03-03-2018, 08:30 PM
(This post was last modified: 03-04-2018, 07:39 AM by Nicholas.
Edit Reason: Took out a couple of charged words when sharing my vegan festival experience. They were not accurate descriptors but more a dramatisation.
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(09-23-2017, 04:38 PM)Nicholas Wrote:(09-20-2017, 02:56 PM)Diana Wrote: It boggles my mind that anyone could care more about their personal free will (to choose torture and death) over compassion.
You have created a confusing dichotomy in this statement, Diana, because compassion begins with the self, and what you and I consume to sustain our bodies is a personal affair. Of all the meme's that you have shared here, they share a common theme. And that theme is personal experience The reason people care more about their own choices than the consequences of them is not beyond your intellectual grasp. In fact it is a good thing that they care at all as it's a step in the right direction. Mike Tyson apparently said that he wished he was born a vegan, and yet, if you studied how he arrived at such a thought, your mind would not boggle at all at why anyone would care more about personal agendas.
Look, personal free will is paramount because in the longer term it is the ONLY way in which to teach. If a decision is made under any group or cultural coercion, then it is almost impossible to claim responsibility for such a choice. It is no choice at all. This is why humans perpetually engage in criminality, and why we need to keep locking people up, because we fail to see the correlations between their personal experience and the choices that they accordingly make. Why, after thousands of years of repetition, are we still locking humans away for behaviours that share a current motive? The motive to survive?
You are completely missing the point of your own argument. The problem is not the consumption of other selves, because that is built into the fabric of our illusion (imagine, for example that you had your top ten males join you on a desert island, and yet not one of them found you desirable?). The problem is the commodification of other selves.
You are concerning yourself with the harmful details of commodification and charging the consumer for their "free will" choices, when in fact, the consumers of such commodities are not free at all!
(09-20-2017, 02:56 PM)Diana Wrote: I don't want to persuade you.
Diana you are smarter than that. Of course you want to pursuade others. You would not have wasted your time sharing memes if you didn't.
(09-24-2017, 10:04 AM)Bring4th_Jade Wrote: Wait Nick - you're saying that consumers don't have free will with what they purchase to consume? I mean, I understand on one level that advertising subverts free will... but every day I think about where my money is being spent and what energies it is contributing to. It's not possible to be ENTIRELY ethical with consumption of commodities, but it's possible to be much, much more ethical with consumption of commodities than all of us are currently being, and I think we all should make this effort as an exercise with the Transformation of the Mind.
Quote:99.8 Questioner: Thank you. Card Number Six I see as the Transformation of the Mind, the male’s crossed arms representing transformation, transformation being possible either toward the left- or the right-hand path, the right-hand path being beckoned or led by the female, the Potentiator. The one on the right having the serpent of wisdom at the brow and being fully clothed, the one on the left having less clothing and indicating that the Matrix or Potentiator would be more concerned and attracted to the physical illusion as the left-hand path is chosen and more concerned and attracted to the mental as the right-hand path is chosen.
The creature above points an arrow at the left-hand path indicating that if this path is chosen the chips, shall we say, will fall where they may, the path being unprotected as far as the random activity of catalyst. And the intellectual abilities of the chooser of that path would be the main guardian rather than a designed or built-in protection by the Logos for the right-hand path. The entity firing the arrow being what seems to be a second density entity would indicate that this catalyst could be produced by a lesser-evolved source, you might say. Would Ra comment on these observations of Card Six, the Transformation of the Mind?
Ra: I am Ra. We shall speak upon several aspects seriatim. Firstly, let us examine the crossed arms of the male who is to be transformed. What, O student, do you make of the crossing? What see you in this tangle? There is a creative point to be found in this element which was not discussed overmuch by the questioner.
Let us now observe the evaluation of the two females. The observation that to the left-hand path moves the roughly physical and to the right-hand path the mental has a shallow correctness. There are deeper observations to be made concerning the relationship of the great sea of the unconscious mind to the conscious mind which may fruitfully be pursued. Remember, O student, that these images are not literal. They haunt rather than explicate.
Many use the trunk and roots of mind as if that portion of mind were a badly used, prostituted entity. Then this entity gains from this great storehouse that which is rough, prostituted, and without great virtue. Those who turn to the deep mind, seeing it in the guise of the maiden, go forth to court it. The courtship has nothing of plunder in its semblance and may be protracted, yet the treasure gained by such careful courtship is great. The right-hand and left-hand transformations of the mind may be seen to differ by the attitude of the conscious mind towards its own resources as well as the resources of other-selves.
We now speak of that genie, or elemental, or mythic figure, culturally determined, which sends the arrow to the left-hand transformation. This arrow is not the arrow which kills but rather that which, in its own way, protects. Those who choose separation, that being the quality most indicative of the left-hand path, are protected from other-selves by a strength and sharpness equivalent to the degree of transformation which the mind has experienced in the negative sense. Those upon the right-hand path have no such protection against other-selves for upon that path the doughty seeker shall find many mirrors for reflection in each other-self it encounters.
Yes, it is built into the fabric of our illusion, specifically for the purpose of letting go our participation in the exploitation of others to move to higher planes of existence. And I'm not just talking about animals - but also about all the things that we buy that are made with the labor of others. The value of certain labor is weighted higher than the value of others' labor, and that creates exploitation and essentially slavery. Slaves make the majority of the goods that we consume. We have to recognize that we do have the free will to stop unconsciously participating in enslavement of others.
This has taken me a long time to respond to. Initially when I first read this I simply rolled my eyes. I could not get past this attitude in my head of "here come the Ra quotes!". For ages I had the desire to dish out a few Ra quotes of my own. I had visions of creating 52 of my favourite Ra quotes, printing them out and flipping 7 of them randomly face up. From there I could present an antithesis with no trouble at all. What stopped me is because I care like you care. It's a tragic irony to realise that Diane, yourself and I, as well as others are coming from the same fertile desire to protect.
I respond now because I believe I have a better understanding on this free will vs compassion divide. What initially stimulated me was the bracketed "to choose torture and death" comment. There is so much more going on underneath the surface of what we reveal to each other. That stimulating comment reminded me very much of how my mother used to talk. A guilt inducing comment aimed at orienting my behaviour to a more acceptable configuration. This is how compassion is perverted into a strategy, and why I am sensitive to such terms. I obviously cannot speak as to why Diane used such a term. But I can surely reveal why It was personally stimulating for me.
[Deleted a passage that encourages comparative thinking by using the word Vegans in reference to individuals]
I went to a Vegan festival today and bought some natural, "activated carbon" toothpaste. I mentioned how important to me it was to start taking care of the teeth that remained in my mouth. A lady next to me said. "It's good for the planet, too". And then the guy selling me this lovely product adds "Yes the bottles are recycled glass"
Now the little wolf in me had all sorts of imaginary comments. First was "Did I ask for your input here!?" and then I thought about the guy "Why can't you look at me when serving?"
I quickly processed it though when I realised it was just 2 like minded folks communing. We are all vulnerable at heart and that's why we group together in communities. Perhaps it was because I am a white male with broad shoulders? Who knows. I know one thing though. I missed the opportunity to express to them that I felt lonely in that moment and had just as much a need for community as they do. Oh well.