Bring4th

I feel that others and myself seem more "zen" for lack of a better word the past few months. I see it most clearly in the forum posts of others, in real life with others, and in myself (presumably ). It also seems there has been much growth and balance in many people in this same time period.

Has anyone else noticed this?

In another post, Q'uo pointed out "rejoice in being here" because of how much we planned and fought to be here. I talked with a Christian lady, and mentioned how I like zen just a couple of days ago. I feel ok for the most part. But sometimes it's hard being here. I've noticed much growth in myself. In others, I tend to give them the benefit of the doubt, so I don't see so much growth in others, as I had always seen much potential in them already.

It's going to be interesting how this year ends up. The only thing I dread is the performance review where we have to fill out some text about how we think we did, and get feedback from the manager. I've done quite a bit of work, but not as much as some people. The end of the year and midyear reviews are two times that I don't look forward to. But thankfully they are only about a week long each.

Xise you have helped me in the past with some of your responses. I don't recall them atm, but I remember them being very helpful. I believe others have become more accepting of me. That's one thing I've noticed improve and change. We're just lucky to be alive at this time, being able to serve others and help mother Earth with our vibration. It makes me want to stick around for at least a little while, so that I can keep being of service. Because once I depart 3D I may never return to it. So I'm giving Creator all the experience I can while I'm hear. In the more drawn out higher densities without the veil, security is total, and we realize our creatorhood and finally become gods in our own right. When you realize you're a god for eternity, life might become monotonous. But I don't know. There's so much to create.

GW, you are a beautiful soul. Thank you for your kind words brother.

it's good to take stock of one's personal experience every now and then; almost like an oil check to see how the car is doing : d

my own observation would be that personal catalyst seems harder to avoid than ever before. It is not so much that it is more intense, or more brutal, but that it is more 'relentless' in my opinion. This is based on observations in myself and close others (both on the forums, and friends in my personal space) over the last 3 months. This 'unavoidability' of catalyst can make things seem much more confronting; as these represent one's deepest fears and imbalances (referencing a thread title that you posted a long time back).

but not being able to avoid these things also presents a golden opportunity to move forward ... to address these deepest issues.

I have seen the following MASSIVE UPHEAVALS in many others in these last few months:

* sudden job changes (not always chosen)
* sudden moving of residence (again, not always chosen)
* relationship changes (either breakups, or the tentative exploring of serious dating after a long time out of the game).
* the sudden onset of spiritual abilities, offering either a confirmation or a new avenue of service-to-others

now, these life occurences happen all the time, but they appear to me, at least, to be crammed and stacked into a small window of time for many people.

the external changes just represent internal opportunities, and the external is just the surface presentation of much chaotic swirl.

- -



if I could trace a date, I think things started going haywire and quite 'crazy' around the time that caycegal posted this thread: http://www.bring4th.org/forums/showthread.php?tid=7861

I am sure, that others, like myself, who are sensitive to these fluctuations in energetic environment (external to self), will have noticed a tidal wave or roller coaster of peaks and troughs of energy since that time. Activity and posting on the forums/chat is reflective of these dramatic climbing up and dropping down of available (earth?) energy.

for the longest time (more than 6 months now) I have been up-in-the-air as if these 'energetic fluctuations' were my internal state or if I was reading something environmental. In the past, I would have said I was projecting my own internal state onto the outside, but as I have gotten much more in balance in the last 2 years, I am reasonably comfortable in making a delineation between external and internal causations these days.

I would definitely describe the environmental energies affecting all of us as having the quality of a massive rollercoaster.

those who are more aligned and in tune can 'ride' this rollercoaster and make use of what it offers (and just sit tight and ride out the lulls); for those who are less internally 'stable' it can be a rough road indeed; with the upbeats feeling like a frenetic orchestra playing too fast, and the low points almost like 'death', with total loss of vital energy and inability to participate or share. (loss of creative mojo).

- -



earth changes? the onset of 4d vibrations? increase in the photon in local space?

thoughts are becoming things?

Quote:40.9 Questioner: Has the vibration of the basic, of the photon, of all our particles increased in frequency already?

Ra: I am Ra. This is correct. It is this influence which has begun to cause thoughts to become things. As an example you may observe the thoughts of anger becoming those cells of the physical bodily complex going out of control to become what you call the cancer.

these vibrations causing greater self-transparency?

Quote:40.12 Questioner: You mentioned that thoughts of anger now are causing cancer. Can you expand on this mechanism as it acts as a catalyst or its complete purpose?

Ra: I am Ra. The fourth density is one of revealed information. Selves are not hidden to self or other-selves.

The imbalances or distortions which are of a destructive nature show, therefore, in more obvious ways, the vehicle of the mind/body/spirit complex thus acting as a teaching resource for self revelation.

These illnesses such as cancer are correspondingly very amenable to self-healing once the mechanism of the destructive influence has been grasped by the individual.

things are definitely changing, and this is not the ressurection of a 12-21-12 meme : D.

The psychological quality of experience is becoming more 'translucent'.

Hiding from the self seems much less possible now.

and this can be a scary, and also ecstatic, way of being.

(09-29-2013, 12:57 PM)xise Wrote: [ -> ]GW, you are a beautiful soul. Thank you for your kind words brother.

(09-29-2013, 01:25 PM)plenum Wrote: [ -> ]The psychological quality of experience is becoming more 'translucent'.

Hiding from the self seems much less possible now.

and this can be a scary, and also ecstatic, way of being.

I feel more integrated, like part of me is a sun. It offers sometimes scary catalyst. The times when my mind was slipping were scary. I agree that lots more transparency is made available now. I still have unconscious, and still have shadow to integrate. But as long as I remember that part of me is a star, I shine on both the good and the bad. I bring life to many beings whom I care for deeply. I am also Creator, but I find being a star to be more exciting at the moment. Because my love and my light makes the difference for those beings. I can't wait for 4D or higher, when truth is revealed, and it becomes obvious our relation to the cosmos. I've wanted to have my own Universe, but I think being a star is phenomenal enough. I sometimes feel the heat of this sun in my heart chakra. It is the furry star.

A lot of sexual fusion happens in a star. But it's also a peaceful place.

(09-29-2013, 12:33 PM)xise Wrote: [ -> ]I feel that others and myself seem more "zen" for lack of a better word the past few months. I see it most clearly in the forum posts of others, in real life with others, and in myself (presumably ). It also seems there has been much growth and balance in many people in this same time period.

Has anyone else noticed this?

Yes, I have noticed it so many times I gave up mentioning it every time. Some people have hit what I would refer to as a 'personal renaissance', and I was simultaneous noticing I had reached a lot of the same epiphanies. I consider it a synchronicity. The number of times I have experienced general synchronicity in 2013 has nearly become obnoxious.

---

Plenum, That was a very profound post. I am flabbergasted when I come to so many of the same conclusions on my own silently then see it reflected in another's post on this forum.

After having some difficult times this summer, I have had a wonderful week; in dreamtime my (or someone else's) spirit guides have helped me to heal some decades-old traumas. I feel much lighter in spirit than I have for some time.

I've been doing a ton of work in my dreams, too, Eddie. Dreams are such a valuable resource.

Chuckling at the notion that these thoroughly new-age framed remarkes were not an integral part of the meme. All the hallmarks present, even use of borrowed terminology and ad hoc neologisms to convey apprehensions from lopsided intuitive perception. Exaggeration, magical thinking, self-fulfilling prophecy (framing), etc. Give credit where it's due.

(09-30-2013, 06:30 PM)zenmaster Wrote: [ -> ]Chuckling at the notion that these thoroughly new-age framed remarkes were not an integral part of the meme. All the hallmarks present, even use of borrowed terminology and ad hoc neologisms to convey apprehensions from lopsided intuitive perception. Exaggeration, magical thinking, self-fulfilling prophecy (framing), etc. Give credit where it's due.

Feel free to comment on your own life experience instead of judging others admittedly subjective experience. Exaggerating the positive, reframing the negative, and believing that it's all part of a grand intelligent plan sounds like an incredibly effective way to maximize positive catalyst.

(09-30-2013, 07:19 PM)GentleReckoning Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-30-2013, 06:30 PM)zenmaster Wrote: [ -> ]Chuckling at the notion that these thoroughly new-age framed remarkes were not an integral part of the meme. All the hallmarks present, even use of borrowed terminology and ad hoc neologisms to convey apprehensions from lopsided intuitive perception. Exaggeration, magical thinking, self-fulfilling prophecy (framing), etc. Give credit where it's due.

Feel free to comment on your own life experience instead of judging others admittedly subjective experience. Exaggerating the positive, reframing the negative, and believing that it's all part of a grand intelligent plan sounds like an incredibly effective way to maximize positive catalyst.

Anything and everything anyone does sounds like an incredibly effective way to maximize positive catalyst. Easy is it not.

Forgive me, I'm not sure I'm familiar with the term "positive catalyst" (and perhaps "negative catalyst")? If someone could be so kind as to explain.

Edit: Ok found an explanation! I still need to finish book 4! Anyway, question withdrawn

Quote: 94.12 Questioner: It seems to me that the Experience of the Mind would act in such a way as to change the nature of the veil so that catalyst would be filtered so as to be more acceptable in the bias that is increasingly chosen by the entity. For instance, if the entity had chosen the right-hand path the Experience of the Mind would change the permeability of the veil to accept more and more positive catalyst, and also the other would be true for accepting more negative if the left-hand path were the one that was repeatedly chosen. Is this correct?

Ra: I am Ra. This is not only correct but there is a further ramification. As the entity increases in experience it shall, more and more, choose positive interpretations of catalyst if it is upon the service-to-others path and negative interpretations of catalyst if its experience has been along the service-to-self path.

94.14 Questioner: I can understand, to use a poor term again, the necessity for an archetype for Catalyst or a model for Catalyst of the Mind, but what is the reason for having a blueprint or model for Experience of the Mind other than this simple model of the dual repository for the negative and positive catalyst? It would seem to me that the first distortion of free will would be better served if no model for experience were made. I’m somewhat confused on this. Could you clear it up?

Ra: I am Ra. Your question is certainly interesting and your confusion hopefully productive. We cannot learn/teach for the student. We shall simply note, as we have previously, the attraction of various archetypes to male and to female. We suggest that this line of consideration may prove productive.

(09-30-2013, 08:26 PM)xise Wrote: [ -> ]Forgive me, I'm not sure I'm familiar with the term "positive catalyst" (and perhaps "negative catalyst")? If someone could be so kind as to explain.

Edit: Ok found an explanation! I still need to finish book 4! Anyway, question withdrawn

Quote: 94.12 Questioner: It seems to me that the Experience of the Mind would act in such a way as to change the nature of the veil so that catalyst would be filtered so as to be more acceptable in the bias that is increasingly chosen by the entity. For instance, if the entity had chosen the right-hand path the Experience of the Mind would change the permeability of the veil to accept more and more positive catalyst, and also the other would be true for accepting more negative if the left-hand path were the one that was repeatedly chosen. Is this correct?

Ra: I am Ra. This is not only correct but there is a further ramification. As the entity increases in experience it shall, more and more, choose positive interpretations of catalyst if it is upon the service-to-others path and negative interpretations of catalyst if its experience has been along the service-to-self path.

94.14 Questioner: I can understand, to use a poor term again, the necessity for an archetype for Catalyst or a model for Catalyst of the Mind, but what is the reason for having a blueprint or model for Experience of the Mind other than this simple model of the dual repository for the negative and positive catalyst? It would seem to me that the first distortion of free will would be better served if no model for experience were made. I’m somewhat confused on this. Could you clear it up?

Ra: I am Ra. Your question is certainly interesting and your confusion hopefully productive. We cannot learn/teach for the student. We shall simply note, as we have previously, the attraction of various archetypes to male and to female. We suggest that this line of consideration may prove productive.

Passages like this really make me wish just a little more learn/teaching had been done with this particular group of entities.

---

(09-30-2013, 08:21 PM)zenmaster Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-30-2013, 07:19 PM)GentleReckoning Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-30-2013, 06:30 PM)zenmaster Wrote: [ -> ]Chuckling at the notion that these thoroughly new-age framed remarkes were not an integral part of the meme. All the hallmarks present, even use of borrowed terminology and ad hoc neologisms to convey apprehensions from lopsided intuitive perception. Exaggeration, magical thinking, self-fulfilling prophecy (framing), etc. Give credit where it's due.

Feel free to comment on your own life experience instead of judging others admittedly subjective experience. Exaggerating the positive, reframing the negative, and believing that it's all part of a grand intelligent plan sounds like an incredibly effective way to maximize positive catalyst.

Anything and everything anyone does sounds like an incredibly effective way to maximize positive catalyst. Easy is it not.

Yes, but the mental models and tools you mentioned are some of the most effective methods for increasing positive catalyst. Thusly am I confused as to what you are communicating.

Each of the things that you mention can be used or mis-used by an individual to increase their perception of negative/positive catalyst. Your choice of adjectives lead me to believe that you subjectively believe that they are objectively not useful for this purpose.

Useful perhaps, everything has it's place, though they're not particularly efficient (or helpful).
Those tools of expression that we see being used a lot in these new age groups are effective ways of skewing one's view and conveniently escaping (reality and) responsibility.
Exaggerating something distorts the perspective of it compared to what it actually is, it is a form of dishonesty with the self.
Same can be said about the various others listed.

What's the use of all the positive catalyst if it's not processed and integrated (honestly)?

That being said I do feel much calmer than I used to, but to disregard the amount of self work involved in that process and to ascribe the major factors to some abstract conveniently self created metaphysical cause would be another form of dishonesty, though there are metaphysical principles involved. There's risk to reduce the perceived value of the self by ascribing all progress to a process which is "above" you and even more risk of over valuing oneself for perceiving being "in tune" with this process when others are perceived as not. Both cause perceptual disparity of self and other self.

Don't disregard the work you've done, but don't disregard the work you should do.

As for people within this forum, how's old greg (the ogre)? lol

Things will always be changing.

Edit: All processes capable of being imagined within your mind are within you, dis-identifying with parts of yourself is what can cause a lot of trouble.

There are awful lot of assumptions flying around this thread at this point. It may even go so far as to be negative judgments of an other self's path/progress, bordering on wet-blanketry. That is particularly interesting since it appears that everyone that has contributed so far are seasoned seekers; so it is certainly not anyone's first rodeo. Therefore, it is highly unlikely that any of the positive conclusions anyone has reached are superficial/not well thought out.

(09-29-2013, 01:25 PM)plenum Wrote: [ -> ]I have seen the following MASSIVE UPHEAVALS in many others in these last few months. . . .

I have seen this as well. Perhaps not just upheavals, but massive changes. However, even the changes which are wonderful seem to have involved personal growing pains. Everything from career changes in a big way to physical problems/surgeries to the surfacing of unresolved childhood issues. These things come up continually in life, yet it seems to me that the past months have been particularly active. I don't watch TV or involve myself with any news media, so my observations are the result of my own circle of acquaintances.

I noticed this acceleration in change starting in the second half of last year (2012). And, Zenmaster, this observation has nothing at all to do with any propaganda. Although, it cannot be discounted that the propaganda incited mass hysteria.

Aside from any information, practical or imagined, out there, I would say that unresolved, stubborn or deeply buried, old stuff is being cleared. I can conjecture it is being cleared for a purpose, and it follows that the purpose is growth. And since it appears to be on a large scale involving so many individuals at the same time, the growth, then, would be equally large as a whole.

(09-29-2013, 12:33 PM)xise Wrote: [ -> ]I feel that others and myself seem more "zen" for lack of a better word the past few months. I see it most clearly in the forum posts of others, in real life with others, and in myself (presumably ). It also seems there has been much growth and balance in many people in this same time period.

Has anyone else noticed this?

i have! personally, i think the 12/21/12 @ 11:11 trauma is finally wearing off. for me it was hard to remain balanced w/ that mysterious date still ahead of me bc my synchronicities began w/ 11:11.

(09-30-2013, 09:50 PM)GentleReckoning Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-30-2013, 08:26 PM)xise Wrote: [ -> ]Forgive me, I'm not sure I'm familiar with the term "positive catalyst" (and perhaps "negative catalyst")? If someone could be so kind as to explain.

Edit: Ok found an explanation! I still need to finish book 4! Anyway, question withdrawn

Quote: 94.12 Questioner: It seems to me that the Experience of the Mind would act in such a way as to change the nature of the veil so that catalyst would be filtered so as to be more acceptable in the bias that is increasingly chosen by the entity. For instance, if the entity had chosen the right-hand path the Experience of the Mind would change the permeability of the veil to accept more and more positive catalyst, and also the other would be true for accepting more negative if the left-hand path were the one that was repeatedly chosen. Is this correct?

Ra: I am Ra. This is not only correct but there is a further ramification. As the entity increases in experience it shall, more and more, choose positive interpretations of catalyst if it is upon the service-to-others path and negative interpretations of catalyst if its experience has been along the service-to-self path.

94.14 Questioner: I can understand, to use a poor term again, the necessity for an archetype for Catalyst or a model for Catalyst of the Mind, but what is the reason for having a blueprint or model for Experience of the Mind other than this simple model of the dual repository for the negative and positive catalyst? It would seem to me that the first distortion of free will would be better served if no model for experience were made. I’m somewhat confused on this. Could you clear it up?

Ra: I am Ra. Your question is certainly interesting and your confusion hopefully productive. We cannot learn/teach for the student. We shall simply note, as we have previously, the attraction of various archetypes to male and to female. We suggest that this line of consideration may prove productive.

Passages like this really make me wish just a little more learn/teaching had been done with this particular group of entities.

---

(09-30-2013, 08:21 PM)zenmaster Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-30-2013, 07:19 PM)GentleReckoning Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-30-2013, 06:30 PM)zenmaster Wrote: [ -> ]Chuckling at the notion that these thoroughly new-age framed remarkes were not an integral part of the meme. All the hallmarks present, even use of borrowed terminology and ad hoc neologisms to convey apprehensions from lopsided intuitive perception. Exaggeration, magical thinking, self-fulfilling prophecy (framing), etc. Give credit where it's due.

Feel free to comment on your own life experience instead of judging others admittedly subjective experience. Exaggerating the positive, reframing the negative, and believing that it's all part of a grand intelligent plan sounds like an incredibly effective way to maximize positive catalyst.

Anything and everything anyone does sounds like an incredibly effective way to maximize positive catalyst. Easy is it not.

Yes, but the mental models and tools you mentioned are some of the most effective methods for increasing positive catalyst. Thusly am I confused as to what you are communicating.

Each of the things that you mention can be used or mis-used by an individual to increase their perception of negative/positive catalyst. Your choice of adjectives lead me to believe that you subjectively believe that they are objectively not useful for this purpose.

you obviously misunderstood my comment. I was pointing out the humor (irony) in implying that the meme was not (and is not) thoroughly borrowed. Then you jumped in with some remarks about the validity of some method of framing catalyst which has absolutely nothing to do with the hypocricy involved. That increases the humor.

(10-01-2013, 01:23 PM)zenmaster Wrote: [ -> ]That increases the humor.

lol.

What, you don't find going off half-cocked with blatant projection funny?
I do. As a suitable stimulator of personal catalyst, people will always attempt to hold you responsible for their own distortions unless and until those distortions are owned. The particular way this is demanded and framed varies, but as an unconscious process, the valuing and expectations involved are usually *also* part of a meme (I.e. subcultural pattern of mind). One of the more famous is the so-called "mean green valuing meme".

(10-01-2013, 07:10 PM)zenmaster Wrote: [ -> ]As a suitable stimulator of personal catalyst, people will always attempt to hold you responsible for their own distortions unless and until those distortions are owned.

All is one. Thus, each and every mind/body/spirit complex is responsible for his or her (presumably distorted) responses, reactions, feelings, and emotions in all interaction with other m/b/s complexes and catalysts, because in ultimate reality, there is only the one Creator, interacting with itself.

I hope this is one reference to infinity that doesn't fall astray of the typical appeal to infinity issues!!

(10-01-2013, 07:18 PM)xise Wrote: [ -> ]

(10-01-2013, 07:10 PM)zenmaster Wrote: [ -> ]As a suitable stimulator of personal catalyst, people will always attempt to hold you responsible for their own distortions unless and until those distortions are owned.

All is one. Thus, each and every mind/body/spirit complex is responsible for his or her (presumably distorted) responses, reactions, feelings, and emotions in all interaction with other m/b/s complexes and catalysts, because in ultimate reality, there is only the one Creator, interacting with itself.

I hope this is one reference to infinity that doesn't fall astray of the typical appeal to infinity issues!!

In "all is one" there are no distinctions in the first place. Meanwhile, here on 3D earth, there is a process of development and lack of the understanding of that "oneness". Why is there lack of understanding of that oneness? Lack of acceptance. Why is there lack of acceptance? Separation of self from self. If all is one, then why is there separation of self from self? Oh wait, there isn't because all is indeed one.

(10-01-2013, 10:57 AM)Parsons Wrote: [ -> ]There are awful lot of assumptions flying around this thread at this point. It may even go so far as to be negative judgments of an other self's path/progress, bordering on wet-blanketry. That is particularly interesting since it appears that everyone that has contributed so far are seasoned seekers; so it is certainly not anyone's first rodeo. Therefore, it is highly unlikely that any of the positive conclusions anyone has reached are superficial/not well thought out.

I'm sorry if my post seemed like that. My post wasn't directed as much at the posters as that would have been somewhat unnecessary given that zen was pointing out humor which got misinterpreted, mine was following a certain point within that convo though not as jokingly.

My post was to the thousands of guests we get on this site who may have happened to see a post saying that magical thinking and exaggeration were fantastic ways of increasing positive catalyst (which they can be but generally aren't helpful for personal growth) and gone off trying to increase that behavior thinking it will be beneficial, also the whole "world is changing" thing. My own distortions were projected as I this is the one thing that really hurts me to see. However I purposefully try and time my posts somewhat quickly so I can still hopefully contribute yet unconsciously project a bit so I can become more aware of my distortions (not entirely conducive to group discussion and it's a habit I'm trying to wean myself off lol), needless to say I learned something about myself here lol.

I don't doubt the capability of the guests on this site but this is just something I would like to see happen less as it can really mess people up.

(10-01-2013, 01:23 PM)zenmaster Wrote: [ -> ]you obviously misunderstood my comment. I was pointing out the humor (irony) in implying that the meme was not (and is not) thoroughly borrowed. Then you jumped in with some remarks about the validity of some method of framing catalyst which has absolutely nothing to do with the hypocricy involved. That increases the humor.

Excellent. Arguing with a non-existent adversary is always good catalyst.

I have had a new job in the last couple months which brought me to a greater place of stillness and growth. I've also just moved apartments and am getting a new car (my old one was totaled) and I have had massive awakenings within myself. I've been really beginning to get know myself.

I've really, to be honest, not even thought about external energy changes because I perceive it all inside of myself. Maybe it's like the solar flares that effect people without them thinking it has anything to do with outside energy and perceiving to be their own doing. (Which it is.)

(10-01-2013, 11:03 PM)GentleReckoning Wrote: [ -> ]

(10-01-2013, 01:23 PM)zenmaster Wrote: [ -> ]you obviously misunderstood my comment. I was pointing out the humor (irony) in implying that the meme was not (and is not) thoroughly borrowed. Then you jumped in with some remarks about the validity of some method of framing catalyst which has absolutely nothing to do with the hypocricy involved. That increases the humor.

Excellent. Arguing with a non-existent adversary is always good catalyst.

Hence my point.

(10-02-2013, 02:02 AM)zenmaster Wrote: [ -> ]

(10-01-2013, 11:03 PM)GentleReckoning Wrote: [ -> ]

(10-01-2013, 01:23 PM)zenmaster Wrote: [ -> ]you obviously misunderstood my comment. I was pointing out the humor (irony) in implying that the meme was not (and is not) thoroughly borrowed. Then you jumped in with some remarks about the validity of some method of framing catalyst which has absolutely nothing to do with the hypocricy involved. That increases the humor.

Excellent. Arguing with a non-existent adversary is always good catalyst.

Hence my point.

That said, I always excuse myself for misunderstanding your posts as you tend to express yourself with the bare minimum of verbage.

(10-02-2013, 06:40 AM)GentleReckoning Wrote: [ -> ]

(10-02-2013, 02:02 AM)zenmaster Wrote: [ -> ]

(10-01-2013, 11:03 PM)GentleReckoning Wrote: [ -> ]

(10-01-2013, 01:23 PM)zenmaster Wrote: [ -> ]you obviously misunderstood my comment. I was pointing out the humor (irony) in implying that the meme was not (and is not) thoroughly borrowed. Then you jumped in with some remarks about the validity of some method of framing catalyst which has absolutely nothing to do with the hypocricy involved. That increases the humor.

Excellent. Arguing with a non-existent adversary is always good catalyst.

Hence my point.

That said, I always excuse myself for misunderstanding your posts as you tend to express yourself with the bare minimum of verbage.

The catalyst is actually available for addressing before any condition of argument is pursued.