Quote:Ra, 1.7: There is no polarity for all will be, as you would say, reconciled at some point in your dance through the mind/body/spirit complex which you amuse yourself by distorting in various ways at this time. This distortion is not in any case necessary. It is chosen by each of you as an alternative to understanding the complete unity of thought which binds all things.
If everything is perfect, there is nothing to change and there is nothing to desire except what exists in front of us. When we incarnate, we do it with the intent to change something or change ourselves. It has become undeniable to me that incarnation itself is a depolarizing act. Not a severe one but depolarizing nonetheless. To me, it is now a concious rejection of this planet, its environment and the people I interact with to the extent that I shape them with my very existence.
Beyond the lower thresholds of the positive polarity, we have to make the choice to reject certain aspects of this universe. Some call this service, they try to reject "evil," ignorance, chaos, destruction by balancing it out through this service, with the imposition of light. True love sees nothing to fight or change. I see nothing to change.
It is only desire that gives this game leverage. It is only through desire we come to incarnate. And it is only through the most hungry of desire and left-handed will one comes to incarnate in abstract realms such as this one even after being aware of the inherent unity that exists in all.
Wanderers are not like most of their kind. Coming here is a concious descension, a defiance of striving towards all. It is quite beautiful.
(12-20-2013, 06:53 PM)Adonai One Wrote: [ -> ]Quote:Ra, 1.7: There is no polarity for all will be, as you would say, reconciled at some point in your dance through the mind/body/spirit complex which you amuse yourself by distorting in various ways at this time. This distortion is not in any case necessary. It is chosen by each of you as an alternative to understanding the complete unity of thought which binds all things.
If everything is perfect, there is nothing to change and there is nothing to desire except what exists in front of us. When we incarnate, we do it with the intent to change something or change ourselves. It has become undeniable to me that incarnation itself is a depolarizing act. Not a severe one but depolarizing nonetheless. To me, it is now a concious rejection of this planet, its environment and the people I interact with to the extent that I shape them with my very existence.
Beyond the lower thresholds of the positive polarity, we have to make the choice to reject certain aspects of this universe. Some call this service, they try to reject "evil," ignorance, chaos, destruction by balancing it out through this service, with the imposition of light. True love sees nothing to fight or change. I see nothing to change.
It is only desire that gives this game leverage. It is only through desire we come to incarnate. And it is only through the most hungry of desire and left-handed will one comes to incarnate in abstract realms such as this one even after being aware of the inherent unity that exists in all.
Wanderers are not like most of their kind. Coming here is a concious descension, a defiance of striving towards all. It is quite beautiful.
oh really. then how are you supposed to evolve further. (unless you're 7d)
It was definitely not necessary that I experience separation. I can kind of agree with you about incarnation not being necessary. But we choose to because we want to experience limitation. The soul is infinite, and when we are on the other side we know our infinite nature.
I hadn't thought of incarnating as being depolarizing. Not sure if I can agree fully, since by our choices we either polarize or depolarize. But I do believe that coming here made things harder for me. But maybe I wanted a challenge. If life is depolarizing, I don't want to come back again. Though I don't think in my service of being a radiator of love/light that I am taking a spiritual step backwards.
(12-20-2013, 07:28 PM)bosphorus Wrote: [ -> ] (12-20-2013, 06:53 PM)Adonai One Wrote: [ -> ]Quote:Ra, 1.7: There is no polarity for all will be, as you would say, reconciled at some point in your dance through the mind/body/spirit complex which you amuse yourself by distorting in various ways at this time. This distortion is not in any case necessary. It is chosen by each of you as an alternative to understanding the complete unity of thought which binds all things.
If everything is perfect, there is nothing to change and there is nothing to desire except what exists in front of us. When we incarnate, we do it with the intent to change something or change ourselves. It has become undeniable to me that incarnation itself is a depolarizing act. Not a severe one but depolarizing nonetheless. To me, it is now a concious rejection of this planet, its environment and the people I interact with to the extent that I shape them with my very existence.
Beyond the lower thresholds of the positive polarity, we have to make the choice to reject certain aspects of this universe. Some call this service, they try to reject "evil," ignorance, chaos, destruction by balancing it out through this service, with the imposition of light. True love sees nothing to fight or change. I see nothing to change.
It is only desire that gives this game leverage. It is only through desire we come to incarnate. And it is only through the most hungry of desire and left-handed will one comes to incarnate in abstract realms such as this one even after being aware of the inherent unity that exists in all.
Wanderers are not like most of their kind. Coming here is a concious descension, a defiance of striving towards all. It is quite beautiful.
oh really. then how are you supposed to evolve further. (unless you're 7d)
Evolution will occur whether one strives for it not. Even if one goes against it. Evolution is only significant to one's existence if they choose it to be such. It is a doctrine, not a reality that evolution and lessons are why we are here. It is an interpretation of our lives, only one truth out of many.
Consider that change doesn't exist in how we think of it.
Instead consider that we're constantly flipping through an infinite amount of present realities. Some are different. Some of similar. But no one reality changes into another - they all exist, just is not presently experienced if that's not the one we're in. I don't believe in this form we can experience all realities simultaneously.
Is a curiosity to experience a seemingly unexplored (for some definition of unexplored) specific reality necessarily a reject of other realities? If the the self is the Creator, it is not fitting to create your own experience without rejection? Isn't that what the Creator does - when he creates anything, does he truly reject anything? If so, each and every creation of any free will is a rejection of other scenarios by that definition, and that doesn't fit with my understanding of the unity of creation. I believe that's what's so interesting about infinity. Distinct creations, yet all together in unity.
Nothing is rejected, all exists in reality. Perhaps in a different form, or once we're fully able to accept something in one reality we can start accepting multiple simultaneous realities. The Creator does not reject by creating; I don't think we don't reject by creating our reality. Where it gets confusing is that we can create reality through rejection and power and control, but we can also create reality through love and acceptance. The power-control-rejection scenario breaks down at high levels due to the holographic nature of each entity being the creator (so how can one have control over another that is really itself), whereas the love and acceptance scenario is consistent with the holographic nature of consciousness. I'll have to flesh out and think about these ideas a bit more.
To put another way, if I'm the Creator, and all entities are the Creator, and all realities exist simultaneous, then all realities are being accepted. Maybe I personally want to shift my point of view with another reality, but each reality has a version or multiple versions of me experiencing it if the reality as it has the Creator. I'm literally everywhere, as I'm the Creator...you are too. We're everywhere at once. Nothing is rejected, though we can deceive ourselves into thinking you aren't me, and therefore what I experience is different from what you experience.
My experience is your experience; we just haven't realized it yet in this paradox of time. The consciousness writing these words is a uniquely distorted form of the same but differently distorted consciousness that read these words, but ultimately we're the same consciousness. You, me, us and I are all talking to ourselves yo, and apparently we're having a blast
Yes I agree xise. Bashar talks about All that Is. In that everything that is possible already exists in a parallel reality. And we're just shifting through billions of parallel realities per second. This philosophy of the Law of One resonates with me the most.
I like what you say about creating multiple simultaneous realities. I'm looking forward to the reality where I can create entire Universes. By what you say, we create reality doing anything at all. We can't help but create reality. But it's what level we are creating at. Even on the other side of incarnation, after death, we are creating realities, much more rapidly. I look forward to being able to create my desires. Unless on the other side we don't have desires. I'm not sure.
(12-20-2013, 07:45 PM)xise Wrote: [ -> ]Consider that change doesn't exist in how we think of it.
Instead consider that we're constantly flipping through an infinite amount of present realities. Some are different. Some of similar. But no one reality changes into another - they all exist, just is not presently experienced if that's not the one we're in. I don't believe in this form we can experience all realities simultaneously.
Is a curiosity to experience a seemingly unexplored (for some definition of unexplored) specific reality necessarily a reject of other realities? If the the self is the Creator, it is not fitting to create your own experience without rejection? Isn't that what the Creator does - when he creates anything, does he truly reject anything? If so, each and every creation of any free will is a rejection of other scenarios by that definition, and that doesn't fit with my understanding of the unity of creation. I believe that's what's so interesting about infinity. Distinct creations, yet all together in unity.
Nothing is rejected, all exists in reality. Perhaps in a different form, or once we're fully able to accept something in one reality we can start accepting multiple simultaneous realities. The Creator does not reject by creating; I don't think we don't reject by creating our reality. Where it gets confusing is that we can create reality through rejection and power and control, but we can also create reality through love and acceptance. The power-control-rejection scenario breaks down at high levels due to the holographic nature of each entity being the creator (so how can one have control over another that is really itself), whereas the love and acceptance scenario is consistent with the holographic nature of consciousness. I'll have to flesh out and think about these ideas a bit more.
To put another way, if I'm the Creator, and all entities are the Creator, and all realities exist simultaneous, then all realities are being accepted. Maybe I personally want to shift my point of view with another reality, but each reality has a version or multiple versions of me experiencing it if the reality as it has the Creator. I'm literally everywhere, as I'm the Creator...you are too. We're everywhere at once. Nothing is rejected, though we can deceive ourselves into thinking you aren't me, and therefore what I experience is different from what you experience.
My experience is your experience; we just haven't realized it yet in this paradox of time. The consciousness writing these words is a uniquely distorted form of the same but differently distorted consciousness that read these words, but ultimately we're the same consciousness. You, me, us and I are all talking to ourselves yo, and apparently we're having a blast
that was fun to read. gold star for u.
"quantum mechanics says all realities exist simultaneously until observation forces the wave function to collapse into a single reality. some believe that there is only 1 reality & that nothing is real until the wave function collapses. (so if a tree falls down in the forest and no one is around, there is no sound.) other people believe that all realities exist."
Now we might as well enjoy it.
Why did you incarnate to depolarize? What is the lesson in that?
(12-20-2013, 06:53 PM)Adonai One Wrote: [ -> ]If everything is perfect, there is nothing to change and there is nothing to desire except what exists in front of us.
I think the fact that you come to this conclusion, and then the fact that we're here despite the fact, is good evidence as to why saying "everything is perfect" is mostly useless in the way people say it in third density.
Quote:It has become undeniable to me that incarnation itself is a depolarizing act.
May be undeniable to you, but Ra would disagree, at least if the Wanderer is to penetrate the reason for its incarnation.
Quote:36.17 Questioner: Then what is the motivation for the… Oh, let me finish that question first. What is the motiv— what is the mechanism that this unusual sixth-density entity would wish to gain to polarize more negatively through wandering?
Ra: I am Ra. The Wanderer has the potential of greatly accelerating the density whence it comes in its progress in evolution. This is due to the intensive life experiences and opportunities of the third density. Thusly the positively oriented Wanderer chooses to hazard the danger of the forgetting in order to be of service to others by radiating love of others. If the forgetting is penetrated the amount of catalyst in third density will polarize the Wanderer with much greater efficiency than shall be expected in the higher and more harmonious densities.
So the idea that wandering is a defiance of "striving towards all" doesn't hold up against this view. Wanderers incarnate with two purposes...to serve, and to further their evolution.
Edit:
Just in case that Ra quote is misconstrued as being irrelevant as Don specifically mentions negative polarizing Wanderers, here's another:
Quote:52.9 Questioner: Well, I would just include the question as to why time of harvest is selected by so many Wanderers as time for incarnation?
Ra: I am Ra. There are several reasons for incarnation during harvest. They may be divided by the terms self and other-self.
The overriding reason for the offering of these Brothers and Sisters of Sorrow in incarnative states is the possibility of aiding other-selves by the lightening of the planetary consciousness distortions and the probability of offering catalyst to other-selves which will increase the harvest.
There are two other reasons for choosing this service which have to do with the self.
The Wanderer, if it remembers and dedicates itself to service, will polarize much more rapidly than is possible in the far more etiolated realms of higher-density catalyst.
The final reason is within the mind/body/spirit totality or the social memory complex totality which may judge that an entity or members of a societal entity can make use of third-density catalyst to recapitulate a learning/teaching which is adjudged to be less than perfectly balanced. This especially applies to those entering into and proceeding through sixth density wherein the balance between compassion and wisdom is perfected.
We are talking to Ourselves. This fact always makes me smile in mirth.
*crawls back into mother's womb since incarnation is not necessary*
(12-20-2013, 11:03 PM)Bring4th_Austin Wrote: [ -> ]Quote:It has become undeniable to me that incarnation itself is a depolarizing act.
May be undeniable to you, but Ra would disagree, at least if the Wanderer is to penetrate the reason for its incarnation.
...
So the idea that wandering is a defiance of "striving towards all" doesn't hold up against this view. Wanderers incarnate with two purposes...to serve, and to further their evolution.
I simply refer to the initial choice to incarnate. All other choices can be polarizing and to a sum much greater than the polarization lost. My only point is incarnation comes out of a resistance, likely small, of the self and the planet one is incarnating to.
In the eyes of Wisdom, helping another is a resistance, rejection of their current state and catalyst. Any act of compassion requires a loss of polarity to aid such. Although the polarity gained after the act will be, again, of a far greater sum.
I do not intend to disparge but make a point about how polarity isn't black-and-white and that the all-accepting entity doesn't interfere at all.
(12-20-2013, 09:32 PM)Tanner Wrote: [ -> ]So, now what?
We accept ourselves and our choices.
Helping another is not resistence if the other is seen as self. Is not the Creation perfect also in its transformation? Is not the continuous change as perfect as the stability of eternity? Compassion is not resistence if it is seen to be without attachment.
Wherein is the paradox resolved in that the all accepting entity must also accept its own existence and influence? Where is there interference where all is seen as self aiding self?
What you see as a rejection of a state, I see as an acceptance of evolution. There is acceptance and rejection inherent in all choices, that is why they are choices because the fulcrum of will is weighted and where we place our choice determines where the weight of our will falls.
What I see here is descriptive perception. You are giving a description of a process based on your personally perceived relationship to it in terms of what is acceptance and what is rejection. This is valid, but it is not really encompassing of the whole truth. The whole truth includes all descriptions, both positive and negative, accepting and rejecting, and we choose which aspect of that whole we are going to focus our will upon.
To use a simple analogy, say we have water in a sink that has a plug in. Say the plug is then taken out, the catalyst for the water. Now, the water must flow down the drain, but if it thought about it it could come to three basic conclusions.
One, that it is a good, positive thing, there is acceptance of the new pathway down the drain, the old form of the sink is left behind but not forgotten and the force that allowed it, the one who pulled the plug, is seen as a boon.
Two, it is an unfortunate thing, the shape of the sink must be rejected and the form of the self rejected for freedom to flow, the force that allowed it seen to be disruptive of the continuing self.
Three, the water flows.
You see, in all of these the same event is occuring but the mental description that may be applied to it is multidimensional based entirely on the perspective between self and other self. We musn't confuse the actuality of reality with our mental descriptions.
You are correct, Tanner. All that is left to consider is how "the creator" in its entirety exists, influences and accepts its influence.
(12-20-2013, 06:53 PM)Adonai One Wrote: [ -> ]When we incarnate, we do it with the intent to change something or change ourselves.
Quite the opposite actually. We partake in the incarnation process to regress back and realise our true selves. 'Lessons' and 'Catalyst' is merely a crutch we use to remove those distortions and beliefs which prevent us from doing so, allowing one to align more effectively with their core whilst in-carnate (
In-the-
flesh). 'You are that which you seek' afterall. As is stated in the Ra Material, the Higher Self, or Oversoul, is a mid sixth density entity which is the end sum result of development, so what exactly are you learning if you've already 'learnt' all there is?
"All learning is remembering" - (The common attribution is to Plato).
The core aim of evolution is essentially to return to Source contributing the net sum experience accumulated across the way for the benefit of the whole so that it may use what has been learnt to invest in new experience in an ever increasing awareness/expansion of it's Infinite 'Self'.
Late edit: Was told to emphasize the 'understanding' of the Self, rather than learning, both on the Micro (individualised Spirit) and Macro (Source/Origin/Infinite Creator) levels.
From my experience I have come to feel that the result was created first and acts as a "future pull", then the equation (current state of this realty) or story on how we got to that result is created as a deepening and celebration to what is. A prequel if you will.
*Takes off Jack Black style*
This is not real reality, it´s just a tribute!
Woven in the brand new art form called linear time
-------------
This reality can only be viewed as real within its own system, Just like Money is only real within its own system, and outside that system it is meaningless.
Then again, talking about the realness of this reality here is almost like falling asleep and talking with one of your dream characters about how there is a more real life on another level of wakefulness that is not on the same level of forgetfulness that’s within the Dream.
to quote gemeni "Now we might as well enjoy it." <3
“And an individual mind must continually gain in knowledge and power of concentration, or become stagnant; for there is no center in the Universe that is not changing for better, or worse, during a period of evolutionary activity. Everything must evolve, or devolve.”
What men call life is evolution. "What men call death is dissolution. When the atoms composing a man's physical body have ceased to vibrate at a rate rapid enough for the mental, or higher, consciousness to hold them together, as a center of physical force, the man has ceased to manifest upon the material plane and his physical atoms must be dispersed. The dispersed physical atoms will again be attracted to other material centers while the same magnetic mind will create another material body by attracting other atoms, of a higher rate of vibration, into its matrix.
And when this Cosmic Day is done, and this period of time has ended, the manifestation of God—Universal Consciousness—will again become vibrationless. The atoms composing all centers in the Universe will cease to rotate and will remain motionless where they once manifested. And it shall then come to pass that, "In the place where the tree falleth, there it “shall be"; and evolution will rest until the dawn of another Cosmic Day.”
Excerpt From: Ingalese, Isabella, joint author. “Fragments of truth.” New York, Dodd, Mead and co., 1921. iBooks.
Adonai One, in light of your supposed hypothesis;
The transmission of the Ra material, if viewed as a 'de-polarizing act' due to abridgement of free will, would only be reconciled by means of Ra's wanderers actually interpreting and carrying out the lessons contained therein- including the lessons about past activities and age-old loss of polarization/karma for the Ra complex which has in-part bounded them/us to a karmic contract with this planet/peoples (though the original act/risks undertaken were made in a more 'universal contract', pertaining to the subsequent laws after free will including Responsibility). This act of Wandering could also possibly be a (temporary?) de-polarizing act, as the lessons and polarity may needs to be re-covered.
Though they/we are already integrating these poles as a unified being, would not the work created within this vast unified paradox be that which empowers the will to accept the light/lessons that 7D seeks in order to octave up?
Therefore even the 7D being (which is by any definition I can muster, a very 'positive adept') is maybe even more so susceptible to these de-polarizing risks- 'actions' carried out in faith in the One Infinite and with out expectation. Of course that last one is a long-learned lesson, but that's fine our time here is likely infinite right.
It is my hypothesis is that the next octave is reached at the singularity of ALL life within this octave coalescing into Unity which means that these minor/major shifts in polarity may be a most efficient means of forcing the experiment into completion, catalyst in it's most scientific definition. I think it is important to note that the completion of any experimental reaction is called the state of Equilibrium, hence the necessity for Balancing and also the conscious/subconscious(lol) crystallization of the green-ray for the positive adept, universal acceptance. The 'narrow band' vibration which is experienced/eminated by such a frequency of beingness is only an other step towards freedom- a freedom which can only truly be obtained Together. This is why it is necessary for the 'Laws' of conduct. They do not need to be obeyed, even the Confederation doesn't stick word-to-word as they are really unworded and variable parameters, it is a system of co-operation, and the greatest service to others is a willingness to become United, or so it seems my friends. Peace, Adonai.
This is important to note, I think, as in creating 'limited' systems through which to experience Ourself we must also leave an opening-whether it be a pin-prick hole for light to shine through, etc, as the operator does not prefer to compute infinite loops, lol.
I can sympathize with your perspectives Adonai. There is also the idea of calling and aiding in the manner requested however..that wanderers incarnate because people want help. So it's not so much about moving in one direction over the other, but simply answering a request for help..service for service's sake. These quotes may be helpful:
"It, however, constitutes a great calling which we of all creation feel and hear as if our own entities were distorted towards a great and overwhelming sorrow. It demands our service."
"The general cause of service such as the Confederation offers is that of the primal distortion of the Law of One, which is service. The One Being of the creation is like unto a body, if you will accept this third-density analogy. Would we ignore a pain in the leg? A bruise upon the skin? A cut which is festering? No. There is no ignoring a call. We, the entities of sorrow, choose as our service the attempt to heal the sorrow which we are calling analogous to the pains of a physical body complex distortion."
Also, consider that even seemingly "logical" thoughts are, in part, a product of our distortions and biases.
For example, negative entities have closed green and blue rays. Yet their logical is often be impeccable. Their distortions simply give them a certain perspective that may be incomplete to those who are more balanced, but perspective itself is not illogical. However, because of the distortions within them, they would find attraction to thoughts that deny the worth of the other self, and involve in manipulations of power.
Now, in a somewhat similar analogy, consider an entity that has a weak red or a weak orange. They too might have impeccable logic and a certain perspective. However, what thoughts would they be drawn to? Thoughts of a unsatisfying physical existence? Thoughts that an incarnation is unneeded and unnecessary?
Each of our distortions gives our thoughts a certain flavor, for which logic does not necessarily immediately reveal. Keeping this in mind can reveal different perspectives on the same question much more easily than examining whether A + B = C. Just something to consider as you ponder your current inquiry.
Intellectualization is like the grand-daddy of all avoidance/distraction methods. Distracting self from emotions, honest perceptions, etc.
Ad hominem. This isn't about me. Thank you.
I find this incredibly disrespectful. Both of you are not even addressing the actual proposition.
(12-21-2013, 06:33 PM)Adonai One Wrote: [ -> ]Ad hominem. This isn't about me. Thank you.
I find this incredibly disrespectful. Both of you are not even addressing the actual proposition.
Brother, my last post was not directed completely at you. If you read my post in a vacuum outside of other threads in this forum, it may seem to come somewhat out of left field.
But there have been other threads in this forum about dissatisfaction with the illusion (quite a few really) and I think that dissatisfaction and finding reasons not to incarnate can have similar themes that I thought it interesting to comment on; to see the patterns therein.
As I am interested (obsessed!) about balance I look at all inquiries from many perspectives, but one perspective being what does the inquiry itself tell us about ourselves? I am sorry if I offended you. I freely admit that my orange is always in need of work so I assure you I was not trying to assert some sort of superiority or put you down. I think I may understand where you come from as sometimes I feel that your posts are somewhat aggressively commented upon; but I assure you this was not my intent.
Much love A1. This blue ray thing is such a work in progress as well!
Interpretation of catalyst.
Making sense where there is none, it´s a lot of fun
non-sense is my Word of the day
suddenly nonsense makes a lot of sense
How the hell did we get so dense?
Situation vibration unknown
who is it really on the other side of my internal phone?
Probably a garden gnome
(12-21-2013, 03:52 PM)rie Wrote: [ -> ]Intellectualization is like the grand-daddy of all avoidance/distraction methods. Distracting self from emotions, honest perceptions, etc.
Tool - Lateralus Wrote:Over thinking, over analyzing separates the body from the mind.
Withering my intuition, missing opportunities and I must
Feed my will to feel my moment drawing way outside the lines.
I think intellectualization, as rie is conveying, is not quite the same as over thinking, or over analyzing. Check it:
Intellectualization
Yes it's a defense mechanism. I've seen it in the form of trying to over-think things just to avoid other experiences... like the time someone tried to parallel discontent of life to discontent of how religious scriptures were interpreted. Usually evident what they are not say but actually saying.