Bring4th Forums
  • Login Register
    Login
    Username:
    Password:
  • Archive Home
  • Members
  • Team
  • Help
  • More
    • About Us
    • Library
    • L/L Research Store
User Links
  • Login Register
    Login
    Username:
    Password:

    Menu Home Today At a Glance Members CSC & Team Help
    Also visit... About Us Library Blog L/L Research Store Adept Biorhythms

    As of Friday, August 5th, 2022, the Bring4th forums on this page have been converted to a permanent read-only archive. If you would like to continue your journey with Bring4th, the new forums are now at https://discourse.bring4th.org.

    You are invited to enjoy many years worth of forum messages brought forth by our community of seekers. The site search feature remains available to discover topics of interest. (July 22, 2022) x

    Bring4th Bring4th Studies Strictly Law of One Material Regarding the One Infinite Creator

    Thread: Regarding the One Infinite Creator


    Jocie (Offline)

    Member
    Posts: 28
    Threads: 2
    Joined: Aug 2017
    #18
    09-05-2018, 07:46 AM
    At this point Spinoza inserts a note explaining in terms of
    his philosophy a pair of mediaeval technical terms, the Latin
    of which can be translated as ‘naturing Nature’ (Nature as a
    cause) and ‘natured Nature’ (Nature as an effect) respectively.
    The distinction has attracted much attention from scholars,
    but in itself it is fairly trivial, and it has no structural role in
    the Ethics. Spinoza uses the terms only in 31, to which he
    makes no further reference anywhere in the work. The note
    and that proposition are omitted from the present version,
    and along with them 30, which has almost no role except in
    31.]
    32: The will cannot be called a free cause, but only a
    necessary one.
    The will, like the intellect, is only a certain mode ·or
    way· of thinking. And so (by 28) each volition—·each
    act of the will·—can exist and be fit to produce an
    effect only if it is caused by another cause, and this
    cause again by another, and so on, to infinity. So the
    will requires a cause by which it is caused to exist and
    produce an effect; and so (by D7) it cannot be called a
    ‘free’ cause but only a necessary or compelled one.
    That was based on the will’s being a finite entity to
    which 28 applies. Suppose it is infinite, making 28
    irrelevant to it. Then it falls under 23, which means
    that it has to be caused to exist and produce an
    effect by God—this time by God-as-having-the-infiniteand-
    eternal-essence-of-thought rather than God-ashaving-
    this-or-that-temporary-and-local-quality. So
    on this supposition also the will is not a free cause
    but a compelled one.
    Corollary to 32: God doesn’t produce any effect through
    freedom of the will.
    Second corollary to 32: Will and intellect are related to
    God’s nature as motion and rest are, and as are absolutely
    all natural things, which (by 29) must be caused by God to
    exist and produce an effect in a certain way.
    The will, like everything else, requires a cause by
    which it is caused to exist and produce an effect in a
    certain way. And although from a given will or intellect
    infinitely many things may follow, God still can’t be
    said on that account to act from freedom of the will,
    any more than God can be said to act from ‘freedom
    of motion and rest’ on account of the things that
    follow from motion and rest! So will doesn’t pertain to
    God’s nature any more than do other natural things;
    it is related to God in the same way as motion and
    rest. . . ·In short: acts of the will, such as human
    choices and decisions, are natural events with natural
    causes, just as are (for example) collisions of billiard
    balls. And to attribute will to God, saying that because
    the cause of each volition is God (= Nature) therefore
    God has choices and makes decisions, is as absurd as
    to suppose that God is rattling around on the billiard
    table·.
    33: Things could not have been produced by God in any
    way or in any order other than that in which they have
    been produced.
    All things have necessarily followed from God’s given
    nature (by 16), and have been caused from the necessity
    of God’s nature to exist and produce an effect in a
    certain way (by 29). To think of them as possibly being
    different in some way is, therefore, to think of God as
    possibly being different; that is to think that there is
    some other nature that God could have—some other
    divine nature—and if such a nature is possible then
    it is actually instantiated, which means that there
    are two Gods. But it is absurd to suppose that there
    could have been two Gods. So things could not have
    been produced in any other way or in any other order
    than they have been produced.
    Note on 33: Since by these propositions I have made it as
    clear as day that there is absolutely nothing in things on the
    basis of which they can be called contingent, I wish now to
    explain briefly what we should understand by ‘contingent’—
    but first, what we should understand by ‘necessary’ and
    ‘impossible’. A thing is called ‘necessary’ either •by reason of
    its essence or •by reason of its cause. For a thing’s existence
    follows necessarily either from its essence and definition
    or from a given efficient cause. And a thing is also called
    ‘impossible’ for these same reasons—namely, either because
    its essence or definition involves a contradiction, or because
    no external cause has been caused to produce such a thing
    ·in which case the external causes that do exist will have
    been enough to prevent the thing from existing·.
    A thing is called ‘contingent’ only because of a lack of
    our knowledge. If we don’t know that the thing’s essence
    involves a contradiction, or if we know quite well that its
    essence doesn’t involve a contradiction, but we can’t say
    anything for sure about its existence because the order of
    causes is hidden from us, it can’t seem to us either necessary
    or impossible. So we call it ‘contingent’ or ‘·merely· possible’.
    Second note on 33: From this it clearly follows that things
    have been produced by God with the highest perfection, since
    they have followed necessarily from a most perfect nature.
    God’s producing everything there is doesn’t mean that God
    is in any way imperfect. The suggestion that God could have
    acted differently is, as I have shown, absurd. . . .
    I’m sure that many people will reject my view as absurd,
    without even being willing to examine it. Of course they
    will! because they have been accustomed to credit God
    with having an absolute will—·that is, with just non-causally
    deciding what to do·—which attributes to God a ‘freedom’
    quite different from what I have taught (D7). But I am also
    sure that if they would consent to reflect on the matter, and
    pay proper attention to my chain of our demonstrations,
    they would end up utterly rejecting the ‘freedom’ they now
    attribute to God, not only as futile but as a great obstacle to
    science. I needn’t repeat here what I said in the note on 17.
    Still, to please them ·or at least meet them half-way·, I
    shall argue on the basis that God’s essence does involve will,
    and shall still prove that it follows from God’s perfection that
    things could not have been created by God in any other way
    or any other order. It will be easy to show this if we consider
    ·two things·. First, as my opponents concede, it depends on
    God’s decree and will alone that each thing is what it is; for
    otherwise God wouldn’t be the cause of all things. Secondly,
    all God’s decrees have been established by God from eternity;
    for otherwise God would be convicted of imperfection and
    inconstancy. But since in eternity there is neither when,
    nor before, nor after, it follows purely from God’s perfection
    that God could never have decreed anything different. It is a
    mistake to think of God as having existed for a while without
    making any decrees and then making some.
    The opponents will say that in supposing God to have
    made another nature of things, or supposing that from eternity
    God had decreed something else concerning Nature and
    its order, one is not implicitly supposing any imperfection in
    God.
    Still, if they say this, they will ·have to· concede also
    that God’s decrees can be changed by their maker. Their
    supposition that God could have decreed Nature and its
    order to be different from how they actually are involves
    supposing that God could have had a different intellect
    and will from those that God actually has; and they—·the
    opponents·—hold that this could have been the case without
    any change of God’s essence or of God’s perfection. But
    if that is right, why can’t God now change God’s decrees
    concerning created things while remaining just as perfect?
    ·It is absurd to suppose that God can do this—e.g. that from
    now on the laws of physics will be slightly different every
    second Tuesday—but my opponents have left themselves
    with no basis for ruling this out as the absurdity that it
    really is·. . . .
    Therefore, since things could not have been produced
    by God in any other way or any other order, and since the
    truth of this follows from God’s supreme perfection, we have
    to accept that God willed to create all the things that are
    in God’s intellect, with the same perfection with which God
    understands them.
    The opponents will say that there is no perfection or
    imperfection in things: what is to count in things as making
    them perfect or imperfect, and thus called ‘good’ or ‘bad’,
    depends only on God’s will. So God could have brought it
    about, simply by willing it, that what is now perfection would
    have been the greatest imperfection, and conversely that
    what is now an imperfection in things would have been the
    most perfect. ·Thus the opponents·. But God necessarily
    understands what God wills; so what the opponents say here
    is tantamount to saying outright that God could bring it
    about through an act of will that God understands things in
    a different way from how God does understand them. And
    this, as I have just shown, is a great absurdity. . . .
    I confess that •this opinion that subjects all things to a
    certain unguided will of God and makes everything depend
    on God’s whim is nearer the truth than •the view of those
    who maintain that God does all things for the sake of the
    good. For the latter seem to suppose something outside God,
    something not depending on God, to which God in acting
    attends as a model and at which God aims as at a goal. This
    is simply to subject God to fate [Latin fatum, here = ‘something
    independently fixed and given’]. Nothing more absurd can be
    maintained about God—shown by me to be the first and only
    free cause of the essence of all things and of their existence.
    I shan’t waste any more time refuting this absurdity.
    34: God’s power is God’s essence itself.
    It follows purely from the necessity of God’s essence
    that God is the cause of God (by 11) and (by 16 and
    its corollary) the cause of all things. So God’s power,
    by which God and all things exist and act, is God’s
    essence itself.
    35: Whatever we conceive to be in God’s power, necessarily
    exists.
    Whatever is in God’s power must (by 34) be so related
    to God’s essence that it necessarily follows from it,
    and therefore necessarily exists.
    36: Nothing exists from whose nature some effect does
    not follow.
    Whatever exists expresses the nature, or essence of
    God in a certain and determinate way (by the corollary
    to 25), that is, whatever exists expresses in a certain
    and determinate way the power of God, which is the
    cause of all things. So (by 16) from everything that
    exists some effect must follow.

      •
    « Next Oldest | Next Newest »

    Users browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)



    Messages In This Thread
    Regarding the One Infinite Creator - by KevinAir - 09-03-2018, 05:46 PM
    RE: Regarding the One Infinite Creator - by Foha - 09-03-2018, 06:04 PM
    RE: Regarding the One Infinite Creator - by KevinAir - 09-03-2018, 06:53 PM
    RE: Regarding the One Infinite Creator - by smiLie - 12-26-2018, 08:39 PM
    RE: Regarding the One Infinite Creator - by Tae - 12-27-2018, 03:56 AM
    RE: Regarding the One Infinite Creator - by KevinAir - 09-03-2018, 07:07 PM
    RE: Regarding the One Infinite Creator - by Sacred Fool - 09-03-2018, 08:09 PM
    RE: Regarding the One Infinite Creator - by KevinAir - 09-03-2018, 08:29 PM
    RE: Regarding the One Infinite Creator - by Foha - 09-03-2018, 08:18 PM
    RE: Regarding the One Infinite Creator - by Jocie - 09-05-2018, 07:23 AM
    RE: Regarding the One Infinite Creator - by Jocie - 09-05-2018, 07:26 AM
    RE: Regarding the One Infinite Creator - by Jocie - 09-05-2018, 07:31 AM
    RE: Regarding the One Infinite Creator - by Jocie - 09-05-2018, 07:34 AM
    RE: Regarding the One Infinite Creator - by Jocie - 09-05-2018, 07:44 AM
    RE: Regarding the One Infinite Creator - by Jocie - 09-05-2018, 07:46 AM
    RE: Regarding the One Infinite Creator - by KevinAir - 09-03-2018, 08:23 PM
    RE: Regarding the One Infinite Creator - by Stranger - 09-04-2018, 03:51 AM
    RE: Regarding the One Infinite Creator - by Nau7ik - 09-04-2018, 08:47 AM
    RE: Regarding the One Infinite Creator - by Stranger - 09-04-2018, 11:34 AM
    RE: Regarding the One Infinite Creator - by Nau7ik - 09-05-2018, 08:56 AM
    RE: Regarding the One Infinite Creator - by flofrog - 09-04-2018, 07:44 PM
    RE: Regarding the One Infinite Creator - by Stranger - 09-05-2018, 01:48 PM
    RE: Regarding the One Infinite Creator - by Taralie Peterdaughter - 09-05-2018, 09:58 PM
    RE: Regarding the One Infinite Creator - by flofrog - 09-06-2018, 01:13 AM
    RE: Regarding the One Infinite Creator - by loostudent - 09-08-2018, 08:28 AM
    RE: Regarding the One Infinite Creator - by smiLie - 12-18-2018, 10:37 PM
    RE: Regarding the One Infinite Creator - by KevinAir - 02-02-2019, 08:14 PM
    RE: Regarding the One Infinite Creator - by KevinAir - 02-03-2019, 10:25 AM
    RE: Regarding the One Infinite Creator - by Infinite Unity - 12-19-2018, 12:54 AM
    RE: Regarding the One Infinite Creator - by flofrog - 12-19-2018, 01:00 AM
    RE: Regarding the One Infinite Creator - by Cyan - 12-19-2018, 11:47 AM
    RE: Regarding the One Infinite Creator - by flofrog - 12-19-2018, 04:46 PM
    RE: Regarding the One Infinite Creator - by unity100 - 12-20-2018, 05:26 PM
    RE: Regarding the One Infinite Creator - by Patrick - 12-21-2018, 04:01 PM
    RE: Regarding the One Infinite Creator - by Ghostdancer17 - 12-23-2018, 04:16 PM
    RE: Regarding the One Infinite Creator - by Ghostdancer17 - 12-23-2018, 05:58 PM
    RE: Regarding the One Infinite Creator - by unity100 - 12-27-2018, 07:24 AM

    • View a Printable Version
    • Subscribe to this thread

    © Template Design by D&D - Powered by MyBB

    Connect with L/L Research on Social Media

    Linear Mode
    Threaded Mode