What does "initiation" mean? And Tarot study questions
07-01-2018, 05:55 PM,
#1
What does "initiation" mean? And Tarot study questions
41.23 Questioner: I have a book, Initiation, in which the woman describes initiation. Are you familiar with the contents of this book?
Ra: I am Ra. This is correct. We scan your mind.

41.24 Questioner: Jim has read the entire book. I have only read part of it, but I was wondering if the teachings in the book with respect to balancing were your teachings, Ra’s teachings?
Ra: I am Ra. This is basically correct with distortions that may be seen when this material is collated with the material we have offered.[/size]


***************************************

I found great comfort and extreme soul-searching (like a kite with the string suddenly broken--wonderful freedom!) with LOO and want to know if any of my experiences were analogous to "initiation." I'd also like to know more details about this Initiation book that Don mentioned.

Also, I now feel it's time to learn at a deeper level. To this regard, I started to self-study the Tarot using Book IV material, but I feel I need more formal guidance, so I'm thinking of joining a group that studies the Tarot. Looking around, I found information about B.O.T.A., this group feels more resonant with me somehow but haven't contacted them yet. I'm interested in any comments and suggestions. Thank you.
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07-01-2018, 06:09 PM,
#2
RE: What does "initiation" mean? And Tarot study questions
I think it was the King's chamber that did an initiation in the Great Pyramid.

One has to be a very pure channel because there is great potential for disarrangement of the mind.

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07-01-2018, 06:30 PM,
#3
RE: What does "initiation" mean? And Tarot study questions
Hi there kelly!

I believe this is the book mentioned:

http://www.bring4th.org/forums/showthread.php?tid=6711&highlight=initiation

In regards to your question about a more 'disciplined' study of the tarot, there was a recent post which sheds a lot of personal experience on this matter.

Of course - no need to follow exactly in someone else's footsteps, but it might provide some insight.

(06-05-2018, 03:49 AM)kenney Wrote:  If i may add, from my perspective having graduated from the Church of Light and having mastered their way before moving on.

Studying the tarot as it is presented by Zain may be the single MOST (and i can not emphasize this enough) MOST worthwhile en devour anyone can take if they are attempting to unravel the Ra books for their own personal development. I found them (by then the Church of Light of course) in the late nineties, when I told Carla how lonely I was and I had reached my limit of learning alone, it was her suggestion. As an aside back then the only way I could get the Ra books was to write to L&L a letter and request a book, so I ended up sending a doantion with these big long letters telling why I was always loosing the first book giving it away to people hoping to make a friend to study with.

out of fear of becoming part of some crazy cult...i waited about 15 years to take her advice  Dodgy

the full post is here: https://www.bring4th.org/forums/showthread.php?pid=245558#pid245558

G
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kellybee, Spaced
07-01-2018, 07:16 PM, (This post was last modified: 07-01-2018, 07:43 PM by kellybee.)
#4
RE: What does "initiation" mean? And Tarot study questions
[quote='Bring4th_Plenum' pid='246993' dateline='1530484231']
Hi there kelly!

I believe this is the book mentioned:

http://www.bring4th.org/forums/showthread.php?tid=6711&highlight=initiation

In regards to your question about a more 'disciplined' study of the tarot, there was a recent post which sheds a lot of personal experience on this matter....
[/quote]

[quote='Bring4th_Plenum' pid='246993' dateline='1530484231']


THANK YOU. (Indeed...Ask and you shall receive...)  Heart

Yes, I am also hesitant about inadvertently "joining a cult" so I've been just reading the LOO material repeatedly for years (time flies!). I'll look up CC Zain's Church of Light material, thanks. I do know that the BOTA was founded by Paul Foster Case, of A.O./Golden Dawn connection, so seemed also legit to me. Curiously, I noticed that both schools of thought are derived from Hermetic orders (Luxor for COL, Golden Dawn for BOTA).
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Bring4th_Plenum
07-02-2018, 08:30 AM,
#5
RE: What does "initiation" mean? And Tarot study questions
There are different ways to study the Tarot. Personally, the best illumination I’ve received was from studying the Tarot archetypes in the format laid out by Ra: first 7 Mind, second 7 (Energy) Body, and final 7 for Spirit. Don explores the first 7 with Ra before the contact is ended. Ra gives a key to unlocking the archetypes for Body and Spirit by explaining the first 7 cards of Mind. It will require personal work and study.

Another method of studying the Tarot is by way of the Holy Qabalah and the Tree of Life.

Paul Foster Case wrote a book of meditations on the 22 Hebrew letters, “The Book of Tokens”’, which are assigned to each Major Arcana card. This will give a big clue to each card’s significance.

So, there are different ways to go about studying the Tarot. I hope that you find what works best for you!
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kellybee
07-02-2018, 01:03 PM, (This post was last modified: 07-02-2018, 01:04 PM by kellybee.)
#6
RE: What does "initiation" mean? And Tarot study questions
Thank you Nau7ik. I did the same format of study from Ra, then set it aside for a year because I couldn't make headway beyond the first 7 of Mind. I was too distracted with worldly matters and likely not spiritually ready yet so I concentrated on yoga for a while to deepen meditation. Now I feel I'm getting ready to resume. I feel the Ra material makes it all seem familiar, while the mystic schools weave this "magical" aura around the information.

But as we know...Seek and you shall find... Heart
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sunnysideup
07-02-2018, 01:32 PM,
#7
RE: What does "initiation" mean? And Tarot study questions
Bring4th_Plenum, thanks again for the link on the Initiation book. I'm halfway through (found a free PDF online) and it's really powerful stuff. A lot of the spiritual exercises mentioned and even the concepts discussed seemed so very resonant with the Ra material.
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Bring4th_Plenum
07-02-2018, 06:30 PM,
#8
RE: What does "initiation" mean? And Tarot study questions
Awesome stuff.

Glad it helped  Smile
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kellybee
07-02-2018, 06:54 PM,
#9
RE: What does "initiation" mean? And Tarot study questions
I read Initiation a couple months back and thought it was great. I've also signed up with the BOTA and have enjoyed their material but I'm not very deep into it.

The thing with the tarot and magical groups is that they all have their own take on it, so I think it comes down to either finding a system that works for you and sticking with it or else getting your hands on everything you can and coming to your own conclusions (which is what I've been doing).

I have C. C. Zain's Sacred Tarot but I found his interpretations didnt work for me. I also have Crowley's book of Thoth which is a mixed bag (I like that he has Strength and Justice, or Lust and Adjustment, in the same configuration as in the Ra material and that he switched tzaddi's attribution to the Emperor, etc. but a lot of his interpretations don't resonate with me.)

I think a big part of working with the Tarot is developing your own relationship to the cards.

Now initiation is something else. I've been wondering for some time if I should persue initiation with a group or continue on my own path. I think the is definitely value to adhering to a tradition and receiving instruction from someone further along the path but there's also an expected level of commitment and loss of the freedom to cut your own path. I think it would be worth it if I found the right teacher.
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kellybee, Learner
07-03-2018, 12:51 AM,
#10
RE: What does "initiation" mean? And Tarot study questions
As I understand initiation can be initial spiritual awarenes (opening of heart) or a ritual connected with this.
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07-03-2018, 12:06 PM,
#11
RE: What does "initiation" mean? And Tarot study questions
(07-01-2018, 05:55 PM)kellybee Wrote:  41.23 Questioner: I have a book, Initiation, in which the woman describes initiation. Are you familiar with the contents of this book?
Ra: I am Ra. This is correct. We scan your mind.

41.24 Questioner: Jim has read the entire book. I have only read part of it, but I was wondering if the teachings in the book with respect to balancing were your teachings, Ra’s teachings?
Ra: I am Ra. This is basically correct with distortions that may be seen when this material is collated with the material we have offered.[/size]


***************************************

I found great comfort and extreme soul-searching (like a kite with the string suddenly broken--wonderful freedom!) with LOO and want to know if any of my experiences were analogous to "initiation." I'd also like to know more details about this Initiation book that Don mentioned.

Also, I now feel it's time to learn at a deeper level. To this regard, I started to self-study the Tarot using Book IV material, but I feel I need more formal guidance, so I'm thinking of joining a group that studies the Tarot. Looking around, I found information about B.O.T.A., this group feels more resonant with me somehow but haven't contacted them yet. I'm interested in any comments and suggestions. Thank you.

Hi Kellybee!
I didnt quite get what you're asking specifically.

Do you want to know what iniation means in general?
Or specifically in the context of this book?

I am pretty familiar with initiations, I received many. But I didnt read that book.
So i am not sure, what exactly you want to know.

Additionaly, what is it you want to be initiated in?
Cpuld you be more specific?

Or are seeking initiation regarding the tarot?
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07-04-2018, 01:03 AM,
#12
RE: What does "initiation" mean? And Tarot study questions
Hi Agua,

I was asking specifically what "initiation" meant in that particular LOO passage. I finished reading the "Initiation" book mentioned by Don (author E. Hirch) and have a better understanding now--they meant initiation as an Adept. While I think it's a great reference book, I can honestly say that I am not ready for *that* kind of initiation (Egyptian pyramid kind). I would say a lot of our spiritual learning/experiences we discuss here in Bring4th are similar to the pre-initiation learning that the ancients pursued for years, prior to their final initiation as Adepts.

The question about the Tarot was unrelated to the initiation question. No, I'm not seeking to be "initiated" into a mystery school to learn Tarot. I merely looked into their curricula (BOTA, COL) because I do want to further my knowledge of it.

Looking through my books, I do have The Royal Road: A Study in the Egyptian Tarot by George Fathman from a few years ago. I think I'll start reading this again.
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07-04-2018, 01:32 AM, (This post was last modified: 07-04-2018, 01:39 AM by kellybee. Edit Reason: correct an error )
#13
RE: What does "initiation" mean? And Tarot study questions
(07-02-2018, 06:54 PM)Spaced Wrote:  I read Initiation a couple months back and thought it was great. I've also signed up with the BOTA and have enjoyed their material but I'm not very deep into it.

The thing with the tarot and magical groups is that they all have their own take on it, so I think it comes down to either finding a system that works for you and sticking with it or else getting your hands on everything you can and coming to your own conclusions (which is what I've been doing).....

Hi Spaced,

You are so right that different groups have their own take on the Tarot, that's why I'm looking for an approach I'm more comfortable with. I'm a little hesitant in joining magical groups though, that's why I've been sitting on the fence for >2 years now. BOTA is the first one I considered inquiring into just to learn Tarot. I agree that the correct path is to come to your conclusions regardless of what you are taught. (15.13. We learn from you. We teach to you. Thus, we teach/learn. If we learned for you, this would cause imbalance in the direction of the distortion of free will.)

I did read 2 Tarot books a while back but didn't feel they were a good fit (I forgot the authors, I'll check again). I realize now I have one more book I haven't read--The Royal Road: A study in the Egyptian Tarot by George Fathman. This book's images were the ones published in the Ra material. I'll see if it's a better fit for me.

As far as "initiation" as an Adept (per the "Initiation" book by E. Hirch), I am far from ready for that. But I truly learned that your Teacher will appear to nudge you along when it is time, even if not yet time for initiation. L/L
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Bring4th_Plenum
07-04-2018, 08:08 AM, (This post was last modified: 07-04-2018, 08:53 AM by Agua.)
#14
RE: What does "initiation" mean? And Tarot study questions
*edited*
I started a mew thread with the topic and instead answer the "initiation" thing.

i'll describe what initiation has been like for me, I received a whole lot of them throughout the years.

I'll give an example:

I have been wondering how I could access "more" consciousness in my daily life.
I have worked with many methods but felt the need for a change.

So one day, during an inner journey, I received an initiation.
I was "put" in a totally different state of being here.
I was suddenly much more connected with my body. I felt and experienced a connection with plants that exceeded what i experienced before by far!
The connection with my body and with plants went deeper and deeper, it finally reached what i would call a subatomic level.
I was in a state where i already had that connection.

From this position, i could compare it to my usual state of being. I could see the difference.
I could see what the obstacles were and i was shown how to go about removing them.
After a while, this state subsided.

i experienced such as this many times.
Basically it was always the same.
I was shown the desired end-state and i was shown how to "get there".

This is how i would describe initiation!


As for "when will i be ready for a teacher or initiation":

From my experience the only thing necessary is you have to be willing to leave your intellectual understanding behind, not more but not less.
As long as you insist in understanding intellectually, you can only be given abstract information. No deeper experience is possible.
You can only be given abstract information, like in a book. However that would not help much obviously.
As soon as you are willing to let go of this kind of understanding, you can be initiated. You can open up enough and most of all you can open up on the level initiation takes place.

If a student is still "locked" in the intellect, no serious teacher will initiate, since its not really possible!
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07-05-2018, 08:41 AM,
#15
RE: What does "initiation" mean? And Tarot study questions
(07-02-2018, 01:03 PM)kellybee Wrote:  Thank you Nau7ik. I did the same format of study from Ra, then set it aside for a year because I couldn't make headway beyond the first 7 of Mind. I was too distracted with worldly matters and likely not spiritually ready yet so I concentrated on yoga for a while to deepen meditation. Now I feel I'm getting ready to resume. I feel the Ra material makes it all seem familiar, while the mystic schools weave this "magical" aura around the information.

But as we know...Seek and you shall find... Heart

We are in the same boat Smile the first 7 cards flow together beautifully for me. I am working to understand the others but haven’t gotten very far.
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