Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys
12-13-2017, 06:47 PM,
#91
RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys
(12-13-2017, 06:33 PM)Aion Wrote:  
(12-13-2017, 06:27 PM)Dante776 Wrote:  
(12-13-2017, 04:38 PM)Aion Wrote:  
(12-13-2017, 04:21 PM)Elros Wrote:  
(12-13-2017, 04:19 PM)Aion Wrote:  I think the thread started off with finger pointing so I think it's pretty expected that you would see the same reflected in the thread.

Wasn't the finger pointing toward the medias and not women though?

It was at both. "Are some women in the feminist movement just using this issue in their quest for power?"

On that note, where do you think all this information about male sexual assault victims came from? Likely some media source, although maybe not 'mainstream'.

A simple google search reveals many 'reputable' media sources reporting on it:

https://www.cnbc.com/2017/11/24/sexual-harassment-isnt-just-about-men-says-female-ceo-commentary.html
https://www.unilad.co.uk/featured/opinion-is-sexual-harassment-really-always-a-one-way-street/
https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/media-spotlight/201505/when-men-face-sexual-harassment
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2017/11/16/dont-forget-about-the-men-who-said-theyve-been-sexually-assaulted-too/?utm_term=.f1b35b821cdf
https://psmag.com/news/women-sexually-assault-men-92099

So the claim that it isn't being represented in media seems unfounded and more like some kind of bait for an argument, or maybe I was just lucky with Google and found things the OP didn't.

Of course you can find articles on this. I have already referenced articles and videos in my post. But the point is that men aren't the one's making this a contentious hot button issue. They aren't building campaigns around their assault claims. And I'm not suggesting that they do. They can however try to stop this from turning into an inquisition and the outing of people from their jobs or political office based 'only' on allegations.

The 14th Amendment, in declaring that no State "Shall deprive any person of life, liberty or property without due process of law, nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws," undoubtedly intended, not only that there should be no arbitrary deprivation of life or liberty or arbitrary spoliation of property but that equal protection and security should be given to all under like circumstances in the enjoyment of their personal and civil rights.


Quote:The OP also failed to mention that there are also many cases of men being abused by other men, and even plenty of women being abused by women.

This has been mentioned in some of the articles that I posted as references.

So you are trying to turn people against the women whom you see as 'putting up a ruckus', then?

I don't live in America, so I cannot comment on its laws. However, only in a small handful of cases, even on that list you posted, has anybody been outright fired. Some have been suspended, others have taken their leave. There is also quite a number of men in that article who both apologize and admit to the possibility of misconduct, so I don't think it's quite as one sided as you make it out to be.

My point being, what's your point? What are you trying to achieve?

That's clearly a loaded question. I'm not trying to turn people against anyone. Why does a civil discussion about an important issue in our country have to have some sort of hidden agenda or end with a winner or loser? Maybe that's your perspective but I don't see it that way. That just feeds the egregores as you mentioned.
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12-13-2017, 06:59 PM, (This post was last modified: 12-13-2017, 08:07 PM by Aion.)
#92
RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys
(12-13-2017, 06:47 PM)Dante776 Wrote:  
(12-13-2017, 06:33 PM)Aion Wrote:  
(12-13-2017, 06:27 PM)Dante776 Wrote:  
(12-13-2017, 04:38 PM)Aion Wrote:  
(12-13-2017, 04:21 PM)Elros Wrote:  Wasn't the finger pointing toward the medias and not women though?

It was at both. "Are some women in the feminist movement just using this issue in their quest for power?"

On that note, where do you think all this information about male sexual assault victims came from? Likely some media source, although maybe not 'mainstream'.

A simple google search reveals many 'reputable' media sources reporting on it:

https://www.cnbc.com/2017/11/24/sexual-harassment-isnt-just-about-men-says-female-ceo-commentary.html
https://www.unilad.co.uk/featured/opinion-is-sexual-harassment-really-always-a-one-way-street/
https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/media-spotlight/201505/when-men-face-sexual-harassment
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2017/11/16/dont-forget-about-the-men-who-said-theyve-been-sexually-assaulted-too/?utm_term=.f1b35b821cdf
https://psmag.com/news/women-sexually-assault-men-92099

So the claim that it isn't being represented in media seems unfounded and more like some kind of bait for an argument, or maybe I was just lucky with Google and found things the OP didn't.

Of course you can find articles on this. I have already referenced articles and videos in my post. But the point is that men aren't the one's making this a contentious hot button issue. They aren't building campaigns around their assault claims. And I'm not suggesting that they do. They can however try to stop this from turning into an inquisition and the outing of people from their jobs or political office based 'only' on allegations.

The 14th Amendment, in declaring that no State "Shall deprive any person of life, liberty or property without due process of law, nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws," undoubtedly intended, not only that there should be no arbitrary deprivation of life or liberty or arbitrary spoliation of property but that equal protection and security should be given to all under like circumstances in the enjoyment of their personal and civil rights.



Quote:The OP also failed to mention that there are also many cases of men being abused by other men, and even plenty of women being abused by women.

This has been mentioned in some of the articles that I posted as references.

So you are trying to turn people against the women whom you see as 'putting up a ruckus', then?

I don't live in America, so I cannot comment on its laws. However, only in a small handful of cases, even on that list you posted, has anybody been outright fired. Some have been suspended, others have taken their leave. There is also quite a number of men in that article who both apologize and admit to the possibility of misconduct, so I don't think it's quite as one sided as you make it out to be.

My point being, what's your point? What are you trying to achieve?

That's clearly a loaded question. I'm not trying to turn people against anyone. Why does a civil discussion about an important issue in our country have to have some sort of hidden agenda or end with a winner or loser? Maybe that's your perspective but I don't see it that way. That just feeds the egregores as you mentioned.

If it's an important issue then you obviously have a stance on it. Are you saying you don't have a position, and if so, why bother posting about it? You obviously have some point to make and are clearly dancing around making it.

You don't make many threads here but there is a pretty clear theme amongst them.

And it's cool if that's your thing, I just don't see the reason for all the fluff. You mentioned briefly the idea that these things were maybe an intentional distraction but didn't really go too far that way, but it seems that's more what you were getting at. So why not talk about that?
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12-13-2017, 07:19 PM, (This post was last modified: 12-13-2017, 07:23 PM by Glow.)
#93
RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys
Hey all lovely Bring4thers.
I haven't read the thread much, but what I have has made me see this issue is going to keep coming back over and over until we run out of catalyst over it. That's totally cool.

But I had an interesting thought and it might be useful. I think we are/have been getting this ALL wrong.
Even the words feminist/patriarchy are the equivilant of disinformation or perhaps misdirection.

Do we really think it is the masculine role to take without reciprocation, concur without concern for impact, use and abuse endlessly without hesitation to get what one wants, deny intrinsic care and rights equally among all people, to think only of oneself, or "their people" This isn't male, nor female.

This is living from the unconscious wounds and fears. This is a people, whom ever is in power over others, race/sex/species just a mask fearful of death/starvation/oppression/homelessness/lack of love/rejection/judgement.....etc

These behaviors are a sign one is not in unity and one has not made their wounds and drivings of behavior conscious. Once one faces and heals their own wounds, finds no need for judgement it is natural to then also see other selves wounds and the drivers of their behavior so again not judge but be compassionate.

It is not male vs female.
This is moving from lower triad energies of living unconsciously toward moving to higher triad energies and making all conscious.

I still see the pendulum swing in there at this point as being a necessary step.

Men have had freedom to act out their unconscious wounds in positions of power over others.
Women have not and as we know we cannot force someone to just heal a wound. Sometimes they have to face the karma of creating those wounds to understand the other side. I don't think most will perpetuate what they have suffered but staying in this polarized field of opposites vs unity over this issue will not help anything. Judging one another for NEEDING to face the parts within ourselves who crave power over others or what ever distortion they express is NOT going to get us anywhere. Unless you of course need to experience judging others and feeling superior. If so carry on.

The rest of us if we focus on continuing to look inward, heal our wounds, really understand them. Apply that same compassion and understanding to others. Little by little the light of consciousness shines on others darkness of unconscious and we will reach a tipping point. That tipping point happens because as we heal ourselves we no longer judge or send the energy of our wounds onto others. Without that energy exchange(karmic) no wounds are created so the remaining heal even faster and easier.

Just a thought I hope you do not mind me sharing. If it doesn't resonate it isn't meant to so carry on.
Love to you and non-judgement, be where/who you are.
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12-13-2017, 07:28 PM,
#94
RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys
Well said, mate.
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12-13-2017, 08:08 PM,
#95
RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys
C_A Wrote:It's destroying us

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Gotta learn to love that ride back to the bottom.
There is no magic greater than honest distortion toward love.
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12-13-2017, 08:31 PM,
#96
RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys
(12-13-2017, 07:19 PM)Glow Wrote:  It is not male vs female.

Some men have had freedom to act out their unconscious wounds in positions of power over others, just as some women have.
Some women have not, just like some men also have not, and as we know we cannot force someone to just heal a wound. Sometimes they have to face the karma of creating those wounds to understand the other side. I don't think most will perpetuate what they have suffered but staying in this polarized field of opposites vs unity over this issue will not help anything. Judging one another for NEEDING to face the parts within ourselves who crave power over others or what ever distortion they express is NOT going to get us anywhere. Unless you of course need to experience judging others and feeling superior. If so carry on.

Just edited this bit to make it not male vs female.

It's also interesting to note the idea that either gender, with a power issue over the other gender, may just be what actually is enslaved most between the two. There's a kind of pull from both ends which may be used in many ways and which may distort each in many ways also when blocked.

While the destination is great and all, it's really about the journey. Enjoy each step, other-self.
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12-13-2017, 08:57 PM,
#97
RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys
(12-13-2017, 06:59 PM)Aion Wrote:  If it's an important issue then you obviously have a stance on it. Are you saying you don't have a position, and if so, why bother posting about it? You obviously have some point to make and are clearly dancing around making it.

You don't make many threads here but there is a pretty clear theme amongst them.

And it's cool if that's your thing, I just don't see the reason for all the fluff. You mentioned briefly the idea that these things were maybe an intentional distraction but didn't really go too far that way, but it seems that's more what you were getting at. So why not talk about that?

I've already made my position known throughout this thread. Honestly though it would be nice to dispel misconceptions on both sides and recognize that we are all part of a 3rd density Game and try to move towards reconciliation and balance as others have already stated in this thread.

It reminds me of a quote from Val Valerian of the book Matrix V...

Val Valerian Wrote:Observations: Matters of Balance

I've heard comments about how a couple of people ONLY want to hear of matters spiritual. Spiritual matters are the Light side of polarity. Matters dealing with the Game are Dark side of polarity. You are unbalanced if you ONLY want to hear about spiritual matters while incarnated on Earth OR you ONLY want to hear about physical matters; Balance is the blending of both to serve your Higher Self.

Yin-Yang balance is jumping from one to the other, example: noticing the Event, but failing to make appropriate spiritual connections (such as 'it was their time', if their Higher Self allowed it to happen, it was for the experience for BOTH dead and survivors, etc) makes you part of the Game (such as ’we have to get them/ revenge', fear controlled, glue to every word the TV says even if it keeps repeating, etc).

What you’re getting here is the Balance that comes to Awakened Final incarnations. You are not all ready for that, and that's ok. Proceed at your pace, BUT don't try and lecture me to 'only give spiritual information'. You probably want one of the Light sider sites where you can coo and bless each other. If you only want what's going on in the Event at the moment, you want CNN or just about any other TV channel on now. If you want a Balanced approach, you're in the right place.
           
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12-13-2017, 08:58 PM, (This post was last modified: 12-13-2017, 09:49 PM by Glow.)
#98
RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys
I think much like certain races/species/the earth the female sex has had LESS opportunity to put the power over others distortion into use which is why I phrased it as I did. I wasn’t trying to imply it was a male vs female thing but more a opportunity vs less opportunity issue. One with little access to power cannot wield power to the same degree.

This may be my own perception issue. Im trying to listen to the light as closely as I can but perception is always coloured by ego so not infallible in 3D. Smile I’m always trying.
Your phrasing is equally valid and not in conflict with my own but that’s what I was trying to say obviously still in 3D ..Smile

Edited to add both of my rays other current incarnations are male and they certainly are powerless in many ways due to being male so I can see why you’d comment what you did about power enslaving in a way.

I’m starting to see an imbalance as balance right now so the whole idea of there being 1 perfect balance is only good in a 2D theory. Balance is imperfect and always changing with as many parameters as we have.

Infinite I guess.
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12-14-2017, 03:49 AM,
#99
RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys
Oxford law study looks at the impact of false sexual abuse allegations:

https://www.law.ox.ac.uk/sites/files/oxlaw/the_impact_of_being_wrongly_accused_of_abuse_hoyle_et_al_2016_15_may.pdf
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12-14-2017, 06:29 AM, (This post was last modified: 12-14-2017, 08:27 AM by YinYang.)
RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys
CA Wrote:I see you are so adamant with these feelings and this area.  I will try not to step on your feelings or invalidate you, I'll try very hard to accept you rather than judge.  I don't want you to be upset or anyone and I have not managed that very well at all.   I admit it, I'm more disruptive than helpful...

You call me a narcissist now, among other things.

I'm not upset, C_A, throughout posting in this thread, I've been completely calm and relaxed.

If you or anyone else posting here is still struggling to see what the #MeToo movement is about, let me spell it out.

Sexual predators (99.999999% men) acting with impunity.

Given that this movement has now gone global (and I hope it becomes an avalanche), all men are aware now. Impunity is over. This is a culture change around sexual harassment and assualt. I'm trying to get you to see that this is not about you, this is not your moment. This is the moment belonging to all woman (and abused men) worldwide, it is something to celebrate. Who would have thought anything positive can ever come out of Hollywood? Lol! The irony....

Another thing worth mentioning about how things unfolded in this discussion, is the days are over where women are dismissed, we are part of the conversation now, and this is only just the beginning.

On a lighter and more humorous note, I think Meryl Streep will think twice in future before calling someone 'God' in an Oscar speech... "House of Cards" anyone? How prophetic.



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12-14-2017, 01:35 PM,
RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys
(12-13-2017, 08:58 PM)Glow Wrote:  I think much like certain races/species/the earth the female sex has had LESS opportunity to put the power over others distortion into use which is why I phrased it as I did. I wasn’t trying to imply it was a male vs female thing but more a opportunity vs less opportunity issue. One with little  access to power cannot wield power to the same degree.

Well I think it is mostly the notion of what power is that changes. Every archetype will somewhat have a male/female version as they reflect a dualization of energetical focus. The male version of power is conscious, physical and straightforward, like a warlock that explodes things on its path.  The female version of power is more unconscious, subtle and astral and indirect, like a witch that ensnares and bewilder.

Also since gender is merely like an incarnative option for souls, this is even more true, as the male/female as genders ultimately reflect souls which are neither genders but instead see themselves through gender. So you can talk to someone associating them with males across history, but that person can very well have had more lifetimes as a woman than you did. I think in the nature of the feminine, its control over power is by default something more hidden.

Focusing on gender focuses on separation as genders is an illusionary abstraction between souls to create a sense of separation where there is none.

(12-13-2017, 08:58 PM)Glow Wrote:  This may be my own perception issue. Im trying to listen to the light as closely as I can but perception is always coloured by ego so not infallible in 3D.  Smile I’m always trying.
Your phrasing is equally valid and not in conflict with my own but that’s what I was trying to say obviously still in 3D ..Smile

Edited to add both of my rays other current incarnations are male and they certainly are powerless in many ways due to being male so I can see why you’d comment what you did about power enslaving in a way.

I’m starting to see an imbalance as balance right now so the whole idea of there being 1 perfect balance is only good in a 2D theory. Balance is imperfect and always changing with as many parameters as we have.

Infinite I guess.

Good idea about imbalances, very right imo. If we term imbalances as distortions then they are pretty much required for there to be anything at all.

While the destination is great and all, it's really about the journey. Enjoy each step, other-self.
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12-14-2017, 02:11 PM,
RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys
(12-14-2017, 03:49 AM)isis Wrote:  Oxford law study looks at the impact of false sexual abuse allegations:

https://www.law.ox.ac.uk/sites/files/oxlaw/the_impact_of_being_wrongly_accused_of_abuse_hoyle_et_al_2016_15_may.pdf

Excellent study!
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12-14-2017, 03:03 PM, (This post was last modified: 12-14-2017, 03:40 PM by YinYang.)
RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys
The rules of disinformation

1. Hear no evil, see no evil, speak no evil.  Regardless of what you know, don't discuss it -- especially if you are a public figure, news anchor,  etc. If it's not reported, it didn't happen,  and you never have to deal with the issues.

2. Become incredulous and indignant.  Avoid discussing key issues and instead focus  on side issues which can be used show the topic  as being critical of some otherwise sacrosanct group or theme. This is also known as the  'How dare you!' gambit.

3. Create rumor mongers.  Avoid discussing issues by describing all charges, regardless of venue or evidence, as mere rumors and wild accusations. Other derogatory terms mutually exclusive of truth may work as well. This method which works especially well with a silent press, because the only way the public  can learn of the facts are through such 'arguable rumors'. If you can associate the material with the Internet, use this fact to certify it a 'wild rumor' from a 'bunch of kids on the Internet' which can have no basis in fact.

4. Use a straw man. Find or create a seeming element of your opponent's   argument which you can easily knock down to make  yourself look good and the opponent to look bad. Either make up an issue you may safely imply exists based on your interpretation of the opponent/opponent arguments/situation, or select the weakest aspect of the weakest charges.  Amplify their significance and destroy them in a way which appears to debunk all the charges, real and fabricated alike, while actually avoiding discussion of the real issues.

5. Sidetrack opponents with name calling and ridicule.  This is also known as the primary 'attack the messenger'  ploy, though other methods qualify as variants of that approach. Associate opponents with unpopular titles such as 'kooks', 'right-wing', 'liberal', 'left-wing', 'terrorists', 'conspiracy buffs',  'radicals', 'militia', 'racists', 'religious fanatics',  'sexual deviates', and so forth. This makes others  shrink from support out of fear of gaining the same label, and you avoid dealing with issues.

6. Hit and Run. In any public forum, make a brief attack of your opponent or the opponent position and then scamper off before an answer can be fielded, or simply ignore any answer. This works extremely well in Internet  and letters-to-the-editor environments where a steady stream of new identities can be called upon without having to explain criticism, reasoning -- simply make an accusation or other  attack, never discussing issues, and never answering any subsequent response, for that would dignify the opponent's viewpoint.

7. Question motives. Twist or amplify any fact which could be taken to imply that the opponent operates out of a hidden personal  agenda or other bias. This avoids discussing issues and forces the accuser on the defensive.

8. Invoke authority. Claim for yourself or associate yourself with authority and present your argument with enough 'jargon' and 'minutia' to illustrate you are 'one who knows', and simply say it isn't so without discussing issues or demonstrating concretely why or citing sources.

9. Play Dumb. No matter what evidence or logical argument is offered, avoid discussing issues except with denials they have any credibility, make any sense, provide any proof, contain or make a point, have logic, or support a conclusion. Mix well for maximum effect.

10. Associate opponent charges with old news. A derivative of the straw man -- usually, in any large-scale matter of high visibility, someone will make charges early on which can be or were already easily dealt with - a kind of investment for the future should the matter not be so easily contained.) Where it can be foreseen, have your own side raise a straw man issue and have it dealt with early on as part of the initial contingency plans. Subsequent charges, regardless of validity or new ground uncovered, can usually then be associated with the original charge and dismissed as simply being a rehash without need to address current issues -- so much the better where the opponent  is or was involved with the original source.

11. Establish and rely upon fall-back positions.  Using a minor matter or element of the facts, take the 'high road' and 'confess' with candor that some innocent mistake, in hindsight, was made -- but that opponents have seized on the opportunity to blow it all out of proportion and imply greater criminalities which, 'just isn't so.' Others can reinforce this on your behalf, later, and even publicly 'call for an end to the nonsense' because you have already 'done the right thing.' Done properly, this can garner sympathy and respect for 'coming clean' and 'owning up' to your mistakes without addressing more serious issues.

12. Enigmas have no solution.  Drawing upon the overall umbrella of events surrounding the crime and the multitude of players and events, paint the entire affair as too complex to solve. This causes those otherwise following the matter to begin to lose interest more quickly without having to address the actual issues.

13. Alice in Wonderland Logic. Avoid discussion of the issues by reasoning backwards or with an apparent deductive logic which forbears any actual material fact.

14. Demand complete solutions. Avoid the issues by requiring opponents to solve the crime at hand completely, a ploy which works best with issues qualifying for rule 10.

15. Fit the facts to alternate conclusions.  This requires creative thinking unless the crime  was planned with contingency conclusions in place.

16. Vanish evidence and witnesses.  If it does not exist, it is not fact, and you won't have to address the issue.

17. Change the subject. Usually in connection with one of the other ploys  listed here, find a way to side-track the discussion with abrasive or controversial comments in hopes of turning attention to a new, more manageable topic. This works especially well with companions who can  'argue' with you over the new topic and polarize the discussion arena in order to avoid discussing more key issues.

18. Emotionalize, Antagonize, and Goad Opponents. If you can't do anything else, chide and taunt your opponents and draw them into emotional responses which will tend to make them look foolish and overly motivated, and generally render their material somewhat less coherent. Not only will you avoid discussing the issues in the first instance, but even if their emotional response addresses the issue, you can further avoid the issues by then focusing on how 'sensitive they are to criticism.'

19. Ignore proof presented, demand impossible proofs. This is perhaps a variant of the 'play dumb' rule.  Regardless of what material may be presented by an opponent in public forums, claim the material irrelevant  and demand proof that is impossible for the opponent to come by (it may exist, but not be at his disposal, or it may be something which is known to be safely destroyed or withheld, such as a murder weapon.) In order to completely avoid discussing issues, it may be required that you to categorically deny and be critical of media or books as valid sources, deny that witnesses are acceptable, or even deny that statements made by government or other authorities have any meaning or relevance.

20. False evidence. Whenever possible, introduce new facts or clues designed and manufactured to conflict with opponent presentations -- as useful tools to neutralize sensitive issues or impede resolution. This works best when the crime was designed with contingencies for the purpose, and the facts cannot be easily separated from the fabrications.

21. Call a Grand Jury, Special Prosecutor, or other  empowered investigative body. Subvert the (process) to your benefit and effectively neutralize all sensitive issues without open discussion. Once convened, the evidence and testimony are required to be secret when properly handled. For instance, if you own the prosecuting attorney, it can insure a Grand Jury hears no useful evidence and that the evidence is sealed and unavailable to subsequent investigators. Once a favorable verdict is achieved, the matter can be considered officially closed. Usually, this technique is applied to find the guilty innocent, but it can also be used to obtain charges when seeking to frame a victim.

22. Manufacture a new truth. Create your own expert(s), group(s), author(s), leader(s) or influence existing ones willing to forge new ground via scientific, investigative, or social research or testimony which concludes favorably. In this way, if you must actually address issues, you can do so authoritatively.

23. Create bigger distractions. If the above does not seem to be working to distract from sensitive issues, or to prevent unwanted media coverage of unstoppable  events such as trials, create bigger news stories (or treat them as such) to distract the multitudes.

24. Silence critics. If the above methods do not prevail, consider removing opponents from circulation by some definitive solution so that the need to address issues is removed entirely. This can be by their death, arrest and detention, blackmail or destruction of their character by release of blackmail information, or merely by destroying them financially, emotionally, or severely damaging their health.

25. Vanish. If you are a key holder of secrets or otherwise overly illuminated and you think the heat is getting too hot, to avoid  the issues, vacate the kitchen.
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12-14-2017, 03:23 PM, (This post was last modified: 12-14-2017, 03:26 PM by YinYang.)
RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys
Dante, I have highlighted your primary techniques in red for you, which you have used in this thread...
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12-14-2017, 03:57 PM,
RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys
The women reporters who sparked the #MeToo movement are already being written out of the story

Ronan Farrow has done great reporting on Harvey Weinstein. But it began with Jodi Kantor and Megan Twohey.

[Image: DQr_xX6XcAAK-Ia.jpg]

Source
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12-14-2017, 04:24 PM,
RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys
(12-14-2017, 03:23 PM)YinYang Wrote:  Dante, I have highlighted your primary techniques in red for you, which you have used in this thread...

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12-14-2017, 04:38 PM, (This post was last modified: 12-14-2017, 04:46 PM by Coordinate_Apotheosis.)
RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys
(12-14-2017, 06:29 AM)YinYang Wrote:  
CA Wrote:I see you are so adamant with these feelings and this area.  I will try not to step on your feelings or invalidate you, I'll try very hard to accept you rather than judge.  I don't want you to be upset or anyone and I have not managed that very well at all.   I admit it, I'm more disruptive than helpful...

You call me a narcissist now, among other things.

I'm not upset, C_A, throughout posting in this thread, I've been completely calm and relaxed.

If you or anyone else posting here is still struggling to see what the #MeToo movement is about, let me spell it out.

Sexual predators (99.999999% men) acting with impunity.

Given that this movement has now gone global (and I hope it becomes an avalanche), all men are aware now. Impunity is over. This is a culture change around sexual harassment and assualt. I'm trying to get you to see that this is not about you, this is not your moment. This is the moment belonging to all woman (and abused men) worldwide, it is something to celebrate. Who would have thought anything positive can ever come out of Hollywood? Lol! The irony....

Another thing worth mentioning about how things unfolded in this discussion, is the days are over where women are dismissed, we are part of the conversation now, and this is only just the beginning.

On a lighter and more humorous note, I think Meryl Streep will think twice in future before calling someone 'God' in an Oscar speech... "House of Cards" anyone? How prophetic.




I don't understand how you don't see prejudice in your post.

So I'm going to just note this for you, you say this movement isn't about me, but then you state its for abused men.

This movement is for me then.  I am sorry you cannot see that...

And it's very saddening to see you still label men sexual predators, all men (99.999999 percent of them anyway)

I'm guessing you think I'm a sexual predator, so, with that, I think I will refrain from further interactions with you, at least until I feel like you've gotten all these discriminatory feelings towards me/n settled.

It's extremely hurtful to be called something so horrible, you don't even seem to realize how hurtful your words have become.

I must reluctantly say, you remind me of one of the girls that abused me, that makes me incredibly cautious now.  So I will refrain from here on out.

Glow, Aion, Elros, Isis, you've all pointed to some helpful thoughts, and even new things to consider.  I just want to thank you all for your help.  I hope everyone will be able to heal from these discussions one day.

I really hope one day we'll all see things more clearly.
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12-14-2017, 05:47 PM,
RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys
Heh.  So one of my friends who lurks here sent me a message basically saying that for an alleged spiritual group, they expected vastly different responses in this thread.

I guess it goes to show that we're all vulnerable to the illusions of seperation.
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12-14-2017, 06:35 PM, (This post was last modified: 12-14-2017, 06:36 PM by Glow.)
RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys
CA- If we can’t get there smoothly how do we expect the world to get there smoothly. Smile
Long road
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12-14-2017, 08:33 PM,
RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys
That's literally the logic I had after my initial blow up.

Large Distant Change begins at I.  I must change for the world to change.
This change is not wrong, it is a choice of discipline of the self.  To see not them and I, but Us.

Unity starts with yoU.

You are me.  I am you.  We must work together.

Sadly it is a layered and reinforced, conditioned mentality, these things that bring us to separation.  Even in the face of positive motives, we can so easily see something so vastly differently from what it intended and desired.  Further in some areas we're all the hurt animal called Terran.  When our hurt wounds are tended to, the pain makes us recoil.

It's the burning sensation as ointment is applied to a cut that tells you it is beginning to heal.
It's the deterioration of muscle and the burn from it that leads to stronger muscles.

We must hurt to heal I am beginning to think.

I think if we hide this hurt, we are not exposing it to be tended to.  To hide behind anything, from pride to shame to politics to statistics, we have to show the doctor our wound so she can heal it, not conceal it and speak of it in a myriad of ways.

Everyone is everything.  It'd seem we need focal points to discern what is manifested, a common point is radical prejudice, sub-points of that are terrorism, racism, and sexism.

We all contain a little bit of that by inference of being infinite beings of infinity.

We must accept this and forgive this, of ourselves, of others.

No one is perfect because we're all imperfect, which paradoxically makes us all perfect the way we are.

I can't speak of the media influences of specific areas, only broadly, and as we all see, that has led to problems with discussion.  It halts discussion for debate and argument.

I think we need guidelines for discussion of 'isms', most notably, racism and sexism.  So that we can have a structured means of working through these catalytic issues in a way that helps us not respawn the very catalyst we communed in threads to work upon.

I see a powerful desire to work on reconciling racism and sexism in this forum, we have communed in several threads to discuss these topics and virtually all of them devolved into point proving labels and opinions.  Again and again we fall to ego and seperation and fail to see each other as equals.

I will admit to doing this myself, if others would admit this too, we might be able to accept some underlying concerns that avail themselves, and put them on hold long enough, to be still, long enough to find a sort of trickle of light in this matter, a ray of love to follow towards.

Let's talk about creating something instead of ending something.

Let's transform this want to end something into a want to create something new.  A better way to take over the previous way.

To transform sexism and racism into a distant history. To educate others on the equality between us all rather than teach about past ways of differentiating each other.  It's good to educate on history but no one says Hitler's Genocides are being learned and enacted, so its still good to provide realization that things like racism and sexism occur, but we must portray them and guide those learning of these things, that they are wrong and go against everything that stands for the word, UNITED.
That there are reasons for everything, that we can't stereotype people and expect a good outcome if we do it broadly.  Obviously there are some exceptions such as stereotyping a gang member as dangerous, or a mentally unstable person with physically violent tendencies, or a person whom is known to manipulate others.

But beyond exceptions, generally speaking, sexism has to be transformed into gender equality and mutual understanding.  Racism has to be transformed into cultural equality and mutual (diplomatic?) understanding.

Jesus turned water to wine.

Can we turn prejudice into acceptance?
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12-14-2017, 08:52 PM,
RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys
Quote:50.7 Questioner: Thank you. Can you expand on the concept which is this: that it is necessary for an entity to, during incarnation in the physical as we call it, become polarized or interact properly with other entities and why this isn’t possible in between incarnations when he is aware of what he wants to do, but why must he come into an incarnation and lose memory, conscious memory of what he wants to do and then act in a way that he hopes to act? Could you expand on that please?

Ra: I am Ra. Let us give the example of the man who sees all the poker hands. He then knows the game. It is but child’s play to gamble, for it is no risk. The other hands are known. The possibilities are known and the hand will be played correctly but with no interest.

In time/space and in the true-color green density, the hands of all are open to the eye. The thoughts, the feelings, the troubles, all these may be seen. There is no deception and no desire for deception. Thus much may be accomplished in harmony but the mind/body/spirit gains little polarity from this interaction.

Let us re-examine this metaphor and multiply it into the longest poker game you can imagine, a lifetime. The cards are love, dislike, limitation, unhappiness, pleasure, etc. They are dealt and re-dealt and re-dealt continuously. You may, during this incarnation begin — and we stress begin — to know your own cards. You may begin to find the love within you. You may begin to balance your pleasure, your limitations, etc. However, your only indication of other-selves’ cards is to look into the eyes.

You cannot remember your hand, their hands, perhaps even the rules of this game. This game can only be won by those who lose their cards in the melting influence of love; can only be won by those who lay their pleasures, their limitations, their all upon the table face up and say inwardly: “All, all of you players, each other-self, whatever your hand, I love you.” This is the game: to know, to accept, to forgive, to balance, and to open the self in love. This cannot be done without the forgetting, for it would carry no weight in the life of the mind/body/spirit beingness totality.
The desire to be free is one of the brightest burning flames in the heart of humanity.
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12-15-2017, 03:47 AM, (This post was last modified: 12-15-2017, 06:36 AM by YinYang.)
RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys
Coordinate_Apotheosis Wrote:I don't understand how you don't see prejudice in your post.

Point out the prejudice in my post please, write it down word for word.

Coordinate_Apotheosis Wrote:So I'm going to just note this for you, you say this movement isn't about me, but then you state its for abused men.

It's for all women and a small percentage of sexually harassed or abused men, do you fall inside this category?

Coordinate_Apotheosis Wrote:And it's very saddening to see you still label men sexual predators, all men (99.999999 percent of them anyway)

Good heavens, is there something wrong with your reading ability? I said 99.999999% of sexual predators are men, not 99.999999% of men are sexual predators... I thought if I spelled out word for word what this movement was about, it would eliminate all confusion, but I didn't account for the likes of you it seems.

Coordinate_Apotheosis Wrote:I'm guessing you think I'm a sexual predator [...] It's extremely hurtful to be called something so horrible, you don't even seem to realize how hurtful your words have become.

And now this whopper! How do you deduce from my post that I think (or have called you) a sexual predator?

Coordinate_Apotheosis Wrote:I must reluctantly say, you remind me of one of the girls that abused me, that makes me incredibly cautious now.  So I will refrain from here on out.

And I must reluctantly admit that I think you are devoid of sound reasoning. It's also interesting to me how you always lament about how you can't endure all the suffering in this world any longer, naming the rape of women specifically in these soliloquies of yours, and when the opportunity arose to add your voice in support of these women, you decided to undermine the movement.
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12-15-2017, 04:47 AM, (This post was last modified: 12-15-2017, 04:59 AM by Aion.)
RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys
(12-14-2017, 05:47 PM)Coordinate_Apotheosis Wrote:  Heh.  So one of my friends who lurks here sent me a message basically saying that for an alleged spiritual group, they expected vastly different responses in this thread.

I guess it goes to show that we're all vulnerable to the illusions of seperation.

I think it's pretty loose to call the forum a 'spiritual group'. It's a mixmash of people who are predominantly spiritual or semi-spiritual but there is very little 'group' as far as I can see. We just all happen to be writing on the same forum. A lot of people have read the Ra Material so I suppose that's our common ground, but then, opinions on it vary widely.

Some might want it to be different. Others might like it that way. I would like peace.

As I have heard it put by a monk I met - we have all drank the crazy water.
The desire to be free is one of the brightest burning flames in the heart of humanity.
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sunnysideup
12-15-2017, 11:19 AM,
RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys
Another interesting take...

***************************

This Isn’t About Bad Apples; It’s About Our Broken Sexual Culture

It seems that another man in power gets called out every single day for sexual harassment or assault charges these days. Harvey Weinstein may have been the first to make our collective jaws drop with his ritualistic and repeated attacks, but he has since been joined by a football team’s worth of predators.

But this is not about bad apples. This is about a root system that is insufficient to grow healthy sexual humans. I’ve been thinking about this a lot lately as I have been reading Jaclyn Friedman’s insanely timely book, Unscrewed: Women, Sex, Power, and How to Stop Letting the System Screw Us All. If you have any hankering to understand the story behind and underneath the story that has been hogging our headlines lately, it’s worth a read.

The basis of Jaclyn’s argument is that we have been living through an “era of fauxpowerment” — “a time when shiny pictures of individual women wielding some symbol of sexual power are used to distract us from our still mostly retrograde and misogynist status quo.”

Think Kerry Washington in her sexy outfits tromping all over D.C. to fix what’s broken. Think Kim Kardashian posting naked pictures of herself and calling it feminist. Think Melania Trump, who was a model before she was first lady, making money off of her sex appeal was a direct path to the White House.

In our neoliberal capitalistic society, sexual power has been advertised as something that you can purchase — whether it’s high-end, like exorbitantly expensive, non-toxic make-up endorsed by GOOP, or populist, like Victoria’s Secret underwear designed to make teenage girls in the heartland feel like the porn stars their boyfriends are watching endlessly and at no cost online.

Which brings us to the next infuriating area of American sexual dysfunction: our sexual education strategy (or total lack thereof). Currently, only 24 states and the District of Columbia mandate sex education. But even in those states, districts interpret what “sex education” means widely and inadequately.

What’s even crazier is that kids today — the same ones with easy access to porn and all the other warped, degrading messages about sex available on the Internet — are getting less sex education than previous generations! A recent study published by the Guttmacher Institute found that today’s teens are less likely to be educated on important and timely topics than were their parents. In 2011–2013, 43 percent of adolescent females and 57 percent of adolescent males did not receive information about birth control before they had sex for the first time.

So while it’s beyond time to expose predatory men in power and talk about sexual harassment and assault policies in every institution in America, our work isn’t done there. This is also about addressing a much broader brokenness. It’s about admitting that we raise girls to feel like their power is their sexuality, and therefore they have to either hoard it and benefit from being seen as pure, or dole it out in strategic ways that will help them get ahead (their own pleasure or preference is irrelevant in either terrible choice). It’s about admitting that we raise boys to see sex as something they are entitled to, as something transactional, as something that men seek out and women either resist or give in to. And it’s about the continued attempt to control women’s bodies, particularly their reproduction.

In other words, this is an exciting, emperors-have-no-clothes moment, but what we must really be after is tearing down the masters’ houses and rebuilding them entirely. We have to remake this country — starting with sex education and working our way up and out — to reflect the actual complexity and broad range of how human sexuality gets expressed and must be honored.

Friedman points out an incredibly powerful detail in her book. When the Steubenville rape took place, one of the bystanders — an American boy — said that he didn’t intervene because he didn’t recognize what he was seeing as rape. The unconscious victim wasn’t fighting back. She was little more than a passive receptacle, which fit with the way he’d seen sex — not rape — depicted on television. When Brock Turner was raping a young woman on Stanford’s campus, two bystanders riding by on bikes saw something happening in the dark shadows and intervened. They happened to be young men educated and socialized in Sweden, a place that integrates sex education starting in kindergarten. Those young men knew, in a split second, that what they were seeing was wrong, a violation of basic human rights, and they honored their instincts to stop it.

This is not a story about a coward and two heroes. It’s a story about a country that treats sex like a necessary vice, power play, and business opportunity, and its teenagers like perverts who must be kept in the dark, and another that prioritizes health, sexuality, and human dignity across the lifespan.

I know which one my children deserve. What about you?

Source
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12-15-2017, 11:49 AM,
RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys
(12-10-2017, 04:08 AM)Dante776 Wrote:  
(12-10-2017, 12:32 AM)0000 Wrote:  nah Jade is correct - ur a troll (aka: 'agent provocateur')
supprised u didn't say ra's part of a feminazi reptilien world take over - next post?
nb: hows the 'demonic possession' going? see u gave up sucking that thread dry after aion gave useful answers which u ignored

long live white lives matter/NRA/MRA  
us guys been kept down far to long bro  
lol yeah riiight
Huh Confused  Angry

You know, this kind of ignorant pea-brained comment really isn't worth responding to. If it is SMC, I suppose you missed the spanking I gave you in the 'demonic possession thread' and are back for more. The stupid feminazi reptilien comment sounds like something she would say. And how's your demon possession going? Don't think for a moment that you don't have them just because you don't recognize it as such. No, the only "troll" on here is pathetic nut jobs like you who don't know how to have a civil conversation and would rather attack people that you are intellectually threatened by. And FYI I'm not done with that thread and will be posting more information soon which I'm sure you're salivating at the mouth for and can't get enough of. I welcome your Non-Provocateur comments here and there as well, but you already know that if you come at me a certain way, your're gonna get it a certain way. So, it's best to come correct!

say wha?

been offline IRL windsurfing all week better than this stress
i stand up for my mom &girlfriend cos my brothers in lockdown & blew his chance
my mom taught me to know whiny mens rights trolls when i read it
thers too many opnions here and not enuff sense
i came here via hidden hand page i like the main info from ra but reading these forums is a big headache
i still say u sucked energyfrom the other thread /never followed through with the help offered- kept finding more excuses
ps: SNC & Jades correct that ur neg focus is suspicious... (isis seems a bit of a fangirl?)... lotsa good replies in this thread
getting back to the ra info now
-later
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12-15-2017, 12:49 PM, (This post was last modified: 12-15-2017, 06:52 PM by Dante776.)
RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys
Coordinate_Apotheosis Wrote:So I'm going to just note this for you, you say this movement isn't about me, but then you state its for abused men.
YinYang Wrote:It's for all women and a small percentage of sexually harassed or abused men, do you fall inside this category?

You're still not getting it YinYang. It shouldn't just be about "all women and a small percentage of sexually harassed or abused men." Although elsewhere you said that this is "Our Moment" [Women]!

I have a question for you! Why is it that there are never any 'high-profile' women found culpable in any of these cases? 100% of the time!? Given the diversity of human nature, how is it possible that NONE of these women ever "initiated," were the "aggressors," "consented," or were found to be "lying?" Is it because high-profile women just don't do this sort of thing or is it because men just aren't reporting it? I find this very odd! (This could apply to some non high-profile women reporting against high-profile men as well.)

Quote:In Washington, DC the Violence Against Women act is slithered through Congress and Hillary said she wanted to go to the Senate to "do everything for women". This is more of the same Orion crap. If it was the Violence Against People act, that's a different story, but the legislation leaves it open for continued violence by females against males while banning the reverse. (Matrix V)

Why Don't We Hear About Men's Rights? | Marc Angelucci #RPRF


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12-15-2017, 12:57 PM, (This post was last modified: 12-15-2017, 12:59 PM by Jade.)
RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys
It's actually quite simple. It's numbers. How many women are in powerful positions? Very few compared to men. That's why the nature of this power struggle is imbalanced at the core.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_women_CEOs_of_Fortune_500_companies

Quote:This is a list of Women CEOs of the Fortune 500, based on the magazine's 2017 list. As of the date of publication, women held 6.4 percent of Fortune 500 CEO roles.

I would guess, that those women who have these positions had to likely work extra hard to earn them, so they are likely not as glib with their power as men who hold prestigious positions are.
There is no magic greater than honest distortion toward love.
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12-15-2017, 01:01 PM, (This post was last modified: 12-15-2017, 01:15 PM by Dante776.)
RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys
Yes but (This could apply to some non high-profile women reporting against high-profile men as well.) And is it likely that ALL of the reporting high-profile models and actresses are 100% innocent?
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12-15-2017, 01:21 PM,
RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys
(12-15-2017, 01:01 PM)Dante776 Wrote:  Yes but (This could apply to some non high-profile women reporting against high-profile men as well.) And is it likely that ALL of the reporting high-profile models and actresses are 100% innocent?

What makes you think this? Do you have any proof, or are you just content to speculate and accuse women of being liars? At what percentage of perceived "innocence" does a victim stop being a victim? I thought you wanted everyone to be perceived as innocent until proven guilty?

There are so many stories that have come out that have legitimate proof, OR, have actually had the accused admit to what they have done - in fact, many if not most of the higher profile men have admitted wrong doing and apologized. So, I think saying that their accusers are lying is not based on any proof whatsoever.
There is no magic greater than honest distortion toward love.
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12-15-2017, 02:39 PM, (This post was last modified: 12-15-2017, 06:57 PM by Dante776.)
RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys
(12-15-2017, 01:21 PM)Bring4th_Jade Wrote:  
(12-15-2017, 01:01 PM)Dante776 Wrote:  Yes but (This could apply to some non high-profile women reporting against high-profile men as well.) And is it likely that ALL of the reporting high-profile models and actresses are 100% innocent?

What makes you think this? Do you have any proof, or are you just content to speculate and accuse women of being liars? At what percentage of perceived "innocence" does a victim stop being a victim? I thought you wanted everyone to be perceived as innocent until proven guilty?

There are so many stories that have come out that have legitimate proof, OR, have actually had the accused admit to what they have done - in fact, many if not most of the higher profile men have admitted wrong doing and apologized. So, I think saying that their accusers are lying is not based on any proof whatsoever.

I beg to differ. Some men are beginning to put up a public defense. Again, I'm not saying that none of these men aren't culpable. And don't understand why this is seen in only "absolute" terms. I'm just saying, is it possible that "some" of these women are omitting their culpability or are they ALL 100% innocent (absent of an investigation or court settlement)?

Quote:Geraldo Rivera says women may be "criminalizing courtship" after Matt Lauer report - CBS NewsCBS

All The Matt Lauer Scandal Details: His Statement, Geraldo Rivera's Defense Of Him & More | PeopleTV



Russell Simmons And Tavis Smiley Fight Back Against Sexual Misconduct Allegations


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