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Cyan

I seem to remember somewhere that the first step of the negative adept is to try to capture or enslave their higher self, or some such.

I cant remember it exactly but failing that.

What are your thoughts on the first steps to be taken by a negative adept at 4thD early?

Other areas seem more clear to me so it appear slikely that this version of my psyche where this question feels relevant would be most helped by said information.

Thanks and L/L

3DMonkey

I suppose that makes sense. The Negative Adept would begi n by disregarding the wisdom of the HS and claim their dominance over self. Like a brat child. They cut off any source of advice.
sometimes i think i'm a negative inept.
Cyan, I am not sure that you can capture or enslave your Higher Self, as it is you in the future. How is it possible to capture and enslave yourself in the future? But then who knows... Intelligent Infinity works in mysterious ways.

I would imagine that as a newly graduated negative entity, adept or not, coming into fourth density negative, you will start at the bottom of the foodchain so to speak, and will have to work yourself up. Negative space/time is probably very, very hierarchical in its environment, so as a newbie, you will be at the bottom, taking orders from everybody and doing as you are told. Then depending on your abilities to control and separate your self from the self, you will learn how to control and separate your self from other selves.

Brittany

The first step is to establish one's place in the chain of dominance. In the world I remember, the social hierarchy revolved around a challenge system. There were certain requirements that had to be met before you could challenge someone, but in general if the guy on the bottom of the totem pole wanted to take on the guy at the top he was welcome to give it a shot. Whoever won assumed the highest rank between the two challengers. Therefore, if said guy from the bottom of the totem pole somehow managed to defeat the guy at the top, he would acquire the top position. If you lost a challenge you automatically became the subordinate of the one you lost to. How much farther you fell after that depended on how many others might want to get in on your moment of weakness, and how well you could defend yourself from further challenges.

You might also find this helpful:
http://lightoftheshadow.wordpress.com/se...-02-29-12/
http://lightoftheshadow.wordpress.com/se...-03-04-12/
How can you "enslave" your Higher Self? Any attempts to do so in this vastly limited plane of existence would be laughable to the highest and most perfect aspect of yourself which, mind you, exists in a dimension far beyond our comprehension. Your Higher Self programs your life experiences and what catalyst you as a lesser avatar of it will face in this life. I'm pretty sure a conscious and visceral "F YOU HIGHER SELF, YOU MY HO NOW" directed to your Higher Self will result in some pretty punishing catalyst.

For starters, there is ABSOLUTELY NO REASON to seek to "enslave" your Higher Self, when there is a mutual serving going on between you/all parallel you's and it anyways. If a negative adept sought to pursue this, then they should not be considered an adept. A true adept would be aware that it is moreso a matter of comprehension that while you are distinct from your Higher Self in that you are subjected to this illusion and it is not, it still intricately works with you, and at any time it may manifest in your vessel and it may channel through you, possibly at will with enough discipline and understanding.

3DMonkey

"I'm pretty sure a conscious and visceral "F YOU HIGHER SELF, YOU MY HO NOW" directed to your Higher Self will result in some pretty punishing catalyst"

I think this is exactly what STS is. "punishing catalyst". You don't have to control what you consider the Higher Self. You just need to suppress the positive feed from HS.

I also think it is difficult for us to comprehend what highly polarized STS is. We are all STO. Why else do we try so damn hard for each other? But seriously, the true STS is deep into control. So deep, we can forget what they are like.
STS is not punishing catalyst. STS simply entails acting from a place of greed, manipulation, megalomania, pursuing self-gratification at the expense of others, sizing up the value of others in an attempt to view how you may derive usage from another as though they were some sort of reservoir of energy that the STS adherent may freely drink from.

Suppressing the "positive feed" from the Higher Self, while not a particularly wise choice of action at all, is still within the boundaries of Free Will. If you pay careful attention, you will be able to see which route is the 'best' to take and is the one laid out for you by the Higher Self and the various ways in which your Higher Self plays a key role in things. In my case of one who has absolutely resolved to polarize STO and seek the light be serving others, the best determined route for is the one where the primary intention is to do good for someone, help another, put another before oneself.

For example: I need to go to the supermarket for a family member. The walk sign is flashing for me to cross the street. Suddenly I have the thought of going to a deli and buy a cigarette or something first. The street sign leading there will not allow me to walk, and cars are passing by. If I were to pursue the path of serving another before myself, my path will be very fluid, easy, and clear if I choose to cross the street to the supermarket. Now, if I were to want to make a detour and go to the grocery instead I would be performing several 'unskillful' acts: I would be choosing to gratify myself first, and even worse I'd be ingesting poison into my body. My Higher Self is, at this point, trying to convey to me that this path is not conducive to my true will by the no-walk sign, the many cars preventing me from progressing further, and the fact that I'd have to wait there for approximately one minute. Perhaps in that one minute, if I decided to go the "lesser path" of this junction, I am afforded the opportunity of an entire minute to rethink my decision and head back onto the 'best' route.

One folly of this forum is the tendency to seem to over-conceptualize and compartmentalize the notion of STO and STS. These terms were chosen by Ra, and were stated as both being valid, because they are a highly evolved being and at their current nexus they have transcended polarity. It is important to filter these terms and water them down so to speak as to better apply them to our current density of illusion. STO = seeking to help out another in any way for any reason, STS I have already described above, greed, manipulation, etc. So 3DMonkey, if you would seek to comprehend the mentality of one who is "highly polarized STS", look towards the ones who many term "the Illuminati" or "The Powers That Be" for a prime example. The most cold, calculating and manipulative people are somewhat synonymous with "STS".

STO would be Buddha, very genuinely humble individuals, etc. Pretty much anybody who finds enjoyment and bliss in being able to help anybody out. The next time you ask a random person who seems to be having trouble with something, "Hey, do you want/need any help?" you are polarizing in the STO path.

3DMonkey

I think, simply, STS is telling your conscience to F*** Off
Telling your conscience to f- off isn't even a good way of serving yourself, unless you're one of those emo creatures and somehow find enjoyment in belittling yourself, lol. Tongue

Brittany

I think the issue here is assuming that there is a standard of conscience. Plenty of people have done terrible things while fully believing they are serving the greater good. What I believe to be morally acceptable could differ vastly from your own moral code, and who is going to step in and say which is right? The negative perspective seems to be "This is for your own good, in the long run. When you understand, you will thank me for doing this to you." I think that those who succeed in graduating into the negative polarity do so with a completely clean conscience in the vast majority of cases.

Cyan

Does it sound logical that STO seeks to follow his her emotional/intuitive core and complete specific tasks?

I see STS as more about instead of performing tasks, you seek to control and manipulate the world itself in the abstract.

STO seems to be more about adapting yourself to the world around you.

STS seems to be more about adapting the world around to yourself.

That seems to be the best energy specific understanding i am able to grasp.

End of self control over the universe is a pure white existence to self and viewed as pure black existence to others (lack of interaction and turning towards internal god self)

End of allowing others to control is still undefined as it is a random variation pattern depending on actions of all in the system.

I believe, that STO is more about serving your heart to do what your heart wants.

STS is more about trying to understand from a cognitive level WHY it all works the way it does.

As the systems of the universe are incredibly easy to figure out if a normal average human say, the person channeling Ra can generally figure them out, the next logical point is this.

The only thing left unfigured very quickly is the reasoning/emotional context of those making the choices.

So, both STO and STS very rapidly turn into an interest about the other entity.

STO is interested in the emotions (yay lets go create something) STS is interested more in the "what is this place we create something into, and why?"

So. From such a view, STO would be the trap and STS would be the answer.

Because STO focuses on the emoitons associated with the other self when they create. STS focuses on the desire of the person creating.

I've started to see it as balls of light and beams of light.

STS seems to be the beam and STO seems to be the ball.

Does any of this make sense to readers?
(03-11-2012, 04:56 PM)Ankh Wrote: [ -> ]Cyan, I am not sure that you can capture or enslave your Higher Self, as it is you in the future. How is it possible to capture and enslave yourself in the future? But then who knows... Intelligent Infinity works in mysterious ways.

I would imagine that as a newly graduated negative entity, adept or not, coming into fourth density negative, you will start at the bottom of the foodchain so to speak, and will have to work yourself up. Negative space/time is probably very, very hierarchical in its environment, so as a newbie, you will be at the bottom, taking orders from everybody and doing as you are told. Then depending on your abilities to control and separate your self from the self, you will learn how to control and separate your self from other selves.

By acting now to create a different future AKA, a different higher self.

3DMonkey

Balls and beams....
(03-13-2012, 07:05 AM)Cyan Wrote: [ -> ]
(03-11-2012, 04:56 PM)Ankh Wrote: [ -> ]Cyan, I am not sure that you can capture or enslave your Higher Self, as it is you in the future. How is it possible to capture and enslave yourself in the future? But then who knows... Intelligent Infinity works in mysterious ways.

I would imagine that as a newly graduated negative entity, adept or not, coming into fourth density negative, you will start at the bottom of the foodchain so to speak, and will have to work yourself up. Negative space/time is probably very, very hierarchical in its environment, so as a newbie, you will be at the bottom, taking orders from everybody and doing as you are told. Then depending on your abilities to control and separate your self from the self, you will learn how to control and separate your self from other selves.

By acting now to create a different future AKA, a different higher self.

Wooaaa... *That* was an interesting thought...
(03-11-2012, 09:25 AM)3DMonkey Wrote: [ -> ]They cut off any source of advice

That made much sense to me. Thank you, 3DM.

Cyan

(03-13-2012, 09:41 AM)3DMonkey Wrote: [ -> ]Balls and beams....

Blush oh how freudian of me *giggles* BigSmile
(03-13-2012, 09:46 AM)Ankh Wrote: [ -> ]
(03-13-2012, 07:05 AM)Cyan Wrote: [ -> ]
(03-11-2012, 04:56 PM)Ankh Wrote: [ -> ]Cyan, I am not sure that you can capture or enslave your Higher Self, as it is you in the future. How is it possible to capture and enslave yourself in the future? But then who knows... Intelligent Infinity works in mysterious ways.

I would imagine that as a newly graduated negative entity, adept or not, coming into fourth density negative, you will start at the bottom of the foodchain so to speak, and will have to work yourself up. Negative space/time is probably very, very hierarchical in its environment, so as a newbie, you will be at the bottom, taking orders from everybody and doing as you are told. Then depending on your abilities to control and separate your self from the self, you will learn how to control and separate your self from other selves.

By acting now to create a different future AKA, a different higher self.

Wooaaa... *That* was an interesting thought...

I would imagine it this way.

The universe presents you with two fundemental choices and beliefs. Either you do what is good for all (the path of least resistance) or You do what you feel is best.

One can be said to be surrender to god /higher self /service to others
The other can be said to be refusal to surrender to god/higher self/service to others.

One is where you have a distinct past, present and future, where in the far future you view a paradise like state where EVENTUALLY all grievances get sorted, and a utopian peace reigns. Towards that goal is a specific set of steps to be taken "3rd D to 4th D to X D and to Y thre and then to lick this entity here"

As you can see, the LOO as described by Ra defines a pyramidical hierarchy where above her are entities desiring to contact the 6th D entitiy to guide it to the 8th and the other octave.

This is part of a fundementally strict hierarchy where at the top is a entity where all others merge to, and at the bottom is a state from where all entities emerge from.

A basically loop like current.

Now, if you are a STS entity what you do, is you grab onto this loop like current by understanding that it is FAR more likely that you are already in all levels at once, than that you will reach any specific level at any specific date.

So. Knowing that you are already in a future utopistic state can be reached only through the heart.

Either through using the heart to calculate that yes, it is indeed true that we are all already in a paradise like state, or, through feeling it as a desire to serve a "greater good"

Those that calculate that we are in a paradise reach the 4th D, which is the understanding of the principle of LOO, as you would put it, and then from that the 5th D is the calculation of the potential paths you as a merged body-mind-spirit (low, heart, high) will take.

This can be acheived by either of two ways. the one described above, which is through the intellectual contact directly to the field.

Or

Just feeling it.

One is the path of feeling creation, the other is understanding creation.
(03-13-2012, 07:05 AM)Cyan Wrote: [ -> ]
(03-11-2012, 04:56 PM)Ankh Wrote: [ -> ]Cyan, I am not sure that you can capture or enslave your Higher Self, as it is you in the future. How is it possible to capture and enslave yourself in the future? But then who knows... Intelligent Infinity works in mysterious ways.

I would imagine that as a newly graduated negative entity, adept or not, coming into fourth density negative, you will start at the bottom of the foodchain so to speak, and will have to work yourself up. Negative space/time is probably very, very hierarchical in its environment, so as a newbie, you will be at the bottom, taking orders from everybody and doing as you are told. Then depending on your abilities to control and separate your self from the self, you will learn how to control and separate your self from other selves.

By acting now to create a different future AKA, a different higher self.

You know, I thought about it, and I still don't think that you can "alter" your Higher Self. Because Higher Self resides in mid sixth density, which is the density of unity, of oneness. And what is the first separation in negative path?

Daddy Ra Wrote:36.14 Questioner: Was Himmler in any way in contact with his Higher Self at that time when he was incarnate during the 1940s?

Ra: I am Ra. We remind you that the negative path is one of separation. What is the first separation: the self from the self. The one known as Himmler did not choose to use its abilities of will and polarization to seek guidance from any source but its conscious drives, self-chosen in the life experience and nourished by previous biases created in other life experiences.

So, it is your free will, or choice, to do whatever you find suitable or appealing during this dance of experiences, but actually there is no real free will, or choice perhaps, in that that you have to eventually, sooner or later, realize the unity and oneness of all things and beings.

So, if you choose a highly strong polarization in negative path in order to alter your future self, you still can not alter your Higher Self which, as I said, a being residing in unity, or oneness of all. That means that you will only take a longer path, since by polarizing more intensively towards the negative, you will eventually need to balance by whatever means that will be necessary in order to learn the ways of unity. As in this density we make our choice, in next we will learn ways of love. In next ways of wisdom. And in order to proceed and become the consciousness of the Creator, which is in the mid seventh density, the density of Foreverness, you need to learn ways of unity, or oneness, which is sixth density is all about, and where your Higher Self dwells.

Cyan

(03-14-2012, 05:06 AM)Ankh Wrote: [ -> ]
(03-13-2012, 07:05 AM)Cyan Wrote: [ -> ]
(03-11-2012, 04:56 PM)Ankh Wrote: [ -> ]Cyan, I am not sure that you can capture or enslave your Higher Self, as it is you in the future. How is it possible to capture and enslave yourself in the future? But then who knows... Intelligent Infinity works in mysterious ways.

I would imagine that as a newly graduated negative entity, adept or not, coming into fourth density negative, you will start at the bottom of the foodchain so to speak, and will have to work yourself up. Negative space/time is probably very, very hierarchical in its environment, so as a newbie, you will be at the bottom, taking orders from everybody and doing as you are told. Then depending on your abilities to control and separate your self from the self, you will learn how to control and separate your self from other selves.

By acting now to create a different future AKA, a different higher self.

You know, I thought about it, and I still don't think that you can "alter" your Higher Self. Because Higher Self resides in mid sixth density, which is the density of unity, of oneness. And what is the first separation in negative path?

Daddy Ra Wrote:36.14 Questioner: Was Himmler in any way in contact with his Higher Self at that time when he was incarnate during the 1940s?

Ra: I am Ra. We remind you that the negative path is one of separation. What is the first separation: the self from the self. The one known as Himmler did not choose to use its abilities of will and polarization to seek guidance from any source but its conscious drives, self-chosen in the life experience and nourished by previous biases created in other life experiences.

So, it is your free will, or choice, to do whatever you find suitable or appealing during this dance of experiences, but actually there is no real free will, or choice perhaps, in that that you have to eventually, sooner or later, realize the unity and oneness of all things and beings.

So, if you choose a highly strong polarization in negative path in order to alter your future self, you still can not alter your Higher Self which, as I said, a being residing in unity, or oneness of all. That means that you will only take a longer path, since by polarizing more intensively towards the negative, you will eventually need to balance by whatever means that will be necessary in order to learn the ways of unity. As in this density we make our choice, in next we will learn ways of love. In next ways of wisdom. And in order to proceed and become the consciousness of the Creator, which is in the mid seventh density, the density of Foreverness, you need to learn ways of unity, or oneness, which is sixth density is all about, and where your Higher Self dwells.

Unless negative is the only way to reach back to the 3rd density and attain the goal of new octave (8th) density.


To clarify, if this world is all bound by two things, karma, and Law of One.

Then logically, this world is only composed of a single wave function.

So, the Ra-STO path is to serve the same wave function (3rd density ego that can contact 8th density because of understanding of the worlds nature as a game) So, Ra advocates rising along the main vertical axis from the 3rd through the 4th 5th and 6th until all meld into one.

That sounds like a higher self who's purpose is to teach its lower self how to gain acces to the higher self.

How to, in a way, reach the level of the higher self. If you only had enough, what?

What do you need to correlate and catalogue all the observations that you have on the external environment. Time ofcourse, they say that from 3rdD PoV something like the negative density 4th lasts X amount of time and so on. Have you thought its not real time, its subjective time.

So that if you want to reach the level (4th) you need 45.000 years of thinking like a 3rd D entity to "get it" and move to the next level.

So then, what if you jump to the negative, but do it in a way that vastly improves your relative ability to control time.

You go through all the steps from 3rd to early higher self in your subjective world bubble. Then you merge with "all is one" and realise that you can retain some knowledge from this merging. You pick what you think is most relevant to your ego-self and drop back down again.

Then you re-enter the 3rd density and realise that the 6th density is your higher self, NOT an outside force. It is simply the merging of all into one, or in other words, the elimination of this body and the gaining of another.

At this point, it is relatively easy to understand that trying to gain your higher self is both possible, and what is in fact advocated by Ra.

Raise yourself along the main vertical power current until such a time as you attain communion with your higher self, then decide from that where you want to go and return back to the appropriate level.

Though it is, i'll admit, a bit muddled.

From then, it is possible to reach a specific state of viewing the other self.

Not as strictly a part of the self but a new creative surface that the joint self can use.

so then, rising in levels becomes entirely irrelevent. What matters is that you live by what you want. If you live on the 3rd, you live in emotions, you live in struggles, you live in learning to split the 2 concepts of good and bad into three concepts of mind-body-spirit.

When you jump to the 4th, you get two choices.

One is one where you continue to perceive the world in terms of "life after death" where you are trying to earn your place in a specific hierarchy (4th D 5th D, YAY i hope i get the pretty place now, fingers crossed everyone)

One is one where you perceive the world in terms of interactions. Once those interactions synch up and both start raising up towards the 6th while entirely synched in the 3rd they share a new concius entity on the 4th. But for this to work both parties must be self centered, that is to say, centered in this moment (We are already in paradise) instead of that moment (life after death when we eventually reach paradise)

Since both parties must understand that if we focus on this moment, and the ability to control the higher self and accept t his world as reality, then who ever wins the competition is better at turning the world.

But, what if the game played is love? That you try to seek those who seem best able to love each other and god? That you seek to challenge them so both can see who knows this world, who knows this divinity better.

Anyway. I think that Ra is trying to describe to the group that such a state is possible at this moment but it requires all entities involved to accept all power over all they perceive for all time and then try to find another entity to play with. But only if you enjoy loosing too, if you enjoy when you get defeated, because, after all, it was all just a game anyway. If you dont enjoy being defeated and dont enjoy being told that you must be selfish, you can attempt to climb up along the layers post singularity until you realise that if all is truly one then t his is all just a game played for the entertainment of the all, therefore, all your desires are pre-coded by you for you so that you would do what you want to do. God handles the rest!

Then again, thats just one possible view =)


EDIT:

Quick edit: If this is a game there is only one relevent thing, create new play partners to play with. So, someone creates these random flecks of energy and gives them all the following choice (do you serve the whole (creation) and remain unmoved and non-sentient, because it is the path of least resistance) or do you serve yourself and accept that creation needs no servants, only new creations.

In other words.

Do you turn towards god believing that it is the right thing to do.

OR

Do you understand the following:

Everything around you is always and inseparable from god. Only your concious world view is what separates you from god. As your delusions fall away you become god, as your delusions increase you fall away from god. Somewhere along there will be a level where you feel natural. That level is wha tyou should seek post-singularity and simply be who you wish to be. The universe, and god, are so much better than you, dont think you have anything to serve but yourself.

But that being said.

Dont be a douche.



And assuming that human programming is anywhere near the best way to do it in binary. We are now at the apex or very near to the apex as we are creating 1-2 density beings by the bucket. Play any computer games and you see 1-2 density beings. Look at normal human interactions and you see 3-4 look higher than that by increasing your subjective calculating speed (brainpower) and you start to see the patterns behind that and larger entities that play the game through these bodies start to appear (higher self) and there are two kinds, the massive blobs that follow shared energies (places like Ra) and the individuals that follow private energies but merge (higher-self captured and self moving)
Alright, bro. All experiences are of infinite worth to the Creator, so good luck on your path! (And don't be a douche BigSmile)

Cyan

(03-14-2012, 06:28 AM)Ankh Wrote: [ -> ]Alright, bro. All experiences are of infinite worth to the Creator, so good luck on your path! (And don't be a douche BigSmile)

Angel I wouldnt do it if i didnt think it was what my Heart got all Blush about. I think you'll all BigSmile and Tongue and RollEyes and possibly Dodgy at it !

edit:

So, heres is something I thought up, lets see what you think:

This is a game of 8 dimensions resting upon the 9th, which is time.

8th is octave to octave (reality to reality). Or, otherwise said, god-state to god-state.

7th is unified pre god-state

6th is pre-unified and so on, down to what is seen as 3rd and 4th D.

This is seen by a STO oriented entity as a hierarchichal structure (source of service is out there, in the structures themselves). You are meant to progress from 3rd to 4th to 5th to 6th and THEN the party begins, but FIRST you just do this.

This happens when an entity convinces you that the goal of all that is here is to escape from all that is here. Your world view slowly distorts towards a point whre you see the fulfilment of your goals in "time" instead of in space.

This is common in channeled groups such as Ra, where the source of the channeling is most likely some abstract entity trying to accumulate people to it. I would wager a guess that Ra itself as an entity would be roughly the same as the collected thoughts, desires and emotions of the people participating here and all of our energy pooling into a single "abstract" conciousness that then was accessed by the first channel (people who did the first connections) and then opened through that.

Her mind reached into the abstract and created this entity in the 6thD called Ra from the void and carefully her finely tuned ego-self desire to help others created a instant where she touched her higher self and channeled the basic truth to the group which then all participated in it.

So, in a negative/STS view, Ra is the higher self-manifestation of all the participants of this forum, and as such, is distinctly negative (time oriented) and hierarchical (structure oriented one-source principle due to channeled nature) and indoctrinating (selective system of control where some discussions, memebers and participants are preferred over others).

From this PoV it looks like the entity Ra has in fact captured a great deal of your cognitive powers. Seeing as how you accept its interpretation of the world (end oriented-time oriented-hierarchical-post/death) you would inevitably get bad health, and lack of all things you would call "why negatives have better health."
---

Thats my view of the day on the topic.
If the group that channeled Ra wouldn't already have accumulated distortions towards the seeking of the Creator, then they would never had received these teachings. They asked and received.

There might be universes beyond ours, where the Ra-material is severely incomplete, considering infinity. Though Ra's teachings have proved to be fruitful in the understanding of our situation, as Ra had been through a relatively similar experience.

Keep in mind that third density death is the only time we die. So to strive for eternal life is useless to the entity seeking to refine its being. Bad health is not a result from positive polarity, rather from an over-compassionate energy make-up. One can maintain a functioning mind/body/spirit-complex while polarizing STO.
(03-11-2012, 04:56 PM)Ankh Wrote: [ -> ]Cyan, I am not sure that you can capture or enslave your Higher Self, as it is you in the future. How is it possible to capture and enslave yourself in the future? But then who knows... Intelligent Infinity works in mysterious ways.

Instead of starting a whole new topic, I would like to share my thoughts as a reply to this post in this topic I remembered was already here.

First of all, "How is it possible to capture and enslave yourself in the future?" Obviously the same way that the higher self guides and advises the self in the "past". I thought everyone here had already come to terms with the simultaneity of all time in ultimate reality (in which your higher self exists, so you're guiding your "tentacles" "now", or are being "enslaved" "now").  I do not see how time, out of all things, should be the main problem here.

Moving on, to the "enslavement" of the higher self. When I first read this (first and still the only occasion I've heard of such) here, my first thought was "b*llocks", or something along that line. Some say you should listen to your first unbiased instinct, your "gut feeling", as that is the right one. But then again, it could equally be the reaction of a closed-minded ego-self judging too soon based on a lack of insight. My response might've been this latter one, based on my most recent of my, what I like to call, "revelations". Let me explain.

I have come to believe that a very valid path to "whatever it is seekers are aiming to get to" (enlightenment, ascension, evolution, whatever, I don't care any more) is by building a close personal relationship with "whatever higher force you believe in" (your higher self, God, nature, the Universe, Great Spirit, I give up) as described in the Conversations with God series, most importantly Friendship with God (all of which is essentially is Neale channeling his higher self through automatic writing, if you like).

There are many ways to do that, I will not attempt to give an extensive list here, you can get an idea from the CWG books, or even from the Convoluted Universe books, but there is a wealth of info on this online anywhere. What matters is the intention. You need to have the desire which needs to reach a certain intensity and I suppose, being in this low-vibe 3D, you must DO something, like meditate (which may be considered engagement in the ultimate lack of doing anything), prayer, yoga, channeling, and the list is as varied as entities can be.

The point here that would be relevant to the above remark would be, that creating such a personal relationship is not a possibility on the + path ONLY! Indeed, your higher self, which is BEYOND polarities, (meaning it had incorporated both "sides", or rather had realized there is no such thing as sides, merely on an illusory level) will provide its "assistance" to its "tentacles" upon request, regardless of the tentacle's polarity. Obviously a highly aware, negatively polarizing entity will be more than likely inclined to "draw" on such a resource once aware of it (which it should become pretty soon as I imagine), which it will pursue with great efforts, or maybe not so great, due to their level of discipline. Now obviously the purposes which they will "use" their higher self for will be predominantly self-serving, which is perfectly fine for the HS. As long as the entity has the intense desire and the specific goal, a sense of purpose, which can be considered their seeking, or following their own path, which is as valid as any other, the higher self will not say "no, you're bad, I'm not helping you". And due to the nature of what neg entities do as part of following their path, which is manipulation, enslavement and control, they will, to the external observer, seem as though this enslaver had managed to enslave their higher self. Which would be no more than saying that they are using the "Secret" (as explained by Rhonda Byrne) the "you create your own reality" principle, to their own purposes rather than the service of other selves. Which is not really that "different", as you need to have learned to love and care for your self FIRST as a pre-requisite of helping others EFFECTIVELY.

For me, "enslave", and "make contact with", are just two ways of describing the same process. Even if you're on the positive path, you are still making a concrete request to the HS expecting a response from it. What is quintessential here is the HS's recognition and honouring of the free will of the lower selves and providing what is asked without judgement. However, when a neg entity does the same, it may SEEM enslavement, or you might perceive it as though they had made a pact with the devil, or they are controlled by Satan, whatever your personal background is, where in reality it's just another of your(!) other-selves utilizing available tools to evolve. And that's already more than most are still stuck in.

As a side-note, I am currently interested in creating a dialogue with my higher self using what's called the QHHT, which you can read about if you want, but there is a WORLD more to what I have in mind with it, which would be long and complicated to begin to explain here, and I consider it as my own path only. Would love to share, maybe after some progress in a separate topic would be more appropriate. To sum it up, I would prefer clear verbal communication, which can be initiated without an external hypnotherapist, maybe eventually even without the need of a trance state, or perhaps being accessible any time due to a lack of difference between a trance state and the waking state, at least on a certain level. Who knows what's possible.
(02-06-2016, 11:03 AM)Rolci Wrote: [ -> ]For me, "enslave", and "make contact with", are just two ways of describing the same process. Even if you're on the positive path, you are still making a concrete request to the HS expecting a response from it. What is quintessential here is the HS's recognition and honouring of the free will of the lower selves and providing what is asked without judgement. However, when a neg entity does the same, it may SEEM enslavement, or you might perceive it as though they had made a pact with the devil, or they are controlled by Satan, whatever your personal background is, where in reality it's just another of your(!) other-selves utilizing available tools to evolve. And that's already more than most are still stuck in.

I agree with you that enslavement is basically a point of view, but I'd say there are still some pretty fundamental differences between how those contacts proceed. A positive entity is going to not just recognize the free will of its higher selves, but also the teach\learning feedback loop, and that they are doing service for their higher selves even as they ask for services. Likewise, this point of view requires recognizing HSes as being -in some ways- separate entities rather than viewing them solely as self. Or at least all those realizations are within reach of a positive which has gotten into contact with its HSes. Once they make those realizations, the possibilities for collaboration and exploration start becoming quite large.

A negative would see few if any divisions at all, or likely view itself as being its own highest self incarnated. (Which it kinda is.) They probably wouldn't even question where the voices of advice were coming from, seeing them merely as a subset of self, and wouldn't have the slightest interest in the teach\learning systems. They'd probably find the idea fairly absurd. This intense focus on self brings a certain magnification of willpower. But it comes at the expense of both the collaborative possibilities for broadening one's horizons, and the positive feedback loop induced by mutual deliberate teach\learning.

They're two paths to the same end, but I'd say the processes are still fairly distinct.
It really would make no sense trying to enslave your "higher self", no matter how hard a negative entity tried. The higher self is beyond this positive/negative game, so it's irrelevant. Sure you can THINK of enslaving your higher self, but it won't happen.

In my opinion, I would think the first step of the negative adept is to make some sort of name for yourself. You begin at the bottom of the ladder and climb up, via greed, deception, etc. But you are also competing against other 4D entities, and at the mercy of 5D/6D entities who could dispose of you at will, so there is always a large amount of fear. I'll assume once you get passed the fear of even these higher entities, this may polarize you even more.
The first step is self-mastery and from there mastery over others.

By contrast, for the positive the first step is also self-mastery, and from there is mastery beside others.

Subtle, but very apparent difference between 'over' and 'beside'.
my understanding is that to invoke the magical personality is to invoke the higher self. This can be utilised as a resource for both positive and negative adepts alike for the purpose of magical workings in order to serve others or the self.

not quite enslave exactly, but make contact with, like rolci described

Quote:Ra: I am Ra. When the magical personality is properly and efficaciously invoked the self has invoked its Higher Self. Thus a bridge betwixt space/time and time/space is made and the sixth-density magical personality experiences directly the third-density catalyst for the duration of the working. It is most central to deliberately take off the magical personality after the working in order that the Higher Self resume its appropriate configuration as analog to the space/time mind/body/spirit.

Quote:Ra: I am Ra. The three aspects of the magical personality, power, love, and wisdom, are so called in order that attention be paid to each aspect in developing the basic tool of the adept; that is, its self. It is by no means a personality of three aspects. It is a being of unity, being of sixth density and equivalent to what you call your higher self and, at the same time, is a personality enormously rich in variety of experience and subtlety of emotion.

The three aspects are given that the neophyte not abuse the tools of its trade but rather approach those tools balanced in the center of love and wisdom and thus seeking power in order to serve.
The use of the magical personality/higher self has further implications. If you DO try to invoke the higher self, and depolarize while you do, you can depolarize the higher self which creates a lot of problems with guidance. Anyway, my point being that the higher self is not "above" or beyond polarity, yet, so it is possible to affect it by polarizing actions in certain circumstances.

Quote:Ra: More importantly, the time/space mind/body/spirit analog, which is evoked as the magical personality, has its only opportunity to gain rapidly from the experience of the catalytic action available to the third-density space/time mind/body/spirit. Thus the adept is aiding the Creator greatly by offering great catalyst to a greater portion of the creation which is identified as the mind/body/spirit totality of an entity.

Quote:73.11 Questioner: Desire and will are key factors in the process. Is this correct?

Ra: I am Ra. We would add one quality. In the magical personality desire, will, and polarity are the keys.

Quote:75.36 Questioner: How does the use of the magical ritual of invoking the magical personality aid the mind/body/spirit complex totality? Could you expand on the answer you gave in the last session with respect to that?

Ra: I am Ra. When the magical personality is properly and efficaciously invoked the self has invoked its Higher Self. Thus a bridge betwixt space/time and time/space is made and the sixth-density magical personality experiences directly the third-density catalyst for the duration of the working. It is most central to deliberately take off the magical personality after the working in order that the Higher Self resume its appropriate configuration as analog to the space/time mind/body/spirit.

Quote:Ra: I am Ra. The practice of magical workings demands the most rigorous honesty. If your estimate of your ability is that you can sustain the magical personality throughout this working, it is well. As long as you have some doubt it is inadvisable. In any case it is appropriate for this instrument to return its magical personality rather than carry this persona into the trance state, for it does not have the requisite magical skill to function in this circumstance and would be far more vulnerable than if the waking personality is offered as channel. This working is indeed magical in nature in the basic sense. However, it is inappropriate to move more quickly than one’s feet may walk.
I would request some assistance here. I never truly uhm... grasped the whole magical personality thing. Could anyone give a magical personality for dummies kind of brief explanation without quoting the Ra Material?

As for contacting the higher self, it seems there is a whole lot of fuss about it here, also in the quotes. Can someone point out how what we're talking about here is different from a simple verbal communication through someone in a somnambulistic trance, as happens during a QHHT session (or as is described in the Convoluted Universe books)?

Many thanks
(02-07-2016, 02:25 PM)Rolci Wrote: [ -> ]I would request some assistance here. I never truly uhm... grasped the whole magical personality thing. Could anyone give a magical personality for dummies kind of brief explanation without quoting the Ra Material?

As for contacting the higher self, it seems there is a whole lot of fuss about it here, also in the quotes. Can someone point out how what we're talking about here is different from a simple verbal communication through someone in a somnambulistic trance, as happens during a QHHT session (or as is described in the Convoluted Universe books)?

Many thanks

Well the first thing about QHHT is the process of getting the conscious mind out of the driver seat. This process is fundamentally reliant on the practitioners capacity to convey to the subject that the wheel is in safe hands. This is a vibrational tuning process and has unique qualities. The success rate ranges between 1/20 to 1/30, and is a relatively new art form.

The magical personality is essentially the individual's potential in contacting it's own higher self, unifying with it, and producing the relevant healing atmosphere, for either the self or other self. 

There is no difference, essentially.
(02-07-2016, 05:14 PM)Nicholas Wrote: [ -> ]There is no difference, essentially.


Thanks for that. So are you saying that developing the magical personality is basically an ability to conduct a QHHT session on yourself without the intervention of a practitioner? Also what would be the exact experience like, as I don't suppose there would be the verbal communication that could be recorded for re-listening.

So if the two are same, who in a QHHT session has the magical personality? The hypnotherapist conducting the conversation, or the person whose higher self is finding a channel through the lower self giving them personal advice and healing (or sometimes the conductor advice and encouragement)?
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