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Being consciously unloving. - MrWho - 06-07-2021
I think it is common sense that we want to avoid accruing karmic debt. Be aware of how you treat others. Treat them with love.
Whether a vaccine or a set of guidelines to adhere too. If we follow things with a sense of treating others with love. The karmic implications will remain neutral. Catalysts will not form.
The wheel of action will remain unmoved.
Infinite love/light
https://www.lawofone.info/s/12#29
Quote:Questioner: What could one of these entities do to become karmically involved? Could you give us an example?
Ra: I am Ra. An entity which acts in a consciously unloving manner in action with other beings can become karmically involved.
RE: Being consciously unloving. - Sacred Fool - 06-07-2021
Yeah...well, maybe?
If one responds to catalyst in such a way because one "thinks" one should be loving, maybe one is not being genuine? That too, it seems, would be a way to accrue karma because the lesson is not thoroughly learned, no? So, what's the point of advising people about what their behaviour should look like when the deeper lessons--and the stronger karmic ties--lie at deeper levels? Outward behaviour is the crust; your true being is the creme. And your true being is not much affected by stuff people tell you to do on the internet, it seems to me.
RE: Being consciously unloving. - Anders - 06-07-2021
I think of our past biological and social inheritance as a form of karma. And that's a huge amount of baggage, as Dolores Cannon called karma.
And also, conscious effort to be loving is probably a useful practice. However, how do we behave from our subconscious habits? How do we behave in catalyzing and stressful situations, before our conscious mind has a chance to kick in?
RE: Being consciously unloving. - Patrick - 06-07-2021
Ultimately, one would act lovingly by nature and not just to prevent karma. But maybe all the reasons to be loving are good reasons?
RE: Being consciously unloving. - Ohr Ein Sof - 06-07-2021
Acting is one thing, beingness is another. We may act for sometime until we can learn "to be" more loving. !st to ourselves and then to All others.
After all, we are here to learn both loving and unloving ways of being and then the balance between the two, well, if that is our path.
I find it is more balanced to accept the other as it is instead of what I feel or think the entity should be.
RE: Being consciously unloving. - MrWho - 06-07-2021
@Sacred Fool. You are absolutley right. It has everything to do with being self conscious. Just getting you, and others to think about it is the point.
@Anders. All Karma can be removed and settled with forgiveness. Even if we are unaware of it. "Forgiveness is the stoppage of the wheel of karma or action."
https://www.lawofone.info/s/17#20
@Patrick Ultimately yes. However catalyst has and does go awry. "Emotional pain" is an example.
https://www.lawofone.info/s/34#6
@Ohr Ein Sof I agree. Basically it is about being "consciously aware". At least the concept is important to share in my opinion. Even for people just starting their path.
RE: Being consciously unloving. - Anders - 06-07-2021
@MrWho Okay, maybe it's easier to change the subconscious than we have been made to believe. And I believe that true forgiveness is the realization that there is nothing to forgive. Otherwise forgiveness becomes something we can decide to do or not to do which makes it a shaky situation.
RE: Being consciously unloving. - Diana - 06-07-2021
Thank you MrWho for bringing this up.
The OP quote from Ra reminds me of their quote about not getting caught up in the maelstrom.
Quote:12.28 ▶ Questioner: Are most of these from the fourth density? What density do they come from?
Ra: I am Ra. Few there are of fourth density. The largest number of Wanderers, as you call them, are of the sixth density. The desire to serve must be distorted towards a great deal of purity of mind and what you may call foolhardiness or bravery, depending upon your distortion complex judgment. The challenge/danger of the Wanderer is that it will forget its mission, become karmically involved, and thus be swept into the maelstrom from which it had incarnated to aid the destruction.
I think a Wanderer or seeker might totally get caught up in 3D things here. The collective environment is pervasive and unrelenting. For one who is trying consciously to evolve, it is like swimming upstream.
Since we are under a veil here, all subject to the same pressures, survival concerns, and chaos, it makes sense to me that in order to stay on track with whatever path one is on, self-honesty is paramount. As far as being "loving," I do agree that true unconditional acceptance (love) must flow from the authentic self.
There is more than one layer to everything as far as I can tell. So even though actions and thoughts do flow from the authentic self, which may partially be hidden and be highlighted through triggers, the desire to be kind, loving, and not harmful to others has value, even if it is through a filter that distorts it. And I think, in this, one might make a distinction between the desire not to do harm (STO), and the desire to paint oneself in a certain way (being "nice" as a way to seem "better than" or "advanced" or fitting into an established paradigm).
The bottom line for me is self-honesty, and from there, one can build a path that is rooted in acceptance. That path is not straight and clear in my experience, and twists and turns and converges and splits, but the courage to look within self to me provides the strength to walk that path wherever it goes.
RE: Being consciously unloving. - Ohr Ein Sof - 06-07-2021
(06-07-2021, 08:49 AM)MrWho Wrote: @Sacred Fool. You are absolutley right. It has everything to do with being self conscious. Just getting you, and others to think about it is the point.Btw, it is good to see ya again! I was just thinking about you a couple days ago.
@Anders. All Karma can be removed and settled with forgiveness. Even if we are unaware of it. "Forgiveness is the stoppage of the wheel of karma or action."
https://www.lawofone.info/s/17#20
@Patrick Ultimately yes. However catalyst has and does go awry. "Emotional pain" is an example.
https://www.lawofone.info/s/34#6
@Ohr Ein Sof I agree. Basically it is about being "consciously aware". At least the concept is important to share in my opinion. Even for people just starting their path.
I watched this excellent video about sharing our knowledge with others and you are correct, we can share as long as they are open to hear it. If they are not, you know....that leading a horse to water thing? I was thinking about this very thing the other day regarding a relative of mine and instead of wondering how I could say something to this person so that they would be receptive, I began to wonder why it was so important to me? Which of course, began and ended in deep self introspection.
In an increasingly hostile and divided world, I think positive seekers wish to show others the way to true freedom and that is through the ways of truth, love and understanding. Unfortunately, many times we instead end up forgiving that which refuses to forgive and love that which refuses to love. Hey! AGAIN! Good to see you! Hugs.
RE: Being consciously unloving. - flofrog - 06-07-2021
I wonder if the desire to encourage others selves on the positive path, is not because once we start to engage on it, we feel soon such a change, compared to what may have been chaos before that we wish others could feel that too. Just a thought.
Obviously not having any expectation of change lightens the way when we deal with otherselves, lol
Ramana said 'this love path has no expectations. You are uneasy riding the body?
Dismount. Travel lighter. Wings will be given.' which is pretty nice
Good to see you too, Mr.Who
RE: Being consciously unloving. - Louisabell - 06-08-2021
(06-07-2021, 08:41 AM)Ohr Ein Sof Wrote: Acting is one thing, beingness is another. We may act for sometime until we can learn "to be" more loving. !st to ourselves and then to All others.
After all, we are here to learn both loving and unloving ways of being and then the balance between the two, well, if that is our path.
I find it is more balanced to accept the other as it is instead of what I feel or think the entity should be.
This comment reminded me of the below quote, mainly the bolded part below:
Ra Wrote:10.14 Questioner: For general development [of the] reader of this book, could you state some of the practices or exercises to perform to produce an acceleration toward the Law of One?
Ra: I am Ra.
Exercise One. This is the most nearly centered and usable within your illusion complex. The moment contains love. That is the lesson/goal of this illusion or density. The exercise is to consciously seek that love in awareness and understanding distortions. The first attempt is the cornerstone. Upon this choosing rests the remainder of the life-experience of an entity. The second seeking of love within the moment begins the addition. The third seeking powers the second, the fourth powering or doubling the third. As with the previous type of empowerment, there will be some loss of power due to flaws within the seeking in the distortion of insincerity. However, the conscious statement of self to self of the desire to seek love is so central an act of will that, as before, the loss of power due to this friction is inconsequential.
Exercise Two. The universe is one being. When a mind/body/spirit complex views another mind/body/spirit complex, see the Creator. This is an helpful exercise.
Exercise Three. Gaze within a mirror. See the Creator.
Exercise Four. Gaze at the creation which lies about the mind/body/spirit complex of each entity. See the Creator.
The foundation or prerequisite of these exercises is a predilection towards what may be called meditation, contemplation, or prayer. With this attitude, these exercises can be processed. Without it, the data will not sink down into the roots of the tree of mind, thus enabling and ennobling the body and touching the spirit.
What I read the above as saying is that, even just the conscious desire or attempt to be loving, even if you're not totally feeling it, can help people along the path to being more authentically loving, which I think is pretty difficult to do all the time in this stressful world. Maybe the most loving thing one can do is to take a break and re-center one's self before re-engaging with the difficult catalyst. Having said that, I believe when one acts on emotions in sincerity, then they're not completely acting consciously as emotions are subconscious and can alter one's perception of events pretty dramatically. I believe that is why premeditated crimes are judged more harshly compared to crimes done in the heat of the moment.
RE: Being consciously unloving. - ANGEL - 06-10-2021
(06-07-2021, 08:41 AM)Ohr Ein Sof Wrote: Acting is one thing, beingness is another. We may act for sometime until we can learn "to be" more loving. !st to ourselves and then to All others.
After all, we are here to learn both loving and unloving ways of being and then the balance between the two, well, if that is our path.
I find it is more balanced to accept the other as it is instead of what I feel or think the entity should be.
Accepting someone as they are is certainly the most desirable but how do you accept when someone actively and willfully hurts others. I can not respect someone who chooses to harm others and knows they have issues and simply don't care to change. Its truly archaic and cowardly not to be willing to work on yourself when you know you have deficits. You should always be improving yourself. Cource that's a choice too.
RE: Being consciously unloving. - Patrick - 06-10-2021
(06-10-2021, 09:10 PM)ANGEL Wrote:(06-07-2021, 08:41 AM)Ohr Ein Sof Wrote: Acting is one thing, beingness is another. We may act for sometime until we can learn "to be" more loving. !st to ourselves and then to All others.
After all, we are here to learn both loving and unloving ways of being and then the balance between the two, well, if that is our path.
I find it is more balanced to accept the other as it is instead of what I feel or think the entity should be.
Accepting someone as they are is certainly the most desirable but how do you accept when someone actively and willfully hurts others. I can not respect someone who chooses to harm others and knows they have issues and simply don't care to change. Its truly archaic and cowardly not to be willing to work on yourself when you know you have deficits. You should always be improving yourself. Cource that's a choice too.
Accepting someone actively and willfully hurting others does not mean you agree with what they are doing. You can protect yourself and others from such while still accepting them as being heavily confused and in need of love and healing.
RE: Being consciously unloving. - Raukura Waihaha - 06-10-2021
(06-10-2021, 09:10 PM)ANGEL Wrote:I try to look at it as them choosing to be in the dark pre incarnation, as a sacrifice for those who need catalyst.(06-07-2021, 08:41 AM)Ohr Ein Sof Wrote: Acting is one thing, beingness is another. We may act for sometime until we can learn "to be" more loving. !st to ourselves and then to All others.
After all, we are here to learn both loving and unloving ways of being and then the balance between the two, well, if that is our path.
I find it is more balanced to accept the other as it is instead of what I feel or think the entity should be.
Accepting someone as they are is certainly the most desirable but how do you accept when someone actively and willfully hurts others. I can not respect someone who chooses to harm others and knows they have issues and simply don't care to change. Its truly archaic and cowardly not to be willing to work on yourself when you know you have deficits. You should always be improving yourself. Cource that's a choice too.
It seems they are worthy of just as much respect as those who chose other methods of helping.
RE: Being consciously unloving. - ANGEL - 06-18-2021
(06-10-2021, 09:58 PM)Raukura Waihaha Wrote: I try to look at it as them choosing to be in the dark pre incarnation, as a sacrifice for those who need catalyst.
It seems they are worthy of just as much respect as those who chose other methods of helping.
I totally agree here. It took me a long time to see this possibility as well. Sometimes I wonder if they come with the intent to help which would then be a service of love. In truth this is not likely their intent but is indeed the heart of God, using all things for the good and to glorify love. Mwah
The catalyst brought by the darkness is used mightily and the most perplexing stuff this entity has ever seen. I'm thankful though for the wisdom gained in understanding this mindset and though extremely different, certain viewpoints are spot on and calls alot into question for me as well. Its been the most horrifying and the most joyous adventure all wrapped up into one big disappointment. I intend to change that into love. Its a work in progress.
Someone here asked why it matters to stop so much, that we want to try and help the negative see love as the true great power to follow, for me its because the pain they have suffered has been my failure to love them and I know how empty and lost and afraid they feel inside. They won't tell you this and may not even believe this, but this is truth in their core. Please forgive me. Give love another chance. If any should lose themselves because of me, I just can't be ok with that. Not to mention the chaos they bring and the pain they bring. People who enjoy ruining others, those without love contained at all in the body, think about the truth and acts they have capable within them. This must stop. We need to reboot the way we think. We must give until we take our last breath so our new worlds are lined with gold and loving is all we see and create. Heal the hearts of men. Forgive and love until they see it as real instead of bullshit. Even then its not likely they will accept it. I won't give up on them though. No way no how. I can't respect their behaviors and I will not allow them to hurt others in my presence again without consequences, this is love too. After all, we are God too. God never gave up on me.
So far this standing by them, has failed miserably. They see that as weakness instead of loyalty and honoring them. Stupidity and beneath them. The strength required to love the unloving is the strength of a God. The strength to forgive the acts they do ... will require gutting you, tearing your heart to shreds, and then remembering how much power love has to reclaim its promises. Talk about a rough road to be on. Geezohflip as my dad used to say!! Miss you daddy, love you.billy always but from a distance.
RE: Being consciously unloving. - ANGEL - 08-02-2021
Someone here asked why it matters to us to try so hard to show them the way to the real power in this universe and I've been trying to do this with every person I have ever met. So here is my truth... I understand that trying to aid people who do not want it or hasn't asked for it, is likely to fall upon deaf ears. With some they hate you to your core for not seeing this truley delusional fake brilliance, they believe of themselves (in this dimensional reality), that they honestly will hurt you and as deeply as they can. Like children who have tempers etc. They can take your life so its a very serious thing. Most will eventually do a wrong to you and well I expect it. It takes more strength and courage and Godlike heroism to even want to be in the same room with some people ... let alone offer up the keys to the universe and love them anyway.
I do this because God did it for me and I have been where they are. I know it hurts deeply when we love others at times and though it is not love that is the problem, I understand why people might decide to turn their back on it and use it against us. We are under the veil and forget and can't feel the love of God bathing us in his radiance ...in our radiance 24 hours a day , we are desperate to feel any small modicum of that love in our lives again. We are ripe for the picking. They miss the point that they are hurting themselves more each and every day they act to hurt anyone.
I heard what Ra said about this being the final oppurtunity, for most people on this planet to "graduate". I also surmmised that something horrid happens if these people don't make it as it is a loss to the creator, me! The days of waiting to be asked for help are over as far as I'm concerned and I am boldly engaging in clear and precise speech that is not designed to sugar coat bullshit. These are souls and they are lost and terribly so. They act in ways that damage our souls and they sometimes do it intentionally too. What if the negative entities end up being formless ghost like apparitions sucking energy out of any air they find that still contains some, as some here have eluded too?? Hungry and lonely and full of wretched hate. Not on my watch by God and therefore if it costs my life to be bold and force them to see what I see, so be it. My ex may not deserve this love but neither did we. He will have to kill me to shut me up and that goes for everyone I determine is in need of a wake up CALL. God, knows no one spares me of mine and thank God. It takes courage to stand against ignorance and hatred. Time is short and noone ever died from kindness. Kindness is not a killer and thats all there is to it.
I'm in the trenches with the most lost of us out here and I'm there because they need love the most. Someone here once told me I needed to choose better resources, and quite frankly it only proved to me how much he needed to look at other resources himself. Do you higher folk forget how much can be learned from every resource in this world. I have learned and seen more beauty and pain standing in line at the circlek store on the corner than I can honestly say to you here. They are you too! These are you and quite frankly this is your wake up call sir. Please remember that we are all one and sitting in judgement is not helping anyone of us. There are alot of people out there that look like wastes of skin and yup I get it....but that is you and me and someone has to help them see ...someone has to help them. If not me then you??? Thats why I am here and why my resources appear to you the way they do. Instead of judging me in GOD knows what ways and inflicting more and more pain , you might try reflecting on ways you could assist me and keep your hands clean too. No worries , I'm used to living in the poorest if places and giving my life as fodder. Gotta say ... I'm about tired of resistance and needs you deem as folly. Let me do what I must AND HELP ME TO HELP THEM. IT IS MY FOCUS ALWAYS.
RE: Being consciously unloving. - Patrick - 08-02-2021
(08-02-2021, 04:41 PM)ANGEL Wrote: ...HELP ME TO HELP THEM. IT IS MY FOCUS ALWAYS.
I wish I knew how.
But like you, I'm still just figuring things out.
RE: Being consciously unloving. - meadow-foreigner - 08-02-2021
(08-02-2021, 05:07 PM)Patrick Wrote:(08-02-2021, 04:41 PM)ANGEL Wrote: ...HELP ME TO HELP THEM. IT IS MY FOCUS ALWAYS.
I wish I knew how.
Sometimes the best help one can provide is to let the loved ones experience whatever experiences they want to; providing a nest-like environment if and only if the loved ones consciously, willingly come to you for assistance; and to assist in what is asked, and not what appeals to the helper's perspective.
RE: Being consciously unloving. - sillypumpkins - 08-02-2021
Bottom line, IMO, is you can’t help those who don’t want help. Respecting another’s free will is a great yellow ray exercise, especially when you sooooo desperately want to help in the way you see fit
RE: Being consciously unloving. - J.W. - 08-02-2021
Metaphorically,
If you come across a person who is hungry, and you want to help them...
Give them a bowl of plain soup, but with the condiments (salt/pepper) on the side...
They can season it however they'd like...
We should lay out our aide as true to the foundation of the infinite creator as possible, i.e.: "duality" is one of the fundamental distortion, because existence require "contrast" for consciousness to experience itself.
Personally, I feel the best way to help is to provide undistorted understanding of the "foundation" as much as possible to the seekers... (there will be bias and distortion, but all we can do is to try our best.)
The rest will be left to the freewill of each individual soul and the experience they so choose for the infinite creator within them to experience.
l/l
RE: Being consciously unloving. - Sacred Fool - 08-02-2021
From a different perspective, the act is less meaningful than the love with which it is offered. I.e., what you do is less important (metaphysically speaking) than how much love you make your offering with.
RE: Being consciously unloving. - MonadicSpectrum - 08-05-2021
(06-07-2021, 08:49 AM)MrWho Wrote: @Anders. All Karma can be removed and settled with forgiveness. Even if we are unaware of it. "Forgiveness is the stoppage of the wheel of karma or action."
https://www.lawofone.info/s/17#20
While I do believe all Karma can be resolved with forgiveness given sufficient time to manifest, I think it is easy to be ungrounded to not have concern for consequences of one's actions because they can simply be forgiven away. Someone could, for example, choose to drink small amounts of poison every morning and bless it with love, and it's unlikely they would be skilled enough to forgive it to the point of not having negative consequences. It's important to be grounded in real temporal limitations that we have until we develop the skills to transcend them.
RE: Being consciously unloving. - Patrick - 08-05-2021
Quote:26.30 Questioner: And then, can you describe the mechanism of the planetary healing?
Ra: I am Ra. Healing is a process of acceptance, forgiveness, and, if possible, restitution. The restitution not being available in time/space, there are many among your peoples now attempting restitution while in the physical.
26.31 Questioner: How do these people attempt this restitution in [the] physical?
Ra: I am Ra. These attempt feelings of love towards the planetary sphere and comfort and healing of the scars and the imbalances of these actions.
The restitution part probably gets harder everyday for someone wanting to poison themselves on purpose everyday.
RE: Being consciously unloving. - Ohr Ein Sof - 08-05-2021
(08-05-2021, 02:46 PM)MonadicSpectrum Wrote:(06-07-2021, 08:49 AM)MrWho Wrote: @Anders. All Karma can be removed and settled with forgiveness. Even if we are unaware of it. "Forgiveness is the stoppage of the wheel of karma or action."
https://www.lawofone.info/s/17#20
While I do believe all Karma can be resolved with forgiveness given sufficient time to manifest, I think it is easy to be ungrounded to not have concern for consequences of one's actions because they can simply be forgiven away. Someone could, for example, choose to drink small amounts of poison every morning and bless it with love, and it's unlikely they would be skilled enough to forgive it to the point of not having negative consequences. It's important to be grounded in real temporal limitations that we have until we develop the skills to transcend them.
Forget it your wisdom won't be well aceepted here. I like your wisdom however as it resonates with me. While it is very true that forgiveness can squash Karma there is also a side that needs for certain amount of Karmic situations to play out instead of looking at all human suffering as needless. Some of our greatest amounts of growth have been captured through large amounts of human suffering. According to myself, the only needless suffering is what is imposed on the self by one's own self but until we are liberated from ignorance we can never know the depth of our own ignorance. Once we are consciously aware of this depth, forgiveness can be presented as the only solution. But I really enjoyed reading this comment as it resonated with me deeply.
RE: Being consciously unloving. - Ohr Ein Sof - 08-05-2021
(08-05-2021, 03:27 PM)Patrick Wrote:Quote:26.30 Questioner: And then, can you describe the mechanism of the planetary healing?
Ra: I am Ra. Healing is a process of acceptance, forgiveness, and, if possible, restitution. The restitution not being available in time/space, there are many among your peoples now attempting restitution while in the physical.
26.31 Questioner: How do these people attempt this restitution in [the] physical?
Ra: I am Ra. These attempt feelings of love towards the planetary sphere and comfort and healing of the scars and the imbalances of these actions.
The restitution part probably gets harder everyday for someone wanting to poison themselves on purpose everyday.
on purpose....means unconsciously so you could say. We are not aware 100% of our shortcomings Patrick therefore we drink the poison everyday and choose to drink it out of not being aware completely of what we are doing. Have you ever heard of this,"forgive them father for they know not what they do?" This is unconsciousness in one sentence. If you knew better, you would do better. And you will suffer and you will make others suffer until you do know better. Human suffering 101.
RE: Being consciously unloving. - Patrick - 08-05-2021
(08-05-2021, 09:27 PM)Ohr Ein Sof Wrote: "forgive them father for they know not what they do?"
The romans were torturing and killing someone in public. They did not know they were killing God. BUT they knew they were not being loving. Their intentions were consciously unloving. They just thought that doing this to a criminal was ok.
(08-05-2021, 09:27 PM)Ohr Ein Sof Wrote: ...you will suffer and you will make others suffer until you do know better. Human suffering 101.
As a seeker of the Law of One, I do know that all are God. Killing anyone or anything alive is killing God.
But the difference with those romans is that finding out that all are God did not change my intentions towards others. If they knew they were killing God instead of a criminal maybe they would have changed their minds.
As for myself, that fact changes nothing, I always had positive intentions as far as I can remember in this incarnation. I always thought everyone was important. At some point I wanted to be a prison guard, because I figured even the most evil criminal needs compassionate treatment while in prison.
So in my opinion you are hardly making a fair comparison.
That being said, I was not aware I was making people suffer. What should I know in order to not make others suffer?
RE: Being consciously unloving. - MonadicSpectrum - 08-05-2021
(08-05-2021, 03:27 PM)Patrick Wrote: The restitution part probably gets harder everyday for someone wanting to poison themselves on purpose everyday.
That's a great point. Is it possible to have true forgiveness without an equivalent change in behavior? I don't think so. If one wants to alleviate karma, I think it must have a corresponding change in behavior with behavior seeking restitution, which is the opposite behavior of the harm that was caused, being the best option. Perhaps this is the essence of spiritual bypassing and being ungrounded... not changing how one thinks and acts in response to negative consequences and simply choosing to ignore the consequences (believing this to be forgiveness) rather than understand and integrate the consequences into one's understanding of reality (what I call true forgiveness).
I like to think of karma as a form of momentum towards a way of living that lends itself to a set pattern of consequences. One may think that forgiveness is simply a change of perspective, but if this change of perspective does not lend itself to undoing the negative momentum, then it is not a change of perspective that is true forgiveness and only the illusion of forgiveness. People may think they've forgiven something when their actions show that they have not actually changed their perspective properly to stop producing negative karma.
Linking back to the poison example, someone who truly forgives themselves for drinking poison will then seek to stop drinking the poison and move the momentum in the opposite direction towards only drinking healthy drinks and undoing the harm of the poison. But if someone has built up so much momentum (such as alcohol addiction), it may take significant time and effort to fully undo the momentum even if true forgiveness or change of perspective is the first step. In contrast, an alcohol addict who believes they've forgiven themselves each time they drink in excess each day but do not change their behavior are spiritually bypassing and not actually balancing the karma.
Ohr Ein Sof Wrote:Forget it your wisdom won't be well aceepted here. I like your wisdom however as it resonates with me. While it is very true that forgiveness can squash Karma there is also a side that needs for certain amount of Karmic situations to play out instead of looking at all human suffering as needless. Some of our greatest amounts of growth have been captured through large amounts of human suffering. According to myself, the only needless suffering is what is imposed on the self by one's own self but until we are liberated from ignorance we can never know the depth of our own ignorance. Once we are consciously aware of this depth, forgiveness can be presented as the only solution. But I really enjoyed reading this comment as it resonated with me deeply.
It's alright with me however others on this forum choose to interpret or use the words I offer. I share them for purposes of helping others grow and learn based on what I've learned from my personal experience, but it's possible others don't see them as helpful which I accept as it's outside of my control. But if I help just one reader find more clarity (and I'm glad my message resonated with you), then it is worth it for my time and effort. For to help one is to help all.
RE: Being consciously unloving. - jafar - 08-05-2021
(06-07-2021, 01:41 AM)MrWho Wrote: I think it is common sense that we want to avoid accruing karmic debt. Be aware of how you treat others. Treat them with love.
Whether a vaccine or a set of guidelines to adhere too. If we follow things with a sense of treating others with love. The karmic implications will remain neutral. Catalysts will not form.
The wheel of action will remain unmoved.
Infinite love/light
https://www.lawofone.info/s/12#29
Quote:Questioner: What could one of these entities do to become karmically involved? Could you give us an example?
Ra: I am Ra. An entity which acts in a consciously unloving manner in action with other beings can become karmically involved.
I tend to see 'karma' not as a form of 'debt' (or 'profit').
But as a form of 'attachment'.
The bodies, the 'virtual sheathings', the 'identity constructs', the 'maya koshas' by itself is a karmic construct.
It's built up through 'attachment' and peeled of gradually through time and can be boosted through 'detachment'.
And see how Ra pair the word 'karma' with 'involvement'...
"attachment (Uppadi) is the root of suffering (Dukkha)"
-- Siddhartha
And by no means 'karma' is 'bad', karma is actually neither, through karma the infinite creator is experiencing 'illusion of separation'. But Siddhartha view the 'illusion of separation' as 'suffering'.
Putting it into game context as metaphor, when one logged in to multi player game as assault12 and find itself suddenly being shot by sniper123 , and 'dead' there are two things that can happened.
A. Lough it out loud or even be happy and congratulate the other player for successfully shot me dead.
B. Be angry and vow for revenge.
Option B is the metaphor for 'karmically involved'.
The player once known as assault12 will logged in again to the game, maybe now as assault13 trying to find sniper123 and 'even the score'. Failed again, the player will try again now as assault 14.
In the 10th attempt as assault22 it finally succeed, but this time around sniper123 vow for revenge, logged in again as sniper124 trying to find assault22 to 'even the score'.
As such the 'player' behind assault12 and sniper123 become 'karmically involved'.
It fuel their desire to logged in again and again and again into the game through multiple 'game avatars'.
The 'involvement' might ends and severed once option A is taken.
You know dude I've logged in to this game trying to shoot you for 100,000 times now, honestly I'm now sick and tired of this game, so go ahead shoot me up, congratulations, you won my friend! This will be my final session in the game, after this I'm out.. for good.
One layer of 'karmic structure' (Game avatar) will then be shed... thinning / reducing the karma.
And the 'karmic involvement' between the players behind assault12 and sniper123 is now severed.
RE: Being consciously unloving. - Louisabell - 08-06-2021
(08-05-2021, 11:14 PM)MonadicSpectrum Wrote:(08-05-2021, 03:27 PM)Patrick Wrote: The restitution part probably gets harder everyday for someone wanting to poison themselves on purpose everyday.
That's a great point. Is it possible to have true forgiveness without an equivalent change in behavior? I don't think so. If one wants to alleviate karma, I think it must have a corresponding change in behavior with behavior seeking restitution, which is the opposite behavior of the harm that was caused, being the best option. Perhaps this is the essence of spiritual bypassing and being ungrounded... not changing how one thinks and acts in response to negative consequences and simply choosing to ignore the consequences (believing this to be forgiveness) rather than understand and integrate the consequences into one's understanding of reality (what I call true forgiveness).
I like to think of karma as a form of momentum towards a way of living that lends itself to a set pattern of consequences. One may think that forgiveness is simply a change of perspective, but if this change of perspective does not lend itself to undoing the negative momentum, then it is not a change of perspective that is true forgiveness and only the illusion of forgiveness. People may think they've forgiven something when their actions show that they have not actually changed their perspective properly to stop producing negative karma.
Linking back to the poison example, someone who truly forgives themselves for drinking poison will then seek to stop drinking the poison and move the momentum in the opposite direction towards only drinking healthy drinks and undoing the harm of the poison. But if someone has built up so much momentum (such as alcohol addiction), it may take significant time and effort to fully undo the momentum even if true forgiveness or change of perspective is the first step. In contrast, an alcohol addict who believes they've forgiven themselves each time they drink in excess each day but do not change their behavior are spiritually bypassing and not actually balancing the karma.
Welcome to Bring4th MonadicSpectrum! I really liked what you wrote here, and it made me think of the below quote from the LOO, especially the bolded part below.
Ra Ra Wrote:34.5 Questioner: If an entity develops what is called a karma in an incarnation, is there then programming that sometimes occurs so that he will experience catalyst that will enable him to get to a point of forgiveness thereby alleviating the karma?
Ra: I am Ra. This is, in general, correct. However, both self and any involved other-self may, at any time through the process of understanding, acceptance, and forgiveness, ameliorate these patterns. This is true at any point in an incarnative pattern. Thus one who has set in motion an action may forgive itself and never again make that error. This also brakes or stops what you call karma.
I wanted to elaborate on your poison analogy. People consciously ingesting poison everyday out of compulsion, addiction and/or to self-medicate happens all the time. Cigarettes come to mind as the negative health implications of smoking is now well known. This behaviour however is often the symptom of a much deeper problem in one's life. We only have so much willpower in a day, and when dealing with very stressful situations, we may have no motivation for self-care left. Perhaps forgiveness in these other areas of life, including forgiving the blame we often put on ourselves when we feel unable to cope in life, will result in the cessation of the poison habit automatically.
Thinking about these kinds of unhealthy habits, usually the focus is on the effects on the body, but there is also a lot of mental suffering that goes a long with it. Examples of this would be the cognitive dissonance of willingly causing harm to one's body in order to seek comfort, to ignore the self's needs as though they are not important, reinforcing the belief that the self has poor willpower, etc. So, there are many aspects to forgive in order to find one's true power again beyond just the physical act of stopping the behaviour, I believe. This definitely takes a shift in perspective, usually quite a dramatic one depending on how entrenched the negative behaviour is.
RE: Being consciously unloving. - jafar - 08-06-2021
(08-06-2021, 12:10 AM)Louisabell Wrote: That's a great point. Is it possible to have true forgiveness without an equivalent change in behavior? I don't think so. If one wants to alleviate karma, I think it must have a corresponding change in behavior with behavior seeking restitution, which is the opposite behavior of the harm that was caused, being the best option. Perhaps this is the essence of spiritual bypassing and being ungrounded... not changing how one thinks and acts in response to negative consequences and simply choosing to ignore the consequences (believing this to be forgiveness) rather than understand and integrate the consequences into one's understanding of reality (what I call true forgiveness).
If one wants to 'lessen' the karma, then 'acceptance' is required.
Acceptance here in the meanings of 'letting it go', 'detachment' the opposite of attachment.
Ascension is gained through the opposite of gaining, through letting it go..
The entity grew attached to many things, to him/her self, to money, to wealth, to homes, to cigarettes, to food, to mushroom, to ayahuasca, to other people (good or bad), to enemy, to friends, to women, to men, to wives/husband, to girlfriend/boyfriend, to children, to family, to ethnicity, to countries, to races, to planet and zillions of other things that one can attached to.
The more 'attachment' one have the more 'karmic structure' it will have.
This 'karma' is the one that drive the entity to 'experience more' to take 'another shot', in one form or another.
Everything that has a beginning will have an end.
When it's time to let go better let go, this will lessen the karma.
But by no means that karma is 'bad' thus it need to be get rid of, because karma is also the driver for 'experiencing'.
Karma is the driver of 'samsara', the cycle of experiencing..
The driver of creation.
It is only 'bad' if one objective is to unite with the infinite, ending the cycle of experiencing, ending the 'limited/bordered self'.
Or in game metaphor, to permanently logged off from the game.
If one objective is still to play the game, and experience / explore the game more, then karma is 'good'.