Service to self / service to others
08-07-2017, 12:06 PM,
#1
Service to self / service to others
Hello, Law of One community!

I am a new student of Law of One, having discovered the idea and books as of a few weeks ago. I have leapt into the first book, but found myself quite entangled with the Ra-lingua. I came across Carla's book `Living the Law of One', and am really enjoying that, and am now reading both books alternately - the 101 and the book 1.

I have a question about service to self and service to others. From what I understand, both paths - sts and sto - would lead to harvesting/graduation. Carla, in her book, says she is of the sto polarity, and that if the reader is of sts polarity then he/she "shall need to look elsewhere for insight as to how to proceed".

I, myself, identify as striving on the sto path. However, I can't get my head around this idea - that someone on the path of sts is also on the path to "enlightenment" or graduating to the 4th density. How can that be? I thought that idea would be to make the transformation to sto, thereby coming closer to the idea of unity, that we are all one.

Can someone please explain this? Or lead me to parts in the readings that would help understand this...

Thank you!
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08-07-2017, 02:28 PM,
#2
RE: Service to self / service to others
To put it in the most simple terms, to enjoy a higher degree of the creators light is to approach unity of purpose/intention (this raises consciousness/intelligence).

This unity can be achieved by force (control), or by cooperation (acceptance). One is the STS path, one is the STO path. Merging self with other self, or by integrating other selves into YOUR self who then integrate others selves into their self and so on. Those who together seek, shall far more surely find, whether that is the joy of union with love and light of the creator, or the union with the power and wisdom of the of the creator. The contact with intelligent infinity may had in either format.
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08-07-2017, 06:48 PM, (This post was last modified: 08-24-2017, 02:07 PM by rva_jeremy.)
#3
RE: Service to self / service to others
(08-07-2017, 12:06 PM)chamkigirl Wrote:  I thought that idea would be to make the transformation to sto, thereby coming closer to the idea of unity, that we are all one.

This is understandable; almost all religions and spiritual schools place themselves in a cosmology where the whole point, the whole reason for believing in the first place, is to be one of the good guys and not one of the bad guys -- however their moral system constructs that. One thing that differentiates the Law of One is the philosophy's absolute embrace of free will.  As portions of the Creator, we have a totally free choice of what path to tread, without judgment or condemnation. Evolution can occur both on the left hand and the right hand path, and progress back to the Creator can take a circuitious route through darker parts of the Creation. To quote the material:

Ra Wrote:In truth there is no right or wrong. There is no polarity for all will be, as you would say, reconciled at some point in your dance through the mind/body/spirit complex which you amuse yourself by distorting in various ways at this time. This distortion is not in any case necessary. It is chosen by each of you as an alternative to understanding the complete unity of thought which binds all things. You are not speaking of similar or somewhat like entities or things. You are every thing, every being, every emotion, every event, every situation. You are unity. You are infinity. You are love/light, light/love. You are. This is the Law of One.

http://www.lawofone.info/results.php?s=1#7

So why even have STS and STO to begin with, if it's all an arbitrary choice? Apparently, we need a certain amount of focus to our spiritual power -- our thought, our desire, our will -- in order to continue our evolution back to the Creator. There are two poles on this axis of focus: to commit to the reality of unity, or to marshal almost our entire will or being towards the cause of denying unity. Our current experience in third density is like a gym where, in the same way you lift heavy things to build muscle, you deal with difficult situations to build your focus towards the way you wish to think of yourself, otherselves, and the Creation.  Those of Ra admit that the inherent bias in each of us that makes us choose one path over another is a mystery.

All the above is my opinion / interpretation, hope it helps.

Jeremy
It is not that love will tell you what to do.
It is that love will tell you how to do it with love.
Q'uo 3/19/06
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08-08-2017, 01:52 AM,
#4
RE: Service to self / service to others
Another way to look at it is that the STS does perceive Oneness - they just see themselves as being that One, and everything else as being extensions of themselves. Which is an attitude that is... not totally incorrect, but still fundamentally distorted. But then, a sufficiently STO-oriented 3D or 4D entity could easily be so self-less that they perceive the Creator in everything except themselves, which is also fundamentally distorted.

Both are attitudes that can point one towards the idea of unified Oneness, but neither attitude has all the answers yet.

Time will tell.  It always does.
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08-08-2017, 02:00 AM, (This post was last modified: 08-08-2017, 02:07 PM by xise.)
#5
RE: Service to self / service to others
It's about love.

STO is universal love, and STS is about trying to evolve through intense self-love and only works through the beginning of 6D, at which point only the STO path can generate enough total love to get to mid-6D (and beyond that is the releasing of polarity).

Service to Others means Service to All. That includes yourself.
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08-08-2017, 08:27 AM,
#6
RE: Service to self / service to others
2017-04-16 which I just read from Jims Blog(Jim as in one of the three who assisted in channeling RA) and felt this may help discussion
https://www.bring4th.org/archive.php?uid=214&catid=&m=4&d=17&y=2017

Questioner: That is a very important point. I used the wrong word. What I meant to say was I believe that it was not necessary for an entity to be consciously aware of the Law of One to go from third to fourth density.

 
Ra: I am Ra. This is correct."

Now here is an extract of Jims interpretation

"Ra responded to Don's first question by reminding us that our third density does not have the capability to understand the Law of One. Thus it is not only not necessary to understand the Law of One to be graduated into the fourth density, but it is necessary to realize that we do not understand the Law of One in order to be available for harvest. We have the veil of forgetting between our conscious and subconscious minds, so we are consciously unaware of the true nature of reality: that we live in a creation of unity, made out of light by the power of love.

 
Even when we come to this realization these words and concepts are mere shadows of what they describe. I believe that the best that we can do, and what will aid our harvestability the most, is to love with all our heart, with all our mind, with all of our strength whenever we have any doubt as to how to proceed on our spiritual path. We can talk about all kinds of concepts, but all that we can really do is love, and that loving attitude will assure graduation in the fourth density of love and understanding."

I recommend reading his blog.. each day he covers one/sometimes more of the questions from Law of One.
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08-08-2017, 10:43 PM, (This post was last modified: 08-09-2017, 11:27 AM by Infinite Unity.)
#7
RE: Service to self / service to others
(08-08-2017, 02:00 AM)xise Wrote:  It's about love.

STO is universal love, and STS is about trying to evolve through intense self-love and only works through the beginning of 6D, at which point only the STO path can generate enough total love to get to mid-6D (and beyond that is the releasing of polarity).

I agree

I believe Love is the "original" thought due to the mere depth/complexity/intensity/Infinity/nature of "Love". It is almost like the most long lasting face/thought/invention that exists/encompasses and the tool or the origin of all the seen and unseen to us. This is also the life component of "life". The enlivener, if you will. All other inventions/thoughts are meaningless without the alchemical component love facilitating/organizing and uniting/intelligizing all other structures/thoughts. This does not mean that seemingly negative spaces do not exist within such a being. As the being is geared to facilitate or teach/learn love. Such zones could be seen as beneficial/necessary to teach/learn love. Those that know love, know that within love the bitter sweetness: is never ending. In that the underlying sum-total dynamic energy is always, and ever the same. The same amount of unending joy, under-ridden by the sorrow of oneness.

Then in another light. In my opinion the Logos is the being we all add up to, as all the cells and organs add up to you. Then the logos is a being. The original being.
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rva_jeremy
08-23-2017, 03:51 PM,
#8
RE: Service to self / service to others
I think STS is the choice of omiting love altogether. It's not about accepting but controlling - also the self.
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08-24-2017, 11:48 AM,
#9
RE: Service to self / service to others
Thank you, all. This has really helped, though I am still a bit confused about how someone of negative polarity can be harvested. I see that this is also about my letting go of my judgements of STS being "wrong", and to truly accept and understand FREE WILL as the Law of One intends. I am just starting to scratch the surface of the Ra material, and many of your answers have helped me go deeper.

Thank you!
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08-24-2017, 01:16 PM, (This post was last modified: 08-24-2017, 01:41 PM by Elros.)
#10
RE: Service to self / service to others
(08-24-2017, 11:48 AM)chamkigirl Wrote:  Thank you, all.  This has really helped, though I am still a bit confused about how someone of negative polarity can be harvested.  I see that this is also about my letting go of my judgements of STS being "wrong", and to truly accept and understand FREE WILL as the Law of One intends.  I am just starting to scratch the surface of the Ra material, and many of your answers have helped me go deeper.

Thank you!

Harvest within the Octave is in no way about becoming better and instead an exploration of a given spectrum of beingness and so harvest is linked to vibrational growth within this spectrum. If you hold both charges they will nullify one another and so you need to explore a given charge to ascend upward.

I think you can see both polarities as being selfful and only the outer edges of the Octave reflect actual selflessness, emergence into 1D from the Source and the merging into 7D toward the Source, which touches to that which is One unconditionally with All. The Octave system in the middle is then dependant upon you holding a selfful charge as the exploration of a self,  and both polarities are poles of a potential charge you can have in relation to yourself as both self and other-selves in perception of the Creator seen in both. Both polarities are potentials of Love and can hold an equal charge, Love is that which rejects and accepts under circumstances.

To give a simple example. If you desire, as a self, to be of a STO nature, then can you be One with All? The answer is no because you desire to embrace a single aspect of your infinite nature while rejecting its counterpart, while your self totality is truly both always. Selflessness is stagnation within the design of the Octave which requires selffulness to advance. STO is much like the default nature of things and as such any exploration of STS reflect the required circumstances for STO to be made STS and STS ever only resolves in embracing and accepting itself (being STO with the self) and this healing enables one to then be STO with others. STS distortions cannot be overcome and must be distilled positively, as it is an aspect of what we all are.

More than that STS is not wrong, it is that STO is not good. You are STO for yourself as you are both self and other-selves and being STO is basically just being in a heathly relationship with what you are. Then one can ask, why can the self be driven toward being unhealthy with itself? (maybe its awareness of love rejects aspects of itself?)

Another simple example of sefful postive/negative charge and selfless positive/negative charge. Say mankind harvested negatively, the Earth would then become selflessly negatively charged although it would not be selffuly negatively charged.

You are in a dance with your life, acknowledge your end.
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08-24-2017, 04:15 PM,
#11
RE: Service to self / service to others
chamkigirl Wrote:This has really helped, though I am still a bit confused about how someone of negative polarity can be harvested.

Perhaps it would help if you worked out your feelings a bit more here in this thread. What exactly is it about the concept of the negative polarity being harvestable that confuses you? Is there a pre-existing belief you hold that this idea conflicts with?

Jeremy
It is not that love will tell you what to do.
It is that love will tell you how to do it with love.
Q'uo 3/19/06
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08-24-2017, 04:36 PM, (This post was last modified: 08-24-2017, 04:36 PM by Glow.)
#12
RE: Service to self / service to others
(08-24-2017, 11:48 AM)chamkigirl Wrote:  Thank you, all.  This has really helped, though I am still a bit confused about how someone of negative polarity can be harvested.  I see that this is also about my letting go of my judgements of STS being "wrong", and to truly accept and understand FREE WILL as the Law of One intends.  I am just starting to scratch the surface of the Ra material, and many of your answers have helped me go deeper.

Thank you!

Remember they are harvested for a different path. 3d is he choice between paths.
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08-24-2017, 08:23 PM,
#13
RE: Service to self / service to others
I have pondered this in this thread:  https://www.bring4th.org/forums/showthread.php?tid=4440

If your interested... Smile

(08-07-2017, 12:06 PM)chamkigirl Wrote:  Hello, Law of One community!

I am a new student of Law of One, having discovered the idea and books as of a few weeks ago.  I have leapt into the first book, but found myself quite entangled with the Ra-lingua.  I came across Carla's book `Living the Law of One', and am really enjoying that, and am now reading both books alternately - the 101 and the book 1.

I have a question about service to self and service to others.  From what I understand, both paths - sts and sto - would lead to harvesting/graduation.  Carla, in her book, says she is of the sto polarity, and that if the reader is of sts polarity then he/she "shall need to look elsewhere for insight as to how to proceed".

I, myself, identify as striving on the sto path.  However, I can't get my head around this idea - that someone on the path of sts is also on the path to "enlightenment" or graduating to the 4th density.  How can that be?  I thought that idea would be to make the transformation to sto, thereby coming closer to the idea of unity, that we are all one.

Can someone please explain this?  Or lead me to parts in the readings that would help understand this...

Thank you!

"You are not here to fix it... You are here to love it." ~ Q'uo
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08-27-2017, 12:44 PM,
#14
RE: Service to self / service to others
(08-24-2017, 04:15 PM)rva_jeremy Wrote:  
chamkigirl Wrote:This has really helped, though I am still a bit confused about how someone of negative polarity can be harvested.


Perhaps it would help if you worked out your feelings a bit more here in this thread.  What exactly is it about the concept of the negative polarity being harvestable that confuses you?  Is there a pre-existing belief you hold that this idea conflicts with?

Thanks, Jeremy, for encouraging to resolve my query.

Well, I suppose "service to self" comes across as something "selfish", implying a certain value judgement. I understand that a STO oriented person might also risk becoming somewhat of a martyr, and that there needs to be a healthy balance with STS. But, someone primarily oriented as STS seems like he/she wouldn't really be living the Law of One, so to say, as he wouldn't experience himself as "other selfs".

As I read on through the material, I am learning to shed my tendency to judge STS bit by bit, but I'm not quite there yet. Like I really don't get how Hitler could not graduate in negative polarity, but Genghis Khan did. I don't get how he could be "depolarized" because he saw himself as Germany's saviour.
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08-27-2017, 12:57 PM,
#15
RE: Service to self / service to others
Thank you for taking the time to explain Minyatur, but there's a LOT that confuses or eludes me in your explanation. Allow me to respond, in italics below.

(08-24-2017, 01:16 PM)Minyatur Wrote:  
(08-24-2017, 11:48 AM)chamkigirl Wrote:  Thank you, all.  This has really helped, though I am still a bit confused about how someone of negative polarity can be harvested.  I see that this is also about my letting go of my judgements of STS being "wrong", and to truly accept and understand FREE WILL as the Law of One intends.  I am just starting to scratch the surface of the Ra material, and many of your answers have helped me go deeper.

Thank you!

Harvest within the Octave is in no way about becoming better and instead an exploration of a given spectrum of beingness and so harvest is linked to vibrational growth within this spectrum. If you hold both charges they will nullify one another and so you need to explore a given charge to ascend upward.

I think you can see both polarities as being selfful and only the outer edges of the Octave reflect actual selflessness, emergence into 1D from the Source and the merging into 7D toward the Source, which touches to that which is One unconditionally with All. The Octave system in the middle is then dependant upon you holding a selfful charge as the exploration of a self,  and both polarities are poles of a potential charge you can have in relation to yourself as both self and other-selves in perception of the Creator seen in both. Both polarities are potentials of Love and can hold an equal charge, Love is that which rejects and accepts under circumstances.

What does this mean? I don't get it.

To give a simple example. If you desire, as a self, to be of a STO nature, then can you be One with All? The answer is no because you desire to embrace a single aspect of your infinite nature while rejecting its counterpart, while your self totality is truly both always.

Sure, but as a STO oriented person, I would be 51% or more dedicated to others, which means I would be 49% or less dedicated to myself. So, I don't desire to embrace a "single aspect of [my] infinite nature". I have both aspects within me in a certain proportion.

Selflessness is stagnation within the design of the Octave which requires selffulness to advance. STO is much like the default nature of things and as such any exploration of STS reflect the required circumstances for STO to be made STS and STS ever only resolves in embracing and accepting itself (being STO with the self) and this healing enables one to then be STO with others. STS distortions cannot be overcome and must be distilled positively, as it is an aspect of what we all are.

I don't understand the phrases in bold.

More than that STS is not wrong, it is that STO is not good. You are STO for yourself as you are both self and other-selves and being STO is basically just being in a heathly relationship with what you are. Then one can ask, why can the self be driven toward being unhealthy with itself? (maybe its awareness of love rejects aspects of itself?)

You say "STO is not good", but then you say STO is "basically being in healthy relationship with what you are". So, isn't that "good"?

And the bit in bold, i don't understand.


Another simple example of sefful postive/negative charge and selfless positive/negative charge. Say mankind harvested negatively, the Earth would then become selflessly negatively charged although it would not be selffuly negatively charged.

Sorry. I don't get the above quote either.

Apologies that I'm not able to get this! And thank you sincerely for the sustained discussion.
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08-27-2017, 01:18 PM,
#16
RE: Service to self / service to others
(08-24-2017, 08:23 PM)Patrick Wrote:  I have pondered this in this thread:  https://www.bring4th.org/forums/showthread.php?tid=4440

If your interested... Smile


(08-07-2017, 12:06 PM)chamkigirl Wrote:  Hello, Law of One community!

I am a new student of Law of One, having discovered the idea and books as of a few weeks ago.  I have leapt into the first book, but found myself quite entangled with the Ra-lingua.  I came across Carla's book `Living the Law of One', and am really enjoying that, and am now reading both books alternately - the 101 and the book 1.

I have a question about service to self and service to others.  From what I understand, both paths - sts and sto - would lead to harvesting/graduation.  Carla, in her book, says she is of the sto polarity, and that if the reader is of sts polarity then he/she "shall need to look elsewhere for insight as to how to proceed".

I, myself, identify as striving on the sto path.  However, I can't get my head around this idea - that someone on the path of sts is also on the path to "enlightenment" or graduating to the 4th density.  How can that be?  I thought that idea would be to make the transformation to sto, thereby coming closer to the idea of unity, that we are all one.

Can someone please explain this?  Or lead me to parts in the readings that would help understand this...

Thank you!

Thanks, Patrick! This did help! Yes, I think the key to my understanding/resolving this conundrum within me of STO/STS is to understand the Law of Free Will. Your thread really helped get a better sense of that.
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08-27-2017, 04:01 PM, (This post was last modified: 08-27-2017, 04:07 PM by Elros.)
#17
RE: Service to self / service to others
(08-27-2017, 12:57 PM)chamkigirl Wrote:  Thank you for taking the time to explain Minyatur, but there's a LOT that confuses or eludes me in your explanation.  Allow me to respond, in italics below.

Glad to explain my thoughts a bit more.


(08-27-2017, 12:57 PM)chamkigirl Wrote:  
(08-24-2017, 01:16 PM)Minyatur Wrote:  Harvest within the Octave is in no way about becoming better and instead an exploration of a given spectrum of beingness and so harvest is linked to vibrational growth within this spectrum. If you hold both charges they will nullify one another and so you need to explore a given charge to ascend upward.

I think you can see both polarities as being selfful and only the outer edges of the Octave reflect actual selflessness, emergence into 1D from the Source and the merging into 7D toward the Source, which touches to that which is One unconditionally with All. The Octave system in the middle is then dependant upon you holding a selfful charge as the exploration of a self,  and both polarities are poles of a potential charge you can have in relation to yourself as both self and other-selves in perception of the Creator seen in both. Both polarities are potentials of Love and can hold an equal charge, Love is that which rejects and accepts under circumstances.

What does this mean? I don't get it.

Both polarities are a charge of Love and they have the same core potential which enables both. Love can be made to be full (acceptance) or incomplete (rejection), when made full it seeks to radiate its fullness and when made incomplete it seeks to absorb into its incompleteness. Love is not one of the two, but truly the potential for both and the Creator then sees the cause and effect which bring about the positive potentials of its Love and the cause and effect which brings about the negative potentials of its Love.

The Ra material states that the negative path was not known until confusion was introduced to offer a better quality experience to the Creator, I think that carries well the idea that the negative only ever manifests in particular circumstances.

(08-27-2017, 12:57 PM)chamkigirl Wrote:  
(08-24-2017, 01:16 PM)Minyatur Wrote:  To give a simple example. If you desire, as a self, to be of a STO nature, then can you be One with All? The answer is no because you desire to embrace a single aspect of your infinite nature while rejecting its counterpart, while your self totality is truly both always.

Sure, but as a STO oriented person, I would be 51% or more dedicated to others, which means I would be 49% or less dedicated to myself.  So, I don't desire to embrace a "single aspect of [my] infinite nature".  I have both aspects within me in a certain proportion.

I actually think that wandering is such an interesting experience because it allows the spirit to balance both polarities in greater ways as aspects of the self than it is possible from standing in a strong polarized charge. Beyond harvest, entities will work toward attaining a strong charge in either direction and work with that polarity, each path is a lengthy exploration and exploring a path disallows to explore the other simultaneously (at our level only though, as we also are the Logos which explores both truly simultaneously).  

(08-27-2017, 12:57 PM)chamkigirl Wrote:  
(08-24-2017, 01:16 PM)Minyatur Wrote:  Selflessness is stagnation within the design of the Octave which requires selffulness to advance. STO is much like the default nature of things and as such any exploration of STS reflect the required circumstances for STO to be made STS and STS ever only resolves in embracing and accepting itself (being STO with the self) and this healing enables one to then be STO with others. STS distortions cannot be overcome and must be distilled positively, as it is an aspect of what we all are.

I don't understand the phrases in bold.

I think a good way to put it is that what is negative resolves in healing and cannot be wished to simply vanish, it must be worked with from that state while embracing that state. Rejection accentuates the negative path and acceptance alleviates it.

I think this quote touches the subject nicely :

Quote:69.11 Questioner: Can you tell me of the situation that the Wanderer finds itself in and why the path back cannot be the simple moving back into the same value of positive time/space?

Ra: I am Ra. The path back revolves, firstly, about the higher self’s reluctance to enter negative space/time. This may be a significant part of the length of that path. Secondly, when a positively oriented entity incarnates in a thoroughly negative environment it must needs learn/teach the lessons of the love of self thus becoming one with its other-selves.

When this has been accomplished the entity may then choose to release the potential difference and change polarities.


However, the process of learning the accumulated lessons of love of self may be quite lengthy. Also the entity, in learning these lessons, may lose much positive orientation during the process and the choice of reversing polarities may be delayed until the mid-sixth density. All of this is, in your way of measurement, time-consuming although the end result is well.

Touches a bit why I said above that to follow the STO path is not being One with All, as when in a negative time/space you need to embrace becoming one with your negatively polarized other-selves to resolve your polarity.

(08-27-2017, 12:57 PM)chamkigirl Wrote:  
(08-24-2017, 01:16 PM)Minyatur Wrote:  More than that STS is not wrong, it is that STO is not good. You are STO for yourself as you are both self and other-selves and being STO is basically just being in a heathly relationship with what you are. Then one can ask, why can the self be driven toward being unhealthy with itself? (maybe its awareness of love rejects aspects of itself?)

You say "STO is not good", but then you say STO is "basically being in healthy relationship with what you are".  So, isn't that "good"?


And the bit in bold, i don't understand.

Well it is not good as in that it is not virtuous, it is somewhat more of a privileged state.

I think a focus on good and bad disallows compassion, while a focus on seeing a healthy/unhealthy state allows greater compassion (or at least that's my take at it Tongue). If I see someone great in hatred, I do not think of them as bad and instead acknowledge that all their hate is an abstraction of inner wounds they are unable to cope with facing in vulnerability, and so when I see someone not bound by hatred I do not think of them as good either and acknowledge their same potential to be bound in hatred which is simply not manifested, as both are One and nothing unlike another.

For the bold part, the only manner in which you can be negative with others is because they mirror aspects of yourself you are unacceptant of and in attempting to control and suppress these aspects in others you attempt at controlling and suppressing these aspects within yourself. It is never healthy to hurt others as all you can hurt is your own beingness. So then one can ask, why can one be unhealthy with itself? While the answer is probably of an infinite nature, I'd say it is because there is a contained unwellness which manifests in unhealthy behaviors.

Another aspect of why healthy is not necessarily good, is that this was what the cosmos initially was and the experience of disharmony is stated to be a mean to offer a better quality experience to the Creator. Tensions yield passion.

(08-27-2017, 12:57 PM)chamkigirl Wrote:  
(08-24-2017, 01:16 PM)Minyatur Wrote:  Another simple example of sefful postive/negative charge and selfless positive/negative charge. Say mankind harvested negatively, the Earth would then become selflessly negatively charged although it would not be selffuly negatively charged.

Sorry. I don't get the above quote either.


What I meant by this is that as self we explore polarity selffully while the Logos and sub-Logois above us explore polarity selflessly in providing an environment for polarity to be expressed and discovered.

A negatively polarized planet mean that the sub-Logoi holds a negative charge within its beingness because of having allowed free will to those inhabiting its world, but this is different from how a mind/body/spirit complex inhabiting this world explores itself in its own polarity. Maybe it wasn't useful to share, but what I meant is that neither polarity are selfless of themselves and selflessness does not dictate its own polarity. A bit like how to reach the Source to be One with All would mean to encompass all that is in all possible colors and not preferred sets of colors.

I don't think that sub-Logois are necessarily completely selfless but that they work selflessness while polarity is a work of selfulness.

(08-27-2017, 12:57 PM)chamkigirl Wrote:  
Apologies that I'm not able to get this! And thank you sincerely for the sustained discussion.

My pleasure, I love contemplating these subjects but I may not be very good at expressing my thoughts.

It went a bit far into my thoughts, but to go back on your original question; you can see that both polarities are one's ability to do work within the Octave and this work is what is required for growth, so what matters is an intensity of charge to work from. This density and the following are more centered upon feeling for harvest, while the fifth works wisdom and the sixth works unity to transcend polarity, and the seventh works toward all-reaching foreverness.

The Octave as a whole is much like a structure meant to expand experience and awareness of Love in all its potentials to fulfill the Creator's seeking of Itself.

Hope I haven't made it more confusing than it was!

You are in a dance with your life, acknowledge your end.
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08-27-2017, 04:41 PM, (This post was last modified: 08-28-2017, 07:28 AM by rva_jeremy.)
#18
RE: Service to self / service to others
(08-27-2017, 12:44 PM)chamkigirl Wrote:  Well, I suppose "service to self" comes across as something "selfish", implying a certain value judgement.

Right -- and not that there's anything wrong with the implication. In my opinion, values are things that we use help focus us on the path we want to grow on. They are more tools than axioms.

If there is no right and wrong, holding a value judgment can hardly be "wrong", anyway. It's just a way to relate to a reflection of ourselves. There's no problem with you feeling a certain way about relating -- it's just a matter of balancing, like you said. The judgement will fall away once it's no longer teaching you about yourself.

(08-27-2017, 12:44 PM)chamkigirl Wrote:  I understand that a STO oriented person might also risk becoming somewhat of a martyr, and that there needs to be a healthy balance with STS.

Especially to thrive in third density, I heartily agree. It's just curious and tragic that there are some who aspire to go beyond comfortably polarized. All you need, so to speak, is 51% STO (whatever that means, but I think we all understand that there's some underlying vibratory algebra here).

(08-27-2017, 12:44 PM)chamkigirl Wrote:  But, someone primarily oriented as STS seems like he/she wouldn't really be living the Law of One, so to say, as he wouldn't experience himself as "other selfs".

Well, it kind of depends on how you look at it. I rather think about STS as the separate self realizing its unified nature through controlling otherselves. That is the particular way STS seeks the one, how it experiences itself as "other selves".

Think about the way it feels to be mad at yourself for a flaw or quality you have. When you're very angry, you can think thoughts and feel things that feel painful and harsh. Yet, it's yourself: in fact, you'd have no ability to address let alone separate from, this part of yourself if you didn't recognize it as part of yourself in the first place. You are simply adopting a controller/controlled relationship between, let's say, your ego and this behavior or quality to bring it into acceptibility. While this is a negative relation, I think it's also a relation that can be considered a way of bringing the components into unity, just with a very different feel than what acceptance achieves.

(08-27-2017, 12:44 PM)chamkigirl Wrote:  As I read on through the material, I am learning to shed my tendency to judge STS bit by bit, but I'm not quite there yet.  Like I really don't get how Hitler could not graduate in negative polarity, but Genghis Khan did.  I don't get how he could be "depolarized" because he  saw himself as Germany's saviour.

To make a somewhat obtuse point for illustration alone: if Ghengis Khan were in Hitler's shoes, he would have done what many of the other higher ups in the Nazi party did and simply exploit the situation for his own benefit.

Hitler was a true believer: ultimately, his desire was to serve the concept of the German Nation. Set aside how distorted this elitist concept of German nationalism is. He still saw what he did as loyal service to this cause, something greater than himself. I believe that those of Ra are indicating that his confusion stemmed from using highly negative means to achieve positive insufficiently negative, if not entirely positive, ends. It wasn't just that he allowed his distortions and imbalances to be energized and manipulated by genuinely STS folks. It was also his inability to fully accept the negative acts he was responsible for that engendered a great deal of cognitive dissonance, I suppose. He felt he was serving an idea worth the sacrifice, but that was not the self.

Jeremy
It is not that love will tell you what to do.
It is that love will tell you how to do it with love.
Q'uo 3/19/06
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08-28-2017, 07:18 AM,
#19
RE: Service to self / service to others
Here's another passage that may help with grasping why STS is possible as a path forward.

Ra Wrote:Questioner: You use the same nomenclature for fourth-density negative as for fourth-density positive. Both are called the dimension of love or understanding. Is this correct?

Ra: I am Ra. This is correct. Love and understanding, whether it be of self or of self towards other-self, is one.

Session 20, Passage 36

Jeremy
It is not that love will tell you what to do.
It is that love will tell you how to do it with love.
Q'uo 3/19/06
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08-28-2017, 07:54 AM, (This post was last modified: 08-28-2017, 07:58 AM by loostudent.)
#20
RE: Service to self / service to others
(08-24-2017, 11:48 AM)chamkigirl Wrote:  Thank you, all.  This has really helped, though I am still a bit confused about how someone of negative polarity can be harvested /.../

Welcome chamkigirl!

Ra explains that third density is the choice - the axis. "The remainder of the densities is continuous refining of the choice." Early Logoi chose a plan with less free will - in this Garden of Eden only STO polarity was available. Later the fruit of knowledge of good and evil was made avaiable through the veiling process. In this new conditions with more free will lessons of love became more effective. Those who love, love more deeply and those who resist, resist more deeply.

Harvestable/harvested negative entities serve the Creator in their own way (although it's just STS to them). The story of Job is a good example.

I think if this was not avaible, then we would also love less deeply - like in Edenic monochrome experiences:

Quote:There is the possibility of love of other-selves and service to other-selves, but there is the overwhelming awareness of the Creator in the self. The connection with the Creator is that of the umbilical cord. The security is total. Therefore, no love is terribly important; no pain terribly frightening; no effort, therefore, is made to serve for love or to benefit from fear. (82.22)
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08-28-2017, 01:58 PM, (This post was last modified: 08-29-2017, 12:31 AM by Apochrahyll. Edit Reason: Removed Inappropriate stuff for a beginner. )
#21
RE: Service to self / service to others
You must take note that STS, STO are merely labels. In essence every action that you take can, only be possibly divided into either being for your own self interest or of others, this is the simplest polar representation of action.

Your coming close to the creator is not a function of the label instead it is a function of what YOU believe and feel is taking you close.

Therefore it is perfectly valid for a STS labelled entity to move towards the creator by proceeding through densities because it believes and feels it is so.
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08-28-2017, 03:35 PM, (This post was last modified: 08-28-2017, 03:39 PM by xise.)
#22
RE: Service to self / service to others
(08-27-2017, 12:44 PM)chamkigirl Wrote:  Well, I suppose "service to self" comes across as something "selfish", implying a certain value judgement.  I understand that a STO oriented person might also risk becoming somewhat of a martyr, and that there needs to be a healthy balance with STS.

This is actually a common misunderstanding of STO. Higher level STO - STO past Jesus level (maybe Buddha level) involves no martyrdom. Martyr is a result of STO orientation without wisdom - just pure love. Once wisdom and love are achieved, the loving and wise path that does not require martyrdom becomes clear. It's much, much easier to find loving paths that involve martyrdom and requires less wisdom. And remember STO loves all, including the self, so if there is a path that is both loving to all and self and doesn't require martyrdom then that is a wise and loving thing. Ra speaks of martyrdom as love without wisdom.


So thinking in terms of STO versus STS to prevent martyrdom is a misunderstanding. It's more about STO without wisdom versus STO with wisdom that prevents martyrdom.

Quote:75.14 Questioner: The instrument would like to know why twice at the “Benedictus” portion of the music that she practices did she experience what she believes to be a psychic attack?

Ra: I am Ra. This is not a minor query. We shall first remove the notations which are minor. In the vibrating, which you call singing, of the portion of what this instrument hallows as the Mass which immediately precedes that which is the chink called the “Hosanna” there is an amount of physical exertion required that is exhausting to any entity. This portion of which we speak is termed the “Sanctus.” We come now to the matter of interest.

When the entity Jehoshua decided to return to the location called Jerusalem for the holy days of its people it turned from work mixing love and wisdom and embraced martyrdom which is the work of love without wisdom.

The “Hosanna,” as it is termed, and the following “Benedictus,” is that which is the written summation of what was shouted as Jehoshua came into the place of its martyrdom. The general acceptance of this shout, “Hosanna to the son of David! Hosanna in the highest! Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord!” by that which is called the church has been a misstatement of occurrence which has been, perhaps, unfortunate for it is more distorted than much of the so-called Mass.

There were two factions present to greet Jehoshua, firstly, a small group of those which hoped for an earthly king. However, Jehoshua rode upon an ass stating by its very demeanor that it was no earthly king and wished no fight with Roman or Sadducee.

The greater number were those which had been instructed by rabbi and elder to make jest of this entity, for those of the hierarchy feared this entity who seemed to be one of them, giving respect to their laws and then, in their eyes, betraying those time-honored laws and taking the people with it.

The chink for this instrument is this subtle situation which echoes down through your space/time and, more than this, the place the “Hosanna” holds as the harbinger of that turning to martyrdom. We may speak only generally here. The instrument did not experience the full force of the greeting which it correctly identified during the “Hosanna” due to the intense concentration necessary to vibrate its portion of that composition. However, the “Benedictus” in this particular rendition of these words is vibrated by one entity. Thus the instrument relaxed its concentration and was immediately open to the fuller greeting.

Service to Others means Service to All. That includes yourself.
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08-29-2017, 09:03 AM, (This post was last modified: 08-29-2017, 09:04 AM by loostudent.)
#23
RE: Service to self / service to others
(08-28-2017, 01:58 PM)Apochrahyll Wrote:  You must take note that STS, STO are merely labels. In essence every action that you take can, only be possibly divided into either being for your own self interest or of others, this is the simplest polar representation of action.

Your coming close to the creator is not a function of the label instead it is a function of what YOU believe and feel is taking you close.

Therefore it is perfectly valid for a STS labelled entity to move towards the creator by proceeding through densities because it believes and feels it is so.

To my understanding thought or action in the moment is a building block. Polarity is built in a proces of repetition/accumulation of building blocks in dispositions/biases.

STS path is the path of separation. Thus the negative entities are dealing with spiritual entropy and eventually abandon negative polarity in sixth density.
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08-30-2017, 01:15 PM,
#24
RE: Service to self / service to others
(08-29-2017, 09:03 AM)loostudent Wrote:  
(08-28-2017, 01:58 PM)Apochrahyll Wrote:  You must take note that STS, STO are merely labels. In essence every action that you take can, only be possibly divided into either being for your own self interest or of others, this is the simplest polar representation of action.

Your coming close to the creator is not a function of the label instead it is a function of what YOU believe and feel is taking you close.

Therefore it is perfectly valid for a STS labelled entity to move towards the creator by proceeding through densities because it believes and feels it is so.

To my understanding thought or action in the moment is a building block. Polarity is built in a proces of repetition/accumulation of building blocks in dispositions/biases.

STS path is the path of separation. Thus the negative entities are dealing with spiritual entropy and eventually abandon negative polarity in sixth density.

You are indeed correct. I did not touch upon that.

Regarding the other statement, I personally take statements like these by Ra which cannot be possibly verified or experienced with a grain of salt...maybe it is so..maybe it is not.
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