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She's a bit mystical for my tastes but I'm sold on this episode.



Melissa

Her perspective is very inspiring, practical and like a breath of fresh air compared to most new age woo-woo.

Fang

This is some pretty selfish hack philosophy, and I've seen some s*** in my day

Her definitions of humility are weird, and disturbing...

The most dangerous thing you can give a person is the idea that they are perfect, too many Icarus Complex cases in the spiritual community already.
The words sound good but why does it look like she's talking down to the viewers rather than uplift them?

I mostly hear "You're stupid, you don't get this, this is beyond your comprehension, understand this". Another great example how we see things different, perhaps =)
Overall I understand she's trying to communicate the value of divine identity; to encourage that confident energy lost in our youth and to realize that we are of infinite worth. It's certainly true and I think we should explore our feelings and desires related to those ideas.

But I agree with Fang that the message has a type of dark type of energy. Well I guess it's best to say she's trying to tackle two very large issues, self-worth and authority (two things that are their own discussions yet also overlap) in such a small video that all sorts of assumptions have to be made, creating a message that is incomplete and imbalanced. These things are refined in a lifetime of balance. For instance, using her baby and the bottle analogy, she doesn't mention that it is the divine feminine full of grace and gentleness that nurtures and gives in this world, which first provides a foundation of support so that things are possible. For if there were no givers, no one would receive. That's worth meditating on. It's a quote I came up with too, you can use it Tongue

So life is a give and take, an exchange, an energy transfer if you will. We can have self-worth and desires, but we also have to realize that others are worth it also.
Giving and taking should never connote sacrifice or lowering the self if one loves the self in unison with all things.

Melissa

This is the reason why she calls herself a spiritual catalyst. She projects strong feminine energy and she's very comfortable with herself. It's not something most people are used to seeing, so it may appear a bit 'scary' or intimidating at first.

But it's silly to base your opinion after watching just one video/topic.
Her definition might be laden with her biases, beliefs, world views, and assumptions. According to her, humility is about feeling special due to the bonding between mother-child that becomes inflated at pathological levels whereby the parents must use shame as means to deflate overinflated self-worth.

My understanding thru experience: Humility might be about coming from a place of learning - that one is ever learning and growing and improving. It's about remaining open to the possibility of not knowing or improving. It's not about self-worth or significance. It's about being open and flexible to discover self. Humility or humbleness is often misunderstood as meek or degrade oneself and happens across cultures in this world. Often by those who have orange and yellow ray catalyst about their own self-worth and issues around relationships w/ 'authoritah'.

When catalyst is interpreted positively, we don't feel shame or stupid or insignificant/deflated/meek or overinflated/significant etc- we appreciate that we are able to accept something with openness of heart and mind bc we are learning something new about self & world around us. One might feel gratitude and knowing that, yeah I did not understand this before and now I am grateful for this lesson for I have grown. Humbled. Perhaps it may be something like: teach me please, bc I do not understand.
Do you believe learning is inherent, rie? Also, please note that I agree with your definition although I would consider it an open acceptance to all possibilities, not just an open mind to certain things in certain subjects.
(05-28-2014, 03:10 AM)Adonai One Wrote: [ -> ]Do you believe learning is inherent, rie? Also, please note that I agree with your definition although I would consider it an open acceptance to all possibilities, not just an open mind to certain things in certain subjects.

Open heart & mind is what I wrote - all systems go. Yeah all possibilities.

Inherent? Why not. Why do you ask?
For some believe that learning is something that requires sacrifice of one's values for another set.
After watching Teal's video and reading some of the replies, it seems not everyone present agrees on the definition of humility. To be sure, here is the definition of being "humble" according to the dictionary:

Dictionary.com Wrote:humble
[huhm-buh l, uhm-]

adjective, humbler, humblest.
1. not proud or arrogant; modest:
to be humble although successful.

2. having a feeling of insignificance, inferiority, subservience, etc.:
In the presence of so many world-famous writers I felt very humble.

3. low in rank, importance, status, quality, etc.; lowly:
of humble origin; a humble home.

4. courteously respectful:
In my humble opinion you are wrong.

5. low in height, level, etc.; small in size:
a humble member of the galaxy.

verb (used with object), humbled, humbling.
6. to lower in condition, importance, or dignity; abase.

7. to destroy the independence, power, or will of.

8. to make meek:
to humble one's heart.

As you can see, six out of eight of the definitions are, I would consider, mostly negative or lowering in nature. It's no wonder Teal denounces humility in her video considering its strictest definition. We have come to sometimes describe and experience humility differently in modern culture, and that is well; someone who does not believe they are above others is someone considered humble. Where the problem lies when it comes to humility, I believe, is when someone is told they must be of lesser importance than another, when they are told they must prove their worth and earn their dues. This also happens to correspond to the dictionary's definition of being humble. My understanding is that everyone is worthy of happiness, love and care, regardless of their status. An arrogant man, a balanced man and a humble man alike are deserving of unconditional support. However, it would seem several schools of thought among society and religion emphasize humility as the greatest of all virtues and, in some more extreme cases, as the only way to redemption.

Nowhere in the video does Teal ascribe to a philosophy of elevating the self above the others; she focuses instead on the celebration of everyone's individual gifts and vouches for harmony and love in all her videos.

Finally, I will have to respectfully disagree with you Fang about the following statement you made: "The most dangerous thing you can give a person is the idea that they are perfect". While I see all perspectives as valid, I do not believe a philosophy which relies on abasement of the self is effective in the long run; carrying such beliefs fervently can actually lead to the development of distortions related to low self-worth, guilt, shame and self-hatred. I believe all men and women are born perfect. I also believe that if more people were to adopt such a view, unconditional love inwards and outwards would flow more freely. And as for myself, in life, I am not moved by a desire for ascension, transcendence or perfection; I am simply moved by love for my desires, for myself and for others, equally valued.
(05-28-2014, 01:37 AM)Melissa Wrote: [ -> ]This is the reason why she calls herself a spiritual catalyst. She projects strong feminine energy and she's very comfortable with herself. It's not something most people are used to seeing, so it may appear a bit 'scary' or intimidating at first.

By dark I mean some of the things she says reinforces separation and illusion..darkness. For instance, she suggests that people in power, religious leaders, and just authority structures or anything perceived as negative in the world is against us..something other than self. But we know that the nature of these things is that they are always pointing towards something within the self, and so those things are distortions of distortion of distortion. They're things I would have said in the past, so I don't think she is wrong for feeling those things, I just think insights are always available.

(05-27-2014, 02:13 PM)Adonai One Wrote: [ -> ]Giving and taking should never connote sacrifice or lowering the self if one loves the self in unison with all things.

I don't think we should lower ourselves either. We should explore what we want and express ourselves in the face of catalyst. It's just that many times, especially when it comes to personal relationships, conflict is pointing towards something we haven't recognized. This is a large topic and so context is everything.

I've seen you mention issues with your parents before, which I've dealt with, and in a lot of ways I had to continually learn to be myself and reject certain pressures. As I grow, I'm learning that they mirror me in a lot of ways however.

"This contact may be characterized as one typical of the Brothers and Sisters of Sorrow wherein those receiving the contact have attempted to prepare for such contact by sacrificing extraneous, self-oriented distortions in order to be of service."

"Each present sacrificed much for no tangible result. Each may search its heart for the type of sacrifice, knowing that the material sacrifices are the least; the intensive commitment to blending into an harmonious group at the apex of sacrifice. Under these conditions we found your vibration."

"We may indicate that the crux ansata is a part of the concept complexes of the archetypical mind, the circle indicating the magic of the spirit, the cross indicating that nature of manifestation which may only be valued by the losing. Thus the crux ansata is intended to be seen as an image of the eternal in and through manifestation and beyond manifestation through the sacrifice and transformation of that which is manifest."

"Secondly, we thank you for we know what you sacrifice in order to do that which you as a group wish to do."
Even spiritual catalysts like Teal Scott has her own catalyst, no? It would be fascinating to ask what her personal experience is around humility and how she learned what she knows about 'humility'. How she began to form her own definition and understanding of humility.
Ra only acknowledged that Carla and co. were sacrificial. I have never seen Ra directly endorse sacrifice.

(05-28-2014, 12:39 PM)reeay Wrote: [ -> ]Even spiritual catalysts like Teal Scott has her own catalyst, no? It would be fascinating to ask what her personal experience is around humility and how she learned what she knows about 'humility'. How she began to form her own definition and understanding of humility.

You are very focused on people accrediting themselves via experiences.
(05-28-2014, 01:25 PM)Adonai One Wrote: [ -> ]Ra only acknowledged that Carla and co. were sacrificial. I have never seen Ra directly endorse sacrifice.

(05-28-2014, 12:39 PM)reeay Wrote: [ -> ]Even spiritual catalysts like Teal Scott has her own catalyst, no? It would be fascinating to ask what her personal experience is around humility and how she learned what she knows about 'humility'. How she began to form her own definition and understanding of humility.

You are very focused on people accrediting themselves via experiences.

Accrediting?

Melissa

Icaro, thanks for that clarification. Though she generally always advocates what you've described, as I've heard her say it many times in her videos. She's stated that she often adapts her language so people can relate to, or understand, what she's saying, since she came in with full pre-veil memory, but those memories or concepts tends to 'alienate' her, in a sense, from the people she's trying to assist. Makes sense to me. I don't necessarily agree with everything she says but I find her perspective, and the way she's empowering others very interesting and inspiring.

Reeay, if you're interested than find some of her interviews on youtube, where she talks extensively about how she came to be. One of the things I appreciate about her is her vulnerabilty, being very open about her own struggles, emotional turmoil and deep shadow work (her past was extremely horrifying) ;on her path of healing, love, acceptance; the whole shabang.
(05-28-2014, 05:54 PM)Melissa Wrote: [ -> ]she came in with full pre-veil memory

Oh, where do I sign up?
(05-28-2014, 05:54 PM)Melissa Wrote: [ -> ]Icaro, thanks for that clarification. Though she generally always advocates what you've described, as I've heard her say it many times in her videos. She's stated that she often adapts her language so people can relate to, or understand, what she's saying, since she came in with full pre-veil memory, but those memories or concepts tends to 'alienate' her, in a sense, from the people she's trying to assist. Makes sense to me. I don't necessarily agree with everything she says but I find her perspective, and the way she's empowering others very interesting and inspiring.

I'll have to listen to some more of her videos. I've heard some others before but her background sounds interesting.
Yes I have watched many of her videos. I dunno, if one holds similar views as she does around humility this might be something that 'resonates' but it doesn't match my understanding. If to her the idea is about 'shaming' overinflated sense of self-worth and significant, I am assuming there are life experiences that confirmed this belief. Sounds like personal stuff. Basically we share what we believe based on evidence for belief. You collect evidence based on personal experience (e.g., history) then make own judgments (discernment). Basic psychology.
With this video and discussion in mind, why did Ra insist on being credited as "an humble messenger of the Law of One."
Quote:62.23 Questioner: Isn’t this unusual that a fifth-density then would bother to do this rather than sending a fourth-density servant, shall I say?

Ra: I am Ra. This is correct. Nearly all positive channels and groups may be lessened in their positivity or rendered quite useless by what we may call the temptations offered by the fourth-density negative thought-forms. They may suggest many distortions towards specific information, towards the aggrandizement of the self, towards the flowering of the organization in some political, social, or fiscal way.

These distortions remove the focus from the One Infinite Source of love and light of which we are all messengers, humble and knowing that we, of ourselves, are but the tiniest portion of the Creator, a small part of a magnificent entirety of infinite intelligence.

I will note, in my personal interpretation, that they never truly lower themselves but speak on their proper representation of the whole.

(05-29-2014, 05:43 PM)reeay Wrote: [ -> ]Yes I have watched many of her videos. I dunno, if one holds similar views as she does around humility this might be something that 'resonates' but it doesn't match my understanding. If to her the idea is about 'shaming' overinflated sense of self-worth and significant, I am assuming there are life experiences that confirmed this belief. Sounds like personal stuff. Basically we share what we believe based on evidence for belief. You collect evidence based on personal experience (e.g., history) then make own judgments (discernment). Basic psychology.

It's possible to have too much self-worth? So, is it possible to give certain people too much worth? Should we limit the value of people thusly?
I believe humility isn't necessarily about self worth or significance but the ability to remain open and flexible to learn and discover self.
Ra defines humility here as well, in their interpretation:

Quote:12.31 Questioner: Is there a best way for these entities to heal themselves of their physical ailments?

Ra:...

The seventh or violet ray is unimpaired, this being not only an energy receptor but a sum total of the vibratory level of the individual. The other energy centers are also quite clear. The solution to healing in this case is action that puts into practice the peaceful understanding in humility distortion that the entity is one with the Creator, therefore perfected and not separate. In each case of what you would call ill health one or more of these energy centers is blocked. The intelligence of the mind/body/spirit complex needs then to be alerted either by the self as healer or by the catalyst of another healer, as we have said before....
That's not a definition . . . they're following up on a query of how wanderers can heal themselves of blockages using Carla as an example. Ra's advice for how to deal with her indigo-ray blockage related to feelings of unworthiness is to practice humility in the face of the knowledge that she is one with the creator.

So isn't Ra endorsing humility here?

(05-29-2014, 06:11 PM)Adonai One Wrote: [ -> ]It's possible to have too much self-worth? So, is it possible to give certain people too much worth? Should we limit the value of people thusly?

It is most certainly possible to have too much self-worth http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grandiose_delusions
It's certainly a context clue towards how they perceive humility. It's very clear:

"...action that puts into practice the peaceful understanding in humility distortion that the entity is one with the Creator, therefore perfected and not separate."

"...we are all messengers, humble and knowing that we, of ourselves, are but the tiniest portion of the Creator, a small part of a magnificent entirety of infinite intelligence."

And they call themselves humble. I don't think you can shape it in any other way with what they provide. I think to shape this to something else is to put a hand up Ra's butt and make them speak for you. Humility, to them, is clearly oneness with the creator and seeing all as magnificent and perfected.

They are endorsing humility within their own context.

As for your link and label, I don't consider that an over-inflated self-worth. I consider that a suppression and undervaluing of the actual self in the face of a fantasy that negates the self.
Well the way I would interpret those quotes is that Ra is saying that you have to be humble in the face of the knowledge of your nature as being one with the creator if you want to polarize positively, otherwise there is danger of falling prey to the distortion of unworthiness (like Carla) or the distortion of over-inflated self-worth which can lead one to feeling that they belong to an elite.
(05-29-2014, 06:11 PM)Adonai One Wrote: [ -> ]They are endorsing humility within their own context.

This is a good point. Teal holds her own context for humility as well. Similar to the point Reeay is making, that the concept of humility is based on how our worldview is shaped from experience, and Teal may be coming from a place where the idea of humility seems folly because of the lessons she has learned in this lifetime. And with other people that may resonate with her, they feel that humility is detrimental to their individuation, which is a primary goal here. To others, humility may be a proper attitude for their balancing and lessons being learned.
(05-29-2014, 08:10 PM)Spaced Wrote: [ -> ]It is most certainly possible to have too much self-worth http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grandiose_delusions

I once thought it was my job to ascend the whole world, and another time to save the Universe. Talk about delusions of grandeur. I even once thought I was going to prove that God exists.