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    Bring4th Bring4th Studies Strictly Law of One Material Confederation, Eastern Orthodox Christianity and Meditation

    Thread: Confederation, Eastern Orthodox Christianity and Meditation


    Asolsutsesvyl Away

    Sup-end-ous
    Posts: 392
    Threads: 17
    Joined: Apr 2018
    #8
    03-22-2020, 03:37 PM
    I remember reading an old exchange between Carla and another person, where Carla mentioned those two paths in terms of that of "the heart" vs. of "the mind" and her belief that that of "the heart", i.e. the "active and inclusive" one, was the right one for her.

    This may or may not be reflected in the channeled message.

    The two approaches are also described in Gnosis vol. I by Boris Mouravieff. The Fourth Way presentation he gives is that which most directly ties the Fourth Way teaching (more well-known in Gurdjieff's version) to esoteric Orthodox Christianity.

    Gnosis, vol. I Wrote:Two practical methods are recommended by the Tradition to develop the faculty of discernment: each of them is adapted to one of the two types of exterior man most widespread in our civilization:

    - The negative method, or method of exclusion, is recommended to man 3, that is, the intellectual type;
    - The positive method, or method of integration, is recommended to man 2, the emotional type.

    The value of each of these two methods is equal. The difference is, that if he follows the first the seeker will not see the light except at the peak of his efforts; if he follows the second, he will be encouraged by sparks from the consciousness of the real 'I' which will accompany him all along the path.
    The Fourth Way teaching divides people into three temperaments, in terms of where they are usually and naturally centered: 1. Psychomotor or instinctive; 2. Emotional; and 3. Intellectual.

    Gnosis, vol. I Wrote:In principle, man 3 is endowed with a tendency not to believe. He is of a rather sceptical nature: he often and easily progresses to a critical analysis of the facts and problems that face him. [...] The negative method takes these characteristics into account. In observing the movements of the inner life, it undertakes a critical analysis of the most scrupulous and impartial type possible. It observes the comings and goings of the little 'I' s or groups of little 'I' s and, recognizing them as being Non-I's, makes an effort not to be identified with them. Little by little, he thus discards that which does not indicate a real and permanent tendency in the currents of his mental life.

    When such constatations are repeated in a controlled way, over and over again, the observer will perceive that certain elements are permanent, and consequently cannot be subjected to the principle of exclusion with true objectivity: he will then find himself not far from the threshold of the real 'I'.
    Without the need for faith, nor for idealism, such a striving can allow a person to exclude all the false and transient within the self in order to finally succeed in igniting a pure contact with what is real, or "higher". Mouravieff warns that "total impartiality" is needed, with the risk of falling deeper into illusion if the impartiality is lacking. There is also the need to have internalized a pure spiritual "magnetic center", through positive spiritual influences, beforehand, as when the internal transformation completes, all conventional morality is destroyed and the result is either a person with the soul firmly in charge, or a sociopath.

    Gnosis, vol. I Wrote:The second method is positive. It can only apply to man 2, the centre of gravity of whose mental life is found in the heart. This man may have an ideal and try to reach it. For this he will attempt to reassemble those elements of his Personality where the seeds of his ideal are scattered. This method is the reverse of the preceding since it tends not to the exclusion of unstable elements but to a synthesis, an affirmation. If such a man is called hot, it is because he has given free rein to his positive emotions: exactly the opposite of the cold method of critical analysis and exclusion. This is not without danger, but the danger is of a different nature. It comes from an initial error in the choice of an ideal, or rather from the attitude when the choice is made. [...] It is a question of lack of sincerity towards oneself. The profound divergence between admitted and unadmitted aims can cause an interior rupture which, when strongly emphasized, can go so far that it provokes division in the Personality.
    It is irrelevant how outside authorities judge the ideal.

    The negative/excluding method requires a striving towards perfect impartiality. The positive/integrating method requires a striving towards perfect sincerity.

    Mouravieff notes that in practice, while people gravitate toward one or the other of the mentalities and methods, and its required ability/virtue, natures are not usually that clear-cut and what works best is usually a mixture of the approaches in whatever proportion individually works the best.

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    Messages In This Thread
    Confederation, Eastern Orthodox Christianity and Meditation - by flow - 03-21-2020, 02:42 AM
    RE: Confederation, Eastern Orthodox Christianity and Meditation - by Infinite - 03-21-2020, 08:30 AM
    RE: Confederation, Eastern Orthodox Christianity and Meditation - by flow - 03-21-2020, 09:15 AM
    RE: Confederation, Eastern Orthodox Christianity and Meditation - by Infinite - 03-22-2020, 11:55 AM
    RE: Confederation, Eastern Orthodox Christianity and Meditation - by flofrog - 03-21-2020, 11:48 AM
    RE: Confederation, Eastern Orthodox Christianity and Meditation - by Aion - 03-21-2020, 02:49 PM
    RE: Confederation, Eastern Orthodox Christianity and Meditation - by Sacred Fool - 03-21-2020, 02:55 PM
    RE: Confederation, Eastern Orthodox Christianity and Meditation - by Asolsutsesvyl - 03-22-2020, 03:37 PM
    RE: Confederation, Eastern Orthodox Christianity and Meditation - by Sacred Fool - 03-23-2020, 02:41 AM
    RE: Confederation, Eastern Orthodox Christianity and Meditation - by Nau7ik - 03-29-2020, 09:50 AM
    RE: Confederation, Eastern Orthodox Christianity and Meditation - by flow - 03-30-2020, 02:28 AM
    RE: Confederation, Eastern Orthodox Christianity and Meditation - by Aion - 04-10-2020, 12:49 PM
    RE: Confederation, Eastern Orthodox Christianity and Meditation - by Nau7ik - 03-30-2020, 08:32 AM
    RE: Confederation, Eastern Orthodox Christianity and Meditation - by Aion - 04-10-2020, 01:03 PM
    RE: Confederation, Eastern Orthodox Christianity and Meditation - by flow - 04-11-2020, 06:16 AM
    RE: Confederation, Eastern Orthodox Christianity and Meditation - by jafar - 04-26-2022, 05:50 PM
    RE: Confederation, Eastern Orthodox Christianity and Meditation - by mozgocheck - 04-26-2022, 03:26 PM
    RE: Confederation, Eastern Orthodox Christianity and Meditation - by 3-24-2022 - 04-26-2022, 09:09 PM

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