(02-14-2021, 11:14 PM)Dtris Wrote: Finally caught up. Great thread.

Infringement on Free Will is a term which first means the terms need defined. There has been attempts to define infringement, but not free will.

(...)

The ability of each individual and each society to determine their own path in all aspects, not just spiritually, is ultimately what free will is about. The STS path is quite literally about infringing on the free will of others. The more a STS individual can do so the more they polarize. If Free Will infringement was not possible in 3D then STS polarization would not be possible either. The STO path is IMO best summed up from a quote from Neal Donald Walsh, "Love Allows".

(02-15-2021, 06:38 PM)Aion Wrote: If Free Will is the First Distortion and the first movement away from "true unity", is that a suggestion that Infinity in potential is 'not free'?

Quote:27.8 Questioner: Now, I understand that the first distortion of intelligent infinity is the distortion of what we call free will. Can you give me a definition of this distortion?

Ra: I am Ra. In this distortion of the Law of One it is recognized that the Creator will know Itself.

(02-15-2021, 07:08 PM)Minyatur Wrote:

(02-15-2021, 06:38 PM)Aion Wrote: If Free Will is the First Distortion and the first movement away from "true unity", is that a suggestion that Infinity in potential is 'not free'?

To me it really is the first paradox. Could the Creator not come to know Itself? I'd think not.

Quote:27.8 Questioner: Now, I understand that the first distortion of intelligent infinity is the distortion of what we call free will. Can you give me a definition of this distortion?

Ra: I am Ra. In this distortion of the Law of One it is recognized that the Creator will know Itself.

(02-15-2021, 06:38 PM)Aion Wrote: ...
If Free Will is the First Distortion and the first movement away from "true unity", is that a suggestion that Infinity in potential is 'not free'?
...

(09-07-2012, 09:23 AM)Raz Wrote: I believe that the result is there; we experience it as the "future attractor". This reality is like an equation or prequel, designed to create a deeper understanding of that result.

Quote:27.9 Questioner: Then am I correct then in assuming that the Creator will know Itself the Creator, then grants for this knowing the concept of freedom— total freedom of choice in the ways of knowing? Am I correct?

Ra: I am Ra. This is quite correct.

Quote:We wished to impress upon those who wished to learn of unity that in unity all paradoxes are resolved; all that is broken is healed; all that is forgotten is brought to light.

(02-15-2021, 07:42 PM)Patrick Wrote:

(02-15-2021, 06:38 PM)Aion Wrote: ...
If Free Will is the First Distortion and the first movement away from "true unity", is that a suggestion that Infinity in potential is 'not free'?
...

In Unity, everything is stuck together and not free.  But it does not know about free so it's not missing anything.

What is interesting is that it became aware before becoming aware of being able to be many.

What was it like for Infinity to be aware, I AM, without freewill?

But as Ra said, all the "steps" are actually simultaneous.  So there was no moment to be aware without being aware of freewill?

1) The first known thing in creation is infinity. The infinity is creation.

2) Infinity became aware (intelligent infinity).

3) Intelligent Infinity became aware of the concept of free will.

4) It realized It was even free to consider the idea of many-ness, that is, more than one. Free will immediately gives rise to many-ness.

5) Intelligent Infinity decided to explore this idea.  In so doing Intelligent Infinity became the Creator.

6) The 1st distortion, free will, finds focus. This is the 2nd distortion the Creative Principle or Love. (Love may be seen as the type of energy of an extremely high order which causes intelligent energy to be formed from the potential of intelligent infinity in a particular way. All Love emanates from the Oneness.)

7) Love uses Its intelligent energy to create a certain pattern of illusions or densities in order to satisfy Its own intelligent estimate of a method of knowing itself.

8) This intelligent energy thus creates a distortion known as Light. From these 3 distortions come many, many hierarchies of distortions each having its own paradoxes to be synthesized, no one being any more important than another.

9) Due to the infinite possibilities of intelligent infinity, there is no ending to many-ness. The exploration thus is free to continue infinitely into an eternal present.

Here is a nice explanation of it all from our current perspective in 3d.

(09-07-2012, 09:23 AM)Raz Wrote: I believe that the result is there; we experience it as the "future attractor". This reality is like an equation or prequel, designed to create a deeper understanding of that result.

(02-15-2021, 08:10 PM)Aion Wrote: ...
Great lay out, there is one part that stands out and which turns my own mind.

"Intelligent infinity decided to explore this idea", this idea of a "decision" or a choice made is a great mystery. This sense that until this happened infinity... didn't choose...? The paradox is too great for this flesh brain.

(02-15-2021, 08:32 PM)flofrog Wrote: Neal Walsh in Conversations with God had that image offered to him, imagine a completely white room, nothing happens, and suddenly a black dot appears in one corner and suddenly everything is different and you have to have an opinion about it.

(02-16-2021, 10:51 AM)Patrick Wrote: In Unity, everything is stuck together and not free.  But it does not know about free so it's not missing anything.

(02-16-2021, 10:51 AM)Patrick Wrote: What boggles my mind is that the Infinity is somehow "more" than the set of all possibilities.

(02-16-2021, 12:28 PM)Diana Wrote: I think this has to do with another conundrum—how something infinite could evolve. But if it couldn't, then evolving would not be a possibility, and all possibilities must exist within infinity. Infinity cannot be finite.

Quote:16.39 Questioner: I am assuming it is not necessary for an individual to understand the Law of One to go from third to fourth density. Is this correct?

Ra: I am Ra. It is absolutely necessary that an entity consciously realize it does not understand in order for it to be harvestable. Understanding is not of this density.

(02-16-2021, 12:57 PM)Patrick Wrote: It's ok not to get it.

Quote:16.39 Questioner: I am assuming it is not necessary for an individual to understand the Law of One to go from third to fourth density. Is this correct?

Ra: I am Ra. It is absolutely necessary that an entity consciously realize it does not understand in order for it to be harvestable. Understanding is not of this density.

(02-17-2021, 12:45 PM)flofrog Wrote: Something like this, zedro ?    

universe to a leaf..

(02-17-2021, 02:53 AM)zedro Wrote: I find infinity is easier to comprehend when you consider it as a division (or magnification) of a single unified thing, rather than an expansive outward concept, and that the observation dynamically alters what is being observed.

So you start with say an apple (the creation as a whole) and then start to cut it into pieces. There is no limit to how many times you can divide it. Then you magnify it, and observe that there is a micro structure, and that can be divided. As you keep dividing and magnifying, you keep discovering what the apple actually is. This is the essence of the creation exploring itself, it's a continuous fractal pairing down and division process, except that the fractals are dynamic and can interact and change itself in an interative feedback process, further expanding the infinite observing of itself. Or something like that

(02-19-2021, 10:15 PM)Dtris Wrote: Now take that process and reverse it and for a true infinity it should also work in the opposite direction. In other words there is no apple.

(02-19-2021, 10:15 PM)Dtris Wrote: Now take that process and reverse it and for a true infinity it should also work in the opposite direction. In other words there is no apple.

(02-19-2021, 10:15 PM)Dtris Wrote:

(02-17-2021, 02:53 AM)zedro Wrote: I find infinity is easier to comprehend when you consider it as a division (or magnification) of a single unified thing, rather than an expansive outward concept, and that the observation dynamically alters what is being observed.

So you start with say an apple (the creation as a whole) and then start to cut it into pieces. There is no limit to how many times you can divide it. Then you magnify it, and observe that there is a micro structure, and that can be divided. As you keep dividing and magnifying, you keep discovering what the apple actually is. This is the essence of the creation exploring itself, it's a continuous fractal pairing down and division process, except that the fractals are dynamic and can interact and change itself in an interative feedback process, further expanding the infinite observing of itself. Or something like that

Now take that process and reverse it and for a true infinity it should also work in the opposite direction. In other words there is no apple.

I personally think the greatest issue to understanding is that infinity is actually not a very good word. The only two languages I know of which have better words for it is Chinese and Hebrew.

In Chinese the Wuji is the state before Taiji. Taiji is best known by the Yin Yang Diagram and is the state of polarity. Wuji is a state of undifferentiation which preceeded Taiji. The famous saying in China from the Taoist texts which is most pertinent is "One leads to two, two leads to three, three leads to the 10,000 things." One being Wuji, two being Taiji, and 10,000 things is a saying which is used to mean a lot, or an unknown number, or uncountable number.

In Hebrew the word is Ain. Which is usually translated as infinite but it doesn't really match the feel of the word. I find this one more difficult to explain. There is Ain, Ain Soph, and Ain Soph Aur. Which are usually translated as infinity, infinite limitless, and infinite limitless light. These precisely match the progression Ra explains of Infinite Intelligence, Infinite Energy, and Light.

The reason infinite is such a poor word is because it is a mathematical term for a sequence which has no beginning or end. Which since we are primarily native english speakers the concept of infinity is tied to the infinite series, or an infinite line, etc. The concepts which are behind Wuji and Ain are even more expansive for lack of a better word.

Quote:The reason infinite is such a poor word is because it is a mathematical term for a sequence which has no beginning or end.

(02-23-2021, 11:10 PM)MrWho Wrote: Then use the word "unity" instead. They are one in the same.

(02-24-2021, 07:58 PM)Patrick Wrote: In mathematics there are many infinities.  An infinity is not the same as the Infinity.