Bring4th

I still don't understand what the spirit complex is. Here the definition of Ra:

Quote:This spirit complex is the channel whereby the inpourings from all of the various universal, planetary, and personal inpourings may be funneled into the roots of consciousness and whereby consciousness may be funneled to the gateway of intelligent infinity through the balanced intelligent energy of body and mind

.(30.2)

Someone here knows some correspondence to spirit complex in the traditional esoteric teachings?

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About the effect of nuclear weapons, I always read that our spirit/consciousness/atman (I suposse all this is the same thing) is immortal. But, reading again, seems to me that which occurs is not the disintegration of spirit, but the separation of the mind, body and spirit:

Quote:Those who were destroyed, not by radiation, but by the trauma of the energy release, found not only the body/mind/spirit complex made unviable, but also a disarrangement of that unique vibratory complex you have called the spirit complex, which we understand as a mind/body/spirit complex, to be completely disarranged without possibility of re-integration. This would be the loss to the Creator of part of the Creator and thus we were given permission, not to stop the events, but to ensure the survival of the, shall we say, disembodied mind/body/spirit complex. This we did in those events which you mention, losing no spirit or portion or holograph or microcosm of the macrocosmic Infinite One.

(26.23)

And here, stretchs of Q'uo and Latwii about the subject:

Quote:I am Q’uo, and we might respond by suggesting that there is the release of energy of such a nature within the process of detonation of one of your nuclear weapons that not only does the physical material of your illusion suffer great disfiguration, but it is possible that the mind/body/spirit complex which might be referred to as the soul, if you will, can also undergo a type of disintegration if there is not the immediate aid of those able to harness this released energy and other energies for the preservation of the integrity of the mind/body/spirit complex.

[...]

I am Q’uo, and am once again with this instrument. Our choice of terminology was that most familiar to this instrument, and we apologize for using that which was not familiar to your own experience. The concept of the soul being affected by the release of the nuclear energy is that which we have described as the potential for the disintegration of those major components of what you have called the soul, and that is a being that is complex, a being which experiences the creation by means of utilizing the mind, the body, and the spirit. The effect of the release of the nuclear energy is to cause a disintegration, or an unbinding, shall we say, of mind, of body and of spirit, each from the other, so that the unified joining of them called a soul in your terms is no longer able to perceive experience and to focus conscious awareness.

Thus, there is the necessity for the healing or maintenance of the integrity or unity of these complexes during the release of nuclear energy. The maintenance of such integrity is the honor and duty of those who watch over the progress of your planet’s populations, and these entities have moved in this service in previous times of your planet’s experience in order that no soul might lose its integrity through the release of nuclear energy.

[...]

J: This separation of the mind/body/spirit complex, does this occur only, shall I say, at a ground zero type situation in a nuclear explosion, or is a large percentage of those entities which ultimately die as a result of a nuclear explosion, does the same separation take place in those entities?

I am Q’uo, and we find that, in general, as you would say, the most probability of the disintegration of the mind/body/spirit complex would be at that location you have described as ground zero, and would decrease as the distance from this point increased.

May we answer further, my brother?

J: Has there ever been a case in which the complexes of mind/body/spirit was beyond reorganization, as it was totally destroyed as a result of the nuclear device?

I am Q’uo, and we cannot answer as to yes or no, for we have not experienced all that there is to experience, and are unable to speak of that with which we are not familiar as either having observed or experienced such and such an event. We do not say that such is impossible. We can suggest that such is not probable, for always there are those who serve as observers, teachers and guides who take the necessary care for the preservation of those under their guidance.

Source: https://www.llresearch.org/transcripts/i..._1005.aspx

Quote:S: I have a question concerning nuclear explosions. What happens to an entity that is caught in one of these?

I am Latwii, and I am aware of your question, my sister. It is our assumption that your field of interest lies in the dissolution of [an] entity rather than the physical manifestation of nuclear explosion, and we shall attempt to answer the question on that perspective.

The entity which is within the most intense area affected by the disruption that you refer to as a nuclear explosion is affected thusly. The Word of the Logos Itself is disrupted, in the manner of a framework or structure on your planetary surface can be disrupted, to such a degree as to be rendered into particulate matter, and such is the effect upon an entity experiencing this dismantling, so to speak.

As the Logos is the force establishing the framework into a functional form within your particular density and galaxy, this disruption relinquishes the form, in effect canceling the structure which had been formed by the Logos. The raw material, so to speak, does not cease to exist, but rather ceases to retain its structured form, and to put it simply, returns to the Creators’ raw material pile, so to speak.


We would hasten to point out that this occurrence is not limited to those entities of your own density, but also of those lesser densities occupying the same area of effect. Therefore, we would emphasize the responsibility taken on by those who would detonate such a device, in that the entities affected are not only your people, but also those first and second-density entities who occupy the same localities. We would refer to this as food for thought.

Source: https://www.llresearch.org/transcripts/i..._0507.aspx

After all, if all this space/time is an illusion, how can a something physical cause the infeasibility of an entity? I really don't understand.

It seems they are explaining an entity as the mix of personal/planetary and various universal energies. So if a conglomeration of energies was separated into its parts due to this more powerful nuclear energy it seems it could not be reconstructed because that passage of time where the energies that acted upon it has passed.

I’m thinking astrological energies and the experiences of the entities lives could not be rewoven as they had been. Though all time being now I am not sure how there isn’t a big “save” feature but perhaps that is how those of Ra were allowed to interfere by “saving before” they were reduced to its parts.

The part that bothers me more and might just be semantics is where they liken the mind/bod/spirit complex to a soul. The soul I reach back to has so many experiences contained as m/b/s that I actually do not think of this me as a soul at all but the experience of a soul or an extension of a soul into the body.

Interesting

“how can a something physical cause the infeasibility of an entity? “

We kind of know that our sun is doing fusion, and it has both physical and metaphysical aspects..

A nuclear device could either be fusion or fission, so I guess it also has both physical and metaphysical influences..

Even orgonite generates scalar waves and that's metaphysical. Though that is beneficial.

(09-19-2019, 01:08 PM)Highrculling Wrote: [ -> ]“how can a something physical cause the infeasibility of an entity? “

We kind of know that our sun is doing fusion, and it has both physical and metaphysical aspects..

A nuclear device could either be fusion or fission, so I guess it also has both physical and metaphysical influences..

Ou "guess"? Ra outright stated as such.

(09-17-2019, 05:03 PM)Glow Wrote: [ -> ]It seems they are explaining an entity as the mix of personal/planetary and various universal energies. So if a conglomeration of energies was separated into its parts due to this more powerful nuclear energy it seems it could not be reconstructed because that passage of time where the energies that acted upon it has passed.

I’m thinking astrological energies and the experiences of the entities lives could not be rewoven as they had been. Though all time being now I am not sure how there isn’t a big “save”  feature but perhaps that is how those of Ra were allowed to interfere by “saving before” they were reduced to its parts.

The part that bothers me more and might just be semantics is where they liken the mind/bod/spirit complex to a soul. The soul I reach back to has so many experiences contained as m/b/s that I actually do not think of this me as a soul at all but the experience of a soul or an extension of a soul into the body.

Interesting

There's what you think of as a soul and what Ra explicitly refers to as a soul. If the 2 are inconsistent, Ra is likely the one who is closer to correct.

It was actually Q uo which isn’t an unconscious channel so to me not as infallible as Ra.

Also Quo on further reading states it as “what you would call a soul” implying it is only by our common terms little i is the soul.
Most people do consider little i there soul but once you identify with a smc you realize a larger portion of self. I onreread see they were not defining soul just using the definition most have on the planet thinking little i is them.

Ra explains that things that happen inside space/time impact and distort Intelligent energy that creates space/time (see the pyramid effect example). Our mind/body/spirit complex is part Intelligent Energy part Infinite Intelligence from Ra point of view. The mind/body/spirit complex is emerged in this illusion locked in the physical body vessel for incarnation duration. Just imagine how strong of a distortion you will feel on your mind/body/spirit complex beyond space/time when your vessel is disintegrated by a nuclear explosion in space/time.  Just imagine how strong of a distortion will cause a nuclear explosion in space/time on Intelligent Energy field creating space/time.  

I see this too as Loki does, if I understood you right Loki. I see the fission in space/time. The soul in time/space would seem to me kept in its integrity since after all there is no real separation between the soul and Creator

Infinite, in traditional esoteric teachings, I think I would see the spirit complex as the Atman in The Hindu tradition

I will try to to explain my understanding on this quote from Ra:

Those who were destroyed, not by radiation, but by the trauma of the energy release, found not only the body/mind/spirit complex made unviable,

In this first part Ra is referring at the fact that the ones destroyed by trauma of nuclear explosion died  on Earth BUT:

but also a disarrangement of that unique vibratory complex you have called the spirit complex,

their complex become disintegrated in three separate part mind complex, body complex, and spirit complex.  We humans call the mind/body/spirit complex simply spirit because we think from the space/time illusion point of view where our physical vessel is the very important part which is the home of the soul. From Ra we know that physical vessel is home for mind/body/spirit complex. In other words what Ra calls mind/body/spirit complex we call spirit.

which we understand as a mind/body/spirit complex, to be completely disarranged without possibility of re-integration.
In this last part Ra is saying I believe that disarrangement of that unique vibratory complex is understood at his level as  mind/body/spirit complex, to be completely disarranged without possibility of re-integration

It makes sense that they refer to it as "trauma of the energy release", trauma, in my understanding could be likened to an injury. And "disarrangement of that unique vibratory complex". And also "disintegration, or an unbinding, shall we say, of mind, of body and of spirit"

Quote:Definition of disintegration:
 the breaking down of something into small particles or into its constituent elements

Quote:Definition of trauma
a: an injury (such as a wound) to living tissue caused by an extrinsic agent
b: a disordered psychic or behavioral state

In my understanding, then, healing of such trauma, rearrangement, or reintegration is just as much possible.

To think that there are beings infinity loving that would give it their all to serve and heal other-selves from such an experience.

Quote:10.1 ▶ Questioner: I think it would clarify things for us to go back to the time just before the transfer of souls from Maldek; see how the Law of One operated with respect to this transfer and why this was necessary. What happened to Maldek— or the people on Maldek to cause them to lose their planet? How long ago did this occur?

Ra: I am Ra. The peoples of Maldek had a civilization somewhat similar to that of the societal complex known to you as Atlantis in that it gained much technological information and used it without care for the preservation of their sphere following to a majority extent the complex of thought, ideas, and actions which you may associate with your so-called negative polarity or the service to self. This was, however, for the most part, couched in a sincere belief/thought structure which seemed to the perception of the mind/body complexes of this sphere to be positive and of service to others. The devastation that wracked their biosphere and caused its disintegration resulted from what you call war.

The escalation went to the furthest extent of the technology this social complex had at its disposal in the space/time present of the then time. This time was approximately seven oh five, oh oh oh, seven hundred and five thousand [705,000] of your years ago. The cycles had begun much, much earlier upon this sphere due to its relative ability to support the first-dimensional life forms at an earlier point in the space/time continuum of your solar system. These entities were so traumatized by this occurrence that they were in what you may call a social complex knot or tangle of fear. Some of your time passed. No one could reach them. No beings could aid them.

Approximately six hundred thousand [600,000] of your years ago the then-existing members of the Confederation were able to deploy a social memory complex and untie the knot of fear. The entities were then able to recall that they were conscious. This awareness brought them to the point upon what you would call the lower astral planes where they could be nurtured until each mind/body/spirit complex was able finally to be healed of this trauma to the extent that each entity was able to examine the distortions it had experienced in the previous life/illusion complex.

After this experience of learn/teaching, the group decision was to place upon itself a type of what you may call karma alleviation. For this purpose they came into incarnation within your planetary sphere in what were not acceptable human forms. This then they have been experiencing until the distortions of destruction are replaced by distortions towards the desire for a less distorted vision of service to others. Since this was the conscious decision of the great majority of those beings in the Maldek experience, the transition to this planet began approximately five hundred thousand [500,000] of your years ago and the type of body complex available at that time was used..

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I then imagine that when the mind/body/spirit are aligned they act as a 'channel', a 'shuttle' or an 'image' of the Creator within, the channel can be asleep, not aware, conscious or aligned, but the Creator is omnipresent and all that there is.

(09-17-2019, 02:18 PM)Infinite Wrote: [ -> ]Someone here knows some correspondence to spirit complex in the traditional esoteric teachings?

I'm making a search, perhaps which Ra calls "spirit" is the same as "atman" in many esoteric sources of Earth. But all the sources says atman is immortal and eternal. Seems to me atman is each one of us as a hologram of the Creator, our essence. I still not found a answer of Ra which indicates that the spirit is this.

----EDIT----

Ra used the term as a hologram of Creator as can be seen in the itself answer I quoted on my first post:

Quote:Those who were destroyed, not by radiation, but by the trauma of the energy release, found not only the body/mind/spirit complex made unviable, but also a disarrangement of that unique vibratory complex you have called the spirit complex, which we understand as a mind/body/spirit complex, to be completely disarranged without possibility of re-integration. This would be the loss to the Creator of part of the Creator and thus we were given permission, not to stop the events, but to ensure the survival of the, shall we say, disembodied mind/body/spirit complex. This we did in those events which you mention, losing no spirit or portion or holograph or microcosm of the macrocosmic Infinite One.

(26.23)

And here answers of Q'uo:

Quote:Questioner: Yeah, I’d like to know if there’s a relationship between what we call spirit and what we call consciousness.

I am Q’uo. Indeed, my brother, there is a most close relationship between these concepts. Each entity here and all entities, indeed, are those portions of the one Creator that have been sent forth much like explorers, adventurers into the great unknown of creation to discover the relationship between the self and the creation and the Creator, to discover that these are all one. Each portion, then, has a need for the various vehicles and accoutrements of each density or level of the creation.

Within this third-density illusion, there is the necessity of the physical vehicle so that the spirit that is whole and perfect within each may have a means by which to experience that which this illusion offers concomitant with this physical vehicle and preceding and (inaudible) is the consciousness, the identity of each entity. The spirit, then, through the use of the mind, the consciousness, utilizes the physical vehicle and most particularly the energy centers or chakras of this physical vehicle which move upwards from the base to the crown located within the physical brain in order to form the incarnational patterns that each will travel in order to discover the Creator within and in order to give that Creator the experience of the self as a means for the Creator to know Itself.

Thus, the consciousness that each possesses is the dynamic rules by which each may co-create the illusion in which you move, that each may co-create the experience of giving and receiving love. These experiences are many, through many incarnations and many densities, for this creation is rich and varied and offers to each seeker the full reach of the one infinite Creator.

Is there a further query, my brother?

Questioner: So, is it that spirit and consciousness are one and the same thing, or are they closely related, or does one create the other, or what?

I am Q’uo, and am aware of your query, my brother. The spirit of each entity, the soul identity, if you will, is the core concept with which all begin. From this core concept, then, comes the creation of the consciousness that shall inhabit various physical vehicles, both the vehicles and the consciousness being the tools of the spirit or soul’s identity.

[...]

Questioner: Can you clarify your definition of the [word] “spirit”?

I am Q’uo, and am aware of your query, my brother. We call spirit that individuated portion of the one Creator that has chosen to take form within the physical universe in order to proceed upon the great evolutionary journey of seeking and knowing the one Creator.

Source: https://llresearch.org/transcripts/issue..._0803.aspx