12-08-2019, 03:24 PM
This thread contains a lot of things, but if a larger and more detached view from a relative newcomer is of interest, here's some general impressions.
Early, some good information was posted. Jade's early post about misinterpretations of the Law of One material was personally useful, as it described a big part of what's wrong in the Cassiopaea community (which I was involved in for a number of years).
Soon after in this thread, it all spiraled into a drama which mainly informs about the nature of such drama. Actually, my personal hindsight view is that the moderation here may have been too lenient, because as mentioned later on, a number of people left due to the general drama on the forum around that time. On some other forums, a fairly balanced approach to handling such situations is that of temporarily suspending people who greatly disrupt the life of the online community, somewhat earlier on; after a month or so, they can participate again, at which time they have hopefully cooled off and can participate without being so combative.
However that may be, the "climate" has shifted again and the times seem to have returned to something much more calm.
This discussion ties into the thread '"Political Correctness" and Fourth Density'. I have the same general impressions regarding the whole left vs. right thing, but more strongly, now reading through the rest of this thread. Part 1 is:
It's much messier in the world of people who aren't into positive spiritual development, of course.
Regarding pro-left vs. pro-right views, I generally think it's a shame when people get stuck in these loops of conventional thinking which don't lead anywhere except sustaining themselves at the cost of understanding of those with the opposite leanings.
Much better thinking is possible, building upon the foundation of ideas already part of the basic thinking in this community. Some posts go that way, rising above the conflict and bringing some clarity.
Ideological frames of mind provide lenses which bring some things into focus while obscuring other areas of reality. The more is seen through a lens, the more compelling the dogmas associated with it become. When what is seen through the filter becomes connected to personal emotional experience, tunnel vision results.
When contemplating larger psychological patterns, a depressing view of humanity going in circles and different generations leaping into different types of tunnel vision results. Basically sensible people on each side of a divide cling to the better ideals they have, while the thinking doesn't rise above the narrow filtering which hides the corresponding flaws, and the set of good ideals and flaws on the other side.
It can be difficult to destroy ideological filters in oneself, because they become tied to ideas of what the truth is. Inner upheaval and emotionally living through the contradictions and absurdities reached through each narrow standpoint can lead beyond it all, to a more detached and balanced perspective. That type of inner change opens the door to greater understanding, at which point the words and slogans of ideologies become far less convincing, and it all begins to look hollow.
If the old ideological "programs" are avoided, and larger thoughts and patterns are examined instead, it becomes possible to bridge gaps in understanding without meaningless fights about vacuous symbols and slogans (whether associated with the left or the right).
That's possible between people who are into growth of understanding. I mean, there's no hope that it will happen on a mass scale. There's not really any need of such hope, either. Humanity is what it is, and what grows when growing beyond old patterns happens in individuals, perhaps connected to a future "not of this world", i.e. not of the 3D monkey business in which the dynamics of primates are extended with complex memes and in complicated societies, but remains the same in essence.
Perhaps it looks very different to people who strongly feel that this or that group of people are "my people", and there's other people who are "not my people". I.e., us vs. them. I cannot really believe in that in the same way any longer; appearances deceive, and what unites and divides people tends to exist on the levels of physical life, and of memes living a life of their own through human hosts who blindly "run" and propagate them.
Most conflicts in this world are like the senseless and meaningless results of machines moving around and violently bumping into one another in pseudo-random patterns which change over time. Almost all meaning perceived in it appears, on a closer look, to be illusion. With such "machines" doing what they do, s*** simply happens, and that's the heart of the meaning to be found in it, along with the potential choice to go a different route and strive to become something else.
Early, some good information was posted. Jade's early post about misinterpretations of the Law of One material was personally useful, as it described a big part of what's wrong in the Cassiopaea community (which I was involved in for a number of years).
Soon after in this thread, it all spiraled into a drama which mainly informs about the nature of such drama. Actually, my personal hindsight view is that the moderation here may have been too lenient, because as mentioned later on, a number of people left due to the general drama on the forum around that time. On some other forums, a fairly balanced approach to handling such situations is that of temporarily suspending people who greatly disrupt the life of the online community, somewhat earlier on; after a month or so, they can participate again, at which time they have hopefully cooled off and can participate without being so combative.
However that may be, the "climate" has shifted again and the times seem to have returned to something much more calm.
This discussion ties into the thread '"Political Correctness" and Fourth Density'. I have the same general impressions regarding the whole left vs. right thing, but more strongly, now reading through the rest of this thread. Part 1 is:
(10-29-2019, 03:03 PM)Asolsutsesvyl Wrote: I think it may be confusing to define a basically good-natured and respectful approach to others as political correctness.
Political correctness is basically when an ideology becomes the criteria for acceptability. It is rigid, and in principle, a computer program could do the judging.
[...] I think that striving to become more balanced, and develop a genuine understanding, works far better than a system in which rules are "socialized" into the participants. Socialization basically amounts to replacing the natural with the artificial, deadening the soul-based conscience and replacing it with morality combining culture with the physical primate nature. [...] (The catch as regards spiritual work is, only people with positive souls in charge become positive when morality is destroyed.)
It's much messier in the world of people who aren't into positive spiritual development, of course.
Regarding pro-left vs. pro-right views, I generally think it's a shame when people get stuck in these loops of conventional thinking which don't lead anywhere except sustaining themselves at the cost of understanding of those with the opposite leanings.
Much better thinking is possible, building upon the foundation of ideas already part of the basic thinking in this community. Some posts go that way, rising above the conflict and bringing some clarity.
Ideological frames of mind provide lenses which bring some things into focus while obscuring other areas of reality. The more is seen through a lens, the more compelling the dogmas associated with it become. When what is seen through the filter becomes connected to personal emotional experience, tunnel vision results.
When contemplating larger psychological patterns, a depressing view of humanity going in circles and different generations leaping into different types of tunnel vision results. Basically sensible people on each side of a divide cling to the better ideals they have, while the thinking doesn't rise above the narrow filtering which hides the corresponding flaws, and the set of good ideals and flaws on the other side.
It can be difficult to destroy ideological filters in oneself, because they become tied to ideas of what the truth is. Inner upheaval and emotionally living through the contradictions and absurdities reached through each narrow standpoint can lead beyond it all, to a more detached and balanced perspective. That type of inner change opens the door to greater understanding, at which point the words and slogans of ideologies become far less convincing, and it all begins to look hollow.
If the old ideological "programs" are avoided, and larger thoughts and patterns are examined instead, it becomes possible to bridge gaps in understanding without meaningless fights about vacuous symbols and slogans (whether associated with the left or the right).
That's possible between people who are into growth of understanding. I mean, there's no hope that it will happen on a mass scale. There's not really any need of such hope, either. Humanity is what it is, and what grows when growing beyond old patterns happens in individuals, perhaps connected to a future "not of this world", i.e. not of the 3D monkey business in which the dynamics of primates are extended with complex memes and in complicated societies, but remains the same in essence.
Perhaps it looks very different to people who strongly feel that this or that group of people are "my people", and there's other people who are "not my people". I.e., us vs. them. I cannot really believe in that in the same way any longer; appearances deceive, and what unites and divides people tends to exist on the levels of physical life, and of memes living a life of their own through human hosts who blindly "run" and propagate them.
Most conflicts in this world are like the senseless and meaningless results of machines moving around and violently bumping into one another in pseudo-random patterns which change over time. Almost all meaning perceived in it appears, on a closer look, to be illusion. With such "machines" doing what they do, s*** simply happens, and that's the heart of the meaning to be found in it, along with the potential choice to go a different route and strive to become something else.