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Believing yet not without doubt - Koolaid - 02-04-2009

The Ra material and what I believe to be truths within it have changed my very existence in only positive ways. Yet I cannot help but feel uneasy, or perhaps unsure of certain things. Like, for example, Ra claims the pyramids to have been made to "look built, rather than thought" so that future generations would not conceive of them as being "other worldy". Hmm, how convenient.
And bigfoot. So there's two separate bigfoot species living in caves on the western mountain regions of North America. Which can't exactly be disproved (like all of it, which also is convenient) but those bigfoot must be masters of evasion.
And the UFOs of the new mexico area, I don't remember exactly what Ra's explanation was for the many sightings (was it the orion group?) but call me crazy but I always thought it had something to do with American's secret aircraft development, especially significant new technologies (at the time) contributing to stealth jets, etc for the war.
It would be an extreme coincidence for all of these UFOs to turn up at the exact same sites where these gorvernment aircrafts were being built. Perhaps UFO occurances were contributed BY the government to allure the public's eyes away from the real situation at hand. Makes a bit more sense to me, and just pretend this was the real case: it worked wonderfully didn't it?


RE: Believing yet not without doubt - ayadew - 02-04-2009

Hello Koolaid, there is always doubt in this density. Because ultimately there is no "absolute truth" to be percieved, only paradoxes.

Moore's paradox: "It's raining, but I don't believe that it is."

The things you state here is not really relevant I feel, they are at the edge of of "credibility" of what Ra says. But so many other things Ra says are incredibly deep and feels true intuitively.
It's your Free Will to chose whether to believe in their words.
If there was no polarity, you would never have a choice and no way to understand things. Yahweh initially intended this world to be a paradise, with only service to others, but this existence was stellar and nothing ever changed. This is not the Creators intention, he is very curious...

My personal doubts are mostly centered around this "Creator" person, why does he exist? Yet, why, is the greatest question ever asked, and noone's ever come close to answering that one.
Ra:
Quote: 8TH DENSITY: The octave, which moves into a mystery we do not plumb.
You will not find answers from Ra in that...


RE: Believing yet not without doubt - βαθμιαίος - 02-04-2009

As far as the UFOs go you should read the excerpt from session 8 in Book V. You might find that you agree with Ra on that.


RE: Believing yet not without doubt - Koolaid - 02-04-2009

Interesting.
Ra: I am Ra. These of which we spoke are of third density and are part of the so-called military complex of various of your peoples’ societal divisions or structures.

The bases are varied. There are bases, as you would call them, undersea in your southern waters near the Bahamas as well as in your Pacific seas in various places close to your Chilean borders on the water. There are bases upon your moon, as you call this satellite, which are at this time being reworked. There are bases which move about your lands. There are bases, if you would call them that, in your skies. These are the bases of your peoples, very numerous and, as we have said, potentially destructive.


A military base on the moon..hmm, if only we could head on up there and find proof of that statement it would pretty much wrap it up as far as doubt is concerned.


RE: Believing yet not without doubt - MisterRabbit - 02-04-2009

Quote:My personal doubts are mostly centered around this "Creator" person, why does he exist? Yet, why, is the greatest question ever asked, and noone's ever come close to answering that one.



I think the whole point is that there is no creator PERSON, but that the creator is all, and is intelligent energy originating in intelligent infinity. And infinity, of course, is beyond all definition, because it can have no form, so how are we to describe it? It is mystery, and that should never be lost. The minute you think you know, you've given up all chances of discovering. All words and concepts must meet short of infinity in paradox, and will never actually touch it. Yet, oddly enough, it is this very quality in which lies it's unity also: only that which is formless and infinite can truly be singular and all-encompassing. Anything else would just be a finite, limited form. I understand it simply as there is none else. I think questions like these make us realize that there is a point at which to not take the rational mind so seriously and and begin to simply see, and to simply be. To stop trying to think about the creator, and learn to be it, through opening ourseles to love.
On that note, I wrote a sort of to-do-list/poem about meditation after a particularly good session of it yesterday, which expresses what I'm talking about more...well, poetically.

Look
The sentence eels swimming
Listen
The talking heads yammering
Feel
The waves rising and falling
Taste
The saliva nectar's sweetness
Play
Within the field of infinity
Be
The silence that is
Open
And allow Love to emerge
Shine
Let the silent Love spill over
From Creation
Into creation

My poems are getting more and more "mystical" here lately. Anyway, hope that helps to illustrate what I mean by going beyond the logical "talking heads yammering" though not necessarily throwing the baby out with the bathwater, of course. See them yammering, I say. There they are! Yammer yammer yammer yammer yammer yammmer yammer yammer.........Whew, lookatem go! Such things then become playful, rather than annoying; acceptable, even as they temporarily limit us some of the time. As John lennon so aptly put it

Love is the answer, and you know that for sure
Love is a flower, you gotta let it grow
Love is surrender, you gotta let it go

Needless to say this is one of the things that I've struggled with, and so have thought alot about it. Ok I'll shut up now.


RE: Believing yet not without doubt - ayadew - 02-05-2009

Hello MisterRabbit, please note that "person" was just a figure of speech. Heart

Yes, I agree with your intepretation. We must give up the search outwards, for everything is right in front of us. We are the fractal, the hologram, we are the Creator.

Wonderful poem! It resonated with me.

Peace and love.


RE: Believing yet not without doubt - Lavazza - 02-05-2009

I have a few thoughts that might be helpful.

I also went through a short period where I read these things in the Law of One and was also very confused. Moon bases, big foot, etc... If we are to take any of the Ra material seriously, doesn't it make sense to take all of it seriously? This is a rational thought. For me it was the Giza pyramid construction that I couldn't bend my head around.

For me the bottom line really is the fact that I don't believe we can understand everything in this density, and for me this includes all of the above items. We have intellectual minds and that in itself is a great gift for figuring out things like the sciences. But I think the mistake that humanity keeps making over and over again is this false assumption that we can really know everything. When we run in to things that we can't reconcile with evidence we get uncomfortable and say "Well, that can't be true then". That is probably why Ra and Q'uo have stated time and time again that faith is an important tool for spiritual seeking.

The way I moved past this stumbling block was to accept that it's very unlikely for me to find tangible proof of these things in this life time. So I think to myself "Well, I can't say that it couldn't happen" and move on.

One last thought- Don't forget where this information is coming from. ET's communicating to us via telepathy. If you had told me that this happens a few years ago I would have called the guys in the white lab coats to take you away. My point is again, we operate on faith with this information and so it really comes down to that choice for each individual. If we could prove it there would be a much larger number of peolpe to stand behind the Law of One books, however would the material be as effective without the faith?


RE: Believing yet not without doubt - Monica - 02-11-2009

Hi Kooaid!

Thanks for expressing your doubts! Nothin' wrong with that, to be sure!

One of the things that impressed me the most about the LOO was Ra's refusal to conclusively 'prove' transient issues, such as proving the existence of ET's by landing on the White House lawn. The reason made perfect sense to me, when viewed from the perspective of a holographic UniVerse - landing on the White House lawn would prove most inconvenient for those who'd rather not be forced to believe in such things.

I remember thinking that the explanation was just so...noble. I didn't see Ra insisting that we believe such-and-such...quite the contrary: the info was presented with the caveat that we take what was useful and discard the rest. There just didn't seem to be any agenda, no matter how hard I looked for it.

That impressed me. Interestingly, it was the very LACK of concrete 'proof' presented by Ra that seemed the most compelling to me. Whereas charlatans usually try to 'prove' their deceptions, Ra had no reason to...the Truth either resonated or it didn't.

The explanation of how the pyramids were built, the UFO bases, info about abductions...all that stuff resonated with me. It made sense, in ways I never would have imagined. But that's just me! If Ra's explanations didn't resonate with you, then...just discard and keep only that which proves useful to you.

And that is the most important point of all: You don't need to accept ALL of it to find it useful. To expect it to be totally provable is, imo, to miss the point of it. The lesson for us is that it's NOT provable! That is the purpose of the Veil: to provide an environment in which we must decide for ourselves, when we have no proof...we must trust when we have no reason to trust...if it were all provable, it would negate the very point of the LOO as regards to 3D reality.

Anyone seeking absolute proof of anything presented in the LOO won't find it...of that I am certain. At least not at this point. In a few years, maybe...

PS. If, as you say, the alleged UFO evidence is really from secret military bases, then...just who IS Ra? Where did all this LOO stuff come from? (something to ponder)

peace


RE: Believing yet not without doubt - Lavazza - 02-11-2009

I ran across something from Aaron (deepspring.org) that was incredibly insightful. As usual I can't find the direct link now...

it went something like this, although I am working from memory:

"We'd like to start this session by asking all of those here who are wondering if this is real or just made up to please set the debate aside. The thoughts you are hearing are real thoughts regardless of where they come from. If you find them helpful then use them, if you do not, set them aside. Thank you."


RE: Believing yet not without doubt - sos - 02-11-2009

Hello Koolaid.
I have been following the LOO material for at least 25 years. Several years ago, I went through about a year of becoming very skeptical about it all to the point of being afraid all of it might be false and that I might have wasted a huge segment of my life placing so much energy in something that was deluded. There are some things in it that make me really wonder, but I've been very observant over the past 25+ years, and I have witnessed things unfold in a way that seems to have confirmed almost everything Ra said. But some of that skepticism surrounded the pyramids for me as well. I kept thinking that if the Great Pyramid had appeared overnight as was said, there would have been some record of that happenning since it's from the time of Imhotep, and there are many records in existence from that time. Also, there are the quarry marks and other things that make it seem very man-made. Also, the dates of the construction of the pyramids and the apparent trouble Ra had in pinning down an exact date for it that made me question it. Another thing was the statment that Uranus was moving through 1st density and woud move through all the densities. Uranus? It's on the edge of the solar system. How could it support 2nd or 3rd density life? There are many other loose ends in the material that I wish I had more info on. There is a "loose ends" thread somewhere in the forum that I've posted on. Maybe right here would be a good place to start another one. But even with the loose ends, my inner guidance tells me the LOO material is legit, as I always knew on an inner level that it was. I was incredibly drawn to it from the first time I read it. I've now probably read parts of it hundreds of times, more or less. Hope this helps.


RE: Believing yet not without doubt - MisterRabbit - 02-14-2009

As far as the whole Uranus thing is concerned, let's remember that our the sun and all the planets are already increasing in their energetic activity, and we know that stars grow over time. It could simply be that Uranus will go through the other densities far later in the development of this particular star.
To me, all these things have never been all THAT hard to believe. I had the "wow, really?" sort of feeling like I think anyone would when I first read them, but I am personally far more skeptical of the taken-for-granted conventional world-view that has been handed to us by our scientists, academics, and philosophers, than I am of the strange. In fact, I find the strange refreshing, in that it hints that there is far more than we are able to know by our rational and limited sensory means. My general attitude towards these sorts of things is simply that "There are far more things in the heavens and the earth, Horatio, than are dreamt of in your philosophies."
So, I would say to the skeptics that perhaps they should turn their skepticism also to the conventional worldview they assume must be the measure against which all others are judged. If you're going to be skeptical, be skeptical of EVERYthing, at least, not just that which is different from the view that most people agree on. If anything, the view that most people agree on ought to be the main one to be questioned.
And lastly, in my opinion, paradigmatic incombatability is not in any way an indication of the validity of evidence. All evidence should be taken on equal grounds, so far as the intellect is concerned.
And then, of course, contemplated in the heart.


RE: Believing yet not without doubt - Richard - 02-14-2009

(02-04-2009, 03:36 AM)Koolaid Wrote:  The Ra material and what I believe to be truths within it have changed my very existence in only positive ways. Yet I cannot help but feel uneasy, or perhaps unsure of certain things. Like, for example, Ra claims the pyramids to have been made to "look built, rather than thought" so that future generations would not conceive of them as being "other worldy". Hmm, how convenient.
And bigfoot. So there's two separate bigfoot species living in caves on the western mountain regions of North America. Which can't exactly be disproved (like all of it, which also is convenient) but those bigfoot must be masters of evasion.
And the UFOs of the new mexico area, I don't remember exactly what Ra's explanation was for the many sightings (was it the orion group?) but call me crazy but I always thought it had something to do with American's secret aircraft development, especially significant new technologies (at the time) contributing to stealth jets, etc for the war.
It would be an extreme coincidence for all of these UFOs to turn up at the exact same sites where these gorvernment aircrafts were being built. Perhaps UFO occurances were contributed BY the government to allure the public's eyes away from the real situation at hand. Makes a bit more sense to me, and just pretend this was the real case: it worked wonderfully didn't it?

So...perhaps the path you set for yourself this time around is to overcome your skepticism and learn to live on faith?

I can sympathize...that was hard one.

Richard


RE: Believing yet not without doubt - Koolaid - 02-19-2009

Well Richard, I think you're right. We set forth these challenges for ourselves, and I suppose I chose beforehand to have this naturally skeptical mind. It's absurd really, how I can read so many things that resonate with me and I just feel that it's right without question, and then a little thing will throw me off and if I question some minor, unimportant thing then I'm forced to question everything, even all those true feelings I've had. It's not a very proportionate ratio, but I'm working on it. I realize how I've been and that it is often illogical to let these little things make me skeptical of the whole larger picture, and now I've come to accept that there are many things that I will never be able to personally prove or disprove, and to not just throw away countless helpful learnings simply because I find something hard to believe. Now I know not to let that happen, if something is hard to believe then I leave it at that, it's simply hard for me to imagine, not impossible, and it doesn't change anything about all the positive things this material has shown me. I've still got obstacles to overcome, don't we all? I've learned not to allow myself to be so unreasonable at times. One step at a time.


RE: Believing yet not without doubt - ayadew - 02-20-2009

As one can't even prove that one exists... well...

Egypt is filled with wonder. There's a temple with perfectly aligned stones underground, completely without hieroglyphs. You mean to say that a very primitive people made these stones with copper tools and pulled the stones that weights 50+ tons..... the pyramids are an amazing catalyst. They are mysterious, and truly proves that we do not know everything.
That we cannot know everything. Thus you are free to chose what you believe and know.


RE: Believing yet not without doubt - SJD - 02-27-2009

I can identify with the doubting OP.

LOO is the best description of reality--from the standpoint of my own studies, biases, and experiences--I've ever come across; and yet, I am not prepared to characterize that material as being the unvarnished truth. My uncertainty is reflected in my lack of a large number of posts here.

But I will not hesitate to recommend the LOO as being highly worthy of consideration--as I have done many times on other Spirituality message boards.
Steve