The Steps of Creation
04-16-2019, 11:30 PM, (This post was last modified: 04-16-2019, 11:36 PM by Infinite.)
#1
The Steps of Creation
I still stay confused with some terminologies of Ra on cosmology. My view is:

1) There is infinity. That isn't the same as intelligent infinity. So the infinity became aware of itself through the first distortion called free will.

Quote:The first known thing in the creation is infinity. The infinity is creation.
(13.5)

Quote:What was the next step or the next evolvement?

Ra: I am Ra. Infinity became aware. This was the next step.
 (13.6)

Quote:The first distortion, free will, finds focus.
 (15.21)

2) As Ra said, "awareness led to the focus of infinity into infinite energy." That's the second distortion intelligent infinity, called also Love or Logos:


Quote:Awareness led to the focus of infinity into infinite energy. You have called this by various vibrational sound complexes, the most common to your ears being “Logos” or “Love.” The Creator is the focusing of infinity as an aware or conscious principle called by us as closely as we can create understanding/learning in your language, intelligent infinity.
 (13.7)

Quote:The first distortion, free will, finds focus. This is the second distortion known to you as Logos, the Creative Principle or Love.
 (15.21)

Here we have the first terminology problem. Looks like Ra used the term "Logos" to refer intelligent infinity and intelligent infinity individualized from itself (a major Logos, as for example the Logos from which our sun is a sub-Logos).

Continuing:

3) The intelligent infinity, through the free will again, creates another distortion, the third distortion known as Light:

Quote:The next step is still at this space/time nexus in your illusion achieving its progression as you may see it in your illusion. The next step is an infinite reaction to the creative principle following the Law of One in one of its primal distortions, freedom of will.
 (13.8)

Quote:The first distortion, free will, finds focus. This is the second distortion known to you as Logos, the Creative Principle or Love.This intelligent energy thus creates a distortion known as Light.
 (15.21)

Quote:how intelligent infinity became individualized from itself?

Ra: I am Ra.

[...]

The intelligent infinity discerned a concept. This concept was discerned due to freedom of will of awareness. This concept was finity. This was the first and primal paradox or distortion of the Law of One. Thus the one intelligent infinity invested itself in an exploration of many-ness.
 (13.12)

So, the free will is used when the infinity became aware of itself and when the intelligent infinity discerned the concept of infinity.

4) From this distortion the Logos is created:

Quote:The energies moved in increasingly intelligent patterns until the individualization of various energies emanating from the creative principle of intelligent infinity became such as to be co-Creators.
(13.9)

Does anyone agree or disagree with me?

And, is it possible see intelligent energy as the third distorion Light? (The Logos is created from the Light and as Ra said, the indigo-ray body, the level of intelligent energy, is an analog of the Logos, so the Logos would be intelligent energy).
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04-17-2019, 12:12 PM, (This post was last modified: 04-17-2019, 12:14 PM by Patrick.)
#2
RE: The Steps of Creation
This is what I have in my notes for the Cosmology.

1) The first known thing in creation is infinity. The infinity is creation.

2) Infinity became aware (intelligent infinity).

3) Awareness led to the focus of infinity into infinite energy (the One Infinite Creator).

"Intelligent infinity has a rhythm or flow as of a giant heart beginning with the central sun, the presence of the flow inevitable as a tide of beingness without polarity, without finitude; the vast and silent all beating outward, outward, focusing outward and inward until the focuses are complete. The intelligence or consciousness of foci have reached a state where their spiritual nature (or mass) calls them inward, inward until all is coalesced. This is the rhythm of reality (B2,6)"

Can you spot the big bang in the above quote ? Wink

"The basic rhythms of intelligent infinity are totally without distortion of any kind. The rhythms are clothed in mystery, for they are being itself. (B2,7)"

"Being aware, Intelligent Infinity became aware of the concept of free will. It realized It was even free to consider the idea of many-ness, that is, more than one - whereas Its nature was Oneness, namely, the one infinite undifferentiated ground of being..."

"...Intelligent Infinity decided to explore this idea, and in so doing Intelligent Infinity became the Creator. Free will is therefore a distortion away from undifferentiated Oneness because it immediately gives rise to many-ness. It is called the first, or primal, distortion."


"Due to the infinite possibilities of intelligent infinity, there is no ending to many-ness. The exploration thus is free to continue infinitely into an eternal present. (B1,131)"

"The 1st distortion, free will, finds focus. This is the 2nd distortion known to you as Logos, the Creative Principle or Love. (B1,148)"

"Love may be seen as the type of energy of an extremely high order which causes intelligent energy to be formed from the potential of intelligent infinity in a particular way. All Love emanates from the Oneness. (B2,8)"

"Love uses Its intelligent energy to create a certain pattern of illusions or densities in order to satisfy Its own intelligent estimate of a method of knowing itself. (B2,9)"

"The next step is an infinite reaction to the creative principle (love) following the Law of One in one of its primal distortions, freedom of will. Thus many, many dimensions, infinite in number, are possible. The energy moves from the intelligent infinity due first to the outpouring of randomized creative force which then creates patterns. These patterns of energy begin to regularize their own rhythms and fields of energy, thus creating dimensions and universes. At this point the physical universes were not yet born. The steps are simultaneous and infinite. (B1,129-130)"

"This intelligent energy thus creates a distortion known as Light. From these 3 distortions come many, many hierarchies of distortions each having its own paradoxes to be synthesized, no one being any more important than another.
(B1,148)"
 

"The way we perceive the world is a direct reflection of the way we understand ourselves." ~ Rupert Spira
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04-17-2019, 01:51 PM,
#3
RE: The Steps of Creation
 
We have no way of knowing how many levels of Logoi there are before reaching the level of our galaxy.
 
 

"The way we perceive the world is a direct reflection of the way we understand ourselves." ~ Rupert Spira
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04-17-2019, 02:25 PM, (This post was last modified: 04-17-2019, 02:26 PM by IndigoGeminiWolf.)
#4
RE: The Steps of Creation
(04-17-2019, 01:51 PM)Patrick Wrote:   
We have no way of knowing how many levels of Logoi there are before reaching the level of our galaxy.
 

That is really fascinating. Do you think it's infinite?

And to think that we as infinite creators are as powerful as a galactic Logos, just with amnesia.
I have actually worked with intelligent energy to cure a dog before.
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04-17-2019, 02:35 PM,
#5
RE: The Steps of Creation
(04-17-2019, 02:25 PM)IndigoGeminiWolf Wrote:  
(04-17-2019, 01:51 PM)Patrick Wrote:   
We have no way of knowing how many levels of Logoi there are before reaching the level of our galaxy.
 

That is really fascinating. Do you think it's infinite?

And to think that we as infinite creators are as powerful as a galactic Logos, just with amnesia.
I have actually worked with intelligent energy to cure a dog before.

We ARE our galactic Logos, with amnesia as you said. Smile
 
 

"The way we perceive the world is a direct reflection of the way we understand ourselves." ~ Rupert Spira
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04-17-2019, 02:55 PM, (This post was last modified: 04-17-2019, 02:59 PM by Infinite.)
#6
RE: The Steps of Creation
Thanks Patrick.

(04-16-2019, 11:30 PM)Infinite Wrote:  And, is it possible see intelligent energy as the third distorion Light? (The Logos is created from the Light and as Ra said, the indigo-ray body, the level of intelligent energy, is an analog of the Logos, so the Logos would be intelligent energy).

I made a mistake about this statement. In a stretch that I quoted above, Ra says intelligent energy creates the distortion Light:

Quote:The first distortion, free will, finds focus. This is the second distortion known to you as Logos, the Creative Principle or Love. This intelligent energy thus creates a distortion known as Light.

It seems intelligent energy is an aspect of intelligent infinity. As Ra said, touch intelligent infinity produces "work", which they called intelligent energy.

With this information, I think there are many kind of energies. For example, on traditional esoteric traditions is teach the chakras and the correspondent elements as below:

red-ray center = earth
orange-ray center = water
yellow-ray center = fire
green-ray center = air
blue-ray center = ether/chi/ki/akasha/prana

And I suposse:

indigo-ray center = intelligent energy
violet-ray = intelligent infinity

Does anyone have any ideas about the difference between prana and intelligent energy?
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04-17-2019, 06:38 PM,
#7
RE: The Steps of Creation
(04-16-2019, 11:30 PM)Infinite Wrote:  Does anyone agree or disagree with me?

A couple of things I would suggest contemplating:

1) Infinity must necessarily contain intelligence, else it is not infinity. So infinity is automatically intelligent and aware.
2) Free will necessarily connotes intelligence/awareness, because in order for a choice to be a choice, there must be awareness of choice. Otherwise, it was just this thing that randomly happened (like scientists imagine the big bang). It would be a logical contradiction if there was not awareness or intelligence prior to this. But prior to the 2nd distortion there was no ego, from my perspective, as that is the second distortion. Self awareness.
3) There are sections of the Ra material where Ra calls the state prior to free will "intelligent".
4) I think the distinction they were attempting to convey by calling it "intelligent" after Logos formation (distortion 2) was that the Logos manifestation is a "deliberate focusing of intelligent infinity". They weren't saying, in my opinion, that it wasn't intelligent prior to the free will distortion, only that *will* is being applied to that intelligent infinity. It is being "organized" by that will. Thus Ra is using "intelligent" in that section to connote organization rather than disorganization. At least, that is my perspective on that section that avoids the logical pitfalls of assuming the alternative.

Consider this section:


"[...] Conversely, the blackness of the black hole, metaphysically speaking, is a concentration of white light being systematically absorbed once again into the One Creator. Finally, this absorption into the One Creator continues until all the infinity of creations have attained sufficient spiritual mass in order that all form once again the great central sun, if you would so imagine it, of the intelligent infinity awaiting potentiation by free will. [...]"


And also:


"To define intelligent apart from infinity is difficult, for these two vibration complexes equal one concept. It is much like attempting to divide your sound vibration concept, faith, into two parts."


(04-16-2019, 11:30 PM)Infinite Wrote:  And, is it possible see intelligent energy as the third distorion Light? (The Logos is created from the Light and as Ra said, the indigo-ray body, the level of intelligent energy, is an analog of the Logos, so the Logos would be intelligent energy).

I think the 3rd distortion is intelligent energy, but it is outer energy. It is the macrocosmic body of the Logos. This is what all the physical illusions are made of (which is the body of the Logos). The inner part is Love. Love is inner, light is outer from my perspective.

But they are ultimately two sides of the same coin.

(04-16-2019, 11:30 PM)Infinite Wrote:  Does anyone have any ideas about the difference between prana and intelligent energy?

As Ra used the term, I would say there is no difference. The distinction becomes only one of vibration. All energy is intelligent, but it is on a spectrum between red to violet. The higher the vibration, the more intelligent, conscious, and organized it becomes.

Good judgment comes from experience, and experience comes from bad judgement.
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04-18-2019, 10:20 AM,
#8
RE: The Steps of Creation
(04-17-2019, 06:38 PM)anagogy Wrote:  1) Infinity must necessarily contain intelligence, else it is not infinity. So infinity is automatically intelligent and aware.

Do you think was a transmission mistake of Ra when they said infinity became aware? I believe infinity is beyond any concept even the concept of intelligence, which is a distortion. So, when this infinity "expire", the distortions are created.

(04-17-2019, 06:38 PM)anagogy Wrote:  2) Free will necessarily connotes intelligence/awareness, because in order for a choice to be a choice, there must be awareness of choice.

Remeber we are talking about something beyond any imagination. The power of Creator is infinite. So, this infinity can do anything. Including make a choice before exist intelligence. But, I believe there is always some kind of intelligence/awareness but impossible of we understand.

(04-17-2019, 06:38 PM)anagogy Wrote:  "[...] Conversely, the blackness of the black hole, metaphysically speaking, is a concentration of white light being systematically absorbed once again into the One Creator. Finally, this absorption into the One Creator continues until all the infinity of creations have attained sufficient spiritual mass in order that all form once again the great central sun, if you would so imagine it, of the intelligent infinity awaiting potentiation by free will. [...]"

Yes. But there is some contradictions on material. It's hard discern them

(04-17-2019, 06:38 PM)anagogy Wrote:  "To define intelligent apart from infinity is difficult, for these two vibration complexes equal one concept. It is much like attempting to divide your sound vibration concept, faith, into two parts."

It was about the concept of intelligent infinity, the second distortion. Because on this level everything is one and can't be seen separated.

(04-17-2019, 06:38 PM)anagogy Wrote:  I think the 3rd distortion is intelligent energy, but it is outer energy. It is the macrocosmic body of the Logos. This is what all the physical illusions are made of (which is the body of the Logos). The inner part is Love. Love is inner, light is outer from my perspective.

But they are ultimately two sides of the same coin.



Interesting. Thanks.

(04-17-2019, 06:38 PM)anagogy Wrote:  As Ra used the term, I would say there is no difference. The distinction becomes only one of vibration. All energy is intelligent, but it is on a spectrum between red to violet. The higher the vibration, the more intelligent, conscious, and organized it becomes.

I was talking in the sense of the traditional esoteric teachings. This is, the blue-ray is correlated with the ether/akasha/space. My question was the difference of blue and indigo-ray. Sometimes Ra called blue-ray as light. This is correlated with ether/akasha/space. Seems there is a difference, probably in the level of energy as you said.
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04-18-2019, 05:08 PM,
#9
RE: The Steps of Creation
(04-18-2019, 10:20 AM)Infinite Wrote:  
(04-17-2019, 06:38 PM)anagogy Wrote:  1) Infinity must necessarily contain intelligence, else it is not infinity. So infinity is automatically intelligent and aware.

Do you think was a transmission mistake of Ra when they said infinity became aware? I believe infinity is beyond any concept even the concept of intelligence, which is a distortion. So, when this infinity "expire", the distortions are created.

I don't think it was a mistake, so much as I believe they could have used better words, for example at another point in the material they talk about the creation mimicing the creator in its discovery of awareness. This is what they say:


"Each step recapitulates intelligent infinity in its discovery of awareness. In a planetary environment all begins in what you would call chaos, energy undirected and random in its infinity. Slowly, in your terms of understanding, there forms a focus of self-awareness. Thus the Logos moves. Light comes to form the darkness, according to the co-Creator’s patterns and vibratory rhythms, so constructing a certain type of experience. This begins with first density which is the density of consciousness, the mineral and water life upon the planet learning from fire and wind the awareness of being. This is the first density."


Here they specifically mention *self-awareness* rather than just awareness. This is the creation mimicing the creator. So I don't necessarily believe it was a mistake, it just wasn't the best choice of words. Because the creator is aware from the beginning of first density (8th density from the previous octave) but the fire and wind are more conscious than the water and earth, and so the first learnings begin as a result of that differential, and awareness is intensified gradually until it reaches the yellow ray egoic level of self awareness (in a cosmic sense).

(04-18-2019, 10:20 AM)Infinite Wrote:  
(04-17-2019, 06:38 PM)anagogy Wrote:  2) Free will necessarily connotes intelligence/awareness, because in order for a choice to be a choice, there must be awareness of choice.

Remeber we are talking about something beyond any imagination. The power of Creator is infinite. So, this infinity can do anything. Including make a choice before exist intelligence. But, I believe there is always some kind of intelligence/awareness but impossible of we understand.

I see, you may be right, but I can't conceptualize anything I can't find the logic in, so if that is your belief, I will leave you to it. I wouldn't be able to understand a choice made without awareness. To my understanding that wouldn't be a choice, it would just be a random thing that happened. At some point, I suppose you have to just believe what resonates most with you. Thanks for your thoughts.

Good judgment comes from experience, and experience comes from bad judgement.
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04-18-2019, 06:14 PM,
#10
RE: The Steps of Creation
Infinite, about your question on prana and intelligent energy, the hindu finds prana comes directly from the sun or .. intelligent energy. If I think of prana, I think intuitively immediately of Creator's breath, or energy.. so .. what do you think ?
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04-19-2019, 08:25 AM,
#11
RE: The Steps of Creation
(04-18-2019, 06:14 PM)flofrog Wrote:  Infinite, about your question on prana and intelligent energy, the hindu finds prana comes directly from the sun or .. intelligent energy. If I think of prana, I think intuitively immediately of Creator's breath, or energy.. so .. what do you think ?

That’s the same way I see it. Prana is the Breath of Life, microcosmically. And it is the Word, macrocosmically. “Let there be Light.”

An interesting observation was made in this thread... Light is a product of intelligent energy. Intelligent energy can correlate with the the Limitless Light, which is the idea of manifestation, I.e. Light.
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04-19-2019, 11:35 AM, (This post was last modified: 04-19-2019, 12:41 PM by Infinite.)
#12
RE: The Steps of Creation
Well, I made a research and came to some conclusions. The five elements are: earth, water, fire, air and akasha (a.k.a. ether or space). The fifth element is the metaphysical space which permeates everything. The akashic record exists in specie of etheric network more subtil than the physical world. The prana is a vital energy that animates everything and is more subtle than ether/akasha . I believe is which Ra called "intelligent energy". So, about chakras and rays:

red-ray = earth
orange-ray = water
yellow-ray = fire
green-ray = air
blue-ray = ether/akasha
indigo-ray = intelligent energy/prana
violet-ray = intelligent infinity


(04-18-2019, 06:14 PM)flofrog Wrote:  Infinite, about your question on prana and intelligent energy,  the hindu finds prana comes directly from the sun or .. intelligent energy. If I think of prana, I think intuitively immediately of Creator's breath, or energy..  so ..  what do you think ?

Yes, the prana or intelligent energy comes from the sun. As Ra said many times, the Logos use intelligent energy in many manners.

And about intelligent energy and the third distortion Light:

Quote:The concept of light is instrumental in grasping this great leap of thought as this vibrational distortion of infinity is the building block of that which is known as matter, the light being intelligent and full of energy, thus being the first distortion of intelligent infinity which was called by the creative principle.

This light of love was made to have in its occurrences of being certain characteristics, among them the infinite whole paradoxically described by the straight line, as you would call it.
(13.9)

Quote:The nature of the vibratory patterns of your universe is dependent upon the configurations placed upon the original material or light by the focus or Love using Its intelligent energy to create a certain pattern of illusions or densities in order to satisfy Its own intelligent estimate of a method of knowing Itself. Thus the colors, as you call them, are as strait, or narrow, or necessary as is possible to express, given the will of Love.
(27.17)

Perhaps the third distortion Light would be the same as Akasha/Ether. And so, the three higher chakras representing light, intelligent energy and intelligent infinity.
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04-19-2019, 11:38 AM,
#13
RE: The Steps of Creation
Yes, I always thought of the blue chakra as Light, because it's the same as wisdom according to Ra.
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Infinite
04-19-2019, 03:38 PM,
#14
RE: The Steps of Creation
Interesting:

Quote:The nature of the vibratory patterns of your universe is dependent upon the configurations placed upon the original material or light by the focus or Love using Its intelligent energy to create a certain pattern of illusions or densities[...]
(27.17)

Quote:All matter throughout the universe is the outcome of one primal matter called Akasha; and all force, whether gravitation, attraction or repulsion, or life, is the outcome of one primal force called Prana. Prana acting on Akasha is creating or projecting the universe.

Source: "Selections From Swami Vivekananda"
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Nau7ik
04-19-2019, 04:30 PM,
#15
RE: The Steps of Creation
All of the below coexist.

1 - Infinity, the mystery. Inert, cannot be described, has everything contained inside, in equal and cancelling amounts

one level below

2 - Infinity separates into two concepts. One of them is infinite intelligence / intelligent infinity / intelligent energy. It has potential. It is intelligent. It separates with something to gain potential and have energy, which means it has potential, and therefore it is intelligent. As you can understand, infinite energy is infinite for everything down below, but not infinite compared to infinity itself, since we can use one adjective to describe it - intelligent. This is the first thing we can talk about. Its not one, for it has infinite finite parts. Its not infinitely many and fragmented, because it is also united.

one level below

3 - Intelligent infinity focuses to foci, which channel its energy. This is called the creator. It is described as one, however it is likely that it follows the same blueprint from above: It would appear one to us, however it comprises of infinite finites. After all, we all come from the same source and we are many. So we were already present in our unison which we call the creator, at this stage. Its also one, and many at the same time. Light likely comes to being at this point.

one level below

4 - Creator manifests as likely an infinite number of logoi. This may have happened in the earlier stage too. These logoi create infinite creations.

one level below

5 - From this point on, the refractions and sublogoi create infinite sub parts of the creation.

Also the below post has some insights.

https://www.bring4th.org/forums/showthread.php?tid=16979&pid=259059#pid259059
can reach me@ unity100-gmail
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Infinite Unity
04-20-2019, 09:24 AM,
#16
Question  RE: The Steps of Creation
(04-19-2019, 03:38 PM)Infinite Wrote:  Interesting:

Quote:The nature of the vibratory patterns of your universe is dependent upon the configurations placed upon the original material or light by the focus or Love using Its intelligent energy to create a certain pattern of illusions or densities[...]
(27.17)

Quote:All matter throughout the universe is the outcome of one primal matter called Akasha; and all force, whether gravitation, attraction or repulsion, or life, is the outcome of one primal force called Prana. Prana acting on Akasha is creating or projecting the universe.

Source: "Selections From Swami Vivekananda"

“Light is the shadow of God.”

Very interesting indeed! It would seem that the Ra Material, the Holy Qabalah, and Eastern metaphysics all agree here. We are simply using different terminology. And when multiple sources bear witness to the same truth, we know we are onto something.

Qabalah knows this as the play of force and form; Chokmah and Binah. The Limitless Light represents the possibility of manifestation. Kether is pure being (unity) from whence comes the Big Bang of Chokmah (“Let there be light!”; the Word). The outflowing Force is unrestricted and expanding initially until the Binah phase supervenes and constricts Force into form.

The Sword and the Serpent describes the creation of the Material universe thusly: 1 Kether as Unity, 2 Chokmah as Expansion, and 3 Binah as Constriction:

Quote:Prima Materia and Big Bang
Space, initially, in this connotation, symbolizes the Ain Soph: negative existence. A number of physicists in past generations have made the mistake of trying to identify Space with a hypothetical aspect of positive existence, as for example, an ether; but the negative attribution is needed to fulfill all the conditions. Out of negation appears the First Sephirah, Kether [Unity; Pure Being]. Movement indicates the precense of energy, and energy is the potential of matter. Whence comes this first impulse? [...] Here is the mysterious but essential nexus between the Worlds: energy pouring through from the Astral Light at a point which is at first truly without dimension. This energy is not the outflung imbalance of a single Sephirah: it holds concentrated in its single brilliance the influences of all the Sephiroth as these have been developed and balanced in the three Worlds down to Yetzirah. It is thus a true Kether-Force, increasing field of energy manifesting as white heat of incomparable intensity.

The force-fields increase as tremendous areas of electrical tension. The critical point is reached: that which the Qabalists have dignified as the Big Bang! [...] The first varied associations are formed, becoming stablised as atomic structures: some of a few such infinitesimal particles, others of greater numbersZ these first atoms hurled in great clouds through space make up what can only conceived of as the most tenuous of gases, but a gas is atomic matter. The tremendous development of our universe has begun.

[...] The primal gas is hurled outward from the centre of explosion into the void, and now the Binah phase supervenes. Still at white heat, it has nevertheless lost temperature considerably, and contraction and an increase in density ensue. Long have the Qabalists spoken of a “sterile Mother” without being deterred by the paradox, and in this they are right, for this aspect of Binah is typified by the contrasting of the radiant torrent of Chokmah in the cold womb of Space into which it has been poured. Yet Binah is also to us a bright and fruitful Mother, for it is her tempering and formative power which makes possible the development of all the sustains our life.
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04-20-2019, 09:53 PM,
#17
RE: The Steps of Creation
I thought the concept was finity, or of finite quality, thus the paradox.
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04-25-2019, 02:32 PM, (This post was last modified: 04-25-2019, 05:30 PM by loostudent.)
#18
RE: The Steps of Creation
NHow things come into existence? In cosmology there are two most common concepts: emanation and creation.

Quote:The concept of emanation is that all derived or secondary things proceed or flow from the more primary. It is distinguished from the doctrine of creation by its elimination of a definite will in the first cause, from which all things are made to emanate according to natural laws and without conscious volition.
(Internet Encyclopedia of Philosophy)

Creation in strict sense is inventing something from nothing. An act of free will. There is something new, different, surprising ... Creation is an event. It has potential to be experienced. There is a sense of separation inherent in the very act. Like work of art is separated from the artist. Work is because of the author's free will. Not by necessity or law. Emanation on the other hand is like a smell of flower. It's something uncreated that flows naturally/by default from the source. It automatically belongs together. Kabbalah combines emanation and creation and also adds formation (creation from something) and action. Therefore there are four worlds (planes) - from inner to outer ...

I don't really get Ra's cosmology.
"First thing known is infinity." - Is it really known?
"The infinity is creation." - I thought infinity is absolute reality, ground of all being. Creation on the other hand is contingent. I think creation really is when intelligent infinity through first distortion free will finds focus and creates light.
------------
Grace to you and peace from God our Father.
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anagogy
04-25-2019, 03:33 PM,
#19
RE: The Steps of Creation
Is it possible the Creator was lonely before it created Creation?
Or is loneliness not an attribute of Creator?
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David_1
04-25-2019, 03:39 PM,
#20
RE: The Steps of Creation
   Was the Creator lonely?
   Have you ever experienced something really great?  Isn’t it even better when shared with another person?
   Possibly the Creator was so full of love that He just really wanted to share it with others.
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04-25-2019, 11:04 PM,
#21
RE: The Steps of Creation
(04-25-2019, 03:33 PM)IndigoGeminiWolf Wrote:  Is it possible the Creator was lonely before it created Creation?
Or is loneliness not an attribute of Creator?

Loneliness is a distortion, as any concept is a distortion. The intelligent infinity has no distortions.
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anagogy
04-26-2019, 10:17 AM,
#22
RE: The Steps of Creation
(04-25-2019, 11:04 PM)Infinite Wrote:  
(04-25-2019, 03:33 PM)IndigoGeminiWolf Wrote:  Is it possible the Creator was lonely before it created Creation?
Or is loneliness not an attribute of Creator?

Loneliness is a distortion, as any concept is a distortion. The intelligent infinity has no distortions.

We are Creator, and we get lonely. So I think Creator gets lonely too.
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04-26-2019, 12:42 PM,
#23
RE: The Steps of Creation
(04-25-2019, 02:32 PM)loostudent Wrote:  Creation in strict sense is inventing something from nothing. An act of free will. There is something new, different, surprising ... Creation is an event. It has potential to be experienced. There is a sense of separation inherent in the very act. Like work of art is separated from the artist. Work is because of the author's free will. Not by necessity or law. Emanation on the other hand is like a smell of flower. It's something uncreated that flows naturally/by default from the source. It automatically belongs together. Kabbalah combines emanation and creation and also adds formation (creation from something) and action. Therefore there are four worlds (planes) - from inner to outer ...

I agree.

(04-25-2019, 02:32 PM)loostudent Wrote:  I don't really get Ra's cosmology.
"First thing known is infinity." - Is it really known?

I think what they mean by that is infinity is the first thing awareness is acquainted with because, as you said, that is the ground of being. It isn't "knowing" in an intellectual sense, more like the inner awareness of all that is. There is a direct awareness of being infinity.

(04-25-2019, 02:32 PM)loostudent Wrote:  "The infinity is creation." - I thought infinity is absolute reality, ground of all being. Creation on the other hand is contingent. I think creation really is when intelligent infinity through first distortion free will finds focus and creates light.

Well as we know from other sections of the Ra material, the creator does not properly create, it merely experiences itself by creating experiential distortions that enhance contrast so that archetypal facets of the creator stand out brightly and clearly. So there was an infinity there before it was "formed", and the creator took those already existing emanations (the seven rays) and "organized" them in a certain way through an act of will. So creation is more like "organization", rather than a strictly nothing to something situation. So when Ra says that the infinity is creation, I think they mean that the creator and created are one. The substance of infinity is the substance that is molded by the creator to form what we know as the creation.

Or anyway, that is my perspective on it.

Good judgment comes from experience, and experience comes from bad judgement.
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04-26-2019, 12:48 PM,
#24
RE: The Steps of Creation
(04-26-2019, 10:17 AM)IndigoGeminiWolf Wrote:  We are Creator, and we get lonely. So I think Creator gets lonely too.

That's true, but I think what he's saying is that loneliness arises from separation, rather than unity. So in unity, there is no perception of lack of love, or lack of companionship. In unity, just like a social memory complex of 6D, there is no distinction between "we" and "I". They have both come to mean the same thing at that level.

So the more one becomes consciously aware of being the creator, the less loneliness one would feel. We feel loneliness because we only have a superficial awareness of being the creator. An intellectual understanding, but not much of a visceral conscious understanding except during rare moments in our physical lives.

Good judgment comes from experience, and experience comes from bad judgement.
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04-29-2019, 09:22 AM, (This post was last modified: 04-29-2019, 09:23 AM by loostudent.)
#25
RE: The Steps of Creation
(04-26-2019, 12:42 PM)anagogy Wrote:  Well as we know from other sections of the Ra material, the creator does not properly create, it merely experiences itself by creating experiential distortions that enhance contrast so that archetypal facets of the creator stand out brightly and clearly. So there was an infinity there before it was "formed", and the creator took those already existing emanations (the seven rays) and "organized" them in a certain way through an act of will. So creation is more like "organization", rather than a strictly nothing to something situation. So when Ra says that the infinity is creation, I think they mean that the creator and created are one. The substance of infinity is the substance that is molded by the creator to form what we know as the creation.

What about this section:

Quote:The intelligent infinity discerned a concept. This concept was discerned due to freedom of will of awareness. This concept was finity. This was the first and primal paradox or distortion of the Law of One. Thus the one intelligent infinity invested itself in an exploration of many-ness. Due to the infinite possibilities of intelligent infinity there is no ending to many-ness. The exploration, thus, is free to continue infinitely in an eternal present. (Ra, 13.12)

This sounds to me like proper creating. Manyness was something totally new and it was discerned and being explored (Let be) in free will. In unity there is no finity. No-thing. Thus whitout Creator's free decision there could easily be no finity explored in manyness.

Quote:That which is infinite cannot be many, for many-ness is a finite concept. To have infinity you must identify or define that infinity as unity; otherwise, the term does not have any referent or meaning. In an Infinite Creator there is only unity. (1.7)
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Grace to you and peace from God our Father.
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04-29-2019, 01:49 PM,
#26
RE: The Steps of Creation
(04-29-2019, 09:22 AM)loostudent Wrote:  What about this section:

Quote:The intelligent infinity discerned a concept. This concept was discerned due to freedom of will of awareness. This concept was finity. This was the first and primal paradox or distortion of the Law of One. Thus the one intelligent infinity invested itself in an exploration of many-ness. Due to the infinite possibilities of intelligent infinity there is no ending to many-ness. The exploration, thus, is free to continue infinitely in an eternal present. (Ra, 13.12)

This sounds to me like proper creating. Manyness was something totally new and it was discerned and being explored (Let be) in free will. In unity there is no finity. No-thing. Thus whitout Creator's free decision there could easily be no finity explored in manyness.

Well, I would somewhat disagree that it was totally new. In the same way that the spirit complex exists there in potential in animals, as it is something inherent and waiting to be tapped, so too was the manyness inherent in the creator. Infinity contains everything. What we call "finity" is a slice, or cross section, of infinity/unity. Just like the white light contains all the colors, but in order to experience them, a prism of separation must be introduced. So it was something already latent in potential. So the only thing that changed was the organization factor. By introducing the distorting effect of the prism, separation was thereby experienced. This forced the Logos manifestation down into a "lower energy shell" of infinity (a more distorted perspective of infinity). But that was necessary in order for creation to occur. In order to have the illusion of creation, there has to be an illusion of lack. Unity/infinity is like a full canvas, a plenum of everything, the illusion was like sweeping that away in favor of a blank canvas. This created a void, which then had the potential of being filled by creative acts of will.

So I don't think it was a totally new thing, so much as it was the "illusion of a totally new thing". Also, from my perspective this process of reaching the natural base state of infinity/unity, and then again discerning the concept of finity and then reaching for that manifestation has been something that occurs in every octave, and I don't believe there was a "beginning octave" in the normal way we would think of it in rational cause/effect terms. I think that is something that redounds outwards to the limits of infinity as well. Dreams inside of dreams inside of dreams. Or mirrored reflection, within reflections, within reflections. There are an infinity of "simulations" and awareness has the capacity to put on "identities" thereby confining perception to more restricted views of infinity like the illusion we experience, or taking off said identity and allowing perception to settle back into the more encompassing infinite absolute state. The "focusing" onto a specific state is the very function of the logos manifestation. The focusing of unity is love.

Good judgment comes from experience, and experience comes from bad judgement.
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04-29-2019, 09:19 PM,
#27
RE: The Steps of Creation
I think you can term any creation as a partial reflection of its creator. Why does a musician create a song that is unlike what another musician is creating at the same time? Because the song reflects the musician, a creation reflects its creator. I think creating works this way, you as a separated focus (Logos) are inspired by what you know yourself to be and in contrast to what you appear to not be as a relative self. This sense of separation is the creative principle. What I think needs to be understood is that the unity we link to white light is not without this, else there would be no movement into separation and from separation back into unity. That is the limit of a point of view, of awareness, unified unity is lacking in that it cannot perceive itself without making itself relative, this lack creates the movement into separation. Then, the lack found in focused separated unity goes back to realize unified unity in which it is rooted. Awareness is always only an abstraction and so this is without beginning nor ending, it is merely an intelligent causality to what the One Infinite Creator is. In both cases, I think there is what we could term the "cycle of eternity", this is the cycle that made the Creator aware and made it seek to find focus and know Itself (yields infinite Octaves of focus), then this paradoxical perception of finity makes the cycle of eternity into realizing infinity. There is no one without the other, the principle of each is closer to a paradox and the truth is non-dual. What we call unity is like both the root and harvest of separation, yet its own root and harvest is separation. The One Infinite Creator is the non-duality found in the middle of these paradoxes of perception.

Think of how all that Ra truly says the first distortion entails is that the Creator will know of Itself. It becomes aware of Itself, the relativity of a unit without relativity, full in nothing but potential, but knows nothing of what this potential can be. To know Itself, It has to find focus upon what It is and thus become infinite separate aspect of the unity of what It is (the cycles of Octaves throughout the infinite circle of making the One relative to the unity of Itself), It gains knowledge through relativity, while all it knows before this is somewhat its potential to be made relative. But then, none of these separate aspects are truly without the others, they contain the potential to become them but as separate of becoming them, and so comes to be realized the completeness within the seeming incompleteness.

Anyway, I'm not entirely satisfied with my post but I find a certain humor in using dual words to describe the non-dual. The best way to realize the essence of everything and how it becomes is probably by working opposites. Like the material says, the mind contains all things and all thoughts that a being has also has an antithesis, by accepting both sides of every thought you can realize completeness. Although I see the true nature of the Creator, of Infinity, as non-dual, there is clearly infinite duality and to be without it would make non-duality quite very dual. On a side lies the finite-infinity and on the other side lies the infinite-finity and throughout the cycles of it all, the mystery cannot be fully grasped as awareness is never fully the object of what it is aware of. At some point you know enough though and from there a leap can be made, offering a new harvest of the experiences of the Creator by the Creator and this in turn enabling a new relativity to be born.

There is no self in the sense of separate individuality, yet there is one prevailing identity.
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04-30-2019, 08:46 AM,
#28
RE: The Steps of Creation
Looking to the steps, it's the intelligent infinity or the intelligent infinity individualized (a major Logos) who creates the Light? If is the intelligent infinity, the individualization of the intelligent energy and the Light are created at the same time (I know this occur on eternity without time, it's just to clarification)?
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Patrick
04-30-2019, 10:02 AM,
#29
RE: The Steps of Creation
(04-30-2019, 08:46 AM)Infinite Wrote:  Looking to the steps, it's the intelligent infinity or the intelligent infinity individualized (a major Logos) who creates the Light? If is the intelligent infinity, the individualization of the intelligent energy and the Light are created at the same time (I know this occur on eternity without time, it's just to clarification)?

If light was created "after" the first level of individualization, then it might only exist in this universe. And other universes, created by other first level Logoi, would have something else.  That's an interesting thought. Smile
 

"The way we perceive the world is a direct reflection of the way we understand ourselves." ~ Rupert Spira
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04-30-2019, 11:11 AM,
#30
RE: The Steps of Creation
(04-30-2019, 10:02 AM)Patrick Wrote:  If light was created "after" the first level of individualization, then it might only exist in this universe.

Good point. So, is the intelligent infinity who creates the densities right?
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