(02-10-2011, 11:28 AM)Spectrum Wrote: [ -> ]I did not limit the above comment to 1600 BC, I applied the above comment to the time period of Genesis and Exodus (1600 BC onwards). You keep saying things I said which I didn’t say. Earlier in the thread you implied that I said Yahweh walked amongst third density mind/body/spirit complexes at the same time when Ra did, when I never said that either.
lack of information and detail in some comments you have made, causes one to assume things to complete the picture. inevitably, it ends up at such a point.
Quote:Book I, Session 18 February 4, 1981 Wrote:Questioner: When did Yahweh act to perform the genetic changes?
Ra: I am Ra. The Yahweh group worked with those of the planet you call Mars 75,000 years ago in what you would call the cloning process. There are differences, but they lie in the future of your time/space continuum and we cannot break the free will Law of Confusion.
The 2,600, approximately, time was the second time—we correct ourselves: 3,600—approximately, the time of attempts by those of the Orion group during this cultural complex; this was a series of encounters in which the ones called Anak were impregnated with the new genetic coding by your physical complex means so that the organisms would be larger and stronger.
It is very obvious that the verses in the Hebrew bible Genesis I referenced earlier refers to what Ra talks about here. Are you going to keep rejecting or twisting solid proof I provide you with?
you have just said that i was making up things as you have said it, however, went on to do it yourself.
there is no problem in regard to what i said in above. if you fall back and reread, you will see that i take yahweh's first major incident as moving of martian entities from mars, and giving them more capable bodies 75,000 years ago. this is said in the first part of the quote you have given as 'solid proof'.
the 'second time', you bolded, refers to the second time yahweh has worked with the entities of this planet in that fashion, as Ra tells us.
and it says this was a series of ENCOUNTERS in which anak was impregnated, in order to produce stronger offspring. in other quotes, we learn that yahweh has came to do this in incarnated form. and, with the word encounter we see above, we understand that this, was a process in which yahweh entities had impregnated anak tribe in encounters. this resembles alien encounter/pregnancy situations in modern literature.
basically yahweh came, and mated with anak tribe.
anak tribe was not located in egypt, but in caanan.
Quote:Ra tells us that Yahweh’s physical contact 3600 years ago with third density mind/body/spirit complexes provided the Orion entities with the opportunity to advance their own agenda and make serious inroads for the first time upon the planetary consciousness, and the Hebrew bible tells us that Yahweh told Moishe to lead the Israelites out of Egypt.
this is misplaced :
Quote:18.24 Questioner: Then Yahweh’s communications did not help or create what Yahweh wished for them to create. Is this correct?
Ra: I am Ra. The results of this interaction were quite mixed. Where the entities were of a vibrational sum characteristic which embraced oneness, the manipulations of Yahweh were very useful. Wherein the entities of free will had chosen a less positively oriented configuration of sum total vibratory complex, those of the Orion group were able for the first time to make serious inroads upon the consciousness of the planetary complex.
don asks about 'communications'. the quotes above and below refer to various incidents and situations regarding yahweh. however the above quote about serious inroads, does not refer to the physical interaction as you state so strongly.
you should not forget that at the time of these encounters, yahweh was also trying to create a group of entities to fight against orion group, taking up 'the good cause'. this is not done just by impregnating huge entities - communication in thought forms, or dissemination of thoughts furthering that agenda has to have made. not to mention that, after failure of this plan, yahweh left yahweh name and took on a meaning in the direction of 'it is coming', and started to disseminate positively oriented information, as Ra tells us. additionally they name this as the major thing that created to the forming of the armageddon concept.
therefore, concentrating on 'physical interaction' and naming it as the incident in which serious inroads were made, would be wrong.
the communications for fighting orion etc should be happening before the israelites left egypt. the fact that there was an entity and a movement resulting in the hebrews moving out of egypt tells us there was communication of all sorts existing at that time - a motive, a driving force had existed. this, may have been yahweh, tainted by orion, or both.
Quote:For statement like these I’m afraid you are going to have to provide proof. Can you provide any ancient literature referring to a ‘holy war’ which precedes Yahweh’s physical interaction to third density mind/body/spirit complexes. Right now you are starting to contradict Ra, since Ra explicitly tells us that it was Yahweh’s “walking among us” which provided the Orion members with the opportunity to encourage the distortion complexes amongst third density mind/body/spirit complexes of a ‘holy war’. This was the transition from poly-theism in Egypt to mono-theism, with the Israelites believing that their ‘God’, Yahweh, was the one true God, which justified in their eyes all their wars of conquest, because Yahweh told them to, but we know that Yahweh would never do that, so we know that it was an Orion influence manipulating and deceiving them into thinking it was Yahweh encouraging this.
firstly, as i have mentioned in the above block, there is nothing pertaining to 'physical contact' or 'walking among' leading to the serious inroads you speak of. what is being talked about, is communication. however, it is not limited to physical contact or genetic communication :
Quote:18.14 Questioner: Can you tell me how Yahweh communicated to Earth’s people?
Ra: I am Ra. This is a somewhat complex question.
The first communication was what you would call genetic. The second communication was the walking among your peoples to produce further genetic changes in consciousness. The third was a series of dialogues with chosen channels.
in case you notice, moses itself apparently was a channel. unfortunately one which received information from both sides.
as for proof of concept of holy war existing before this, you need to just look at the mesopotamian history, especially the period pertaining to sumerian, and before. priest-kings have been conducting wars in the name of their gods long before the period that was being discussed here.
in addition, egypt didnt transition to monotheism during the time of moses, or anything shortly thereafter. it was a polytheist culture until christianity.
Quote:Egyptian mythology and Egyptian myths and tales, was also lifted straight from Egyptian mythology by the Israelites and presented as their own in the Hebrew bible, which is to be expected, because the Israelites were actually Egyptian themselves, who were deceived by Orion members into thinking that they were ‘different’. What makes this deception even more interesting, is that modern day genetic studies have shown that the true Semitic gene is to be found amongst the peoples of the Arab world, including those of the West bank and the Gaza strip. Those Orion folks have been busy with their deception of the planting of the distortion complex of elitism and ‘being different’. But these are just interesting pieces of the puzzle, and bears no relation to the question at hand, although…everything is connected, and it gives a little insight into how great this deception really was/is, and how cunning those Orion folks really are.
now i understand your confusion, and your conclusions. you are actually thinking that israelites were egyptians.
israelites were not egyptians at any given point. they were, israelites, living in the caanan zone.
before the enslavement by egypt, they were called hebrews. this was not the first time they were enslaved as such, there was also the babylon incident. no surprise, in that, before the exodus, they were a nomadic people :
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hebrews
Quote:Hebrews (Hebrew: עברים or עבריים, Tiberian ʿIḇrîm, ʿIḇriyyîm; Modern Hebrew ʿIvrim, ʿIvriyyim) is an ethnonym used in the Hebrew Bible. It is mostly taken as synonymous with Israelites, especially in the pre-monarchic period when they were still nomadic, but in some instances it may also be used in a wider sense, referring to the Semitic nomads known to the Egyptians as Habiru or Shasu during the Egyptian Empire on the eve of the Bronze Age collapse.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israelite
this is why they were called the slave race. they werent egyptians.
apparently, starting from that misconception, you have made a lot of conclusions, including placing anak, a tribe the hebrews (at that point israelites) encountered during their exodus, in caanan, and conclusion of monotheism's start in egypt.
hebrews, and all their counterparts, are in semitic people's group, the genes of which you speak of :
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Semitic_peo...ic_peoples
as you can see, they are a group of nomadic, or semi nomadic people in general. despite not having any relation with egypt. it is also the reason why semitic genes are found in a lot of the planet's population, since they had been settling here and there, or moving about due to empires' conquests. (some being their own empires, as in the case of islam empire)
Quote:Here you are again contradicting Ra. Ra explicitly states that it was Yahweh’s physical intervention 3600 years ago, and not Yahweh’s intervention 75 000 years ago that enabled the Orion entities to for the FIRST time make serious inroads into the planetary consciousness.
again, it says communication, not genetic impregnancy. you seem to be directly concluding physical contact, which is wrong at that point. communication was also going about, especially after failure of anak incident, by yahweh, and orion. not to mention that, orion directly talked to moses.
Quote:I feel like I need to caution you about making assumptions unity 100, you know what they say about assumptions. Although I know this is not an assumption on your part, you are so hell-bent on being right, that you are grabbing at every grass stalk you can, to ‘prove’ your point. This is actually a twist on your part, and it’s becoming rather ridiculous now.
assumptions are on your side, not mine. you assumed hebrew people, were egyptians, and apparently have moved to a lot of points from there, from anak tribe to monotheism. not to mention that, you have assumed word communication to be pregnancy, despite there were explicitly stated that there are 3 means of communication.
i am not 'grabbing at every grass stalk'. i am trying to put important concepts in regard to this subject, at their fine points. for as you can easily see, assumptions or misrememberings or misconceptions cause a lot of wrongful conclusions. ranging from placing monotheism in a culture which didnt have much to do with it until a thousand and a half year later, to transplanting a totally different culture set as another, which leads to a more important misconception to conclude that concept of holy war was not there before moses incident and 1600 bc events.
however i am seeing you are being rather aggressive, and apparently straying from discussing the subject.
Quote:What does Ra tell us about the results of Yahweh’s intervention with third density mind/body/spirit complexes 75 000 years ago?
No elitism and holy wars being mentioned above. Ra then proceeds:
results of yahweh's transfer of martians in cloned bodies 75,000 years ago, was a population of entities that was already in quite different bodies than the earth populations at that point, smarter, walking more erect, able to talk and think sharper.
http://lawofone.info/results.php?session...=1&ss=1#13
refer to various points about intelligent, smarter or stronger entities having tendency to feel elite in sections regarding yahweh, or orion.
rest, we already have discussed above.
however, if you go as far to combine quo sessions regarding this mars transfer, you will see bluntly how this transfer affected the planetary sphere right after its happening, especially leading to the adoption of bellicose actions and warlike manners, and separation.
which, are told by Ra to have shortened the average lifespan of earth entities from 900 years to 700 years at the end of 2nd cycle, even at the start.
Quote:I’m honestly starting to wonder how much proof a person must provide you with, for you to actually admit that you might have been mistaken.
clear and precise portrayal of the situation is enough to make me say i was mistaken. this has happened before. however, what you bring, is not anything as such, as pictured in the above points and issues.
normally i would just skip all this discussion, saying that i didnt see any value in continuing the exchange. however, in this case, there are serious misconceptions you are keeping, which leads you to make misplaced conclusions. and in addition to your ponderings, these may mislead the people who are not interested or researched in the subject while reading them, and hence, i am responding.
Quote:No, this is not true. Can you provide any historical proof that any third density mind/body/spirit complex who were part of the elite, were referred to as “the sons of God”. Only higher density social memory complexes “walking among us” in the flesh, were referred to as “sons of God”, that being Yahweh and Jeshosuah (Jesus), that we know of. Ra explained to us that higher density beings “walking among us” in the physical, were always deified, and that was the damage being caused due to that erroneous distortion complex.
all pharaohs were sons of gods, or particular god, long before the period you are speaking of. moreover, most of the priest-kings appearing in city states post-neolithic period, were named as prophets, sons of gods, only mediums in between gods and the people. until the separation of the temples and military power in sumer, priest was the king, religious leader, everything of the society. after that point, the military kings have had to again assume the authority through claiming of son of god concept.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sumerian_religion
sumerian history goes way before that.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sumer
maybe you are way too immersed in biblical or hebrew knowledge or terminology, and tend to see everything through the eyes of that information or something. however, it is easy to notice that the concept was already there before 1600 bc incident, even if the concept and words 'son of god' was not directly used. (and it was, as in egypt).
Quote:[quote]first, 'sons of god' is a term that is used interchangeably for any group that is considered elite. this even goes for later situations, like in the case of jeshosuah.
Jehoshuah (Jesus) was hardly elite, in fact, quite the contrary! He opposed elitism and power, which Judas tried to enforce upon him, resulting in his own death.
Ra tells us a lot about Jehoshuah (Jesus):
Jehoshuah (Jesus) was so opposed to elitism and power, that he insisted on entering Jerusalem on the back of a donkey, to prove his point.
the gap in between what's being said in my quote above, and what you have responded, is appalling. i dont know what you are even objecting to.
jesus of nazareth is still named as son of god. (LATER stages part of my sentence). there is nothing in my sentence that says he himself referred to himself as son of god.
moreover, i have already established the concept of son of god existing before hebrews had their exodus in 1600 bc.
i am beginning to think that, you are a biblical or hebrew inclined person, with a religion from those parts, and you are making a lot of misconceptions and conclusions while rushing into the perceived defense of the concepts you hold dear.
Quote:Nope. Genesis says:
..........
Ra told us that the result of Yahweh’s sexual interaction with third density mind/body/spirit complexes produced giants, so are you saying that Ra was wrong, and that you are in fact right, and that giants were around before Yahweh's intervention./quote]
you are basing evidence on bible.
if we link up your genesis quote with what you say in the above context about Ra, the giant incident (hence anak) had to happen "when men began to multiply on the face of the earth", and not in 1600 BC.
there is no linkage in between genesis, and what you say in the above quote block.
[quote]Are you going to contradict Ra again, and say that there were giants before Yahweh “walked amongst them”?
at that point, i dont even know what you are replying to, and what you are saying. i didnt at any point say anything as such.
i had had said that the anak incident apparently happened in caanan, before the hebrews arrived with their exodus, according to historical timeline and records. you had had attempted to place anak in egypt, not to mention made hebrews egyptians. then proceeded to give a quote from genesis saying that there were giants when men had began to multiply on earth, despite that contradicting what you were trying to say afterwards, and even contradicting yourself in the above quote too, since you are accusing me of saying that there were giants before yahweh walked amongst them. the genesis quote you name speaks of the times 'men beginning to multiply on the face of earth'.
Quote:Look very carefully at the following verse, I will bold the area of interest for you:
Genesis 6:4 Wrote:There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.
at this point i am rather sure that you are a religiously inclined person.
you are giving 'evidence' from genesis, whereas hebrews themselves say in their torah that their scouts have met anak while scouting ahead of moses' group ....
Quote:So, since Jahweh’s initial “walking amongst them” in Egypt, the offspring of that “walking amongst them” continues afterwards…
yahweh didnt walk in egypt, and produced any giants. you cannot show bible as evidence to it.
Quote:Firstly, proof of your statement would be appreciated. Since we do not have ancient Egyptians with us today who can elaborate on their art, we are only left to our own subjective impressions.
what evidence ? this is common egyptology knowledge. in all cases in which an entity taller/bigger than someone else is portrayed, it is the pharaoh or a god. if gods and pharaoh are represented in the same scene, pharaoh is smaller than god, and bigger than any other human. in scenes where only pharaoh exists, it is bigger.
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&sourc...i=&aql=&oq=
we dont have egyptians today with us. we have science.
here is a particular link for easy reading
http://www.epiceras-ancientegypt.com/anc...n_art.html
Quote:Tell tale signs
Ancient Egyptian art was consistent in nature. Some of the rules that were followed were:
* Representations of pharaohs were larger than others in a scene to demonstrate their importance.
* Statues in the sitting positions had hands on knees.
* Statues of Gods always showed the appropriate animal head. For example Anubis was always represented with a jackal's head.
* Male statues were darker than female ones.
Art in ancient Egypt was meant to capture life as it was at the time. So much so that it was more important to complete the piece in a time frame than it was to perfect it.
moreover, art in egypt is representative of idealized standardized concepts, not what you directly see. the only era in which people were portrayed or sculptored as they were, was akhenaton's era.
Quote:So, any depictions of giants I provide you with, you will refute. That, after you said earlier that the Egyptians were renowned for documenting anything of significance. So if the Egyptians depicted giants in their art, you will not accept it as evidence. Well, then you will also agree then, if we accept your logic, then all Zecharia Sitchin's theories are wrong, since his work is based on the Sumerian tablets (art). Then I would imagine that according to your logic none of Graham Hancock's theories are valid, because he based them on cave drawings and other art. Don't you understand that all we have to go by, with regard to these ancient civilizations, is their art?
On top of that, in the depiction that I provided, all indications are that the 'giant' depicted is not a Pharaoh, since the Pharaohs wore very distinctive clothing to distinguish them from others.
i cannot say anything for zecharia sitchin. i wasnt the one placed anak before 1600 bc, yet you have accused me of doing that, after giving not only genesis quote for placing them before 1600 bc, but also now theories of someone else for placing them in sumer ? i dont know what you are saying at this point even.
any tall/bigger creature given in an egyptian scene is either pharaoh, or a god. in later egyptian phases, high priest can be represented bigger than other people, but shorter than pharaoh.
and the picture you have just linked as proof, is the picture of another pharaoh, with his scepter, and ankh, symbols of pharanoic authority and power :
![[Image: 220px-Pharaoh.svg.png]](http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/4/43/Pharaoh.svg/220px-Pharaoh.svg.png)
i am beginning to think you are concluding a lot of things with scant information/knowledge on the subject.
Quote:On top of that, in the depiction that I provided, all indications are that the 'giant' depicted is not a Pharaoh, since the Pharaohs wore very distinctive clothing to distinguish them from others.
![[Image: egyptian.jpg]](http://img69.imageshack.us/img69/2189/egyptian.jpg)
the depiction you provided before, and above, is another pharaoh. it seems that, it is very probably akhenaton even, who was often pictured receiving blessings from sun disk aton, with his beloved wife :
http://www.google.com/images?um=1&hl=en&...i=&aql=&oq=
leaving aside that headpiece definitely being the headpiece of pharaohs, the pharaoh in question is even easily identifiable to akhenaton. it seems you made another 'definitive' conclusion before having sufficient information on the subject.
in a search i have made in order to identify the exact source of the picture to determine exact identity of the pharaoh, i have seen that the image you link below
http://img69.imageshack.us/img69/2189/egyptian.jpg
comes up in a lot of conspiracy sites talking about annunaki, shown as proof. along with various other irrelevant parchments/fresks being shown as proof due to odd skeletal/skull structure of the entity shown, who happens to be akhenaton - he was born with a certain condition that caused his skull and features to be elongated.
Quote:There are many considerations here. Firstly, the giants that were the offspring of Yahweh, were the ones who bought into the distortion complex of elitism, and would therefore have been amongst the ones who left Egypt. Since the Hebrew bible tells us the tale of David and Goliath that happened later after they left Egypt, we can take a clue from this, that these giant offspring were amongst those who left Egypt.
i cant even follow you here. you are showing hebrew bible as proof for anak being in egypt, despite hebrew torah says david - goliath event happened AFTER they left egypt (which you yourself also say), AND torah also says that hebrew scouts encountered anak while scouting ahead of moses' party ?
Quote:Since we know that the ones who bought into the distortion complex of elitism were the Israelites, and not the Egyptians who stayed behind, the possibility that one of these giants, who were the enemies of the Egyptians, would have been mummified by the Egyptians, were quite slim, because mummification was reserved for those who the Egyptians honored. The Egyptians would not have mummified an enemy.
Also, Ra told us that the pyramids and their original benevolent intent were later used for royalty and housing the mummies of royalty (STS behaviour), much in opposition to the original intent. Since Ra built the pyramids thousands of years before Yahweh “walked amongst” them, and producing giant offspring, and Ra told us that the pyramids quickly fell into the hands of the elite, those mummies were most likely the mummies prior to Yahweh’s appearance, since it was thousands of years until Yahweh arrived.
your quote above is wrong in multiple points, however i wont elaborate, for it will take a lot of additional referencing. not to mention your train of thought is self propelling, concluding a lot of things on false information obtained from extreme conspiracy sites, not historical records.
Quote:I don’t think we are in disagreement about the fact that the offspring of the Anak were around long after the Israelites left Egypt, we are disagreeing on when they made their first appearance, which, as we have established, was when the Israelites were still in Egypt.
But you don’t accept any proof that I provide, not even Ra's own words, which I can do nothing about.
excuse me, there is nothing to accept. you have showed torah as proof, which contradicts your claim, also 2 pictures of pharaohs, one of which was easily identifiable to akhenaton, of which you were sure of not being a pharaoh, and a giant. not to mention you lacked knowledge of egyptian art and depiction of pharaohs.
Quote:By the way, the Yahweh/Orion “stint” have never seized, as you can see when you follow the developments in the Middle East.
it havent seized ? almost all societies, including egypt, collapsed due to wars and strife after 1600 BC, numerous empires rose and fell, justified by gods and conquest, and as early as persians, holy war concept had took on hold en masse, not only among hebrews. after that, a lot of other episodes came, one of which being crusades, which engulfed more places than middle east. not to mention the islamic crusade stint, which happened before christian crusades, and affected 3 continents itself. not to mention that after that the region remained oppressive, with slavery even continuing today, with rigid clan structure and control schemes based on elitism.
currently, since a time, earth is only accepting high frequency or already 4d entities. these are changing the nature of all societies. you cannot link the change in the last century, to something irrelevant.
Quote:And since Ra told us in the same session that the second time was 3600 years ago, and that the second time was by walking amongst your peoples,
and since we know that Moishe talked to Jahweh whilst still in Egypt, and we now know that Moishe interacted with Jahweh in the flesh, as opposed to any other means, like telepathically or through channelling, we know that the the Anak giants first appeared in Egypt.
Contemplating this whole thing now, it's most likely that Moishe (Moses) was one of these giants (Anak) himself, because Orion would not have been able to sell the elitism distortion to him if he wasn't 'one of them'.
we dont know yahweh interacted with moses in flesh. there is nothing regarding that. that's your conclusion. maybe you are confusing '3600 years ago' with 3600 bc. 3600 years ago, is 1600 BC.
moreover you made even moses anak, and a giant.
....................
with all due respect, you dont have enough information on history in order to discuss in this detail on this subject. there were numerous conclusions, and even trains of thought produced from incorrect information, and leaning on christian bible.
i find the situation unproductive. if the situation persists in your next reply (if you choose to continue) i may need to politely opt out of replying.
So since Sumerian religion precedes Judaism, I think we have to start looking into whether this was also lifted from another religion by the Hebrew bible, like the Sumerian deluge myth.![[Image: 08010168.jpg]](http://www.lessing-photo.com/p3/080101/08010168.jpg)
![[Image: egyptian_art.bmp]](http://www.50inchverticaljump.com/egyptian_art.bmp)