Bring4th

Sorry in advance if this is inappropriate, but I feel that the situation has a huge impact on who I am & my work here. I'm going to keep this as simple as possible.

My grandfather molested me throughout my childhood. I also found out later on he did it to my sister too. I never had the courage to tell my parents -- until I was a teenager. They did nothing about it. NOTHING. I guess they never really knew what to do about something that happened so long ago.

So my dad tells me the other day that my grandfather is dying in the hospital. I am having a hard time with this. I have never confronted my grandfather about it & neither did my parents. He probably thinks I have no recollection of it. Part of me wants to let him just die. And the other part of me feels like I need to send him a letter or do ANYTHING just to let him know he was wrong, and that I remember VIVIDLY what he did (many, many times)

What would you do? Would you let him rot? Or would you take possibly the last opportunity you may have to confront him?

I feel like I want to confront him but at the same time - That is not an act of love. That would be outwardly displaying hate & I am very much against that. I usually regret when I act on negativity. I am just so deeply confused - as it has been with me literally as long as I can remember..

Confrontation is sometimes the most loving action one can take because it leads to resolution. It is very challenging, but when you consider the fact that otherwise you will always continue to live wondering and without that resolution, and who knows, maybe the realization will do his soul some good as well.

(11-01-2012, 08:08 PM)lightworker Wrote: [ -> ]Sorry in advance if this is inappropriate, but I feel that the situation has a huge impact on who I am & my work here. I'm going to keep this as simple as possible.

My grandfather molested me throughout my childhood. I also found out later on he did it to my sister too. I never had the courage to tell my parents -- until I was a teenager. They did nothing about it. NOTHING. I guess they never really knew what to do about something that happened so long ago.

So my dad tells me the other day that my grandfather is dying in the hospital. I am having a hard time with this. I have never confronted my grandfather about it & neither did my parents. He probably thinks I have no recollection of it. Part of me wants to let him just die. And the other part of me feels like I need to send him a letter or do ANYTHING just to let him know he was wrong, and that I remember VIVIDLY what he did (many, many times)

What would you do? Would you let him rot? Or would you take possibly the last opportunity you may have to confront him?

I feel like I want to confront him but at the same time - That is not an act of love. That would be outwardly displaying hate & I am very much against that. I usually regret when I act on negativity. I am just so deeply confused - as it has been with me literally as long as I can remember..

I'd suggest...start by imagining as vividly as you can, in an appropriate place and time when you can focus, what it would be like to visit or call him, and how the interaction would take place. You'll probably have a much clearer understanding on whether or not you feel it is right to act in one way or another on this.

(11-01-2012, 08:08 PM)lightworker Wrote: [ -> ]What would you do? Would you let him rot? Or would you take possibly the last opportunity you may have to confront him?

I feel like I want to confront him but at the same time - That is not an act of love. That would be outwardly displaying hate & I am very much against that. I usually regret when I act on negativity. I am just so deeply confused - as it has been with me literally as long as I can remember..

You are certainly presented with a strong catalyst. And I intuit what you seek is forgiveness. However, we wouldn't wish to persuade you. This is entirely your choice and we can only suggest you follow what feels "right" to you, whatever it may be. Given you express a state of confusion and openly ask for advice... I know this may not be the answer you are expecting, but: I highly suggest you go into a quiet place and sit in meditation for some time.

You will know what to do better than any of us.

I feel for you lightworker. I've been working with forgiveness lately, and it's liberating (even if you don't actually physically see the person) Please keep in mind that pre-incarnation you may have chosen to experience that type of catalyst for whatever reason that is/was pertinent to both your personal evolutions. You know in your heart what you wish to do at this point.
Love and Light.

Follow your intuition. Be sure that you are guided by your heart, not your ego or mind.

I cannot imagine the situation you are in. But I will give my humble opinion nonetheless for are we not all one?

Confrontation is not necessarily bad. There are many Q'uo readings about how the best way to process catalyst of one who has wronged you is to confront them from a place of love. Even if you cannot do this, I think the mere act of attempting to confront him in order to further love and forgiveness is a good thing.

When I have been confronted with similar (but much less intense) situations, I often find that I am best able to confront with love when I personally do the following:
(1) internally process the catalyst, with love, forgiveness and acceptance for the entity that caused it before seeing that entity
(2) understanding that many people's minds fracture when they do something horrible, to such an extent that they are in denial, and as such, I understand and I realize that I may never get the acknowledgement that I desire (my career that puts me in contact with criminals has helped me tremendously understand the criminal mind)
(3) and release the karmic bonds simply vibrating with forgiveness, or attempting to, one final time around that person who has wronged me. I might not prefer to interact with them again, but I try to say or do one significantly good thing to them to vibrate the knowledge that I have forgiven them. Often, if this is a person who I believe will be in denial if I just say something like "I forgive you" (some are in such denial they will say "for what - get out of here I did nothing!!" but its important to have compassion for those people whose mind has fractured, for they do really live an tortured internal existence), and so instead a simple moment where I prep them food, or put my hand on theirs with a warm smile. I'm not suggesting you be at their side 24/7, but a simple moment like that, and ending your interaction with them with loving smile, has done wonders for me.

I have often had discussions with religious/spiritually inclined friends about the fact that true evil exists in this world increases our ability to love.
For is it not true that:
nearly all people can love the saints among us;
many can love those individuals who are good at heart but have hurt others in error;
some can love those who were completely selfish in that past but have recently turned from that path;
but it is few indeed who can love and appreciate the truly monstrous among us.

Our souls here on the Earth plane are forged in fire. The fire that touched you was particularly scorching. May the flames one day die down so that you can radiate your pristine inner spiritual beauty for all to see, for all to share in, and for all those who have wronged you. If not today, maybe another day; but it is a day that is surely to come.

Peace and love my friend.
xise

Family members of mine were severely abused by their father and when the father was dying in hospital one of them refused to go see him. The father begged the other children to get his son to come and say goodby, to no avail.

The son has no regrets about not seeing his father before his death (nearly 40yrs ago now) and will only say he was a very evil man and he couldn't bring himself to see him. All 12 children refused to speak of the evils committed against them and except for one grew up to be the nicest, kindest, most STO adults you can imagine.

Now the one son has held onto this anger and resentment for many decades and now has cancer. 3 of his sisters and 3 of his brothers all died of cancer.

I'm not suggesting you will end up with disease, and I'm not suggesting you go see someone that caused you so much pain. But you must try to forgive and let go of the pain. I have no idea how you would heal such a horrendous experience but there has to be a way.

I recall Monica talking on In the Now about helping a friend heal from
past abuse, but I can't remember the procedure she used. Something about communicating to the little abused child within and allowing it to express the pain. Maybe you can ask her.

Good luck my friend.

(11-01-2012, 08:08 PM)lightworker Wrote: [ -> ]Sorry in advance if this is inappropriate, but I feel that the situation has a huge impact on who I am & my work here. I'm going to keep this as simple as possible.

My grandfather molested me throughout my childhood. I also found out later on he did it to my sister too. I never had the courage to tell my parents -- until I was a teenager. They did nothing about it. NOTHING. I guess they never really knew what to do about something that happened so long ago.

So my dad tells me the other day that my grandfather is dying in the hospital. I am having a hard time with this.

My advice:

Go there and spend a dying mans last moments comforting him that even the worst crimes can be overcome and the worst pains healed.

Patterns of abuse sometimes run in families. It's possible that your parents and/or grandfather were also abused.

How terribly sad this is that you would think expressing "pain" is inappropriate. I understand why you would think it and I may do so as well when put in you're shoes, but its.. "wrong"

lightworker has been hurt not you

I agree with Siren and would add only you will know what you need to do.

(11-01-2012, 08:08 PM)lightworker Wrote: [ -> ]What would you do? Would you let him rot? Or would you take possibly the last opportunity you may have to confront him?

Having not had the experience that you describe, I find it very difficult to answer. I know not what you have experienced/felt, only you do.

I can relate with a drunk of a father during childhood the most. He terrorized the family with hes behavior, the fear of pain was constant when he was drunk. He has never laid a hand on me but it felt like he could at any time. Both to my mom and me. We were dependent on him by the apartment we were in and monetarily. He did not shy away to use that fact against my mum many times. With "time" I got to understand why she cry-d.
I have hated/despised my father more than once to the point of never wanting to see him again. He has stopped drinking so much but still does it and is the same as he was "then". He was so 5 days a go for reference.

Do I hate him? Yes I do.. if I so choose. Do I love him? No I don't... If I do not want to.

I accept him as he is/I am, like any man.. a fool
He is playing a part like we all are, and it is not for me to judge their chosen road. I can be anything I choose to be and I have chosen what I feel is love. I choose to love him in my own way and forgetting that is what invites confusion

Love and light my friend, you're truth is there to see, do what you feel is right.

(11-02-2012, 08:36 AM)Lycen Wrote: [ -> ]How terribly sad this is that you would think expressing "pain" is inappropriate. I understand why you would think it and I may do so as well when put in you're shoes, but its.. "wrong"

lightworker has been hurt not you

Not sure if this is directed at me but if so, I assure you that I don't think it inappropriate to express pain.

(11-02-2012, 09:04 AM)βαθμιαίος Wrote: [ -> ]

(11-02-2012, 08:36 AM)Lycen Wrote: [ -> ]How terribly sad this is that you would think expressing "pain" is inappropriate. I understand why you would think it and I may do so as well when put in you're shoes, but its.. "wrong"

lightworker has been hurt not you

Not sure if this is directed at me but if so, I assure you that I don't think it inappropriate to express pain.

The quoted content by you was meant wholly to the one named lightworker

I apologize for the confusion I caused, I did not see it. My whole post is a reaction to lightworkers.

No worries. I think I was confused by this line:

(11-02-2012, 08:36 AM)Lycen Wrote: [ -> ]lightworker has been hurt not you

(11-01-2012, 08:08 PM)lightworker Wrote: [ -> ]Part of me wants to let him just die. And the other part of me feels like I need to send him a letter or do ANYTHING just to let him know he was wrong, and that I remember VIVIDLY what he did (many, many times)

What would you do? Would you let him rot? Or would you take possibly the last opportunity you may have to confront him?

I feel like I want to confront him but at the same time - That is not an act of love. That would be outwardly displaying hate & I am very much against that. I usually regret when I act on negativity. I am just so deeply confused - as it has been with me literally as long as I can remember..

So part of the problem that you're facing right now is the ambivalence you feel between 2 seemingly opposing forces:

On the one hand you want to confront him, and on the other, to not do anything. You want grandfather to know that what he did was so painful and so wrong. Perhaps you want to express your feelings about this to your family, who seemed to have avoided doing anything about it?

And there's another part of you that wishes to go with the path of forgiveness.

By confronting him you feel that you are "displaying hate," thus it goes against the core of your being, which understands that forgiveness is healing.

That pained/angry side of you needs to have a voice, an opportunity to let it out because perhaps it's not fully on board yet with the idea (to forgive grandfather). It's an act of love to listen to this side of you, and to be compassionate to its experience. Forgiveness starts with the self.

Self-forgiveness... paramount to healing trauma.

Has time stood still since the incidents?

Has life remained unchanged?

The oak seed, torn from its womb by the wind, shall not accomplish anything by ignoring its present state of being as a mature tree, to relive its seedly experience for the sake of demanding all past events answer to its discernment of them.

The universe has changed and in that change one's past is now memory which serves to assist as experience to discern higher understanding. in higher understanding one should realize that vindication and retribution serves only to satisfy vengeance. And, when final, that satisfaction will be fleeting.

At what expense shall it come?

That is the real question one must ask in this situation.

What are the consequences of revisiting past experience for the purpose of vengeance?

Will the lives of others not involved in those past incidents suffer as a result of that quest?

Has the one who was the victimizer changed from their ways of victimizing, as many of us do ourselves? Will bringing retribution upon them now only serve to bring destruction upon those who live with them now in loving relationships?

If this person has grown and changed, as we all do, then to seek a form of justice that imposes only retribution, in disregard for all other consequences, would violate those affected as unjustly as the original act.

An old man, long ago having been sorry for his ways, having left those ways far behind and moved on into new life, can either be punished for his old ways, or can be recognized for his regret. Regardless, their admission and acknowledgment has nothing to do with your own state of healing.

For the type that has no conscience or remorse, a re-visitation will find no positive end. The spots of that leopard will not be changed by your insistence.

If you believe that such violation continues upon others, than that should have been the reason for action long ago. If you can stop it now, than such recourse is still warranted.

But to revisit such atrocity simply for the sake of self indulgence, without consideration of the further consequences as well as the present state of being, would be just as selfish as the act which violated you long ago.

Far more must be considered then simple vengeance.

Discernment of one's past must be for the purpose of growth, and that is not served by seeking retribution.

But serving an other who suffers the same as you because the predator continues their ways is an honorable act; not because it brings a criminal to justice, but because it puts an end to ongoing crime.

Before you go down that path my friend, consider the present circumstances and residual consequences. Do not ride on a high horse of justice in ignorance of the injustices that you may end up imposing on many others for the sake of a justice which is now defined only by your need for revenge.

Ask yourself if destroying the lives of innocent others because of ways that may long ago have been left far behind in regret, will really satisfy your discernment of past experience.

Is your revisiting of this going to help someone involved, or going to hurt someone completely uninvolved É

Justice of this sort is blind and cares only for the written law.

Your soul is not healed by enforcement of law. It is healed by understanding and full consideration.

Righting a wrong that happens now is acceptable.

Avenging a wrong that no longer exists to appease the law of self is unacceptable if it wrongs others in the process.

Be certain of the consequences of your decisions and actions in full context at all times. In this way, you honor both your own growth and understanding, as well as acknowledging that all are subject to the same and deserving of the same opportunity to grow.

Who besides you knows what remorse you have experienced in order to reach your present state of being, or the many mistakes which you have made along that way.

Allow every other that same consideration and your discernment of that past shall be fulfilling.

However if after you have exhausted that process of discernment and you have reason to believe that a predator may still be on the loose, than some innocent awaits your assistance.

(11-01-2012, 08:08 PM)lightworker Wrote: [ -> ]What would you do? Would you let him rot? Or would you take possibly the last opportunity you may have to confront him?

First and foremost, thank you for inviting us all into your heart.

Secondly, you already know the answer, now you just need to let it unfold.

I will add only this obversation: leaving aside all the very deep and nuanced spiritual and psychological questions of what and how and why, there is a cold, hard fact I don't believe anyone has yet pointed out.

If you do not go to see him, you will always ask yourself afterwards what would have happened if you did. But if you do go to see him, no matter what happens (and whatever it may turn out to be, it will surely be very, very different from any of your imaginary run-throughs of the event), you are very unlikely to ask yourself what would have happened if you had not gone. Even if it turns out to be painful or an apparent waste of time, you will know that you made the effort, and will most likely have no regrets.

Unless there is something I'm missing, that is not a subjective observation, it is a simple fact. It is, at any rate, the best I have to offer.

Best of luck.

(11-02-2012, 02:48 PM)J.Q. Wrote: [ -> ]

(11-01-2012, 08:08 PM)lightworker Wrote: [ -> ]What would you do? Would you let him rot? Or would you take possibly the last opportunity you may have to confront him?

First and foremost, thank you for inviting us all into your heart.

Secondly, you already know the answer, now you just need to let it unfold.

I will add only this obversation: leaving aside all the very deep and nuanced spiritual and psychological questions of what and how and why, there is a cold, hard fact I don't believe anyone has yet pointed out.

If you do not go to see him, you will always ask yourself afterwards what would have happened if you did. But if you do go to see him, no matter what happens (and whatever it may turn out to be, it will surely be very, very different from any of your imaginary run-throughs of the event), you are very unlikely to ask yourself what would have happened if you had not gone. Even if it turns out to be painful or an apparent waste of time, you will know that you made the effort, and will most likely have no regrets.

Unless there is something I'm missing, that is not a subjective observation, it is a simple fact. It is, at any rate, the best I have to offer.

Best of luck.

This is the sort of inconsiderate self indulgence that i warn of.

Do the lives of innocent others have no meaning to you in your quest to please your own doubtsÉ

If so then follow this advice.

(11-02-2012, 02:57 PM)ShinAr Wrote: [ -> ]

(11-02-2012, 02:48 PM)J.Q. Wrote: [ -> ]

(11-01-2012, 08:08 PM)lightworker Wrote: [ -> ]What would you do? Would you let him rot? Or would you take possibly the last opportunity you may have to confront him?

First and foremost, thank you for inviting us all into your heart.

Secondly, you already know the answer, now you just need to let it unfold.

I will add only this obversation: leaving aside all the very deep and nuanced spiritual and psychological questions of what and how and why, there is a cold, hard fact I don't believe anyone has yet pointed out.

If you do not go to see him, you will always ask yourself afterwards what would have happened if you did. But if you do go to see him, no matter what happens (and whatever it may turn out to be, it will surely be very, very different from any of your imaginary run-throughs of the event), you are very unlikely to ask yourself what would have happened if you had not gone. Even if it turns out to be painful or an apparent waste of time, you will know that you made the effort, and will most likely have no regrets.

Unless there is something I'm missing, that is not a subjective observation, it is a simple fact. It is, at any rate, the best I have to offer.

Best of luck.

This is the sort of inconsiderate self indulgence that i warn of.

Do the lives of innocent others have no meaning to you in your quest to please your own doubtsÉ

If so then follow this advice.

I'm sorry you feel that way, and that you feel the need to throw insults around.

I offered the observation above because it was the least sentimental, most objective reply I could think of--it is not my philosophy or my opinion as far as I can tell (I could be wrong, as I implied above); it is not poetry or metaphysics or armchair editorializing, but, it seems to me, simply and unavoidably the case, no matter my opinion or yours or anyone's.

Lightworker specifically--and courageously--asked for advice (unless, that is, the phrase "What would you do?" has some sort of double meaning I'm unaware of). I was touched, and honored, and did my best to answer. Period.

No offense, but your feelings about it are your responsibility, Shin'Ar, not mine.

There are many people who experience sexual trauma, who have never confronted their perpetrators, and have able to come to a place of peace. I actually know very few who chose the path of confrontation w/perpetrator. Just an observation... it seemed as though they became conflicted about the fact that they confronted the other (guilt, more anger towards self) because they were conflicted about it to begin with (self-fulfilling prophecy).

(11-02-2012, 03:52 PM)rie Wrote: [ -> ]There are many people who experience sexual trauma, who have never confronted their perpetrators, and have able to come to a place of peace. I actually know very few who chose the path of confrontation w/perpetrator. Just an observation... it seemed as though they became conflicted about the fact that they confronted the other (guilt, more anger towards self) because they were conflicted about it to begin with (self-fulfilling prophecy).

That might be "just an observation," but it's a good one, and sounds right to me.

Strangely, a lot of experts recommend the opposite course. (I'm not saying they're right! I have no clue.)

Lightworker, there is a website that offers support to victims of sexual abuse called Pandora's Project (http://www.pandys.org/index.html) I found the article below there. I hope it can help you at least pose some important questions.

Confronting Your Abuser
(in your life and in your mind)

© 2007 Pandora's Aquarium
By: Melinda

Deciding To Confront
Directly confronting your abuser and/or those who knew of the abuse but did not try to help you is not for every survivor, but it can be a dramatic, cleansing tool.

If you feel you need to confront your abuser, do it, before the person dies and you never have the chance again; don't let that desire haunt you forever.

Reasons to confront:
1) Validation of memories
2) Make those you confront feel the impact of what was done to you
3) See your abuser suffer
4) Revenge seeking
5) To seek payment for therapy
6) To try to establish a real relationship

Questions to ask yourself before you decide:
1) Whom do I want to talk to and why?
2) What do I hope to gain? Is this realistic?
3) Am I willing to lose contact with those who also know the person?
4) Am I stable enough to stand being challenged?

Keep in mind:
1) Abusers don't like to feel out of control and don't like to be confronted.
2) Your abuser will probably not admit to the abuse or even think what s/he did was abuse.
3) It's a good idea to bring a friend for support or have someone to meet up with afterwards.
4) It's okay to change your mind about the confrontation; don't feel obligated to follow through if you change your mind or have doubts about the outcome.

How To Confront
Focus on doing the encounter for yourself, not for the response you want to receive. Set the boundaries, choose the timing, and choose the location to be comfortable and convenient for you. Practice role playing with a therapist or someone you trust. Write out the main points you want to make and memorize them. Imagine the worst reaction you could get and if you would be able to handle it. Remember that the purpose is to speak up for yourself, say what you want to say and ask for what you want, whether you will receive it or not, and know that you took charge of the situation. This will completely flip the situation around from what it was during the abuse; confronting is very powerful.

If you fear retaliation
If you are unsure if the reaction will be a violent one, keep it to a public place, bring friends as witnesses, and don't give out your current address or phone number.

If Confronting Is Not For You
Not confronting is a perfectly fine option as well. Don't feel pressured to confront because of encouragement from others or from hearing positive stories of confrontation. You're not more of a survivor or any better healed by confronting if it's not for you. Don't do it if you're not ready, your support group isn't strong enough, or there's real danger involved.

Confronting Mentally or Symbolically
If you cannot confront because you do not know who your abuser was, or your abuser is dead, you can still work out a confrontation in your mind. Many survivors who cannot physically confront their abuser fantasize of killing or otherwise hurting their abuser; this is perfectly normal in thought and is a healthy way to own your anger and feel powerful and in control.

Confronting the deceased
An obvious way to confront your abuser if s/he is dead is to do so at their grave. This may yield a more fulfilling result than simply voicing your feelings elsewhere.

Symbolic ways to confront:
1) Write a letter and don't send it.
2) Gather the things that remind you of the abuse and bury them or burn them. If burning, consider keeping the ashes to spread or let fly on the wind.
3) Contribute to a survivor newsletter or other publication.
4) Organize or participate in Take Back The Night (http://www.takebackthenight.org/) or The Clothesline Project (http://www.clotheslineproject.org/).
5) Contribute time and/or money to an organization that helps survivors.
6) Act out the confrontation with others.

(11-02-2012, 04:08 PM)J.Q. Wrote: [ -> ]That might be "just an observation," but it's a good one, and sounds right to me.

Strangely, a lot of experts recommend the opposite course. (I'm not saying they're right! I have no clue.)

Lightworker did say, " That would be outwardly displaying hate & I am very much against that. I usually regret when I act on negativity." Already made up mind about the consequences of confrontation.

What is the intent of confronting grandfather?

When confrontation is a reaction to one's anger or hatred, then it could spiritually and psychologically and socially be harmful.

When confrontation is intended for healing (like getting family members to become more open about resolving problems/trauma), it could be a beautiful process of multigenerational healing.

βαθμιαίος said:

Quote:Patterns of abuse sometimes run in families. It's possible that your parents and/or grandfather were also abused

And families pretty much repeat patterns of how problems, like sexual abuse, are handled, especially when there is multigenerational occurrences of sexual trauma.

(11-01-2012, 08:08 PM)lightworker Wrote: [ -> ]Sorry in advance if this is inappropriate,

Seeking advice is never inappropriate! We are here for you! I haven't read the rest of the posts yet, so I might be jumping in too late, but here is my opinion:

I would most definitely go talk to him. BUT, before I went, I would spend some time in meditation and apply the technique Ra advised us to use: Take a few minutes, when you have privacy, to really feel the negative emotions. In a harmless way, alone, where you can't take it out on anyone, just allow those feelings of fear, anger and hate to intensify and be expressed. Hit a punching bag or a pillow, or scream, or some other physical release, for just a few minutes, if you feel like you're going to burst from the pent up emotions.

After just a few minutes of this, make a conscious choice to balance those negative emotions with their polar opposite: LOVE/compassion/forgiveness. You might not feel it at first. Do it anyway. Just choose it. CHOOSE to love and forgive your grandfather. CHOOSE to have compassion for him. He probably got molested too when he was a child. That doesn't excuse it, but it does help to explain it. Psychologists are well aware that sexual molestation of children often gets passed on from generation to generation. This does NOT mean that every child who got molested ends up being a molester himself!! But it does mean that nearly all molesters were molested as children. It is up to you NOW to break that chain! We know from Ra that forgiveness breaks the cycle of karma. You know that you must forgive him, but you don't feel like it right now because you still are carrying all that pain. The pain must be confronted and released. That is the purpose of the technique Ra gave us. By allowing yourself to feel that pain/fear/anger/hatred, it gets expression in a harmless way (by hitting a pillow instead of a person) and THEN it is much easier to get into a place of love/forgiveness/compassion.

So I would do the technique. I have used it before and it really does work! At first, I didn't feel the love, but by making the CHOICE to love/forgive, it DOES happen! Then, after doing the technique, you can go visit your grandfather in a state of forgiveness. Even if you're not totally in a state of love, even if you're still feeling anger and hate, at least you would have started the process. He might not remember, he might deny it, OR he might be very relieved to be given an opportunity to own up to his own actions.

Remember, all souls presently incarnate were allowed to incarnate by seniority, based on who had the best chance of polarizing. Your grandfather is nearing death and by bringing this out into the open, it might be a beautiful gift you give him: The opportunity to make amends. He can't fully make amends on his deathbed, but he can start that process. Who knows? By showing such courage and compassion to him, you might be able to break the karmic bond between you, and assist the polarization of both of you!

So, I would do the technique, and affirm that your intention is to forgive him, even if you don't feel it yet. Just stay focused on that intention. Then I would go see him, and start out by asking him if he remembers. Then I would gently but firmly tell him what happened, and how much it hurt you. But here's the important part: Don't stop there. It's crucial that you tell him you want to forgive him! Even if you're not totally there yet, let him know that that's your intention and you are working on it. Tell him you now have a spiritual foundation that you live by, and you recognize that he must have been hurting too, to inflict pain on a child. Reach out to HIS inner child, who was most certainly abused also. If you can't have compassion for the old man, see if you can muster up some compassion for the little child that is inside him. Because, guaranteed, HIS inner child was abused, and is still in there, still in pain. By reaching out to HIS inner child, you will help heal YOUR inner child. Because, all is ONE!

If your hate for him is so strong that you don't trust yourself to be around him alone, then ask someone to go with you. Make it clear to them that your intention isn't to distress a dying old man. That's why you want to use Ra's technique to clear the hate beforehand, so it doesn't come pouring out at him. You don't want to vomit all over him. Just talk to him. Stay calm. Gentle but firm.

If he denies it, then he isn't ready to deal with it, and his unresolved karma will follow him into his next life. But YOU can clear YOUR karmic connection to this pattern, even if he doesn't! He'll just have to find someone else to engage in this pattern, because you will have cleared it and moved on.

He might be senile and truly not remember consciously. But he will know, on some level. If he isn't conscious, you can still talk to him. His soul will know. You can still clear the karma on your end, without his participation. But talking to him in person is an act of service, because you are giving HIM an opportunity to heal also, not just yourself.

I will hold you and him in my prayers. Please let us know what happens! If you decide to talk to him, you may still benefit from some therapy afterward to help yourself heal. I have some suggestions on that too, if you'd like to hear them. But for now, the important thing is to talk to your grandfather while you still can.

(11-02-2012, 02:57 PM)ShinAr Wrote: [ -> ]This is the sort of inconsiderate self indulgence that i warn of.

Do the lives of innocent others have no meaning to you in your quest to please your own doubts

I didn't get any impression whatsoever from lightworker that he wished to act selfishly, self-indulgently, or hatefully. In fact, s/he stated that s/he didn't want to act out of hate, and was confused.

I know it might seem self-indulgent to someone who has never experienced abuse, but as someone who has, I can attest that such childhood traumas aren't easily healed. The pain runs deep.

If done with the intention of forgiveness, the confrontation could be very healing. Intention can make all the difference.

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(11-02-2012, 03:52 PM)rie Wrote: [ -> ]There are many people who experience sexual trauma, who have never confronted their perpetrators, and have able to come to a place of peace. I actually know very few who chose the path of confrontation w/perpetrator. Just an observation... it seemed as though they became conflicted about the fact that they confronted the other (guilt, more anger towards self) because they were conflicted about it to begin with (self-fulfilling prophecy).

It can go either way. My sister was advised by a therapist to confront our parents, so she sent them a series of long, nasty, hateful letters which did absolutely nothing to heal anyone, and just sent our mother into a tailspin of guilt and anguish. Writing the letters could have been therapeutic, by getting her feelings out, but sending them just caused more damage. My sister never followed up with any forgiveness, even when asked to on my mother's deathbed. My mother died with the karma between them unresolved. That was just tragic, because my mother wanted so much to have an opportunity to apologize to my sister. But my sister's hate denied her that opportunity.

The way my sister did it isn't the type of confrontation that I am suggesting.

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(11-02-2012, 04:08 PM)J.Q. Wrote: [ -> ]Lightworker, there is a website that offers support to victims of sexual abuse called Pandora's Project (http://www.pandys.org/index.html) I found the article below there. I hope it can help you at least pose some important questions.

Confronting Your Abuser
(in your life and in your mind)

Good find! That is some excellent, sound advice! I would just add to that, the spiritual dimension of forgiveness.

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(11-01-2012, 10:26 PM)xise Wrote: [ -> ]Confrontation is not necessarily bad. There are many Q'uo readings about how the best way to process catalyst of one who has wronged you is to confront them from a place of love. Even if you cannot do this, I think the mere act of attempting to confront him in order to further love and forgiveness is a good thing.

Agreed! Q'uo also gave a technique for bringing the negative emotion up into the heart, where it can be transmuted into love. (I sure wish I could find that session! Does anyone remember it? I've been looking for it for awhile now.)

(11-01-2012, 10:26 PM)xise Wrote: [ -> ]When I have been confronted with similar (but much less intense) situations, I often find that I am best able to confront with love when I personally do the following:
(1) internally process the catalyst, with love, forgiveness and acceptance for the entity that caused it before seeing that entity
(2) understanding that many people's minds fracture when they do something horrible, to such an extent that they are in denial, and as such, I understand and I realize that I may never get the acknowledgement that I desire (my career that puts me in contact with criminals has helped me tremendously understand the criminal mind)
(3) and release the karmic bonds simply vibrating with forgiveness, or attempting to, one final time around that person who has wronged me. I might not prefer to interact with them again, but I try to say or do one significantly good thing to them to vibrate the knowledge that I have forgiven them. Often, if this is a person who I believe will be in denial if I just say something like "I forgive you" (some are in such denial they will say "for what - get out of here I did nothing!!" but its important to have compassion for those people whose mind has fractured, for they do really live an tortured internal existence), and so instead a simple moment where I prep them food, or put my hand on theirs with a warm smile. I'm not suggesting you be at their side 24/7, but a simple moment like that, and ending your interaction with them with loving smile, has done wonders for me.

I have often had discussions with religious/spiritually inclined friends about the fact that true evil exists in this world increases our ability to love.
For is it not true that:
nearly all people can love the saints among us;
many can love those individuals who are good at heart but have hurt others in error;
some can love those who were completely selfish in that past but have recently turned from that path;
but it is few indeed who can love and appreciate the truly monstrous among us.

Our souls here on the Earth plane are forged in fire. The fire that touched you was particularly scorching. May the flames one day die down so that you can radiate your pristine inner spiritual beauty for all to see, for all to share in, and for all those who have wronged you. If not today, maybe another day; but it is a day that is surely to come.

Peace and love my friend.
xise

Excellent advice and beautifully stated! That is a very good point about abusers being fractured. I recently had a most unpleasant experience with someone who seemed very nice on the outside, but later exhibited all the classic signs of a sociopath. It was very difficult to understand because she really seemed like 2 different people. I knew this person had been horribly abused as a child. I did some research and learned that when child are abused at a very young age, they often fracture, in order to lock away the pain. I concluded that this person likely had Dissociative Personality Disorder, which is very common in people who were severely abused as children. It explained how she could do reprehensible things; the 'nice' personality was cut off from what the sociopath personality was doing.

It might help the forgiveness process to remember that the grandfather was once an abused child too, and may be similarly dissociated. So if he is in denial, or presents a sweet persona, it may be that the 'nice' part of him truly has no clue about what his other personality did.

Monica: what the therapist suggested was... awful. There are 'non-invasive' ways to deal with trauma but confronting perpetrators may actually re-traumatize someone, if their PTSD or other condition is severe... but it's something that ought to be a person's choice to confront/not confront, not professional advice.

I hope your sister is doing well. I've worked with clients who missed their opportunity to work on relationship with their deceased family members... we worked intrapsychically (internal family) because we each internalize a bit of our family in us and work from the inside. Worked well... it's a lifetime healing process but they felt relief.

Actually, in modern techniques you wouldn't even need to talk through trauma or think too much about it, much less confront head on...

(11-02-2012, 09:10 PM)rie Wrote: [ -> ]Monica: what the therapist suggested was... awful. There are 'non-invasive' ways to deal with trauma but confronting perpetrators may actually re-traumatize someone, if their PTSD or other condition is severe... but it's something that ought to be a person's choice to confront/not confront, not professional advice.

This was about 30 years ago. Hopefully, psychiatry/psychology has progressed since then.

(11-02-2012, 09:10 PM)rie Wrote: [ -> ]I hope your sister is doing well.

Unfortunately, 3 of my sisters never recovered. One was in and out of mental hospitals, and is heavily medicated to this day, now nearing 70. the other 2, in their 60s, spent their entire adult lives in a state of perpetual hate and anger. They cut themselves off from the rest of the family, but last I heard, they were still living in the past. But thanks!

My philosophy is: If parents ruined the first part of our lives, why let them ruin the rest of it?

(11-02-2012, 09:10 PM)rie Wrote: [ -> ]I've worked with clients who missed their opportunity to work on relationship with their deceased family members... we worked intrapsychically (internal family) because we each internalize a bit of our family in us and work from the inside. Worked well... it's a lifetime healing process but they felt relief.

Actually, in modern techniques you wouldn't even need to talk through trauma or think too much about it, much less confront head on...

Please tell us more about the work you do!

This thread is doing me so much good. Thanks everyone, especially you, Monica, for sharing some of the deeper and darker matters in your family for facilitating the healing of those interested. That, I call, a real brilliant act of service to others. Thanks once again to everyone for liberally sharing your thoughts. It is helping me face my own inner demons. I have been an abuser for quite sometime in my life, too. For last few years now, I would go into fits of rage with my mother due to my own inner pain. Probably, that is what is called being fractured. This thread brings healing to both the abuser and the abused. Of course, there is absolutely no justification for the pain I have caused. I choose to turn over into a new leaf and ask my mother one more last time sincerely, for forgiveness. I have asked forgiveness many times before and have relapsed into shouting rants and display of fits of anger, aimed to cause fear. I now feel sad for what I have done. I will change for the better. That is the choice I make. I hope my mother accepts my apologies

(11-02-2012, 07:37 PM)Bring4th_Monica Wrote: [ -> ]Agreed! Q'uo also gave a technique for bringing the negative emotion up into the heart, where it can be transmuted into love. (I sure wish I could find that session! Does anyone remember it? I've been looking for it for awhile now.)

Actually, on second thought I believe it's in the Aaron/Q'uo Dialogues book.

Forgiving does not mean that what was done is okay.

Forgiving involves an understanding of your grandfather's twisted mind illness. Maybe he couldn't help himself, maybe he's a sociopath.

I don't know, but sometimes such an illness has a physically imbalanced cause, and sometimes the cause is terrible emotional pain as a child.

So either because he can't help it, or because he needs to protect himself from further hurt, he may have created his own universe where only he matters.

Charming sociopaths never really give a damn about others feelings. They need a way to express hostility through domination, and abusing a child would be a release.

Lying is very easy for them, while shame or embarrassment may be impossible. In their universe they are powerful and always right, but perhaps somewhere in that twisted mind, is an unrecognized spark that maybe their universe isn't true . . . and this would create rage and fury. A child victim would release such tension. And there would be zero thought or concern for the human heart devastation they leave behind.

I don't know this, I don't know your grandfather. Sociopath is only one of many ways to understand.

But I did need to forgive and release my mother, and understanding her weaknesses and her needs, helped me get there. It may help you too.

And there is also, always, a soul contract question. Did I require (my case no where near as harsh as yours) being betrayed and lied about? Did I require loosing the entire rest of my family? Well, maybe.

Maybe this soul lesson has helped me stand on my own? Combatting the low self esteem she caused took a very long time, but was a needed part of the process? Has this helped me realize my inner strength?

I am no longer a victim, I am now a survivor. I am no longer terrified, I am now living easier. Forgiving is a wonderful release, and is really an entirely selfish act. Forgiving will cleanse your karma with him. It will free you, and he never need know.

I agree with Monica:
My philosophy is: If parents ruined the first part of our lives, why let them ruin the rest of it?

Just change parents into grandfather.

I'm a hypnotherapist, and I do Life Between Lives (LBL) work. In one such session, my client (and her twin), had been molested often by their much older sister's husband. Their protests were ignored and dismissed by this older sister, and both twins despised her.

(In LBL we go to the most recent past life, and live that life, and re-experience that death, and then ascend towards . . . . .the space we go between lives, to meet our Teachers and our soul group and our Soul Self . . . . . 4D? . . . . . another dimension . . . . . nirvana . . . . . .)

As this client was ascending after her past life death, a wonderful and loving deep blue being appeared to comfort her. That being was my client's older sister. Client astonished by the love there . . . .

Time with client's Guide and Elders . . . It seems that my client was so spiritually oriented, and her desire and instinct to just float out of her body was so strong, that she need this weight, this grounding, to have her stay on this planet and in this body. And that explanation resonated an understanding and balance for her.

If interested in such a spiritual journey, you may find a Life Between Lives Hypnotist near you at: http://www.spiritualregression.org


When we are certain of our path, we should follow it. Your question reflects a certain uncertainty, so I feel doubtful that a confrontation would satisfy.

When uncertain and conflicted, then wisdom may involve listening to the warnings of your own heart, and leave him to die.

Maybe the work you need do is within you, and really has nothing to do with him any longer.

I don't know the correct answer, this is just what I feel, only you know what to do.

But the cosmos seems to have created a "hurry up," around this decision, because he's dying. I say (and you know) time isn't real. So take your time, and do this healing for yourself, in your own manner. I think that the timing of his death should not hurry you.

When he dies, his Guides and Elders will lay this all out for him in their perfectly patient, and understanding, and loving, and clear, firm, and inescapable manner. He will receive the lessons and the help that he needs, as he should.

When you work through this weight you are carrying, and you let go of him with forgiveness, he may then recognize and celebrate your wisdom, and that may further help his own release.

Update on my previous post: Hi, just an update on my previous post. I had an open discussion with my mother and apologized clearly for all the mistakes I did. She said she forgives me and asked me only to construct a wall so that the past does not keep hampering and downgrading my present and my future. Now, the task is not to relapse, ever. At times, I feel sad that the abused need to be under the 'mercy' of the abusers, since they are usually more 'powerful' within a given context. In my case, I am going to make sure that I am going to stay firm on my commitment of honoring and respecting my mother, as a way of alleviating my karma over the way I have behaved with her so far. Thanks for opening this thread and discussing such a painful matter. It helps. It really is quite a distance from just talking the talk and walking the walk.

Monica: The work I do... kinda varies these days... but the core is to be genuine, calm, compassionate, empathic... all the rest follows from that point. Realistically speaking, it's impossible to change others.... so we don't really focus on that... So we help people shift to look more within. It's hard at first because blaming or scapegoating others is safer for a person with lots of trauma experiences. They build their tolerance for pain and ambiguity and they will start to turn within more and more.

I've worked with many women who have bad terrible experiences with parents. They have a hard time letting the 'cord' go, even when unimaginable abuse occurred. They still yearn for their parents. That whole love-hate dynamics is difficult to process. But it's possible.