Bring4th

in this passage here, Don asks a bit about the Industrial Revolution and what it 'meant'.

Ra responds by saying that about 200 years ago, the law of seniority was starting to take effect (those who have a higher chance of making the harvest grade were given priority in incarnating, in the hopes that 4 or 5 lifetimes before the Harvest point would give them enough experience to harvest).

these individuals would be minimum yellow ray activated, and seeking towards green, and also through green to blue.

as a result of a higher proportion of these incarnated beings, more Wanderers also arrived to assist. and their motives were to bring in ideas around Free Will, and Technology, so that mankind would free themselves from slavery and have greater self-autonomy (time to contemplate themselves and their life).

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these Wanderers started arriving in waves:

Quote:11.29 Questioner: What about the Industrial Revolution in general. Was this planned in any way?

Ra: I am Ra. This will be the final question of this session.

That is correct. Wanderers incarnated in several waves, as you may call them, in order to bring into existence the gradual freeing from the demands of the diurnal cycles and lack of freedom of leisure.

and this was how it was done:

first ideas around free will were offered - (David Hume? John Locke? Voltaire?)

and then ideas around technology were offered - (the steam engine? electric lighting?)

Quote:26.13 Questioner: Did the Confederation then step up its program of helping planet Earth sometimes, some time late in this last major cycle? It seems that they did from the previous data, especially with the Industrial Revolution. Can you tell me the attitudes and reasonings behind this step up? Is there any reason other than that they just wanted to produce more leisure time in the last, say, a hundred years of the cycle? Is this the total reason?

Ra: I am Ra. This is not the total reason. Approximately two zero zero [200] of your years in the past, as you measure time, there began to be a significant amount of entities who by seniority were incarnating for learn/teaching purposes rather than for the lesser of the learn/teachings of those less aware of the process. This was our signal to enable communication to take place.

The Wanderers which came among you began to make themselves felt at approximately this time, firstly offering ideas or thoughts containing the distortion of free will.

This was the prerequisite for further Wanderers which had information of a more specific nature to offer. The thought must precede the action.

so yes, the world is changed through ideas.

Dolores Cannon also talks about waves of volunteers.

I like what you say about the law of seniority taking affect some 200 years ago. I hadn't realized that. I thought it was for the full major cycle of 25,000 years. So I'm extremely lucky to be here at this time. Grateful too.

Thank you Mr. Plenum.

If I had to choose three, Jefferson's three are as good as any:

Quote:"Bacon, Locke and Newton. I consider them as the three greatest men that have ever lived, without any exception, and as having laid the foundation of those superstructures which have been raised in the Physical and Moral sciences"
-Thomas Jefferson

And yes, you also chose Locke. He really is a colossus. Nowadays, most people know him for the political philosophy his second treatise and his support for religious freedom, but he also wrote, what was for over 100 years, the most important book on education in England (which advocated treating children as rational creatures, rather than toys), as well as being the most important philosopher of British empiricism and theory of mind.

Now, the Rationalism/Empiricism divide is an interesting one, because really, both are equally valid.

The founder of Empiricism Francis Bacon, inventor of the scientific method, cornerstone of the physical sciences. In physics/chemistry/biology you test something a million times and get the same result, it's considered proved. Experience is the basis of empiricism. It's "a posteriori" (after). Bacon, and all of Empiricism's major philosophers, were British. Newton, also, was first and foremost an experimental scientist and his math used physical analogies.

While, the founder of Rationalism is first and foremost... a Mathematician! Descartes, which united equations and Geometry. Nothing in math can be proved through any amount of testing, a Mathematical Proof is pure logic. Rationalism believes knowledge can indeed be acquired "a priori", through logic alone. Mathematicians talking amongst themselves are rationalists, they believe they're discovering real truths. Leibniz was the last major rationalist, and it's his notation that we use for calculus, not newton's. (They both invented calculus simultaneously). All of the rationalists are from the European continent, not Britain, and all were, first and foremost, mathematicians, not experimental scientists.

(Note: Immanuel Kant set the stage for attempts to reconcile these two)

EDIT: Another interesting difference between Rationalism/Empiricism is that mathematical proofs use Deductive reasoning, while empirical experimentation uses Inductive.

As for political philosophy, England, the "Charter of Liberties", the Magna Carta precursor, was issued in 1100, a mere 29 years after the Norman Invasion, and since the Magna Carta, the king lost absolute power and they had a proto-parliament. So England has had a lot of experience (a posteriori!) with politics. Locke and others helped consolidate it, by formulating the argument for Democracy (That the government serves the General "Free Will" of the people) and Liberty (That government must respect the liberty, or "Free Will of individuals" using philosophical"a priori", arguments from first principles.

Now, note that Britain still has a King. He remains, perhaps like a vestigial organ on an animal. Civil institutions, politics, are living, evolving things, and the product of trial and error which we may not be able to totally understand. That's an argument for a conservative temperament, in the sense of skepticism towards radical change. Taken to the extreme, as in Nazism it becomes a rejection of all a priori arguments, a rejection or reason itself. While, a liberal temperament, or faith in a priori arguments, can become communism where that faith is too great, and all existing institutions are seen as valueless and destroyed.

I realized I bypassed the direct concerns of your post. I found a great quote from wikipedia about that, though. It's in the wikipedia article on Leibniz, mathematician and rationalist philosopher:

Quote:Work in the history of 17th- and 18th-century ideas has revealed more clearly the 17th-century "Intellectual Revolution" that preceded the better-known Industrial and commercial revolutions of the 18th and 19th centuries. The 17th- and 18th-century belief that natural science, especially physics, differs from philosophy mainly in degree and not in kind, is no longer dismissed out of hand. That modern science includes a "scholastic" as well as a "radical empiricist" element is more accepted now than in the early 20th century.

That intellectual revolution is also known as The Enlightenment.

thanks for the thoughts jv. Although the time period specified is rather loose.

there have been many intellectual titans for sure.

and as one can see, the 'service' one offers can be quite rational and in the domain of science. Wandering is not all about the energy bodies and developing psychism

far from it, it is adopting the limitations of 3d and working with them (although those limitations are less restrictive than convention would have us believe).

expanding the realm of what is 'possible' is done through the spread of ideas. And that is great service indeed (offering someone else the possibility of seeing themselves in a more 'expansive' light').

namaste mr JV (java man is your new nick )

Rationalism/Empiricism are considered "epistemology", or the study of how we acquire knowledge. Extreme empiricists sometimes say that empiricism rests upon no assumptions, but this is false. It, and the scientific method, make one major assumption: Causality. That is, that there are causes and effects. In truth, Empiricism/Scientific method is method of finding truth by analyzing and testing causes and effects; the epistemology of Causality.

Another interesting question is the scope of causality. A philosophical Determinist see everything in the world as being entirely the result of a great chain of cause and effect. Another idea is the "cosmological argument", which is that, the chain of causality must have a beginning, a 'First Cause' and thus a 'Prime Mover'.

EDIT: This idea goes back to Aristotle, but the Father of Empiricism and the Scientific Method, Francis Bacon, has a great quote about this argument:

Quote:A little philosophy inclineth man's mind to atheism, but depth in philosophy bringeth men's minds about to religion. For while the mind of man looketh upon second causes scattered, it may sometimes rest in them, and go no further; but when it beholdeth the chain of them, confederate and linked together, it must needs fly to Providence and Deity.

Or the Newton Version:

Quote:The main Business of natural Philosophy is to argue from Phenomena without feigning Hypotheses, and to deduce Causes from Effects, till we come to the very first Cause, which certainly is not mechanical.

Causality is arguably the most important and central concept in all of Buddhism, where it is known as "Dependent Origination". It is the basis for the ideas of karma, rebirth, and emptiness. The goal of a Buddhist is to understand that everything arises dependently, that is, everything was caused, and is thus "empty" of inherent existence. Karma is causality where the first cause, the 'seed' comes from the free will of a sentient being. The final effects, the ultimate 'fruit' of this 'seed' at the end of the chain of causation, is determined entirely by the original intention. One desires not to simply accumulate good karma to better one's conditions in the eventual hope of achieving liberation from causality itself, and hence no longer be bound to reincarnation - another result of causality.

With harvest, we are not bound by karma, are we (forced to reincarnate)?

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(08-26-2013, 06:02 PM)plenum Wrote: [ -> ]far from it, it is adopting the limitations of 3d and working with them (although those limitations are less restrictive than convention would have us believe).

Thanks for this. I like hearing that our limitations are less restrictive than we sometimes think. It's about working with the limitations we do have, I agree. Even if I am a wanderer, I've chosen to be here at this time, complete with limitations, because on the other side there are no limits. I wanted to experience limitation, albeit how crazy that sounds now.

Quote:8.6 Questioner: How did the United States learn of the technology to build these land [inaudible]?

Ra: I am Ra. There was a mind/body/spirit complex known to your people by the vibratory sound complex, Nikola. This entity departed the illusion and the papers containing the necessary understandings were taken by mind/body/spirit complexes serving your security of national divisional complex. Thus your people became privy to the basic technology. In the case of those mind/body/spirit complexes which you call Russians, the technology was given from one of the Confederation in an attempt, approximately twenty-seven of your years ago, to share information and bring about peace among your peoples. The entities giving this information were in error, but we did many things at the end of this cycle in attempts to aid your harvest from which we learned the folly of certain types of aid. That is a contributing factor to our more cautious approach at this date, even as the need is power upon power greater, and your people’s call is greater and greater.

Quote:11.25 Questioner: Then I assume you can’t name him and would ask you where Nikola Tesla got his information?

Ra: I am Ra. The one known as Nikola received information from Confederation sources desirous of aiding this extremely, shall we say, angelically positive entity in bettering the existence of its fellow mind/body/spirit complexes. It is unfortunate, shall we say, that like many Wanderers the vibratory distortions of third-density illusion caused this entity to become extremely distorted in its perceptions of its fellow mind/body/spirit complexes so that its mission was hindered and in the result, perverted from its purposes.

Quote:26.20 Questioner: Thank you. In the recent past of the last thirty to forty years the UFO phenomena has become known to our population. What was the original reason for— I know there’ve been UFOs throughout history, but what was the original reason for the increase in what we call UFO activity say in the past forty years?

Ra: I am Ra. Information which Confederation sources had offered to your entity, Albert [Einstein], became perverted, and instruments of destruction began to be created, examples of this being the Manhattan Project and its product.

Information offered through Wanderer, sound vibration, Nikola [Tesla], also being experimented with for potential destruction: example, your so-called Philadelphia Experiment.

Thus, we felt a strong need to involve our thought-forms in whatever way we of the Confederation could be of service in order to balance these distortions of information meant to aid your planetary sphere.

I think the task is given to the Wanderers/duals whom see it in potential to exhibit some necessary changes.
Or like, basically Confederation says we are being more careful cause the technological route to enlightenment has somewhat backfired, and we take the blame.
The Ra material is another such technology, which one may note the intense desire within for purity of service (trying to create something which cannot be tainted).
One musts be careful in ones interactions/services.
Honestly I don't see too much of a difference between densities, as all are pondering and worshiping the One Infinite Mystery in it's subtlety and majesty, comprehension itself as is an ever-changing current. Ever-anew..

I see a night and day difference between the densities. As different as I am from a rock, is higher density compared to us. I honestly can't wait for the day when I walk the steps of light, and graduate. I feel confident I can make it.