How do you prove you're real?

[Aion]

If that's the game I think it is, my personal opinion is to just team up with you on a fps game so my urge to shoot you can be projected onto others. . . . .

Illusions too believe they are real because they experience.

Just because you are, doesn't mean you actually are.  
Imagine being a self aware illusion.  You're not real, but feel like you are.  Weird how that works, so once more I still don't know how to prove yourself real.

As Gem says, who does the thinking?  What is a thought, why does it make me any more real than the passing notice of an entity or the whim of ones awareness?

How can I prove my thoughts are real?

I'm just trying to plumb how much people question their reality.  Most never go beyond their thoughts as validation.

But see, that is exactly what I'm getting at: what is the difference between the perfect illusion of a thing, and the thing actually being so?  There is no difference.

The perfect simulation of "existence" is no different than existence.  The perfect illusion of a tree, is no different than an actual tree.  If the creator knows all things, all potentials, then all potentials are real.  Because the knowingness, or simulation of experience, is perfect down to the finest detail.  I'm just trying to point out the threshold, beyond which the distinction is not apparent, and therefore completely arbitrary.

To play devils advocate for a moment, say your thoughts are fake.  What is the difference between fake and real?  If there is no difference, why worry about the distinction?  From my vantage point, if you have no barometer for unreal, than by default, things are real.  Real and unreal are relative to one another.  Without the relativity, there can be no distinction. 

Quantum Mechanics is my barometer, your absence of separation is commendable but by your own words, separation is very real then.

Hence, I literally do not comprehend how you ignore your own logic to make your own logic work.

In my view we are real, what is fake is simply how you define what you are. As long as you think of yourself in other ways than being the OIC in your "room of nothingness" dreaming of your senses and body, then you are grounded within the illusions you set yourself to experience. The human ego in itself as an identity is born from the meeting of body, mind and spirit. What you are as a human will be as long as you live, then everything that makes you will carry on their respective evolution with their share of the experience, the soul being the furthest one in it's path. A mind/spirit/body complex in a way is just a mind-like spirit/body-like spirit/spirit complex. There's just awareness, there's just soul, there's just the OIC, there's just us. Your body in itself is a world of which you are the God, you can either take good care of it or destroy it, both scenarios offer catalyst to what makes it up.

The basic nature of your awareness that simply is, is the very thing that is real and the very thing that is making up everything around you. There is only awareness taking upon itself identity, this identity is fake because our true essence is that of infinite potential which is not limited to a strand of experience in itself like we are. The state of infinite potential is reached in-between every octaves when one rejoins with the Source and let go on his past experiences and identity to become what we truly are, which is the potential to become anything and everything.

I disagree with a notion that an illusion can believe it is real, an awareness can believe it is something within illusion and define wrongly what it is.

So basically I as myself dont really exist but am real...???

At least your reasoning is sensible but my comprehension lacks perceiving how this proves to yourself that you're real beyond admitting you're made up of real parts you can't ascertain to be real or not and just assume or believe.

As for your last sentence.  You negate your entire point in my view with it, because to me, you are illusion, as am I.  If I follow your logic at the very end, you're basically assuming all you've said without knowing if it and you are real but assuming a mechanic of both operating?

I'm confused overall by you at times Min.
But you make me really want to do shrooms to see what you see.

I disagree with a notion that an illusion can believe it is real, an awareness can believe it is something within illusion and define wrongly what it is.

Exactly.  The experiencer cannot be the experience.  The creator is the backdrop of the created.  Awareness is the creator.

Or like it is described in quantum mechanics, the observer that makes reality remain coherent. Each of us is an observer, but ultimately we all are the very same Observer.

I tend to call the OIC, the One Infinite Dreamer because of this notion. We are not fake, we are dreaming of our reality.

I can see this but wish I had a say as an eyeball where I'm pointed at.

I thought Ra said that Creator is the Creation.

Actually it was:

13.5 Questioner: Thank you. Can you tell me of the earliest, first known thing in the creation?

Ra: I am Ra. The first known thing in the creation is infinity. The infinity is creation.

Well, you are right IGW, the creator is the creation.  But we are dealing with abstract concepts here.  The creator is the creation in the exact same way that a mirror is reflecting your image.  The appearance is not the reality.  You could say that you are it, but what you see with your bodily senses is a distorted (inverted) reflection of your essence as creator.  The "eye" cannot actually see itself, only a reflection of itself.  This is why, in my opinion, the 8th density is eternal mystery.  The essence of the creator is unquantifiable.  Beingness cannot be "known".  Only the creations of the mind can be "known".  Knowing is a function of mind.  There is a reality beyond mind, and that is 8th density, or pure spirit.  What you see reflected, in the mirror of mind, is matter, which can be known and quantified.  

But awareness is the backdrop of all existence.  I'm not sure if I'm making this clear, but that is how I see things.  The reflection is subject to the reflectee.  And the reflector (which would be akin to the mind) just reflects things, as per its nature.  "Will" comes from the spirit.

I guess I'll reiterate.  How do you know or prove you're not the reflection, not just an image who being exactly the same in all perceivable ways, isn't just an image, disappearing as quickly as it appeared?

I don't really care if this is illusion and I am but a dancing thought. At least I can experience.

I'm glad you're positive about it.  I'm tired of experiencing.

Just a contemplation I had recently.

Anyone wish to share how they can prove they're real?

The answer I was given to "what is real?" merely added to my own confusion at the time...

Remember Everything Always Love.

Other than that I suggest you pinch yourself, because I cannot prove that it hurts 

I can, it involves noticing how one degrades with pain.
Of any style, physical, mental, emotional, spiritual.

Its not diversion, its destruction.

When its enjoyed, obviously the being has inflicted enough pain to find its return pleasant as well.

Real to me is the ability to question it.  If I can't question it, how could it be real...for me individually?
Others see something beyond real and flock to it like flies to a light (no insult intended!!!)
I question it.  Thats how I define and believe.  But I like going further than questioning once.

Yes, air is real, can't see it but its there.  Are my guides real?  Intuition pings back yes, my synchronicity says yes.  Ieven am terrified after this incarnation ends itll all be just a joke somehow like oh yeah I was Joe and I didn't know anything and it drove me mad LOL

So I question, and honestly, hope at death I disappear and whatever I am continues on haunted by me.  I hope it learns more than it bargained for.

Because I, am not, that.  And so far, no one here has offered anything I see as means to view I and that as the same IN THIS PLACE (3D).  Until I do, I think my soul might need to be taught a lesson about putting 3D life through hell.

How to do that?  Dunno.  Its not a bargain, its an effect to a cause.

That is how I understand Reality, there is an effect to a cause.  The effect creates the cause.

Its backwards.  Reality like society, is backwards.

Actually, how do you define not being real?

The opposite way I define being real.

Which is being questionable.  If it isn't in a way that can produce answers as to effect and cause, why should I believe its real?  How do I define its reality when I can't?  I know its unperceivable? That's enough to know its something, I believe Ra is real, as well as octave settings and systems of intelligent creation.

Because they are in a sense, questionable but proveable.

Now I'm sure there's something real and unquestionable.  My opinion on those, you haven't thought of the question or all questions are known and answered that currently need to be.

How do you know a really really real hallucination wasnt actually real?

Does an LSD trip make you experience unreality or is it just illusion caused by some mechanical occurrences of the real?

If real can produce illusions which appear as real as reality, what is actually real or illusion? How do you know?
I'm not speaking of The Matrix tier nonsense, I'm speaking philosophical tier nonsense (I mean, what is sense?)

If illusion is as good as real, what is real?

to OP;
There is a secret you hold
that can not be proven or told
the secret is that you are where you are
and not in a cat, dog or star...

According to images of the Universe which may or may not be real (self reality pun, ba dum tish)

I'm inside of a neuron in a cosmic brain.

Isis: since my quote button has failed me and I'm not fighting my.mobile browser anymore.

I think it is possible to prove something is real, just impossible to prove that your proof is also real.

I wonder where I go in my sleep.  Why I cease and must return, why dreams are better than reality.  Is my awareness even real? Or is it like Min said, just an occurrence from partial things creating something more?

Aion, your pain can still be illusion, even if it feels real.

Also I seriously would shot the person who came up with that game.  What a great way to bully..  .

(That only took 3 hours to write)

I think you would greatly benefit from a read of the book. 'Projection of the Astral Body' by Sylvan Muldoon and Harewood Carrington, it actually has some answers to these exact questions with some very compelling evidence.

I think your problem is the way you define 'real'. It seems you are equating 'real' with 'truthful' and in that case I don't think it is possible to 'prove' something is real without first denying it the opposite.

I'd like to turn it around and ask if you can prove that anything is not real? I mean proof, not 'reasoning'. Logic doesn't prove anything. Questioning is just an exercise in logic, so questioning doesn't to me establish the reality of something. What may be apparent unquestionable to one may still be very questionable to another so that's hard for me to base reality on.

Also, we can talk about pain being illusory but the experience of it is real. So maybe the issue is that you don't think experience is real? I can assure you, it's hard to argue the truth of reality with a fist flying towards your face. The point isn't about pain, it's about contact.

Now, one can say it's an illusion, but your logic is thus also an illusion so you are using illusory logic to illusively illustrate an illusory illusion you are experiencing based on your illusory selve's understanding of its illusory self. So, you cannot actually prove it is an illusion anymore than you can prove it is 'real'. You can only reason.

So, with both sides defeated, what dictates reality? The fact that it's still right there. Go ahead and disbelieve it, see it as illusion and refute it, but it is rather persistent. If you ask me, the question isn't whether or not things are real but whether or not you perceive them as real, I think that's the actual difference in experience.

For me, I can see it both ways, so I conclude that 'real' and 'illusory' are likely just a duality that is obscuring the true unified nature. I think the truth is some weird combination of both, a paradox to be sure.

Also, fisticuffs is just a funny way of saying a fist-fight. Why don't you want to fight if everything is illusory? Why is an experience of peace more important than conflict in a state of illusion? Why use illusion to avoid illusion? If I'm not real and you're not real then there is no actual pain and no actual harm. If nothing is real, why fear the pain?

I think the best proof we have for being real is the fear we experience when we consider that we're not.