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Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys - Printable Version +- Bring4th (https://www.bring4th.org/forums) +-- Forum: Bring4th Community (https://www.bring4th.org/forums/forumdisplay.php?fid=16) +--- Forum: Olio (https://www.bring4th.org/forums/forumdisplay.php?fid=7) +--- Thread: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys (/showthread.php?tid=15056) |
RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys - Coordinate_Apotheosis - 12-15-2017 Okay, I think I'm done here. It's clear I'm not helping deter the radical prejudice present here nor am I helping certain sexist individuals from learning anything. If all you want to do is prove me wrong and you right, then no one is getting anywhere. When you're ready to even try to see men and women in an equal light as women and men, well, I don't see that happening even any time soon. When you're done assaulting me maybe I will consider further interactions, but as of this moment, YY, please be happy to know you'll be the first ever member I stop responding to. Even Jade isn't so condescending and scathing as you've become. Nor is she as misleading. In many ways I regret time and time again doing this incarnation, you are now just another reminder of why on a long list. People are cruel and thoughtless towards others. I bid you in the immortal words of Fez, A Good Day. Maybe one day I won't be personally attacked for trying to remind people we're all one and we shouldn't be so judgmental towards each other. Maybe, but probably not. Your love is hurtful. And Dante, seriously, you're not helping your own cause. By this point you've simply ensnared a few people in a charged circular debate on sexism and whom is more sexist, boys or girls. You've ensured further separation. Congratulations on winning, you won nothing. I will be refraining from responding to you too, as you're as bad as YY. May you all eventually find peace through this prejudice... I'll pray for y'all. Maybe I'll make my own thread with a heavier attempt at aiming towards resolutions rather than anything else... RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys - Dante776 - 12-15-2017 (12-15-2017, 03:56 PM)Coordinate_Apotheosis Wrote: And Dante, seriously, you're not helping your own cause. By this point you've simply ensnared a few people in a charged circular debate on sexism and whom is more sexist, boys or girls. You've ensured further separation. Congratulations on winning, you won nothing. I will be refraining from responding to you too, as you're as bad as YY. I'm sorry that you see my role in this that way C_A. Even YY's. I think you have it all wrong. Why does it have to be zero sum gain with you? Everything doesn't always have to be about winning or losing. That was not my purpose for this thread. The purpose was to talk it out. Have a discussion. This is the ONLY WAY that you get to a resolution. That is how we all move toward balance. That may not be as easy and palatable as you would like it to be but I felt that it was a discussion worth having. And watch for the major media to start taking this position soon as well. So, if you want to storm off and create another thread attempting to do the same thing, just be prepared for a lot of push back, resistance, and disagreements because people have strong feelings about this on both sides. You'll have to go through the same process. Best of luck with that! Quote:42.2 Questioner: I will just read it very rapidly the question, then. RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys - Coordinate_Apotheosis - 12-15-2017 I'm sorry that you don't see the offensiveness in your posts. I hope one day you will be able to see through other's eyes. Good luck, love you all, even if you hurt me, that's just me hurting myself. May peace find us all. RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys - Dante776 - 12-15-2017 (12-15-2017, 06:49 PM)Coordinate_Apotheosis Wrote: I'm sorry that you don't see the offensiveness in your posts. I hope one day you will be able to see through other's eyes. Lighten up man. It's not that deep! Hey, your're not going anywhere are you? I mean...we'll still see ya' on other threads, right? RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys - YinYang - 12-16-2017 Coordinate_Apotheosis Wrote:It's clear I'm not helping deter the radical prejudice present here nor am I helping certain sexist individuals from learning anything. C_A, I doubt you can see the humour in it when a self-proclaimed misogynist announces it's clear he's not helping "deter the radical prejudice present here" or "help certain sexist individuals learn anything". As for my sarcasm earlier in the thread, that was in response to the same humour of a self-proclaimed misogynist announcing "When everyone is ready to start talking about fixing these issues, I'll be around." I have also noticed you have a penchant for making false assertions and distorting the truth, of which I myself have now also been at the receiving end of... Coordinate_Apotheosis Wrote:When you're done assaulting me maybe I will consider further interactions, but as of this moment, YY, please be happy to know you'll be the first ever member I stop responding to. I'm sorry you see me correcting your false assertions as 'assault', instead of addressing my individual points I put to you, which was "How do you deduce from my post that I think (or have called you) a sexual predator?" and "please point out the prejudice in my post". Saddle Up for the Ride! - Dekalb_Blues - 12-16-2017 (12-13-2017, 08:08 PM)Bring4th_Jade Wrote:C_A Wrote:It's destroying us Jade -- LOL! Perhaps my black-humour gland is hyperactive, but somehow the delightfully cartoonish simplicity of this Tarot-card image strikes me as almost unbearably funny, depicting as it does a sort of ultimate and anything-but-subtle overthrowing of all sorts of human fond-hopes-&-dreams. As the Scots poet Burns put it in another connection: The best-laid schemes o' mice and men Gang aft agley, An' lea'e us nought but grief an' pain For promis'd joy! (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/To_a_Mouse) I can almost hear the comic-book-style sound effects: ZAP! BOOM! AAAAAUUUGGGHHH! CRASH!!! as various hubristic best-laid schemes o' men gang agley. As someone who's been married more times than some folks have had hot meals, and who used to work professionally in psywar to boot (and thus is knowl- edgeable more than somewhat about the spectrum of modes of conflict from subliminal subversion to nuking -- you know, there's a reason for the lasting popu- larity of the old adage, "All's fair in love and war"), I just can't bring myself to factionally fault-find in the current approved, politically-correct Total-War-Between- The-Sexes fashion; I espouse, rather, a philosophy of Sadder-But-Wiser-Compassionating-Of-Our-Incarnate-Predicament-As-Wee-Sleekit-Cowrin-Tim'rous-Mortal- Beasties.* The co-evolutionary scheme of the colluding sexes -- the affordances their mutual harmonies and (seeming) disharmonies provide for catalyst up, down, and sideways, eight ways to Sunday -- is way more complex than the imbecile, Victim-Culture-promoting reductive schemata cynically provided for mass consumption courtesy of the Usual Human-Society-Destabilizatory Suspects charioteering around the galaxies creating their characteristic brand of self-servingly divisive disinform- ative mischief. ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ * https://leftisrightblog.files.wordpress.com/2015/05/life-in-hell-mistakes-were-made.jpg, http://runt-of-the-web.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2016/08/memes-about-regretting-nothing.jpg Bonus! The hard-earned secret inner wisdom behind appreciating, adding positively to, & learning from any intense relationship worth the heart-room it takes up!!: https://images.gr-assets.com/quotes/1511992603p8/8630.jpg Burn After Reading! ![]() RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys - Aion - 12-16-2017 (12-15-2017, 05:39 PM)Dante776 Wrote:(12-15-2017, 03:56 PM)Coordinate_Apotheosis Wrote: And Dante, seriously, you're not helping your own cause. By this point you've simply ensnared a few people in a charged circular debate on sexism and whom is more sexist, boys or girls. You've ensured further separation. Congratulations on winning, you won nothing. I will be refraining from responding to you too, as you're as bad as YY. What sort of resolution do you desire that does not include winners or losers, someone being right and someone being wrong? If we are just going to agree to disagree then we can just do that. Problem solved. RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys - Dante776 - 12-16-2017 (12-16-2017, 10:40 AM)Aion Wrote: What sort of resolution do you desire that does not include winners or losers, someone being right and someone being wrong? If we are just going to agree to disagree then we can just do that. Problem solved. Winners and losers is more of a competitive approach. A cooperative approach aligns with the process of integrative bargaining, which leads parties to seek win-win solutions. This is a more 'balanced' approach to conflict resolution. RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys - YinYang - 12-17-2017 Listen Up: There Is a Solution to the Sex Abuse and Harassment Epidemic Unfolding Before Your Eyes—And You Will Be Surprised at Who Must Step Up to Succeed The list keeps growing of powerful men accused of sexual abuse, assault, or harassment. In historical order, just to name the headliners, Bill Clinton, Fr. Paul Shanley, Jerry Sandusky, Bill Cosby, Donald Trump, Harvey Weinstein, Roy Moore, Al Franken, John Conyers, and Charlie Rose have all faced accusations of this nature. Thank God. This is the moment that will change history, because the “kings” of our culture are being brought to the public square and revealed for what they are – craven abusers of power. There has been intense media coverage but surprisingly little if any attention paid to the experts on sex abuse, assault and harassment, who could inject facts into the discourse. There is actually a science of child sex abuse and sex assault. Instead, there has been a lot of hand-wringing by those who do not labor in this vineyard, and over-politicization of the issues to the point that you can’t see what you need to see. When a cable news show staffs its “panel of experts” to discuss these cases solely with political reporters and pundits, they are missing the mark. Let’s start by putting some facts about sexual misconduct on the table. About the Perpetrators: Don’t Trust Your Instincts This is about power, and Americans typically understand how power operates. To start at the beginning, the United States is based on a basic proposition: assume everyone who has power is likely to abuse it. You can thank James Madison and the other Framers for this time-tested foundation. To be sure, they were discussing the President, Congress, and the courts (which covers Trump, Clinton, Conyers, and Franken) but, let’s face it, the same reasoning applies to the priesthood, college sports, Hollywood, music, and the media. Each sex abuse, assault, and harassment case is about a man abusing his power over a child, woman, or man who can’t match his influence. Those in the headlines have had astronomical power over their victims, and they exploited it. Despite their power to hire and fire and make or break careers on the merits, they hedonistically grasped for more. Americans are understandably struggling with the “before” and “after” images of these men. There is a cognitive dissonance once their misdeeds become public. It’s not an either-or issue, though: these men are both their talented, successful selves and sex abusers. It may be natural to trust your instincts about who is a predator, but it is foolhardy. A common response to these allegations is that “it cannot be true” while the person struggles to outfit the image of a powerful or “good” guy with this ugly element. These men want you to continue to be blind to that new revelation. They only get to exercise the power they do by clearing the space around them, either through mass intimidation like Weinstein or by being the “nice guy” like Clinton or Rose. They spent their whole careers persuading you that they are who they appear to be—but in reality they are not. So coming to the truth means you have to abandon your certainty about identifying sexual molesters. It is heartbreaking when you learn that the formerly lovable Bill Cosby is despicable or that “godly” Roy Moore is in fact the guy Jesus was talking about when he said, “If anyone causes one of these little ones—those who believe in me—to stumble, it would be better for them to have a large millstone hung around their neck and to be drowned in the depths of the sea.” Matthew 18:6. Yet, only the truth will protect the next child or prevent other victims from piling up. As long as you self-righteously insist you can infallibly read another person’s soul, you are asking for the perverse to harm the vulnerable. To put this another way: sexual predators lie, and they tend to be really good at it. Ken Lanning, the now-retired FBI expert on child sex abuse, has explained pedophiles in a way that also makes sense for the sexual assaulters and harassers: the reason that these guys have succeeded at harming others is because they earn people’s trust–either through accumulated power or through being the super nice guy. Their trustworthiness creates the access. So the fact that you have known someone “forever” and never seen them do one bad thing is basically irrelevant when it comes to those who sexually abuse, assault, or harass. What they are doing is not done on the street corner for you to see. Your instincts are wrong. Perpetrators also succeed because they are duplicitous. They live a double life, and are so arrogant that they believe no one will ever know about their “indiscretions.” So when you hear someone like Trump or Moore protesting their innocence in the face of a long line of believable women, you should be thinking more about narcissism and a Messiah complex than doubting these women. The perpetrators fervently believe that they are wonderful men who don’t deserve to be brought down like this—regardless of the sexual misconduct they perpetrated. Their power is boundless, even God-given! In their self-referential world, they have magical powers to treat women and children as objects and to never be held accountable. If you are still in denial about any of the men mentioned above, you need to re-read the preceding section. About the Victims: Wading Through Intimidation, Humiliation, and Shame Victims of sexual misconduct rarely make it up and often cannot come forward immediately. They have been accused by some of fabricating their claims either for publicity or because they are seeking a “pay day.” This is patently ridiculous. First, it is a matter of fact that people rarely make up sexual misconduct. This is a humiliating event, not something you want to announce from the ramparts. And the perpetrators know how to convince their victims that telling others is risky, whether it is the priest telling the kid his parents will go to hell if he tells or Weinstein threatening a young woman’s career prospects. Second, the “pay day” allegations are also just ignorance of the law. The vast majority of these victim’s claims are well beyond the statute of limitations. This is especially true for the harassment victims, whose statutes of limitation are measured in days–180 to 300 days to be precise. They have no legal leverage at this point; they are just trying to do the right thing by telling the public the emperor has no clothes. Even if they were within statute, the point of such claims is to shift the cost of the misconduct from the victim to the one(s) who caused it. That is just fair. Some Americans also have attacked the victims’ credibility because they took so long to come forward. In reality, though, sexual misconduct victims often do take decades to come forward. In fact, the delay is often an indicator of their truthfulness, ironically enough. All sorts of coping mechanisms get in the way of coming forward earlier, from self-blaming and denial to PTSD and alcohol and drug addiction. This goes back to the toxicity of the power differential. They feel small, ashamed, humiliated, worthless, and intimidated all at once. The misconduct can come to define them in their own minds and lead to a dramatic shift in their self-worth, confidence, and even their career choices. All the while, the powerful abuser struts around in the public square proving his immense worth. And you wonder why it takes victims so long? About the Context of the Misconduct One of the reasons that you did not know about all these guys is that they create their conditions to dominate and to disempower the victim in secrecy. It’s not enough that they are already more powerful than the victim; they also like to isolate their prey. Notice how many of the cases you have heard about recently involve the perpetrators’ home, a hotel room, or a car. The victims have been lured into places where the perpetrator is in complete control, literally king of his domain. Why? Because they don’t want to be stopped, and, remember, this is a power trip. Trapping the prey is part of the conquest. The public’s general ignorance of the facts of sexual misconduct– including the characteristics of the predator, the disabilities of the victim, and the secret contexts—has too often betrayed the victims and led to affirmation of the man who will simply do it again. The facts can help turn that around. But lasting change must go beyond attitudes to action. The Other Factors That Have Created a Vicious Cycle of Seemingly Endless Sexual Misconduct The public’s ignorance of the facts of sexual abuse, assault, and harassment, and the intimidation and shaming of the victims are not the only reasons sexual misconduct gets buried. Just as importantly, there are the legal mechanisms that drive these claims underground. First, as discussed above, the statutes of limitation have been inexcusably short. For the children, many states continue to have indefensibly short SOLs. For the women raped years ago, the rape SOLs were short then, and the Supreme Court has made it impossible to give them a second chance at criminal prosecution under Stogner v. California. As discussed above, sexual harassment claims are cut off very quickly! Second, nondisclosure agreements have permitted women to shift the cost of healing from their shoulders to the perpetrators’, but they have had to accept a gag in order to get this much justice. Given their feelings of intimidation and humiliation at the time of signing the agreements, they could easily be persuaded that the nondisclosure mandate is “all for the best.” No one more than the victim wants this to just be over. Moreover, they were usually led to believe that they were the “only one” anyway, so what good was having a bullhorn? Lawyers for the perpetrators routinely—with a straight face—tell the victim she was the very first to report, while having settled dozens more cases just like hers. Weinstein loved these agreements, which gave him carte blanche for the next victim, but he was not the only one. They were also popular with the Catholic bishops and abusers across the spectrum for decades. The defense lawyers advised their offensive clients that this would solve the “problem.” Third, the insurance companies that were on the hook for the bad behavior of employees actively pushed companies to either rebuff the woman’s claims with hardball tactics or, second best, enter these secret settlements to avoid future liability. Few understand how the insurance industry drives settlements in virtually every sphere, e.g., the employment sphere, as here. Employers have insurance against employee misbehavior, and insurance companies have paid or partially paid many of the settlements in the sexual misconduct arena from the churches to the companies to the media. For them, there has been one value and one value alone: reduce exposure. If that means helping a perp get off and go on to graze for the next victim, their attitude has been “not my problem.” Thus, the legal system and the greed of the insurance industry have perversely operated to empower abusers of all stripes. To be blunt: a lot of the responsibility for the perpetuation of sexual misconduct lies at the feet of the insurance companies. It’s time they become part of the solution instead. It Is Time for the Insurance Industry to Find a Moral Compass and Stem This Tide of Sexual Misconduct There is a systemic solution to the sexual misconduct pandemic, and it requires the insurance industry to step up. The vast majority of these claims are in the civil arena, because so few prosecutions go forward with the “beyond a reasonable doubt standard.” (Prosecutors are elected officials who watch their win-loss ratios closely. The public would be shocked by how few of the cases involving sexual abuse and assault are ever prosecuted despite strong evidence, but that is another column for another day.) That puts the insurance system on center stage due to its power to coerce better practices with the threat of no or escalating coverage. It has been no friend to victims as it has implemented non-disclosure agreements, intimidated victims, and avidly lobbied against statute of limitations reform. If the industry declines to reform its predator-friendly practices, it’s time for hearings on Capitol Hill, which would supplement the recent hearings to enact legislation and rules to govern sexual harassment in Congress. They should probably happen anyway, but if there is no major insurance reform to solve the problem, there is no choice but to subpoena the executives. In all likelihood, Congress and the state legislatures will need to coerce them to do the right thing. The insurance industry has the power to turn around at least the workplace on these issues if it starts demanding the kind of preventative practices only it can effectively enforce and punishes those who harbor perpetrators with escalating premiums and the threat of no coverage. With respect to members of Congress, it’s not the insurance world that matters, but rather a corrupt federal system ensconced in federal law. Interestingly, it needs the same fixes as the insurance industry, though, so I will include it in the discussion below. Here is where we need to start to bring industries, institutions, and Congress into line: First, non-disclosure agreements in sexual misconduct cases violate public policy and should be made unenforceable. While it is reasonable to permit the parties to agree that the settlement number is confidential, the perpetrator and/or entity should not be permitted to gag the victim. Non-disclosure agreements have been the darlings of the insurance companies and a mandatory feature of the federal system. The congressional victim has one route: to enter a lengthy and dysfunctional process at the end of which, if there is a settlement, secrecy is forced on her. I would expect the insurance industry to sic its lobbyists on members contemplating a paradigm shift in this arena and to fight any bill that neutralizes nondisclosure clauses. But this is one of those instances where the public disclosure is so obviously in the common good that lawmakers need to put cotton in their ears. Besides, perhaps my cynical expectation that the industry (and members of Congress) will fight for nondisclosure agreements to the detriment of the common good is misplaced. One can hope daily scandals will guide the industry and federal government to a moral compass that points toward policies that protect the vulnerable rather than the predators and their complicit institutions. Second, eliminate the SOLs for sex abuse, assault, and harassment. Let the victims come forward when they are ready, not according to some artificial deadline. 99% of the women who have come forward against the list of men at the start of this article were barred from the judicial process. This is a cause the insurance companies have been fighting for decades—against their better interests. They don’t want SOLs to open up, because more perpetrators and at-fault institutions named, which increases their liability. Yet, it’s better for them to permit the SOLs to be liberalized, because it concretizes their liabilities and makes it possible to demand that a perpetrator be fired so that they can avoid future liability. With short SOLs, the cycle of misconduct, settlement, misconduct, settlement remains in place, which does not serve the industry’s ultimate ends. Third, insurance companies (and Congress) need to institute workplace rules with teeth that are a pre-condition to coverage and/or service that halt the secrecy spiral: • To qualify for coverage or to maintain one’s status in Congress, there should be mandatory training, as in real training conducted by professionals and not in-house people, on the rules of sexual misconduct from abuse and assault to harassment. It should be made clear that no one gets a pass—not the perpetrator and not the bystander, or observer. There should be mandatory reporting internally and to the authorities when a crime has occurred. Reporters must be shielded from retaliation. • Employers and Congress should be required to pledge to discharge any employee who has engaged in sexual misconduct, and that determination follows an investigation. Recommendations for other jobs would be required to disclose the sexual misconduct. Failure to disclose would create liability for the company that discharged the predator. • Employers and Congress must institute meaningful zero tolerance policies for sexual misconduct that are worth the paper they are written on. Most companies have pro forma policies but in practice, as we have learned, supervisors are wont to ignore allegations if the man serves the organization’s interests, whether it be image, power, or money. If it turns out a company’s supervisor learned about sexual misconduct and ignored it, that should come with the heavy price of steeply increased premiums. The member of Congress who fails to disclose knowledge of sexual misconduct should be subject to mandatory censure. • There need to be annual sexual misconduct audits. If there is reason to be suspicious, the insurance company (or relevant committee in Congress) must investigate all allegations with special focus on any cover-up. Results are to be released to the public, not buried. • Policies related to off-premises business or institution-related activities need to be tightened up. If the employee is performing work for the organization or in its name off-premises, as was Charlie Rose at his home, the company should be liable for any misconduct and the insurance company on the hook. There need to be rigid rules about work off-premises (other than flex-time when there is no employee interaction). Charlie Rose’s and Weinstein’s off-premises activities couldn’t have happened but for the environment. They weren’t going to parade around nude and uncovered at work. Fourth, as I discussed here, the defamation laws need to be rewritten to protect the victim who goes public. None of these guys should be permitted to rattle the saber of defamation like Cosby, Trump, or Moore. The first order of business in any such claim should be an expedited proceeding on the facts of the sexual misconduct. If the victim proves the acts occurred to a preponderance of the evidence, the perpetrator should be liable for treble damages and attorneys fees. The remedy will deter such lawsuits except for the most narcissistic predators. Find a comfortable place to read this holiday weekend, because more sexual abuse, assault, and harassment stories will roll across your Twitter and Facebook news feeds. There will be lots to read. Oh, wait, if you’re one of the guys waiting for the sexual misconduct shoe to drop, I suppose you won’t be that comfortable. Good. Welcome to a world where the vulnerable have a chance at justice. Source RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys - YinYang - 12-17-2017 And the revelation continues... The Republican Lawmaker Who Secretly Created Reddit’s Women-Hating ‘Red Pill’ Thankfully he's out of a job now. 200 000 subscribers to this little corner of the internet... another parallel universe made visible. RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys - Dante776 - 12-17-2017 Stranger Wrote:Notice above that 41% of rape cases were found to be false allegations. YinYang Wrote:I'm sorry Stranger, but this is simply not true... From your article... What kind of person makes false rape accusations? False rape accusations loom large in the cultural imagination. We don’t forget the big ones: The widely-read 2014 Rolling Stone article, later retracted, about a brutal gang rape at the University of Virginia; the 2006 accusations against innocent members of the Duke University lacrosse team. These cases are readily cited by defense attorneys and Republican lawmakers and anyone else who wants a reason to discuss the dangers of false allegations. What if a woman has consensual sex, and then regrets it the next day? What if a woman gets dumped by her boyfriend and decides to accuse him of rape as revenge? What if she’s just doing it for attention? Are false accusations reaching epidemic levels in today’s hard-drinking hookup culture, where the lines of consent have been blurred? Critics argue that reports of rape should be treated with more caution, since men’s lives are so often ruined by women’s malicious lies.[...] Quote:Kanin reported that 41% of 109 consecutive rape cases investigated by the police department of a small, Midwestern city over a 9-year period were determined to be false reports. RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys - Dante776 - 12-17-2017 (12-17-2017, 05:25 AM)YinYang Wrote: And the revelation continues... From your attached article... TAKING THE RED PILL [...] The Red Pill borrows its name from a scene in “The Matrix” in which Morpheus offers Neo a choice between two realities: “You take the blue pill—the story ends, you wake up in your bed and believe whatever you want to believe. You take the red pill… and I show you how deep the rabbit-hole goes.” In manosphere-speak, the rabbit hole is feminism, which the red pill reveals to be a War on Men. In this reality, the “feminine imperative” reigns; masculinity is its victim. As a result of this power struggle, old gender dynamics formerly seen as mutually beneficial, such as marriage, have all but disappeared, but female expectations of a pedestalled life unfairly remain.[...] The Red Pill guides men as they become accustomed to this new “reality.” It advocates self-improvement: the importance of diet, exercise, and constant learning. RAPE AND THE RED PILL Part of the pain inflicted on him by one of his exes, or so Fisher claimed: the alleged threat of a rape accusation against him. Fisher claimed online that during a bitter breakup, an ex-girlfriend threatened to accuse him of rape. “She didn’t follow through, thank god,” Fisher, under the alias Pk_atheist, wrote in 2012. Whether or not the threat actually occurred, Fisher’s posts reveal an ongoing paranoia over being accused of date rape. In his original ‘Welcome to the Red Pill’ post in October 2012, Fisher warned that in today’s feminist world, “A guy can approach a woman, be assertive, and if she’s attracted, there’s a hookup. Yet, if he’s not attractive, this EXACT behavior is “creepy”… If you’re unattractive, feminism tells us, you’re likely a rapist… men are tip-toeing to make sure they don’t accidentally become rapists themselves.” Four years after its founding, “rape hysteria,” remains a central topic of discussion on the forum. On r/TheRedPill, Pk_atheist admitted in December 2012 to supposedly video-taping sexual encounters with women in order to protect against false rape allegations. Men, Fisher said, should always take action to protect themselves against a past partner accusing them of rape. Online, Fisher advised another user to be careful not to offend prior flings whom he’d ghosted. Insulting a woman, he maintained, was likely to set off a deluge of sudden false accusations. “…If she feels insulted, your incidence of false rape accusations or pregnancy scares go waaaaaaaaay up,” he counseled.[...] RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys - crimson - 12-18-2017 "Why Aren't Men Fighting Back?" There is a MRA movement since William Farrell many years ago. Most recent documentary show several of them (its not free) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wLzeakKC6fE However many believe that there is no point since the system is so biased. Identity politics at least in the angloamerican systems has absorbed the women's movement into 3rd and 4th wave feminism and created a deep division between men and women. So many men go MGTOW... RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys - crimson - 12-18-2017 (12-18-2017, 12:30 AM)crimson Wrote: "Why Aren't Men Fighting Back?" EDIT: I meant Warren Farrell. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warren_Farrell RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys - YinYang - 12-18-2017 Dante, out of a sense of morbid curiosity I looked into this 'Red Pill' group on Reddit over the weekend, it's quite a large group of disenfranchised men fuelling each other's hatred of women and society at large. I had no idea these extreme views are shared by such a large group of men, it really is a parallel universe made visible to me. It didn't upset or anger me, it made me very sad for them. I'm well versed on the topic of cults, and while I thought I have now heard of almost every type of philosophy cults have formed around, this was a first. This is a prime example of what Ra calls "catalyst gone awry", as far as the founder of this group goes. And now he's channelling that hatred through this movement and riling up other vulnerable and wounded young men in society. It's negative polarisation, if you swallow the philosophy and the lies espoused by them. As a woman, I can confidently tell you that everything they say about women are lies. In addition, in which reality will any healthy woman consent to being filmed during sex? Given that it appears to me that you are giving this group the nod of approval, of which the more radical members are openly advocating rape, I think it's pointless trying to talk any sense into you at this juncture. There's a recovery group on Reddit for ex Red Pill men who have swallowed this toxic philosophy in the past, and their posts are typical of cult recovery discussion forums. Here's the link if you're interested - https://www.reddit.com/r/exredpill/ And here's an insightful article... Quote:Spitting out the Red Pill: Former misogynists reveal how they were radicalised online RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys - YinYang - 12-18-2017 Hey C_A Thanks for reaching out to me in PM, I guess you’re the bigger person here. I am really sorry for how I hurt you, there is no excuse. I feel awful. I hope my PM shed a little light on how the cookie crumbled here over quite some time. It doesn’t excuse my behaviour of course, and I thank you for forgiving me. You are smart, funny and talented, and I had no right to throw diagnoses around without even knowing you, or knowing your past or your triggers. For that I sincerely apologise. Thank you for the catalyst, it was needed. I will be taking a hiatus from this forum for a while, it’s just too messy. I had a clear dream the other night, in it I was stuck in a traffic jam. I was close to the back of the traffic jam, with only a few cars behind me, and a truck sped up to us from behind whose breaks had obviously failed and slammed into the cars at the back. All the people in the cars behind me were dead, and I narrowly escaped. It was such a clear dream that I knew it had to mean something. I lay there in bed and knew that the “stuck” feeling is how I feel when I participate here. It troubles me. I don’t know if I helped some, I’m pretty sure I hurt some and f***** up on numerous occasions, but it’s time to move on - the ever dancing Yin and Yang... Sorry to everyone I ever hurt here, I’m not so good with putting a guard in front of my mouth…. aaaaaand, I’m tired of fighting. My only advice (thank you Alan Watts), is don’t take yourselves so seriously. Remember to laugh, remember to play, and remember the humour. I love you all, thanks for a wild ride! RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys - Dante776 - 12-18-2017 (12-18-2017, 03:16 AM)YinYang Wrote: Dante, out of a sense of morbid curiosity I looked into this 'Red Pill' group on Reddit over the weekend, it's quite a large group of disenfranchised men fuelling each other's hatred of women and society at large. I had no idea these extreme views are shared by such a large group of men, it really is a parallel universe made visible to me. It didn't upset or anger me, it made me very sad for them. I'm well versed on the topic of cults, and while I thought I have now heard of almost every type of philosophy cults have formed around, this was a first. YinYang...Just to be clear here, those two articles were articles you referenced in your post. I had never heard of the Red Pill group until you posted them in your message. I 'do not' see myself at that extreme end of the masculine pendulum, but it just goes to show that there are men out there that are espousing the same kind of rhetoric that you are espousing from a female perspective. So, where does it end? So long! RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys - YinYang - 12-18-2017 Yes, it was your selective pickings of the article (and exclusion of some troublesome things), that made me act on a hunch... so long to you too, and good luck on "fighting back". By the way, there's a reason we practise Jungian psychology today, and not Freudian psychology. One was a genius and pioneer, the other pathological - in reference to your "penis envy" stab... RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys - Dante776 - 12-18-2017 (12-18-2017, 10:17 AM)YinYang Wrote: Yes, it was your selective pickings of the article (and exclusion of some troublesome things), that made me act on a hunch... so long to you too, and good luck on "fighting back". By the way, there's a reason we practise Jungian psychology today, and not Freudian psychology. One was a master, the other pathological - in reference to your "penis envy" stab... The same can be said about you and the awfully hurtful things you said about Coordinate_Apotheosis and many other men that are reading your posts. And from that last line, it seems to me that you are determined to keep the "fight" going! RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys - YinYang - 12-18-2017 I'll leave the fighting to you, Dante, good luck with that! RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys - crimson - 12-18-2017 I believe all this is the result of the increase in orange energy, less available yellow to be really usable anyway. I see these developments as "normal", at least due to the conditions in this planet. Although green is right here, ready to be used by those able to use it but appears to be bringing all kinds of behaviors in many people. However, I am considering importance of geographical locations more than before as well. At least for me. It seems things would get somewhat worse before getting better. Seems that way to me anyway. However, couples are forming and will form but probably more and more of an entirely different nature. I am talking about the dual activated people now reincarnated and reincarnated (reincarnating). I see these as the natural development, however I don't see marriage to be that important anymore. RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys - rinzler - 04-18-2020 I'm sorry to make this thread resurface but I think it's more relevant now than ever. We're being played against each other and few are capable of overcoming their own biases. There are good and bad men and women out there. One can see that on the amount of people who are going to be harvested. I'd say it's below 1 percent to be honest(Ra's 3D STO-society had less than 15%, that says a lot). Enough to make a difference for the polarity of this planet but still the majority of interaction with other people on this planet is going to suck because most are imbalanced. Also the wanderers who come here, some of them work on their own issues which creates even more issues. (see Don,Carla and Jim) They've talked about in in the channelings. Hell the only thing this does is create more energy for the negatives . It shows how f***** up this system on the planet truly is. Ra's social memory complex isn't about saving or changing anything. They're saving themselves. The intereference with humanity caused them to accumulate negative karma. They practically birthed the illuminati by their misguided love. I'd say if you truly want real good help ask your higher self to help you resolve biases, trauma and such. It is the only thing in existence that knows what's best for you. It is literally you in the future. Being able to talk to it is like having all the cheat codes to the game. They won't be able to touch you. Of course this is a skill that is super hard to acquire but I've read about a few who've shared their experiencese and it seems to pay off a lot. Anytime you interact with someone their biases, opinions etc affect you. You become involved. The interaction might make some trauma resurface and show you what needs to be healed but it is a inefficent way to do so in my opinon. Trough meditation you can trigger it yourself and work with it in your mind which is in my view a lot easier. The teachings of buddhism and such talk a lot about this but anyways. Anything is better than interacting with this s*** system on this planet. It is the matrix, never ever forget that. It might help you if you trick(basically the plan of everyone who is incarnating here, IMHO very foolish for wanderers as said in the Ra Material) it but it is always working against you as are the unaware people who do not know of it's secret influences. In a way everyone is an agent who is not balanced. It's like Morpheus said. If you're not one of us, you're one of them and it sure can take a long time to fully wake up and get rid of the cords the Matrix has attached to you. Can be seen in this thread. Best advice I can give people here is don't get attached. It is the root cause of suffering. Only from an objective position can you discern right from wrong. Otherwise you'll just make the mess on this planet worse and it's going to take lifetimes to work on stuff you could have easily figured out yourself. Meditation is the tool for spiritual growth and from there on a lot of other abilites get activated. I think for the immature souls of this planet they don't have much of a choice as they are kind of trapped. I don't think I'm a wanderer but I'm glad I stumbled upon the Ra Material and things of that nature. It really helped me to see the bigger picture. I only wish more people would see it. It appears that the negative influences on this planet are too strong. Wasn't that also the reason Carla stopped channeling Ra? I really hope the system will be designed better next time. It has a lot of flaws that's for sure. So many people who are drowning in the mess of this planet ![]() RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys - Agua - 04-21-2020 removed RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys - EvolvingPhoenix - 04-21-2020 (12-07-2017, 08:00 PM)Dante776 Wrote: Men do not "fight back" against sexual harassment and unwanted sexual advances or touching because if we do, we will be shamed, ridiculed and blamed for our circumstances by many people, including many who talk a very good talk about supporting equality, but refuse to walk the walk, knowing they will not be held accountable for their hypocrisy. If anyone calls them out on it, they will be labeled a misogynist. If we started fighting back in any harsh sense (not just physical, but in any hars hitring way) we would be accused of abusive behaviour and "toxic masculinity" would once again serve as the scapegoat, allowing people to stay in their comfort zones and not have their beliefs challenged. Also, there is rarely true male commaradery outside of the military nowadays. Fellow men will likely be indifferent to one's plight. RE: Why Aren't Men Fighting Back? - The Sexual Assault of Men and Boys - Black Dragon - 04-22-2020 (04-21-2020, 01:30 AM)Agua Wrote: Peaking from experience I can say however, as long as you insist on the world being so bad, its usually because of a hidden agenda. Thanks for this. It wasn't directed at me, but you have no idea how helpful to me this is. It really hit home, because its something my higher self has been trying to get me to look at, and it wouldn't fully sink in or I'd just push it away. Thanks for posting this concept in such a clear way that I can't help but look at it. |