Feminism is about a 5 year old, thought.
04-13-2019, 03:49 PM,
#1
Feminism is about a 5 year old, thought.
So, I've been observing modern feminism for a while now and the activity is very similar to a child of around 5 going through the "confrontational period" of their life. It seems that feminism is yet to make a huge blunder so the feeling of all power is still there in combination with a sense of knowing how things should be done and being opposed by "old white power", this to me seem very much like a child telling their parent that they know how things should be done. Not to take into effect that the child maybe right, it does seem like a "tantrum" going on. Perhaps the best historical similar is the french revolution, it started as a tantrum but destroyed itself when they brought out the quillotine. So I'm interested in waiting and seeing what this new type of civilization produces, will it be able to produce a equalitarian paradise or will it devolve into the use of the quillotine and the tantrum.

I'm taking it to be a 5 year old even though its closer to a 60 year old due to the fact that the oldest earth ideologies are thousands of years old, not 60, if they are old people then certainly feminism is a young person.

Not to take part in the whole right and wrong debate in relation to this, I'd prefer to note that it seem the activities stem from lack of huge failures yet. I wonder how the activity will change when they encounter their first huge failure, for example what if the pay wage gap gets disproven or it turns out that females do more home violence, such a disprove would be what I'm looking for, then we could see if they adjust like an adult civilization or keep going on a tantrum. I would love to see what civilization they produce but I'm suspicious of the results of such a collection of anger, it seems counterproductive.

So that being said, i wonder how many see feminism as a child ideology and how many see it as an adult ideology and how this number changes the interactions between the adherants, it would be an interesting study.

So thats all I wanted to say, feels to me like an ideology waiting for its first big hurdle and to evolve upwards from it, hope it does well.
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04-13-2019, 07:32 PM, (This post was last modified: 04-13-2019, 07:34 PM by Louisabell.)
#2
RE: Feminism is about a 5 year old, thought.
I believe the problem with over-generalised conclusions of certain idealogies (and mainly the intentions of the people behind them) is that you are trying to describe a 3rd density phenomena with 2nd density conceptual understanding.

Feminism is an umbrella term encompassing a collection of ideologies that are expressed on a group level. Anyone who's heard of feminism has a part to play in this group dynamic, so pretty much everyone living in the west at least. One cannot even imagine how complex and massive such a group is. Could even a supercomputer make all the calculations neccessary to truly represent the degree of nuance involved when millions of adult humans are making decisions surrounding "gender roles" and their meaning - something quite central to the human experience?

Maybe now we can begin to understand how abysmally insufficient statements such as feminism is this..., feminism is that... is.

Moreover as we become ever more saturated in media, we have to acknowledge the role of confirmation bias in our lives. Your version of feminism is very different to my version of feminism, as with everyone else. Someone who had an abusive mother and who frequents MGTOW forums is going to have a different idea of the role of feminism as a social worker with an alcoholic father and who works in disadvantaged immigrant communities.

We are all part of an infinite Creator, with an infinite array of perspectives. This is beautiful. Let's acknowledge the significance of everyone's unique experience. Let's not assume they're crazy, irrational, stupid. Lets entertain the idea that maybe everyone has good reasons for thinking the way they do and lets begin to learn from eachother.

I find feminism or sexism extremely interesting because when it comes to other groups, it's possible to have very little interaction with people of a different race or sexual orientation or religion. But when it comes to gender, there is no escaping it. We live with eachother, work with eachother, fall in love with eachother. So therefore we all have strong opinions and biases forged over our very personal experiences. I propose there is no other idealogy to feminism with more self-proclaimed experts in the field, with more people who think they know what it's all about and how other people should conform to their enlightened views.

For example - the gender pay gap. There are multiple ways to see this. One way will propose that women chose not to participate in the workforce as much as men, they're not as ambitious, therefore they cannot expect to earn as much, therefore the pay gap is a myth. Another way to see it puts into question the assumption that men are more ambitious (surely hypergamy, considered a toxic female trait in the manosphere, is the empitomy of ambitious behavior), and that just because women make babies it neccessarily needs to impact their careers. Maternity leave was a huge advancement in this, and Australia has 12 months leave with a guarantee of your job when you go back. But then it was thought that "maternity" leave was sexist, so now it is "parental" leave and the father can take this time off as well. For me this is a great step forward for men's rights as well, why shouldn't they get the same opportunity to bond to their baby in those early times?

Some men would prefer not to be the primary care giver of a baby, changing diapers and the like, and so see such a move as emasculating (feminism trying to turn men into women), but then is he not just resisting the idea that he doesn't get to decide what a man is? Seems quite childish to me as obviously some men want this - they go on parental leave.

Personally I like diversity of thought and personality and believe that the onus should fall on the individual to make an appropriate choice of partner. Some of my feminist friends think that doesn't go far enough. I don't see how that's moral or even possible, but that is just a testament to how different all our interpretations of what feminism should encompass is.

Lastly, I want to discuss a very important idea, and that is assigning motives to other people. In order to hold a strong oppositional position with a group, one must assign motive to that group. Sometimes these assumptions are held up with a lot of evidence and based in fact (i.e. white nationalists want a country of only white people - it's in the name) while other times these assumed motives are based on flimsy evidence, caricatures or are only representative of extreme or subversive elements in the group. Anti-progressive/cultural-Marxist thought leaders have rightly critiqued this practice when directed at them, only to turn around and do the same thing to their progressive counterparts (apparently all women who label themselves feminist don't want equality, but want to put men down, no matter what they say about it).

I see this as a block in 3rd ray understanding causing a block in 5th ray ability to really communicate and listen carefully to people, take them at their word, not preconceived ideas about them.

So in a round about way, do I think SOME elements of feminism are like a 5 year old tantrum? Well of course, because feminism IS people and there are plently of humans walking around with the emotional maturity of infants. Men too who pretend to gag because a woman choses not to shave her underarms are 5 year olds throwing a tantrum. Just humans being humans. But to also ignore that there are plenty of intelligent people with valid reasons involved in feminism is to not see the reality of complex human systems.

I see no evolution possible trying to simplify things down to orange ray thinking. A group made up of millions is not one 5 year old child. How you chose to respond to that child cannot be appropriately applied to all individuals in the group. The group will not "grow up" as one, but parts will evolve, other parts will devolve. So the question becomes, can you stand the ambiguity and chaos and still find a way to love people?
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04-13-2019, 07:39 PM,
#3
RE: Feminism is about a 5 year old, thought.
Interesting response. I'll think a bit and maybe write a response.
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04-13-2019, 07:45 PM,
#4
RE: Feminism is about a 5 year old, thought.




Currently watching this and considering it funny, your opinion may vary.
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04-13-2019, 08:35 PM,
#5
RE: Feminism is about a 5 year old, thought.
(04-13-2019, 07:45 PM)Cyan Wrote:  



Currently watching this and considering it funny, your opinion may vary.

Gender relations run the gambit of absolutely hilarious to downright tragic.

I see most of the ridiculousness comes from the complete inability to put one's self in the mind of the opposite "cis"-gender. Out of curiosity, I am constantly trying to see the world through the eyes of a male who find women attractive, since their bodies seem to be plastered everywhere. Yet apart from foundational feminine and masculine energies, I still can't seem to understand what all the fuss is about. I guess the article writer in the video has a unique perspective as someone who has experienced radically different amounts of sex hormones in their life.
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04-13-2019, 09:18 PM,
#6
RE: Feminism is about a 5 year old, thought.
That video is hilarious Smile

I know feminism was started by the elite for two main reasons. The first was to get a second paycheck, so the family could afford me and pay more to bankers and the government. And secondly, it was to break up the family - if you don't have a strong family, you need to rely more on the government. And it's a shame so many kids are raised in daycare, practically by necessity now. It's worked pretty well.

The dogma surrounding feminism has gotten pretty insane in recent years - to the point where the silent majority is looking at it in shock, IMO.
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04-24-2019, 08:59 AM,
#7
RE: Feminism is about a 5 year old, thought.
Sadly, things aren’t always the way they seem at first.
We have the gift of being able to look at information.
Think!
Then choose.
I suspect choices are often made from a “It’s about me” point of view.
Should I always follow what others think?
Only fish that are dead always swim with the stream!
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04-24-2019, 11:47 AM,
#8
RE: Feminism is about a 5 year old, thought.
(04-24-2019, 08:59 AM)David_1 Wrote:  Sadly, things aren’t always the way they seem at first.
We have the gift of being able to look at information.
Think!
Then choose.
I suspect choices are often made from a “It’s about me” point of view.
Should I always follow what others think?
Only fish that are dead always swim with the stream!

I ike this. Instead of getting caught up in the human drama, it is my practice to live and think as an empowered individual. Regarding for example, equal pay, I'm out of that box because I have worked for myself most of my adult life—which was a choice. If I were working for a company who was paying me less than a man with the same job, I would address that with the manager, and if that got me nowhere I would go to the CEO. Before that came up, I would know I was doing my very best, and not just working to get a paycheck.

But activism is something that appears to be necessary to drive humanity forward. In order for women to be able to vote, for instance, there had to be a rebellious push from activists. There are activists now trying to expand the consciousness of humanity to include compassion for animals and not just people. Hundreds of years ago we had a civil war in the US over slavery. Big leaps forward are usually messy it seems, when you are dealing with so many humans at different levels of consciousness.

A note about the French Revolution: It was mob mentality yes, but I wouldn't categorize it as a tantrum. According to history, the citizens revolted because they were starving, living in extreme poverty, in juxtaposition to the royalty and elite who were obliviously flaunting excess and privilege.
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04-24-2019, 12:48 PM,
#9
RE: Feminism is about a 5 year old, thought.
Beautiful thoughts, Diana.
There are many things on Earth I consider unjust.
It is a noble cause to promote compassion and justice.
One problem is that decisions are sometimes made from the point of view of “What can I get out of it?”
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04-24-2019, 07:57 PM,
#10
RE: Feminism is about a 5 year old, thought.
(04-13-2019, 07:32 PM)Louisabell Wrote:  I believe the problem with over-generalised conclusions of certain idealogies (and mainly the intentions of the people behind them) is that you are trying to describe a 3rd density phenomena with 2nd density conceptual understanding.

Feminism is an umbrella term encompassing a collection of ideologies that are expressed on a group level. Anyone who's heard of feminism has a part to play in this group dynamic, so pretty much everyone living in the west at least. One cannot even imagine how complex and massive such a group is. Could even a supercomputer make all the calculations neccessary to truly represent the degree of nuance involved when millions of adult humans are making decisions surrounding "gender roles" and their meaning - something quite central to the human experience?

Maybe now we can begin to understand how abysmally insufficient statements such as feminism is this..., feminism is that... is.

Moreover as we become ever more saturated in media, we have to acknowledge the role of confirmation bias in our lives. Your version of feminism is very different to my version of feminism, as with everyone else. Someone who had an abusive mother and who frequents MGTOW forums is going to have a different idea of the role of feminism as a social worker with an alcoholic father and who works in disadvantaged immigrant communities.

We are all part of an infinite Creator, with an infinite array of perspectives. This is beautiful. Let's acknowledge the significance of everyone's unique experience. Let's not assume they're crazy, irrational, stupid. Lets entertain the idea that maybe everyone has good reasons for thinking the way they do and lets begin to learn from eachother.

I find feminism or sexism extremely interesting because when it comes to other groups, it's possible to have very little interaction with people of a different race or sexual orientation or religion. But when it comes to gender, there is no escaping it. We live with eachother, work with eachother, fall in love with eachother. So therefore we all have strong opinions and biases forged over our very personal experiences. I propose there is no other idealogy to feminism with more self-proclaimed experts in the field, with more people who think they know what it's all about and how other people should conform to their enlightened views.

For example - the gender pay gap. There are multiple ways to see this. One way will propose that women chose not to participate in the workforce as much as men, they're not as ambitious, therefore they cannot expect to earn as much, therefore the pay gap is a myth. Another way to see it puts into question the assumption that men are more ambitious (surely hypergamy, considered a toxic female trait in the manosphere, is the empitomy of ambitious behavior), and that just because women make babies it neccessarily needs to impact their careers. Maternity leave was a huge advancement in this, and Australia has 12 months leave with a guarantee of your job when you go back. But then it was thought that "maternity" leave was sexist, so now it is "parental" leave and the father can take this time off as well. For me this is a great step forward for men's rights as well, why shouldn't they get the same opportunity to bond to their baby in those early times?

Some men would prefer not to be the primary care giver of a baby, changing diapers and the like, and so see such a move as emasculating (feminism trying to turn men into women), but then is he not just resisting the idea that he doesn't get to decide what a man is? Seems quite childish to me as obviously some men want this - they go on parental leave.

Personally I like diversity of thought and personality and believe that the onus should fall on the individual to make an appropriate choice of partner. Some of my feminist friends think that doesn't go far enough. I don't see how that's moral or even possible, but that is just a testament to how different all our interpretations of what feminism should encompass is.

Lastly, I want to discuss a very important idea, and that is assigning motives to other people. In order to hold a strong oppositional position with a group, one must assign motive to that group. Sometimes these assumptions are held up with a lot of evidence and based in fact (i.e. white nationalists want a country of only white people - it's in the name) while other times these assumed motives are based on flimsy evidence, caricatures or are only representative of extreme or subversive elements in the group. Anti-progressive/cultural-Marxist thought leaders have rightly critiqued this practice when directed at them, only to turn around and do the same thing to their progressive counterparts (apparently all women who label themselves feminist don't want equality, but want to put men down, no matter what they say about it).

I see this as a block in 3rd ray understanding causing a block in 5th ray ability to really communicate and listen carefully to people, take them at their word, not preconceived ideas about them.

So in a round about way, do I think SOME elements of feminism are like a 5 year old tantrum? Well of course, because feminism IS people and there are plently of humans walking around with the emotional maturity of infants. Men too who pretend to gag because a woman choses not to shave her underarms are 5 year olds throwing a tantrum. Just humans being humans. But to also ignore that there are plenty of intelligent people with valid reasons involved in feminism is to not see the reality of complex human systems.

I see no evolution possible trying to simplify things down to orange ray thinking. A group made up of millions is not one 5 year old child. How you chose to respond to that child cannot be appropriately applied to all individuals in the group. The group will not "grow up" as one, but parts will evolve, other parts will devolve. So the question becomes, can you stand the ambiguity and chaos and still find a way to love people?

Thank you for this thoughtful and considered response. I would have been far more glib and dismissive. Something for me to meditate on.
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04-24-2019, 09:19 PM, (This post was last modified: 04-24-2019, 09:20 PM by Cyan.)
#11
RE: Feminism is about a 5 year old, thought.
I wonder what feminism will be like in the 2060's when it reaches school age. Give or take. It will be interesting to see.





Smile
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