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+---- Thread: If time doesn't really exist (/showthread.php?tid=5478)
If time doesn't really exist - lightworker - 09-05-2012
If time doesn't really exist. And going with the theory that the past, present & future are all occurring simultaneously.... Has the harvest not already happened?
I'm confused. If our higher selves have already been through all this, are they not aware of what has already happen with our harvest?
Sorry if this doesn't make sense and I'm getting things scrambled.
RE: If time doesn't really exist - Unbound - 09-05-2012
Oh the heavens are having a good giggle.
RE: If time doesn't really exist - Oldern - 09-05-2012
(09-05-2012, 02:45 PM)lightworker Wrote: If time doesn't really exist. And going with the theory that the past, present & future are all occurring simultaneously.... Has the harvest not already happened?
I'm confused. If our higher selves have already been through all this, are they not aware of what has already happen with our harvest?
Sorry if this doesn't make sense and I'm getting things scrambled.
Here is my understanding of it:
Time is simply a bunch of three dimensional stuff (series of events) laid in front of our consciousness in a linear fashion. Three dimensional existence is the last place where this kind of interactive experience can be had this way.
What is being masked here is that we could see the whole room (i.e. through walls, through each others "inner thoughts and feelings", through stars and galaxies and universes), but by limiting the sensors that we are focusing on through third density, we get the feeling that we are existing with a linear time and a rather "rigid" three dimensional space.
So yes, harvest have already happened, and everything that has happened was "just for a moment", but in order to have a valid experience of it, you will need to unpack that zipped experience, and have a (time-wise, seemingly) linear journey. That is this density, basically.
There is a reason why many spiritual practice puts heavy emphasis of "in the now", because ultimately that is the only thing that exists. Arbitrary dates such as the harvest's date (whether that be 2012.12.21 or tomorrow 6:45 or anytime after 2030) are just as illusionary, if you want them to be. Or you can place power outside of you...but that is up for each individual to decide, of course.
RE: If time doesn't really exist - Patrick - 09-05-2012
Quote:70.12 Questioner: Then what we are looking at is a long path of experience through the densities up to mid-sixth density which are a function totally of free will and result in the awareness of the higher self in mid-sixth density, but since time is illusory and there is a, shall I say, unification of time and space or an eradication of what we think of as time, then, all of this experience that results in the higher self, the cause of evolvement through the densities, is existing while the evolvement takes place, since it’s all simultaneous. Is this correct?
Ra: I am Ra. We refrain from speaking of correctness due to our understanding of the immense difficulty of absorbing the concepts of metaphysical existence. In time/space, which is precisely as much of your self as is space/time, all times are simultaneous just as, in your geography, your cities and villages are all functioning, bustling, and alive with entities going about their business at once. So it is in time/space with the self.
Quote:36.2 Questioner: Then would the mind/body/spirit complex totality be responsible for programming changes in catalyst during, say, a third-density experience of the mind/body/spirit complex so that the proper catalyst would be added, shall we say, as conditions for that complex changed during third-density experience? Is this correct?
Ra: I am Ra. This is incorrect. The higher self, as you call it, that is, that self which exists with full understanding of the accumulation of experiences of the entity, aids the entity in achieving healing of the experiences which have not been learned properly and assists as you have indicated in further life experience programming, as you may call it.
The mind/body/spirit complex totality is that which may be called upon by the higher self aspect just as the mind/body/spirit complex calls upon the higher self. In the one case you have a structured situation within the space/time continuum with the higher self having available to it the totality of experiences which have been collected by an entity and a very firm grasp of the lessons to be learned in this density.
The mind/body/spirit complex totality is as the shifting sands and is in some part a collection of parallel developments of the same entity. This information is made available to the higher self aspect. This aspect may then use these projected probability/possibility vortices in order to better aid in what you would call future life programming.
Quote:36.4 Questioner: Do I understand from this then that the higher self or Oversoul may break down into numerous units if the experience is required to what we would call simultaneously experience different types of catalyst and then oversee these experiences?
Ra: I am Ra. This is a statement we cannot say to be correct or incorrect due to the confusions of what you call time. True simultaneity is available only when all things are seen to be occurring at once. This overshadows the concept of which you speak. The concept of various parts of the being living experiences of varying natures simultaneously is not precisely accurate due to your understanding that this would indicate that this was occurring with true simultaneity. This is not the case.
The case is from universe to universe and parallel existences can then be programmed by the higher self, given the information available from the mind/body/spirit complex totality regarding the probability/possibility vortices at any crux.
RE: If time doesn't really exist - zenmaster - 09-05-2012
(09-05-2012, 02:45 PM)lightworker Wrote: If time doesn't really exist. And going with the theory that the past, present & future are all occurring simultaneously.... Has the harvest not already happened?Time does exists as a psychological perception. If all time is simultaneous, then the harvest has not happened, it is happening now. Ra says "There is the perfect balance between the known and the unknown." which is interesting to contemplate.
I'm confused. If our higher selves have already been through all this, are they not aware of what has already happen with our harvest?
Sorry if this doesn't make sense and I'm getting things scrambled.
RE: If time doesn't really exist - native - 09-05-2012
Awhile back I made a whole thread about the concept of time and the present moment as it relates to the harvest. You might appreciate it http://www.bring4th.org/forums/showthread.php?tid=3222
RE: If time doesn't really exist - lightworker - 09-06-2012
laughing at me??? cool.
Cause I really thought I could come here and ask questions without being laughed at.
Thank you Icaro, Patrick, zenmaster, oldern.
Maybe I just think too much & get myself all confused.
RE: If time doesn't really exist - Patrick - 09-06-2012
My friend, please keep in mind that absolutely everything is true. Obviously all cannot be true at the same time for everyone in the experience we are currently having. So it is actually you who decides what is Truth to you. Simply take in what you resonate with and discard all the rest. You may do this whatever the source of information.
Much love and light to you.
PS: I'm pretty certain that Eternal was not laughing derisively at you.
RE: If time doesn't really exist - Spaced - 09-06-2012
The heavens are a compendium of fools who will laugh at anything. Luckily they are always laughing with you, not at you
RE: If time doesn't really exist - AnthroHeart - 09-06-2012
Yeah, I must seem really silly at times to those beings. I can imagine them laughing as you say.
I must be very entertaining.
I am practically addicted to this website and to spirituality, and 4D/6D. I wonder if one of my lessons of this life was not to seek too hard.
RE: If time doesn't really exist - Parsons - 09-06-2012
Sometimes I say or think things soley because I picture them laughing at me. Usually when I make a very silly mistake, I picture the observers laughing at me and I start laughing right along with them. I don't think there is any such thing as laughing at someone maliciously in larger life... I think that tendency is 3D distortion and they do not judge us. As Patrick stated, they laugh with us. They understand that this world is currently the most limited/distorted experience in all of creation. It's a wonder we make it through the day-to-day struggles at all.
RE: If time doesn't really exist - AnthroHeart - 09-06-2012
(09-06-2012, 01:22 PM)Parsons Wrote: They understand that this world is currently the most limited/distorted experience in all of creation. It's a wonder we make it through the day-to-day struggles at all.
So true. Compared to 4D positive it's a prison. But it has it's freedoms as well. I agree with you about making it through our struggles.
RE: If time doesn't really exist - Patrick - 09-06-2012
(09-06-2012, 01:51 PM)Gemini Wolf Wrote:(09-06-2012, 01:22 PM)Parsons Wrote: They understand that this world is currently the most limited/distorted experience in all of creation. It's a wonder we make it through the day-to-day struggles at all.
So true. Compared to 4D positive it's a prison. But it has it's freedoms as well. I agree with you about making it through our struggles.
http://www.llresearch.org/transcripts/issues/2001/2001_0204.aspx Q'uo Wrote:...Each entity such as yourself that joins this circle of seeking brings many riches in the nature of the variety of experience, the purity of emotion, the passion with which truth, love, etc. are sought so that those of our group may be able to appreciate the difficulties that each of you are able to labor under successfully even though you may think that your ability is far less than successful. When you are able to express a difficult emotion, the emotion, situation, relationship, or other Earthly adventure that is not offered to those of us who are now discarnate, to those of us who live, shall we say, on the other side of the veil of forgetting, then it is that our appreciation grows as you are pulled one way and the other in the struggle to remember love.
Just as you within this circle of seeking would enjoy reading a new novel that is in your area of interest, we of the Confederation of Planets are always interested to observe that which is freely shared within this circle of working. For it allows us to see how each entity may work with the catalyst which is presented in the daily round of activities, to see how the love and light of the one Creator may yet shine forth from the darkest of experiences, from the most confusing of experiences. This gives us a great deal of joy, to see that, indeed, that there is no place where love may be hidden so deeply that it will not shine forth in a brilliant and inspiring way. Thus you inspire us as much as we attempt to inspire you...
RE: If time doesn't really exist - Alex from Greece - 09-06-2012
Time is the monster!
RE: If time doesn't really exist - anagogy - 09-07-2012
(09-05-2012, 02:45 PM)lightworker Wrote: If time doesn't really exist. And going with the theory that the past, present & future are all occurring simultaneously.... Has the harvest not already happened?
I'm confused. If our higher selves have already been through all this, are they not aware of what has already happen with our harvest?
Sorry if this doesn't make sense and I'm getting things scrambled.
First off, don't feel bad that you have questions or feel scrambled. I applaud that you have thought about this deeply enough to consider this question.
The Higher Self does not know your specific future. The Higher Self is like a spiritual guide to you. You also have a host of other spiritual entities assigned to you that assist you in various ways, but your Higher Self is sort of like your main spiritual guide, in a sense. The main thing to keep in mind is you have many different aspects to your consciousness, and they have different attributes. The Higher Self has its own specific attributes.
In order to not "break the game" as it were, the Higher Self is not given access to that particular aspect of information. Keep in the mind, the Higher Self is a manifestation that is "given" to the late sixth density self, as a gift from its future self-ness. The Higher Self is of a mid-sixth density level of consciousness. There are portions of your self which do, in fact, know your future, but they are not allowed to interact with you as the Higher Self does. There is always the great Law of Confusion that must be taken into account in these situations. As Zen said, there is the perfect balance between the known and unknown.
So think of your future self as a path through a maze. It knows the specific route you are going to take because it is you in the future. The Higher Self portion of your future consciousness is like that same maze but the path through it has been erased. It is aware of all the paths through the maze, but is not aware of the one you will choose to go through it. Ra has said that the Higher Self is like a map in which the destination is known. However, it does not know what specific path you will take through that map to the destination. It just knows you will eventually reach the destination. It is, however, intimately aware of the paths through said maze, and can assist you in providing information in that regard.
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36.7 Questioner: In that case my higher self would, shall we say, have a very large advantage in knowing precisely what was needed since it would know what… as far as I am concerned, what was going to happen. Is this correct?
Ra: I am Ra. This is incorrect, in that this would be an abrogation of free will. The higher self aspect is aware of the lessons learned through the sixth density. The progress rate is fairly well understood. The choices which must be made to achieve the higher self as it is are in the provenance of the mind/body/spirit complex itself.
Thus the higher self is like the map in which the destination is known; the roads are very well known, these roads being designed by intelligent infinity working through intelligent energy. However, the higher self aspect can program only for the lessons and certain predisposing limitations if it wishes. The remainder is completely the free choice of each entity. There is the perfect balance between the known and the unknown.
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RE: If time doesn't really exist - Raz - 09-07-2012
I believe that the result is there; we experience it as the "future attractor". This reality is like an equation or prequel, designed to create a deeper understanding of that result.
RE: If time doesn't really exist - Patrick - 09-07-2012
(09-07-2012, 09:23 AM)Raz Wrote: I believe that the result is there; we experience it as the "future attractor". This reality is like an equation or prequel, designed to create a deeper understanding of that result.
You've pretty much explained the whole Creation right there.
RE: If time doesn't really exist - unir 1 - 09-08-2012
(09-07-2012, 04:01 AM)anagogy Wrote: So think of your future self as a path through a maze. It knows the specific route you are going to take because it is you in the future. The Higher Self portion of your future consciousness is like that same maze but the path through it has been erased. It is aware of all the paths through the maze, but is not aware of the one you will choose to go through it. Ra has said that the Higher Self is like a map in which the destination is known. However, it does not know what specific path you will take through that map to the destination. It just knows you will eventually reach the destination. It is, however, intimately aware of the paths through said maze, and can assist you in providing information in that regard.
Writing in response to this part of your post, anagogy-
So would you agree that the higher self must not infringe on our free-will by doing anything other than "guidance"?
For example: it would not push us toward the "exit", which we may or may not be aware of, or seeking.
Would I be correct in stating that the higher self only "chooses for you" when you have no 3rd density opportunity to do so yourself? In example: when you have passed away and take refuge in the other side; I suppose there, and only there the higher self adjusts limitations and predispositions if it wishes.
But then, what would be the reason for that? If I may suggest, perhaps it is for the lessons yet to learn or those we pick up from our past life to resume in our journey in this realm of free-will...
Also
(09-07-2012, 04:01 AM)anagogy Wrote: It is, however, intimately aware of the paths through said maze, and can assist you in providing information in that regard.
I'm assuming the higher self, since it knows not the future of your path, can only tell you about what you've been through, not where you're headed...so it can't tell you what's ahead because you haven't chosen it yet. Though it can tell you...what you've been unaware of in your path? I'm not seeing much else it could say. Paradoxically, would it automatically tell you of what you were unaware of, thus infringing, or would you have to be aware of the desired info, thus not needing the information retold to you? Is there a merge here, where the higher self becomes present in you, and you are simply...the higher self? Is it basically (according to my speculation) as Ra put it in session 70, answer 11?
RE: If time doesn't really exist - anagogy - 09-08-2012
(09-08-2012, 03:35 AM)unir 1 Wrote:(09-07-2012, 04:01 AM)anagogy Wrote: So think of your future self as a path through a maze. It knows the specific route you are going to take because it is you in the future. The Higher Self portion of your future consciousness is like that same maze but the path through it has been erased. It is aware of all the paths through the maze, but is not aware of the one you will choose to go through it. Ra has said that the Higher Self is like a map in which the destination is known. However, it does not know what specific path you will take through that map to the destination. It just knows you will eventually reach the destination. It is, however, intimately aware of the paths through said maze, and can assist you in providing information in that regard.
Writing in response to this part of your post, anagogy-
So would you agree that the higher self must not infringe on our free-will by doing anything other than "guidance"?
For example: it would not push us toward the "exit", which we may or may not be aware of, or seeking.
Would I be correct in stating that the higher self only "chooses for you" when you have no 3rd density opportunity to do so yourself? In example: when you have passed away and take refuge in the other side; I suppose there, and only there the higher self adjusts limitations and predispositions if it wishes.
The higher self does not control or manipulate you in any fashion. There are some beings who have not activated their heart center to any degree whatsoever, and in those instances, the Higher Self chooses their lessons and incarnative circumstances for them. It is sort of like auto-pilot for souls who haven't yet awakened to their spiritual nature. However, once the heart chakra has been activated, all predisposing incarnative biases are collectively decided by the incarnating soul and the Higher Self together.
(09-08-2012, 03:35 AM)unir 1 Wrote: But then, what would be the reason for that? If I may suggest, perhaps it is for the lessons yet to learn or those we pick up from our past life to resume in our journey in this realm of free-will...
All predisposing limitations, or biases, that are selected prior to physical incarnation are for the purpose of accelerating spiritual growth. They are selected based on their potential for you to release the illusory distortions that prevent you from tapping into intelligent infinity.
(09-08-2012, 03:35 AM)unir 1 Wrote:(09-07-2012, 04:01 AM)anagogy Wrote: It is, however, intimately aware of the paths through said maze, and can assist you in providing information in that regard.
I'm assuming the higher self, since it knows not the future of your path, can only tell you about what you've been through, not where you're headed...so it can't tell you what's ahead because you haven't chosen it yet. Though it can tell you...what you've been unaware of in your path? I'm not seeing much else it could say. Paradoxically, would it automatically tell you of what you were unaware of, thus infringing, or would you have to be aware of the desired info, thus not needing the information retold to you?
Even though the Higher Self does not know your future per se, it can see the momentum of your biases, and can see the probabilities associated with that. Keep in mind, most people do not communicate, consciously, with their Higher Selves during incarnation unless the appropriate channels are opened up in their consciousness. In a more basic sense, everybody is communicating with their Higher Self unconsciously, and this communication is translated by us as emotion. The Higher Self has a broader view than the incarnating personality, so it can see probabilities very clearly and help you follow those probabilities you desire.
It provides information based on the direction of what you desire. It does not provide information unsolicited, usually. It does not judge your desires. It just assists you in experiencing what you desire to experience. When your focus of thought is in opposition to how your Higher Self is looking at things, relative to that subject, you will feel negative emotion. When your focus of thought is in harmony with your broader Higher perspective, you will feel varying degrees of positive emotion. When you feel a visceral sense of well being, it means you are in the process of manifesting a desirable outcome. Your emotions allow you to sense your degree of harmony with your inner beingness, based on your focus of thought.
(09-08-2012, 03:35 AM)unir 1 Wrote: Is there a merge here, where the higher self becomes present in you, and you are simply...the higher self? Is it basically (according to my speculation) as Ra put it in session 70, answer 11?
The merge is just the natural progression of time. Your Higher Self is you in the future. It is the mid sixth density version of yourself that has turned towards itself in the past to assist it, giving it the very assistance it received when it was a 3rd density entity.
RE: If time doesn't really exist - AnthroHeart - 09-08-2012
I wonder what it feels like to achieve higher self manifestation.
RE: If time doesn't really exist - unir 1 - 09-08-2012
Anagogy,
thanks, though we digress. Also, knowing the higher self concept seems to me as something on my don't-need-to-do list, which i don't need to list either. but i did, so i asked. I had chosen to think, rather than to find the Love in the moment- well, later.
RE: If time doesn't really exist - anagogy - 09-09-2012
(09-08-2012, 10:30 PM)unir 1 Wrote: [...] I had chosen to think, rather than to find the Love in the moment [...]
From my perspective, they can be one in the same.
And you are welcome, of course.
