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    Bring4th Bring4th Studies Spiritual Development & Metaphysical Matters Family

    Thread: Family


    Billy (Offline)

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    #1
    07-15-2015, 11:03 PM (This post was last modified: 07-15-2015, 11:38 PM by Billy.)
    How do you tell your family that you fell utterly disconnected from them, are indifferent towards them and/or hate and resent resent them (or at least some of them) and that a part of you desires to cut them out of your life and be on your way, with no desire to give the relationship another go and try and mend it?  I ask because this is how I feel towards my family, have felt so for a long time now, and have not even so much as hinted that I may be feeling this way (I am the quite one who stays in his room). Such a revelation would come as completely unexpected to them I am pretty sure, which is why this is hard, as I am gonna have to be the one break the illusion of 'wellness'.  

    I realize that sooner or later these thoughts and feelings are going to have to be revealed, and being that I am 22 years old and I desire to move out, sooner is better than later.  The bubble is gonna have to burst, even though there is intense resistance and all I really wan't to do is run away and not have to face and express this.  I just don't know how to do it and what to do afterwards.  I'm tired of pretending that all is well and dandy, when in actual fact it isn't. I'm tired of lying to myself and other. Any advice?
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      • ree, Nicholas, isis
    anagogy Away

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    #2
    07-16-2015, 04:32 AM
    Why do you think you feel this way towards them? What about them does not jive with you?

      •
    Billy (Offline)

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    #3
    07-16-2015, 06:20 AM
    (07-16-2015, 04:32 AM)anagogy Wrote: Why do you think you feel this way towards them?  What about them does not jive with you?

    I have yet to fully discover the cause of these emotions, which is bothering me greatly.  I can't point to any clear examples of abuse towards me and it almost feels like I am the one with the problem, the blame is entirely on me and I am a bad person for it.  I can't talk to any of them about anything (the very thought of doing so I find repulsive and repugnant with there being vast aversion and resistance) even though they would be willing to hear me out and help me.  I have been given ample opportunity to express how I feel and ask for help ("are you okay?" is a regular question) yet such attempts annoy me and make me want to withdraw even further.  Why?  

    I do believe though that as a child my family failed me massively and did not provide me with the love, acceptance, understanding, affection, warmth, wisdom, guidance, help, attention and direction I so sorely craved, nor did they even come close to doing so.  Can something like that cause such intense feelings of disconnect, aversion and hate even though things are relatively peaceful and good otherwise?  Some people have it so much worse, yet they don't feel like this.  It's almost like I wish they were outwardly abusive towards me and treated me with contempt, then my feelings would be legitimate and I wouldn't have to carry around such guilt.   
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      • Jade
    Jade (Offline)

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    #4
    07-16-2015, 11:10 AM
    Sounds like a vibratory mismatch. Also, as you are an adult now, maybe you're being encouraged to step out on your own into the world. Moving out would be a good first step. You don't have to cut all contact with them or anything that drastic right away - even a reduction in time spent around them might help clear your head and your emotions.
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      • Billy, norral, Charles
    Minyatur (Offline)

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    #5
    07-16-2015, 11:20 AM
    Something I tend to always say, is to meditate on why you could've chosen them yourself as your family.
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      • Diana
    Matt1 Away

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    #6
    07-16-2015, 11:31 AM (This post was last modified: 07-16-2015, 11:32 AM by Matt1.)
    I am a strong believer in the mirroring effect. What you dislike in others is in fact something you dislike in yourself. That being said i agree with what Jade said, now you are an Adult and if you are able to move out financially then perhaps just having your own free space will be what is in order rather than cutting off your family completely.
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      • Namaste
    ree (Offline)

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    #7
    07-16-2015, 12:19 PM
    (07-15-2015, 11:03 PM)Folk-love Wrote: How do you tell your family that you fell utterly disconnected from them, are indifferent towards them and/or hate and resent resent them (or at least some of them) and that a part of you desires to cut them out of your life and be on your way, with no desire to give the relationship another go and try and mend it?  I ask because this is how I feel towards my family, have felt so for a long time now, and have not even so much as hinted that I may be feeling this way (I am the quite one who stays in his room).  Such a revelation would come as completely unexpected to them I am pretty sure, which is why this is hard, as I am gonna have to be the one break the illusion of 'wellness'.  

    I realize that sooner or later these thoughts and feelings are going to have to be revealed, and being that I am 22 years old and I desire to move out, sooner is better than later.  The bubble is gonna have to burst, even though there is intense resistance and all I really wan't to do is run away and not have to face and express this.  I just don't know how to do it and what to do afterwards.  I'm tired of pretending that all is well and dandy, when in actual fact it isn't.  I'm tired of lying to myself and other.  Any advice?

    Can totally relate to your experience. I felt unfulfilled and neglected in the love department from family. At a certain point my sadness and anger became toxic... I intuitively understood that this toxicity could be detrimental to all of us. It was like, either I go or I implode. For 2-3 years I lobbied for my parents to let me leave and when the first opportunity came I took it and left. I had put real focus on the intent to leave to protect family from hurt or drama or disappointment. 

    What happened next was pretty good for all of us. Sometimes having physical distance can help to reflect and maybe help relate to family in new ways. We still had issues but w/ separation and time we've slowly got to know each other in new ways that helped us appreciate each other more, e.g.,  how I was able to appreciate things about my family I had never really noticed.

    Wasn't till my late 20s, early 30s that I came to terms with rather super-charged emotions around family, and it still is a major catalyst... but I'm just so happy I listened to my heart and followed it (to leave) and channeled strength into my intent to protect my family & self. 

    Good luck folk-love!
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      • sunnysideup, Diana, Nicholas, Namaste, norral
    Nicholas (Offline)

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    #8
    07-16-2015, 03:52 PM
    (07-16-2015, 06:20 AM)Folk-love Wrote:  

    I do believe though that as a child my family failed me massively and did not provide me with the love, acceptance, understanding, affection, warmth, wisdom, guidance, help, attention and direction I so sorely craved,


    I can very much relate to this Folk-love and the key words I would point out here is "believe" and "failed". My own mother had a very stressful time raising me and a social worker that was assigned to our family told her that I had "high expectations". She told me that many years later and it proved insightful for me in understanding the friction between us. She told me a story of when she came home from work one morning (she worked night shift as a nurse) and kicked off her shoes once getting inside the front door. I was not walking at this time and she called me a shuffle baby as I would shuffle along on my bum. On this occasion I shuffled over to her shoes in the hallway, picked them up and placed them neatly to the side. These were pretty much her words. "I could have throttled you after the dirty look you gave me!".

    Unfortunately she interpreted "high expectations" as me wanting a high life or a silver spoon upbringing, but what was actually the case was that I expected quality. My upbringing was of a poor quality as I conceived it (much like you have described above) but she had it in her mind that it was a material thing. Very early in my life I began to resent her loss of temper, her past tense punishment justifications and it soon snowballed into pretty much every thing she did. For example I was walking myself to school at 6 years of age in my first year of infants/kindergarten and no other child was allowed to do this. I figured my mother was irresponsible and not worth listening to. So her misjudging fuelled my misjudging, and so forth. In fact any adult that tried to control me would be met with an ever determined amount of resistance. That was how I began to develop my cunning and deceptive tactics when it came to doing what I wanted to do.

    So I very much felt failed, not just by my mother but also by the adult role models around me.

    (07-16-2015, 06:20 AM)Folk-love Wrote: Can something like that cause such intense feelings of disconnect, aversion and hate even though things are relatively peaceful and good otherwise?


    Absolutely! They are not privy to your thoughts about the past nor your judgements of them. Its like you have taken them to a court of law and have not giving them an opportunity to explain their side of the story.  

    I will share this experience with you. During a mental breakdown when I was 24 years old I attacked my mother in a red mist moment of vengeance. My brother called the police and 2 officers came to my room to question me. One of them said "why did you do it" (I had rather pathetically tried to strangle her after she threw some clothes at me). I proceeded to tell him that it was about time she had a taste of her own medicine and if she hadn't...
    He cut me off with "how old are you", I replied "24". He then said, and I am quoting from an exact memory here. "When are you going to take responsibility for your own actions?"

    ...???

    That was a bombshell moment for me because right at that point I realised I was blaming my mother for my own harboured thoughts and feelings. I began to weep with guilt and the remorse was very evident. I then tried to go for a walk but the 2nd officer held me back while the officer who questioned me spoke to my mother downstairs. The officer holding me back was wise to do so as it was only a 15 minute walk to the seashore, and given that I had been diagnosed with drug induced psychosis, I felt most sincere in breathing in the salt water.  


    (07-16-2015, 06:20 AM)Folk-love Wrote: It's almost like I wish they were outwardly abusive towards me and treated me with contempt, then my feelings would be legitimate and I wouldn't have to carry around such guilt.   

    My mum was outwardly abusive towards me and I was also outwardly abusive towards her. The great pang of sorrow and regret that hit me was when I realised that at some point in her life she was a bubbly little girl with a flower in her hair and a spring in her step. If she had been taught the things I had expected as a child, I am sure she would have provided them for me also.

    Still to this day Folk-love I am in gratitude to that police officer mentioned above. Without his thought provoking questions I would not have been able to see my mother through the eyes of a victim, as well as a perpetrator.
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      • ree, sunnysideup, Billy
    Billy (Offline)

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    #9
    07-16-2015, 09:59 PM
    Cutting them out is admittedly drastic, and such a feeling is coming from a place of pain and confusion.  I think that maybe it would be a good idea to move out, clear my head, and get a better understanding as to the true nature of these feelings, as some posters have suggested.  Thank you all for your replies, makes me feel as though I am not alone.
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      • sunnysideup, ree, Namaste, Nicholas
    Namaste (Offline)

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    #10
    07-17-2015, 04:46 AM
    Remember that your family are all helping you in some way, as you will have pre-incarnative agreements/contracts with them.

    Carla, for instance, was told by Ra that one of her life lessons was to learn to offer love without expectations of return. Perhaps you have a similar challenge in your life. Distance and alone time may help you discover such a notion, and/or help you deal with the catalyst you are generating.

    Until you find, accept and love yourself, you cannot fully love/accept others. Spend as much time as you can accepting and loving yourself for who you are.

    Gaze into a mirror and see the Creator.
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      • Billy
    Billy (Offline)

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    #11
    07-17-2015, 05:24 AM
    Does this have any legitimacy?  Would explain quite a bit, but I imagine it is false.

    http://www.ascensionhelp.com/blog/2013/0...ng-family/

      •
    Namaste (Offline)

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    #12
    07-17-2015, 06:25 AM (This post was last modified: 07-17-2015, 06:26 AM by Namaste.)
    (07-17-2015, 05:24 AM)Folk-love Wrote: Does this have any legitimacy?  Would explain quite a bit, but I imagine it is false.

    http://www.ascensionhelp.com/blog/2013/0...ng-family/

    Disregard. We choose our families and environment in which to learn.

      •
    Nía (Offline)

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    #13
    07-17-2015, 10:07 AM
    Hi Folk-love,

    a completely different, totally human perspective:

    (07-16-2015, 06:20 AM)Folk-love Wrote: I do believe though that as a child my family failed me massively and did not provide me with the love, acceptance, understanding, affection, warmth, wisdom, guidance, help, attention and direction I so sorely craved, nor did they even come close to doing so.

    I have not been there with you and therefore am not able to in any way quantify or qualify what they have done - or rather not done - to you. But in case it would amount to something you could term 'neglect', it would be a severe form of abuse (if a more emotional and psychological than physical, but nevertheless very potent form), and therefore be able to create severe trauma, with all the known consequences. All humans (and many animals) need to be taken care of in the early stages of their lives in exactly the way you seem to have been lacking. So if you feel you have seriously been neglected in that sense, it might very well have caused your feelings and emotional states. Have you ever talked about what you have experienced to someone in detail, ideally in a kind of chronological way? Maybe to a coach/counselor/therapist? Or tried to write it down, chronologically, as far as possible?

    If you don't feel it was 'bad enough' to explain your feelings (regardless of what others think or tell you!) - and I'm not suggesting that, but merely stating it as a possibility - there might also be the option there have been even worse incidents of abuse (emotional, psychological, physical, and/or sexual) that are not available to you in your conscious memory because they have been dissociated due to their severeness and the heaviness of trauma inflicted. Only you can know or find out what the true reasons for your feelings are. Meditation might assist you with that task. Writing memories down might as well. As others have said before me, moving out might also be very helpful in order to clarify your situation; and this would especially be true in the last case, as it's unfortunately very common that one can't remember severe abuse in the presence of perpetrators (sorry for that term in the context of your family...).

    I very much hope my writing was not too personal or bold; please discard anything I have written that does not resonate with you. There are parts of you that know what the reasons are, and your heart and gut feeling might be able to give you a first key to what it might be if you listen closely.

    All the best to you,
    -`ღ´-
    facettes
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      • Nicholas, Billy
    Nía (Offline)

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    #14
    07-17-2015, 10:20 AM
    Off-topic:

    (07-17-2015, 06:25 AM)Namaste Wrote: We choose our families and environment in which to learn.

    Actually, if I piece many parts of information I have been given together, there is no way around assuming that there are people on Earth who strive to interfere with that choice, and successfully so; who actively try to infringe upon our free will and force entities to incarnate into a life and body that they would (probably) not have chosen for themselves. I know it sounds weird and 'heretical'. It's a sensitive issue, and a very complicated and complex one, but some very driven people might really have been successful in bending the rules/Laws to that extent. I will let you know, if interested, if (ever) I will come close enough to something like a proof of that theory.

    So much for now,
    -`ღ´-
    facettes

      •
    Namaste (Offline)

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    #15
    07-17-2015, 11:59 AM
    (07-17-2015, 10:20 AM)facettes Wrote: Off-topic:


    (07-17-2015, 06:25 AM)Namaste Wrote: We choose our families and environment in which to learn.

    Actually, if I piece many parts of information I have been given together, there is no way around assuming that there are people on Earth who strive to interfere with that choice, and successfully so; who actively try to infringe upon our free will and force entities to incarnate into a life and body that they would (probably) not have chosen for themselves. I know it sounds weird and 'heretical'. It's a sensitive issue, and a very complicated and complex one, but some very driven people might really have been successful in bending the rules/Laws to that extent. I will let you know, if interested, if (ever) I will come close enough to something like a proof of that theory.

    So much for now,
    -`ღ´-
    facettes

    The densities in which these choices are made from are disparate; 3D is a plane in which both + and - exist simultaneously, but after that the densities are distinct.

    4/5D- operate in 4/5D-. They don't pop into 4/5/6D+ densities, which would be necessary in order to interfere with the choice to incarnate.

      •
    Nía (Offline)

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    #16
    07-17-2015, 01:09 PM
    Namste,

    (07-17-2015, 11:59 AM)Namaste Wrote: The densities in which these choices are made from are disparate; 3D is a plane in which both + and - exist simultaneously, but after that the densities are distinct.
    4/5D- operate in 4/5D-. They don't pop into 4/5/6D+ densities, which would be necessary in order to interfere with the choice to incarnate.

    many thanks for the explanation. I don't have an understanding of that myself yet, but I very, very, very much hope you are right!

    -`ღ´-
    facettes

      •
    Aion (Offline)

    Sentinel of the LVX Decad
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    #17
    07-17-2015, 01:55 PM (This post was last modified: 07-17-2015, 02:13 PM by Aion.)
    (07-16-2015, 06:20 AM)Folk-love Wrote:
    (07-16-2015, 04:32 AM)anagogy Wrote: Why do you think you feel this way towards them?  What about them does not jive with you?

    I have yet to fully discover the cause of these emotions, which is bothering me greatly.  I can't point to any clear examples of abuse towards me and it almost feels like I am the one with the problem, the blame is entirely on me and I am a bad person for it.  I can't talk to any of them about anything (the very thought of doing so I find repulsive and repugnant with there being vast aversion and resistance) even though they would be willing to hear me out and help me.  I have been given ample opportunity to express how I feel and ask for help ("are you okay?" is a regular question) yet such attempts annoy me and make me want to withdraw even further.  Why?  

    I do believe though that as a child my family failed me massively and did not provide me with the love, acceptance, understanding, affection, warmth, wisdom, guidance, help, attention and direction I so sorely craved, nor did they even come close to doing so.  Can something like that cause such intense feelings of disconnect, aversion and hate even though things are relatively peaceful and good otherwise?  Some people have it so much worse, yet they don't feel like this.  It's almost like I wish they were outwardly abusive towards me and treated me with contempt, then my feelings would be legitimate and I wouldn't have to carry around such guilt.   

    Yeah, it's called resentment. They haven't given you what you expect them to.

      •
    Billy (Offline)

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    #18
    07-17-2015, 09:37 PM
    (07-17-2015, 10:07 AM)facettes Wrote: Hi Folk-love,

    a completely different, totally human perspective:


    (07-16-2015, 06:20 AM)Folk-love Wrote: I do believe though that as a child my family failed me massively and did not provide me with the love, acceptance, understanding, affection, warmth, wisdom, guidance, help, attention and direction I so sorely craved, nor did they even come close to doing so.

    I have not been there with you and therefore am not able to in any way quantify or qualify what they have done - or rather not done - to you. But in case it would amount to something you could term 'neglect', it would be a severe form of abuse (if a more emotional and psychological than physical, but nevertheless very potent form), and therefore be able to create severe trauma, with all the known consequences. All humans (and many animals) need to be taken care of in the early stages of their lives in exactly the way you seem to have been lacking. So if you feel you have seriously been neglected in that sense, it might very well have caused your feelings and emotional states. Have you ever talked about what you have experienced to someone in detail, ideally in a kind of chronological way? Maybe to a coach/counselor/therapist? Or tried to write it down, chronologically, as far as possible?

    If you don't feel it was 'bad enough' to explain your feelings (regardless of what others think or tell you!) - and I'm not suggesting that, but merely stating it as a possibility - there might also be the option there have been even worse incidents of abuse (emotional, psychological, physical, and/or sexual) that are not available to you in your conscious memory because they have been dissociated due to their severeness and the heaviness of trauma inflicted. Only you can know or find out what the true reasons for your feelings are. Meditation might assist you with that task. Writing memories down might as well. As others have said before me, moving out might also be very helpful in order to clarify your situation; and this would especially be true in the last case, as it's unfortunately very common that one can't remember severe abuse in the presence of perpetrators (sorry for that term in the context of your family...).

    I very much hope my writing was not too personal or bold; please discard anything I have written that does not resonate with you. There are parts of you that know what the reasons are, and your heart and gut feeling might be able to give you a first key to what it might be if you listen closely.

    All the best to you,
    -`ღ´-
    facettes

    Thank you for this, I appreciate the honesty and boldness, it is helpful.  I want people to be as honest as possible, as I think it will best help me understand what is going on.  

    I'm going through a period of intense doubt and confusion as to what the cause of these issues are, to the point where it is driving me insane.  A part of me feels as though I am making this all up and/or exaggerating it, which has been further intensified as I talked to my family about this yesterday, and they seemed to be suggesting that perhaps it is my depression talking, and that as a child I wasn't showing such symptoms, although they did remain open to the possibility.  I have been seeing a counselor who has suggested what you are, but I still don't know.  How can I be sure? 

    I feel really, really bad though because I know that my parents tried the best they could, and that any potential abuse or neglect was entirely unconscious, but if they did fail me, then I want to know the truth and not doubt anymore.  Can someone get Ra on the phone?  I need some time/space assistance and guidance.     

      •
    Billy (Offline)

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    #19
    07-17-2015, 09:41 PM (This post was last modified: 07-17-2015, 09:42 PM by Billy.)
    (07-17-2015, 01:55 PM)Farseer Wrote:
    (07-16-2015, 06:20 AM)Folk-love Wrote:
    (07-16-2015, 04:32 AM)anagogy Wrote: Why do you think you feel this way towards them?  What about them does not jive with you?

    I have yet to fully discover the cause of these emotions, which is bothering me greatly.  I can't point to any clear examples of abuse towards me and it almost feels like I am the one with the problem, the blame is entirely on me and I am a bad person for it.  I can't talk to any of them about anything (the very thought of doing so I find repulsive and repugnant with there being vast aversion and resistance) even though they would be willing to hear me out and help me.  I have been given ample opportunity to express how I feel and ask for help ("are you okay?" is a regular question) yet such attempts annoy me and make me want to withdraw even further.  Why?  

    I do believe though that as a child my family failed me massively and did not provide me with the love, acceptance, understanding, affection, warmth, wisdom, guidance, help, attention and direction I so sorely craved, nor did they even come close to doing so.  Can something like that cause such intense feelings of disconnect, aversion and hate even though things are relatively peaceful and good otherwise?  Some people have it so much worse, yet they don't feel like this.  It's almost like I wish they were outwardly abusive towards me and treated me with contempt, then my feelings would be legitimate and I wouldn't have to carry around such guilt.   

    Yeah, it's called resentment. They haven't given you what you expect them to.

    Can that explain such severe disconnect and aversion?  I just keep coming back to the idea that other people have had it so much worse, yet they don't feel the way I do and remain close to their families.  I know we are all different, but maybe I expected too much from my family.  It's almost like I needed them to be extremely loving, affectionate and close knit.  Is that not asking too much and being unrealistic? 

      •
    Billy (Offline)

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    #20
    07-17-2015, 09:45 PM
    (07-17-2015, 11:59 AM)Namaste Wrote:
    (07-17-2015, 10:20 AM)facettes Wrote: Off-topic:



    (07-17-2015, 06:25 AM)Namaste Wrote: We choose our families and environment in which to learn.

    Actually, if I piece many parts of information I have been given together, there is no way around assuming that there are people on Earth who strive to interfere with that choice, and successfully so; who actively try to infringe upon our free will and force entities to incarnate into a life and body that they would (probably) not have chosen for themselves. I know it sounds weird and 'heretical'. It's a sensitive issue, and a very complicated and complex one, but some very driven people might really have been successful in bending the rules/Laws to that extent. I will let you know, if interested, if (ever) I will come close enough to something like a proof of that theory.

    So much for now,
    -`ღ´-
    facettes

    The densities in which these choices are made from are disparate; 3D is a plane in which both + and - exist simultaneously, but after that the densities are distinct.

    4/5D- operate in 4/5D-. They don't pop into 4/5/6D+ densities, which would be necessary in order to interfere with the choice to incarnate.

    The article seems to be suggesting that the 'switch' takes place in 3rd density as the soul is attempting to enter into the fetus.  

      •
    Aion (Offline)

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    #21
    07-17-2015, 10:17 PM (This post was last modified: 07-17-2015, 10:18 PM by Aion.)
    (07-17-2015, 09:41 PM)Folk-love Wrote:
    (07-17-2015, 01:55 PM)Farseer Wrote:
    (07-16-2015, 06:20 AM)Folk-love Wrote:
    (07-16-2015, 04:32 AM)anagogy Wrote: Why do you think you feel this way towards them?  What about them does not jive with you?

    I have yet to fully discover the cause of these emotions, which is bothering me greatly.  I can't point to any clear examples of abuse towards me and it almost feels like I am the one with the problem, the blame is entirely on me and I am a bad person for it.  I can't talk to any of them about anything (the very thought of doing so I find repulsive and repugnant with there being vast aversion and resistance) even though they would be willing to hear me out and help me.  I have been given ample opportunity to express how I feel and ask for help ("are you okay?" is a regular question) yet such attempts annoy me and make me want to withdraw even further.  Why?  

    I do believe though that as a child my family failed me massively and did not provide me with the love, acceptance, understanding, affection, warmth, wisdom, guidance, help, attention and direction I so sorely craved, nor did they even come close to doing so.  Can something like that cause such intense feelings of disconnect, aversion and hate even though things are relatively peaceful and good otherwise?  Some people have it so much worse, yet they don't feel like this.  It's almost like I wish they were outwardly abusive towards me and treated me with contempt, then my feelings would be legitimate and I wouldn't have to carry around such guilt.   

    Yeah, it's called resentment. They haven't given you what you expect them to.

    Can that explain such severe disconnect and aversion?  I just keep coming back to the idea that other people have had it so much worse, yet they don't feel the way I do and remain close to their families.  I know we are all different, but maybe I expected too much from my family.  It's almost like I needed them to be extremely loving, affectionate and close knit.  Is that not asking too much and being unrealistic? 

    Well how important are those things to you and what do you think it is like on their side of things?

    I might ask if you feel you give that which you expect to receive? If not it could be a reflection that you yourself are not meeting your own expectations.

      •
    Nía (Offline)

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    #22
    07-18-2015, 04:50 AM
    Dear Folk-love,

    not much time, so a short one, starting with what you wrote to Farseer:

    (07-17-2015, 09:41 PM)Folk-love Wrote: Can that explain such severe disconnect and aversion?

    That's exactly what I meant with listening to your heart/gut feeling. There seems to be a feeling that there is more which you can't get a grip on (yet), that's why you keep asking that yourself. To my experience with survivors of organized abuse, this points to the suggestion there might be more than you know right now. It doesn't have to, but it is possible. The problem is: You will only get to know what really happened when the time/space is right, when you are prepared for what might be coming. So moving out might be absolutely necessary to progress in that direction. And allowing yourself to think out of the box... everyone who had to survive any kind of abuse must face some unpleasant facts about the perps they at first all don't want to know/acknowledge (it hurts!). Things might be different than you thought/wanted to believe. You must also be ready for that, as it might bring even more suffering for a while. And knowing about Ra's teachings, it is even more difficult, as you know, at soul level, they are not perpetrators, that in sum 'all is well', which is very, very difficult to integrate with a knowledge and the emotional and psychological consequences of abuse and suffering at the hands of human other-selves. No-one can appreciate a catalyst that would bring immense suffering, like torture and/or abuse. It can only be done in retrospection, once it is properly worked through and a good deal of healing has been accomplished.

    (07-17-2015, 09:41 PM)Folk-love Wrote: I just keep coming back to the idea that other people have had it so much worse, yet they don't feel the way I do and remain close to their families.

    All you need to know is, that whatever has been done or not done to you, it was bad enough for yourself to suffer and cause what you're experiencing now. You are all, all are you, so this means it was as bad as anything that happened to others who feel the same, and loving and accepting yourself also means to acknowledge to yourself that it is OK to feel like you do, that it is natural to feel like you do, whatever the reasons are. And then, again, you right now can't even be sure how much worse other people have had it.

    (07-17-2015, 09:41 PM)Folk-love Wrote: I know we are all different, but maybe I expected too much from my family.  It's almost like I needed them to be extremely loving, affectionate and close knit.  Is that not asking too much and being unrealistic?

    That's exactly what even survivors of extreme abuse say for years and years as the true facts about their past surface. Self-doubt and self-blaming are very, very common (and oftentimes instilled by perps), but won't help to get closer to the truth, and they don't help with healing as well. You are feeling like you are for a absolutely serious reason. You have not been born feeling like this. Maybe the first step is to accept just that. There's nothing wrong with you.

    Ah, I'll reply to the rest of what you wrote, too, it just seems to important.

    (07-17-2015, 09:37 PM)Folk-love Wrote: A part of me feels as though I am making this all up and/or exaggerating it, which has been further intensified as I talked to my family about this yesterday, and they seemed to be suggesting that perhaps it is my depression talking, and that as a child I wasn't showing such symptoms, although they did remain open to the possibility.

    Downplaying and blaming the messenger are unfortunately the most typical responses to what you have tried to get across yesterday (hats off!). It sounds all too well known... Where did that depression come from in the first place? When did it start? When was the first time in your life that you have been depressed? Don't tell me, just think about it for yourself, there might be a clue hidden in the depression(s) as well. It is a common post-traumatic symptom (and no chemical imbalance, that is only the effect). May I ask to which possibility they remained open?

    (07-17-2015, 09:37 PM)Folk-love Wrote: I have been seeing a counselor who has suggested what you are, but I still don't know.  How can I be sure?

    You might want to take the power back to you (I know, it is very frustrating to not know). Still, no one can tell you but yourself. You know it already, but for some reason it can't be brought to consciousness yet. The counselor can't know, but they have a bunch of experiences about what symptoms/emotions are with a certain likelihood caused by what kind of experiences. Again, I don't want to suggest that - but you yourself should remain open to the possibility, and all the truth (for now, human terms) you will have to face once you begin to know. If you can't see this one or another counselor anymore, try meditating on it, try writing things down, talk about it to safe people - and if you can, don't avoid hurting thoughts and memories, because that tells parts of you that you are not yet ready to face the even more hurtful things that might be there.

    I am wishing you from the depth of my heart that nothing really bad will come up, and am sending you lots of love to assist with the task of finding out.

    (07-17-2015, 09:37 PM)Folk-love Wrote: Can someone get Ra on the phone?  I need some time/space assistance and guidance.    

    How about you own helpers (your heart, gut feeling, unconscious, memory...), Helpers and Guides? Heart

    All my best wishes,
    -`ღ´-
    facettes
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      • Nicholas
    Billy (Offline)

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    #23
    07-18-2015, 05:35 AM (This post was last modified: 07-18-2015, 05:39 AM by Billy.)
    Thanks again for the reply facettes, I appreciate the assistance.  Talking yesterday with family, I was shown that they are open to the idea that there may be something in my childhood which is causing my feelings, and they were rather nice about it, which just makes me doubt things even further.  If there was something in my childhood I feel that it would have come up by now, as I have been probing around for a few months, but to no real avail.  

    I feel that maybe I have mistakenly gotten this idea in my head and have been trying to pattern or mold my thoughts and feelings around it, thereby creating memories and thoughts which are false.  The fair point was raised that if I was neglected as a child I would have shown symptoms, which I apparently didn't as I still played with my brothers and sister, and was social (to some extent at least).  

    I feel rather embarrassed and stupid now, as I am starting to think that maybe I have got this all wrong and that my emotions stem from elsewhere.  I have been feeling quite sick over the last few days, I wonder if that means anything. I will be seeing a psychologist soon, and hopefully with their assistance, I can gain come clarity on these issues.

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    Nía (Offline)

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    #24
    07-18-2015, 06:29 AM (This post was last modified: 07-18-2015, 06:36 AM by Nía.)
    Hey,

    (07-18-2015, 05:35 AM)Folk-love Wrote: Talking yesterday with family, I was shown that they are open to the idea that there may be something in my childhood which is causing my feelings, and they were rather nice about it, which just makes me doubt things even further.

    Let me play the devil's advocate: What if they think/hope this would be the best way for them to get to know what you remember once you know? Or what if they knew you would doubt yourself even further if they didn't bluntly reject anything, as they knew you strongly suspect/feel/know there is something anyway?

    Seriously, I absolutely don't want to talk you into something, if the reason is another (maybe someone else, and your parents looked the other way/didn't protect you), or nothing worse than what you have written happened to you (which, again, is bad enough), then it should still be possible to find out. Try to remember as much as you can of your childhood, I know I'm being redundant, and write it down chronologically, as much as possible. The more you write down, the more you will remember. Writing is immensely helpful, as it helps the brain to 'sort' things and create a consistent memory, which in turn helps finding possible 'black spots'.

    (07-18-2015, 05:35 AM)Folk-love Wrote: If there was something in my childhood I feel that it would have come up by now, as I have been probing around for a few months, but to no real avail[.

    Is this your heart/gut feeling talking, or your mind? If you really feel like this, then it will be so. But otherwise I have to disappoint you: It can take much longer than a few months for bad things to come up. After all, they are well hidden for a good reason (because you under the current circumstances couldn't live with them), so to be able to rise to consciousness, something about those circumstances has to change first. Maybe that your parents are around. Maybe someone else. Maybe you don't feel secure enough, maybe you don't have enough assistance (of friends etc.) to catch you if you stumble. I don't know what it is, but you could think about what it might be and try to improve the circumstances that bother you the most. Probing around on your own unfortunately isn't very effective, in this regard.

    (07-18-2015, 05:35 AM)Folk-love Wrote: I feel that maybe I have mistakenly gotten this idea in my head and have been trying to pattern or mold my thoughts and feelings around it, thereby creating memories and thoughts which are false.

    Again you write of feelings - are they really feelings, or thoughts? This will give you another clue in what direction to look. But let me assure you, it is very, very rare that someone makes up thoughts; feelings and emotions are reactions to something and not experiences in the first place, and it is almost impossible to create false memories. You might know there is a big debate going on about those in the US, started by a very potent group of perpetrators, but real false memories are so rare the idea is almost dismissible.

    (07-18-2015, 05:35 AM)Folk-love Wrote: The fair point was raised that if I was neglected as a child I would have shown symptoms, which I apparently didn't as I still played with my brothers and sister, and was social (to some extent at least).

    Is this what they say, that you were social and didn't show any symptoms, or what you remember? Still playing with siblings is no proof of anything, even children that have been abused to the worst extent do that, if allowed. Do you remember how you felt and acted at the time? Do you remember feeling 'normal', healthy, happy as a child? What about other symptoms, when did the depressions set in? And why, if you don't remember anything now (if...), wouldn't the same issues have been dissociated as a child already? If you couldn't live with it now, you most likely couldn't have lived with it as a totally dependent and helpless child as well. That's what dissociation is for: That the child can continue to live a rather 'normal' life, despite all what has happened/is happening to him....

    (07-18-2015, 05:35 AM)Folk-love Wrote: I feel rather embarrassed and stupid now, as I am starting to think that maybe I have got this all wrong and that my emotions stem from elsewhere.

    Don't (if it was that easy!). You're just trying to make sense of rather overwhelming emotions, and that's perfectly fine. If the stem from elsewhere, this 'elsewhere' must have been as bad to cause them. So whatever the source is, it's something serious.

    (07-18-2015, 05:35 AM)Folk-love Wrote: I have been feeling quite sick over the last few days, I wonder if that means anything.

    Hm, not suggesting anything, but again that's a very common trait once one comes too close (to the perpetrators liking) to something they shouldn't remember (it keeps things down for you try to avoid that feeling). But maybe it's just your fear of publicly (well) being unjust towards your parents or something like that? Do you remember when exactly you started to feel sick? You might want to try paying close attention to things like this, when they start, when they get better etc. And try to pay attention to emotions/feelings in general, especially if they don't seem 'normal' or natural at the time you experience them. What 'triggered' them? What makes them go away?
     
    (07-18-2015, 05:35 AM)Folk-love Wrote: I will be seeing a psychologist soon, and hopefully with their assistance, I can gain come clarity on these issues.

    That's very good to hear. Very much keeping fingers crossed and hoping that someone intentionally and sympathetically empathetically listening will help you see more clearly soon.

    You don't have to reply anymore now, take your time, think about it and look inwards and watch your feelings and emotions. Your resistance right now (physically and psychologically) seem to suggest you will know more soon. But you can't force it, it just doesn't work like this.

    All the best!

    -`ღ´-
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      • Nicholas, Billy
    Aion (Offline)

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    #25
    07-18-2015, 10:30 AM
    All the power to you, Folk-Love!
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      • Minyatur
    AnthroHeart (Offline)

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    #26
    07-18-2015, 03:44 PM
    I love my mother, but I'm afraid she may betray me one day.
    She sometimes blackmails me.

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    Minyatur (Offline)

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    #27
    07-18-2015, 04:22 PM
    (07-18-2015, 03:44 PM)IndigoGeminiWolf Wrote: I love my mother, but I'm afraid she may betray me one day.
    She sometimes blackmails me.

    Be strong friend.
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      • AnthroHeart
    AnthroHeart (Offline)

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    #28
    07-18-2015, 04:24 PM (This post was last modified: 07-18-2015, 04:26 PM by AnthroHeart.)
    (07-18-2015, 04:22 PM)Elros Tar-Minyatur Wrote:
    (07-18-2015, 03:44 PM)IndigoGeminiWolf Wrote: I love my mother, but I'm afraid she may betray me one day.
    She sometimes blackmails me.

    Be strong friend.

    Thanks. I've been providing for her, but I have to keep it up else I could get into trouble because we wouldn't be able to pay our debts.

    I'm strong though.
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      • Minyatur, Nicholas
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