Bring4th

Playing the devil's advocate...

I was wondering why an entity would choose STS after knowing the true nature of things ("The service-to-self adept will satisfy itself with the shadows and, grasping the light of day, will toss back the head in grim laughter, preferring the darkness"). This is the main reason I could think of. Maybe they're choosing the fastest route back to the Creator.

Quote:Then, as the entities begin to see the Creator, there is a very rapid, as you measure time, procession towards the eighth density. This is due to the fact that one who knows not, cares not.

I think STS would fall into "I don't give a damn" category.

Maybe, in their view, they are attempting to bring people to the Creator faster, by inflicting painful experiences and offering catalyst to evolve, employing powers of control to speed up the evolutionary process as quickly as possible.

Quote:They experience that which they wish by free choice, being of the earnest opinion that green-ray energy is folly.

Assuming that STS is all about efficiency... When using green ray, you're going to be spending time assisting others..time that could be spent progressing towards the Creator. If your goal is to become the Creator, green ray would slow you down.

If they progress faster through 4th, 5th and partially 6th, I could understand them choosing the negative path, even though they know all is one.

Speaking from personal experience, I found that developing the energy centers (not green) occurred much more rapidly when placed in a negative environment, though the pain and effort was more intense. I wouldn't recommend it. it's unbalanced.

What do you guys think?

I don't think it's just about getting back to Creator faster. I'd love to rejoin Creator, though I'm not quite ready to give up my individuality. But I couldn't see myself going STS.

(03-13-2013, 01:19 PM)Wander-Man Wrote: [ -> ]I was wondering why an entity would choose STS after knowing the true nature of things

Once the "heart" (green-ray nexus) has been sufficiently shut off, the contemplation of unconditional compassion for other-selves becomes inconceivable—not to mention undesirable. Having already repressed green-ray energy in 3D and achieved graduation in like manner, the 4D and then 5D entity recognizing the potential and seeing itself as Creator will not see the Creation in the eyes of unconditional love, but in the eyes of absolute domination.

It is the "God Syndrome." With the negation of green-ray there arises the possibility and potential desirability for "galactic conquest," so to speak (because the other portions of Creation are not seen as "you;" and if they are, then oh God, they are totally out of control and need to be brought to order under your rule!). It is the greatest aphrodisiac; for what greater temptation/distortion is there but that of the possibility of total conquering/domination/control of all of Creation? Yet I suppose this cannot be understood by one who has not tread the negative path (and many already have, but remember it not).

Quote:Maybe, in their view, they are attempting to bring people to the Creator faster, by inflicting painful experiences and offering catalyst to evolve, employing powers of control to speed up the evolutionary process as quickly as possible.

They are offering this already, whether they recognize it as such or not. But the StS entity is extremely deceptive (even to itself).

To answer your query more to the point: it is my understanding that the negative path offers a faster progression in the lower densities and becomes somewhat "slowed down" in the higher ones. The inverse opposite applies to the positive path (it is more "difficult" in the lower vibrations but "easier" in the higher ones—this is all, of course, relative to 3rd-density). Then again, time is of little meaning—especially when one is fully and single-mindedly consummated with his/her work at hand ("time flies" and eternity stretches into timelessness; there is no time, only the forever moment of the ever-present now).

(03-13-2013, 01:19 PM)Wander-Man Wrote: [ -> ]Playing the devil's advocate...

I was wondering why an entity would choose STS after knowing the true nature of things ("The service-to-self adept will satisfy itself with the shadows and, grasping the light of day, will toss back the head in grim laughter, preferring the darkness"). This is the main reason I could think of. Maybe they're choosing the fastest route back to the Creator.

I think it's pretty understandable if you look at it in terms of being. I don't think many, if any entities, sit down and do a pro and con list and then select a polarity.

I think entities live their 3D life, learning, discovering, until they come to a point where they stop experimenting with various philosophies and see realize something about their being:

(1) they have a heart that they can't deny and will just be (perhaps despite the fact that having a heart might open themselves to hurt and others would say they are naive!) or

(2) they don't understand or have this "conscience" thing and they will stop worry about all this talk of a conscience and heart and just be (despite the fact that others would say omg you are evil you don't have a heart - they stop self-judging, even if they have desires to what is "evil" such as enjoying dominating others).

It's just a basic state of being. Do you vibrate mainly red, orange, and especially yellow and don't have this green thing, or do you feel and does your energy have green?

I've definitely experimented with STS philosophy in my life, especially in my field (trial law). In times where I was still discovering who I was, I wondered and even wished that I did not have such a big heart, because those around me often did not and had no trouble being selfish. I tried (and I was decent at it), but being selfish and successful in a dog eat dog field was ultimately worse for my being than being less successful and more open hearted and just being who I was. It was much less stressful and natural, for sure

(03-13-2013, 02:14 PM)Siren Wrote: [ -> ]To answer your query more to the point: it is my understanding that the negative path offers a faster progression in the lower densities and becomes somewhat "slowed down" in the higher ones.

Slowed down in 6th? Are you getting this idea from this quote?

Quote:Ra: I am Ra. This is incorrect. The sixth-density negative entity is extremely wise. It observes the spiritual entropy occurring due to the lack of ability to express the unity of sixth density. Thus, loving the Creator and realizing at some point that the Creator is not only self but other-self as self, this entity consciously chooses an instantaneous energy reorientation so that it may continue its evolution.

xise Wrote:I think it's pretty understandable if you look at it in terms of being. I don't think many, if any entities, sit down and do a pro and con list and then select a polarity.

Right, in 3D. In 4D, when the veil is removed, and entities have a better understanding of things, what is their reasoning for continuing on this path? They must know what we know. They're going through millions of years of pain, hardship, and hell. They must have a damned (pun intended) good reason for it. Lust for power isn't good enough. It has to be noble. They have to believe they are making the best, highest and honorable choice. It has to be a holy struggle.

Do they think this experiment of excessive free will was a failure, and are attempting to end it by speeding up evolution?

Do they see STS as the most efficient and productive path? Do they see STO as prolonging suffering by allowing ignorance?

It doesn't make sense.

(03-13-2013, 08:41 PM)Wander-Man Wrote: [ -> ]Right, in 3D. In 4D, when the veil is removed, and entities have a better understanding of things, what is their reasoning for continuing on this path? They must know what we know. They're going through millions of years of pain, hardship, and hell. They must have a damned (pun intended) good reason for it. Lust for power isn't good enough. It has to be noble. They have to believe they are making the best, highest and honorable choice. It has to be a holy struggle.

Do they think this experiment of excessive free will was a failure, and are attempting to end it by speeding up evolution?

Do they see STS as the most efficient and productive path? Do they see STO as prolonging suffering by allowing ignorance?

It doesn't make sense.

I don't see the STS path as millions of years of pain, hardship, and hell. It's a world where the top of the STS pyramid live awesomely, but the rest live progressively less well off.

You can do anything you want with power at the top. I see the STS path as a path where you want to be #1. You don't enter the competition without believing, sincerely, that at some point in the future you're capable of holding that #1 spot.

I agree there is a lot more pain, hardship, and suffering in the STS path compared to the STO path, but I think there is a lot more skill "perfection" (Ra talks about it in terms of the STS care for the body) in the STS path, as STS entities journey is about being #1, and about perfecting all means to achieve that position.

As an STO who holds no ill will toward STS entities (or at least ones that haven't hurt me personally), I see both beauty and horror in the STS qualities of massive corporations/dictatorships/(insert winner takes all type entity). The beauty is in how perfectly they execute their strategy to win. Just some (probably imperfect) examples off the top of my head: The cable companies in how ruthless they are on their monopoly here. In more terrible terms, how effect German Blitzkrieg strategies were in world war II in defeating Poland, the Low Countries, France, and in the Balkans. How effective Walmart is in keeping prices low by not paying their employees. How well the Banks have infiltrated and put their tendrils in all world economies.

Ra talks about the fifth density entity that almost put Carla in time/space as lesser in power but had the skill of a swordsmen. The beauty, for me, in STS in how much they perfect worldly skills in an effort to be #1. There is some true dark beauty behind those skills, and in my opinion I typically don't see the same level of perfection (or probably better called obsession) in STO because it's much more about acceptance and non-judgement than perfection.

The horror of course comes from the fact that in the struggle for ultimate power and position for #1, it is a no holds bar and entities involved in an STS struggle can and will do anything that will get them victory (as long as it doesn't hurt the self). But in the struggle for power and glory, horrible things can and will be done. And that's the tragic aspect.

That being said, I love living life without worrying about the ratrace and what I could do to get to the top - service to others is definitely the path for me!

I think STO is the path for everyone on this site, and those who follow the Ra material.

There's a really good quo transcript that deals with this topic
http://www.llresearch.org/newsletters/is...994_2.aspx

Here are some selected excerpts

Quote:As a positively polarized person living a life in faith, one is prone to feel safe in the arms of the good, the true, and the beautiful. However, the entity upon the negative path feels that there is no safety, feels that there is no haven, feels that it and only it shall be the one to be counted upon and relied upon. Therefore, this entity wishes to build personal power with a greater initial reason and impetus for building a magical personality. Furthermore, this magical personality is simpler to build that the positively oriented magical personality. The negative entity need only attempt to accrete to the self all possible power of any kind whatsoever without the need for discrimination or judgment. The positively polarized entity, instead, is moving through processes of balancing the seemingly opposite of all things to ascertain the most careful balance of truth, of beauty, and of goodness. For to the positively oriented entity it is clear that the illusion has the appearance of a bias toward negative events and circumstances. In order to clarify right action and the positive use of power careful balancing of all stimulus needs must be done.

Thus each of you has the seemingly more difficult task in living a chosen life of faith, for both paths are given by the One Infinite Creator. Although the Creator offers suggestions implicit in experience that the positive path of serving others is preferable and more to be desired, the negative path beckons and it also is, as this instrument would say, godly in that there is no energy but that of the One Infinite Creator. Further, the nature of your experience in third density offers simpler beginnings to a metaphysical base of power for those which choose negativity. What is not obvious is that the negative path becomes more and more difficult until at last it is a road impossible to be walked, whereas the positive path is eternal.

....

The positive path is full of shadows, of questions and doubts, of continual learning and balance. The choice for positivity is not the choice for simplicity of early lessons. The choice for negativity is a choice for simplicity of early lessons. Thusly an entity which is negative has an apparent advantage once it has progressed to a certain point of being absolutely sure of the self without the need for faith, whereas the positively polarized entity is still dealing with the endless and confusing shadows of the spiritual landscape which is lit by the dim star of hope and the thin delicate moonlight of faith.

i recommend the entire article.

Basically the negative path offers simpler lessons in 3D, easier to build a magical personality in 3D, doesn't require faith after a certain point, and doesn't require constant balancing. They even tend to incarnate with more wealth and health (54.22). In essence, you get all the good stuff up front and get the same amount of power as if you graduated positively. Why wouldn't you choose it, sounds like the best deal ever lol

(03-13-2013, 01:19 PM)Wander-Man Wrote: [ -> ]I think STS would fall into "I don't give a damn" category.

On the contrary, I think great care must be taken to see the creation as "that which shall be put in order."

(03-13-2013, 10:39 PM)xise Wrote: [ -> ]Ra talks about the fifth density entity that almost put Carla in time/space as lesser in power but had the skill of a swordsmen. The beauty, for me, in STS in how much they perfect worldly skills in an effort to be #1. There is some true dark beauty behind those skills, and in my opinion I typically don't see the same level of perfection (or probably better called obsession) in STO because it's much more about acceptance and non-judgement than perfection.

Agreed. I think the 95% vs. 51% polarization requirement reflects this, STO followers typically not being as skilled in helping others as STS is in helping itself.

Thanks for the link, spero. I like this paragraph as well:

Quote:Before we leave this topic we would focus once more upon the rich and fertile land of spiritual choice, the dark world within. Each of you gaze within. Do you feel magical? Do you feel powerful? If the answer comes too easily it is likely that there is that within you which would choose the easy way towards power; that is, the path of negativity, for each step upon the negative path seems from within to be positive. One wishes power so that one may help people. The way to help people is to give advice, give teaching, make sure that all is well by controlling various people and circumstances. All these things feel natural and good. Most beginning negative entities have no idea that they are embarking upon the path of negativity. Contrasting with this is the positive path where power is accrued by being the weakest, and true greatness is achieved by being the servant of others, where advice and teaching are given only when requested. How many among your religious systems caught up in the fervor of rightness and righteousness, judge, condemn and control many for their own good? How few there are in your belief systems of religion who abandon doctrine and dogma and seek to serve each entity according to its requests, when it can, and offering only benediction, forgiveness, and acceptance when it cannot. Yet to those few who know themselves well enough not to judge, not to control others, but to work on the self, to these few come strength, magical power, and illumination of incandescent light which shoots through that darkness of the metaphysical field like lightning. The world, as this instrument would say, cannot see that lightning. Only each individual pilgrim upon the positive path who moves into a life in faith, a life without fear may be illumined. It moves through one. It does not stay with one. And such entities are channels of joy and peace. Whether the greeting of negative entities seems or seems not to succeed, such entities are forever safe in spirit.

zenmaster Wrote:On the contrary, I think great care must be taken to see the creation as "that which shall be put in order."

To clarify, I meant that an STS entity doesn't give a damn about assisting other entities other than to increase their effectiveness as pawns. So they progress faster than STO. That's the theory, anyway.

(03-14-2013, 08:41 PM)Wander-Man Wrote: [ -> ]

zenmaster Wrote:On the contrary, I think great care must be taken to see the creation as "that which shall be put in order."

To clarify, I meant that an STS entity doesn't give a damn about assisting other entities other than to increase their effectiveness as pawns. So they progress faster than STO. That's the theory, anyway.

"one who knows not, cares not." I think that more primarily, it's the case that STS has a certain focus of will and faith which is able to seek the creator more effectively.

(03-14-2013, 09:30 PM)zenmaster Wrote: [ -> ]

(03-14-2013, 08:41 PM)Wander-Man Wrote: [ -> ]

zenmaster Wrote:On the contrary, I think great care must be taken to see the creation as "that which shall be put in order."

To clarify, I meant that an STS entity doesn't give a damn about assisting other entities other than to increase their effectiveness as pawns. So they progress faster than STO. That's the theory, anyway.

"one who knows not, cares not." I think that more primarily, it's the case that STS has a certain focus of will and faith which is able to seek the creator more effectively.

Well they are hell-bent..