Anybody here follow American politics much?
There is this guy Glenn Beck that has developed a pretty large following in TV audience and radio, plus selling lots of books etc. The reason I bring this up is I wonder if he knows what he is doing. His big campaign at the moment is:
We can fix everything if we just remember who we are.
That can mean so many things on so many levels but it certainly struck a chord with me. He may well be onto more than he knows.
According to Wiki, he is a roman catholic converted mormon with a 23+ million a year salary... another politician with money, and with a religious agenda as well? I don't trust him!
That being said, I don't trust any politician on earth... power corrupts, absolute power corrupts absolutely.
Chett, my impression is that Beck is an outspoken commentator who's never run for office. Do you think that's fair to say?
What do you think he meant by his famous quote? What do you see as his point of view? Do you think there's a connection between his view and the Law of One material?
Peregrinus, have you investigated Beck's material?
(01-28-2010, 01:52 AM)Questioner Wrote: [ -> ]Chett, my impression is that Beck is an outspoken commentator who's never run for office. Do you think that's fair to say?
What do you think he meant by his famous quote? What do you see as his point of view? Do you think there's a connection between his view and the Law of One material?
Peregrinus, have you investigated Beck's material?
Yes as far as I know he has not run for any office nor does he appear to intend to run. Why should he, he makes pretty good money with what he is doing.
Its not that I agree with him or not, although I do think he often has good points. Its what he is saying about remembering who we are. He may not be even aware of it or know anything at all about LOO. He does appear to be religious so perhaps he has advice he sees as coming from 'God'. No matter what the source it would seem to me that it might well spark a lot of people to wake up. Likely in ways he never thought of.
His material doesn't seem to be very 'partisan', an equal opportunity basher much of the time. The thing about remember ...not connected to politics at all, more about honor and personal responsibility and things generally more fundamental to humanity.
(01-28-2010, 02:04 AM)Chett Wrote: [ -> ]Its what he is saying about remembering who we are.
I'm not a fan of his - I prefer a less confrontational approach, and have different enough opinions that it's hard for me to enjoy his material.
That said, I think that the phrase you mention is a plea to Americans to remember what he sees as the values that defined the American Revolution. He sees those values as underlying what he sees as great about American culture and history. I get the impression that the slogan is entirely political, referring to "we" as a nation remembering what that nation is supposed to stand for. A country that "remembered" a shared heritage would elect politicians who share that memory and act in accordance with the values.
I don't know that much about the Mormon religion. But I think it's all about being told about revelations to those who are important within the church history and hierarchy, not at all about remembering any personal direct association with the divine. If that's what he meant, I'm pretty sure he'd come right out and say it. He proclaims his opinion boldly without worrying who might be offended or tune out. So why wouldn't he do that if he meant to provide a spiritual message as well as a political one?
Actually I am not intending to make a case about his intent, only he knows that. I am simply pondering on the possible result. You put those words out there enough, someone will notice, imo.
And if his intent is negative it would be most amusing that he chooses words that activate a lot more positives.
I love a good joke.
(01-28-2010, 01:52 AM)Questioner Wrote: [ -> ]Peregrinus, have you investigated Beck's material?
I have not. After my first ever encounter with a politician firsthand, I was turned off ever having anything to do with another one. They are all snake oil salesmen in my mind !!! I prefer the social complex rather than this archaic corrupt political system...
No criticism intended but isn't that a form of prejudice P?
I know this kid who wants to be politician.. He's going to be good at it because he can talk like the best of them and he plays the games. But I know him, he really wants to make a positive difference.
Since this morning one of our political parties has been officially qualified as a national socialist party... It's extremely popular even though the politicians involved are clearly a bunch of nitwits with just one point on the agenda... Throw all the jews muslims out... Behind the walls of their office they were exposed to be authoritarian run, one guy is in absolute control. They were exposed to call their own voters idiots and cattle. But no one seems to care. Maybe people really are idiots and cattle?
At any rate, I'm trying to say that there are politicians and politicians.
(01-28-2010, 08:31 AM)Ali Quadir Wrote: [ -> ]No criticism intended but isn't that a form of prejudice P?
I know this kid who wants to be politician.. He's going to be good at it because he can talk like the best of them and he plays the games. But I know him, he really wants to make a positive difference.
Since this morning one of our political parties has been officially qualified as a national socialist party... It's extremely popular even though the politicians involved are clearly a bunch of nitwits with just one point on the agenda... Throw all the jews muslims out... Behind the walls of their office they were exposed to be authoritarian run, one guy is in absolute control. They were exposed to call their own voters idiots and cattle. But no one seems to care. Maybe people really are idiots and cattle?
At any rate, I'm trying to say that there are politicians and politicians.
I believe many begin by trying to make a difference for the better, but the top is just too corrupt and powerful to allow it. All are eventually corrupted or subjugated or a combination of both.
Prejudice... is saying "Monkeys like to eat bananas" prejudice when they all do it? Perhaps my way of looking at it is a labelling of sorts, but if you can show me one good politician that will unequivocally tell the truth, I will change my stance. I may have my head in the clouds, but my feet are firmly on the ground. Ignoring how things are does not just make them go away.
(01-28-2010, 10:31 PM)Peregrinus Wrote: [ -> ]I believe many begin by trying to make a difference for the better, but the top is just too corrupt and powerful to allow it. All are eventually corrupted or subjugated or a combination of both.
Prejudice... is saying "Monkeys like to eat bananas" prejudice when they all do it? Perhaps my way of looking at it is a labelling of sorts, but if you can show me one good politician that will unequivocally tell the truth, I will change my stance. I may have my head in the clouds, but my feet are firmly on the ground. Ignoring how things are does not just make them go away.
I pretty much agree with you, but there are a few, very few exceptions .. check out Ron Paul. Most of the time I just can't stand to even listen to any of them.
(01-28-2010, 01:21 AM)Chett Wrote: [ -> ]Anybody here follow American politics much?
There is this guy Glenn Beck that has developed a pretty large following in TV audience and radio, plus selling lots of books etc. The reason I bring this up is I wonder if he knows what he is doing. His big campaign at the moment is:
We can fix everything if we just remember who we are.
That can mean so many things on so many levels but it certainly struck a chord with me. He may well be onto more than he knows.
It is funny that you bring this up my friend. I just finished watching all 4 of Beck's Monday to Thursday programs recorded. I can say without any hesitation- I loved them and I loved him.
Just listening to the press, I used to think he is a nut job. But little did I know. He is not a politician. He has a viewpoint and he very articulately presents it. It is neither negative not positive. It is about how to solve the problems of America. By going back to the roots and to the constitution. "We the People' can solve all problems and 'They the Government creates most of the problem", That seems to be his mantra. Smaller government, less bureaucracy, more freedom for the individuals are some of his solutions...He comes out really smart and really funny...
I have not heard him espouse his Mormon beliefs. And I have lived with Mormons, they are nice people. Don't mean any harm to anybody. He did talk passionately about following the Ten Commandments once, not this week. But I think spirituality is not his strong suite. He is as mistaken or misguided as average American. But I did not listen to him for his spiritual ideas. I listened to him on his social and political ideas. and I would like to continue to follow him until he gets boring...
Doesn't every politician begin by sounding like the ideas they have are wonderful, that they will save the day by restoring hope and strength and morality to their nation, and people love them for it?
You could have been describing a man named Adolph 80 years ago... people adored and loved him for his fresh thinking.
Smoke and mirrors... and people fall for it ever time.
(01-29-2010, 02:58 AM)Peregrinus Wrote: [ -> ]Doesn't every politician begin by sounding like the ideas they have are wonderful, that they will save the day by restoring hope and strength and morality to their nation, and people love them for it?
You could have been describing a man named Adolph 80 years ago... people adored and loved him for his fresh thinking.
Smoke and mirrors... and people fall for it ever time.
Indeed they have since the first cave man, no doubt.
But then we all know we will die (in this body) someday, still we do our best to live until then. That politicians tend to be STS types that would control us, well its not a reason to ignore them, its a reason to fight them. The dance of black/white, good/evil, positive/negative produces the catalyst that helps us grow.
(01-29-2010, 02:58 AM)Peregrinus Wrote: [ -> ]Doesn't every politician begin by sounding like the ideas they have are wonderful, that they will save the day by restoring hope and strength and morality to their nation, and people love them for it?
You could have been describing a man named Adolph 80 years ago... people adored and loved him for his fresh thinking.
Smoke and mirrors... and people fall for it ever time.
You/we can always take what resonates and leave what does not. I for one will not stop living for the fear of making mistakes...
What resonates with me would be ballots that were listed as such:
[ ] POOR CANDIDATE
[ ] BAD CANDIDATE
[ ] CORRUPT CANDIDATE
[ ] WORST CANDIDATE
[X] NONE OF THE ABOVE, nominate four new possibles!
Eventually, there would be one worthwhile. The one I would like to see would be the one that didn't want to be there, the one who had had a difficult life, the one who had empathy for others, who told the truth above all, and who felt it was above him/her to rule others. THAT would be a good politician.
It's not that I feel like I am not participating, nor stopping living, or living in fear. I am simply not giving MY power over to those that do not deserve it. I do not say "Here is a nice barrel. I am now going to bend over it. Have your way with me as you please." As far as I see it now, people just pick the one that gives the best performance, kind of like voting for their favorite actor, and in todays world, that could be the one and the same. People don't look at track records, at history, at the personal values. They vote for the one they like, and as thus hear what they want to hear, and see what they want to see. How on earth else would have GW, a man I am surprised finished his grade 6 education, have come to power?
fool, since you're familiar with the Glenn Beck show I wonder if you could provide some perspective.
When he talks about the roots of the country, the Founders, Constitution etc. - do you think he's historically accurate? Or is it more of an emotional hook or metaphor for what he feels the country should be about?
Do you think the Founders, Constitution etc. embodied wisdom that resonates with the Law of One? Is a return to a strict interpretation of the Constitution the best we could still do, or are there more evolved political philosophies that might serve us better today?
Do you think that Beck's suggested directions would be excellent for the country?
Peregrinus, I'm a fan of the vote lottery. To become a candidate, buy a ticket. If you win, you have to serve a term in office and then you get the jackpot and can't hold office again. This would give us politicians that can't be bought, don't care about re-election, and are a random cross-section of the population. How about it?
(01-29-2010, 05:13 PM)Questioner Wrote: [ -> ]Peregrinus, I'm a fan of the vote lottery. To become a candidate, buy a ticket. If you win, you have to serve a term in office and then you get the jackpot and can't hold office again. This would give us politicians that can't be bought, don't care about re-election, and are a random cross-section of the population. How about it?
Anything is better than the current system whereby puppets are put into power.
I don't like politics myself. Well, I don't even watch tv, so I'm usually the least informed. But it's not my purpose here to know this stuff.
(01-29-2010, 05:13 PM)Questioner Wrote: [ -> ]Do you think the Founders, Constitution etc. embodied wisdom that resonates with the Law of One?
I guess that is why I resonate with those ideas and ideals. Sometimes I think there has been some non-physical help/inspiration that caused this union. The founders were imperfect beings but they realized it and created a system that worked with checks and balances. I am not a big scholar on constitution but there are some things that I have learned and really enjoyed about it.
It is 'we the people' and not "you the people' in the constitution. They have not looked down upon the people as some illiterate herd to be shepherd. But all as equals. Constitution also stands for Individual Freedom, Justice and Liberty for all. also talks about the Persuit of happiness. Individual is the core of it all. Every individual is unique and worth respecting. Those are all great ideals. They are also not just thoughts but there are specific ways that these ideals have been incorporated in the union. These are all starting point for any journey towards the Law of One. If people are suppressed by a tyrant and big governments, they can not be free to persue happiness (however they define that term).
I believe any movement towards those ideals will be better that what we have today. Considering people to stupid and creating an elite media and socialite groups and think tanks that want to drive the nation. The big governments that keep getting bigger and want to consolidate the power in fewer and fewer hands. Sounds like STS?
Call me old fashioned but I love America and what it stands for...
The American constitution was based on the Roman Republic constitution, seeking equality for all men. Imperfect in that case, it has been imperfect in this case too. Just like communism, the ideas are beautiful, but corruption blackens it.
The Roman Constitution
The Constitution is a document created by men, of course it is not perfect. But I have yet to see a better one.
Socialist/communist/fascist ideas have a major problem in that they remove choice from people. When you forcibly take taxes from some and give money to others you have removed the chance for people to choose to give money to causes they believe in.
In the end taxes are a form of slavery. How would it be if half of your working time you had to work at a job set by the government and not get paid? Well whats the difference if they take the money after the fact for your working time?
Without choice in our behavior how can we polarize?
(01-29-2010, 09:11 PM)Peregrinus Wrote: [ -> ]The American constitution was based on the Roman Republic constitution, seeking equality for all men. Imperfect in that case, it has been imperfect in this case too. Just like communism, the ideas are beautiful, but corruption blackens it.
The Roman Constitution
It is your choice to see or find the imperfection in the magnificent. or you can try to make the imperfect move towards perfect. or you can just move forward with the best you have got. If we wait for the perfect then there will not be any movement. By the nature of the veil the imperfection is built in.
Every empire in history has fallen, and it is not the ideals that is the cause of the fall, but the corruption.
(01-29-2010, 11:18 PM)Chett Wrote: [ -> ]Socialist/communist/fascist ideas have a major problem in that they remove choice from people.
And the American people actually have choice? Having two or more corrupted or subjugated choices, both in the back pocket of the sts elite is not real choice, and those who believe it is otherwise are naive. Offering a child a choice of two shirts to wear might appease the child into thinking he/she has a choice, but it is not true choice.
(01-29-2010, 11:18 PM)Chett Wrote: [ -> ]When you forcibly take taxes from some and give money to others you have removed the chance for people to choose to give money to causes they believe in.
In the end taxes are a form of slavery. How would it be if half of your working time you had to work at a job set by the government and not get paid? Well whats the difference if they take the money after the fact for your working time?
I don't understand what point you are trying to make here. Both democracy and communism do this, not because of the system design, but because of the corruption.
(01-29-2010, 11:18 PM)Chett Wrote: [ -> ]Without choice in our behavior how can we polarize?
In what respect do you aim this question? I see the obvious you point out, but not to what end in what we speak.
(01-29-2010, 11:47 PM)thefool Wrote: [ -> ]It is your choice to see or find the imperfection in the magnificent. or you can try to make the imperfect move towards perfect. or you can just move forward with the best you have got. If we wait for the perfect then there will not be any movement. By the nature of the veil the imperfection is built in.
I am stos, a wanderer from what I believe to be the 5th density. In that, I choose to not control, but to work towards the logical goal of love and harmony. This goal, however, is not what humanity seeks. Each is too busy wanting another SUV, big screen TV, or iPod/Pad to look inward. As long as they can ignore the truth, they will. I know this to be true for I was there myself a short two years ago... I therefore accept that what is best for humanity may not be my idea, but each individuals, and that is why there is imperfection. Asking mankind to see before they open their eyes still leaves all in darkness. When they are ready, they will open their eyes and see. The time is not yet, nor will it be on earth, for that time has run out. There will be a new classroom to continue the work.
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I can't believe I am speaking about politics.... something I have always loathed. Perhaps it is another testimony to the love and light of this forum that I am able to do so without feeling sick, or perhaps it is the decency in which you discuss it with me. In any case, I thank you
(01-30-2010, 12:31 AM)Peregrinus Wrote: [ -> ]I can't believe I am speaking about politics.... something I have always loathed. Perhaps it is another testimony to the love and light of this forum that I am able to do so without feeling sick, or perhaps it is the decency in which you discuss it with me. In any case, I thank you
Consider us your spiritual-political antacid, although I'm not sure if I'm Pepto or Bismol. (See, we have both parties covered.)
(01-30-2010, 12:31 AM)Peregrinus Wrote: [ -> ]I am stos, a wanderer from what I believe to be the 5th density. In that, I choose to not control, but to work towards the logical goal of love and harmony. This goal, however, is not what humanity seeks. Each is too busy wanting another SUV, big screen TV, or iPod/Pad to look inward. As long as they can ignore the truth, they will. I know this to be true for I was there myself a short two years ago... I therefore accept that what is best for humanity may not be my idea, but each individuals, and that is why there is imperfection. Asking mankind to see before they open their eyes still leaves all in darkness. When they are ready, they will open their eyes and see. The time is not yet, nor will it be on earth, for that time has run out. There will be a new classroom to continue the work.
Just wanted to comment on this, in the giant library of sessions I had read on the L/L there was one which I think might offer some insight on this. Now I tried really hard to search for it but I could not find it at all..
Anyways there was the story of Buddha or someone like him who left his palace and his people because he thought they were ignornant and why bother. While he was meditating his guides and angels came onto him and asked him why he left, he told them the reason which was the ignorance. Then what they told him struck him deeply so that he chose to return and serve once more. They asked him I believe it was "What about those on the edge?" on the edge of crossing. For every ignorant person out there there are people on the edge ready to cross over. They just need someone to invest in them and care. I was one such person on the edge for a while, pretty ignorant. Imagine the countless people who are on this edge.
There will always be people seeking to cross over regardless how ignorant it is around them. I believe in making the LOO available wherever it is not. For those who wish to make the choice.
If this seems like infringement think of this, outer entities are not allowed to infringe what so ever, inner entities are allowed somewhat to speak on matters because they once walked the earth, INCARNATE entities should have a bit more choice, if not at least the choice to make the information more available for those who might choose to seek it and contemplate it.
We each walk our own path. The choice to ignore 'politics' is as valid as any other. I know the loss of freedoms and the increased corruption in politics tends to raise my blood pressure, I can only look in small doses. But look I feel I must, if any chance surfaces to turn the ship I want to be there to lend my small strength to the rudder.
Perhaps this makes me odd one out here, I am pretty sure I am not a wanderer. My affinity is very strongly Earth. I doubt many humans as it now stands will learn/accept the LOO but I also think the majority of humans are basically STO and would make STO choices if they have the chance.51% isn't really that much if people actually have free choice.
To quote Buddha "When the student is ready, the master appears".
I haven't left the building yet. I have my students
I was asked yesterday to provide some wisdom, in the form of a quote, for someone to give to a friend they found to be very meddlesome in other peoples affairs. When I thought of and provided the quote "There's only one corner of the universe you can be certain of improving, and that's your own self". ~ Aldous Huxley, the someone asked if this was for the troublemaker or for them self. Of course, it was for whomever would hear it.
(01-30-2010, 02:42 AM)Chett Wrote: [ -> ]We each walk our own path. The choice to ignore 'politics' is as valid as any other. I know the loss of freedoms and the increased corruption in politics tends to raise my blood pressure, I can only look in small doses. But look I feel I must, if any chance surfaces to turn the ship I want to be there to lend my small strength to the rudder.
And perhaps that ship will need help steering in the near future (hint hint).
(01-30-2010, 02:42 AM)Chett Wrote: [ -> ]Perhaps this makes me odd one out here, I am pretty sure I am not a wanderer. My affinity is very strongly Earth.
If you have love in your heart, you are not odd here. On the contrary, you fit in quite well
(01-30-2010, 02:42 AM)Chett Wrote: [ -> ]I doubt many humans as it now stands will learn/accept the LOO but I also think the majority of humans are basically STO and would make STO choices if they have the chance.51% isn't really that much if people actually have free choice.
People do have the free choice, which is why they are exactly where they are. I agree the vast majority will eventually become harvestable sto, but for now they are simply not ready. In that is no wrong, and they are loved each and every one no less for it. All is perfect
I do love this forum, words that uplift all the time, provides excellent balance for those days when the world looks dark.
Thanks for the Huxley quote. Its an idea I have often followed but didn't realize it came from Huxley.
Things are perfect just as they are, all is as it should be.
I need to repeat those words a lot, its very easy to get distracted.
(01-30-2010, 12:31 AM)Peregrinus Wrote: [ -> ]-------------------------
I can't believe I am speaking about politics.... something I have always loathed. Perhaps it is another testimony to the love and light of this forum that I am able to do so without feeling sick, or perhaps it is the decency in which you discuss it with me. In any case, I thank you
My friend! I feel the same way...
I can not wait to log on and experience the beauty and love on this forum being distributed
Interesting thread.
To me, Ra seemed to bless the American experiment, the ideals of the founders, and the idea of participating in the political process when they mentioned that Thomas (Jefferson) and Benjamin (Franklin) were wanderers.
Ra also mentioned the possibility of invasion by fascist or communist forces, suggesting, perhaps, that we are not yet in either of those camps.