010, 01:20 AM)unity100 Wrote: [ -> ]i very much think that they do. because, for they to come into being in any given octave, they (or whatever causing them to exist) had to exist before the octave in the first place.
This is intriguing but it conflicts with my understanding of Ra's description of the merging back into the Creator. ("At the seventh level or dimension, we shall, if our humble efforts are sufficient, become one with all, thus having no memory, no identity, no past or future, but existing in the all.") Do you feel that this idea is supported by the Ra material?
(10-19-2010, 08:19 PM)Quantum Wrote: [ -> ]..........
(10-19-2010, 07:53 PM)CircleofOne Wrote: [ -> ]It's a crude analogy, but to me that would be like exploding a grenade, then taking each piece of shrapnel and putting it back together to find that each piece is now its own grenade?
Ra Wrote:At the seventh level or dimension, we shall, if our humble efforts are sufficient, become one with all, thus having no memory, no identity, no past or future, but existing in the all.
(10-20-2010, 12:17 AM)unity100 Wrote: [ -> ]the octave entities merge with infinite intelligence, yet, they keep their nature, characteristics, biases that they will carry with themselves to the next octave.
(10-20-2010, 11:15 AM)βαθμιαίος Wrote: [ -> ]Ra Wrote:At the seventh level or dimension, we shall, if our humble efforts are sufficient, become one with all, thus having no memory, no identity, no past or future, but existing in the all.
(10-20-2010, 12:17 AM)unity100 Wrote: [ -> ]the octave entities merge with infinite intelligence, yet, they keep their nature, characteristics, biases that they will carry with themselves to the next octave.
Your statement and Ra's are mutually contradictory.
(10-20-2010, 01:15 PM)CircleofOne Wrote: [ -> ]I'd like to bring up a question about the concept of the octave that I've never seen addressed. Ra spoke of their knowledge in assuming that there were infinite octaves, but never clarified if this was horizontal or vertical in concept. Vertical being like a giant, infinite piano with a presumably infinite (unattainable?) progression upwards towards Oneness. Horizontal being the concept of infinite parallel creations. Or some other explanation that I haven't guessed.That's actually a very good question.. Horizontal octaves would fit wonderfully with the concept of possibility. Parallel worlds. That would really be another interesting analogy between the Law of One and physics.
(10-20-2010, 11:15 AM)βαθμιαίος Wrote: [ -> ]Ra Wrote:At the seventh level or dimension, we shall, if our humble efforts are sufficient, become one with all, thus having no memory, no identity, no past or future, but existing in the all.
(10-20-2010, 12:17 AM)unity100 Wrote: [ -> ]the octave entities merge with infinite intelligence, yet, they keep their nature, characteristics, biases that they will carry with themselves to the next octave.
Your statement and Ra's are mutually contradictory.
Ra Wrote:At the seventh level or dimension, we shall, if our humble efforts are sufficient, become one with all, thus having no memory, no identity, no past or future, but existing in the all.
(10-20-2010, 12:17 AM)unity100 Wrote: [ -> ]the octave entities merge with infinite intelligence, yet, they keep their nature, characteristics, biases that they will carry with themselves to the next octave.
(10-20-2010, 11:15 AM)βαθμιαίος Wrote: [ -> ]Your statement and Ra's are mutually contradictory.
(10-20-2010, 12:17 AM)unity100 Wrote: [ -> ]they arent. being one with 'all' doesnt mean 'single'. moreover, 'identity', 'past', 'future', are things that are specific to octaves. at the end of an octave, anything that is specific and defining regarding the multipleness experience of an octave would be left behind. ie - which planet have you evolved on. which galaxy you evolved in. what was the path you followed. did you have a name in 3d. what specie were you. what was the name (if there ever was a name) of your society complex. basically, anything regarding interactions of multiple-entities created by the multiple entities, would be left behind. "social" things in a sense, if you will. however, the characteristics of the spirit, the very differentiation in the nature of those elements, would be discovered, manifested, and carried to another octave.
these are the things we are discovering. this is what the discovery of multiple beingness, the 'creator will know itself' etc, are about.
(10-21-2010, 02:44 PM)Ali Quadir Wrote: [ -> ]Does Ra actually suggest anywhere that information is carried from one octave into the next? Or are we merely assuming this?
(10-21-2010, 02:44 PM)Ali Quadir Wrote: [ -> ]Does Ra actually suggest anywhere that information is carried from one octave into the next? Or are we merely assuming this?
Law of One, Book I Wrote:Questioner: We are concerned in this communication with the evolution of mind, body, and spirit. It seems to me that a good place to start would be the transition from the second to the third density, then to investigate in detail the evolution of third-density entities of Earth, paying particular attention to the mechanisms which help or hinder that evolution.
Do all entities make a transition from second to third density, or are there some entities who have never gone through this transition?
Ra: I am Ra. Your question presumes the space/time continuum understandings of the intelligent energy which animates your illusion. Within the context of this illusion we may say that there are some that do not transfer from one particular density to another, for the continuum is finite.
In the understanding which we have of the universe or creation as one infinite being, its heart beating as alive in its own intelligent energy, it merely is one beat of the heart of this intelligence from creation to creation.
In this context each and every entity of consciousness has/is/will experienced/experiencing/experience each and every density.
(10-20-2010, 11:24 PM)unity100 Wrote: [ -> ]however, the characteristics of the spirit, the very differentiation in the nature of those elements, would be discovered, manifested, and carried to another octave.
(10-21-2010, 03:16 PM)3D Sunset Wrote: [ -> ]Law of One, Book I Wrote:In this context each and every entity of consciousness has/is/will experienced/experiencing/experience each and every density.
(10-21-2010, 07:44 PM)βαθμιαίος Wrote: [ -> ]But Ra says "it would not be our awareness, but simply awareness of the Creator. In the Creator is all that there is. Therefore, this knowledge would be available."
So I agree with Quantum that the Creator carries forward what it learns in this octave, but individual entities don't do so as individuals because they have merged back into the Creator.
[quote='βαθμιαίος' pid='21617' dateline='1287704697']
I agree that this could be interpreted in the way you suggest, but it could also be interpreted to mean that they will experience every density because they are part of the one infinite being. Given Ra's other comments that I have posted above, I think the latter is the safer interpretation.
The Law of One, Book IV, Session 81 Wrote:Questioner: Why does Ra not have any knowledge of that which was prior to the beginning of this octave?
Ra: I am Ra. Let us compare octaves to islands. It may be that the inhabitants of an island are not alone upon a planetary sphere, but if an ocean-going vehicle in which one may survive has not been invented, true knowledge of other islands is possible only if an entity comes among the islanders and says, “I am from elsewhere.” This is a rough analogy. However, we have evidence of this sort, both of previous creation and
creation to be, as we in the stream of space/time and time/space view these apparently non-simultaneous events.
Law of One, Book III, Session 51 Wrote:The third group watching over this process is that group you call the Guardians. This group is from the octave above our own and serves in this manner as light bringers. These Guardians provide the precise emissions of light/love in exquisitely fastidious disseminations of discrimination so that the precise light/love vibration of each entity may be ascertained.
(10-21-2010, 02:44 PM)Ali Quadir Wrote: [ -> ]Does Ra actually suggest anywhere that information is carried from one octave into the next? Or are we merely assuming this?
Quote:I don't disagree that the gleanings of this octave are carried forward to the next. But Ra says "it would not be our awareness, but simply awareness of the Creator. In the Creator is all that there is. Therefore, this knowledge would be available."
So I agree with Quantum that the Creator carries forward what it learns in this octave, but individual entities don't do so as individuals because they have merged back into the Creator.
Quote:Questioner: We are concerned in this communication with the evolution of mind, body, and spirit. It seems to me that a good place to start would be the transition from the second to the third density, then to investigate in detail the evolution of third-density entities of Earth, paying particular attention to the mechanisms which help or hinder that evolution.
Do all entities make a transition from second to third density, or are there some entities who have never gone through this transition?
Ra: I am Ra. Your question presumes the space/time continuum understandings of the intelligent energy which animates your illusion. Within the context of this illusion we may say that there are some that do not transfer from one particular density to another, for the continuum is finite.
In the understanding which we have of the universe or creation as one infinite being, its heart beating as alive in its own intelligent energy, it merely is one beat of the heart of this intelligence from creation to creation.
In this context each and every entity of consciousness has/is/will experienced/experiencing/experience each and every density.
(10-22-2010, 09:29 AM)3D Sunset Wrote: [ -> ]I understand what you're saying, but I think there is a middle ground.
(10-22-2010, 09:29 AM)3D Sunset Wrote: [ -> ]Given this fact, it seems apparent that consciousnesses can cross Octaves. Also recall that our planet is actually under the protection of entities from the next octave.
(10-22-2010, 09:29 AM)3D Sunset Wrote: [ -> ]Would it not be rather straightforward for One with infinite intelligence to reconstitute a conscious entity in a new octave, at whatever stage of evolution of the entity IT desired, in order to allow the the consciousness to complete its evolutionary path, given the fact that it has brought all the knowledge of the entity with it into the new octave?
(10-22-2010, 10:49 AM)unity100 Wrote: [ -> ]this possibility, its existence being infinite, gives meaning to a concept; it means this octave will keep being here forever, even when the entities that constantly graduate from here continually pass to the next octave. so that, it will be still here, when a wanderer from the next octave comes back to 'bring light' for the harvest. it also resembles the higher self phenomenon. second, it seems to imitate the similar pattern of existence/manifestation in the individual level.
(10-22-2010, 10:49 AM)unity100 Wrote: [ -> ]however, what defines the ultimate identity, characteristic of that significator is ultimately the spirit that manifests in that significator. spirit, does not become null and void, at octave end. its nature, whatever it is, will stay. moreover, there will be infinite characteristic about that spirit to be discovered. so, it keeps existing and manifesting in another octave in infinity, manifesting another side of itself from its inner characteristics.
(10-22-2010, 09:16 PM)βαθμιαίος Wrote: [ -> ](10-22-2010, 09:29 AM)3D Sunset Wrote: [ -> ]Given this fact, it seems apparent that consciousnesses can cross Octaves. Also recall that our planet is actually under the protection of entities from the next octave.
Very true. However, it may be that in crossing octaves they don't pass through the timeless merging between octaves but rather think themselves straight to the desired location in the new octave. You don't disagree, do you, that entities that move into the timeless stage at the end of the octave from seventh density have left their identities behind and merged back into the Creator?
Quote:The One you are referring to here would be a Logos or similar, right? I agree it would be possible for such a One to do what you suggest but would it want to, I wonder? Let's take an entity that did not make it all the way through the last octave, when the polarity lesson was mover/moved. Would it really make sense to place such an entity in our third density, say, with its intense catalyst revolving around STO and STS? To me, it would make more sense to allow a new being to form itself out of the harvested, completed knowledge of the Creator of that octave.
Quote:(10-22-2010, 10:49 AM)unity100 Wrote: [ -> ]this possibility, its existence being infinite, gives meaning to a concept; it means this octave will keep being here forever, even when the entities that constantly graduate from here continually pass to the next octave. so that, it will be still here, when a wanderer from the next octave comes back to 'bring light' for the harvest. it also resembles the higher self phenomenon. second, it seems to imitate the similar pattern of existence/manifestation in the individual level.
Interesting idea. Ra does say that there is such a thing as true simultaneity.
Quote:It's not that the spirit becomes null and void at octave end. It's that it, along with all the other spirits of the octave, rejoins the plenum so that the Creator can move into the next octave informed by all the experiences of this one.
(10-23-2010, 02:05 PM)unity100 Wrote: [ -> ]where was your 'identity' before this octave ? entities have merged at the end of last octave too.
(10-23-2010, 04:13 PM)βαθμιαίος Wrote: [ -> ](10-23-2010, 02:05 PM)unity100 Wrote: [ -> ]where was your 'identity' before this octave ? entities have merged at the end of last octave too.
As I understand it, my identity, like all of ours, was the Creator. Each of our identities is as the grass which "withers and dies while the love and the light of the One Infinite Creator redounds to the very infinite realms of creation forever and ever, creating and creating itself in perpetuity."
(10-22-2010, 09:16 PM)βαθμιαίος Wrote: [ -> ]Hi 3D,
I'm afraid that, despite your best intentions, you may have jumped into another angels-dancing-on-the-head-of-a-pin thread. This one, like others, could come down to...
"Finites are real."
"Are not."
"Are too."
"Are not."
But perhaps I'm being too hasty in my analysis.
(10-22-2010, 09:16 PM)βαθμιαίος Wrote: [ -> ]Very true. However, it may be that in crossing octaves they don't pass through the timeless merging between octaves but rather think themselves straight to the desired location in the new octave. You don't disagree, do you, that entities that move into the timeless stage at the end of the octave from seventh density have left their identities behind and merged back into the Creator?
(10-22-2010, 09:16 PM)βαθμιαίος Wrote: [ -> ]The One you are referring to here would be a Logos or similar, right? I agree it would be possible for such a One to do what you suggest but would it want to, I wonder? Let's take an entity that did not make it all the way through the last octave, when the polarity lesson was mover/moved. Would it really make sense to place such an entity in our third density, say, with its intense catalyst revolving around STO and STS? To me, it would make more sense to allow a new being to form itself out of the harvested, completed knowledge of the Creator of that octave.
Law of One, Book I, Session 9 Wrote:Questioner: The guardians were obviously acting within an understanding of the Law of One in doing this. Can you explain the application of the Law of One in this process?
Ra: I am Ra. The Law of One was named by these guardians as the bringing of the wisdom of the guardians in contact with the entities from the Red Planet, thus melding the social memory complex of the guardian race and the Red Planet race. It, however, took an increasing amount of distortion into the application of the Law of One from the viewpoint of other guardians and it is from this beginning action that the quarantine of this planet was instituted, for it was felt that the free will of those of the Red Planet had been abridged.
Quote:18.18 Questioner: Can you tell me Yahweh’s purpose in making the genetic sexual changes?
Ra: I am Ra. The purpose 75,000 years ago, as you measure time, was of one purpose only: that to express in the mind/body complex those characteristics which would lead to further and more speedy development of the spiritual complex.
Quote:28.6 Questioner: When does the individualization or the individualized portion of consciousness come into play? At what point does individualized consciousness take over working on the basic light?
Ra: I am Ra. You remain carefully in the area of creation itself. In this process we must further confuse you by stating that the process by which free will acts upon potential intelligent infinity to become focused intelligent energy takes place without the space/time of which you are so aware as it is your continuum experience.
The experience or existence of space/time comes into being after the individuation process of Logos or Love has been completed and the physical universe, as you would call it, has coalesced or begun to draw inward while moving outward to the extent that that which you call your sun bodies have in their turn created timeless chaos coalescing into what you call planets, these vortices of intelligent energy spending a large amount of what you would call first density in a timeless state, the space/time realization being one of the learn/teachings of this density of being-ness.
Thus we have difficulty answering your questions with regard to time and space and their relationship to the, what you would call, original creation which is not a part of space/time as you can understand it.
Quote:13.7 Questioner: After this, what came next?
Ra: I am Ra. Awareness led to the focus of infinity into infinite energy. You have called this by various vibrational sound complexes, the most common to your ears being “Logos” or “Love.” The Creator is the focusing of infinity as an aware or conscious principle called by us as closely as we can create understanding/learning in your language, intelligent infinity.
Quote:13.12 Questioner: Can you tell me how intelligent infinity became, shall we say (I’m having difficulty with the language), how intelligent infinity became individualized from itself?
Ra: I am Ra. This is an appropriate question.
The intelligent infinity discerned a concept. This concept was discerned to be freedom of will of awareness. This concept was finity. This was the first and primal paradox or distortion of the Law of One. Thus the one intelligent infinity invested itself in an exploration of many-ness. Due to the infinite possibilities of intelligent infinity there is no ending to many-ness. The exploration, thus, is free to continue infinitely in an eternal present.
Category: Cosmology
(10-24-2010, 01:01 PM)βαθμιαίος Wrote: [ -> ]3D,
I think the guardians referred to in session 9 are the social memory complex Yahweh. See
Quote:18.18 Questioner: Can you tell me Yahweh’s purpose in making the genetic sexual changes?
Ra: I am Ra. The purpose 75,000 years ago, as you measure time, was of one purpose only: that to express in the mind/body complex those characteristics which would lead to further and more speedy development of the spiritual complex.
(10-24-2010, 07:56 PM)3D Sunset Wrote: [ -> ]I understand. Suffice it to say that I don't, but to explain would require much more than a snippet. You've obviously already formed your opinion.
(10-24-2010, 12:44 PM)unity100 Wrote: [ -> ]if, an entity is able to discover something about itself, it means that there were things which it didnt know about itself, before. and that means that, that entity had not had the knowledge/awareness of that aspect of its self, or whatever it was that it discovered.
this alone, invalidates the concept of 'one infinite all powerful entity', because, if there was something that is not known before, it means that entity was not as powerful before, hence, not 'all powerful. and, the fact that earlier it didnt contain the awareness of whatever it discovered, it means that this awareness was not found/contained in it before, and therefore it means that it is not infinite.
(10-24-2010, 12:49 PM)3D Sunset Wrote: [ -> ]One last thought on quarantines. In all of our languages and customs quarantines are used to protect others from possible infection. Throughout the Law of One, the term seems to be used in the opposite sense. That is, to protect us from inappropriate meddling from other higher dimensions. Is it possible that the quarantine serves the double purpose of protecting other portions of this Octave from being affected by the experiment?
(10-25-2010, 09:27 AM)Lavazza Wrote: [ -> ]Hey Unity, I'm not so sure about these last points. The logic employed here is just that- and I wouldn't be surprised if logic, especially as employed in third density, is not a logical (pun intended) way to proceed on these matters. I paint myself in a corner by offering this thought as, being in third density also, I cannot hope to make a countering point to your theory and find it more valid.
Quote:But regardless, here it is anyway: Your idea about there being no hope for a 'one infinite all powerful entity' disregards the possibility that, should such an entity exist, being infinite and all powerful, could if it chose to, forget that it was as such and play a game with itself for fun. This is I think probably much more accurate, although as I mentioned earlier I cannot make a convincing case for it, nor even do I find myself with enough time to gather appropriate Ra quotes. Nevertheless I offer it for yours, and others consideration. I have no vested interest of there being such an entity, in fact Pantheism is more my style. But I'm also not closed to the idea of there being a One Creator, or God. Very probably the truth is somewhere in the middle, or somehow both.