Bring4th

The Lightbulb Conspiracy aka Pyramids of Waste
Documentary on planned obsolescence (2010)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I5DCwN28y8o

This is why I scoff at "green cars" and "excuse our mess, we are making our building greener" and "replace your roof with new energy saving products" and "we are producing computers with the lowest carbon footprint".

Replace it. ad infinitum.

(09-08-2011, 09:18 PM)3DMonkey Wrote: [ -> ]This is why I scoff at "green cars" and "excuse our mess, we are making our building greener" and "replace your roof with new energy saving products" and "we are producing computers with the lowest carbon footprint".

Replace it. ad infinitum.

Would not be so bad if there was no waste involved.

(09-08-2011, 09:12 PM)zenmaster Wrote: [ -> ]The Lightbulb Conspiracy aka Pyramids of Waste
Documentary on planned obsolescence (2010)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I5DCwN28y8o

so its better not to spend 1/4 of the energy for same or more illumination ?

(09-08-2011, 09:41 PM)unity100 Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-08-2011, 09:12 PM)zenmaster Wrote: [ -> ]The Lightbulb Conspiracy aka Pyramids of Waste
Documentary on planned obsolescence (2010)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I5DCwN28y8o

so its better not to spend 1/4 of the energy for same or more illumination ?

I think they are making a case that there is no technical reason why a bulb can't last longer with same illumination and energy requirements.

I like this better. http://www.time.com/time/magazine/articl...25,00.html

(09-08-2011, 09:47 PM)zenmaster Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-08-2011, 09:41 PM)unity100 Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-08-2011, 09:12 PM)zenmaster Wrote: [ -> ]The Lightbulb Conspiracy aka Pyramids of Waste
Documentary on planned obsolescence (2010)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I5DCwN28y8o

so its better not to spend 1/4 of the energy for same or more illumination ?

I think they are making a case that there is no technical reason why a bulb can't last longer with same illumination and energy requirements.

a bulb cant last longer with same illumination with energy requirements due to the technology of carbon filament incandescent lightbulbs.

if they are to improve their technology, they are free to keep their incandescent bulbs as much as they want. however, they dont want to do that. they just want that technology around, because some private interests in usa have made sufficient propaganda to equate that bulb business with 'freedom'.

we are using energy saving bulbs for a long time now in turkey, and the energy saving they provide is indeed phenomenal. it cuts the energy spending of any bulb it replaces to 1/4th.

i see a lof of this incandescent bulbs are freedom crap online, and it seems to be a problem mainly in america, and whomever i see arguing for these are generally right wing people.

I think for the use in the movie, it's more like a metaphor intended to express the idea of some manufactured device lasting shorter than possible due to market control rather than a technological reason.

well, lobbies and pro-industry provoked groups say a lot of things. all of them evaluate to total nonsense.

there is no 'market control' here, and the energy saver bulbs are much more expensive (like 15 times). and yet people but them instead of the incandescent ones.

and i dont remember incandescent bulbs outlasting energy savers through 10 years or more usage now. all in all incandescent ones have a higher chance of randomly going poof when you switch the light on.

it is just usual american private interest lobby making and propaganda. 'lobby company' filth, filling internet with fud. even 5 years ago there were private 'grassroots groups' set up behind websites that apparently had hundreds of thousands of subscribers, which turned out to be automated scripts and dud accounts set up by lobby groups - in the anti net neutrality propaganda.

this is no different. give some money to a lobby corporation, and they fill internet with crap like this.

unity, you are a ray of sunshine.

(09-09-2011, 12:08 AM)zenmaster Wrote: [ -> ]unity, you are a ray of sunshine.

i see that the point to cut discussing with you has come in this thread too. thank you for your ever so helpful sarcasm. its rare on the internet.

(09-09-2011, 12:05 AM)unity100 Wrote: [ -> ]and i dont remember incandescent bulbs outlasting energy savers through 10 years or more usage now.

I can't get a year out of the saver bulbs. There must be a limit to the hours of use, since I leave them on 24 hours a day as night lights.

God I love this 3d thing, I hope it lasts for hundreds and hundreds of years!

(09-09-2011, 12:35 AM)Pickle Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-09-2011, 12:05 AM)unity100 Wrote: [ -> ]and i dont remember incandescent bulbs outlasting energy savers through 10 years or more usage now.

I can't get a year out of the saver bulbs. There must be a limit to the hours of use, since I leave them on 24 hours a day as night lights.

yes, if you continually use they pop too. but if you leave an incandescent bulb on 24 hours ... boy. they pop in a jiffy. especially in summer.

I remember there was big campaign in Cuba a few years ago to switch to these energy saver bulbs by Fidel in person as I read once the savings were enormous.

I think it is a fundamental error of the materialist, profiteering paradigm.

Just how to adjust human paradigms is not entirely clear either. How to maintain freewill, STO-STS in harmony throughout all life and provision of a worthy game of life. ... I absolutely loved Ra's comments on the words associated with 'game'. Using that quick lookup website by member B-something_____ (can't find name right now, but thanks, got to study here again, too busy now).

(09-08-2011, 09:24 PM)zenmaster Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-08-2011, 09:18 PM)3DMonkey Wrote: [ -> ]This is why I scoff at "green cars" and "excuse our mess, we are making our building greener" and "replace your roof with new energy saving products" and "we are producing computers with the lowest carbon footprint".

Replace it. ad infinitum.

Would not be so bad if there was no waste involved.

Yes. But the waste is so high. Like getting a new roof because of "hail damage", but really because it is "free".


This movie brings something else back to mind. That is my disgust of the patent and laws thereof. I'm watching, thinking that engineers who wanted to could go out and make the superior product if they chose to. Then, I reminded myself that we have laws against using other peoples' ideas. Ideas are property. Patents are horrible.

I wonder when you folks refer to "energy saver" lights are you talking about LED or Fluorescent? Even though the fluorescents save energy when used, they pose other environmental challenges during disposal as they contain mercury, should be disposed of as environmental hazard, but rarely are. Wondering if those in countries other than the US have experience with this?

(09-09-2011, 11:46 AM)Ruth Wrote: [ -> ]I wonder when you folks refer to "energy saver" lights are you talking about LED or Fluorescent? Even though the fluorescents save energy when used, they pose other environmental challenges during disposal as they contain mercury, should be disposed of as environmental hazard, but rarely are. Wondering if those in countries other than the US have experience with this?

I was wondering that too. I use fluorescent. When the go out, every time, there is melting and brown burns at the base. I toss them out with the garbage. I should probably go back to the others for my own safety.

Although, I am using a couple of the LED lights that look like regular bulbs with the little tetrahedron of LEDs. The light levels are much lower.

I discovered that a hardware chain (Orchard Supply Hw) takes expired fluorescents, so now I drop them when I go there. They also take old dry cell batteries, so I drop them into a jar to take there when it fills up. So make inquiries!

As an engineer, I love efficiency. A few CFLs died prematurely, but most go a long time. I look forward to the LED types getting lower in price, just as LED flashlights have already.

(09-09-2011, 01:54 PM)kycahi Wrote: [ -> ]I discovered that a hardware chain (Orchard Supply Hw) takes expired fluorescents, so now I drop them when I go there. They also take old dry cell batteries, so I drop them into a jar to take there when it fills up. So make inquiries!

As an engineer, I love efficiency. A few CFLs died prematurely, but most go a long time. I look forward to the LED types getting lower in price, just as LED flashlights have already.

The boating industry has some very interesting LED technology developing. I would love to put my home lighting on a solar cell trickle to a battery power, completely LED. Just because it sounds cool, and no other reason.

I dream of living on a sailboat, and it baffles me why we can't use the same techniques for homes.

(09-09-2011, 11:46 AM)Ruth Wrote: [ -> ]I wonder when you folks refer to "energy saver" lights are you talking about LED or Fluorescent? Even though the fluorescents save energy when used, they pose other environmental challenges during disposal as they contain mercury, should be disposed of as environmental hazard, but rarely are. Wondering if those in countries other than the US have experience with this?

http://www.google.com/search?q=osram%20t...20&bih=990

these are what i call energy savers. and these were what was mandated here a while ago.

[attachment=459]

This is what they look like when they go out. Is this safe?