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Jesus really lived? - RickNYC - 03-04-2013
I love the teachings, but I have found nothing to indicate that the man really existed, other than in the folklore, i.e., The Bible. Ra speaks of him, but that is not evidence, although I am tempted to see it as such. The accounts are not first and there is no evidence that they are second person. and yet, there are many stories which are written to quote him, verbatim. I look forward to your replies. Thank you.
RE: Jesus really lived? - Aureus - 03-04-2013
I personally deem the Ra material trustworthy, and so I accept what is mentioned of 'Jesus' as facts. However, Ra does not validate or give credibility to other than what is claimed in the material. The fact that Ra mentioned him does not mean that every mention of 'Jesus' in the bible for example is to be taken seriously or accepted without scrutiny.
RE: Jesus really lived? - Jeremy - 03-04-2013
There is obviously no evidence or it would have surfaced by now so we have to take what is said by channeled entities on faith and discernment.
Here is a transcript from Q'uo regarding Jesus. It also explains that Q'uo is a principle made of of those of Ra and latwii. This is conscious channeling instead of trance channeling.
http://llresearch.org/transcripts/issues/1990/1990_0107.aspx
RE: Jesus really lived? - RickNYC - 03-04-2013
Thank you both. The section from Quo, although eloquent, did not satisfy my query :-) I look forward to more comments.
Love and light.
RE: Jesus really lived? - reeay - 03-04-2013
What answer are you seeking?
Ra on Jesus:
http://www.lawofone.info/results.php?c=People&su=Jesus#Jesus
RE: Jesus really lived? - RickNYC - 03-04-2013
(03-04-2013, 10:04 PM)rie Wrote: What answer are you seeking?
Ra on Jesus:
http://www.lawofone.info/results.php?c=People&su=Jesus#Jesus
Seeking? Illumination; the Christ principles are what are important to me, but it seems that the legend of Jesus is believed by so many, without any historical evidence, that perhaps I have missed something.
I also want to know who fired the shots from the grassy knoll :-)
RE: Jesus really lived? - Bring4th_Austin - 03-04-2013
Why is it important to you whether Jesus really existed or not? How does this particular question help you understand the Law of One and the Ra material?
RE: Jesus really lived? - Spaced - 03-04-2013
The thing with historical evidence regarding one individual who lived 2000 years ago is that you really are not gonna get much unless you are looking for someone who would show up on coins or have statues made of them.
One secret that Archaeologists don't want you to know is that 90% of their theories are based on conjecture. The past is a very malleable thing.
RE: Jesus really lived? - Siren - 03-04-2013
What matters is not the messenger but the message itself. If the message is useful and works for one, why would the messenger even matter? Or would the message lose any veracity if the alleged messenger who spoke it had not in fact existed? This is the question that one should ask.
One can find even useful teachings in a fairy tale.
If you ask for my personal subjective take on it, yes, the one known as Jesus was indeed an incarnated 3rd-density entity on this planetary sphere. However, he has also been used by the Roman Catholic Church the same way Disneyland has used Mickey Mouse as their official "mascot" (as any good businessman would do with their mega-enterprise) =3
RE: Jesus really lived? - RickNYC - 03-04-2013
(03-04-2013, 10:45 PM)Bring4th_Austin Wrote: Why is it important to you whether Jesus really existed or not? How does this particular question help you understand the Law of One and the Ra material?
Please forgive me for asking the question on this forum. I meant to upset no one, but your response to me feels less than helpful and more like I am being judged for asking; perhaps it is just the nature of a forum, in that I won't be able to determine the tone behind the response. I asked for personal interest only and thought, perhaps, that this might be a good group with which to have this discussion.
This question has no bearing on my understanding of Ra, the material or the Law of One.
I wish you well.
RE: Jesus really lived? - Bring4th_Austin - 03-04-2013
RickNYC, I ask these questions only to explore the topic a little deeper, no other reason. Understanding where your questions come from will help shed light on the topic itself. I'm not discouraging this discussion at all, but encouraging it to go deeper.
RE: Jesus really lived? - RickNYC - 03-04-2013
(03-04-2013, 10:53 PM)Siren Wrote: What matters is not the messenger but the message itself. If the message is useful and works for one, why would the messenger even matter? Or would the message lose any veracity if the alleged messenger who spoke it had not in fact existed? This is the question that one should ask.
One can find even useful teachings in a fairy tale.
If you ask for my personal subjective take on it, yes, the one known as Jesus was indeed an incarnated 3rd-density entity on this planetary sphere. However, he has also been used by the Roman Catholic Church the same way Disneyland has used Mickey Mouse as their official "mascot" (as any good businessman would do with their mega-enterprise) =3
Your last statement is what I was asking for, that being a personal reflection about a subject on my mind. I have few with which to have these kinds of discussions, no one to discuss Ra, Quo or The Law of One. I was looking for like-minded spirits; that is all.
Thank you for your response. I wish you well.
RE: Jesus really lived? - zenmaster - 03-04-2013
(03-04-2013, 10:53 PM)Siren Wrote: What matters is not the messenger but the message itself. If the message is useful and works for one, why would the messenger even matter?How about because not all messages are for the common good.
RE: Jesus really lived? - Adonai One - 03-04-2013
Deleted
RE: Jesus really lived? - zenmaster - 03-05-2013
(03-04-2013, 11:43 PM)Adonai-1 Wrote:Generally, that which is in accord with ethical behavior - that which promotes consciousness.(03-04-2013, 11:38 PM)zenmaster Wrote:(03-04-2013, 10:53 PM)Siren Wrote: What matters is not the messenger but the message itself. If the message is useful and works for one, why would the messenger even matter?How about because not all messages are for the common good.
What defines the common good?
RE: Jesus really lived? - JustLikeYou - 03-05-2013
There is, indeed, evidence that Jesus lived, but most of this evidence comes from the Bible itself. My opinion, formed from a nebulous hodge-podge of evidence, reason, resonance and synthetic thought, is that he was a human being with a powerful enough message that it broadcasted itself through the ages. It did not broadcast undistorted, but some of it was preserved, and this can be seen in the Bible as it exists today. I think that there is a significant amount of data about the man which is lost, but the mythology was simply too strong and caught on too shortly after the death of the Legend for it to not be based in reality. It's not a Troy scenario in which the mythology is recounted 1200 years after they happened. And hell, it may well be that even the sack of Troy was firmly rooted in historical events.
Adonai-1 Wrote:What defines the common good?
Robespierre defines this. Too bad he's dead.
RE: Jesus really lived? - Unbound - 03-05-2013
The closest Ive seen to physical evidence is the Shroud of Turin.
RE: Jesus really lived? - Monica - 03-05-2013
I view the Bible the same way I view other historical records, myths and legends from other cultures - stories that reflect that particular culture's attempts to make sense of existence. I don't take any of them literally. I don't think the Bible is any more special than, say, Aboriginal tribal myths or Native American legends about the Great Spirit.
Thus, I have no reason to think Jesus was a historical character, except for the fact that Ra said he really lived. That's enough for me, since I personally have chosen to trust Ra.
So I accept that Jesus really lived, and was a Wanderer who took on a very important mission. Beyond that, what do we really know about him? Are the words attributed to him in the Bible accurate? I doubt it, being that the gospels were all written several decades after his death, and remember, they didn't have tape recorders back then!
So essentially, what we have here is a collection of channeled works. I would use discernment about this particular set of channeled works, just the same as I would towards any modern channeled work. I don't take, say, the channeling of Michael or St. Germain or Ramtha or any of the myriad others as absolute truth, 100% undistorted, so why should I totally accept the Bible? which is, after, all, just another channeled work. Actually, it's a collection of works, with what, some 40+ different authors?
The whole myth surrounding Jesus - the birth in the manger, the crucifixion, etc. - in my opinion has value in an allegorical sense, more so than literally, since I highly doubt those stories are literally true. (The 4 gospels differ wildly on certain details, by the way.)
Jesus was clearly one helluva love dude, ya know? His story - his magnificent portrayal of unconditional love - has far more value for the lessons it teaches, than for whether or not it was literally true.
Therefore, I don't concern myself about whether it really did all go down the way the bible says it did. I seriously question the part about the resurrection, virgin birth, etc. I find those about as believable as the talking snake and the creation of the universe in 6 days...But so what? It doesn't matter. What matters are the concepts that the story of Jesus represent - unconditional LOVE, forgiveness, healing, non-judgment, etc.
The myth of Jesus has become bigger than the reality, but the mainstream Christian version, unfortunately, has totally corrupted it. They've turned it into a lottery - all you have to do is believe a certain way and you get your free ticket to 'heaven.'
But we don't have to settle for that. Nor do we have to throw the baby out with the bathwater. We can reject the mainstream interpretation of Jesus' mission and still accept that he did indeed live, and that his life had tremendous meaning and significance.
Is this picking and choosing which parts of the Bible I accept? You bet! I pick and choose the parts that resonate: the parts about love and forgiveness. A lot of the words attributed to Jesus still carry a strong vibration of love and wisdom. Probably the best way to read the Bible is to focus only on his actual words. Whether he really said those things or not, doesn't matter, because there is some cool stuff in those passages attributed to him. I wouldn't take any of it as absolute literal, authoritative truth, though.
Another good source for studying Jesus is Edgar Cayce. I gained quite an appreciation for Jesus when I studied the Edgar Cayce readings. I trust them way more than I do the Bible.
RE: Jesus really lived? - jivatman - 03-05-2013
The most important topic of consideration in regards to the historical Jesus are the Synoptic Gospels, Matthew, Mark, and Luke. These are largely in agreement, though varying in some details.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Synoptic_Gospels
Note that John is not a Synoptic gospel. It differs greatly in basic details and presents a doctrine that is very different from the other three. It is here where Jesus claims to be god and is full of statements like "I am the... ", and unlike the Synoptics, directly blames Jews for Jesus's cruxifiction. It's believed to have been written several hundred years after the Synoptics.
RE: Jesus really lived? - jacrob - 03-05-2013
If "The medium is the message" (a collaborative relationship by which the medium influences how the message is perceived) then I believe there are alot of people who really want Jesus to have existed. A being purportedly of love and speaking of love despite the darkness of 3rd dimension is a beacon to look up to and admire.
But because of free will there is no evidence. I agree that he is of the logos(as per the Quo link above) and an archetype that speaks to our subconscious.
I ask for his assistance all the time and get signs he's around. It becomes uncanny the way he will appear. I'll ask for him to be around me and my son will bring home a rosary from school for me.
If you believe then I think you will perceive his presence.
RE: Jesus really lived? - Marc - 03-06-2013
Monica,
I love your thoughts (but I always do) and agree with you about much of it.
I've personally been reading many gnostic texts and find soo much resonance in them and would also add those to the list of historical references to Jesus. The Gospel of Thomas is one of my favorites and stays away from all that 'I'm the only way, us vs. them (Jews) attitude.'
In regard to myth, I've been on a journey and realized that the details are never important in mythology, its the message. Also, in our age, myth is synonymous for false, and that is one of the greatest downfalls of the materialistic mindset of this world(/madness). (Also, In 'A Wanderer's Handbook' Carla wrote a great chapter on myths)
We only have this moment to live in and all else is varying different degrees of illusion, whether something 'literally' happened in the past is a moot point. We can't ever know while in the space/time. We only have myth to tell us what happened. Even people like presidents are myths because we only know what history books recorded and they are most likely biased by the writer. In this illusion, it is each one of us who choose what myths to accept or let go. All myths are truths and contain truth, it is never the literal facts that matter right here and now; it is how the myth of the past effects us that truly matters.
Does Jesus inspire you right now? Does the story of Heracles lift your spirit? Do the writings of Thoth call you to light? Do you feel Zeus has abandoned you? Do you feel enslaved to the desires of the ego?
Each of these myths can speak to you, if you will it. Choose your myths and create your own that apply to your story. The spirit knows the true value of myth, while the mind/ego wishes to write it all off as falsehood.
RE: Jesus really lived? - LarryP - 03-09-2013
(03-04-2013, 04:55 PM)RickNYC Wrote: I love the teachings, but I have found nothing to indicate that the man really existed, other than in the folklore, i.e., The Bible. Ra speaks of him, but that is not evidence, although I am tempted to see it as such. The accounts are not first and there is no evidence that they are second person. and yet, there are many stories which are written to quote him, verbatim. I look forward to your replies. Thank you.
There are accounts of his existence in non-biblical records.
- Josephus
- Tacitus
- Lucian of Samosata
Just to name a few.
RE: Jesus really lived? - Namaste - 03-09-2013
Dolores Cannon has some very interesting books on Jesus, based upon information gained from the regression state. Many of the teachings she has brought through are congruent with the Ra Material.
Bashar also talks of Jesus (and other figures of similar nature):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1R8ni2D14XE
Being a part of the Confederation, Jesus is also being channeled:
Ra Wrote:The particular mind/body/spirit complex you call Jesus is, as what you would call an entity, not to return except as a member of the Confederation occasionally speaking through a channel
I have no idea which channeling source is legit, however.
RE: Jesus really lived? - norral - 03-10-2013
rick
u might want to check out the book of urantia. that is a different view towards the life of jesus and a totally different cosmology.
also this series i found quite good
the power of the magdalene
http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_ss_c_0_20?url=search-alias%3Dstripbooks&field-keywords=the+power+of+the+magdalene&sprefix=the+power+of+the+mag%2Caps%2C170
there are about 4 or 5 books in this series which i find quite good and give a different view of the role of women in the early church.
i agree with what others have said. bottom line does the message impact my life for a positive change in some way. the actual details of what happened 2 thousand years ago dont really concern me too much. the messages of the teachings are of importance to me personally. and i agree with some and disagree with some. thats just me .
oh and just one other aside. as far as i understand the buddhist teachings they say that we dont exist ha ha. so forget about jesus im not even sure that i exist ha ha. just thought i would throw that one in there for laughs.
happy hunting
norral
RE: Jesus really lived? - Ashim - 03-10-2013
Yeshua is the entity being discussed.
Yes he did 'live' or was incarnate here on earth several times.
His teachings have been perverted to the extent that only the true seeker will appreciate the truths hidden within holy scripture.
Everyone here, I mean incarnate or not within the earth sphere knows him.
He is available as a teacher and friend.
If you desire his company just wish for it before you go to sleep.
Send your request to The Office of the Christ.
RE: Jesus really lived? - Spaced - 03-10-2013
(03-10-2013, 10:19 AM)Ashim Wrote: Send your request to The Office of the Christ.
Tell 'em Ashim sent you
RE: Jesus really lived? - Parsons - 03-11-2013
(03-10-2013, 09:55 AM)norral Wrote: oh and just one other aside. as far as i understand the buddhist teachings they say that we dont exist ha ha. so forget about jesus im not even sure that i exist ha ha. just thought i would throw that one in there for laughs.
From one perspective, this makes complete sense to me. Our consciousness is simply a 'split personality' of the Creator. All that which we perceive as physical reality(light) is a thought of the Creator.
RE: Jesus really lived? - Monica - 03-12-2013
(03-06-2013, 03:36 PM)MarcRammer Wrote: Monica,
I love your thoughts (but I always do) and agree with you about much of it.
I've personally been reading many gnostic texts and find soo much resonance in them and would also add those to the list of historical references to Jesus. The Gospel of Thomas is one of my favorites and stays away from all that 'I'm the only way, us vs. them (Jews) attitude.'
In regard to myth, I've been on a journey and realized that the details are never important in mythology, its the message. Also, in our age, myth is synonymous for false, and that is one of the greatest downfalls of the materialistic mindset of this world(/madness). (Also, In 'A Wanderer's Handbook' Carla wrote a great chapter on myths)
We only have this moment to live in and all else is varying different degrees of illusion, whether something 'literally' happened in the past is a moot point. We can't ever know while in the space/time. We only have myth to tell us what happened. Even people like presidents are myths because we only know what history books recorded and they are most likely biased by the writer. In this illusion, it is each one of us who choose what myths to accept or let go. All myths are truths and contain truth, it is never the literal facts that matter right here and now; it is how the myth of the past effects us that truly matters.
Does Jesus inspire you right now? Does the story of Heracles lift your spirit? Do the writings of Thoth call you to light? Do you feel Zeus has abandoned you? Do you feel enslaved to the desires of the ego?
Each of these myths can speak to you, if you will it. Choose your myths and create your own that apply to your story. The spirit knows the true value of myth, while the mind/ego wishes to write it all off as falsehood.
Well said! I agree 100%!