04-12-2020, 01:18 AM
(04-09-2020, 01:46 PM)Agua Wrote: „ That's a simple and sensible point. As it relates to myself, hiding in my personal life instead of being "out there" in some sense and actually bringing something to people is a long-running theme.“
It is not uncommon however. I did struggle with that for quite a long time.
It is worth healing however!
In hindsight, I can say I didnt even realize how self limiting this was, way beyond the obvious „not meeting people“
It was actually more of a „not participating in life“, not only shared with others, but even just on my own, which led to a quite miserable state that I continuosly had to numb with games, tv, drugs, internet and more.
I have gone through a curious "loop", where I am currently back at the "hiding" phase. Lessons of my life repeating, before and after my time with the Cassiopaea community, but in a different order and more quickly.
Before those years, while making it through school while increasingly bitter and angry at the world and humanity, and with depression a theme since earlier in childhood, I spent a lot of time on video games and, later, hobby software programming. I had a curiously divided attitude towards everything spiritual, and did not really focus on it that much, apart from constantly being concerned with personal energetic things in an obsessive-compulsive way.
With the Cassiopaea-related information came a deep exploration of philosophical and metaphysical things for the first time. It was the first thing I could really take seriously, and I ended up fully invested in idealism connected to it all. Basically, if you believe in that group, then helping out in connection with it becomes the "best" thing you can do. The peak of that was in 2015, when I got their new wiki (thecasswiki.net, now down) basically ready, along with one more pedantic nerdy member who did about half the editing. The peak of it doubled as my personal experience of "The Tower", in terms of the Tarot, in hindsight.
What thereafter? A very big headache and heartache, following the most sudden personal transition in my life, inwardly. The "larger mind beyond the conscious mind" telling me that I am not just a machine, but a living being, too; a short, structured symbolic presentation which, in hindsight, summarizes part of what I was to live through afterwards; then, basically, heaven and hell.
Now I'm back "outside" the great dreams I had, outside the Cassiopaea community tunnel vision in which it is an island of light in an ocean of darkness, and all disagreements with its spiritual direction are due to the evil forces of "The Matrix".
And I hope to do some things, e.g. return to my undergraduate studies, and/or something else beyond living with my parents while inwardly on shaky ground, not sure when or to what extent I can really "get going" in any particular direction.
In the meantime, restarting on a personal level, and digesting everything, made for visiting this place, where the basic orientation seems to be the opposite, on closer examination, to the Cassiopaea group. While rebuilding my worldview, interacting here seems to help. The thread I made on Cassiopaea-related things in relation to Ra-related things also aims to fill in a basic gap in reasonable criticism on the web.
(04-09-2020, 01:46 PM)Agua Wrote: Faulty wisdom teaching always occurs when people „teach“ something they havent experienced personally.
Every „spiritual information“ that derives from books (or youtube) and interpretation, is not wisdom, it is knowledge which is interpreted by one ´ s own limitations.
There is a tendency to equate that with „the real thing“. Thats where one doesnt see the pitfalls and misunderstandings.
Those teachings are no teachings actually.
[...] What I can say from experience, that, especially when we work alone, we tend to interpret every method through our own limitations and use them in a way that often reenforces the issue, although that wasnt how the method was intended.
Does that make sense?
For example, when we are disconnected from ourselves and ungrounded, we will likely distort a method in a way that further disconnects us from ourselves.
The weird thing about the Cassiopaea group, where the main teacher-figure has experienced a hell of a lot, mixing extremely egocentric symbolic interpretations with a very down-to-Earth attitude in other ways, is how it describes things which can go wrong with spiritual matters so completely. All information which can be needed concerning why theory alone doesn't work, is provided. All the ways in which people can fail to "see themselves" and then paint themselves into corners, are also described. There's also much information about higher-D STS beings and how they work, and what looks like a very extensive follow-up to "book 5"-type Ra material topics.
I can't say how "well" or "badly" I have done in relation to what I learned there, though I did work with that group on the web, to the fullest extent that was possible. Outside the group, the most basic ideas of the group made for much greater psychological and spiritual isolation, not less.
Before the inner breaking point (followed by an outer later on), I had a very strong sense, grown over the years, that in general, I knew and did not know, and understood and did not understand, everything I knew and understood.
Afterwards, I can make no claims as to being grounded, but I can make the claim of having "grown back into" myself, in the midst of more going on in the inner world than can be described. Now I have no method as such, any longer. I simply explore (which includes everything external I do), growing something of an approach over time.
(04-09-2020, 01:46 PM)Agua Wrote: How could a smc be formed without getting in touch with eachother?
How could we get in touch with eachother when we are not really „here“ in this body, in this world?
That should be very obvious.
However, the tendency for many seems to be to „reach“ spiritual realms, which then is being done by „moving away“ from here, by further disconnecting and instead trying to connect with „higher realms“.
This is a huge distortion of the material in my opinion.
Quite the opposite, I believe, its actually about really connecting with the physical plane, which is first and foremost our body.
This is our tool through which we make experiences. When we are not fully connected, we obviously experience only a limited aspect of ours.
So, what might sound like a paradox, actually makes a lot of sense:
If we want to experience spiritual realms, we have to move INTO the physical fully, then we can access our consciousness, and I speak about our greater consciousness, more fully.
Whereas, when we try to get away from here into spiritual realms, we actually are much more limited in our ability to experience our full consciousness.
I think people need to work through their bodies in order to form a positive future, though I'm not sure how much in-person physical contact can tie into it. That's because for the most part, such opportunities do not exist; the world is very big, physically, while people are small, in terms of what they can do in person.
It can make a very big difference to have a smaller portion of people doing something positive in person, compared to if they didn't. But at the same time, it is dwarfed by the mass of what is going on which doesn't include expressions of positive spirituality. But I think what people do, through the physical lives they have, build something not only on the physical level, but something which can grow into a different type of future. I cling to that answer because the idea of everything to do with social memory complexes forming happening in this physical world seems logically impossible.
When physical life is truly lived, with and as part of a connection to "higher realms", then maybe something of the nature of those "higher realms" can move closer to Earth, closer to those who live its basic nature. Then, over time, maybe things can change in ways we cannot predict accurately at this level.
(04-09-2020, 01:46 PM)Agua Wrote: There is a tendency to see ourselves as a mechanical device, nicely sorted into categories.
And then, so one might think, we just have to understand the mechanics to be able to control them.
This could not be further from the truth.
We are no machines, there are no mechanics.
A mechanical view is a disconnected view, it loses sight of the fact that we are a living experiencing feeling sentient totality.
All the issues, problems, blockages we have originated when we felt something that was „unwanted“ (painful, terrifying, overwhelming, whatever). We disconnected from that.
In order to heal, we have to re-connect. With the totality of what we are, not excluding any aspect.
A mechanical view and approach is a manifestation of our disconnectedness,a compartmetalization, an artificial seperating disconnecting of things that actually are a whole, and because of that is a part of our problem and cannot be a solution.
The Fourth Way teaching is also extreme in mechanizing human life. But it uses this as the foundation for describing why people cannot control themselves just by understanding the mechanics: change one thing in a complex system and more things will change in ways you did not predict. I think Gurdjieff went wrong in making the barrier between the Earthly and mechanical, and the spiritual and non-mechanical, a little too strong and rigidly defined in his thinking, though it includes a rich multi-layer structure of nested laws and substances of subtler and less mechanical kinds forming all "matter" in the cosmos, including the unique and all-inclusive "atom" of God itself.
(That teaching is very rich in complex structured ideas, which are used in simplified and somewhat conventionalized form by the Cassiopaea group. They basically discard the "cosmology" and instead use a simplified, distorted version of Ra's cosmology, based on their own "6D STO" channeling.)
I have been going through a process of learning that everything I took to be myself, at various times, is just part of the whole.
But I still think it is possible, but not easy, to form a more full, less disconnected, view in connection with neatly structured intellectual contents. I think in part Gurdjieff actually did so, though much of his idiosyncratic mystical systems thinking has been lost and is not provided by the books which cover his ideas. He emphasized that people have more than one kind of mind, and the labeling-machine associated with the physical brain is not the "proper mind" for understanding things.