03-23-2012, 11:33 AM
(This post was last modified: 03-23-2012, 11:41 AM by Steppingfeet.)
I wish to say to the community that I love you all. I love reading your words on this screen and feeling the intention behind those words. Even when struggling with difficult catalyst, you always reach for solutions and perspective that are rare in this world. What takes place on the forums is as real as any other sector of life, and I thank you all.
Like Abridgetoofar and Ankh, I favor – in general and in this case specifically – reflection. Sometimes it is indeed best not to reflect, at least in a multi-party way, and move on without another word. But as I wrote to another member recently, in most cases, especially ones involving dynamics as complex as those represented in the forums, I think it much, much healthier to actually use the catalyst at hand. Look at it. Identify it. Discern the imbalance. Open respectful dialogue about it. Apply spiritual principles. Accept, integrate, and ultimately learn from it. This is all possible and can be undertaken without judgment for any party. As long as no one is villainized and no one engages in personal antagonism, all parties involved in some form of dispute can meet together at the MLK-Table of Brotherhood. : )
Shin’Ar, you are the bomb dot com for the massive effort you made towards returning the energies to balance and harmony in these two posts:
http://www.bring4th.org/forums/showthrea...3#pid78153
http://www.bring4th.org/forums/showthrea...0#pid77890
Ankh, Austin, Diana, Monica, Tenet AND others who have made genuine heartfelt efforts to reach out, you also rock my world.
Reflection
To reflect on my end of things, I wish to be clear that I have no personal animosity toward Shin’Ar. Godwide_Void, as you pointed out, he’s a beautiful person with positive intentions. He, like all of you, knows things I don’t. He’s got incredible insight to offer. And he’s an asset to the community.
In my participation in this particular energy snafu, I targeted not Shin’Ar the person - who is welcome as an equal brother in seeking alongside and among a community of fellow seekers - but a specific, particular activity and intention: evangelism.
I conferred with Aaron, my co-moderator, regarding my analysis of the situation. I sought the sage advice of another community member. And I paid attention, watching the dynamics of the forum, taking into account the reactions to Shin’Ar. A clear picture emerged.
It wasn’t that Shin’Ar had disagreements, or had a unique take on polarity or other points, it was rather a method and intention to proselytize that created the disturbance and warranted further attention, even if that activity was unconsciously undertaken. The proselytizing was not 100% of his interaction, but it became increasingly predominant, peaking on Tuesday or Wednesday until, with the help of Aaron, the moderators requested that it be discontinued.
Not speaking to *all* of Shin’Ar’s postings, but in the main there became an increasing desire to push a message. There seemed less interest in two-way, mutually edifying discussion and greater interest in converting others to and convincing them of a pre-determined message which he, the messenger/chosen one, was appointed to "reveal".
When any human being casts themselves into the role of messenger of “truth”, and seeks to persuasively and insistently hammer that into the consciousness of others despite requests to chill out, it immediately discounts everyone else’s capacity to know and to discover what is true for themselves. It elevates one to an authority over and above others. This is not humble, positively oriented service, in my opinion.
Just as the religious proselytizer is “genuinely” concerned for the soul of those they are seeking convince of the better/higher/truer way, so to Shin’Ar seemed genuinely concerned for what he sees as the “dangers” of the STS path.
It is an easy rut to fall into. I know when I first began my path I had LOADS of advice for those near me, especially my family, regarding how they ought to best live their lives. For some reason though push as I may, then never seemed to adopt my enlightened wisdom.
I'm sure many of us have had these moments, especially at the beginning of our conscious paths. And most of us have realized that it just doesn't work. We can't change people through coercion or insistent persuasion. (Godwide_Void, I recall that you recently encountered an individual of this orientation on the bus. I recall that the individual did not succeed in winning you over to their truth.
)
First Guideline
The cornerstone of this community is written in the first guideline: We are here to respect each other’s views, not campaign against their wrongness.
And a campaign was being initiated. Multiple threads created on the same topic, inability to hear others’ very careful and nuanced explanations of what service to self is and how the seeker relates to it on both a practical and philosophical level, hammering home the same message ad infinitum, and stating out right that there was a mission to which this particular seeker was called and felt compelled to complete, any disagreement with that message indicating that other’s “risk” of being swept up into the negative polarity.
This particular energy, not the entity behind it, is against the guidelines and is not cool. And I thank Shin’Ar profusely for taking the hard step of reflecting and seeking to amend that particular behavior. At no point did anyone seek to stifle discussion, just reel in the promulgation/promotion/pushing of a one-way message often delivered in the form of sermon.
Terminology
Now to reflect further, there does seem a conflict of terminology and philosophy. Thank you, Shin’Ar, for going to the trouble of explaining the differences. I see how that could create some dissonance, confusion, and tension.
Yet I’m somewhat baffled that such a confusion still persists given that a) the material on which this community is founded is freely available for reading and study, and, b) members have made great effort to communicate what polarity means in their understanding.
But things being as they are, there remains confusion about these terms. No harm no foul.
As a solution, then, I propose this thread wherein we as a community seek to clarify what service to self and service to others mean, how they apply to the life, etc.
As I've said elsewhere, polarity will be something we embarked upon the conscious path of seeking will grapple with for the remainder of our incarnations, and into densities beyond our own, but for the moment let’s try to be as clear and concise as possible and generate understanding in this thread.
Integrating your light
(I borrowed that term/idea from another member.)
You've got such good energy to share, Shin'Ar and are entirely welcome here. You are not “wrong” and other members “right”. And vice versa. It’s simply a matter of a particular form of energy that, naturally of its own accord & without reference to the guidelines, disrupts forum harmony. The guidelines are written with this foreknown and thus do they seek to protect the temple from he or she who would evangelize members. Any other human being who sought to proselytize the temple would be met similarly, though uniquely, of course.
And I am GRATEFUL that that energy seems to have dissipated! I hope that we can continue to reflect with an eye not toward blame and accusation (not implying that anyone is doing that), but toward working together without this particular energy baffling our mutually constructive discussion. (And you guys are already doing that!! You rock so hard.)
At any rate, just my perception among other perceptions, that is.
Peace out - GLB
Like Abridgetoofar and Ankh, I favor – in general and in this case specifically – reflection. Sometimes it is indeed best not to reflect, at least in a multi-party way, and move on without another word. But as I wrote to another member recently, in most cases, especially ones involving dynamics as complex as those represented in the forums, I think it much, much healthier to actually use the catalyst at hand. Look at it. Identify it. Discern the imbalance. Open respectful dialogue about it. Apply spiritual principles. Accept, integrate, and ultimately learn from it. This is all possible and can be undertaken without judgment for any party. As long as no one is villainized and no one engages in personal antagonism, all parties involved in some form of dispute can meet together at the MLK-Table of Brotherhood. : )
Shin’Ar, you are the bomb dot com for the massive effort you made towards returning the energies to balance and harmony in these two posts:
http://www.bring4th.org/forums/showthrea...3#pid78153
http://www.bring4th.org/forums/showthrea...0#pid77890
Ankh, Austin, Diana, Monica, Tenet AND others who have made genuine heartfelt efforts to reach out, you also rock my world.
Reflection
To reflect on my end of things, I wish to be clear that I have no personal animosity toward Shin’Ar. Godwide_Void, as you pointed out, he’s a beautiful person with positive intentions. He, like all of you, knows things I don’t. He’s got incredible insight to offer. And he’s an asset to the community.
In my participation in this particular energy snafu, I targeted not Shin’Ar the person - who is welcome as an equal brother in seeking alongside and among a community of fellow seekers - but a specific, particular activity and intention: evangelism.
I conferred with Aaron, my co-moderator, regarding my analysis of the situation. I sought the sage advice of another community member. And I paid attention, watching the dynamics of the forum, taking into account the reactions to Shin’Ar. A clear picture emerged.
It wasn’t that Shin’Ar had disagreements, or had a unique take on polarity or other points, it was rather a method and intention to proselytize that created the disturbance and warranted further attention, even if that activity was unconsciously undertaken. The proselytizing was not 100% of his interaction, but it became increasingly predominant, peaking on Tuesday or Wednesday until, with the help of Aaron, the moderators requested that it be discontinued.
Not speaking to *all* of Shin’Ar’s postings, but in the main there became an increasing desire to push a message. There seemed less interest in two-way, mutually edifying discussion and greater interest in converting others to and convincing them of a pre-determined message which he, the messenger/chosen one, was appointed to "reveal".
When any human being casts themselves into the role of messenger of “truth”, and seeks to persuasively and insistently hammer that into the consciousness of others despite requests to chill out, it immediately discounts everyone else’s capacity to know and to discover what is true for themselves. It elevates one to an authority over and above others. This is not humble, positively oriented service, in my opinion.
Just as the religious proselytizer is “genuinely” concerned for the soul of those they are seeking convince of the better/higher/truer way, so to Shin’Ar seemed genuinely concerned for what he sees as the “dangers” of the STS path.
It is an easy rut to fall into. I know when I first began my path I had LOADS of advice for those near me, especially my family, regarding how they ought to best live their lives. For some reason though push as I may, then never seemed to adopt my enlightened wisdom.
I'm sure many of us have had these moments, especially at the beginning of our conscious paths. And most of us have realized that it just doesn't work. We can't change people through coercion or insistent persuasion. (Godwide_Void, I recall that you recently encountered an individual of this orientation on the bus. I recall that the individual did not succeed in winning you over to their truth.
)First Guideline
The cornerstone of this community is written in the first guideline: We are here to respect each other’s views, not campaign against their wrongness.
And a campaign was being initiated. Multiple threads created on the same topic, inability to hear others’ very careful and nuanced explanations of what service to self is and how the seeker relates to it on both a practical and philosophical level, hammering home the same message ad infinitum, and stating out right that there was a mission to which this particular seeker was called and felt compelled to complete, any disagreement with that message indicating that other’s “risk” of being swept up into the negative polarity.
This particular energy, not the entity behind it, is against the guidelines and is not cool. And I thank Shin’Ar profusely for taking the hard step of reflecting and seeking to amend that particular behavior. At no point did anyone seek to stifle discussion, just reel in the promulgation/promotion/pushing of a one-way message often delivered in the form of sermon.
Terminology
Now to reflect further, there does seem a conflict of terminology and philosophy. Thank you, Shin’Ar, for going to the trouble of explaining the differences. I see how that could create some dissonance, confusion, and tension.
Yet I’m somewhat baffled that such a confusion still persists given that a) the material on which this community is founded is freely available for reading and study, and, b) members have made great effort to communicate what polarity means in their understanding.
But things being as they are, there remains confusion about these terms. No harm no foul.
As a solution, then, I propose this thread wherein we as a community seek to clarify what service to self and service to others mean, how they apply to the life, etc.
As I've said elsewhere, polarity will be something we embarked upon the conscious path of seeking will grapple with for the remainder of our incarnations, and into densities beyond our own, but for the moment let’s try to be as clear and concise as possible and generate understanding in this thread.
Integrating your light
(I borrowed that term/idea from another member.
)You've got such good energy to share, Shin'Ar and are entirely welcome here. You are not “wrong” and other members “right”. And vice versa. It’s simply a matter of a particular form of energy that, naturally of its own accord & without reference to the guidelines, disrupts forum harmony. The guidelines are written with this foreknown and thus do they seek to protect the temple from he or she who would evangelize members. Any other human being who sought to proselytize the temple would be met similarly, though uniquely, of course.
And I am GRATEFUL that that energy seems to have dissipated! I hope that we can continue to reflect with an eye not toward blame and accusation (not implying that anyone is doing that), but toward working together without this particular energy baffling our mutually constructive discussion. (And you guys are already doing that!! You rock so hard.)
At any rate, just my perception among other perceptions, that is.
Peace out - GLB
Explanation by the tongue makes most things clear, but love unexplained is clearer. - Rumi
![[+]](https://www.bring4th.org/forums/images/collapse_collapsed.png)