Correspondence Between Densities and Traditional Planes of Existence

[Infinite]

Hi. I have some doubts about the relationship of the planes of existence of the esoteric philosophies (Theosophy, Gnosis, etc.) and the densities. This is my vision:

Physical Plane - 3D
Eteric Plane - 4D
Astral and Mental Planes - 5D
Causal Plane - 6D
Buddhic Plane - 7D
Atmic Plane = 8D or Dimensional re-fusion?

I feel that this is not correct. Anyone have any ideia? Thanks. Peace, love and light

[BlatzAdict]

Hi. I have some doubts about the relationship of the planes of existence of the esoteric philosophies (Theosophy, Gnosis, etc.) and the densities. This is my vision:

Physical Plane - 3D
Eteric Plane - 4D
Astral and Mental Planes - 5D
Causal Plane - 6D
Buddhic Plane - 7D
Atmic Plane = 8D or Dimensional re-fusion?

I feel that this is not correct. Anyone have any ideia? Thanks. Peace, love and light

more like 3d has a physical plane and an astral plane overlaid. as a vibration somewhat inbetween 3rd and 4th.
4D has a physical plane and an astral plane etc. 60 % spiritual 40% physical matter
5D same thing 80% spiritual matter 20% physical
6D 100% spiritual matter
7D merging back to creator and beginning next octave.
8D being a planet or a star

This is just my take of my observations.

[anagogy]

Hi. I have some doubts about the relationship of the planes of existence of the esoteric philosophies (Theosophy, Gnosis, etc.) and the densities. This is my vision:

Physical Plane - 3D
Eteric Plane - 4D
Astral and Mental Planes - 5D
Causal Plane - 6D
Buddhic Plane - 7D
Atmic Plane = 8D or Dimensional re-fusion?

I feel that this is not correct. Anyone have any ideia? Thanks. Peace, love and light

Yes.


Red Ray = Physical Plane/Prime Material/This is also the Etheric Plane (as is commonly referenced in occult literature -- not the version Ra was talking about). This is the most congealed manifestation of form, or tangibility.
Orange Ray = Lower Astral Plane (Selfish Vibrations/Vibrations Concerning Self/Lust/Personal Power/Lower Emotional Realm)
Yellow Ray = Middle Astral Plane (Awareness of difference between Self and Other/Societal Vibrations/Personhood in relationship to groups of entities/this is where you begin to see astral cities or conglomerations of souls living together/Lower mental plane.)
Green Ray = Higher Astral Plane (Awareness of others vibrations/empathy/understanding of what another is experiencing/unconditional love/astral heaven type worlds/awareness of harmony/higher emotional plane).
Blue Ray = Devachanic Plane/Mental Plane/vibrations of free communication and pure conceptual ideals/repository of the "pure vibrations" of a thing at a conceptual level/conceptual archetypes after which every further instance of a particular idea is a patternization of, i.e., Plato's ideas of "ideal forms")
Indigo Ray = Causal Plane (Awareness of self as an expression of Intelligent Energy/awareness of self as creator/what Ra called the "etheric body" or the place where light is given form. Think of it as an "eye" or "shutter" that focuses light, giving it form, which is why it is the primal Form Maker.
Violet Ray = Buddhic Plane or alternatively the "Atmic Plane" or the level of 'Christ Consciousness'. Realm of wholeness, and awareness of connection with everything. This is where the m/b/s totality resides. An awareness of the totality of experiential balance. This is the most intangible and "not constrained by form" level.

It is far more useful to think of occult planes and bodies in terms of their Rays, or vibrational architecture, than it is to think of them in terms of their occult names, which are matched and mismatched over and over by different occult teachers. However, I have correlated them as best I presently can to their occult terminology.

Each density exists within all the rays, yet each has a "native" vibration, or plane, that it is naturally attracted to (the plane, or subdensity, where the consciousness of that density naturally gravitates to). The "native plane" of 1st density is the subdensity that most closely correlates with it, which is Red Ray. So the native plane of 1st density is the Physical Plane. However, every 1st density object, like say, a rock, exists in all the other rays as well. It has all the ascendingly balanced bodies, or vibrational levels, to its consciousness just as everything does. So even a rock as a lower astral component, a middle astral component, a higher astral component, devachanic, causal, and buddhic component. It contains all the intelligence levels and vehicles from dense to fine. So similarly, the "native plane" of 2nd density is the orange ray Lower Astral. So when a 2d beings physical form deteriorates, and the aggregates of consciousness lose integration, the vibrational level that its consciousness gravitates towards naturally, or "settles to" is the lower astral plane, which is very "animalistic" consciousness. That is where it feels most comfortable. 

Everything has all the levels. However, the ability for a given perspective of consciousness to utilize the planes increases with density level. This is why your 3rd density chemical body is more complexly patternized than a 1st density chemical body, for example. You also have a more complex astral manifestation/devachanic/etc. manifestation and so on up the planes. The more complex the consciousness, the more complex the patternization or manifestation in each plane of existence. So while you can visit all the planes, no matter what density level you are because it is part and parcel of your 'consciousness continuum', your ability to 'take in' that continuum increases with each density. For example, as a human being, you could learn to inhabit the Buddhic Body or Violet Ray plane. However, your ability to take in that light, would not compare to a 7th density beings ability to 'take in' the light of that level. A higher density being has more complex vehicles in all of the planes, be they physical or any other plane. 

Your density level is a measure of vibrational distance from the One or Prime Unity. That distance is measured in terms of distortion, falsity, or illusion. Your level of distortion, or density, is how much of the creators light, or intelligent infinity, you are filtering, or warping, to your perspective. 

"The source of all distortions is the limit of the viewpoint."

The 8th level is infinity itself. It is the absolute, and it has no vibrational level. It has no distortion. It is Beingness itself. "all begins and ends in mystery". It is the sound of silence. Whereas the rays have relative vibrational pitches or frequencies, the 8th has no frequency and yet, it embodies or contains all frequencies. But everything cancels out in the absolute, except that which cannot be canceled out: Pure Awareness, or Pure Light, or however you want to conceptualize the essential fabric of existence itself. Pure Intelligent Unity.

[AnthroHeart]

Is the 2nd density of the next octave "beyond" infinity? Or is it a whole nother infinity?

[anagogy]

Is the 2nd density of the next octave "beyond" infinity? Or is it a whole nother infinity?

Neither. It is the same infinity (there's only one infinity--unity contains all). It is always the same infinity, just a different refraction of the light of that infinity. One white light being filtered through a different prism each time, which distorts it into the seven rays. Rays are essentially "types" of experiences, or perspectives of consciousness available in infinity. So any creation, or exploration of light, is going to fall into one of those "categories".

The 2nd density of the 'next octave' is simply another focus, or crystallization, of orange ray, or lower astral consciousness (personal consciousness). Every octave is another manifestation of the same rays, but the specifics of how they crystallize will be different. So every octave is going to have a physical/astral/mental/causal/buddhic manifestation. They are simply the natural continuum between the formless and the formed, the intangible and the tangible. The actual forms themselves will be unique, however, just as every snowflake has similar characteristics but is ultimately unique.

2nd density is identification with orange ray, which becomes the perspective, or filter, through which the other rays are then interpreted. So a 2nd density being will see physicality through the eyes of orange ray, and will see the lower astral through the eyes of orange ray, it would see the middle astral through the eyes of orange ray, and so on up the rays. Your density level, or ray that you are identified with, colors everything you perceive to "fit in" to that particular interpretation of reality.

[Verum Occultum]

Yes.

Very deep and well said, my friend. I am wondering what communication is like at higher true-color levels. My understanding is that 5th density is purely mental, which means that some 5D creations, for example, theatre plays, would not be held upon a stage per se, but in environmental/emotional realities/contexts of the idea of the play itself. That is, environments would be created instantaneously (mentally) and everyone (the "audience") would experience the intense emotions of the play & expand their emotional realities and discover something new, contributing to the entire play. It would not happen linearly, but in circles of polycontextual time intensities. There would be explosions of momentary impressions and ecstasy. This is difficult to explain.

Then, at higher levels, information is processed so vastly that interpretations of entire universes/creations are exchanged/communicated. But the communications are so fine-nuanced that they reveal a sense of personality where there are multitudinous melodies of beauty and immense associations. Personality is a poor word in defining this. I mean it in a multidimensional sense, because information/communication comes in "packages". And such a package would include data in extreme intensity, yet it would be perceived in one "moment" (which might be why the concept and experience of time is so different in 3D). What is your concept of communication in higher densities? How far can your imagination take you, my friend?

Ps. funny thing: sometimes when I ride my bike with my hands off the handlebar, I wish I could separate my consciousness to different focuses and multitask in a way that many books would float around the area of my head and I could read them simultaneously with super-speed. Then I imagine people's potential reactions to that situation  

[anagogy]

Then, at higher levels, information is processed so vastly that interpretations of entire universes/creations are exchanged/communicated. But the communications are so fine-nuanced that they reveal a sense of personality where there are multitudinous melodies of beauty and immense associations. Personality is a poor word in defining this. I mean it in a multidimensional sense, because information/communication comes in "packages". And such a package would include data in extreme intensity, yet it would be perceived in one "moment" (which might be why the concept and experience of time is so different in 3D). What is your concept of communication in higher densities? How far can your imagination take you, my friend?

I'm not sure how, precisely, a 5D being experiences its native true color ray, in its native true color plane, but I'm absolutely positive that the level and quality of information exchanged, leaves what we know of as "communication" utterly behind as a primitive and crudely hewn husk of what they have come to understand as "free communication". What little understanding I have of the devachanic realm indicates that in that realm you can, quite literally, become the prime archetypal concept of a thing. For example, you could "become" the concept of "freedom" or the concept of "beauty" or "joy" or "exhilaration". You could see the mental vibrational architecture of the archetypes of your density and how they shape and nuance the consciousness indwelling therein. You could see its shaping effect on the mind and spirit in the same way that in our realm you can easily see the shaping effect a glass pitcher has on the particular liquid contained within it. If you engage in communication with any being in that realm you temporarily merge with them, become them, know exactly what they know, and depart. You communicate by absorbing the energy presence of the other soul (this is true of many nonphysical realms and other densities but the difference is that in 5D, you FULLY take the vibration in, and see it from the others perspective, without your own distortions clouding perception of their perceptions).

All experiences are available for instant download in that realm at the slightest whim, with your unique and signature individuality as a soul still intact. Our internet, majestic though it may be, cannot even begin to compare in terms of the available entertainment, information, and inspiration of that place. In that realm, creativity is on instant tap as simply and readily available as oxygen is in our realm. Inhale, and there it is. The red ray plane or manifestation of a 5D entity would make our 3D concept of 'lofty sensuous beauty' look like a child's plaything by comparison, and their native blue ray nonphysical plane would be equally majestic but lacking in tangible vibrational characteristics, which is difficult for beings, such as us, who mostly only have tangible references and conceptions of "reality" to understand.  

[Verum Occultum]

That sounds awesome. I think that anything & everything that we could possibly imagine is possible and more. The thought of it alone makes me super-excited

[Infinite]

I've a doubt. Density and dimension are the same concept? Cause Ra used the two words. Example:

Questioner: I think this might be an appropriate time to include a little
more background on yourself, possibly information having to do with
where you came from prior to your involvement with planet Earth, if this is
possible.

Ra: I am Ra. I am, with the social memory complex of which I am a part,
one of those who voyaged outward from another planet within your own
solar system, as this entity would call it. The planetary influence was that
you call Venus. We are a race old in your measures. When we were at the
sixth dimension our physical beings were what you would call golden. We
were tall and somewhat delicate. Our physical body complex covering,
which you call the integument, had a golden luster.

Questioner: Of what density level is Ra?

Ra: I am Ra. I am sixth density with a strong seeking towards seventh
density. The harvest for us will be in only approximately two and one-half
million of your years and it is our desire to be ready for harvest as it
approaches in our space/time continuum.

And here, Ra used the two words in the same reply:

Questioner: How were you able to make the transition from Venus? Did
you have to change your dimension to walk upon the Earth?

Ra: I am Ra. You will remember the exercise of the wind. The dissolution
into nothingness is the dissolution into unity, for there is no nothingness.
From the sixth dimension, we are capable of manipulating, by thought, the
intelligent infinity present in each particle of light or distorted light so that
we were able to clothe ourselves in a replica visible in the third density of
our mind/body/spirit complexes in the sixth density. We were allowed this
experiment by the Council which guards this planet.

Peace, love and light.

[anagogy]

Ra occasionally used the terms interchangeably. Is that an issue for you? I think they used it in the more general sense of "domain/dimension of experience", rather than in a '90 degree perpendicular euclidean spatial directional' sense, though its possible they were also referencing spatial directions considering they spoke of 4D beings slingshot traveling through time/space by utilizing a portion of a tesseract (4D cube).

[Matt1]

I think part of the problem is that most occultists are basically using a personalized system for mapping the creation. The most common are from Theosophy and some offshoots of that group such as Alice Baily. I recall Ra basically corresponding the first 3 energy centers to different states of physical being, Red being elemental, Orange being the physical without consciousness awareness of self and the yellow being a self aware being.

The green ray being the astral plane, the blue ray being the devachanic , the indigo being the etheral (which seems to be the the most shocking of all as most people correspond the etheric plane as the plane above physical reality, on the tree of life this is Yesod) The buddic plane being the violet ray.

I find some of the terminology quite confusing in some regards such as different levels of the astral, being lower, middle and high, this seems to be a little bit overly detailed? Considering most people don't normally have conscious awareness of the astral plane, unless this is to suggest the level of adeptship being that the various occult adepts are truly beyond the standard scope of awareness.

On a personal level i find it interesting to note that it might be worth while to simply have a physical plane and the astral plane? That way a realistic approach to occultism may be practiced, with a goal in mind of consciously accessing the inner planes through the discipline of occultism and being back concrete experiences. This calls to mind Ra's structure of the mind, the conscious, the racial mind and the cosmic mind. The practice being meditation to still the conscious mind enough to access the akashic records/astral.

[anagogy]

I think part of the problem is that most occultists are basically using a personalized system for mapping the creation. The most common are from Theosophy and some offshoots of that group such as Alice Baily. I recall Ra basically corresponding the first 3 energy centers to different states of physical being, Red being elemental, Orange being the physical without consciousness awareness of self and the yellow being a self aware being.

In my opinion, this is just one small aspect of these rays. The first couple of rays definitely have an orientation towards the physical or tangible world, but they can manifest in other realms as well. For example, when they spoke of ghosts they talked about orange and yellow ray activations after death. And even red ray is not wholly physical (in the sense that we ordinarily conceptualize physical) as part of the red ray cycle is learning to *become* space/time, as it dwells in timeless chaos in the beginning. That's one of the lessons of its consciousness in its density.

The green ray being the astral plane, the blue ray being the devachanic , the indigo being the etheral (which seems to be the the most shocking of all as most people correspond the etheric plane as the plane above physical reality, on the tree of life this is Yesod) The buddic plane being the violet ray.

Yes, the occult terminology can be very confusing, which is why I think it is important to spend a considerable amount of time getting a visceral intuitive feeling of the "vibrational texture" (for lack of better word) of each of the rays (and associated planes). Then you don't have to rely on the confusing occult nomenclature which get assigned and resigned to various levels based on the intellectual whims of various teachers.

I find some of the terminology quite confusing in some regards such as different levels of the astral, being lower, middle and high, this seems to be a little bit overly detailed? Considering most people don't normally have conscious awareness of the astral plane, unless this is to suggest the level of adeptship being that the various occult adepts are truly beyond the standard scope of awareness.

Yeah, I thought that was an overly detailed response as well when I first read the Ra material and they spoke of lower/middle/higher astral planes. In retrospect, I appreciate that they went to that place of seemingly over detail because it made me ask a lot of questions to myself about *why* they would do that. It's honestly one of my favorite things about the Ra material -- how Ra would inadvertently answer a question by giving extraneous details that were simultaneously both bizarre and yet you got a sort of otherworldly sense it was absolutely dead true as well. I think one of the reasons they went to that extra nuance of detail in regards the astral planes is partially due to the fact that there is a relatively large difference between the lower, middle, and higher astral planes. Like, they might as well be completely different realms (in fact, in my opinion they kinda are). It is only the arbitrary occult nomenclature that gives them a superficial degree of similarity. They could just as well have been named: yesod, netzach, and tiperath (these are just random attributions as an example) and then we would see them as different realms rather than "astral planes" (which tends to make one conceptualize them as all the same "thing").  To be fair, they do share a lot of similarities with each other (referring to the lower/middle/higher astral) but the differences are pronounced as well -- similar to the differences between the consciousness of animals and human beings and 4D aliens. All the planes are essentially "spheres of attention". Even the physical. Similarities? Yes. Differences? Yes, also.

On a personal level i find it interesting to note that it might be worth while to simply have a physical plane and the astral plane? That way a realistic approach to occultism may be practiced, with a goal in mind of consciously accessing the inner planes through the discipline of occultism and being back concrete experiences. This calls to mind Ra's structure of the mind, the conscious, the racial mind and the cosmic mind. The practice being meditation to still the conscious mind enough to access the akashic records/astral.

I think that simple binary approach would be good for someone just starting out, but after a time, you can't help but notice different levels and nuances of vibration or texture. It is like leafing through a book with your eyes closed, and at first your hands aren't sensitive enough to detect the individual fine cut pages, so you inadvertently grab multiple pages at a time when you go to flip them, and then after a time, you eventually begin to develop the sensitivity required to feel each individual split and feel the place where each page parts. That's a rough analogy, but it fits fairly well.

[Infinite]

I was really asking for a answer about the correspondence bewteen the densities and the planes. So, in this moment the sincronicity answered me and I found an interesting text. Second the source I was right in my first post:

Physical Plane - 3D
Eteric Plane - 4D
Astral and Mental Planes - 5D
Causal Plane - 6D
Buddhic Plane - 7D
Atmic Plane = 8D or Dimensional re-fusion?

Here is the text (a passage from the book "The Extraterrestrial Vision" by Gina Lake):

Nonphysical and Extraterrestrial Helpers

Before going into this, it might be helpful to clarify who we are and who we mean by "nonphysical beings." Nonphysical beings include fifth-density beings (spirit guides and others on the higher astral plane), sixth-density beings (spirit teachers and others on the causal plane, the plane beyond the astral), and seventh density beings (beings on the buddhic plane, the plane beyond the causal).We are a sixth-density entity on the mid-causal plane, where both teachers for people on Earth and guides to spirit guides can be found.
Just as spirit guides are assigned to each of you, we are assigned to watch over the work of several spirit guides. We teach them how to improve their work with people. We are particularly involved with spirit guides who are working with Star People and Walk-ins, since their work relates most to Earth's transformation. Similarly, seventh density beings oversee the work we sixth-density beings are doing.

5D = higher astral plane
6D = causal plane
7D = buddhic plane

So, I suppose that 3D is physical plane and 4D is etheric plane. All this make much sense.

Peace, love and light.

[Infinite]

The practice being meditation to still the conscious mind enough to access the akashic records/astral.

How do you know that akashic records is the same of astral plane?

[Infinite]

Red Ray = Physical Plane/Prime Material/This is also the Etheric Plane (as is commonly referenced in occult literature -- not the version Ra was talking about). This is the most congealed manifestation of form, or tangibility.
Orange Ray = Lower Astral Plane (Selfish Vibrations/Vibrations Concerning Self/Lust/Personal Power/Lower Emotional Realm)
Yellow Ray = Middle Astral Plane (Awareness of difference between Self and Other/Societal Vibrations/Personhood in relationship to groups of entities/this is where you begin to see astral cities or conglomerations of souls living together/Lower mental plane.)
Green Ray = Higher Astral Plane (Awareness of others vibrations/empathy/understanding of what another is experiencing/unconditional love/astral heaven type worlds/awareness of harmony/higher emotional plane).
Blue Ray = Devachanic Plane/Mental Plane/vibrations of free communication and pure conceptual ideals/repository of the "pure vibrations" of a thing at a conceptual level/conceptual archetypes after which every further instance of a particular idea is a patternization of, i.e., Plato's ideas of "ideal forms")
Indigo Ray = Causal Plane (Awareness of self as an expression of Intelligent Energy/awareness of self as creator/what Ra called the "etheric body" or the place where light is given form. Think of it as an "eye" or "shutter" that focuses light, giving it form, which is why it is the primal Form Maker.
Violet Ray = Buddhic Plane or alternatively the "Atmic Plane" or the level of 'Christ Consciousness'. Realm of wholeness, and awareness of connection with everything. This is where the m/b/s totality resides. An awareness of the totality of experiential balance. This is the most intangible and "not constrained by form" level.

Ra said astral body is the body of green-ray, but only the pure beings can access the higher astral plane. Do you have any idea to solve that apparent contradiction?

[Nau7ik]

Inner and outer. Inner planes are astral and consist of sub densities. The outer and the inner planes are intimately connected. So the higher astral of 3D would be where inner planes teachers reside, or saints or adepts or angels (third density, green ray sub density time/space—3.4-3.7). The fourth density green ray physical vehicle is like a physical light body, which is often called the vehicle for the astral—the light body. That’s how I understand it. So the 4D entity is capable of travel in the physical space/time and the metaphysical time/space. And so are we if we develop and refine our light bodies. It’s just that it’s natural for the 4D entity compared to the 3D entity who is young in self awareness.

[Infinite]

Inner and outer. Inner planes are astral and consist of sub densities. The outer and the inner planes are intimately connected. So the higher astral of 3D would be where inner planes teachers reside, or saints or adepts or angels (third density, green ray sub density time/space—3.4-3.7). The fourth density green ray physical vehicle is like a physical light body, which is often called the vehicle for the astral—the light body. That’s how I understand it. So the 4D entity is capable of travel in the physical space/time and the metaphysical time/space. And so are we if we develop and refine our light bodies. It’s just that it’s natural for the 4D entity compared to the 3D entity who is young in self awareness.

Yes, I see the seven bodies as the "base" bodies of the densities. Thus, the astral body is the body of space/time of fourth density, the mental body of fifth density, the causal body of sixth density and the buddhic body of seventh density. As the entities ascend to a higher density, one of the main bodies will be activated and become the body of manifestation.

My doubt is because the majority of mankind inhabit the middle and lower astral planes. I always stay confused when I think in the three lower rays.

[Nau7ik]

Inner and outer. Inner planes are astral and consist of sub densities. The outer and the inner planes are intimately connected. So the higher astral of 3D would be where inner planes teachers reside, or saints or adepts or angels (third density, green ray sub density time/space—3.4-3.7). The fourth density green ray physical vehicle is like a physical light body, which is often called the vehicle for the astral—the light body. That’s how I understand it. So the 4D entity is capable of travel in the physical space/time and the metaphysical time/space. And so are we if we develop and refine our light bodies. It’s just that it’s natural for the 4D entity compared to the 3D entity who is young in self awareness.

Yes, I see the seven bodies as the "base" bodies of the densities. Thus, the astral body is the body of space/time of fourth density, the mental body of fifth density, the causal body of sixth density and the buddhic body of seventh density. As the entities ascend to a higher density, one of the main bodies will be activated and become the body of manifestation.

My doubt is because the majority of mankind inhabit the middle and lower astral planes. I always stay confused when I think in the three lower rays.

I would agree that the majority of mankind correspond to middle-lower astral in terms of consciousness. Because the middle-lower astral correspond to the lower triad of chakras, red, orange, and yellow-rays.

That’s the way I see it: 7 outer planes of a density and 7 corresponding inner planes. Space/time is outer planes, and time/space the inner planes.

[Infinite]

That’s the way I see it: 7 outer planes of a density and 7 corresponding inner planes. Space/time is outer planes, and time/space the inner planes.

Yep. The outer planes being the awareness levels of the mind/body/spirit complexes. And I suposse each one of these entities will inhabit an inner plane compatible with your awareness level. A harvestable or green-ray entity higher astral plane, blue-ray entity the mental plane, the adept the causal plane and the violet-ray entity the buddhic plane. Do you agree with these statements?

And I have another doubt. Through the indigo-ray center is possible contact the intelligent infinity. This level is far beyond any plane and any level. Can an indigo-ray entity go to buddhic plane without the activation of violet-ray level?

[AnthroHeart]

I have also heard of the Adi plane, which I believe is like the Buddhic. It's supposed to be the highest plane.
If even the archangels are 3D inner-plane beings, it tells you how amazing higher density beings must be.

[anagogy]

Red Ray = Physical Plane/Prime Material/This is also the Etheric Plane (as is commonly referenced in occult literature -- not the version Ra was talking about). This is the most congealed manifestation of form, or tangibility.
Orange Ray = Lower Astral Plane (Selfish Vibrations/Vibrations Concerning Self/Lust/Personal Power/Lower Emotional Realm)
Yellow Ray = Middle Astral Plane (Awareness of difference between Self and Other/Societal Vibrations/Personhood in relationship to groups of entities/this is where you begin to see astral cities or conglomerations of souls living together/Lower mental plane.)
Green Ray = Higher Astral Plane (Awareness of others vibrations/empathy/understanding of what another is experiencing/unconditional love/astral heaven type worlds/awareness of harmony/higher emotional plane).
Blue Ray = Devachanic Plane/Mental Plane/vibrations of free communication and pure conceptual ideals/repository of the "pure vibrations" of a thing at a conceptual level/conceptual archetypes after which every further instance of a particular idea is a patternization of, i.e., Plato's ideas of "ideal forms")
Indigo Ray = Causal Plane (Awareness of self as an expression of Intelligent Energy/awareness of self as creator/what Ra called the "etheric body" or the place where light is given form. Think of it as an "eye" or "shutter" that focuses light, giving it form, which is why it is the primal Form Maker.
Violet Ray = Buddhic Plane or alternatively the "Atmic Plane" or the level of 'Christ Consciousness'. Realm of wholeness, and awareness of connection with everything. This is where the m/b/s totality resides. An awareness of the totality of experiential balance. This is the most intangible and "not constrained by form" level.

Ra said astral body is the body of green-ray, but only the pure beings can access the higher astral plane. Do you have any idea to solve that apparent contradiction?

I guess I'm not understanding the contradiction. Maybe you can clarify. Many negative beings dwell in the higher densities, in the *physical* planes of those densities. But after death, they reside in the lower astral planes of those densities. The higher planes aren't pleasant to them due to their vibrational configuration.

Every true color density has a spectrum of vibrations. The true color yellow spectrum of 3rd density contains all the planes I listed above. A 3rd density being can access all these planes, but only if they are evolved enough. This would depend on what energy centers have been penetrated. But understand even if they do penetrate those planes, while they are the same planes in every density, a 3rd density being is going to be translating those energies from a 3rd density perspective. So a higher density being would be able to take in even more of those energies than a 3rd density (they could use the energies of them more efficiently). And different densities interact on these different vibrational planes, just like different densities interact on the physical level. For example, I'm sitting here swatting my cat away from the computer as I type. We are different densities, but we are interacting and both incarnated on the same physical plane.

Ra: "Entities inhabit the various planes due to their vibrational nature. The astral plane varies from thought-forms in the lower extremities to enlightened beings who become dedicated to teach/learning in the higher astral planes.

In the devachanic planes, as you call them, are those whose vibrations are even more close to the primal distortions of love/light.

Beyond these planes there are others."

In the section where Ra said green ray was the astral body they said "some may call it the astral body". Some may not. But we know that the physical fourth density is a place arrived at by natural evolution (sexual reproduction) of physical entities in 3rd density. Ra has said that physical biology still holds sway. For example they said, "The frontal lobes of the brain will, shall we say, have much more use in fourth density." Ethereal beings don't need brain organs, only physical beings need brains to translate perceptions and act as a biological CPU for biological functions. They have also mentioned that while the chemical elements of the body are not the same as a third density body, it is still a chemical body. Just like there is a *massive* variety of *physical* elements that make up our physical world, and physical beings in that world, there is a *massive* variation in *physical* elements that make up 4th density. It is similar to the overlap between 3rd density physical and 2nd density physical. The only difference is 4th density physical is invisible to us, by choice (and our bodies have been genetically tampered with to reduce our ability to see higher vibrational matter. That was part of their choice for the spiritual purposes of our density). Making the choice is a spiritual exercise in reducing entropy. That is what the whole game is about: reducing spiritual entropy. That is just another way of describing polarization.

But back to ethereal planes, which are the *actual* subtle bodies in my opinion:

So dead dudes inhabit the middle, or even lower, astral planes if they have not activated the heart center. As Ra said, "Depending upon this time/space locus there will be certain helpers which assist in this healing process. The process involves seeing in full the experience, seeing it against the backdrop of the mind/body/spirit complex total experience, forgiving the self for all missteps as regards the missed guideposts during the incarnation and, finally, the careful assessment of the next necessities for learning. This is done entirely by the higher self until an entity has become conscious in space/time of the process and means of spiritual evolution at which time the entity will consciously take part in all decisions."  

Once the heart center is activated, the being then resides in the upper middle astral planes, or the higher astral planes of 3rd density (depending upon how activated their heart center is). It will be whatever time/space locus is most comfortable for it and its companions. And that is where they plan their incarnations from with the help of their spirit guides. But the natural dwelling place of a 3rd density being is the middle astral, unless they've started to polarize and raise their vibrational level, just as the natural dwelling place of animals, after death, is the lower astral. Negative beings will deliberately stay in the lower to middle astral planes after death. They can't stand the resounding harmony of the higher ethereal planes. It isn't that they cannot go to them, they are just too positive so they have no desire to. But the *physical* versions of these planes, which are the densities as we know them, are the negatives, or opposite versions, which they *can* tolerate because they can still be negative there.

Consider this section:

47.13 ▶ Questioner: What stimulus would create what we call an Earth-bound spirit or a lingering ghost?

Ra: I am Ra. The stimulus for this is the faculty of the will. If the will of yellow-ray mind/body/spirit is that which is stronger than the progressive impetus of the physical death towards realization of that which comes, that is, if the will is concentrated enough upon the previous experience, the entity’s shell of yellow ray, though no longer activated, cannot either be completely deactivated and, until the will is released, the mind/body/spirit complex is caught. This often occurs, as we see you are aware, in the case of sudden death as well as in the case of extreme concern for a thing or an other-self.

This "shell of yellow ray" is what I would call the true color yellow, red subdensity body (physical body in potentiation, that is the energetic substrate for the actual biological body we incarnate into). I consider it part of the physical world, just like the physical body we have now, though we can't see this level of matter/energy with our physical eyes. This is the physical body that automatically coalesces about our consciousness when it intersects the physical plane. Ra calls it something different than I do. The entity in this situation is so focused on their previous physical life that they are stuck on that level. If they move up a layer, they would find themselves in the lower astral (subdensity orange), and if they kept going the middle astral (subdensity yellow), and eventually the higher astral (subdensity green). But the planes all gradually fade into one another, just like the layers of the atmosphere. There are infinite planes. Changing densities, on the other hand, is a definite threshold challenge though, because it involves almost a completely alternate mode of consciousness.

This is why I really don't favor the occult terminology because it makes everything more difficult to understand. The red-sub-density of every true color represents the physical matter of that density (in my opinion). And every sub-ray thereafter is progressively less physical and more ethereal. But the planes are basically the same in every density. The only difference is the complexity, or density level, of the consciousness complex inhabiting them. Physical 3rd density is physical matter that supports 3rd density awareness. 2nd density matter is physical matter supporting 2nd density awareness. And 1st density matter is matter supporting 1st density awareness. But they are all in the same physical plane. The only difference is the complexity of the arrangement.

[anagogy]

But after death, they reside in the lower astral planes of those densities. The higher planes aren't pleasant to them due to their vibrational configuration.

But I should also clarify, when there is no veil (like there isn't in higher densities), the idea of "death" becomes a very archaic 3rd density notion. To them they are merely shedding a vehicle, turning inwards for a while and reflecting, and then turning back, with no gap in conscious memory. And in higher densities than even 4th, the difference between space/time and time/space becomes even more reduced.

[Infinite]

I guess I'm not understanding the contradiction. Maybe you can clarify.

The astral body is the green-ray body, so it would be expected it inhabit the green-ray sub-density. But isn't which happens.

The higher planes aren't pleasant to them due to their vibrational configuration.

I see that as incapacity of support the vibrations. I believe they just can't go to these planes.

This "shell of yellow ray" is what I would call the true color yellow, red subdensity body (physical body in potentiation, that is the energetic substrate for the actual biological body we incarnate into). I consider it part of the physical world, just like the physical body we have now, though we can't see this level of matter/energy with our physical eyes.

The traditional etheric body, right? Do you believe time/space is invisible to conscious mind and the physical matter because vibrates above speed of light?

The red-sub-density of every true color represents the physical matter of that density (in my opinion).

Yes, makes sense. Because the red-ray is the ray of the experience foundation.

But the planes are basically the same in every density. The only difference is the complexity, or density level, of the consciousness complex inhabiting them.

Yep.

[Nau7ik]

That’s the way I see it: 7 outer planes of a density and 7 corresponding inner planes. Space/time is outer planes, and time/space the inner planes.

Yep. The outer planes being the awareness levels of the mind/body/spirit complexes. And I suposse each one of these entities will inhabit an inner plane compatible with your awareness level. A harvestable or green-ray entity higher astral plane, blue-ray entity the mental plane, the adept the causal plane and the violet-ray entity the buddhic plane. Do you agree with these statements?

And I have another doubt. Through the indigo-ray center is possible contact the intelligent infinity. This level is far beyond any plane and any level. Can an indigo-ray entity go to buddhic plane without the activation of violet-ray level?

Yes I agree with those statements.

And to the second part, very interesting. I think the activation of Indigo-ray will denote resonance with violet ray because Indigo is the gateway chakra which brings back intelligent energy from violet ray through the Indigo ray. In my understanding the violet ray is already perfect as is. But in terms of activating or moving the consciousness up the Middle Pillar (spinal column), I think one would have to be in Indigo ray to go to the violet ray or Buddhic body. And then one who is able to rouse the fiery serpent of kundalini to the Crown will have achieved Liberation and will have an awareness of God / Self that is beyond the comprehension.

[Infinite]

Yes I agree with those statements.

And to the second part, very interesting. I think the activation of Indigo-ray will denote resonance with violet ray because Indigo is the gateway chakra which brings back intelligent energy from violet ray through the Indigo ray. In my understanding the violet ray is already perfect as is. But in terms of activating or moving the consciousness up the Middle Pillar (spinal column), I think one would have to be in Indigo ray to go to the violet ray or Buddhic body. And then one who is able to rouse the fiery serpent of kundalini to the Crown will have achieved Liberation and will have an awareness of God / Self that is beyond the comprehension.

Perhaps the difference is access buddhic plane with causal body or buddhic body. The last being the seating of the consciousness at the violet level and activating the buddhic body.

[anagogy]

The astral body is the green-ray body, so it would be expected it inhabit the green-ray sub-density. But isn't which happens.

It depends on what "green ray body" you are talking about. All the bodies that Ra mentioned in that section where they speak of the different vehicles, were *physical* bodies in my opinion. The first 3 described were physical and they made no mention of the rest being nonphysical. So my understanding is that they were describing the red ray sub density body of every density. And we know, of course, that negative beings inhabit fourth density, fifth density, and early sixth density.

But there are *other* bodies, which are the nonphysical bodies, and THAT green ray body, and THAT blue ray body, and THAT indigo body, to my understanding, they do NOT inhabit, out of choice. It may be better to think of the inner plane bodies not as bodies, but rather just planes of consciousness, since these are not physical (each one higher is progressively less physical and more superluminal). They are simply the "thought-form" of a body that coalesces about the consciousness when it intersects that plane. A mind, or ego, naturally and reflexively forms an inner and an outer dimension. That nexus is where the perception of an inner mind, and an outer body begins. I think you've helped me find a better way of explaining these things without recourse to reference to bodies. The beings who reside on the inner planes, don't collect chemical vehicles about themselves, but the beings who inhabit the physical plane of higher densities do. Though, this pretty much ends by fifth density, because they can shape shift essentially, and so can sixth density beings, and they are no longer collecting matter about them (most of time) but rather light bodies. The later in the evolution of the densities you get, the less time you spend in space/time in my opinion. And the earlier one is in the density evolution, the more time you spend in space/time versus time/space.

I see that as incapacity of support the vibrations. I believe they just can't go to these planes.

You might be correct. But sixth density beings instantaneously switch over to positive at the end of their negative cycle. So perhaps it is a matter of semantics whether they "can't" or "won't". Could be a mixture of both.

This "shell of yellow ray" is what I would call the true color yellow, red subdensity body (physical body in potentiation, that is the energetic substrate for the actual biological body we incarnate into). I consider it part of the physical world, just like the physical body we have now, though we can't see this level of matter/energy with our physical eyes.

The traditional etheric body, right? Do you believe time/space is invisible to conscious mind and the physical matter because vibrates above speed of light?

I believe it is some kind of electromagnetic configuration, but still very much in space/time. But yes, traditional etheric body.

About the light, I believe so, yes.

And also, it goes without saying, all this is just my opinion based on my research, experience, and talking with other explorers of these realms, so if this doesn't resonate with you, please feel free to discard it (but share your thoughts, so I can learn too!)

:)

[Infinite]

It depends on what "green ray body" you are talking about. All the bodies that Ra mentioned in that section where they speak of the different vehicles, were *physical* bodies in my opinion.

So my understanding is that they were describing the red ray sub density body of every density.

I'm talking about astral body. If you note, the bodies describes by Ra are the same of the esoteric traditions. Ra made comparisons. And as I said above, I believe these bodies will be activated one by one as the entity ascend to higher densities. So, yes, I agree with you that these bodies are the red-ray or manifestation bodies of the higher densities.

My doubt was because mental, causal and buddhic bodies seems "inhabit" the right colors. But the astral body doesn't. However, I suppose that is because each plane until causal plane (sub-density of sixth-density) has lower and middle vibrations, or negative sub-densities. Something like lower and middle mental and causal planes. The STO entity will inhabit the true color and the STS entity the orange/yellow sub-colors.

But there are *other* bodies, which are the nonphysical bodies, and THAT green ray body, and THAT blue ray body, and THAT indigo body, to my understanding, they do NOT inhabit, out of choice. It may be better to think of the inner plane bodies not as bodies, but rather just planes of consciousness, since these are not physical (each one higher is progressively less physical and more superluminal). They are simply the "thought-form" of a body that coalesces about the consciousness when it intersects that plane. A mind, or ego, naturally and reflexively forms an inner and an outer dimension. That nexus is where the perception of an inner mind, and an outer body begins. I think you've helped me find a better way of explaining these things without recourse to reference to bodies. The beings who reside on the inner planes, don't collect chemical vehicles about themselves, but the beings who inhabit the physical plane of higher densities do. Though, this pretty much ends by fifth density, because they can shape shift essentially, and so can sixth density beings, and they are no longer collecting matter about them (most of time) but rather light bodies. The later in the evolution of the densities you get, the less time you spend in space/time in my opinion. And the earlier one is in the density evolution, the more time you spend in space/time versus time/space.

I agree. As I go penetrating these planes, I'll understand better. Because based in my experiences, there are things I can't express with words. As Ra said, there is a limit on language.

And also, it goes without saying, all this is just my opinion based on my research, experience, and talking with other explorers of these realms, so if this doesn't resonate with you, please feel free to discard it (but share your thoughts, so I can learn too!)

Thanks for your considerations. That always help me growthing up.

[anagogy]

I'm talking about astral body. If you note, the bodies describes by Ra are the same of the esoteric traditions. Ra made comparisons. And as I said above, I believe these bodies will be activated one by one as the entity ascend to higher densities. So, yes, I agree with you that these bodies are the red-ray or manifestation bodies of the higher densities.

My doubt was because mental, causal and buddhic bodies seems "inhabit" the right colors. But the astral body doesn't. However, I suppose that is because each plane until causal plane (sub-density of sixth-density) has lower and middle vibrations, or negative sub-densities. Something like lower and middle mental and causal planes. The STO entity will inhabit the true color and the STS entity the orange/yellow sub-colors.

I understand.

The fact is, there are a lot of subjects I wish that they would have asked Ra a lot more about. But they had limited time, unfortunately.

It is a confusing subject, for sure.

I think "astral" has been misapplied in a variety of ways, by occultists, and also by Ra in that specific session referencing bodies. For example, what most occultists would consider the causal, Ra called etheric, and what most occultists call etheric they referenced as the "shell of yellow ray" (in a separate session as I noted earlier in regards earthbound spirits). So I think there is a lot of confusion ripe for picking there.

It took me a long time to come to the conclusion that they were referring to physicality and space/time rather than non-physicality and time/space. Part of the reason I came to that conclusion was all the references to fourth density and it having physicality (like earlier when I mentioned them referencing the use of the frontal lobes in fourth density). Also, when they mentioned devachanic bodies they gave an important clue as well by saying, "There are many, many types of bodies in each density, much like your own." That made me stop and think. Many different types of bodies. Other densities. That was a big tip off they were referring to physical bodies (at least, from my perspective). Because a nonphysical body can assume whatever configuration, shape, or form (caveat: for the most part). For example, you can have completely different shapes on the astral plane, and sometimes, no form at all (that becomes closer to a mental plane experience). So in the end, I was forced to conclude that the green ray body they were describing was a physical one. Sort of like how you brought up once the idea of a "solar astral" body and a "lunar astral" body, which some occultists have distinguished. I think they were using it in some sense like that, like one was a sort of physicalized version of the astral body (the physical fourth density body) and other references were more toward inner planes (like we've discussed before). And also there is the matter of the huge variety in elements that compose a physical body (I'm thinking of the plant/animal kingdom). So I'm sure the physicality of higher densities is full of lots of weird and varying forms.

Another reason they might have referred to that as astral, in that session, is that some astral travelers claim to gather "ectoplasm" and then project into our physical world -- something I would probably call an "etheric projection". They are, presumably, collecting green ray matter, and then projecting out of their 3rd density body into this body and going about exploring in that conjured body. The collected ectoplasm may give certain occultists advantages (being able to tangibly observe the physical world from an out of body vantage point while still incarnate -- Robert Bruce actually said something like this). I can neither confirm, nor deny, this is how it works (because I simply don't know), but I feel strongly there was something like this being relayed by Ra in that session. Again, more confusion.

It may be that I'm completely wrong too, but this is what feels and seems the most true to me at this time. I'll be sure to note if my mind ever changes on the topic though. I think in some sense, it is better to think of infinite bodies and planes, because although there is a rainbow of different vibratory levels and spectrums, I think the planes seamlessly blend together (like the atmosphere). That is not to say there isn't a definite barrier at the edges of changing densities (that is a bigger transformation). But there is basically endless stratification on the inner planes. The body of those realms is whatever the material of the plane you are intersecting, which then becomes the thoughtform of "outer" or "body". So it might be more fruitful to think of it in those terms than trying to narrow it down to 7 specific vehicles (or 5 if you are going off of eastern literature).

Also I wanted to say that every density, in my opinion, has all of these planes. Even sixth, and negative beings reside in the time/space of these levels here just as surely as they do in every other density that allows negative beings to exist. And they aren't separated from one another. So these might seem like dark gods in the lower planes to other beings. Very powerful consciousness complexes, of higher density intelligence and power, but residing in the dreggs of space and time, in their own little terrible corners of the infinite. Physicality is just a crystallization of the ray that dominates it. It is the same inner/outer planes etc in every density. So any plane less than what I have labeled "the higher astral" is oriented toward the negative or south energy pole, and anything higher is oriented towards the positive north energy pole. It is basically the middle point between positive and negative planes. So you might call that the plane of balance, or harmony. This doesn't make "lower planes" inherently evil, or any less useful of course for catalytic purposes, but it means that entropy, or chaos, has more and more sway the closer to the physical you get, and it is neutralized in the higher astral (things don't decay anymore, whereas in the lesser astral planes they do, slowly, but surely, just like the physical world albeit slower) and higher than that there is a tendency of energy towards order and harmony, rather, than an orientation towards disorder. There is "negentropy" (reversal of entropy).

Thankyou for your thoughts. I always appreciate your thoughtful inquiries.

[Infinite]

I understand. As you said, the Samaelian Gnosis talks about lunar and solar astral body. The lunar body can go only to middle and lower astral planes. The solar body can go to higher astral. This solar body must be build and I suppose it's the fourth density body.

Q'uo said something like that recently:

Z: I have a query. When a person has a Kundalini rising experience, is that the activation of their fourth-density energy body?

Q’uo: I am Q'uo, and am aware of your query, my brother. The rising of the Kundalini to the indigo ray energy center is that which you may indeed describe as the activation of the fourth-density body, that of the green ray energy center, which is then fully energized to be able to experience the higher vibrations now engulfing your planet so that these vibrations may be shared, or channeled, and transmitted to those about the entity experiencing the so-called Kundalini experience. For though an experience which seems solitary in nature, and, indeed, is experienced in this manner, it is one which offers the opportunities for the expansion of consciousness for others with whom the entity experiencing it shall come in contact.

I see the other densities as other octaves. The fourth density planes (space/time and time/space) are from another vibration above the yellow octave. So, we can't go to the fourth density, it's necessary to have a fourth density body. As the astral plane is the sub-density of fourth, for this reason I supposed fourth density has astral characteristics. For example, Ra said that in fifth density the entity function only by thought. That's the same description of the mental plane of the traditions.

Edit: Intersting passage of "Autobiography of an Iogue" when the deceased master of Yogananda appears to him in which seems a fourth density body. He talks about an "astral planet" and a new body:

Source: http://yogananda.com.au/aoy/beyond_death_1.html

[loostudent]

To me Ra's list of bodies is also confusing. First they list three physical (outer) bodies according to three lower densities. Then at once it shifts to inner plane (non-physical) bodies.

17.36 Questioner: I’ve heard that there are seven astral and seven devachanic primary levels. Is this correct?

Ra: I am Ra. You speak of some of the more large distinctions in levels in your inner planes. That is correct.

Is there one inner plane (with several levels) fo each density? What does "your" mean in the quote above? I thought the astral planes are the inner planes of 1d-4d and devachanic inner plane corresponds to 5d.