So, what does penetrating the veil truly entail?

[3DMonkey]

No details. Proof.

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else it's just mental make up

Proof of what? And what would constitute 'proof' for you?

Seeing. Seeing something. Not just believing. Not just blind faith. Oh, don't get me wrong, I believe in the reality of the human spirit; that there is an actual existence of synchronicity and things that happen between persons that can't be put into words; these things I see every day.

No, I wanna see an actual spirit. An actual extraterrestrial. An actual angel. An actual out of body experience- nothing short of a meet and greet with someone while we directly discuss the fact that we left our bodies to have this meeting.

You see, these things aren't actual IMO. These things are concepts- like dreams that are so odd yet they point to the mental focus of the previous day. The human condition is real and can be greater understood by the ideas created by it- all the various forms of archetypes. What's not actual to me is the imagery used by the mind to create the very understanding by the mind. Like, trying to understand the Potentiator of the Spirit, we can't escape using the actual full archetypal structure of the m/b/s in our reasonings, and somewhere in there (if we could chart it) we would find why we needed to apply faith in imagery in order to "give it life" within our ability to comprehend it. ...This reality I understand. I've reached a point where That catalyst (faith in imagery) has been neutralized, and any actual presence of the imagery must either be seen or else it just falls away.

@Azrael- I understand your points/counter points. If anyone is new to this forum and reading my words, please understand I am not being completely fatalistic here. Azrael, I thought you and I had a better understanding of one another.

@The Lovely Lady Angels-